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00:00Today is Josh Allen's birthday, 30.
00:04I saw that he's made, this probably will come as no surprise,
00:08much more money than any other football player in history
00:12by the age of 30, before reaching 30.
00:15Mahomes is already 30, so happy birthday to Josh Allen.
00:19One question I had about him for when we were going to talk to Sal again,
00:23and now we're going to do that,
00:25is for whatever reason, his age, new head coach, I don't know,
00:31you guys have any reason to think, starting with Sal,
00:33you have any reason to think, as we talk about maybe every year,
00:37just to get it in, like how he's used is going to be any different?
00:41I mean, are we yet to the day that probably eventually will come
00:45where they try to scale him back,
00:47and they've done that in certain ways the last couple of years?
00:50I don't know.
00:51Sal, what does all that sound like to you?
00:55Yeah, I think they've tried to do that a little bit here and there,
00:58but really at the end of the day, I think it's just too tough,
01:01and Brandon Bean has alluded to this, and I agree,
01:02which is Josh is going to be his own guy,
01:04and it's just the way he's wired is what he's going to do.
01:07We don't see all these design runs all the time.
01:09Maybe early in his career we saw more,
01:11but that went away maybe a few years ago.
01:12Only in select games we'll see, okay, like they had a game plan to do that.
01:16But you'll see it once in a while still.
01:17You'll see a third down and critical run.
01:20Look, they did it against Jacksonville, right, a couple of times,
01:22I remember in the playoff game,
01:24and then you have the quarterback sneaks that play a part of it.
01:26I think overall, though, the scrambling, deciding to take off,
01:32that's on Josh.
01:32That's just not going away.
01:34No matter what you really kind of try to do there,
01:37I just don't think you're going to have any success
01:40if you're telling him not to do that specifically.
01:42Yeah, and I think maybe to a certain extent, his play,
01:48his ability to scramble effectively will maybe give them clues
01:55about when they should definitively, if they ever will,
01:58sort of scale back the designed runs, right?
02:00I mean, a guy gets to be whatever.
02:02I'm not talking about necessarily this season at all here,
02:04but another five years down the road,
02:07you're seeing him less effective as a runner and a scrambler.
02:10You're just logically going, okay, well, this isn't going to help me as much,
02:14so there's no point in just continuing to try to hammer into the same hole here.
02:20He can't really do that anymore.
02:22But I don't think we're there yet.
02:24I felt like, Sal, it could have been coincidence or circumstantial
02:27that there were multiple times this year
02:31where he went for what looked like an opening
02:36right around the line of scrimmage
02:38and it shut on him faster than he was used to.
02:41Now, that could just be better defending
02:44or that could be, you know,
02:46it's just a fraction slower than it was two years ago
02:50or three years ago.
02:51You know, eventually that is going to really slow down
02:55and maybe it already has started subtly
02:57and we just don't really know it yet.
02:59Yeah, it's a good question and a good point.
03:01And yeah, maybe there is a little bit of that there
03:04that maybe it's a little tick different and slower.
03:07But man, he doesn't appear to be, right?
03:11And I would say that there's definitely more game planning
03:13to understand those escape lanes for him.
03:16Josh has never really been, I shouldn't say never been,
03:20majority of a lot of the scrambles have been that way in that regard.
03:24He finds an opening in between the tackles
03:25and he's going to take off, he's going to run straight
03:27and he's really big and he just does that.
03:29It's maybe a little bit different than when Lamar Jackson runs
03:32and he runs around the edge.
03:33And yes, they'll have some design plays.
03:35So I'm guessing teams try to do a better job there
03:38of containing him.
03:40But sure, maybe if we see that happen again
03:41more and more this year, we think, okay,
03:43is there something there that we can glean from this?
03:47Now, if you take a look at his,
03:48it's just basic stats in rushing, right?
03:50And there's a lot that gets baked into this.
03:52We know that.
03:53I mean, the last three years have all been about the same.
03:56111 attempts, 102 attempts, back to 112 last year.
03:59He actually had more attempts last year
04:01than the previous two years, just by one though.
04:03But if you go back to the two years previous,
04:05it's over 120 each year.
04:06So there was a time where he was definitely being used more
04:09and the numbers reflected.
