- 4 hours ago
On Day 34 of the US-Iran conflict, Iran issued a sharp rebuke to President Donald Trump’s claims of military dominance, questioning the status of its navy and airpower amid threats of strikes on power plants.
Category
🗞
NewsTranscript
00:01Good evening, you're watching India First. I'm Gaurav Savant.
00:04Iran has just issued a statement taunting U.S. President Donald Trump.
00:10Iran asks, are Martians coming from outer space to defend the Strait of Hormuz
00:15if the Iranian Navy has been completely decimated as the U.S. President claimed in his address earlier this morning?
00:23Iran took a jibe at the U.S. President on his claim on the decimation of Iran's air power.
00:30Again, Iran in a statement has asked if people are coming from outer space,
00:34from Mercury for example, to launch missiles, drones and rockets at Israel if Iran no longer has an air power.
00:43This is a huge verbal counter-attack after the Iranians said President Trump cannot send troops into Iran.
00:53If he does that, there will be consequences.
00:56Not a single American soldier will get back alive to the United States of America.
01:02The Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps, the IRGC, hours after President Donald Trump confirmed the world's worst fears,
01:10saying the war will continue, hit back, saying the U.S. has lost and that this war will continue
01:18till the U.S. leaves not just Iran's coastline or that area around, but leaves West Asia.
01:27In fact, President Trump has warned of intense strikes ahead.
01:31In his speech, President Trump said U.S. will continue hitting Iran very hard in the coming weeks
01:36and bomb Iran back to Stone Age if necessary.
01:41And that the next target may well be power generation plants in Iran.
01:48So while the U.S. claims they're on top of the situation on day 34 of the war,
01:53Iran insists the Iranian Navy has not been neutralized.
01:57President Trump is claiming Iranian Navy has been eliminated, air force is in ruins,
02:03key leaders of the regime have been killed, IRGC command and control structure has been decimated,
02:09and missile and drone launch and manufacturing capabilities have been hit.
02:13Iran has hit back.
02:14Iran has issued a statement saying, if our Navy is destroyed,
02:18are Martians coming from outer space to defend the Strait of Hormuz,
02:22are people coming from Mercury to launch missiles at Israel?
02:26But on this special broadcast, we will specifically talk about some key aspects of this conflict,
02:32and we will look ahead.
02:35Steps that are being taken to reopen the Strait of Hormuz for merchant vessels,
02:40for oil and gas tankers.
02:42There's a very crucial meeting in the United Kingdom.
02:4535 countries are participating.
02:47India will also be participating in this meeting on how best the Strait of Hormuz can be kept open.
02:54Sea lanes of communication should be open.
02:56Iran says as of now, it's open for friends, it's open for countries like India,
03:01but it's only a trickle that's coming out.
03:03Two to three to four ships compared to 130 that came out every year.
03:07We'll also decode the movement that you see on your television screen.
03:10More than 18, and by some accounts close to 24 A-10 warthogs.
03:15Close air support aircraft of U.S. Air Force.
03:17The movement of A-10, along with the movement of EA-37B,
03:23compass coil, electronic warfare aircraft.
03:25These are now being relocated to the area of operation of U.S. Central Command.
03:30Does this indicate that the U.S. is keeping all options open?
03:34Perhaps the next stage, a ground assault.
03:37The next phase of escalation in this conflict.
03:40Because, take a look at the bigger picture.
03:42The U.S. is also moving the George W. Bush, the aircraft carrier,
03:47with its R.A. Berg-class destroyers.
03:49Then there are other war assets that are already in the area of responsibility
03:53of the CENTCOM or Central Command, or are moving in very quickly.
03:58Take, for example, USS Canberra, USS Santa Barbara,
04:02USS Tripoli and USS Boxer.
04:05And USS Tripoli and USS Boxer, they're carrying amphibus marine groups.
04:09And we are now being told that soldiers of the 82nd Airborne Division
04:14have also been mobilized or on stand to being mobilized.
04:19All of this would indicate President Trump will have the option to escalate
04:23should he choose to.
04:25Are these all indicators that the next stage of war
04:28will be vertical escalation and very dangerous vertical escalation
04:33in terms of occupation of the islands along the entrance of the Strait of Hormuz
04:37and build up, perhaps, as some analysts argue,
04:41to occupation of parts of Iranian territory even beyond its islands,
04:48maybe the southern coast of Iran, maybe even Ish-fahan.
04:53Is that being war-gamed?
04:55We'll get you much more on that story.
04:56But before that, listen in to U.S. President Donald Trump.
05:01These core strategic objectives are nearing completion.
05:06As we celebrate this progress, we think especially of the 13 American warriors
05:12who have laid down their lives in this fight
05:14to prevent our children from ever having to face a nuclear Iran.
05:22We've beaten and completely decimated Iran.
05:26They are decimated, both militarily and economically and every other way.
05:32And during this period of time, no deal is made.
05:34We have a rise on key targets.
05:36If there is no deal, we are going to hit each and every one of their electric generating plants
05:42very hard and probably simultaneously.
05:45We have not hit their oil, even though that's the easiest target of all,
05:50because it would not give them even a small chance of survival or rebuilding.
05:56But we could hit it, and it would be gone,
05:59and there's not a thing they could do about it.
06:02They have no anti-aircraft equipment.
06:05Their radar is 100% annihilated.
06:08We are unstoppable as a military force.
06:14So, the United States is actually threatening to bomb Iran to Stone Age,
06:18should there be a requirement.
06:20Does this point to clear escalation?
06:23Because some thought that President Trump made this declare victory
06:27and pull out of the situation.
06:29The world economy is in tailspin.
06:30Things could go from bad to worse.
06:32But as President Trump addressed the nation on the Iran conflict,
06:35there are several key takeaways, and let's talk about that.
06:38There's rising uncertainty over what's the endgame of this war.
06:42President Trump has already claimed military objectives,
06:45they've nearly been met.
06:47They're nearly complete, nearing completion.
06:50So, what is the completion point?
06:52He's pledged to dismantle Iran, the regime's power, completely.
06:56So, he's saying Iran should not be in a position to project power beyond its borders.
07:00The specifics on what constitutes victory haven't been articulated very effectively on a road map.
07:07Even as he's signaled ending the war in the next two to three weeks,
07:12there is escalation yet again.
07:14U.S. forces are ready to hit Iran extremely hard over the next couple of weeks.
07:19Diplomatic channels, he says, remain open.
07:21He's addressed American, the disapproval over war.
07:25Trump urged the public to keep the war in perspective.
07:28And this is very crucial, because the devil here may lie just in the detail.
07:33He said, take a look at earlier wars that America fought.
07:36He spoke of the First World War.
07:38He spoke of the Second World War.
07:40The Korean War.
07:41The Vietnam War.
07:43Invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan.
07:46And the timeline from one year to nine years,
07:49compare just to 32 days and counting in this battle.
07:53And he says, most of the war aims have already been met.
07:56On the nuclear front, he indicated, Iran's enriched uranium remains underground.
08:02That a direct raid, perhaps no longer an immediate concern.
08:07Those satellites continue monitoring the situation at all times.
08:11On the Strait of Hormuz, and this is where allies and countries that are dependent on the Strait of Hormuz
08:18are extremely upset.
08:20Donald Trump insisted, U.S. does not rely on shipments of oil.
08:23He placed the responsibility squarely on nations that import oil, gas through the waterways.
