- 1 day ago
John invites Kim to share her story of becoming involved in Word of Faith, New Apostolic Reformation, and Shepherding Movement circles during a vulnerable season of life. She describes relying on personal prophecies, attending meetings where leaders claimed spiritual authority, and struggling to process promises that did not come to pass.
Kim also reflects on high-control church culture, public shaming, pressure to submit, family division, grief, and the long process of healing. The conversation focuses on the dangers of following human leaders as though they speak directly for God, and Kim’s central warning is simple: open the Bible, follow Jesus, and do not allow anyone to replace your relationship with the Lord.
CHAPTERS
00:00 Introduction
01:28 Kim’s Background and First Prophetic Experience
05:42 Trusting Prophecies That Failed
11:53 Public Shaming and Spiritual Authority
18:12 Addiction, Recovery, and Starting Over
24:15 Returning to the Church and Leadership Control
29:30 Submission, Shunning, and the “Sufferings of Christ”
34:17 Angelic Visitations and Leaving the Movement
41:00 Family Tragedy and Reconnecting After Years Apart
47:15 Apologies, Loss, and Shunning at the Memorial
53:01 What Happened to the Movement’s Leadership
55:05 Kim’s Warning: Open the Bible and Follow Jesus
______________________
Weaponized Religion: From Christian Identity to the NAR:
Paperback: https://www.amazon.com/dp/1735160962
Kindle: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0DCGGZX3K
______________________
– Support the channel: https://www.patreon.com/branham
– Subscribe to the channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCBSpezVG15TVG-lOYMRXuyQ
– Visit the website: https://william-branham.org
– Follow on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/WilliamBranhamOrg
– Follow on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@william.m.branham
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Kim also reflects on high-control church culture, public shaming, pressure to submit, family division, grief, and the long process of healing. The conversation focuses on the dangers of following human leaders as though they speak directly for God, and Kim’s central warning is simple: open the Bible, follow Jesus, and do not allow anyone to replace your relationship with the Lord.
CHAPTERS
00:00 Introduction
01:28 Kim’s Background and First Prophetic Experience
05:42 Trusting Prophecies That Failed
11:53 Public Shaming and Spiritual Authority
18:12 Addiction, Recovery, and Starting Over
24:15 Returning to the Church and Leadership Control
29:30 Submission, Shunning, and the “Sufferings of Christ”
34:17 Angelic Visitations and Leaving the Movement
41:00 Family Tragedy and Reconnecting After Years Apart
47:15 Apologies, Loss, and Shunning at the Memorial
53:01 What Happened to the Movement’s Leadership
55:05 Kim’s Warning: Open the Bible and Follow Jesus
______________________
Weaponized Religion: From Christian Identity to the NAR:
Paperback: https://www.amazon.com/dp/1735160962
Kindle: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0DCGGZX3K
______________________
– Support the channel: https://www.patreon.com/branham
– Subscribe to the channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCBSpezVG15TVG-lOYMRXuyQ
– Visit the website: https://william-branham.org
– Follow on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/WilliamBranhamOrg
– Follow on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@william.m.branham
– Follow on Twitter: https://twitter.com/wmbhr
– Buy the books: https://william-branham.org/site/books
Category
📚
LearningTranscript
00:31Hello, and welcome to another episode of the William Branham Historical Research Podcast.
00:35I'm your host, John Collins, the author and founder of William Branham Historical Research
00:40at william-branham.org, and with me I have Kim McBride, former member of Word of Faith,
00:46New Apostolic Reformation, and the Shepherding Movement.
00:48Kim, it's good to have you on, and that's a mouthful, Word of Faith, New Apostolic Reformation,
00:54Shepherding.
00:54I went to a picnic one time, and I talked to this guy who I think he described himself
01:00the same exact way, and he had some very good memories, fond memories of being in each of
01:07those things, and he had some very triggering, troubling memories of being in each of those
01:11things.
01:12So he was trying to explain to me his journey.
01:14And anyway, I'm interested to hear multiple journeys, and yours I'm really interested
01:20because of some of the things that you mentioned in your email, but maybe we could begin.
01:24Just tell everybody a little bit about yourself.
01:27Well, I became a Christian when I was in my early 20s, and I'm a retired nurse.
01:37And I think the main – I really don't have a whole lot to say about myself except the one
01:42thing that I do want to platform this all on because it affected me so greatly was I
01:47was involved in, well, house meetings.
01:52There was a few church meetings, but it was NAR, Word of Faith.
01:56I don't know how to describe it.
01:58And there was a minister that would come, and he was this prophet that would come to our
02:04city, and somebody invited me to go to see him, and I was going through a real traumatic
02:12time during my life.
02:14I was in a really bad marriage with my three children, and it was their father, and we were
02:21going through a lot of just emotional turmoil, and I was always crying out to the Lord to
02:27deliver me from this situation that I was in.
02:30And I went to see this so-called minister the first time I ever went, and I was pregnant
02:36with my daughter, my youngest daughter.
02:41And he gave me – he called me up.
02:43He called my – he said, little lady in the red, would you stand up?
02:49And I did, and he started telling me all this stuff about myself, and I just started blubbering.
02:56I was just crying and crying.
02:58And I – you know, I've heard of cold readings and all of that, but – which it may have
03:04been, but I mean, the things he was saying, there was no way that he would have known,
03:09and I just knew it was God speaking to me.
03:11And so I went back and saw him several more times, and he spoke some more of the turmoils,
03:20particular turmoil that I was going through in my life.
03:23My children even actually got words at one meeting, and of course, they record it and
03:29give you the cassette tape.
03:32And I stood on those words for several years, and they didn't come to pass.
03:40Quite the opposite came to pass.
03:42And all of this didn't blow up in my face until – I'll tell later what all happened,
03:51but all of this didn't blow up in my face to where I really had to deal with it all
03:54until
03:55the IHOP scandal came out, because this man, he was – he wasn't involved in IHOP that
04:03I'm aware of, but he talked about the Kansas City prophets.
04:07This was back in the early 90s, like Paul Cain, he would talk about Paul Cain's watch
04:13stopping and all these kind of crazy things.
04:16You know, there's a lot of people who really doubt that things are happening in the revival
04:21meetings or in these ministries where they have the prophetic things.
