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00:00The man in the box, Nathan Zagura, and he joins us right now on the Wise Heart Right,
00:05We Make It Right, called Kyle Wright Hotline.
00:07Hello, Nathan.
00:08Good morning, Mon Ferrer.
00:09How are you?
00:10I got a controversial question for you, Nathan.
00:12Let's get right to it.
00:13Judas Priest.
00:13The food in New Orleans, overrated, underrated.
00:17Some people think it's the best food in the country.
00:20Other people say, Anthony, it is so overrated.
00:24I think it's a little bit of both.
00:25I've had elite meals in New Orleans, so I kind of think it depends on where you go.
00:30But if you are somebody that has a sensitivity to butter or does not enjoy foods that are so rich
00:38that they bog you down for days,
00:40then I would not recommend the New Orleans cuisine because it is as buttery a cuisine as I think exists
00:47on planet Earth.
00:48But it's also, you can't get gumbo anywhere else like you can down in New Orleans.
00:51So there is, I think there's some very good food down there.
00:55There is also just some rich, rich, rich food.
00:59What did you want me to say?
01:01Why did you weigh in?
01:03I mean, he's talking food.
01:04He's talking butter.
01:06He's talking lots of food.
01:07Oh, so you're saying that I just load myself up with butter all day?
01:11Yeah.
01:12What do you say?
01:13I'm a life kind of butter expert.
01:14I just thought maybe he'd like to weigh in on this conversation.
01:17Life is changing.
01:18You know, I'm busier every day.
01:21I have to have a little lighter fare than I've had in the past.
01:24You know, I have to be that way.
01:27I hate to be that way.
01:28But, you know, 30-year-old Ken, load him up.
01:31But now things have changed.
01:34Nathan, you know, it's been a weird week.
01:38First and foremost, how do we get back on track here?
01:41Because it was emotional last Sunday.
01:43It got emotional this week.
01:45It's like, hey, man, you got to win a football game.
01:46You're 5-3, not 3-5.
01:48We got to compete for the playoffs here.
01:50Yeah, this is a big game to go ahead and win.
01:53And down in New Orleans, look, the good news is stylistically, and they often say styles make the fight, stylistically,
01:59this is a great matchup for the Cleveland Browns.
02:01The New Orleans Saints do not run the football well.
02:03That's been the Achilles heel of the Browns' defense of late.
02:05They don't have anybody who hits chunk runs at all.
02:08Their leading rusher, Kendra Miller, is averaging 2.8 yards a carry.
02:11Their second leading rusher, the venerable Alvin Kamara, is averaging 3.0 yards per carry.
02:16They're one of the worst rush offenses in the league.
02:19Tyler Shuck leads the NFL in dropbacks per game.
02:21I like our ability to get after the quarterback, and I like our ability to cover on the back end.
02:26So I think stylistically, from a defensive standpoint, it certainly matches up well.
02:31And then from an offensive standpoint, you know, this is their bottom four in the league in total defense, in
02:37scoring defense.
02:38They're bottom four in the league on third downs.
02:40So this is a team where you can certainly run the football against them.
02:44Bottom four in the league there.
02:44You can run the football against them.
02:46We should be able to get things going.
02:48It should be a better game for our offensive line.
02:50There is a tough matchup in the tackles, and we might have to give some help out there.
02:53They really don't generate much interior pressure, but they are very good out on the edges,
02:58where Chase Young has finally become, I think, the player a lot of people thought he would be when he
03:03left Ohio State.
03:04He's got 16.5 sacks in his last 17 games.
03:07And the duo of Chase Young and Carl Granderson have combined for at least three sacks in each of the
03:14last three games,
03:15with each of them having at least one and a half sacks in those three games.
03:18So certainly some pressure off the edge, but we should be able to run it down their throats.
03:22They play a lot of single high, and they do blitz, but they play single high behind it.
03:27This year the in vogue thing is to blitz and play the two high shells behind it.
03:30So there will be opportunities.
03:32We'll be able to get the one-on-ones that we want in the pass game,
03:35and I think we have an opportunity to take advantage of them on the outside if we can block things
03:39out.
03:40So we were talking about the offensive game plan for this, and you saw, and we've seen in the NFL,
03:47backup quarterbacks mean more conservative game planning and calling.
03:52We saw it yesterday, obviously, in Thursday Night Football.
03:54What about this game?
03:55We do have Chador, who is an aggressive thrower down the field.
03:59He had some success doing that last year under a different offense.
04:04Does Todd let him air it out, or do they go ball control, complimentary with the defense,
04:11try to get the running game going, and really dial it back a little bit?