08:31Their responsibility to get it open.
08:33Listen in.
08:38As I stated in my announcement of Operation Epic Fury, our objectives are very simple and clear.
08:46We are systematically dismantling the regime's ability to threaten America or project power outside of their borders.
08:53That means eliminating Iran's navy, which is now absolutely destroyed, hurting their air force and their missile program at levels
09:04never seen before,
09:06and annihilating their defense industrial base.
09:09We've done all of it.
09:10Their navy is gone.
09:11Their air force is gone.
09:12Their missiles are just about used up or beaten.
09:16Taken together, these actions will cripple Iran military, crush their ability to support terrorist proxies,
09:23and deny them the ability to build a nuclear bomb.
09:27Our armed forces have been extraordinary.
09:30There's never been anything like it militarily.
09:33Everyone is talking about it, and tonight I'm pleased to say that these core strategic objectives are nearing completion.
09:43So, as President Donald Trump attempts to reassure Americans on the ongoing conflict,
09:48his address has raised many questions that remain unanswered.
09:52Little clarity on the direction of the war.
09:55The speech largely repeated earlier positions.
09:58He hasn't offered a new policy roadmap or an endgame.
10:02On ground, there still is no explanation on the movement of U.S. Marines, the expeditionary units,
10:09the A-10 warthogs that are being sent, the A-82 airborne elements of the paratroopers that are expected to
10:15arrive,
10:16and what will they achieve?
10:18Or are they just standby?
10:20The timeline remains uncertain.
10:22The President spoke of two weeks, perhaps three weeks max.
10:25He did not outline the objectives that he hopes to achieve in these two, three weeks in the roadmap to
10:32that goal.
10:34There's also ambiguity around key allies, the position of Israel.
10:37Whether Israel's Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu aligns with the same timeline, that remains unclear.
10:43At the same point, you know, the earlier 15-point U.S. priest proposal,
10:47that wasn't even mentioned here.
10:49And that lays doubts about what level of diplomacy, if at all, is still on the table.
10:54Critical strategic questions persist.
10:57Is neutralizing Iran's nuclear program still top priority?
11:01And why mixed signals on the Strait of Hormuz from telling Iran,
11:06open it, there could be use of force,
11:09to telling allies, you take charge, that's your problem.
11:13On alliances, President Trump avoided spelling out his clear stance on NATO
11:18after hints that he may withdraw from NATO.
11:21Back home, even as public disapproval grows,
11:24the President framed the conflict as an investment in America's future.
11:29He insisted Iran has been a threat to the United States of America
11:33for close to 50 years, 47 years and counting.
11:37Past Presidents did not have the guts to take on Iran.
11:41He, in fact, singled out Barack Hussein Obama.
11:44He said Barack Obama went and paid money to Iran
11:48instead of tackling the country, instead of tackling the threat.
11:51And perhaps most crucially, the biggest question that remains unanswered,
11:55what does victory mean?
11:57What is victory for the United States of America?
12:00For now, the endgame still remains undefined.
12:06Joining me now on this India First special broadcast
12:09is Colonel John Spencer, Executive Director, Urban Warfare Institute.
12:13Also with me is Sandeep Unnithan, my colleague,
12:15who's been tracking the war very closely.
12:18Colonel Spencer, your reading of President Trump,
12:21was he, in your military view,
12:25able to give you what the endgame is
12:29and the roadmap to achieving that endgame?
12:33Well, it's great to be back with you.
12:35From a military strategy perspective,
12:37because strategy is the pursuit of political goals,
12:39I think the speech reiterated what we already knew,
12:43but I think that's a good thing.
12:44It reiterated the four political goals
12:47and discussed parts of the plan.
12:50Strategy is not a checklist in which you execute.
12:55And then, for one thing,
12:57is that your enemy,
12:59if they knew exactly what you were going to do,
13:01then they would develop a strategy
13:03to stop you from doing that.
13:04So the uncertainty that people believe is in that speech,
13:07I think is purposeful,
13:09but the speech does outline,
13:11reiterate what the goals are and what they are not,
13:13such as, as you and I talked last time,
13:16that the goal is not regime change.
13:18The goal is the change of behavior of this regime.
13:22Fair enough.
13:23If the goal is the change of behavior of this regime,
13:2534 days of bombing has even 1% been achieved.
13:31Change in behavior of the regime,
13:33because Iran today mocks the United States of America
13:36when President Trump says that Iran's navy is decimated.
13:41IRGC hits back,
13:42saying,
13:43are Martians coming from outer space
13:45to defend the Strait of Hormuz?
13:46If Iran doesn't have a navy,
13:49how come U.S. warships can't enter the Strait of Hormuz?
13:54It's a great question.
13:55I mean, we could measure,
13:57although war is also not a spreadsheet,
13:59but when you say, like,
14:00the navy has been destroyed,
14:02you didn't say that they don't have the ability
14:03to project all power,
14:05which is really the goal, right,
14:07to deny Iran's the ability to project power.
14:10As a fact of the navy is destroyed,
14:12that's pretty much a fact,
14:13a navy being boats,
14:14150 plus ships at the bottom of the waters.
14:19Why isn't the Strait of Hormuz
14:22is a matter of risk, right?
14:23Because you can,
14:25you impact the ships that are not American,
14:28but impact the ships that are going through there
14:31in this economic coercion,
14:32and that risk is too high,
14:34both for insurance, right?
14:35Because it's not just a matter of,
14:37why can't a ship go through it without being attacked?
14:39It could, as this operation continues,
14:43but then there is the insurance perspective
14:44of there being enough lower risk,
14:47and that being, I mean,
14:49whether that is a goal,
14:50I'm sure it absolutely should be one of the goals,
14:53but the destruction of the navy
14:54so they can't influence the Strait of Hormuz
14:57is one of the immediate goals,
14:59and I think time will only tell us
15:00who's involved in opening it.
15:02I mean, you have Gulf states saying
15:04they're going to be involved.
15:05You have had NATO members saying
15:07that they would like to be involved.
15:09You're trying to call balls and strikes
15:11on what will happen versus,
15:13yes, the Strait is closed for now,
15:15and there is Iranian oil getting out for now,
15:19but the ideal that that's because
15:21the United States can't do something
15:23versus what it is allowing
15:25because of that second, third order effect,
15:27I know it is impacting India
15:28with the price of gases and things like that,
15:31that the president is factoring in
15:33what would be the second and third order effects
15:35to the market, although the United States
15:37does not get any oil out of this,
15:39and there are ways you can adjust that,
15:41but it's all about risk.
15:42You want to lower the risk before actions,
15:44but to say that Iran is winning at this moment
15:48because the Strait is closed,
15:50I don't personally, as an objective strategist,
15:53just like when the United States
15:54doesn't just destroy all of Iran's oil,
15:57taking away their most vulnerable revenue source
16:01to continue their ability to project power.
16:04I mean, they transferred a billion dollars
16:06to Hezbollah in Lebanon just last year.
16:09Why aren't we striking at those things
16:11that matter to them most?
16:13Because we care about the Iranian people,
16:15and of course, the United States
16:16has to care about that global market.
16:19Okay, and I'll come to that in just a moment.
16:21I'll come to Kargai Island,
16:22and I'll come to the strategy in just a moment,
16:24but on the escalation ladder,
16:26Strait of Hormuz is just one part of the problem.
