- 6 hours ago
Category
📺
TVTranscript
00:03I'm not sure if I'm gonna come in really yeah it'd be fine because they're drowning
00:13or maybe you try it for a bit I'll go first
00:17it's looking good it's looking rough it's a scatty cat I'm not sure
00:24you fancy it
00:51no prints
00:55nothing taken or disturbed
01:00no unfortunately the the blood sample wasn't big enough for the lab to get a full DNA read
01:07it's disappointing
01:11well I really thought it was enough for a full sample
01:14apparently not
01:16what about the glove mark not enough resolution for them to do anything with
01:20you know I took photos of the house right after the break-in
01:26and nothing was touched
01:27no
01:30or they put everything back in its place which is what you would do if you were installing a listening
01:34device I've applied for warrants to do exactly that
01:37you're a copper serious crime squad covert surveillance unit counter corruption
01:42I'm innocent
01:45well I mean um
01:47as you know
01:50we've done a couple of sweeps
01:53nothing
01:55no me neither
01:56so um
01:58you know there's not much more we can do
02:01okay
02:02okay
02:04okay
02:20Oh, my God.
02:42God.
03:06You've worked in surveillance, haven't you, for years, so you're telling me you can't
03:11actually see if they've got in your computer or not?
03:14No.
03:17I've done what I can to check, but you just can't tell now.
03:20You see, there's this incognito spyware runs a keylogger in the background, which means
03:25they can record every key you press, every mouse click.
03:28They can see the emails you write, your messages, your passwords, et cetera, everything.
03:33But they build it so you don't know it's there.
03:35What did the police say?
03:38Well, an officer came out.
03:40He took a sample of the blood.
03:42There was some blood on the handle downstairs, and he thought he could see a disposable glove
03:48mark in it, which means that whoever did it wants to make sure they're untraceable.
03:52He did think they could find a DNA result.
03:54And then nothing, nothing happens.
03:58What do you think this is, sir?
03:59Anything they can find to discredit us.
04:03Something that would look good on the cover of the Daily Mail, for example.
04:07I mean, I can't think of anything that, you know, I mean, I'm...
04:10Well, you know what it is.
04:12What's that?
04:14It's the Free Jazz.
04:16If that gets out, we're fucked.
04:17Oh, fuck off.
04:19But who would want to discredit us, sir?
04:22I don't know.
04:22Could be a burglar who just got scared and legged it.
04:26Yeah, well, or he could have just seen...
04:29...Charlie's Hawaiian Cushions.
04:30Don't say that in front of Jarlie.
04:32I'm not going to do that, am I?
04:33I want to hang on to my balls.
04:36You know, the other day when this happened, the first thing I did...
04:42was pick up the phone to you.
04:43Yeah, no, I saw it. I did see it, yeah.
04:45You probably saw it. I hung up.
04:48Just to...
04:49Yeah, I just think that what we need now is we need...
04:54We need a whistleblower, don't we?
04:56And we need someone from inside the agency.
05:00And high up.
05:01From the top, yeah.
05:05Eileen said that we must be making a difference.
05:07Did she?
05:07Yeah, she did.
05:08So, come on, let's, um...
05:10That's the point, isn't it?
05:11Yeah, we are.
05:12There's no point doing this unless we make a difference.
05:13No, and let's keep going.
05:15Let's keep going and let's find that fucking whistleblower.
05:18Right.
05:20June 2019.
05:21Sir James Bevan Environment Agency.
05:24Dear Sir James,
05:25I'm writing to your office as I'm sure you will know where to direct the question.
05:29October 2019.
05:31Dear Sir James,
05:32I wrote to you to raise concerns about a serious integrity issue involving the agency.
05:38Dear Sir James,
05:3934 days have now passed since I sent you evidence.
05:42I've given up expecting a reply from you.
05:47Dear Ashley,
05:49I am in the seat of your email to Sir James.
05:57Would you mind coming to our office and would the 19th suit?
06:12Is Sir James not coming?
06:13I'm afraid not.
06:15No, Sir James wouldn't routinely attend meetings at this kind of level.
06:19I'd hoped he'd be here.
06:21He's time for.
06:23He's aware of your work.
06:24Well, we're trying to find out what you're going to do about the illegal sewage overflow at Boughton.
06:31The combined storm overflow.
06:33The combined storm overflow at Burton has shown no detectable effects on the water quality.
