00:06From Las Vegas, Nevada, I'm Allison LaForgia, and today I am sitting with the CEO and founder
00:12of Mortgage Workflow Partners, Larry Bailey. Thank you for joining me today. Thank you for
00:18having me. So, Larry, you have over 30 years of experience in mortgage and technology. Let's talk
00:27about what led you to found Mortgage Workflow Partners. Yeah, it's a crazy question. So,
00:34after all that time in mortgage, especially with everything that goes on here at the ice show,
00:39you think it's all about technology. But I actually found when that I went to work for
00:46Ellie Mae back in 2012 to actually implement Encompass for clients. They'd hire, it's under
00:51contract, and I was the guy you got to implement your Encompass. And I'd ask people at that time,
00:56this is 2012, for your documented workflow. I never got a good answer. It was always either zero,
01:03we have nothing, or we have something, but it's really, really old. And so, fast forward over the
01:08next nine years, really, I helped companies in different ways, but it was always workflow first.
01:15And so, an opportunity came to be where it was my chance to take a shot on myself instead of
01:21somebody
01:22else. Started the company, and we began that concept of workflow before technology. And sure
01:30enough, by 2023, it finally started to catch on. And so, we have a team of 23 now, which is
01:38just such
01:38a huge jump for us. And we're happy that people are finally doing what we knew was always needed,
01:44which is to put workflow first. And we're here to help with that or admin services, workflow
01:49documentation, all kinds of things in the mortgage space, because we've got the experience behind us
01:55to know what's needed. Right now, in the industry, there's so much buzz over AI. Never heard of that.
02:03What's AI? I know, right? So, talk to me a little bit about why, despite that buzz, you think workflow
02:11comes first. Sure. Do you use AI? Sometimes. Okay, me too. And so, you ever come up with like an
02:19answer from AI, and you're like, what the heck was that? Doesn't make any sense. Makes no sense. Came
02:23from nowhere. It's an answer. So, but what if you gave it a well-formed prompt that actually described
02:30what you want it to do, so the result is actually what you want? Makes sense, right? So, that's why
02:35workflow comes first. So, even in AI, where companies sometimes think, not everyone, but there
02:46are some institutions that think, just take AI, plug it in, magic pill, silver bullet, the whole thing,
02:53and it's just not true. So, what we really find is that by having companies understand what their
03:00workflow is, it actually parses out the parts that can be automatable, and then we focus AI on that.
03:07That's perfectly fine. But if we don't know what people are supposed to be doing all day,
03:13how can you possibly want them to do it faster? It doesn't make any sense. So, it kind of cuts
03:18back
03:19to my core tenant, and we did, you know, we've helped a lot of companies understand that philosophy
03:26and really take those steps. I built a piece of software called Workflow Coach that actually
03:31embodies the ability to document your workflow and then also tie into projects with work streams.
03:37A lot of fancy stuff, but I built it for us, for our clients, and we're finding out that actually
03:42everybody needs it. You mentioned something to me when we were talking earlier that really captured
03:48my attention and I want you to explain what's important about it. What is native first and what
03:56is important about a native first approach to optimization? It's a lot of words. So, native first,
04:04it would be the equivalent of buying a car and then all of a sudden bolting on all these aftermarket
04:09attachments. Okay. Like, why would you do that? Hopefully, you do that because you've already
04:16figured out that those options weren't available when you were building a car, right? And I'm using
04:20a car analogy because it just kind of popped in my head, but everybody should really understand this.
04:24So, the same thing in mortgage technology. When it comes to understanding everything that you're
04:30doing, whether it's in Compass or it's AI, you've got to understand what's possible in the package that
04:36you are receiving from the technology provider. You've got to nail those settings and those features
04:43and everything down first. Figure out how to modernize your business with those choices.