16:29Let me bring in Sandeep Amnithan,
16:30my colleague, into this conversation
16:32because, Sandeep,
16:33if we were to talk about the escalation ladder,
16:36both vertical and horizontal,
16:37it's Iran that's actually on top.
16:41And that's my question to you, Sandeep,
16:43because now Iran through Yemen
16:45can also block the Bawal Mandab
16:47and, by extension, the Suez Canal.
16:50Would that make America look even weaker or stronger,
16:54the world's most powerful navy,
16:56and three most crucial choke points Iran can dominate?
16:59Yes, absolutely, Gaurav.
17:01You know, the Arabian Peninsula has three choke points,
17:03as we've been speaking.
17:05The Strait of Hormuz is one,
17:06the Bab el-Mandab is the second,
17:07and, of course, you have the Suez Canal,
17:10which is a choke point
17:11which has not been discussed adequately, I feel.
17:13It's a 190-kilometer-long man-made canal
17:16where ships move.
17:17They're mandated to move at a speed
17:20of about eight or nine knots
17:22when they navigate that 190 kilometers.
17:24And this canal is within range
17:27of Iran's ballistic missiles, Gaurav.
17:29So that technically puts three choke points,
17:32one directly under Iran's control,
17:34second through the proxies,
17:35and third by missiles.
17:36So all three choke points are vulnerable.
17:38Now, you know, Gaurav, very quickly,
17:39I was looking at the Trump national security policy
17:42that was rolled out in November last year
17:45for references on the Strait of Hormuz.
17:47And very interesting that the NSS
17:50that Trump administration brought out last year
17:53mentions the Strait of Hormuz in the following terms.
17:55It says that America will always have core interests
17:58in ensuring the Gulf energy supplies
18:00do not fall in the hands of an outright enemy,
18:03that the Strait of Hormuz remain open,
18:06that the Red Sea remain navigable,
18:08that the region not be an incubator
18:10or exporter of terror against American interests
18:13or the American homeland,
18:14and, of course, that Israel remain secure.
18:16So this is very interesting that in an NSS document
18:19where the U.S. says we are a net exporter of energy
18:22and therefore we don't need to focus on West Asia,
18:25it has mentioned all of the regions
18:27that we are now speaking about.
18:28That's a very crucial point you make.
18:29And let me get Colonel Spencer to talk about it
18:32as I request my producers to put that map
18:35of Bab al-Mandab and the Strait of Hormuz
18:38so that our viewers can take a look
18:40at both the choke points,
18:42Bab al-Mandab and the Strait of Hormuz.
18:44But Colonel Spencer, you want to respond to that point
18:46that the U.S. national security strategy
18:49indicates points in black and white
18:52how crucial is protection of the Strait of Hormuz
18:54and the Red Sea,
18:55and this is where President Donald Trump
18:58seems to be shying away from it.
19:01Again, I wouldn't say personally,
19:03and I don't speak for the President or the United States,
19:07but I do agree, actually.
19:08The national security strategy
19:10actually gives us more reasons
19:11of why the operation must continue
19:13because that freedom of global international
19:16basically waters, right?
19:17So this isn't Iranian territorial waters
19:20that they have the right to protect.
19:22This is global international commons.
19:24The reason why the United States is a superpower,
19:27the reason why countries have navies
19:29is a part of this global international
19:31freedom of waters, right?
19:33The reason from the great navies
19:35of the British Empire till now,
19:37and these choke points that it almost gives a reason
19:41to continue the operation,
19:43like off of the Yemen coast,
19:46you have this Houthi pirate terrorist army
19:49that has been built by Iran,
19:53the greatest explorer of terrorism,
19:54to do just this.
19:55And they learned when they attempted this in 2024,
19:59the repercussions,
20:00and just like Iran,
20:01their entire leadership was eliminated in a strike,
20:04and their port was eliminated.
20:06I think that you're underestimating
20:09what the United States and its allies
20:11that care about these straits as well can do.
20:13But I agree with you,
20:14the national security strategy
20:15is not just about maintaining
20:17global international navigation,
20:21basically, in the waters,
20:23but also about reducing these economic terrorist
20:26coercion choke points.
20:28So like they did after the Suez crisis
20:31and built a pipeline to avoid it,
20:34I also wrote a piece recommending
20:36that that should happen more than already,
20:39because Saudi Arabia and the UAE
20:41already have pipes,
20:43should have more pipes
20:44to reduce this choke point
20:46that are so crucial to terrorists using them.
20:49And India is very familiar
20:51with what happens
20:52when a terrorist state
20:53starts doing this coercion.
20:56Oh, absolutely.
20:58India is well aware of it.
20:59But as of now,
21:00because remember,
21:01we are now in day 34 of this crisis,
21:03Sandeep.
21:04We are looking at escalation,
21:06both vertical and horizontal.
21:08And I will come to
21:09the new weapons of war
21:11that are coming into this conflict,
21:12and we'll talk about that in greater detail.
21:14But the two choke points,
21:16Iran has only squeezed one,
21:17and the world is crying.
21:20God forbid.
21:21So far,
21:21the Houthis have only threatened.
21:23They've just lobbed
21:24a couple of missiles
21:25in Israel's direction
21:26from Yemen.
21:28But if Bab al-Mandab
21:30was to be choked,
21:31or if the Suez Canal
21:32were to be targeted,
21:33then the world economy
21:34will collapse.
21:35Well, absolutely, Gaurav.
21:36You know,
21:37it's like 50%
21:38of the world energy
21:39flows through
21:40the Arabian Peninsula,
21:41through those three choke points.
21:43And if those were threatened,
21:45you know,
21:45one after the other,
21:47I'm just looking at
21:48a hypothetical,
21:49you know,
21:49escalation ladder,
21:50if that could happen.
21:51Because the Iranians
21:52have been escalating,
21:54you know,
21:54literally proportionate
21:55to what the U.S.
21:57has been escalating.
21:58So they have,
21:59you know,
21:59this game of dominating
22:00the escalation ladder
22:01is what we've been seeing
22:03over the last month or so.
22:04If that happens,
22:05you're looking at
22:06a big, big crisis, Gaurav.
22:08It's far more than
22:09just the Strait of Hormuz
22:10being, you know, blocked.
22:11It is the entire Red Sea
22:13being denied
22:14to maritime traffic.
22:16And, you know,
22:17who knows
22:18the second and third order
22:19effects of that,
22:21you know,
22:21playing out
22:22in the days ahead, Gaurav.
22:24From whatever we've heard
22:26of President Trump's speech
22:28this morning,
22:29Indian Standard Time
22:29or late last night,
22:31your time,
22:31Colonel Spencer,
22:32whatever he said
22:33in the past 34 days,
22:35is there any indication
22:36that we are moving
22:38in the direction
22:38of a solution
22:40or by all accounts,
22:42and again,
22:43since you study warfare,
22:45since you study
22:46military strategy
22:47and political military strategy,
22:48are all indications
22:50that this is building up
22:51to something bigger
22:53in the days,
22:54if not weeks ahead?
22:57One of the indications
22:58that I took from the speech,
23:00and it's interesting
23:00how people will infer
23:01rather than just take
23:03straight text from the speech,
23:05is that the United States
23:06is talking to someone
23:07and that the elimination
23:09of those 40,
23:1150 senior leaders,
23:13both political
23:13and military,
23:14has changed
23:15that aspect of the war
23:17because war is a contest
23:18of wills
23:19for political goals.