04:16So I was going to say before you said really dial it back a little bit at the end,
04:20I was going to say I think it's going to be the answer is yes to all of it.
04:23I think we're going to try to run, get the ground game going,
04:26but like I said at the beginning, this is a single high team.
04:28They're going to play more than half the time.
04:31It's cover one or cover three.
04:32Three, that means that you can be aggressive.
04:34Those are the defenses that you can take shots down the field against
04:37because you don't have the two safeties over the top.
04:40And so I think it's going to be a mix.
04:42I think you're going to see the Browns certainly get the ground game going,
04:44try to run the football.
04:45But I also think you're going to take some shots down the field because,
04:48number one, that's what Chador Sanders does well.
04:51And number two, it's a defensive style under Brandon Staley
04:55that you know you will have opportunities for one-on-one shots down the field.
04:59So I expect the Browns to, yes, run it, and, yes, make sure.
05:03But I do think there will be calls,
05:05and I think there will be opportunities for shots down the field.
05:08Now, Nathan, when it comes to everything going on defensively,
05:13like they were Swiss cheese.
05:15God, I hate using that term.
05:16Whatever.
05:17They just got ran through back on Sunday and then the week before against Tennessee.
05:24This is not a great running football team you're playing,
05:26but how do you make sure that you keep them not a great running football team?
05:30Well, you know, they had 17 carries for 18 yards in their last game.
05:34They're one of the worst running football teams in the NFL, as a matter of fact,
05:36and in terms of hitting explosive runs, they're right near the bottom of the league.
05:39So, look, it's a dual-edged sword because the Browns lead the NFL in tackles for a loss with 53,
05:46but at the same time, you can't let a trap play pick up 51 yards on third and 13.
05:51You can't let a trap play pick up 25 yards and get out of bounds to start a drive
05:55that I really thought was the backbreaker at the end of that first half down in Pittsburgh.
05:59So they have got to figure some things out, and you've got a very smart coaching strap,
06:03and I believe that they will,
06:04but you have got to be able to balance the aggressiveness up the field
06:08but also making sure that you've got good gap integrity
06:11because what's happening is with these traps is they're letting our guys get up the field,
06:15and they're going to the second level and getting hats on Carson and Quincy,
06:19and now all of a sudden you've got a guy, if he can make one guy miss,
06:22he's into the third level and gone, and that's exactly what we saw happen with Jalen Warren.
06:26Now, this isn't the same type of rushing attack at all.
06:28They do not have that juicy running back in the backfield like a Jalen Warren or even like a Tony
06:33Pollard,
06:33who, by the way, we did a lot in his first eight carries.
06:36We were dreadful against him.
06:37After that, we basically held him to under two yards a carry.
06:40So it's in there.
06:42We've got to do it consistently, and we've got to do it in big moments,
06:45but it's one of those things where what makes our defense so special when it is effective
06:49is the aggressiveness, is getting into the backfield, it is the tackles for a loss and sacks,
06:53but at the same time, you just can't allow a team in third and seven and long
06:56to run it three times and pick up a first down twice.
06:59That just doesn't work in the NFL.
07:01How, depending on how this game goes, your trade deadline is November 10th.
07:09Win or lose, how much could this trade, how much could this change the trade deadline
07:13for the Cleveland Browns?
07:15I don't know much either direction.
07:18I think obviously a win.
07:20I think your needs are pretty clear.
07:23I think what they really would like, I think, to get this offense and maybe help the running
07:27game going to is, you know, a big Y blocking tight end, and I would imagine some might be
07:35available at the trade deadline.
07:36That's to me where I think the Browns would be looking, and I think that would be true
07:40either way because I think that's something that Todd Munkin wants in his offense and has
07:44just not been a part of this offense yet this year.
07:48Not to say that, you know, Harold Phan is certainly more of a receiver.
07:50Blake Whitehart is out there giving a yeoman's effort, but he stylistically is more of probably
07:56a little bit of a pass catcher.
07:57He does the dirty work and does it willingly and does it well.
07:59But, you know, you think about when Todd was in Baltimore with Patrick Ricard, and we're
08:04not looking for Patrick Ricard, but they also had Charlie Kohler, and I think a player of
08:07that ilk is something that the Browns would be interested in for 2026 and, quite frankly,
08:11beyond.
08:13Miles Garrett, he was still limited in practice on Thursday.
08:17Now, I know they play at the same time we do.
08:19How close of attention do you think the NFL is going to be paying attention to this?
08:22It'll be his first game since week one.
08:24And how much attention do you think Browns fans will be paying attention to this game?
08:28A lot of attention being paid here.
08:30I hope they're not paying much attention to that game.
08:32I hope they're dialed in on the Browns and the Saints.