04:49When you've come to the end or you've come up to a dead end where the native doesn't support and
04:55there really is no other workflow way around it, you just have to get this extra piece of text
05:00somewhere else, go for it. But at least you've justified why it's needed and the value that it's
05:06going to provide. And also, it's great feedback for the original technology provider. Because you're like,
05:11hey, by the way, I had to go pay extra for this thing. Do you mind building it for us
05:16so I don't
05:16have to pay extra? Chances are they'll say, yeah, thank you. And they'll take the idea and make it
05:21better for you. But that's why it's important. And then lastly, because we work with multiple
05:29technology partners, we understand what their technology does at the native level. And that
05:33helps us understand how to better suit companies' workflows. And when you don't know what native is,
05:41if somebody builds something custom, it just becomes a scaling issue. So that's why we always
05:46focus native first. So talk to me about something that comes up either as a surprise or maybe that's
05:52a misconception that you come across when you start looking at a company's workflow.
05:58My misconception or theirs? Theirs. Theirs. Oh, theirs. They know what their people do.
06:03Right. And so, or the misconception is also, I'm sure you're going to find stuff, but I'm sure we're
06:11okay. And so the reason why that's a misconception is because business is fine. Like everything's
06:19running. Nothing's broken. Nothing's broken. I mean, we have problems. But so when we actually produce
06:25the workflow report and we show them exactly what's happening and who's doing what and where
06:30they're doing it, the blinders kind of come off. Sometimes there's a lot of unhappiness,
06:40unhappy words after that moment. But after people calm down and they realize that it's really good
06:44to have the information, it's helpful. But yeah, misconception is we don't know exactly what
06:53our team does, but we're pretty sure. And yeah, we usually show them they were completely wrong.
06:59Talk to me about what makes the difference between a company that successfully improves
07:04its workflows and one that doesn't. Typically, it's implementation success and adoption.
07:12So if you have somebody who goes through these workflow assignments and they look at it, what
07:17we find at Mortgage Workflow Partners is we come back to the clients afterwards and look to see
07:24how well have they maintained that organization, how well have they interacted with the workflows that
07:32have been designed. And then ultimately, what was the success? Do they have team members that went
07:38back to doing what they did before? Right? It would be the equivalent of me showing you how to do
07:43something great on your phone. And you're like, yeah, that's cool. But I like doing it my old way.
07:49If that's allowed, then what was the point of investing in improvement? So we measure that.
07:56And hopefully companies do also, because it's the surest way to know if their teams actually have
08:01improved by following better workflows and better outcomes.
08:05Let's end with a forward looking question. Okay. How will focusing on workflow help lenders compete
08:13and grow despite potential market headwinds or tailwinds? Yeah. So in lieu of headwinds or tailwinds,
08:20I'll just say cycles, peaks and valleys, right? And so by following this, when companies figure out
08:28how their workflows are designed, good examples are when companies were doing maybe 200% of what
08:36they're doing now, they had different departments, they had hired for all these different teams,
08:40and now they don't. So the natural reaction is to reduce their force, reduce their workforce.
08:46The challenge is if those workflows are not documented, that knowledge leaves with the team
08:52members that are asked to leave. Huge problem, huge problem. So what we always advocate is get
08:57everything documented first, understand where your, where your workflow can expand or contract as
09:03needed. And then also, you know, as times change through these tailwinds or, or headwinds,
09:11technology is going to change also. Improvements are going to happen. Regulatory is going to change.
09:16So it's important to make sure that everything is, is reachable, and they can review it and see what
09:22they have to do to maintain the levels of success they want to have.
09:26And Larry, what's next for mortgage workflow partners?
09:30We're going to go to dinner tonight. No, I'm kidding. So I think, I think what's next is to
09:36take the rest of this year to really be thoughtful for our clients about how we can deliver on all
09:41these things we talked about today and, and really share with everyone how they can document their own
09:48workflows and start to take these lessons to make their improvements. There's, there's a lot of
09:54companies that are in mortgage lending about, you know, two to 3000 using compass. So we're going
09:59to focus on those folks for now, but, but I do want the company to expand its mission to not
10:05just
10:05encompass, but to every company that lends to have them understand exactly how they can become better
10:11by looking at workflow first.
10:13Well, Larry, thank you so much for talking to me about mortgage workflow partners. I can't wait to see
10:17what's next. Likewise. Thank you.
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