06:39The water quality is stable and not deteriorating.
06:42I mean, our data shows very clearly that we have the best quality water since the Industrial Revolution.
06:49The water's turned brown.
06:51Yeah.
06:52It's turned so brown that when it joins the Thames at Newbridge,
06:55it makes the Thames look like a Swiss mountain stream.
06:59The water is brown in places, but that's a natural phenomenon.
07:04It's caused by a geological fault.
07:05Sorry.
07:06A geological fault?
07:07Yeah.
07:08Yeah.
07:09Sorry, a geological fault is millions of years old.
07:13We remember when the water was clear.
07:15No one remembers the good old days before the geological fault.
07:18In the last 12 months since we installed sensors, there's been no evidence of pollution.
07:23Well, that's because you've installed the monitors upstream from the sewage pipes.
07:26Now, is that incompetence or an attempt to cover up a scandal?
07:30No.
07:31No.
07:31The agency would never position a monitor to achieve a particular reading.
07:34We are working extremely hard to transform the environment.
07:37We've improved and protected something like, I think it's 15,000 kilometers of river.
07:42It's like, but you've had 92 complaints from the general public about sewage pollution.
07:49Now, that's just the wind rush.
07:50I've actually got the breakdown here.
07:52It's, uh, uh, let's see.
07:54Yeah, yeah.
07:55Uh, in, uh, well, in 36 of those cases, there was, um, no offence.
08:01And in 39, there was insufficient evidence.
08:06And in six, we were unable to identify the offender.
08:11Oh, what do you mean you couldn't identify the offenders?
08:13Why can't you identify the offenders?
08:15There's seven sewage works along the wind rush.
08:17They're all run by Thames Water.
08:19So, I mean, you say you've got insufficient evidence, but we keep giving you the evidence.
08:23All we ever do is give you the evidence, and all we get back is it's under investigation.
08:27And then nothing, nothing, nothing ever happens.
08:32In, in exceptional circumstances, for example, after heavy rain, the sewage systems are allowed to overflow.
08:39No, no, no, no.
08:40You see, that's not, that's not the law.
08:42The law is that in all normal climatic conditions, including heavy rainfall,
08:47the water companies have to treat the sewage.
08:50They have to make it safe before they put it back into the river.
08:53The law is a grey area.
08:54No, no, it's not a grey area with respect.
08:57It's the law.
08:58Sorry, um, can I, sorry.
09:02Thames is that their own data, it, it shows they stopped treating sewage at North Leach for, for more than
09:10three months.
09:11Now, they told us that their sensors had broken down, but we think they're lying.
09:19They're, they're lying.
09:21So, well, why would they do that?
09:23Why would they lie to you?
09:24Why would they lie to you?
09:54The government want us to look like a regulator, but they won't let us do our job.
09:59Okay.
10:02When Cameron and Truss gutted the agency, we went from regulating the industry to doing its bidding.
10:09Look, do you think we could take your number?
10:11Look, just keep going.
10:15This is going to be the first government in modern history that at the end of its parliamentary term has
10:21less regulation in place than there was at the beginning.
10:25We've now identified those 3,000 regulations that we're going to scrap.
10:29Let's reduce the amount and the burden of regulation strangled by red tape.
10:33Cut back the health and safety monster.
10:35Cut guidance by 80% and we reduce farm inspections by 34,000 every year.
10:41Regulations will go.
10:42None of my ministers could introduce a regulation unless they abolished one at the same time.
10:47Massively reduce the number of rules, laws and regulations that frankly treat all of you like idiots.
10:57So, really, it's about stripping out as much unnecessary regulation as possible and taking responsibility for climate change and saying
11:07what more can we do to get us to net zero?
11:12As you know, this is a passion project for Sir James, who feels that we can bring our car usage
11:19down by 70%.
11:22Yeah.
11:24It's, yeah.
11:25So, from next month, we're going to be taking the bold decision to cut back decisively on our car leases.
11:37Yeah, come on, sorry.
11:39Mm-hm?
11:39Just, like, to clarify what, what, you're going to get rid of our cars?
11:44So, it's about reducing the agency's carbon footprint.
11:49Just getting that, yeah.
11:51Go ahead, Hannah.
11:52The cars that we drive to the inspections in.
11:56Right, yeah.