23:21So I think ultimately
23:22the fact that the President
23:23says we are talking
23:24to people
23:25who are more reasonable
23:26about coming
23:27to an end solution
23:29of this war,
23:30our operation
23:31to pursue those goals
23:32to include
23:34ensuring that they
23:35never hold this
23:36Strait of Hormuz
23:37as a gun
23:38to the economic
23:39global economy again.
23:41I think there should be
23:42more nations
23:43actually behind
23:44that effort of,
23:46yes, we don't want
23:46this to happen again,
23:48so we want to reduce
23:49the terrorist activity
23:51that is happening
23:52to support
23:53these type of activities,
23:54and that's why
23:54the UN Security Council
23:56voted 13 to 0
23:57and 140 nations
23:59signed up in agreement
24:00that Iran needs
24:01to stop its attacking
24:03of countries
24:05not even involved
24:05and stop holding
24:07the Strait of Hormuz
24:08as some type of weapon
24:09against the world,
24:11not the United States.
24:12And yet,
24:13and yet Iran does so.
24:15So, you know,
24:16those 130 countries,
24:17whatever they may have voted,
24:19quite like NATO,
24:20is the United Nations
24:21also a paper tiger?
24:22You know,
24:23whatever is written there
24:24and agreed to,
24:25it's not what the paper
24:26is written on.
24:27But I now want to move
24:28to the other big pictures
24:30that we are seeing right now,
24:31and I want to play out
24:32those images of the A-10
24:34Warthogs
24:34that are landing
24:35in the UK
24:36en route to West Asia.
24:38They would be a part
24:40of CENTCOM,
24:41but it's not just
24:43just the A-10
24:44Warthogs
24:44close air support aircraft.
24:46Look at the bigger picture
24:47of movement
24:48of military material.
24:51The EA-37B
24:53Compass Call,
24:53Electronic Warfare
24:54Aircraft,
24:55they're relocating.
24:57They can jam
24:58any movement.
24:59US is deploying
25:00the George W. Bush,
25:02the aircraft carrier
25:02with its
25:03Ali-Burg-class destroyers.
25:05They are moving
25:06into this area.
25:07Then the USS Canberra,
25:08USS Tulsa,
25:09USS Santa Barbara,
25:11USS Tripoli,
25:12USS Boxer.
25:14You know,
25:15the amount of men
25:16and material
25:16that's coming
25:17into this region
25:18plus the 82nd Airborne.
25:20Colonel Spencer,
25:22clearly this isn't
25:22shore leave.
25:23This isn't picnic
25:24to West Asia.
25:26Is a land assault
25:28next on the cards, sir?
25:32I have no clue.
25:34And if anybody
25:35ever comes on your show
25:35and say that it is
25:37going to happen,
25:38it's the next
25:39necessary step.
25:40I actually don't agree
25:41with framing
25:41an escalation ladder.
25:43This is war.
25:43This is strategy.
25:45Both sides
25:45get to implement
25:46their strategy.
25:47The United States
25:47gets to position
25:50and give the
25:51President of the
25:52United States options.
25:53And that's what
25:53you're seeing.
25:54But war is also
25:55a contest.
25:57So it is a contest
25:58of will.
25:58So it's not just
25:59what is actually
26:00happening on the ground.
26:01The complete
26:02dismantling of
26:03Iran's means,
26:05right?
26:05It can have all
26:05the interest
26:06to do things
26:07like threaten
26:07the straight
26:08that it wants.
26:08But as you
26:09slowly reduce
26:10that means,
26:11it gets less
26:11interested in
26:13continuing that
26:14behavior.
26:15These forces,
26:16the 82nd,
26:17the two Marine
26:17Expeditionary Units,
26:19all the other,
26:20the A-10s,
26:21the Apaches,
26:21of course,
26:22that shows
26:22the ability
26:23for the United
26:24States to
26:24implement its
26:25strategy with
26:26less constraints.
26:27The enemy has
26:28no power to
26:29stop it,
26:30in the airs
26:31especially.
26:32But these
26:33are options.
26:34Do I know
26:35what's going
26:35to happen?
26:36Do I even
26:37think it's
26:37more likely?
26:38I don't have
26:39the information.
26:39Like you said,
26:40we can listen
26:41to the speech
26:41and say,
26:42they're talking
26:43to someone,
26:43I don't even
26:44know if the
26:44Iranians know
26:45who is fully
26:46in charge,
26:46as you have
26:47disagreements
26:47with the
26:48President of
26:48Iran,
26:49IRGC,
26:50and others.
26:51True.
26:52But Sandeep,
26:53what are
26:53indicators?
26:54You know,
26:55the number of
26:55men and
26:56material,
26:56and I want
26:57to play out
26:57images of
26:57that aircraft,
26:59you know,
26:59the A-10s that
27:00are landing and
27:01taking off,
27:02and A-10s are
27:04virtually a flying
27:06tank with their
27:07titanium hulls.
27:08Look at those
27:08aircraft,
27:09close-air support.
27:11So when US
27:11Marines move in,
27:13or the amphibious
27:13landing crafts
27:14move in,
27:15Sandeep,
27:15these are the
27:16aircraft that
27:16would be flying
27:17on top to
27:17ensure that
27:18there's no
27:18aerial threat,
27:19and the
27:19compass goal
27:20would be
27:20flying on
27:21top to
27:22jam every
27:23enemy,
27:23you know,
27:24signal to
27:24a drone,
27:26signal to
27:26a radar.
27:27Sandeep,
27:27draw that
27:28battlefield for
27:29us.
27:29Tell us what
27:30this indicates.
27:31Well,
27:31you know,
27:31clearly,
27:32Gaurav,
27:32the A-10 is
27:33a very unique
27:34aircraft.
27:34It's been
27:34around for
27:35half a century
27:36almost.
27:36It's a one-of-a-kind,
27:37as you described.
27:38It's a flying
27:38tank.
27:39It's built
27:40around that
27:4130mm
27:42Gatling gun
27:43that it
27:43carries,
27:43that shoots
27:44out milk
27:45bottle-sized
27:47ammunition.
27:49And the
27:49gun is so
27:50powerful that
27:51the aircraft
27:52literally stops
27:52when it fires
27:53it,
27:53and it can
27:54literally
27:55skype through
27:56fortifications,
27:57tanks.
27:58I mean,
27:58that's what
27:58it's been
27:58built for.
27:59It's been
27:59built to
28:00destroy
28:00masses of
28:01Soviet armor
28:02that would
28:02pour in
28:03through
28:03Eastern
28:03Europe
28:04during the
28:05Cold War.
28:06And it's
28:07been actually
28:07deployed
28:08everywhere but
28:09in Europe.
28:10It's been
28:10in the
28:11Gulf War I,
28:12Gulf War II.
28:12it's a
28:13rugged aircraft
28:15and the
28:16numbers that
28:16are being
28:17flown in
28:18Gaurav
28:18suggest that
28:19there is a
28:19plan of
28:20some sort
28:21to bring in
28:22ground troops
28:23and if
28:23ground troops
28:24are going to
28:24move in,
28:25as Colonel
28:26Spencer said,
28:26the 82nd
28:27Airborne,
28:27the MEUs,
28:29the Special
28:30Forces,
28:31if they move in,
28:31this is the
28:32kind of aircraft
28:33that they would
28:33like in the
28:34sky above them,
28:35neutralizing targets,
28:37destroying
28:37fortifications,
28:38bunkers,
28:38holding the
28:39enemy off,
28:40while the
28:42personnel on
28:43the ground
28:43do whatever
28:44they have to
28:45do.