04:25I'm one of the few people who have also witnessed things that they just knew things that they
04:30could not have known.
04:31And I'm not saying that in a bad way.
04:34These were actually good people that this happened to me with, but they were caught up
04:39in a movement that wasn't good.
04:41The problem is, it seems to be widespread, and there do seem to be some tricks involved
04:48in some of the ministries.
04:50So I'll pose it like this.
04:52If there is a real thing, there's an awful lot of the false thing mixed in with it.
04:57And so you can't really tell what's real and what's false, but you wrap yourself so
05:01much up into these ministries that it becomes your everything.
05:04Your life is so intermingled with the life of the people who are involved with it that
05:11you become part of the system.
05:15The problem is, like you said, what if that system starts to fail?
05:19What if the prophecies start to fail?
05:21Then you're asking the question, well, I know this real thing happened to me.
05:26What about this false thing that's happening now?
05:28And people don't really know how to bridge that gap of understanding.
05:32So a lot of times they'll just say, well, I'll put that on the shelf.
05:36I'll think about that later.
05:37And later really doesn't happen.
05:40I'm glad that you were able to get out.
05:42That's the other whole thing about it is that I wasn't really involved in any kind of
05:47a community as far as a church goes, even a community, Christian community.
05:51I was just, I was basically unchurched, but I was going to these meetings and I just had
05:57myself and the Lord.
05:59And of course, I didn't open my Bible much back then because I was never taught that's
06:04what I needed to do.
06:05And so I was relying on these words that this man had given me as though they were thus saith
06:12the Lord, because when the person speaks, that's how they frame it, as though they are
06:18saying, now I'm going to do this and, you know, how they do the words.
06:23And so I relied on those words as though they were literally the word of God, which was horrible
06:31because they, you know, promised the salvation of my unsaved husband, the, you know, all these
06:39promises.
06:40He would tell you things of things there's no way that he could have known.
06:44And then he would prophesy things that were going to happen in the future.
06:47And the way he would say it, he would say it as if it was the Lord's voice and it
06:54was
06:54a guaranteed promise that there's no way that this is not going to happen.
06:59I promise you this is going to happen and that is going to happen.
07:04That didn't happen at all.
07:05The complete opposite.
07:07And, uh, my husband ended up divorcing me.
07:12And, uh, of course I was going through turmoil because I had, you know, told the children
07:18we're fighting the fight of faith.
07:19You know, that's one thing I, I would always remember, you know, about Timothy being told
07:24to fight the good warfare, according to the prophecies that were given him and all this.
07:28And so that I was trying to do, I thought, and teaching my children the same way.
07:35And of course, when it all blew up, that wasn't good.
07:39And he ended up divorcing me.
07:41And the bad part about it is I started going, I did start attending a church and, um, I met
07:50a man there that used to go to a church that when I first got saved, uh, we were friends
07:59with and I had no idea.
08:02I was still standing on the words from my husband.
08:04Even after the divorce, I was still standing on the words, still telling the children, the
08:08Lord's going to save your daddy.
08:09He's promised this, that, and the other.
08:11And, uh, we had had a super bad, uh, hailstorm slash tornado.
08:17They don't know, uh, in my hometown.
08:21And had, I had some damage to my house and this man that I met was talking to me and
08:28we
08:28were rehashing old times, but he sounded so spiritual.
08:31He was talking about the cross of Christ, just all, everything that I always wished I
08:36could hear a man say.
08:38And, um, of course I'd been married to my husband for 17 years, but from the time I was
08:44barely 16 and he was more like a father to me than he was a husband.
08:49I mean, he, so having him leave my life was a very big trauma of abandonment.
08:57And, uh, so when this guy shows up, it was, it was not good.
09:03And he met emotional needs that, you know, and I knew the Lord was warning me to get away
09:10from him, but I didn't do it.
09:11You know, I just kept on saying, I'm okay, Lord, I'm okay.
09:15Well, we ended up, uh, committing fornication with this man.
09:19I did.
09:20And then he held the Bible over me and told me now we need to make this right.
09:25Tonight we need to get married and make what we've done, make this right in the eyes of
09:30the Lord.
09:31And I'm like, I didn't know what to do.
09:34I was in such turmoil.
09:35And anyway, we, we did end up getting married.
09:38And, um, the next morning, um, after our wedding night or whatever, I can remember sitting in
09:46the bed next to him with my knees up in my chest, just wailing because he knew the man
09:53that did that, that I got involved with.
09:56He knew I was standing on prophecies for my husband.
10:01And it sounds crazy to get involved with him like I did.
10:05Uh, but then not only that, but then I traumatized my children because I had promised them that
10:11I was, that their dad was going to be saved.
10:14And here I married another man.
10:17And, um, so anyway, we ended up going to a meeting, my, my, uh, side of the family and
10:26my husband's whole side of the family was there.
10:28And we, we went to meetings down there.
10:30They would have, uh, meetings every several months that were like nationwide.
10:35Uh, you know, people had moved from all over the United States to be there from this person
10:41that, uh, used to be on TBN and I did look it up and it was a fact he had
10:47been on TBN and
10:49very charismatic, very, uh, he was into the shepherding movement, uh, big time.
10:56And, uh, anyway, me and this new husband that I married, we went down there and, uh, you know,
11:02and I was very broken and everything and open to the Lord.
11:06And this man that eventually ended up leaving that place, uh, was there.
11:11He was a, like a co-minister.
11:14He ended up giving us a word and he, as he gave me and my new husband, this word, he
11:19said,
11:20the Lord is telling me to tell you, uh, that he wanted us to move down there basically.
11:25And we did, we came back to our hometown or the house that I was living in, which he had
11:32moved in with me, sold immediately.
11:35We went down to this city.
11:38If I tell you the city, it will be the name of the church because that's what the name
11:42of the church is.
11:44Uh, so anyway, we went down to the church and started trying to settle in and everything.
11:52And, um, the start of the abuse at that church was, uh, one Sunday morning, we were in praise
12:01and worship and I, I think the man started preaching already.
12:05And, uh, I was still in such turmoil for what I had done with my children and everything.
12:09My children were still with me.
12:10I had gotten custody of them and everything that I got up in the middle of the service
12:14and left.
12:15And it's a small city and, you know, I drove our, my van home to our, where we were staying
12:24and I knew, you know, he could find a way home.