11:57Yeah, so, so, self-monitoring and, and a more desk-based regulation is really, it's really helping us move the
12:04needle on climate change.
12:08But, the, the remaining inspections.
12:13Well, yeah, how do we get to those without a car?
12:17Yeah.
12:19It's a great question.
12:20It's a really great question.
12:22And we'll take that forward to the next discussion meeting.
12:25Thanks, Hannah.
12:27Yeah, lovely.
12:28Thanks, everyone.
12:29Not easy news to break, is it?
12:30I mean, it's...
12:31Yeah, surprise, surprise.
12:31Debbie's got something to say.
12:32I know, I know, I know.
12:34But my car...
12:34Everyone's driving cars.
12:35Yeah.
12:35We're the environment agency.
12:37Absolutely.
12:37What's wrong with the train?
12:38I'll keep mine, I think, so, yeah.
12:41Mm, coffee.
12:42How do I get a coffee?
12:44Does anybody know what we're looking at?
12:47Anybody?
12:50Okay.
12:50Could you tell me what the reactants are?
12:53So, if you move your head even slightly, the vertigo gets more intense?
12:57Yeah.
12:58And the attack's happening maybe twice a week?
13:00About that, yeah.
13:05The good news is that you don't have cancer.
13:08We actually think it's Meniere's.
13:11It's a disease of the inner ear.
13:12The main symptom is acute vertigo episodes, vomiting, tinnitus.
13:20It's a pretty neat fit with your presentation.
13:25They were dumping sewage in the water the last time before I got sick.
13:32Right.
13:33You know that from...
13:35The Surfers Against Sewage app.
13:36Okay.
13:39Might that be...
13:40The causes are unclear.
13:42It's post-viral.
13:43This often starts with an ear infection, in that they're common in Surfers.
13:47Yeah, every Surfer I know...
13:48Oh, my God!
13:50Oh!
13:51Whoa!
13:51This is a chronic condition.
13:55I'm afraid there's no cure.
14:18Should we leave the table away?
14:22Just hold his back.
14:49So, by ending on-site inspections in two categories,
14:54three and four, no or low-impact pollution events,
14:58and doubling down on the more serious category one and two incidents,
15:04we think we can turn ourselves into a more effective fighting unit.
15:08Yeah.
15:09So, from today, we are ending on-site inspections for cats three and four.
15:14Any questions?
15:17Well, yeah.
15:20A category three incident can be two kilometres of sewage.
15:25Mm.
15:26We want you to not inspect, to not spend time on these incidents.
15:32Except that since the water companies have been self-reporting,
15:37they almost always only report categories threes and fours.
15:42Categories and fours.
15:42So, they're not actually reporting the serious incidents.
15:45And so, if the water companies are only reporting threes and fours...
16:07Categories and fours.
16:07...or to silently pass them and to not report them as pollution incidents.
16:13Is that clear?
16:19Yeah.
16:20Thanks, everyone.
16:21You're on with your day.
16:21Yeah.
16:33We had to fuck.
16:35Fucking wankers.
16:36How are you going to get to fucking work?
16:39Fuck, Nate.
16:41Horseback.
16:50What time did he call you?
16:52Half past ten last night.
16:55He said he couldn't miss it.
17:08Oh, my God.
17:09Look at it.
17:14Come on, get some shots and we'll call the agency on the way back.
17:40Come on, get some shots and we'll call the agency on the way back.
17:50Come on, Bob.
17:57Come on, Bob.
17:59Come on, Bob.
18:01Get an verlink of your way back.
18:02You're right.
18:07Come on.
18:09Come on, Bob.
18:12Now we're going to approach it to the security demon.
18:17I don't know.
18:44Debbie, are you driving into work tomorrow?
18:47Oh, yeah, obviously. How else would I get in?
18:49Well, can I borrow your car at lunchtime?
18:53What for?
18:55Someone keeps calling up and complaining about the same incident.
18:59It's near the bridge at Hawk Rise, so I'm going to go and take a look.
19:04OK.
19:05A bit of freelance investigation.
19:07A bit of freelance.
19:08And also, he needs to be off the books.
19:11And I need you to promise me not to tell Sophie.
19:15I can't tell Sophie.
19:16You want me to tell Sophie?
19:17Within all world, I can't tell Sophie anything.
19:21In the morning.
19:35I can't tell Sophie.
19:36Oh!