28:45We don't
28:45know what
28:46the objectives
28:47are.
28:47But it's
28:48very clearly
28:49going to be
28:49something related
28:50to what the
28:51four asks that
28:52the United States
28:53had of Iran
28:54at the start
28:55of the
28:55conflict.
28:56Either it's
28:56about the
28:57ballistic missile
28:58capability or
28:59it's the
28:59nuclear weapons,
29:00it's the
29:00HEU, the
29:01highly enriched
29:02uranium that
29:03Iran possesses,
29:05the 440 kg.
29:06So it's
29:07possibly linked
29:08to all of
29:08this based
29:09on which the
29:10US can say
29:11it can pronounce
29:13mission accomplished.
29:14Gaurav.
29:14There are some
29:15reports that
29:15seem to say
29:16that there are
29:17special teams
29:18that are being
29:18readied.
29:20Should there
29:21be a requirement
29:21and should there
29:22be precise
29:22intelligence where
29:23that enriched
29:24uranium is?
29:25Colonel Spencer,
29:27these special
29:27teams will go
29:28in and there
29:29are those
29:29heavy earth
29:29movers,
29:30they'll go
29:30and dig up
29:32the uranium
29:32and they'll
29:33bring the
29:33enriched uranium
29:34out.
29:34Is that a
29:35flight of
29:35fantasy or
29:36is that
29:37actually
29:37something that
29:38US thinks
29:39is doable
29:40because the
29:41besiege is
29:42still in
29:42power, the
29:43IRGC is
29:44in power,
29:44unless America
29:46is working on
29:47some Venezuela
29:47like plan that
29:48despite all the
29:49armed forces that
29:50Venezuela had,
29:51they all seem
29:51to look the
29:52other way when
29:52the Americans
29:53went in and
29:54brought President
29:54Maduro out.
29:55Is that the
29:56dream?
29:56Is that President
29:57Trump's dream?
29:57Similarly, they'll
29:58bring the
29:58enriched uranium
29:59out.
30:02Again, it's
30:02a list of
30:03options and
30:04capabilities.
30:05It would be
30:06an extremely
30:06high-risk
30:07operation.
30:09Where we
30:09believe the
30:10uranium stockpiles
30:11are, especially
30:12in those
30:13nuclear sites
30:13that they
30:14weren't even
30:14supposed to
30:15have, Bordeaux,
30:16Isfahan,
30:18be able to
30:19put ground
30:20forces there
30:20and secure
30:21them.
30:21One comment
30:22on that, so
30:22yes, that is
30:23absolutely an
30:24option and
30:25never doubt.
30:26I think that's
30:27some of the
30:27aspects of
30:28looking to
30:29the past.
30:29What we're
30:30seeing happening
30:31in Iran from
30:31the US
30:32military and
30:32Israel's
30:33perspective has
30:33never happened
30:34in war.
30:34Even if you
30:35look back to
30:35the first
30:36Gulf War, a
30:3642-day
30:37operation where
30:38we dropped
30:38250,000 bombs
30:40and missiles,
30:41about 10%
30:42of those
30:42precision.
30:43We're at
30:43this element
30:44of 15,000
30:45targets engaged,
30:46100% of
30:46them precision
30:47guided munitions
30:48hitting exactly
30:49where they're
30:50supposed to be.
30:50Absolutely
30:51special people
30:52could get on
30:54the ground and
30:54you could put a
30:55security bubble
30:55around them.
30:57I believe the
30:58A-10s are
30:59more used to
31:00clear the
31:01coastline of
31:02remnants of
31:03capabilities that
31:05might threaten
31:07global shipping,
31:08let's say.
31:08But you could
31:09also use them
31:09for close air
31:10support.
31:10Absolutely.
31:11You would
31:12create rings of
31:13bubbles around
31:13these forces.
31:14You could bring
31:15in construction
31:15equipment.
31:16It is one of
31:17the options.
31:18I think the
31:18preferred option
31:19that the
31:19president really
31:20emphasized was
31:21through political
31:22negotiations from
31:23India or is
31:25Iran agreeing to
31:26give that up or
31:28letting the
31:28inspectors come
31:29in to eventually
31:30get it out.
31:31Things like that.
31:31But I believe
31:32this is war.
31:34You want Iran
31:34believing and
31:36with credible
31:38capability already
31:39pre-station that
31:40the United States
31:41will put things
31:42all across without
31:44Iran being able to
31:45do anything and
31:46threaten these
31:47courses of actions
31:48that are legitimate
31:49options.
31:50Sure.
31:51That's very
31:52heartening to hear
31:53if America has a
31:55plan and use the
31:56A-10s to clear
31:58the coast because
31:59President Trump has
32:00said something just
32:01the opposite.
32:01He says Strait of
32:02Hormuz is of no
32:03interest to me.
32:04Let NATO countries
32:05or those who take
32:06oil from there,
32:07let them decide
32:08that.
32:08Except Sandeep,
32:10when he says
32:10something, he may
32:12just end up doing
32:12something completely
32:14different.
32:15Yes, Gaurav, as
32:16we've seen in the
32:17past, this could
32:18just be a smoke
32:18screen.
32:19He could well be
32:20going into the
32:22Strait of Hormuz
32:22as we've been
32:23discussing over the
32:24last several weeks
32:26that those islands
32:27again, it comes down
32:28to those critical
32:29islands starting
32:30from Larak and
32:32Hormuz and, you
32:34know, going all
32:35the way up to
32:37the Karg Island
32:38deep inside the
32:40Persian Gulf.
32:40So this could be
32:41possibly one of
32:42the options that's
32:44there on the table
32:44for the U.S.
32:45military to hit
32:46those islands to,
32:48you know, get
32:49an out.
32:50But then those
32:51islands by themselves
32:52don't represent the
32:54core mission that
32:56the United States
32:57set out to in
32:58this campaign which
32:59began on the
32:5928th of February.
33:01That Iran should
33:01no longer be able
33:02to project military
33:03power beyond its
33:04borders.
33:06Will President
33:07Trump act on
33:08Hormuz?
33:08His indications
33:09are he will not.
33:10NATO members are
33:11actually pushing
33:11back against the
33:12pressure because
33:13President Trump
33:13wants NATO to be
33:15a part of
33:15operations.
33:16He sought help
33:17from NATO
33:18countries and he's
33:19extremely angry
33:20they're not helping.
33:21So President Trump
33:22have once again
33:22threatened to pull
33:23out of NATO.
33:24Germany dismissed
33:25President Trump's
33:26remarks as familiar
33:28rhetoric pointing to
33:30his history of
33:31issuing such empty
33:32threats.
33:33France defended its
33:34stance saying the
33:35alliance was never
33:36meant for an offensive
33:37operation in the
33:38Strait of Hormuz and
33:39joining such action
33:40will violate
33:41international law.
33:42In fact French
33:43President Emmanuel
33:44Macron he's indicated
33:45dialogue with Iran
33:47so that trade can
33:49start and trade
33:50that is unhindered.
33:52Earlier the Prime
33:53Minister of the
33:54United Kingdom
33:54Keir Starmer
33:55he made it clear
33:56Britain will not
33:57be drawn into
33:58conflict.