12:27Uh, I wasn't, and my children, I think we're visiting my, my first husband for the summer.
12:32And, um, anyway, I had left during the middle of the church service because I was in such
12:38turmoil.
12:39And then the next Sunday we went to church and, um, in the middle of the service, and
12:45this was a, this was a frequent thing that the, the leader did.
12:49He mentioned, he started saying, you know, the funniest thing happened in the last service.
12:54And he started saying about how I got up and left in the middle of the church.
13:00In other words, he was shaming me in front of everyone.
13:03And he looked over at me as he was doing that.
13:06And as he looked over at me, he saw tears in my eyes.
13:10And he said to me, he didn't, he didn't even look at me when he said it.
13:14He said, but he made the statement and do not come to me after this service and confront
13:19me or you'll embarrass me and you'll embarrass yourself.
13:23And so about, I don't know, a few days, I don't know when it was later.
13:28I went, made a meeting.
13:30You had to make meetings with the elders.
13:31They had a passing under the hand that you had to do and all this before you could even
13:36come to the church if you were going to join.
13:39And you had to have regular meetings with the elders, you know, to make sure you could
13:42buy a car or move or get married or whatever.
13:46And, um, I had a meeting with the elder and I sat there in the meeting with the elder with
13:51this new husband that I had married.
13:53And I told him the whole story of getting the word and how I ended up marrying this man.
13:59And he's sitting right next to me and I'm in the presence of this new husband.
14:03And I'm telling him, you know, I know the game you played on me and where I'm at and
14:08everything.
14:08So I'm in such turmoil over it all.
14:11And, uh, so this elder, he said, well, let me call the main elder, the one that shamed
14:17me.
14:17And so he called him.
14:19It took him a while.
14:21He finally got there.
14:22I can't even tell you.
14:23He, he, he had a hair.
14:25He's, I won't even say what I would like to say, but anyway, he came in, he sat down and
14:31I was proceeded to talk to him.
14:34And, but I said to him with tears, my eyes, I think I was actually crying.
14:38I said, the way that you shame people from the pulpit, I said, that's sinful.
14:45It's not right.
14:46Because I'd seen him do it before me.
14:48Well, and, uh, he stood up on his feet and turned on his heels and walked out of the
14:54office and you could have heard a pin drop.
14:57And, um, I think we left shortly after that because, uh, there was, like I said, I think
15:04the children, my children were, um, still spending the summer with their dad and a hometown.
15:10And I was crying out to God to get me out of this marriage, still believing for these,
15:15this word to come to pass, even though I'd screwed up.
15:17That's how crazy it was.
15:20And the man that I was currently married to, he became, I had to get out of the marriage
15:26because he was, he would have killed me.
15:28He told me, uh, he only beat me two times, but the last time they did, he told me to
15:33get
15:33away from him or he would kill me.
15:35And, uh, and I believed him because I'd never been treated that way before.
15:39So anyway, I got out of that marriage and he tried to hold the Bible over me that it was
15:44a sin to divorce and this and that and the other.
15:45But the, I know that the Lord led me out of that marriage.
15:49I ended up moving back to, to my hometown, still holding onto the words and it's such
15:55confusion and turmoil of what I've done.
15:58And just, uh, and trying to get my life all back together.
16:01And, uh, I went to work.
16:03I'm a nurse.
16:04I went to work and, uh, ended up, uh, in the midst of all this, the first husband was in
16:11adultery.
16:11Had been the whole time he was living with another woman, which was very distressing
16:15to me and my kids, because he would take the kids with her, the new woman, they would go
16:21and the kids would come home and tell me what all they'd done.
16:23And, you know, it was very distressing.
16:25Darrell Bock That's a terrible thing to have gone
16:28through.
16:29And yet at the same time, I have heard testimonies from other people, some of which have come
16:34on the podcast with very similar stories.
16:37It's not that that type of thing is widespread, but the problem is that it is enabled in this
16:43movement because of the way the movement, the way that the system empowers the leaders
16:49to have governing power over the people, you mentioned the shepherding movement, some of
16:54these things.
16:55That was one of the problems and the reasons why the shepherding movement was disbanded.
16:59Once you give a person that much authority over another human being, if something happens
17:04within that person and they, they start to have psychological problems that will manifest
17:09in the way that they treat the people under them.
17:12And yet at the same time, there are people who really should not be in leadership.
17:17I'll just say it like that, who are in it and they're empowered, which makes it all the
17:21more scary when you think of some of the examples, what you're telling and some of the examples
17:26you read in the news.
17:27And it all comes back to this.
17:29One of the things that you said, they're using thus saith the Lord constantly in these
17:35types of movements.
17:36They come out and they say, God told me this.
17:38And you listen to it and you have to think, well, if God told them, I have to believe it.
17:42You really can't question it.
17:44You can't question anything.
17:45Well, once they realize that they have that power over you, now let's enter that into your
17:51personal life.
17:52God told me that you need to do this.
17:54Or God told me we, we were made for each other.
17:57That kind of thing happens.
17:59And I have seen the families.
18:01In fact, I've, I'm close friends with a family that was in a similar situation.
18:06Their lives were just totally destroyed because of a minister who had that much power over
18:11the people.
18:12That's absolutely the way it was.
18:16Well, when I, to continue on, when I, I came back to my hometown and I was in all the
18:25turmoil
18:25from still believing the words and them not coming to pass.
18:29And I happened to, at the place that I was working, it, it was an urgent care clinic.
18:36One of my high school friends came in and we used to be best friends our whole time in
18:42high school together.
18:43And she said, Hey, Kim, it's your birthday today.
18:46She said, let me take you out for a drink.
18:48And I'm like, no, I don't do that.
18:50I don't.
18:51And I thought to myself, you know what?
18:54I'm pretty, I'm going to go, I'm going to go have a drink.
18:57I'm just about had it, you know, I, and I, I shouldn't have done it.
19:00Well, the horrible thing that happened was I became addicted and it was not long after
19:07that, that I was a full blown addict.
19:11And little did I know, I don't know anything about that world, even though I was in it a
19:17little while just up in high school, but it is very dangerous.
19:21And, um, it was like Joe, it was like Jonah, uh, people all around me were getting arrested
19:27and all kinds of things.