19:36Oh!
19:38Oh!
19:39Oh!
19:40Oh!
19:42Oh!
19:43Oh!
19:43Oh!
19:44Oh!
19:46Oh!
19:49Hi. Hi, is that, um, is that Justine?
19:53Hi, Justine. Um, it's, it's Hannah from the Environment Agency.
20:00Listen, it's about the, um, the pollution event at Hawk Rise.
20:04Um, it came through the system at a duration of 1.34 hours,
20:09and, and I'm here now, and it's, it's, it's still going.
20:15Yeah, yeah, I'm, I'm, yeah, I'm, I'm here now, yeah.
20:19The CSO's still discharging untreated sewage.
20:23I mean, there's, there's a section of the river that is covered over with dried sewage.
20:28I mean, there's, there's dead fish, you can see them from the footpath.
20:31I mean, you're going to get more complaints.
20:34You need to sort this.
20:40Can you prepare and cook a simple meal unaided?
20:45Yeah, but not when I'm having an attack.
20:49Then I can't do anything, I can't, I can't move.
20:52Can you eat and drink unaided?
20:55Yeah, but, again, not when I'm having an attack.
20:59Um, and I've been getting the attacks, well, every few days for the past six months.
21:04But if, if you're not having one of your attacks, can you eat and drink unaided?
21:08Yeah, but...
21:09Yes or no is fine.
21:11Yes.
21:15Can you dress and undress unaided?
21:20It's the same answer.
21:22Moving on to the mobility section of this assessment.
21:25Can you plan and follow a journey unaided?
21:31Yeah, but not when I'm having an attack.
21:34Stand and move for 200 metres.
21:37Not when I'm having an attack.
21:40Well, you know, can you move around, walk for 200 metres?
21:43Of course I can, but not when I'm having an attack.
21:45OK.
21:46Thank you, Mr Santa.
21:47Your total score for the daily living part of the assessment is zero points.
21:52Your total score for the mobility section is zero points.
21:56When you're not having an attack, you're able to do all the tasks I asked you about.
22:00That's the thing with my condition is that sometimes I can do these things and other times I can't.
22:06And when I can't, I can't do anything.
22:08I can't award you a personal independence payment.
22:11I don't know what to do.
22:11If you need further guidance about how to appeal, you can use the web chat to get some help.
22:18If you cannot access the web chat, you can contact the benefits appeal helpline on 0300...
22:24...and let me know what to do with my condition.
22:34Hannah.
22:35Oh, shit.
22:35Sorry.
22:36Sorry, I don't want to.
22:36Sorry, I didn't want to scare you.
22:37Um, do you have a second?
22:39Can I have a word?
22:40Of course.
22:41Yeah?
22:41OK.
22:42So I've just got off the phone to Justine Wright-Philips at the water company.
22:46Yeah.
22:47Yeah, she said you called her.
22:49Yeah, I... Yeah, you... I did.
22:52OK, she said you called her from the site.
22:55Well, I saw that it'd been logged on the system for the fifth time
22:58and people kept calling up complaining
23:00and nobody was doing anything about it, so I...
23:02But we don't have the revenue to be investigating Category 3.
23:08It's not for Category 3, Sophie.
23:11The river is dried over with excrement.
23:14You can see it from...
23:15So that's what I wanted to talk to you about.
23:17So Justine says that the dispersal rate in that area is really high.
23:21Is it?
23:22Yeah, she says there's, like, a strong current and a high dispersal rate...
23:26The overflow pipe has been discharging for over 36 hours
23:29and it is still going.
23:31All right, that's...
23:31The untreated...
23:31That is the water company's responsibility to report to us.
23:35You know this.
23:38OK?
23:39And Justine says that actually, really, the...
23:42Because of the high dispersal rate,
23:44that it should come down to a Category 4.
23:48Be a Category 4?
23:49Yes.
23:50Right.
23:50Mm-hmm.
23:53So, no impact on the environment,
23:56no action needed?
23:57Yes.
23:59Mm-hmm.
24:03Oh, you want me to change it on the system?
24:05Would you? Could you?
24:07Yeah?
24:08OK, thanks so much.
24:10That's great.
24:11Lovely.
24:20So, you see how well we're doing?
24:22Yeah, of course.
24:23What, are you joking?
24:24I'm not joking.
24:25You know SROIC?