04:11Over 760 yards rushing two straight years,
04:13he's failed to get to 600,
04:15but he's still in the 500 plus range,
04:18which is pretty incredible for a quarterback,
04:19to be honest.
04:20That's right.
04:20And it really just has to start with the touchdowns.
04:24It's, I think, my favorite Bill stat to track and has been.
04:28I mean, he has, including playoffs,
04:30think about this number.
04:32In the last three seasons,
04:33he has rushed for 48 touchdowns.
04:37That's incredible.
04:37Including playoffs.
04:38That's more than like Dalvin Cook's career.
04:40That's absurd.
04:41That is absurd.
04:43It's crazy.
04:43Yeah.
04:44If he keeps that pace up for one more season,
04:47he'll have had more rushing touchdowns in the last four years,
04:50like post-COVID, than OJ ever had.
04:53That's incredible.
04:55Isn't it?
04:55He's already 18 past OJ's career number, you know, in total.
04:59But he showed up and he was rushing for eight, nine touchdowns.
05:03I'm like, come on.
05:03This is not sustainable.
05:04And he's just like doubled it almost the last three years.
05:08So really amazing.
05:10Yeah, the goal line, you guys have said it.
05:12And they maybe have wanted to rein him in some,
05:17but then the games get important and it's on.
05:20And so you have that.
05:21And then, of course, these goal line plays where this is what we're doing.
05:25I'm going.
05:26You know, if I'm a split second later on third and five at the 50,
05:31because of whatever reason, maybe it's just there's a part of,
05:34like this is Lamar Jackson, I think.
05:35There's a part of it where you could have,
05:38I'm going to break ties trying to find something downfield here.
05:41Instead of just, you know, doing what my instinct is to just run for the first down,
05:46avoid the hit that way, et cetera.
05:47You get down to the two-yard line.
05:49Yeah, right.
05:49Get on the horse, buddy.
05:50That's right.
05:52And, I mean, I'm thinking of that Jacksonville game, Sal,
05:54and I think, you know, Trevor Lawrence.
05:57Trevor Lawrence did rush for eight or nine touchdowns last year himself.
06:00But in that game, there were a couple of moments where, like, all right, buddy.
06:04He didn't have it.
06:05You got to go.
06:06There was that third down where he went down early.
06:08That's right.
06:09Fourth down, even.
06:09Fourth down inside the five, and he sort of slipped or whatever that was.
06:13Yes.
06:14Yes.
06:14So, Allen is not unique but very special in that area.
06:19So, we'll see what we get.
06:20He turns 30 today.
06:23Sal Capaccio with us.
06:24One thing on the schedule we haven't gotten to with you,
06:27we talked about it a little bit yesterday,
06:28and I know in the morning you also were doing that, the opener.
06:32We've talked about Detroit on a Thursday night to open the stadium in week two,
06:37but not drawing the Texans in week one.
06:40What do you think of that?
06:43Drawing the Texans week one?
06:45I'm sorry.
06:45Yeah.
06:45What was the first part of that?
06:46That's the question.
06:47Just what do you think of opening in Houston?
06:49Oh, what do I think of the opener overall?
06:50I'm sorry.
06:51Well, there was always a possibility, we talked about this a lot,
06:54that the home opener would be week two.
06:56That happened, you know, whether you'd like the Thursday night or not.
06:58It was always a possibility to me it would be a week two game,
07:01and they would open week one on the road.
07:03Then you look at their road schedule, and, you know,
07:06I guess I always lean towards division no matter what, even in the home opener.
07:11But if you look at, you know, the outside division teams,
07:14there's just a bunch of, wow, like really important games and good teams.
07:18And it didn't matter who you put there.
07:20You're going to have probably a pretty sexy opener if it's not the Jets
07:23or the Dolphins, to be quite honest with you.
07:25So I think the Texans are a very, you know, very highly rated type of game
07:29for the NFL, for the Bills to start there.
07:32I think I go right to what has happened there over the last few years,
07:35every time they've played there, it seems like, with Josh Allen at quarterback.
07:37And, oh, my God, you know, you've got to go there, this place,
07:40this house of horrors that you're going to start out 0-1 maybe.
07:42But I also think if you look back at the Texans history,
07:45they have been a team that seems to get better as the season goes on.