19:29And, uh, I ended up getting, they actually gave me, uh, some poisons, something.
19:37And I ended up in the emergency room and I knew that if I didn't get out of there, that
19:42I was going to die.
19:43So I ended up going to, uh, getting myself into a place called new life for girls, which
19:51is, um, I don't know if you've ever heard of cookie Rodriguez.
19:55She, she was, uh, it, it was came out of the David Wilkerson teen challenge program type
20:03thing for women.
20:05And I spent 18 months there and the Lord did a tremendous healing in my life.
20:10And I still kind of were, was holding onto those words, but I, I was trying to put them
20:16out of my life and trying to get my life.
20:18I just did a deep healing.
20:19I can remember before I went crying and, and saying to the Lord, I wished I could go into
20:26the foreign legion.
20:27I just wanted to get away to get my head straight.
20:29And he answered my prayer by letting me get all involved in all of that.
20:34And, uh, so anyway, we, uh, ended up, um, I ended up working again.
20:40I was single and my sister and her family were in the town in East Texas, still heavily involved
20:49in that church, the shepherding church.
20:52And, um, she was pregnant with, I think her fourth or fifth child.
20:57I can't remember.
20:58And, um, she had a stillborn, uh, baby boy.
21:04And, um, and my youngest daughter back then was getting, starting to get into trouble and
21:10be rebellious and all.
21:11I can't remember how old she was.
21:13She was 12 or so.
21:14I can't remember, but, uh, I just knew the Lord was wanting me to go back to, to this
21:22city and I did not want to go.
21:25I did not.
21:26The Lord was letting me know in, in prayer times and stuff.
21:29He wanted me to go back to this city.
21:31I didn't want to go because I knew going back to this city didn't mean just going back to
21:36the city.
21:37It meant going back to this church.
21:39And I did not want to go back to that church, but I said, okay, I'm going.
21:43So once I finally got ourselves moved back down there, what you have to do is call and
21:50make an appointment with the elder, the main, you know, elder that's under the leader and
21:58have a passing under the hand meeting.
22:01And I hadn't seen this person since the last meeting, uh, that I had with the former husband.
22:08He met me out in the foyer and I'll never forget.
22:12He, he saw me in the foyer and he, he put his hand up at me, like, and rolled his
22:17eyes,
22:18like, come on back to where he was almost like just, just a contempt and disgust towards
22:24me.
22:24And I think he'd been instructed by the main leader.
22:29Don't let this lady back in our church.
22:32So, um, but I went in, had the meeting, talked very briefly, and he pounded his hand on the
22:41desk and all he kept saying to me, well, are you ready to submit?
22:45Are you ready to submit?
22:47And my head was just down.
22:49He had no idea what all I had been through the past, you know, two years or whatever
22:55that I was, had been there before.
22:58I put my down, my head down.
23:00I just had tears coming down and I put my head up and I asked him in tears, I said,
23:05are
23:05you still mad at me from the time before?
23:10And he just started laughing and tried to brush it off and came over and patted me on the shoulder.
23:15He said, no, you know, but I had a target on my back.
23:18When I went back to the place, you know, one of the real problems with the movement that
23:23I noticed was that people who had really sincere, we would call it precious faith.
23:29Those who had the sincere faith, the ones who really believe the most, those were the
23:35ones that were exploited the most.
23:37Right.
23:38Those are the people who they could look at and say, well, this person is really trying.
23:42Let's get in their head.
23:43And that's what they did in some cases.
23:45Not every church was like that.
23:47I'm not going to say that the entire movement was like this, but there were certain people
23:52that that was just their psychological makeup.
23:54If they could see that they could control a person, they would gravitate to that person
24:00and then amplify that problem with those who should not be in ministry, like the people
24:05that you're talking about.
24:07Those kind of people, it's like they can sense it in the audience.
24:10They will just hone right in on that person.
24:13And that person is just seeking God.
24:15They're literally there because they're seeking God.
24:18And like you, you came back because you're seeking God.
24:21And now the predators move in.
24:23That is the most distressing part about all of this is that all of the people that are
24:29there, they came there.
24:31There's several that are there that gave up entire churches as pastors of churches, you
24:39know, to come to be a part of this movement, they thought.
24:43You know, and of course, they make it as though they're elite and on the cutting edge of what
24:48God is saying to the body of Christ.
24:49You know, the same thing that IHOP did.
24:52But I went back, I ended up meeting my husband and who was the brother of some of the pillars
25:07in this movement that when it first started and me and my husband got engaged.
25:15And I'll never forget when the first Sunday that we walked in holding hands that up on the
25:21stage was the main leader and the elder that I had been involved with.
25:27And they just, the main leader just put his head down and just shook his head like just
25:33in disgust, you know, saw he watched us walk in and he was looking at us and he just put
25:39his
25:39head down like, oh, this is, she's a joke or whatever, you know, and that's all fine and good.
25:46I remember the Lord comforted me quite a bit of that scripture that says they wagged their
25:50heads, they reviled him wagging their heads as they passed by because that's what it
25:54was similar to when all this started, the pain of all this started coming up.
25:59But anyway, we, we, we were engaged and we were planning on being married and everything.
26:07And this is crazy and this sounds terrible, but this man, the main leader, he had a marriage
26:16conference, I'll never forget this.
26:18And he, and he invited, he had this teaching called the mystery of marriage.
26:23He had several teachings.
26:24And I think a lot of his stuff came from what, uh, watchman knee, he invited all, anyone that
26:32was married or was engaged, leaving it open to us.
26:38I didn't say this, but this man's wife, the first time that I was there, she, the first
26:44wife, she was a very modest, very godly woman trying to submit and just do the best she could.
26:53She taught the women.
26:54She was very admired by everyone there and very modest, very taught the women modesty and
27:01everything.
27:01She ended up getting breast cancer and it was very treatable because of, because of the word
27:07of faith.
27:08She died a very slow, agonizing death of something that could have been treated.
27:13Uh, you know, she didn't die until, uh, February.
27:17I think this was diagnosed in, I want to say 97 and she didn't pass away until 99, uh, February
27:25of 99.
27:25And the man remarried in April of 99 and he married a woman like 20 years younger than
27:34he was that looked like she came out of a cosmopolitan magazine and, and nobody batted
27:40an eyelash.
27:41I mean, she came dressed.