24:28No, what's that?
24:30Strategic Review of Incident Charges, yeah?
24:32It's like what we charge the clients for permits and that.
24:35So, we don't have clients, Cheryl.
24:37We're an environment agency.
24:39Yes, sorry.
24:39Yes, we don't have clients.
24:41But, Sir James has put the prices up, yeah?
24:45And I'm talking like up, up.
24:47Big time.
24:49Well, he's charging the water companies more.
24:51Yep.
24:52Well, they must...
24:53Surely they've gone down to the government,
24:54like, lobbying them, going mad.
24:56They're getting the charges taken down.
24:58No.
24:59Not a peep.
25:00Not a...
25:00Not a peep.
25:01They're just paying it.
25:04We've basically had such a high revenue spike, yeah,
25:08that we are on our way to becoming a client-funded regulator.
25:15Sorry, hold on one minute.
25:16This is going a bit...
25:17So, you're saying that the water companies
25:21are funding the Environment Agency.
25:24Wow.
25:24That's what you're...
25:25Really, you see the issues there.
25:27You can't be serious.
25:29There's a client-funded regulator.
25:34Amazing, isn't it?
25:34How can that even be a thing?
25:37It's a thing.
25:38Well, hold on, because literally,
25:40the other day, Sir James said
25:42that you get the regulation that you pay for.
25:44Yeah.
25:45That we haven't got the money
25:47to do the investigations that we used to do.
25:49Nobody's paying for them.
25:51OK.
25:51That's your area, isn't it?
25:53I mean, all I know is that we have got more cash
25:58than we've ever had before.
26:01Just making conversation.
26:05I've got the job.
26:06Postman?
26:07Mm-hmm.
26:08No?
26:08Yeah.
26:08Did you?
26:09Yeah.
26:09Oh, my God.
26:11Yeah, really good timing.
26:14Uh-huh.
26:15Because I did two pregnancy tests this morning.
26:20What?
26:20And, yeah, I'm pregnant.
26:23What?
26:23Yeah, pregnant.
26:25No.
26:25Yeah.
26:26Yeah.
26:27I sort of just had a funny feeling
26:29and then, yeah, did one test, two lines,
26:33and then I did another test,
26:35and it said two lines as well,
26:36and I was like, fuck.
26:48I'm Susan Davey.
26:50I am the CEO of Southwest Water.
26:53Basically, the wet weather events...
26:55Overflow...
26:56Put a strain on our Victorian networks.
26:58Victoria's...
26:59And, unfortunately, we have a Victorian sewage system
27:03which we have inherited,
27:05and that means things do go wrong.
27:08Why did you say Victorian sewage network?
27:1012%.
27:1112...
27:1212%?
27:13What's 12%?
27:1412% of the sewage system is Victorian.
27:17What do they tell you?
27:19That the whole of the system was Victorian,
27:22so that meant that the investment would be so high
27:25that it'd be impossible to actually fix it all.
27:29Bollocks.
27:29Shall I tell you what stopped it?
27:32When privatisation came in, they just stopped spending.
27:35After the war, they kept upgrading.
27:37Then after privatisation came in,
27:40they just stopped.
27:41Not just Thames, all of them.
27:456% new plants is privatisation.
27:486%?
27:496%.
27:49Is that all?
27:50You know, it'd be good if we could maybe come and visit one of the works.
27:54I don't know about that.
27:55Well, I'll have to see, lads, honestly,
27:57because even just doing this, I feel a bit nervous.
28:01Fucking London Stadium.
28:02That's not a proper stadium.
28:04Fucking massive.
28:05Upton Park.
28:05Now, that was a proper stadium, mate.
28:07London Stadium is too big.
28:09You need fucking binoculars.
28:10Do you know what I mean?
28:10Yeah.
28:11Sorry, Pete, did you want to see an EDM?
28:13Oh, yes, yes, that's right.
28:15Well, I remembered.
28:15So this is an event duration monitor.
28:19Now, we fitted one of these on every sewage pipe in England.
28:23In 2012, right, the coalition government,
28:26they ordered all the water companies
28:28to record how much time they spend dumping raw sewage.
28:32These little units,
28:33they measure how much poo goes into the river by hours.
28:37Management have been dragging their feet for eight years now.
28:40But we're finally getting most of it in now.
28:43And the agency, they've got to publish their numbers.