33:58Responding to
33:59Trump's warning
34:00the UK insists
34:01it remains committed
34:02but will act in
34:04line with their
34:06own national
34:07interests.
34:08Listen in.
34:11First let me say
34:13once again
34:15this is not
34:16our war.
34:18We will not be
34:19drawn into the
34:20conflict.
34:21That is not in
34:23our national
34:24interest.
34:25And the most
34:26effective way we
34:28can support the
34:29cost of living in
34:30Britain is to push
34:32for de-escalation in
34:33the Middle East and
34:35a reopening of the
34:36Strait of Hormuz
34:37which is such a
34:38vital route for
34:40energy.
34:42So let's for a
34:43moment talk about the
34:44North Atlantic Treaty
34:45organisation or NATO.
34:47Now NATO was formed in
34:481949 after the
34:49Second World War to
34:51promote peace and
34:52security among member
34:53states.
34:54Originally NATO had
34:5612 founding members.
34:58From 1949 to 2024
35:01the number grew to
35:0332.
35:04The alliance expanded
35:05significantly after the
35:07collapse of the
35:08Soviet Union after the
35:09end of the Cold War.
35:10it added several
35:11Warsaw Pact countries.
35:13The most recent
35:14addition have been
35:15Finland and Sweden.
35:17NATO's objectives are
35:19focused on protecting
35:20member countries from
35:21external threats,
35:22managing crisis both
35:24through diplomacy and
35:25through military means,
35:26strengthening
35:26partnerships with
35:27non-member nations and
35:29ensuring military
35:31readiness through
35:31modernisation and
35:33strategic planning.
35:34At the heart of the
35:35North Atlantic Treaty
35:36organisation is the
35:38principle of
35:39collective defence,
35:41not collective
35:43offence.
35:44This collective
35:45defence principle is
35:47enshrined in Article
35:485 of the NATO
35:50Treaty which states
35:51that an armed
35:53attack on one
35:54member country will
35:56be considered an
35:57attack on all
35:58member states.
35:59Article 5 is
36:00central to the
36:01alliance, committing
36:02members to
36:03collective defence.
36:05But it applies
36:05only in terms of
36:07armed attack on
36:08member states.
36:09and that is one of
36:09the reasons why
36:11NATO members are
36:12not engaged in the
36:13ongoing US-Israel
36:15versus Iran
36:16conflict.
36:16Along with peaceful
36:17resolution is
36:18mandated under
36:19Article 1 of
36:20NATO, members can
36:21provide non-military
36:23support as well.
36:24And the current
36:25crisis, according to
36:26NATO members, falls
36:28outside NATO's
36:29operational zone under
36:31Article 6.
36:32countries.
36:33So, what's the way
36:34forward?
36:35When it comes to the
36:36state of Hormuz, there
36:38are efforts that are
36:39being made even as we
36:40speak.
36:41And I now want to move
36:42on to the next report.
36:44The United Kingdom
36:45hosted diplomats from
36:46more than 40 countries
36:47this evening as they
36:49held talks on ways to
36:50open the state of Hormuz.
36:51UK's Foreign Secretary
36:53chaired the meeting
36:54after US President
36:55Donald Trump said
36:56securing the vital
36:57waterways was a
36:58problem that nations
37:00that benefit from the
37:02waterways must sort
37:03out and resolve
37:04themselves.
37:05Now, the British
37:06Foreign Secretary said
37:07talks which focus on
37:10political and
37:10diplomatic rather than
37:11military solutions or
37:13military means showed
37:14the strength of the
37:16UK's determination to
37:17open the strait.
37:19Listen in.
37:20We have seen Iran
37:22hijack an international
37:24shipping route to hold
37:26the global economy
37:27hostage.
37:28This is hitting the
37:30trading routes for
37:31Kuwait, Bahrain, Qatar,
37:32the UAE, Saudi, Oman,
37:34Iraq.
37:35But that means liquid
37:36natural gas for Asia,
37:38fertiliser for Africa
37:40and jet fuel for the
37:41world.
37:42And that Iranian
37:43recklessness towards
37:44countries who were
37:45never involved in this
37:46conflict which we and
37:48130 countries across the
37:50world have strongly
37:52condemned at the
37:53United Nations is not
37:55just hitting mortgage
37:56rates and petrol prices
37:58and the cost of living
37:59here in the UK and in
38:01many different countries
38:02across the world, it is
38:04hitting our global
38:05economic security.
38:07But in today's meeting,
38:08we are focusing on the
38:10diplomatic and
38:11international planning
38:12measures, including
38:14collective mobilisation of
38:16our full range of
38:17diplomatic and economic
38:18tools and pressures,
38:20reassurance work with
38:22industry, insurers and
38:23energy markets, and also
38:26action to guarantee the
38:27safety of trapped ships
38:29and seafarers, and the
38:31effective coordination
38:32that we need across the
38:34world to enable a safe
38:36and sustained opening of
38:38the strait.
38:41So the focus remains keeping
38:43sea lanes of communication
38:44open.
38:45Foreign Secretary Vikram
38:46Misri attends this meeting
38:47called by the UK on the
38:49Strait of Hormuz.
38:49The spokesperson for the
38:50Ministry of External
38:51Affairs, additional
38:52Secretary Randhir Jaiswal
38:54said, and I quote,
38:55The UK side invited several
38:57countries, which also
38:58include India, for the
38:59talks on the Strait of
39:00Hormuz.
39:01From our side, Foreign
39:02Secretary attended the
39:04meeting.
39:05He then went on to say,
39:06we are in touch with
39:07Iran and other countries
39:09there to see how best we
39:11can get unimpeded transit
39:13and safe transit for our
39:15ships which are carrying
39:16products including LPG,
39:19LNG and other products.
39:21Now, through this
39:22conversation that we've
39:23had over the last several
39:25days, we have had six
39:27Indian ships which were
39:29able to safely cross the
39:31Strait of Hormuz and we
39:32continue to be in touch
39:34with relevant parties.
39:36Unpored.
39:37The big question right
39:39now, and I quickly want
39:40to once again bring in
39:41Colonel Spencer into this
39:42conversation.
39:44NATO as we know it.
39:46Colonel Spencer, and let
39:48me quickly also bring in
39:49my colleague Sandeep
39:51Punithan into this
39:51conversation.
39:52Is NATO as an alliance
39:54as we know it dead,
39:56Sandeep?
39:57Well, it's not dead,
39:58Gaurav.
39:59It's under a lot of
40:00pressure and, you know,
40:01in the last 90 days,
40:02we've seen this
40:03unprecedented, you
40:05know, sequence of
40:07events where the
40:08United States, which is
40:09the largest part of
40:11NATO, threatening to
40:12invade and capture, you
40:14know, territory belonging
40:15to another NATO member.
40:16So that's a situation
40:18we've never seen in the
40:19last 80 years, ever since
40:21NATO was set up.
40:21So, NATO has been through
40:23unprecedented stress.
40:25It's been through, you
40:27know, something that they
40:28never anticipated when
40:31that NATO charter was, you
40:33know, announced way back in
40:341948, after the Second
40:35World War.
40:36It is facing enormous
40:38challenges in the last, in
40:39the next couple of months.
40:40But, you know, as the
40:41states will discover, they
40:43will find a way via media,
40:44possibly after the Trump
40:47presidency.