27:43My husband told me about this.
27:46He kind of paraded her down.
27:47Like, you know, Hey, look what I've got now.
27:49And it was just, you know, no one batted an eyelash.
27:51It was like they could do whatever and nobody would, you know, there, I don't know if anyone
27:57left the church then or not, but, uh, anyway, so going back to this marriage seminar that
28:02we went to, it was just, when they say seminar, it was just a meeting, you know, a regular,
28:07a regular church meeting, but they called it a seminar.
28:11And, um, and he prefaced the meeting by saying, now I'm going to be having this discussion.
28:17We're going to be talking about marriage and I may be, and he said, if you have a religious
28:22spirit, you may be offended by some of the things that I might say.
28:27Well, he had a dry erase board during that seminar.
28:32This is sounds too, it sounds unbelievable to even be, it is unbelievable.
28:38He drew on the board showing about pleasuring a woman.
28:43And I mean, we didn't go back to the meetings, of course, but I mean, the fact that no one
28:48in the meeting ever said anything, you know, this were the kind of things that would happen
28:54and he would make, I heard him make statements while I was there before I can look out on
28:59this, this audience and I can tell you which one of these women I could go to bed with.
29:04And, you know, looking back at that now, I didn't now where I'm at, I would have stood
29:09up and said, you just told of the sin in your heart of the lust that you're having, but yet
29:16you're making yourself off to be this discerning person that all these people just ate all that
29:22up, you know, and it was just, it was just crazy.
29:25And then moving on, me and my husband, we continued to date.
29:30We continued to go to the church.
29:34And one day I get a phone call from an elder and I answered the telephone.
29:39He said, he said my name.
29:41And then he said, Kim, you need to submit.
29:44He was yelling at me.
29:45You need to submit your life to the Lord Jesus Christ.
29:48And he was yelling.
29:49And I'm, I said, and I said his name and I said, what?
29:54And he said it again.
29:55He wouldn't explain.
29:57And he said it again, the same exact phrase.
29:59And finally I started crying and I said, brother, I said his name and I started crying and I
30:05said, what is all this about?
30:07And, and I, when I started crying, he started laughing and he hung the phone up and I ran
30:12into his wife that evening at the grocery store and I met her.
30:17I'll never forget.
30:17It was in the yogurt aisle and she was crying.
30:20She saw me and she said, I'm so sorry, Kim.
30:24And I hugged her.
30:25I said, it's okay.
30:26It's okay.
30:26You know, don't worry about it.
30:28It's okay.
30:29And then the next Sunday I went to church and I went up to him and I approached him and
30:35I said his name, brother, so-and-so.
30:37I said his name and I was trying to humble myself.
30:40If I've done anything wrong and he just shooed me away with his hand, like get away from me
30:46and turned and walked away.
30:49And then I went up to his wife to embrace her a minute or two later.
30:53And she just turned on her heel and shunned me.
30:56And I'm like, so the next Monday, I think it was, I made a meeting and I met with his
31:03wife in her office because they have a school there.
31:07And I went in her office and I sat down and I sat there and looked across the table from
31:11her, her desk.
31:13And I said her name.
31:14I said, I don't know what in the world is going on.
31:17I said, but I am clean by the blood of Jesus.
31:19And I don't remember, I was trying to defend myself that I had not done anything wrong to be treated
31:24in such a way that I couldn't figure out why I was being treated that way.
31:28And she says to me, her husband, the one that had done it, was in the very next office.
31:32You could have heard a pin drop.
31:34He was listening.
31:35And she said to me, have you ever heard of the sufferings of Christ?
31:39In other words, saying that going through these things is the sufferings of Christ.
31:43And I told her, yes, I know of the sufferings of Christ.
31:47And I don't even remember what else was said.
31:50There wasn't much said after that.
31:51I just got up and left.
31:52And I remember calling my former counselor from the program that I used to be in.
31:58And she said, that's sick.
31:59Have you ever wondered how the Pentecostal movement started or how the progression of modern Pentecostalism transitioned through the latter
32:07reign, charismatic and other fringe movements into the new apostolic reformation?
32:13You can learn this and more on William Branham Historical Research's website, william-branham.org.
32:20On the books page of the website, you can find the compiled research of John Collins, Charles Paisley, Stephen Montgomery,
32:28John McKinnon, and others, with links to the paper, audio, and digital versions of each book.
32:34You can also find resources and documentation on various people and topics related to those movements.
32:40If you want to contribute to the cause, you can support the podcast by clicking the Contribute button at the
32:47top.
32:47And as always, be sure to like and subscribe to the audio or video version that you're listening to or
32:53watching.
32:54On behalf of William Branham Historical Research, we want to thank you for your support.
32:59The sad part about this is, I know there are people listening that will say, this is an extreme case.
33:04Well, you're talking about a movement that wasn't even connected to mine.
33:07And I have, I can put in my mind faces to people who are doing similar things.
33:12And I've had other people who were in ministries that also weren't connected, and they have faces that they can
33:18put to it.
33:19And this movement, this thing that Branham created, Branham and Lindsay, created this thing where it enabled people to get
33:27ultimate power over the people in their church.
33:30And they would say that it was for God.
33:32They would use, thus saith the Lord.
33:33All the different things that you're talking about, this is what spun off into the Word of Faith movement.
33:38They said, we literally have the voice of God flowing through our mouths.
33:42It's a new revelation.
33:43But then people like this were also in the mix.
33:47And none of the people who had this quote-unquote true revelation even had the power to see that among
33:53these sheep, there are these wolves who are going to rise into power.
33:58And some of them, I'm not going to give names.
34:00You actually mentioned the television station that had it.
34:04But there are people who are connected, directly connected to ministers who are in the movement, who claim that they
34:11have the power of God to see.
34:13Why can't they see the wolves?
34:15That's really the question that I ask.
34:16Well, we ended up leaving.
34:20Talking about the message, this man, the main leader, he would have these angelic visitations.
34:27That was the other thing that he would do.
34:29He would have angelic visitations, and he would tell of these things to people.
34:33And the last one that I remember, one of them was at a pizza hut.
34:37He said that he was there with his first wife, and the angel appeared again that he hadn't seen in
34:46a while.
34:47And the angel appeared again, and he spoke to the angel.
34:50He said, I didn't catch your name the first time.