07:49They have some changes at offensive line again this year.
07:53You know, Deshaun Watson wasn't – I'm just Deshaun Watson, excuse me.
07:56I've got him in the brain.
07:56I saw something about him with the Browns.
07:58And, of course, he used to be in Houston.
08:00CJ Stroud was not at his best as the season ended last year.
08:04I think there's a lot of questions about him this offseason right now in Houston.
08:07So I think it's a really intriguing game from that standpoint.
08:10Look, they have a really good defense.
08:11We know that.
08:12That, to me, has been the biggest critical issue and area why the Bills,
08:16you know, last year specifically struggled, but maybe in some other games.
08:20And that's going to be a challenge again.
08:22But I think from an overall standpoint of when you get that team,
08:24it's probably better to get them week one than it might be week seven or eight.
08:27Last year was really about Allen being under siege.
08:30And it's not to say that he wasn't under duress the year before,
08:34but it wasn't to me, as I recall it,
08:36I don't think the sack numbers would back this up or how I remember the game.
08:40I just – Allen had a terrible day just getting the ball out anywhere.
08:46Right?
08:46Didn't he, like, 9 of 23 or something?
08:48Like, the numbers were gassed two years ago?
08:50Yeah.
08:519 of 30.
08:52Two years ago.
08:52Right.
08:53Okay.
08:53I think that a lot of the issue we talked about were the receivers,
08:56to be honest with you.
08:57Right, right.
08:57Yeah.
08:58And there was that situation towards the end of the game
09:00with the three different plays and all that,
09:02how it went down the clock management that people debated.
09:04Right.
09:04I mean, that was a big deal,
09:05but I feel like it was more on the conversation of receivers.
09:09Not that Josh didn't have any blame, of course,
09:12but I thought last year was more about the offensive line
09:15than it was about the receivers and for him being under siege
09:18when those things happened.
09:19Yep.
09:209 of 30 for 131.
09:22One of his worst games ever, at least by numbers.
09:24Nobody caught more than two passes in that game.
09:28So, that's the opener.
09:29Bill's at Texans.
09:30I was – you were away last week,
09:32but I was kind of thinking Minnesota for that game.
09:35I thought that would be kind of cool,
09:36but in the end, I mean, it's just a guess.
09:41Receivers.
09:42On a personal note, by the way,
09:43I'll say I was hoping for Houston later in the year
09:44because warmer weather cities in September
09:47are not as fun as warmer weather cities in November, December.
09:49Right.
09:50Seems reasonable.
09:52There's been a lot of tight end talk league-wide lately.
09:56Teams, to varying degrees,
09:58seemingly showing interest in running two or three tight end sets
10:03or what they'd call 12 or 13 personnel.
10:05The Rams leaning into the position.
10:08And the Bills for a couple of years have been interesting in this area.
10:12And there's just a – there's always –
10:15here we're back – they're back at practice and you're out there
10:17and, you know, is Dalton Kincaid bigger?
10:20And here we're having that conversation again.
10:22There's always a conversation happening about his production.
10:27And what about it?
10:29Like, is it because of whatever reason?
10:32Is he not as good as we want or just whatever it is?
10:35And I think every time – I've heard these conversations
10:38and read a couple of threads, and I think for me, Sal,
10:42there's just like one takeaway, which is he's capped by Knox.
10:48He's capped by the fact that they have another tight end
10:52that makes a lot of money, that plays with his hand down,
10:56and Kincaid really doesn't.
10:58Like, you can't – we've had this conversation for years now, I think,
11:01that Kincaid doesn't offer them – or they think, anyway,
11:04by how they've used him, doesn't offer them that kind of ability to play a –
11:09like, if you will, a full-time role.
11:11In line, right.
11:12At the position.
11:13So he's like – he's not a gadget, but he's not somebody who can compete
11:18with the tight ends around the league that don't have that competition
11:23internally, I think.
11:24So route running, all the yards per route, all those kind of stats
11:29as a pass catcher, he does fine.
11:31But I don't know.
11:32Like, is there a reason to think this year will be different in how they use him?
11:36Is that maybe related to his health or scheme or what?