28:46They have to, by law.
28:47I mean, they're not going to like it, but tough shit.
28:52EDMs.
28:54Yes.
28:57So, we are finalising plans
29:00for the statutory publication of the EDM numbers.
29:06As you know, there have been some technical delays,
29:11but it looks like they're almost ready.
29:13And, uh, they're going to come as a bit of a shock.
29:19Uh, the data's going to show
29:22that the water companies discharged raw sewage
29:26400,000 times in 2020.
29:29That's 1,100 times a day
29:33for a total of 3.1 million hours.
29:40It's a bit of a shocker.
29:42Can I just say that, um,
29:44since operator self-monitoring,
29:47we've had to rely on the water companies
29:49to report back to us.
29:51Yeah, I think that the key here
29:53is that this doesn't get framed
29:55as a failure of regulation.
29:56That is...
29:57That is...
29:58That would be quite wrong.
30:00And, uh,
30:00and I think managing comms on this
30:02is going to be key.
30:03And we are working actively
30:06with the water companies
30:07to, uh, to...
30:08to bear down on the problem.
30:11Yeah.
30:11And, uh...
30:12But that's 1,100 criminal offences a day.
30:16Well, that's actually...
30:17That's debatable,
30:18because that depends on the terms of the permit
30:20and the circumstances around each spill.
30:23Yeah, and we know the legislation permits
30:26discharging after heavy rainfall and so...
30:28No, no, it doesn't.
30:30Sorry, Hannah.
30:31The law doesn't say
30:32that you can just dump sewage after heavy rain.
30:35It says that in all normal,
30:37climatic and seasonal circumstances,
30:39the water companies have to treat the sewage,
30:42not just dump it.
30:44But it's not the agency's job
30:45to adjudicate legal matters.
30:47I mean, this is actually a matter for the courts.
30:49No, no, no.
30:51This is... this is our job.
30:52It's our job to enforce the law.
30:55Yeah.
30:56That's what we're here to do.
31:01What...
31:02Can you, um...
31:04You...
31:04Did you want to...
31:05No, no, you...
31:06You finish off here, Sophie.
31:11So we've identified the problem
31:12and now we work on the problem.
31:14Yeah.
31:14Which is reframing and owning the narrative.
31:16Yeah, we... we don't want this to get misconstrued
31:18as some sort of failure on our part
31:20because it just isn't.
31:21Thanks.
31:21Thanks, guys.
31:21Yeah, thanks.
31:22Thanks so much.
31:23Thanks.
31:24Cool.
31:25Lovely.
31:26Thanks, guys.
31:27Thanks so much.
31:28By the way, um...
31:31So...
31:32I've heard you're going to give evidence in Parliament.
31:34Yes.
31:35Yes.
31:35Amazing.
31:36Yeah, I think he's bad.
31:39What does that mean, thinking about it?
31:40He's, uh...
31:41He's nervous.
31:42No, I'm not nervous.
31:43He's nervous?
31:44No, it's not that I'm nervous.
31:46I want to do it.
31:47It's just...
31:48It's difficult.
31:48Pete.
31:49Don't worry about it.
31:50I'll...
31:50Yeah.
31:51We're counting on you.
31:52We are really counting on you.
31:53And you can explain it in this scientific way.
31:55You're going to come across brilliantly.
31:57They're going to believe you, mate.
31:58Well, it...
32:00It's not really as simple as that.
32:02I mean...
32:02The boys from Mogden called me earlier, right?
32:04Yeah.
32:05And they told me that they dumped
32:06two billion litres of sewage in the Thames
32:09over two days.
32:11Environment Agency haven't got a Scooby.
32:13Did they send you the data?
32:14I've got the data, yeah.
32:15All right.
32:15Can you send that to us?
32:16I will send it to you.
32:18We're not going to let you down.
32:19It makes sense.
32:20Please, you can do this.
32:21Come on, Pete.
32:22That's all right, no.
32:23You're a legend, mate.
32:24Come on.
32:35We now have the lowest number
32:38of serious pollution incidents
32:40from water companies
32:41that we have yet recorded.
32:44More water companies
32:45are now at the highest level
32:47of performance,
32:48what we call
32:49four-star performance.
32:52I mean, we now have
32:53the lowest number
32:54of serious pollution incidents
32:56from water companies
32:57that we have yet recorded.