40:49So, close to a year after
40:51Operation Sindhoor, I want to
40:53now talk about how India
40:55handled Operation Sindhoor
40:56versus how America is
40:59handling Operation Epic
41:01Fury and why in
41:03principles of war you must
41:04have aim, maintenance of
41:06aim very clearly.
41:07India had very clear war
41:09aims during Operation
41:09Sindhoor, including a clear
41:11exit plan.
41:12And India was always on top
41:13of the escalation ladder.
41:14from the time Indian
41:15missiles and fighters hit
41:16the nine terror bases to
41:18the time that IAF and
41:19army hit park radars, air
41:21defense systems and
41:22finally a dozen air bases.
41:24But there's another
41:25aspect.
41:26Chief of the naval staff,
41:28Admiral Dinesh Tripathi,
41:29gave details how Pakistan
41:30sought ceasefire moments
41:32before, just minutes
41:34before, Indian Navy was
41:35to enter the battle from
41:37the western seaboard.
41:38We get you more in this
41:40report.
41:49It's been nearly a year
41:51since India's retaliatory
41:52action against Pakistan
41:54in Operation Sindhoor.
41:56The chief of naval staff
41:57has confirmed that India
41:59was just minutes away from
42:01striking Pakistan from the
42:02sea, but did not go
42:04through with it after
42:05Islamabad requested Delhi
42:07for a ceasefire.
42:08Speaking at the naval
42:10investiture ceremony,
42:12Admiral Dinesh Kumar
42:13Tripathi said, Operation
42:15Sindhoor demonstrated
42:16exemplary readiness and
42:17resolve of the Indian
42:18Navy, further highlighting
42:20how close the situation
42:22came to escalation.
42:25It is now not a hidden
42:26fact that we were just
42:29minutes away from
42:31striking Pakistan from
42:33sea when they requested
42:38stoppage of kinetic
42:39action.
42:41In December, Vice Admiral
42:44Krishnaswaminathan, who
42:45heads the Western Naval
42:46Command, he also said
42:47that the threat of
42:48offensive action by the
42:49Indian Navy during
42:50Operation Sindhoor was
42:52one of the key factors in
42:53Pakistan requesting a
42:55ceasefire.
42:56He had added that if
42:57provoked again, the
42:59Indian Navy's punishment
43:00would be harsh.
43:02action.
43:03If we get involved in
43:06the action, then what
43:08can we tell us?
43:10We know.
43:11We also knew that if we
43:14get into it, then the
43:22school will be
43:23destroyed.
43:24We knew that we were
43:26waiting for the right
43:27time.
43:27and if we still see them, we will be able to do it.
43:31Operation Sindur saw an unprecedented mobilization
43:35of more than 30 ships and submarines within a very short period.
43:39Days after Operation Sindur,
43:41from the deck of indigenous aircraft carrier INS Vikrant,
43:45Defence Minister Rajnath Singh lauded the Navy's role,
43:48saying that India's unmatched maritime supremacy
43:51confined the Pakistani Navy to its own shores.
44:09The Navy's actions during Operation Sindur
44:12has showcased its capabilities at the highest level
44:15and sent out a clear warning to Pakistan
44:18against any further provocation.
44:21Bureau Report, India Today.
44:27Principles of war speak of statement of aim
44:30and maintenance of aim.
44:32Many after Operation Sindur had argued,
44:34when India had the upper hand,
44:36why didn't India continue bombing Pakistan,
44:38including from sea?
44:39Should have bombed Karachi like in 1971.
44:41But the Navy chief's statement
44:43adds a very interesting dimension to this debate.
44:46Navy was poised to strike from sea
44:47when Pakistan shot ceasefire.
44:49So let's revisit Operation Sindur
44:51in the light of Operation Epic Fury
44:53that's currently underway.
44:55Joining me on India first is Vice-Admiral Shekhar Sina,
44:58former flag officer commanding-in-chief
44:59of Indian Navy's Western Naval Command,
45:01incidentally a fighter pilot himself,
45:03and Sandeep Unnitan stays with me on this broadcast.
45:05Sandeep, Admiral Tripathi made a very interesting point.
45:08Seas are no longer secondary theatres of war
45:11where continental conflicts may spill over.
45:13They are now becoming the first arena
45:16where strategic intent is signaled
45:18and the contest is often disproportionate.
45:21Consequences it has.
45:22What's your reading of the statement
45:23that Indian Navy was poised to hit
45:26and Pakistan shot a ceasefire?
45:28Yes, absolutely, Gaurav.
45:29You know, and this is,
45:30we've seen the importance, you know,
45:32of the sea lanes of communication
45:34in the last couple of years.
45:35But for the Navy,
45:37this was a demonstration
45:38of the overwhelming superiority
45:40the Indian Navy,
45:41particularly the Western fleet,
45:43enjoys over the Pakistan Navy.
45:45And Admiral Sinha is here.
45:47He has been part of several such operations,
45:50including the ones in Parakram
45:52when they wargamed exactly these scenarios.
45:55You know, the fact is that
45:57the Indian Navy,
45:58just by appearing on the horizon, Gaurav,
46:01has the ability to convert Pakistan
46:03into a landlocked state.
46:05When we did not see the Pakistan Navy
46:07even sail out,
46:08there was, I think,
46:09one long-range maritime patrol mission
46:11that they flew,
46:12but the rest of the Pakistan Navy
46:14immediately dispersed.
46:16Some of them went into
46:17Gwadar port,
46:19the Chinese port.
46:20The others went into
46:21the commercial berths in Karachi
46:23so that they would not be targeted
46:25by Indian missiles.
46:26So this fear of the Indian Navy,
46:29Gaurav,
46:29is something that the Indian Navy
46:31has worked on very hard
46:33since the 1971 missile attacks on Karachi.
46:36So, Admiral Sinha,
46:37India was minutes from striking Pakistan from sea.
46:40Would Pakistan have known that
46:42given Pakistan's urgency
46:44in seeking a ceasefire?
46:45What is our understanding
46:47of Pakistan's naval preparedness, sir?
46:52Well, thank you, Gaurav,
46:53for getting me on your show.
46:55You know,
46:56this was absolutely a repeat
46:57of Operation Parakram,
46:59as Sandeep just mentioned.
47:01And we were just a few minutes away.
47:05As I mentioned on your program earlier,
47:08that all along the Makarang coast,
47:11the targets were pre-selected
47:13by the Chiefs of Staff Committee.
47:15And we had all the missiles,
47:18the top connectors were connected,
47:20and it was only the bottom connector
47:22which was to be connected and fired.
47:23We were just waiting for one signal
47:25from the neighbor's headquarters,
47:26which didn't happen.
47:27And we were quite disappointed
47:29that it didn't happen,
47:30to be honest.
47:30Because what happens,
47:31you know,
47:32when the military people
47:33are prepared for a war,
47:34you know,
47:35you have given enough sort of boost
47:37to their morale
47:38and your adrenaline is pumping.
47:41So all this.
47:42And Admiral Tripathi,
47:44then a commander,
47:45he was Free Communication Officer with me.
47:47And one could,
47:48he would have recalled all this.
47:50And I'm sure that he was quite charged up
47:52when he made this statement,
47:54even as the Chief of Naval Staff.
47:55So what happens is that
47:58we only have to close sufficiently
48:01so that we stay away
48:03from the fire of their ground-based
48:08anti-shipping missiles
48:09or their aircraft,
48:11which can carry missiles
48:13and they can fire from long distance.