11:40It's really interesting how you've kind of phrased that,
11:44and I'm thinking about there's two different comparisons here
11:47and two different relationships you're talking about.
11:49There's the relationship to the rest of the tight ends in the league
11:52who are really the top at their position, as you talk about.
11:54And then there's a relationship to within his own room.
11:59And I would say from what Joe Brady has said, even just on Tuesday
12:03when we heard from Joe Brady, which is, you know, Dalton,
12:08they feel he can block.
12:09Like, they have no problem asking him to do that, but why do it?
12:13When you have – what he said was, essentially, I think I'm paraphrasing here,
12:17what Joe Brady said was, we don't need to ask him to go, you know,
12:20dig out defensive linemen or defensive ends when you have Jackson Hawes
12:23who can do that.
12:24We're not asking him to do that.
12:26But at the same time, he's a willing blocker.
12:27He was actually pretty good at it last year when – especially early in the year.
12:31You guys remember, there's some clips of, like, man,
12:32he really got pretty good at this.
12:34But why have him do that and put that wear and tear on his body
12:38when you have Dawson Knox, when you have Jackson Hawes?
12:41And while that is a negative for him to be on the field,
12:44it's what the Bills want.
12:46It's what any team would want, I would think,
12:47because you're taking – you're taking, like, a player that you can kind of
12:52keep all that – those miles and that wear and tear off his body.
12:56But sure, now you're also kind of making him into a role where he's not the same
13:02full-time as the guys who are always on the field doing all of those things
13:06and putting up numbers.
13:07So it's really interesting.
13:09I don't think he's – I don't think that's going to change, Mike.
13:11I do think a lot of it is the health, though.
13:14I mean, that's been the talk, the health.
13:16And he missed four games two years ago.
13:19He missed five games last year.
13:21Despite missing the five games last year, I went and looked at the numbers
13:25and kind of put this in my State of the Bills tight end article before I left,
13:29which is pretty interesting.
13:30I didn't realize how good he was.
13:32So he averaged close to 48 yards a game.
13:36It doesn't sound like a lot.
13:37That's 10th most tight end in the league when he played.
13:39Now, some of those games he didn't play that much.
13:40Like, he might have had a lighter workload.
13:43So he actually still, despite that, 10th most in the league.
13:47He was second in the league at his position with 14.6 yards per reception,
13:52which, oh, by the way, is exactly what we were told last year he was going to do.
13:55He was going to go down the field, be a field stretcher, more yak,
13:58more yards per catch, I should say, and that's exactly what happened.
14:01And then the newer stat that people talk about, 2.76 yards per route run,
14:07I'm number one in the league at that.
14:09And if I'm looking at that as a coach going, I don't want to go away from that.
14:12I love that stuff.
14:14Why do I need to have him go blocking people and worry about his health
14:17when I can have him do those things?
14:18Right.
14:18What I would want is to have him do all of those things that he's good at more often,
14:24which, to me, circles back either to Mike's point that they want a different guy
14:31with a different skill set and don't want Kincaid doing that,
14:36or they simply are trying to protect him, and I end up at, you know,
14:40what limits him more than Knox to me is his own health.
14:44I feel like if he were someone they didn't worry about taxing workload-wise,
14:50that he might see the field more than Knox, but they know they can't,
14:55so the blocking, or at least their sense is we've got to be careful, right?
14:59Pitch count, load management, all that sort of stuff.
15:02And if that were out the window completely, I'd love to see what happens, you know?
15:08Like what kind of snap count does he end up at, and is it more of an even split?
15:15Because I think his value is far greater than Knox's.
15:21Despite Knox's versatility and his all-around play,
15:24what's the most valuable thing you can have is a guy that can do what Kincaid can do,
15:28beat the defender, get open, and make plays down the field.
15:32And I think if he's someone I trust physically,
15:35then he's playing 60% of my tight end snaps.
15:39I wonder if he was fully healthy and there weren't any concerns like this,
15:44what they would have done with Dawson Knox in the offseason.
15:46Like how much of that was related to, let's just make sure we have Dawson Knox.
15:50And was, you know, making sure you re-signed him,
15:53how much of that was Dalton's health?
15:57Now, you guys know, I'll tell you too,
15:59I still think they wanted Dawson Knox on this team no matter what.