33:25You're a legend.
33:28I'm an environment officer at the agency. I investigate sewage pollution.
33:36When I first joined, it wasn't a job to get rich on. You know, I could see I was
33:44I was making a difference. Corporations want to make money. We make sure that
33:50they don't poison the rivers doing it. We could investigate, prosecute, whatever it
33:57took. But then they told the companies that they could regulate themselves.
34:03That's appraiser self-monitoring. Exactly. Then came the Cameron cuts, then the trust
34:11cuts. They laid off investigators, slashed prosecutions. I mean, they even took our cars off of us so
34:17we couldn't visit pollution sites. So all these cuts meant you couldn't do your
34:22job properly. That's not it. In 2021, Sir James hiked the prices the water companies
34:31paid for their permits. It was called charge-funded regulation. We get 96 million from the government.
34:39We are now pulling in 411 million from charges. All these cuts, they're just a smokescreen.
34:48We're swimming in cash. I am doing this because I know that it is wrong. And it has ruined
34:56my whole working life. Good luck.
35:16Right. Fucking hell. What should we do? Well, first we read them. And then I think we should call
35:27some journalists. The Environment Agency has refused to comment on whether agency directors
35:36currently hold shares in UK water companies. The agency claimed it would break data protection laws
35:43if it disclosed the information. Environment agency chiefs secretly held a series of private dinners
35:48with water company bosses at the Royal Automobile Club in central London. Documents released under the
35:54Freedom of Information Act showed the meetings were held to discuss how to quell public anger over sewage
36:01space. As the sewage scandal deepens, Environment Agency CEO, Sir James Bevan, has been called to give
36:07evidence to a parliamentary committee. Well, we need to talk about what we say in public and the
36:13responsibilities we have. You have a duty not to openly criticize or discredit the organization in the
36:22media or on social media, or to disclose confidential information to anyone not authorized to receive it.
36:34If your comments inside or outside work impact on the agency's reputation by making derogatory comments
36:41about the organization or your managers, or you make comments that bring the organization into disrepute,
36:48you may be subject to disciplinary action. And in more serious cases, dismissal.
37:09I don't think I want to do this. You'll be fine.
37:17Leave the toilet?
37:20I'm all right. Leave the bloody toilet.
37:22Do you want a pie?
37:24What does that mean?
37:28Well, um, my garden is a, uh, an island which the Windrush, um, wraps around.
37:38I've watched it closely for 18 years, and I watched the water turn brown.
37:44I led a team of scientists using a machine learning analysis of two sewage treatment works run by
37:53Thames Water. One of those works, the Environment Agency said over 10 years that only two pollution
38:02incidents had been reported. Our, uh, machine learning, uh, analysis, uh, uh, it, it showed hundreds of
38:11illegal spills. Uh, more than, than 300 lasted 24 hours. And some, uh, longer than 10 days.
38:23And some for a month.
38:25Have you shown this evidence to the Environment Agency?
38:28Uh, well, we are. I've shown the evidence, like, many times. What usually happens is that they,
38:35uh, they say that, uh, they show a sign of interest, but then nothing happens.
38:44We work very closely with Professor Hammond of, uh, Windrush Against Sewage Pollution. We have a
38:52regular and very fruitful dialogue with him.
38:55Um, you've worked closely with Professor Hammond. Uh, he and Ashley Smith sent you at least 13 emails
39:05detailing evidence of illegal sewage dumping. He published five evidence reports documenting
39:12water company criminality, all of which were sent to you or your senior colleagues. They invited you to
39:19come and look at the river in 2019, and the following year sent you an email with the heading
39:28Environment Agency complicit in lawbreaking.
39:37They never heard back. You never once replied in five years.
39:43How did you manage to work so closely with Professor Hammond when you never once spoke to him?
39:48At the Thames Water Mogdon Treatment Works, there was a spill of 240 Olympic swimming pools of sewage in a
40:00single day.
40:01The existing monitoring failed to pick that up. Now, why was that?
40:06There will always be times when, uh, something happens, usually accidentally. But if we find that a
40:15water company has breached its permit, we will take appropriate action.
40:20Does appropriate action include prosecuting water company executives?
40:25Prosecution is a very high bar, but, uh, where we think that's appropriate,
40:31we wouldn't hesitate. Did you prosecute in this case?
40:35No. Have you ever prosecuted any water company executives?