34:53Could you tell me your name?
34:54I mean, these are the kind of stories that he would tell.
34:56And people would just sit there and not, you know, it was just blow your mind.
35:02That no one would question these things.
35:04But the last thing that he said when you bring up the message was that he was in his tent
35:10one night.
35:11He would take men.
35:12This is the other thing.
35:13He would take men to a nearby state, and they would have men's meetings.
35:19And when he did, a lot of the men's meetings that he went around the campfire was teaching the men
35:26how to pleasure their wives.
35:28And so the wives, I can remember my sister bragging about how she was so glad that her husband went
35:35to the meeting.
35:36And he even made the statement from the pulpit, the wives, the husbands may end up leaving, but the wives
35:44will stay with me in this group.
35:47I mean, you know, and nobody bats an eyelash at any of this stuff.
35:52And so we ended up leaving.
35:55We ended up moving back to my hometown.
35:59I had gotten a phone call that my daughter from her father that she had attempted to self-harm.
36:08And I just got in the car, and I drove to the hometown.
36:12We moved back to where I'm from, and I had found a blog during all this time of a man
36:23that had started a blog about all the misdeeds of this place and the abuse that he's done.
36:30He had gone to South Africa and caused much harm down there and families, broken up families.
36:37And the other thing, I can remember being at a service there.
36:41I don't know if you ever remember that song called Who Let the Dogs Out?
36:45They sang that song in their worship, Who Let the Dogs Out?
36:49And then they would chant, Release the Dogs of War.
36:52And they had some of the men in the thing dressed up in fatigues as like a ceremony that they
37:00were going to go in and tear churches down and to follow him, basically.
37:06And on that blog, the blog that I found, I got quite involved in it.
37:12There was very few people on it, but the guy that owned the blog, he really liked what I had
37:16to say because I had a lot to say because I had studied out all these false things that were
37:22going on.
37:25And I was able to, he liked my, the words that I said.
37:30So he liked me being on his blog and it was on a Facebook page and it had my picture
37:35and I had a, you know, a name that no one knew.
37:38And I, I asked him, please do not let anyone know who this is.
37:44And one of the doctrines that they had down there and I've confronted recently in months because me and my
37:51husband, we have a Facebook page and our, our main goal was to reach people there to get them out.
37:57And I, we put up one of the doctrines that they had was they would use Galatians chapter four, where
38:06it talks about how that we were under tutors and governors until the, the time of, you know, how the
38:12law was our schoolmaster to lead us to Christ.
38:16But they used, they twisted it and use the tutors and governors phrase as tutors and governors are who you
38:23need to be under until you become a full, full grown son.
38:28This is how they framed it.
38:30And this is how they still frame it.
38:32My husband was told when we left the church, someone took him out to eat that was an acquaintance and
38:39said, I'm worried about your sonship.
38:41You know, if you leave, you're going to lose your sonship.
38:44You know, that's what you're taught there, that if you're not obedient, you know, and you're familiar with the way
38:50they do that.
38:51Anyway, I had gotten involved on this blog and someone on the Facebook page, which what the blog was on
39:00from the church that had left there, sent me a friend request.
39:05And he, I objected to his friend request and I wrote him a long rebuking reply of why I did
39:15not want to accept his friend request of all his mistreatments that he did.
39:19And his hypocrisy for now wanting to be my friend after the way he shunned me and the way he
39:27was at the church, you know, basically, I just confronted the church, the church's misdeeds on this guy's web page,
39:35Facebook page.
39:36Well, the blog owner of this saw it and he took it and posted it on his blog about the
39:47church, which put my identity out there.
39:51So everyone knew that it was Kim McBride that was writing these things, which was a disaster because the McBride
40:00family is there.
40:03They have eight children.
40:04It was the husband and my brother's, my husband's brother and his wife.
40:10They have eight children plus several, many grandchildren.
40:14It's a huge family that are in this thing.
40:17And, um, it's grown over the years, but back then that's what happened.
40:23And shortly after that, just months after they found out who it was that was, um, on this blog, uh,
40:30because what the man would do is he would record their on live, not live, but he would, he would,
40:36uh, review their services.
40:39They had it on YouTube and he would review the services or a recording.
40:43He had some way to get a recording of it.
40:45I can't remember if YouTube was going back then or not.
40:47And, and he would critique their services and I would be there critiquing with him as well.
40:53Uh, you know, but then my identity got put out.
40:57They already knew who he was, but I didn't want my identity out, but there it was.
41:01Well, months later, my daughter completed her attempt at taking her life.
41:06She was gone and, um, you know, of course that was the judgment of God on me for speaking out
41:13against this leader.
41:14And we didn't hear anything, you know, from them at all.
41:19Uh, actually, uh, it was a real hard time.
41:23But then years later, uh, and, you know, I, I kind of, I got off that blog after that, that
41:30man did that to me, uh, exposed me and everything.
41:34I just quit.
41:35I thought, you know, what's the point?
41:36I'm not going to do it anymore now that everyone knows who I am.
41:38I've said plenty.
41:39I mean, I called the man diatrophies, all kinds of things.
41:42I exposed their false teachings and a bunch of things.
41:44And I, I just, going through all that, I wasn't going to, so I just backed away from it and
41:50I stayed backed away from it for the longest time.
41:53Uh, anyway, the IHOP came out and in 2020, my younger daughter overdosed and passed away and, um, no condolences
42:04once again.
42:06Uh, and I don't even think we even told them until my, my brother-in-law called my, uh, brother
42:14up one day.
42:15This was the crazy part about it is I can't remember if IHOP was going on.
42:19I don't remember the reason why I started getting interested again in what was going on over at that church,
42:24but I did.
42:25And I started looking the man up and I found out that he was doing a podcast with another man
42:31trying to, you know, that's what he would do.
42:33He would get involved with this other group and this other group trying to garner more support for his movement
42:39or whatever.
42:40And he ended up getting taken down.
42:43Somebody reported to this person that he was on, that he, they need to get away from him.
42:49And I guess they took him seriously and they took, they took the, the leader of this cult that I
42:54was in down.
42:55And I was just spending a lot of time in prayer about it and everything.
42:59And the next thing I know, a month or two later, my brother-in-law calls my husband and says,
43:05we're wanting to come see y'all.