16:01What he means, I mean, two years ago after the season,
16:04when Sean McDermott, and I know he's not here anymore,
16:05when McDermott was, you know, asked, you know,
16:08is there anybody on the team that, you know,
16:09you really, you know, stood out to you for some reason?
16:11Like he specifically mentioned right away, Dawson Knox,
16:13and what he meant to the locker room, what he means to the team,
16:16everything he brings to the table for this team.
16:18And I just think they've identified him as a core guy,
16:20that they didn't want to lose him.
16:21So I think they would have wanted to keep him,
16:24but maybe it became more pressing to make sure you keep him based on that.
16:27Now that said, they also gave Dalton Kincaid the fifth-year option.
16:30They extended him in that regard,
16:32which is he's here for two more years.
16:33It's a good number though.
16:34It's not extronomical.
16:35It's $8 million.
16:36That's a, that's a really nice number to have Dalton Kincaid.
16:38If he can stay healthy and on the field,
16:39you're getting them at a really nice rate in a couple of years for a
16:42fifth-year option.
16:44But I do wonder about those two things.
16:46So according to the way I read Brady, what he says,
16:50and then you get to Dalton Kincaid and what he says, which is,
16:54he said, you know, the proof is he doesn't have a sleeve or a brace.
16:57So I'm going to trust when he says, I feel the best I have,
17:00feel really good in the knee.
17:01The reason he didn't have surgery, he said,
17:03he consulted all these doctors around the league, other doctors,
17:06they recommended don't have surgery, just strengthen the knee.
17:08Here's how you strengthen it.
17:10I feel like he will do more of those things.
17:12I just don't think we're going to be seeing him on the field.
17:15Like you see, I don't know, Mike,
17:16I don't know the numbers on George Kittle per se, right?
17:18But guys like that who you know can kind of do all those things we're
17:21talking about.
17:22It's always made for a really interesting, difficult analysis,
17:27like just sort of the value of the pick of Kincaid.
17:30Knox was what he meant to the core of the bills before they made that pick.
17:35And maybe that's still true.
17:36I thought, I'm thinking of a John Harbaugh comment to this point about,
17:42well, what, why don't you want,
17:43why wouldn't you want Kincaid to play the role that he's best at one time last
17:47year, Harbaugh was asked about Keaton Mitchell,
17:50one of his running backs and he has Derek Henry and Harbaugh basically said,
17:54well, it's kind of a giveaway when we put them on the field,
17:57what we're going to do or not do.
17:59I'm like, well, isn't that the point of good coaching though?
18:02Like that you should be able,
18:03if you have Kincaid playing with his hand down and he has to block a little bit
18:07more than he's done, but it comes at the expense.
18:09And it comes at the expense of knock snaps.
18:11I'm not sure that's bad.
18:13I think, you know, football is always trying to deceive you too.
18:17So I know we're generalizing here, but I don't know.
18:21Well, it's not bad until he misses a block and someone gets hurt.
18:24And then all of a sudden the coach has to answer questions in postgame
18:26on why he did it.
18:27From you.
18:28Right.
18:30So look out.
18:32All right.
18:32Well, so what else is shaking there, Sal?
18:34I feel like we sort of lost touch after rookie minicamp.
18:37Is Jermaine Burton still around?
18:40No, they did not sign him to a contract.
18:42Now he hasn't signed anywhere to my knowledge.
18:44So that could still happen at some point,
18:46but they did not elect to sign him after rookie minicamp.
18:49Okay.
18:50That's probably not a good sign then for him anyway.
18:53I mean, fine for the bills.
18:55No, my, my, my, my focus was on really a lot of the injured guys.
18:58And I just was super encouraged from what I saw from Michael Hoyt and what he
19:01was doing on the side and already out there.
19:03And I mean, I go, I walk out there, he's with a medicine ball doing explosions.
19:06I'm like, are you kidding me?
19:07Like, wow, this guy, he's just a animal.
19:09He was out there doing that.
19:11Josh Palmer was actually doing rehab off to the side as well.
19:15You know, he's a interesting guy in that wide receiver room.
19:17Um, I think a lot of the headlines were key on Coleman, what he said after
19:21practice, things that, you know, he talked about from last year.