48:15Or is that nature of warfare changing
48:18and especially,
48:18look at it, Admiral,
48:20from the point of view of the current war,
48:22America has the world's most powerful navy,
48:2511 aircraft carriers,
48:26strike group,
48:26strong navy
48:27and unable to go into the Strait of Hormuz.
48:30Are undersea drones
49:01changing warfare completely?
49:02You know,
49:03the sea room is not enough
49:05for our ships to manoeuvre.
49:06And that's exactly what is happening to America.
49:08People are saying,
49:09aircraft carrier,
49:10no,
49:10no,
49:11aircraft carrier is not required to go,
49:12it is not supposed to fight that war.
49:13It's just like saying that,
49:14you know,
49:15on a mountain,
49:17you know,
49:17you will use so-and-so weapon system
49:19on,
49:20let's say,
49:21on the desert,
49:22you will use something else.
49:24You know,
49:24forward area,
49:25you will use something else,
49:26some other helicopter.
49:27Similarly,
49:27the navy has got different sectors of warfare
49:30and there are separate,
49:31you know,
49:32there are separate assets.
49:33We have,
49:34you know,
49:34minesweepers,
49:35we have mine layers
49:36and we are also working on what you just mentioned,
49:39the underwater drones.
49:41Underwater drones can actually carry a sweep
49:44and which can sweep that whole area
49:47and even if it gets sort of destroyed,
49:50it's all right.
49:51There are no human losses.
49:52So,
49:52I think the point is that
49:54the nature of warfare hasn't changed.
49:56I think the assets which are available
49:59to fight that war,
50:00that has changed,
50:01really.
50:02In restricted water,
50:03nobody will fight with aircraft carriers.
50:05So,
50:05there is no change in nature of water.
50:06So,
50:06in restricted water,
50:07you know,
50:08were we in a position
50:10and I will come back to
50:12Operation Sindhur,
50:13were we in a position
50:14to dominate
50:15Indian navy
50:16in a position
50:16to dominate
50:17the North Arabian Sea,
50:19ensure Pakistan navy stays
50:21inside harbor,
50:23bomb Karachi
50:24or bomb whatever area
50:25we may want to bomb,
50:26would that put a fear
50:27in Pakistan next time
50:28or next time
50:29with their undersea drones
50:31or their longer range
50:32maritime reconnaissance aircraft
50:34or other assets
50:35or their sea denial capabilities
50:37and their submarines,
50:38they would be in a position
50:39to checkmate us?
50:41Very much,
50:42very much,
50:43Gaurav.
50:43If we are watching the world,
50:45if we are watching Epic Fury,
50:46so are they.
50:47So,
50:48if we are improving our systems
50:49or manner in which
50:50we are actually going to utilize
50:52those new systems,
50:53they will do the same thing.
50:55So,
50:55we have to make sure
50:56that we take it for granted
50:58that if we have it,
50:59they will have it.
51:00It's just that
51:01our numbers are much larger
51:02and our counter to that
51:04should be available to us
51:06in the next warfare,
51:07which I am sure
51:07the navy is working on it.
51:09You know,
51:10I am sure the people
51:11are quite capable
51:12and they would do this.
51:14But it doesn't mean
51:15that the Pakistanis
51:16will not have it.
51:17They are also watching this.
51:18They are also building
51:19their navy.
51:20You know,
51:21the Chinese are helping them
51:22because Pakistan
51:24is basically fighting
51:25a proxy war for China.
51:27It is not fighting
51:28any war of its own
51:29because it doesn't have
51:29anything of its own.
51:31You know,
51:31Absolutely.
51:32So, Sandeep,
51:34you know,
51:34Pakistan's entire concept
51:37of the navy
51:37remains
51:38smaller navy,
51:40sea denial.
51:41India talks of
51:41a bigger navy
51:42and sea control.
51:44Are we seeing
51:45this big,
51:46big change,
51:47you know,
51:47the biggest lesson
51:48from Epic Fury
51:49for us
51:50and for the terror state?
51:52Well,
51:53absolutely,
51:53Gaurav.
51:54You know,
51:54the thing is that
51:55Pakistan is
51:56geographically challenged
51:57and the kind of advances
51:58that we have
51:59with our missilery,
52:00with our sensor capabilities,
52:02there is no part
52:03of Pakistan currently
52:04which we cannot cover
52:05which is left
52:07unexposed to our missiles
52:09or our surveillance devices.
52:11Now,
52:11that is particularly true
52:13of the Pakistan navy as well.
52:15They are exposed.
52:17They do not have,
52:18say,
52:18the same advantages
52:19that Iran has
52:20in the Persian Gulf
52:22because it has
52:22a narrow choke point
52:24there.
52:24It can wage
52:25what is called
52:25choke point warfare.
52:26The Pakistan navy
52:27can't do that.
52:28It's open
52:29to the North Arabian Sea
52:31and that is where
52:31the Indian navy
52:32holds sway.
52:33There's stock
52:34of eight Pakistani submarines
52:36coming in from China
52:37but even those submarines,
52:39Gaurav,
52:39they will ultimately
52:40have to dock
52:41in the ports
52:42in that same coastline,
52:43in Karachi,
52:44in Ormara,
52:45in Pasni,
52:45wherever they build it,
52:46it's open
52:47to the Indian navy.
52:48These submarines
52:49can be attacked
52:50and destroyed
52:51in port.
52:52Just the way
52:52we destroyed
52:53the air bases
52:54during Ob Sindur,
52:55possibly the Indian navy
52:57would do the same
52:57to the Pakistan navy,
52:59the submarines
52:59and warships
53:00even before they exit
53:01harbour, Gaurav.
53:03We were poised
53:04to do that
53:05and that debate
53:06will continue.
53:07Should we have done it
53:08or did we follow
53:10the principles of war
53:11very effectively
53:12to the T
53:13that you've met
53:14your objectives,
53:15you have an exit strategy
53:16and you pull back.
53:17Last 30 seconds,
53:18Admiral Senna,
53:19India did the right thing
53:20by not using navy
53:21or should the navy
53:22have been used
53:23during Ob Sindur?
53:23Absolutely the right decision
53:25because the objectives
53:27of war
53:27or conflict
53:29were already let down
53:30which was a
53:31joint service aim.
53:33The joint service aim
53:33was to attack
53:35these four
53:35in case Pakistan
53:36retaliates
53:37in any of these
53:38then you decimate
53:39the country.
53:40But that didn't happen.
53:41They didn't come
53:42to that stage.
53:43So we have achieved...
53:44So Pakistan was already
53:45on its knees.
53:46It did not strike back
53:47and that's the reason
53:48India did not escalate.
53:50I will leave it at that.
53:52That debate continues
53:52for us.
53:54We are very clear
53:54India was always
53:56on top of that
53:57escalation ladder
53:58when Pakistan
53:59sought a ceasefire.
54:00Admiral Senna and Sandeep,
54:01many thanks for joining me.
54:02We'll continue
54:03tracking the story
54:04very closely.
54:04That is all I have
54:05for you on India First
54:06this evening.
54:06Many thanks for watching.
54:08There are lessons
54:08to be drawn
54:09from every conflict
54:11here or across the world
54:13and we'll continue
54:14with that.
54:15News and updates
54:15continue on India Today.
54:17Stay with us.
54:27We'll see you next time.
54:28We'll see you next time.
Comments