43:07And they live in East Texas, eight hours away.
43:10And when I found that out, I was just like, I said, there is no way I can't, I, there's
43:16no way that I can have this, you know, and I prayed and prayed about it.
43:21And I finally, I got peace and I said, I told my husband, I said, they're not coming.
43:25It's going to, it's going to work.
43:27They're not coming.
43:27Well, no, they were coming and they showed up.
43:31And when they did, they pulled into our driveway.
43:34I was beside myself.
43:36The love of God that came out from me towards them was just, it was supernatural.
43:42And I embraced them and I just loved them.
43:47And I didn't, we didn't talk about anything for the, for, for several days until one day during their four,
43:55four or five day visit, I did get to expose a lot of things that they did not know.
44:01And my sister-in-law said, she just rolled her out.
44:04She said, I just let that stuff roll off my back like water off a duck's back.
44:08I don't, you know, she was very dismissive of it all, even though it was quite shocking.
44:13It's in more detail than what I've given you, the things that happened, you know, because they had all been
44:19told a narrative by this leader.
44:22You know, they had to have been, been told a narrative by this leader about me, you know, and, and
44:31I, I, but I did confront my sister-in-law about their non-condolences of the deaths of my daughter.
44:39And, and, and she apologized somewhat.
44:43She just, you know, she didn't seem that sorry, but she apologized.
44:46And I was grateful, you know, I was glad, I was more grateful that I got to tell my side
44:51of the story and let them know they'd been deceived all this time, but they didn't change their, the way
44:57they thought.
44:58She made the statement, though, and this was crazy.
45:01She said, well, we thought once about leaving, and my brother-in-law looked at her and said, we did.
45:08And it was weird.
45:10But anyway, they ended up leaving.
45:12They ended up going back to East Texas.
45:16And I had a few texts back and forth with my sister-in-law.
45:21She was still, it was like they, they have the mindset there.
45:25If you're not part of their group and you are a Christian that has any kind of walk with the
45:30Lord, it's almost like how the elder brother and the prodigal son, they're kind of like the elder brother.
45:39Like, you know, you know, we've been going through all this for years, sticking with this guy, and you, you've
45:44got to walk with the Lord, and you haven't gone through us, what we've gone through, staying with this man.
45:51It really breaks my heart to hear the stories like yours where there are lives involved.
45:56I have had, I can't tell you how many multiple people have told me that they either had a friend
46:02or family member, that this, this is happening.
46:05And the other thing that's really hard for me, I can't even put all of that on YouTube, because YouTube
46:11does not, the platform does not allow me to talk about that specific subject.
46:16And I'm, I'm dancing around the word, if you can't tell.
46:20But it is widespread in this movement, and it needs to be talked about.
46:24That's one, that's one of the real hard truths.
46:26And at the same time, I have had multiple people tell me, in fact, I want to say early in
46:33my, when I first began this in 2012, was the first person.
46:37They told me, John, I have tried to do the thing that you're describing with your daughters multiple times.
46:44And until I started getting into your research, I never knew that it was the church causing me this.
46:50And this person is thriving today.
46:52This is a person who escaped, they deprogrammed, they got through it.
46:56But think of all the people who don't escape.
46:59That's really the hard part for me.
47:01And that, that really is widespread.
47:03And I'm glad you're talking about it.
47:05And I'm glad you talked about it in the way that you did, because I think I can release it
47:08like this.
47:09It's really difficult for people like me to talk about.
47:12But it's, this is a really hard story.
47:15Yes, well, my, my sister-in-law, she, we, like I said, we had texts back and forth a little
47:21bit.
47:21And then one day we had our final interaction and she wanted, she initiated it and wanted to say that
47:31she was sorry for, for their, not being, you know, non-condolence of the deaths of our daughters.
47:39She didn't come out and say the word shunning, but she was basically trying to say that.
47:44And she said she just didn't understand it all.
47:48And, and I was in tears and I accepted her apology.
47:51And we, you know, over the phone embraced each other in love.
47:54And I told her I loved her and I, and I, it was very emotional.
47:57And, and then about a month or so later, I don't know, I'm sorry.
48:03We got a phone call that she was killed in a fiery crash.
48:09And we were, of course, just in shock.
48:12And my husband and me both were like, we're going down there.
48:17We didn't get condolences in our tragedy.
48:20We are going to go down there and show them what the Lord wants for us to be as the
48:25body of Christ.
48:26So we went down there and, um, a large family was there and it was a little bit at a
48:32time, one by one, the grown up, the grown children.
48:37Now they were all grown.
48:38Uh, and, um, I'm stumbling around.
48:43They, they gave me condolences of, of, uh, that they, and they apologized for not, uh, giving us any condolences
48:53at the loss of my daughters.
48:55But the fact was, it wasn't any of them that we were really that upset about.
48:59It was there, it was my brother and sister-in-law because they were too young to expect them to
49:05give condolences at the time that it all happened.
49:07But anyway, so we went to the memorial service and I was, I was hopeful.
49:12It seemed as though the Lord was healing up our family somewhat.
49:15And it was really, I was hopeful and I was, I was praising the Lord, expecting that there was going
49:20to be some kind of healing in all of it.
49:22And we went to the memorial service about a week later.
49:26Everyone came from out of town and all over the place.
49:29And, um, I knew there would probably be some shunning, but I had no clue what it was going to
49:36be.
49:37And I'm sure there were several hundred people there.
49:39I would make eye contact with people.
49:42You know, we, we went in there and we were sitting down and everything.
49:45And I would see people that, you know, I used to be somewhat friendly with.
49:49And when they recognized who I was, of course, it'd been 20 years.
49:53So we, of course, we've aged and everything.
49:54But when they recognized who it was, they were looking at, they would have a smile on their face.
49:59And when they recognized it was me, they would grimace and turn their face away.
50:05And, you know, which that wasn't, that wasn't, it was painful, but it wasn't, I expected somewhat that.
50:12But the weird part was my husband never had any, uh, problems with the church.
50:18He, he never spoke against him.
50:20It was always me.
50:21He was an innocent victim.
50:23They all thought that just married this woman.
50:25That's crazy.
50:26They think.