19:23Um, and then of course, you know, Landon Jackson and his role getting bigger,
19:28him and Dwayne Carter coming back, what that looks like.
19:30Terrell Bernard talked a lot about what really kind of the, the, the injuries
19:34really, you know, physically and mentally really did a lot to him last year.
19:38And he's looking forward to a restart this year, so to speak.
19:42Shakir had a thing also ankle.
19:44He did.
19:44Yes, yes, he did.
19:45And he, um, but he's, he's been out there doing everything and doesn't look like
19:48he has any, from my eyes, any limitations on anything that they have him doing
19:51right now.
19:52Dawkins.
19:53Uh, Dawkins was, you know, in a boot a while ago and a picture, but, um, I
19:57don't, we didn't see him.
19:58He wasn't on the field.
19:59Uh, he wasn't at OTAs.
20:02I, I don't think it's anything serious from indications, you know, we've had from
20:05other kind of things happening.
20:07Um, but obviously it's something to take a look at the next time we're out
20:10there.
20:11If he, if he is there, he missed James Cook wasn't there.
20:13Doreen Williams wasn't there.
20:14Christian Benford wasn't there.
20:15There were a handful of guys that we did not see.
20:17Now that's just for one day.
20:18Who knows?
20:19Maybe they're there today when they do stuff, but we only get one day a week.
20:21Jack, you mentioned the guys that have, have bulked up here.
20:25Um, it, you know, Jackson and Carter, two, two defensive linemen who have barely
20:30registered at all.
20:32More so Jackson.
20:33I mean, his rookie season was a wash Carter got in some games in his rookie year, but
20:37that got undone.
20:38And last year was lost.
20:41Um, is this like a dart throw?
20:43Uh, or do you think like what, what percentage chance would you put on either one of those
20:49guys becoming important contributors on this defensive line, Atlanta Jackson and Dwayne
20:54Carter specifically?
20:55Yeah.
20:56Yeah.
20:58Um, I think Carter is facing more of an uphill battle to actually be on the roster, a guy
21:03you talked a lot about last year with this bulldog, right?
21:05But I'm going to say about Jackson, what I said about Carter last year, I just can't
21:09see that moving off a now.
21:10Well, in Jackson's case, a third round pick a year later, I just, it would really be surprising
21:15to me.
21:15I know it's a new defensive system and scheme, but I just don't feel, you know, that Brandon
21:19Bean would want to divest himself that early.
21:21Carter's in a different situation.
21:23It is his third year and he missed all of his second year.
21:25And there's a log jam at that position.
21:27Now, what's going to help Dwayne Carter is he actually can play from what they say, the
21:33nose tackle position.
21:34If they really want to have somebody there to play more of the true nose, and you might
21:38need somebody to do that on this team.
21:40And he did get bigger.
21:41You don't see it as much on him that you do on Atlanta Jackson.
21:43He's already a big guy in that regard, but really TJ Sanders doesn't play that spot
21:47at Oliver doesn't play that spot.
21:49You can put Deion Walker there, but I don't know if that's the best use of him, but Dwayne
21:53Carter can play that spot.
21:54So that could help him.
21:55As far as, as far as Landon Jackson, he told us he's going to play the four eye technique.
21:59I want to explain what that is to everybody.
22:01Four eye means four inside.
22:03So when you say a four technique that's head up on the, on the tackle, a four inside, four
22:08eye means inside eye of the tackle.
22:10So you see the inside shoulder or of the, of the offensive tackle.
22:15Right.
22:15That means there's still a guy outside of him in a five man front, right?
22:19There's a guy outside of him as an edge rusher.
22:21He is not going to be asked to do that.
22:23He's going to be asked to basically hold his ground, maybe penetrate once in a while, but
22:27get down the line and make plays.
22:28And that's going to be his role.
22:29And I think that, I mean, it would be surprising to me, like I said, if he's not at least
22:34on
22:35the field as a member of the Buffalo bills and them trying to see that work.
22:39Very good.
22:40Nice to talk to you as always.
22:41Thank you, Sal.
22:42You got it guys.
22:43It's our Sal Capaccio on the Western hotline.
22:45His appearances are brought to you by New York's only outlet liquor.
22:48When you need to stock up, it's the place to buy a case.
22:51What?
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