40:40No, but if we thought the evidence warranted it, we wouldn't hesitate.
40:48Last year, you told this committee that you became aware of sewage dumping in May 2021.
40:53Yes. But three weeks after that, you told the committee that the water companies were improving,
40:59and that more of them were getting four out of four stars.
41:05Why were you telling the committee that the water companies were doing a four-star job?
41:11Well, you've quoted everything I said.
41:16I think I stand by everything I said. I think you'll find them mutually consistent.
41:25The agency's job is to make sure the water companies obey the criminal law, but it doesn't do it,
41:33and the water companies do whatever they want. The alleged crimes of their directors
41:39are never prosecuted. They've built criminality into their business models because pollution
41:46is highly profitable and repeat offending has no consequences. Therefore, in the light of the
41:54remarkable absence of any counter-corruption measures, we demand an investigation into the
41:59Environment Agency.
42:04The key test for me on regulation, less regulation. Is it something that enables the builders,
42:10not the blockers? Cut guidance by 80%. We've also got to look at regulation.
42:15Regulations will go. And where it is needlessly holding back the investment. Reduce the amount
42:20and the burden of regulation. Rip up the bureaucracy that blocks investment. Northumbria and water recorded
42:2630.1 spills per overflow over the course of 2023. 280,000 hours and change in total. The chief executive,
42:38Heidi Mottram, received a bonus of £234,000 that year. Why did you take football tickets
42:46from the parent company? Well, I didn't.
42:50OK. CK Hutchins Holdings owns 75% of Chung Kong Infrastructure Holdings, the owner of Northumbrian
42:57Water. And you declared £2,000 in football tickets and hospitality.
43:01Well, on that occasion, there was nobody from a water company that was involved in offering those
43:07tickets. There was nobody from a water company at that event. Well, I wouldn't have known that.
43:12They weren't present. Why didn't you know? You should have known that.
43:14You said that these sort of people should potentially be in the dock if they have been
43:18found to break the rules. You took £2,000 in tickets and hospitality for a football match from
43:24bosses linked to that company that polluted that water. Why should people in Northumbria think that
43:30you're fit for your dock? Well, I certainly wouldn't have known that. And judge me by what I do.
43:33Why not? Judge me by what I do.
43:34Well, that is what you did.
43:48Environment Minister Steve Reid is pursuing legal action against a group of anglers trying to restore
43:55the ecosystem of their local river on the grounds that cleaning up individual rivers is
44:02administratively unworkable. Concerns have been raised about the number of leading
44:06labour figures with links to lobbying firms working for water companies. Among the invited
44:11guests at the government's international investment summit was Macquarie Bank. Described as the vampire
44:18kangaroo by critics, Macquarie presided over the near collapse of Thames Water, leaving it £10 billion in debt
44:25after having illegally dumped billions of litres of raw sewage.
44:54I know I can't be left alone with her.
45:01Lauren speaking speaking
45:02...privatised water is a better deal than nationalised water.
45:06Come on you, Lou, they go, I know, I know.
45:07That the water privatisation I believe will go very successfully indeed,
45:12that will go very successfully indeed, and perhaps there will be had better wait and see,
45:18...so that we can pontificate in the light of the fact.
45:21How did it come to this?
45:25How did it happen that England is the only place in the whole world
45:33whose water system is wholly privatised?
45:39That our seas and our rivers are full of shite?
45:45I just feel like we're trying to bring down
45:48England's biggest organised crime syndicate.
45:53I mean, they're not the mafia, these water companies.
45:57They're not a drugs cartel,
45:59but they do dump sewage a thousand times a day,
46:03and almost all of those are illegal.
46:07And the cash they've accumulated,
46:12£145 billion since privatisation,
46:15and they've got that because they seem to have built criminality
46:19into their business models.
46:22So they are like an organised crime syndicate.
46:27And the CEOs and the owners are like crime bosses.
46:33I mean, they don't murder people, obviously.
46:36They're not assassins.
46:40But me and Peter are sitting here waiting for these crime lords to put things right.
46:49And if we leave them to their own devices,
46:53they never will.
46:56They never will.
46:59We've put the things that we own and care about together,
47:05we've put them into the hands of financial speculators,
47:08whose job it is, is just to make money.
47:12We need to put the people who care in charge.
47:16MUSIC PLAYS
Comments