50:27So, um, the thing that was so, that was so hurtful is that we were standing there and,
50:36and, and just me and my husband were standing there and one elder comes up to him and grabs
50:43him by the shoulders and embraces him and says his name and then puts him at, uh, arm's length
50:49and looks him in the eyes and tells him how much he loves him and how are you doing, buddy?
50:54We just think you're, we just love you and this and that.
50:57And I'm standing right next to him as though they were instructed by someone.
51:02And I think, I definitely think they were to do this, to purposely embrace him and to
51:09ignore me because two, three people did that back to back, the exact same thing.
51:16And when we left there that day, as we were walking out to the car, oh, I actually, my sister
51:24was there because she used to be, she went to the funeral, the memorial service too.
51:28She'd moved back to our hometown.
51:30And when I saw her, we, we hadn't seen each other for years, but when I saw her during the,
51:36after all that happened, I just fell into her arms and started bawling.
51:40I said, you're the first friendly face I've seen in all of this.
51:43But anyways, we were walking out to the car after it was over with me and my husband.
51:47I've never seen my husband's eyes filled with such anger.
51:52It frightened me.
51:53He was so angry.
51:54But then he, my husband, and he wouldn't mind me telling you this, he's the kind that
51:58stuffs things emotionally.
52:00And he did for a long time until we, until recently.
52:06But then months later, I put up in the middle of the night on a Facebook page, what had happened
52:13at that memorial service.
52:15And I got a direct message back from the daughter of the woman who perished, my sister-in-law.
52:21And she said, Aunt Kim, I'm in tears.
52:24I can't believe that you were done that way.
52:26I'm so sorry.
52:28I can't believe.
52:29And she's a member of the church.
52:30She said, I'm so sorry that you were done that way.
52:32She was so upset that I was mistreated.
52:34And then a few days later, after the next Sunday service, she direct messaged me and said, Aunt
52:41Kim, do you know the pain that you're causing our family?
52:44And I mean, I was just, you know, and it was pretty much left that way.
52:50It never did resolve after that.
52:52And so that's, that's pretty much the end of the story.
52:54And we're, we've got our Facebook page up and we're still trying to reach people, but
53:01they've reframed things.
53:02They've been confronted about their false doctrine.
53:06They just reframe it.
53:07It's still, ever since the man, the main man, he had had a heart attack.
53:14And I'll tell you, I, I prayed for that man.
53:17And I did, I don't even want, I wouldn't even, a real Christian in my mind does not
53:22even want to see Hitler go to hell.
53:24You know, that's just the, the Lord has no pleasure in the death of the wicked.
53:28And, and I prayed for him.
53:30Then he ends up getting leukemia and it was very fast acted and died.
53:36And, and, and the, his, his second wife ended up leaving the church, but they're still
53:41continuing on with their discipleship program and their, the way that they've always
53:47been, but they don't have that main leader there with that fear that kept everyone bound.
53:52It's not near like what it used to be.
53:54But the fact that, um, I didn't get to say this, that two different people during all
53:59this time, one was one of the main leaders that was with this guy.
54:03He wrote a public letter and we have it on our page, this, uh, separating himself from
54:11this leader and saying, having begun in the spirit, he's now in the flesh and he is sinning.
54:18He has broken up families and all this kind of stuff.
54:21I, and I want to publicly say, I do not.
54:24He called it, he called it out.
54:25Unlike people like Derek Prince that went away from it and never said a word, this man went
54:31away from it and he had plenty to say, you know, just so he wouldn't be associated.
54:38And then another leader, uh, did the same thing.
54:42Uh, he called him out because he was supposedly this man's, uh, overseer, this man, this leader
54:49there didn't have an overseer.
54:52He was discipled by the Lord Jesus Christ.
54:54Although everyone else had to be discipled by them, you know, I'm rambling, but thank
55:00you for your opportunity to let me say all this.
55:03I appreciate it.
55:04If you could go back in time, way back before all of this happened, knowing all of the things
55:10that you would go through, very, very hard things that you have gone through.
55:14If you could give some advice to yourself, what advice would you give yourself?
55:17Open the Bible, open the Bible, read the words of Jesus.
55:22The words that stick out to me and my main warning to everyone is if they say, here's
55:32Christ, there's Christ, somebody anointed someone that, you know, Paul said, Hey, what
55:38are you doing?
55:39Don't follow me.
55:40Don't follow Apollos.
55:41Don't follow Cephas, follow Jesus.
55:44And, you know, and I, that's not me and my Bible and Jesus.
55:48We are to have fellowship, but the thing of following a man.
55:54Following a man is the most dangerous thing, well, you know, that you can do.
56:01And giving, they usurp the Holy Spirit in your life.
56:06And that's just, don't allow anybody to usurp your relationship with the Lord.
56:12If the Lord wants to tell me something, the Lord can tell it to me His self.
56:16I don't need someone else telling me the Lord says to you.
56:21I'm not completely close to that, but I tell you, I've got a seatbelt with airbags when
56:26it comes to the charismatic movement.
56:28And for people who are listening who might want to reach out and connect with you or your
56:34materials, where do they find you on the web?
56:37Well, they can find us on our Facebook page.
56:41It's Michael Kim McBride.
56:43We combined our names and direct message us there.
56:49I really, I think all of this, John, has been for my own healing, just to tell it.
56:54I don't, as much as I hope that people will come out of it after all of this, I, you
57:00know,
57:00it's like the Jim Jones thing.
57:02You, you, you're in it so deep.
57:04They've got so much.
57:05The other thing I would say, they have so much equity in it that you can't come out of it.
57:11You have so much equity that you just can't get away from it.
57:14Well, it's a very hard story to listen to, but I think more people need to hear it.
57:18Thank you so much for doing this.
57:20Thank you, John.
57:21I appreciate it very much.
57:23Thank you for the opportunity.
57:24I'm so, I was so surprised that you wanted to hear my story and I appreciate you very much.
57:29Thank you for everything you do.
57:31Sincerely, I mean it.
57:33Well, if you've enjoyed our show and you want more information or to share your story,
57:36you can check us out on the web.
57:37You can find us at william-branham.org.
57:40For more about the dark side of the new apostolic reformation,
57:43you can read Weaponized Religion from Christian Identity to the NAR.
57:47Available on Amazon, Kindle, and Audible.
58:18And we'll see you guys on Facebook.
58:23Bye.
58:25Bye.
58:29Bye.
58:29Bye.
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