08:34Listen, right now the Rams are, if the playoffs start today, they're out of the playoffs at 4-4,
08:38and you've got everybody that's in the NFC North in the playoffs.
08:42So that's a team that's got to get going.
08:44Now, there certainly is plenty of time left for them to do so, and they are talented.
08:48But, yeah, I think you want to see that defense that has struggled a little bit there for the Rams
08:52and get a boost with Miles Garrett back, and it would not surprise me at all that, you know,
08:56if he took the time to be back at 100%, it would not surprise me if he goes and has
09:00a big impact in this game.
09:02He is, after all, the last time that we saw him in a Browns uniform,
09:06and I'm not going to count week one because I guess he was limited there, you know,
09:10he was the most dominant defensive player in the NFL,
09:12and it would not surprise me if he continues to be that.
09:16Has Lamar Jackson played his last snap for the Baltimore Ravens?
09:19I don't think they can get out of the contract next year.
09:22I really don't think so.
09:24I think there's too much money.
09:25Someone wouldn't trade for the contract?
09:27Isn't it like $70 to $80 million next year of a cap hit?
09:32I mean, it's a big, big number.
09:34Would somebody do it?
09:35Maybe, but at the same time, you know,
09:37we're not seeing Lamar Jackson healthy for the second year in a row,
09:41and that would be concerning to me if I was about to shell that out.
09:45Is he one of the great transcendent players in the game?
09:47You bet.
09:47But, you know, he's got a lot of abilities,
09:49but right now availability has not been one of them at the level you would want
09:52for that kind of investment.
09:54I don't think he's played his last game for the Ravens.
09:56I think it just shows.
09:58I actually had this conversation with somebody this morning.
10:01It goes to show, last night, like you take the kid, Ayano.
10:06He threw 28 touchdowns with one pick in college at UConn.
10:09Now, it's not like he's playing the best in college football,
10:12but the guy clearly knows how to throw a football.
10:14He completed 70% of his passes.
10:17He threw one touchdown, one interception all season.
10:19He threw two, obviously, last night,
10:21at least by the time that I had turned that game off and it was over with.
10:24It's hard to play quarterback in the NFL.
10:26I mean, I don't know if we really have an appreciation of just how hard it is
10:30to play quarterback in the NFL when you think about that
10:33and the performance that we saw last night,
10:35just quarterback play around the league in general.
10:37So back to the original point about Lamar Jackson,
10:39if you can get somebody with that kind of talent,
10:41of course you would move the mountains to get them.
10:44But it's not always that easy.
10:46And unfortunately, you know, it comes with a big salary number for him
10:49and it comes with, at this point in his career,
10:51legitimate durability concerns.
10:54Hey, Jacksonville has four blowout wins this year.
10:57Should they be talked about more seriously
10:59as a team that can win the Super Bowl this year?
11:01Absolutely.
11:02What can't they do?
11:03I mean, they have the biggest point differential in the NFL.
11:05They know how to score the football.
11:07They can throw it with Trevor Lawrence.
11:09They've got good weapons at the receiver position.
11:11They have good weapons at tight end in Brenton Strange,
11:13Bajal Tootin and Chris Rodriguez.
11:15And Tootin's been, you know, excellent this year.
11:16And then they play a great defense.
11:18And Liam Cohen is a dude.
11:20I know that there's a lot of talk about press conferences this week.
11:23And, you know, if they went the way people wanted them to go,
11:26I would say that nobody had probably a rockier start
11:29behind the microphone than Liam Cohen in Jacksonville.
11:32And clearly, that does not matter.
11:34And he's got that team playing at a high level.
11:36Yes, the Jacksonville Jaguars absolutely should be being talked about
11:39as a legit Super Bowl contender right now.
11:41Jeremiah Love went on IR.
11:43Ashton Jennings had a rough start.
11:45Is there a hard and fast rule to you
11:47to not take running backs in the first round?
11:50Me, yes.
11:51But for every time you say something like that,
11:54there's a Jameer Gibbs, who I think would be an asset to any football team.
11:57But I do think you can find value at the running back positions in other places.
12:01And you've seen that around the league.
12:04The reality is, when you look at, you know, what's going on in the NFL,
12:08and obviously Gibbs is unbelievable and has been a great exception to that rule.
12:12B. John Robinson certainly is a great running back.
12:14But I think that team could have been in a better spot doing some other things.
12:18You know, you look at what Tampa,
12:19Tampa just won a game without throwing the football.
12:21Bucky Irving is not a first-round running back.
12:23And not only did Bucky Irving run for a career high, I think 170 yards in that game.
12:27Gainwell was over 100 yards in that game.
12:29The week before, Sean Tucker, the third running back,
12:32had over 70 yards and a touchdown.
12:34Some teams can run the football.
12:35If you put the right things in place, you can have, you know,
12:38the guys in the NFL are all very talented.
12:40You can be effective.
12:41That's just such a valuable position.
12:44And the reason I don't like it isn't so much that it's a running back.
12:47It's just when you look at the salaries of running backs,
12:49when you draft one in the first round, especially early, like Love or Gentry,
12:53you're paying them already at the top of their position
12:55without the guaranteed production that comes with a second contract.
12:59You know what I mean?
13:00Where you're saying, oh, I paid this guy at the top of the position
13:02because he's been the top of the position.
13:04You're doing it on a theoretical.
13:05In the case of both Jeremiah Love and Ashton Gentry right now,
13:07that looks like money that was poorly spent.
13:11It's like if you have one token and you have a token that can get you
13:14something that's worth $10 million, $20 million, $30 million, $40 million,
13:19$50 million,
13:20aren't you going to try to get that token in the $50, $40 million range
13:24as opposed to taking the $10 million?
13:26And that's to me, that's the calculus that I would make in that.
13:29Mike McDaniel, why hasn't it worked for the Chargers?
13:32I was reading on CBSSports.com yesterday that he could get fired after this weekend.
13:38Is that an Amari and Hampton problem over there with the Chargers?
13:41Or is that an offensive line injury problem more than it is Mike McDaniel?
13:45Well, that's another first-round running back who's struggling bigly as Amari and Hampton.
13:50I still think Justin Herbert knows how to play quarterback.
13:53I just wonder if Mike McDaniel's system that he has become so reliant upon depended so much on speed.
13:59And you think about Tyreek Hill and Jalen Waddell when they were running around slinging it
14:04and it was in vogue, it was new.
14:06They don't have peak Tyreek Hill.
14:08They don't have Jalen Waddell down there.
14:09They don't have that kind of speed.
14:11And I think Justin Herbert would be much better off in, say, a more traditional offense
14:16like the one that Todd Munkin runs.
14:17I think Justin Herbert would be lighting up this league.
14:19There's no question in my mind he's a talented player.
14:21I think it is just a...
14:22We talked about them getting styles to make fights.
14:24I think this is a style mismatch.
14:26And I can't say that's an original thought of mine, but Greg Cosell, who's watched more NFL film
14:30than anybody on planet Earth, said that before week one on our show.
14:33And he said, I don't think this is going to work.
14:35And boy, was he right.
14:37I mean, it has been a catastrophic failure.
14:39And I do...
14:39Yeah, a change is needed there, which is hard to believe, but it is definitely needed.
14:44Nathan, one last one quick.
14:46Is Shador nicer to you when you ask him questions than the rest of the media?
14:49All right, we're moving.
14:50The vultures in the Cleveland media.
14:53I hear Lucas crying.
14:54I got to go get him.
14:55Yeah, go take care of him.
14:57Thank you very much.
14:58Nathan Zagura.
14:59On the Wise Heart Right, we make it right.
15:01Call Kyle Right Hotline.
15:03What are you going to do if he plays well?
15:04And we talk about him being the starter next week.
15:06We're going to be celebrating.
15:07Are you kidding me?
15:10How could we not?
15:10That's always the cheat code.
15:12I mean, I'm a bronze fan.
15:13I root for the team to do well.
15:15That's always the cheat code.
15:15That's the cheat code for me to root for the team I grew up watching.
15:18Our buddy Maurice in the Bay Area is like, you said they were only going to win five games.
15:21Yeah, I was wrong.
15:23And now I'm celebrating them win.
15:24Now, somebody said we're not allowed to do Super Bowl Super Browns if they win this game.
15:27I'm not allowed to do the thing that we do based on our reaction by the originators of the Super
15:32Bowl Super Browns based on our reaction to the press conference.
15:36No, that's not how it works.
15:37I'm going to do Super Bowl Super Browns.
15:40I'm going to do it hard, too, and loud.
15:42See, here's the difference.
15:43I know for a fact we will be rooting for the Browns next September, regardless of who the quarterback is.
15:49I don't know that those people telling us that we don't get to do Super Bowl Super Browns will be
15:53rooting for the Browns next September.
15:54What did I tell you at 845?
15:55That's why I was so upset over the, should or this in the presser, and should or that in the
15:59presser.
16:00I go, Jared Verse, you'll be rooting for the Browns next September, and Jared Verse will be playing for the
16:05Browns next September.
16:06That's the whole point of that.
16:08Boom.
16:08Champions pose.
16:10Ken Carman, Tone Master General, coming in hot, 945 on the fan.