- 8 hours ago
Ask This Old House - Season 24 Episode 13 - Split Water Heater, Attic Ladder
Category
🎥
Short filmTranscript
00:00On Ask This Old House, our experts travel across the country to answer questions about your house.
00:19Today, Ross discusses the advancements in water tank technology
00:24and works with a homeowner to install a solar thermal unit.
00:29Then, do you have problems with houseplant pests?
00:32Jen gives advice on how to get rid of them.
00:35And Nathan helps a homeowner get better access to their attic by installing pull-down stairs.
00:42On Ask This Old House.
00:48Hi, I'm Ross Rathui and welcome back to another episode of Ask This Old House.
00:53When most people think about solar, they think about photovoltaic panels
00:57or solar electric panels that take the sun's energy and convert it into electricity.
01:01There's also solar thermal, which uses the sun's energy to create heat or hot water used for domestic hot water or pool heating.
01:09But today, we're headed to a homeowner's house to help them upgrade their water heater.
01:13And we're going to be using a new technology that pairs up heat pumps with solar thermal collectors.
01:18We're really excited to help them out.
01:23You must be JC.
01:24Hi, Ross. Welcome to our home.
01:26Yeah, we're glad to be here.
01:27You wrote in about a water heater upgrade and trying to get more efficient.
01:30So, tell me about that.
01:31So, we use exclusively oil here.
01:33And because of that, our water heater is all electric and it's not very efficient.
01:39Sure.
01:40So, I'd like to upgrade to a more efficient water heater if possible.
01:43Right.
01:44So, you've got an oil system for space heating and you have a traditional electric water heater for domestic hot water.
01:50That's correct.
01:51Got it. Okay.
01:52Well, I got a jump start on it and I reached out to a local company that specializes in energy efficient water heating options.
01:57He's going to help us out today.
01:58I think he's in the basement already.
02:00I can take you there and meet him.
02:01All right. Let's go.
02:03Hey, Bruce. Good to see you.
02:08What's going on?
02:09How are you?
02:10All right. So, you get a lay of the land here about what's going on. I see the oil boiler.
02:13Yeah.
02:14The electric water heater.
02:15Yeah. Yeah. So, in this house, the space heating is by oil boiler and the domestic hot water is by what we call a resistance water heater, just a regular electric tank.
02:23So, there's an electric element in the top. There's an electric element in the bottom. This is to cold in from the street and this is to hot out to the house.
02:30Efficiency-wise, we're looking at...
02:32So, its efficiency is about one or a little bit less. So, a unit of electricity goes in, you get a unit of hot water out. Dollar in, dollar out.
02:39Okay. So, when you think about these, we think about upgrades and what can we do better?
02:43Right.
02:44So, what are the other options out there?
02:45Right. So, the hybrid water heaters. Everybody's installing heat pumps. As a matter of fact, in 2029, you're not going to be able to even buy these.
02:51You're going to have to put a heat pump water heater in your basement.
02:53Wow.
02:54So, that's what we're talking about today.
02:55So, that's what I see over here, right?
02:56Exactly. This is a conventional hybrid or heat pump water heater. They're called air source.
03:01They're called air source because they take warm air from the room. They harvest the energy through the compressor or the heat pump unit on top.
03:07They take the warm energy out of that air and then they blow cold air out.
03:10So, these units can operate where on the efficiency scale?
03:12The nameplate efficiencies are extremely high for some of these units. They're like four, but that's in a test condition.
03:17You know, in real-world conditions, it'll be between two and three, depending on how cold the basement is and stuff like that.
03:22Got it. So, if we're in a hot climate, you know, very warm, where you have air conditioning demands pretty much year-round, this is a great solution, right?
03:29Yeah. It's a phenomenal solution. In the south, for example, there's a lot of water heaters in garages. So, some air conditioning and dehumidification in your otherwise hot and humid garage is a good thing.
03:38Right. Up here in the northeast where, you know, where there's space heating and you have to heat your home, it's not necessarily a good thing.
03:43Right. All right. So, what other options do we have in a cold climate like this?
03:46So, this is a split system. Far less known, right? Far less understood.
03:51But basically, instead of harvesting warm air from inside, there's an evaporator panel that gets mounted on the wall anywhere in the house and it harvests the heat from outside, right?
04:00So, that panel right there reminds me of a solar panel. Exactly. And so, you're mounting that outside. Yep.
04:05And that is like the outdoor heat pump. That's the evaporator panel, effectively, for a heat pump.
04:10Exactly. So, there's no effect on the conditioned space inside. It's not blowing cold air. You don't have to reheat anything.
04:15And it looks like a solar panel, but what's happening is that the refrigerant, all these units use refrigerant, the refrigerant is going through the evaporator
04:22and it's evaporating and gaining energy and going back inside to the heat pump unit, which has a compressor, which ultimately makes the hot water.
04:28So, the usual common question I get is, so, if it's 32 degrees outside or even colder, how does that thing work?
04:34Exactly. Exactly. So, the efficiency of this is extremely high in the summer. In the winter, the efficiency is less.
04:39But all that means is that the heat pump unit itself, the compressor, runs longer. So, lower COP in the winter, but still vastly higher than a regular electric water heater.
04:47Sure. But on an annual basis, it'll be between two and three in the high twos. Higher in the summer, lower in the winter.
04:53Got it. So, you increase the net COP compared to that. Yes.
04:56And you're way higher efficiency compared to that. Exactly.
04:58So, the cold climate like this, the fact that I don't have to have discharging cold air and putting that onus on the heating system,
05:03the fact that I can do that with an outdoor heat pump effectively with that panel, that really gives us that boost,
05:08and especially if the sun is shining on it.
05:09That's right. So, this thing is smart enough to know that when the sun is shining on it, oftentimes that panel doesn't see a lot of sun.
05:15Sometimes it doesn't see any sun. It's designed to work by convection, which means air movement.
05:19If it happens to get some sun on it, then it's happier, but the test conditions assume that there's no sun and there's no air movement.
05:25So, it's meant to go on the back of a house and the landscaping and stuff like that.
05:28Okay. So, JC, the question comes down to which option? What are you thinking about here for an upgrade?
05:33Well, this definitely sounds like a great option, so let's do it. Let's install this.
05:37All right. Let's get to work. All right, Bruce, we'll help you out.
05:39Thank you, Bruce. Yeah.
05:41First thing we do is we go in the basement. We figure out where we place the new heat pump on the walls.
05:46We measure from the floor. We mark the holes. We hammer drill.
05:54We put a level on it because our heat pump needs to be level.
06:00And then a two-person operation. We hang the heat pump onto the bracket.
06:04And then we maneuver the storage tank next to the heat pump so we're not wasting space.
06:11Electrical. First thing you want to do is make sure that connections are safe.
06:14So, that means that after you turn the breaker off, and then we mount a new junction box.
06:18The tank is in a different location, so we have to extend the conductors to the new location.
06:24From that junction box, we'll mount a new MC cable.
06:32From the junction box to the tank, we screw the covers back on the tank in the four-square junction box,
06:38and then we test the circuit.
06:40Next step, they remove the old tank.
06:42They shut the water off.
06:44They drain the existing tanks.
06:46They cut some piping.
06:51They remove the old tank. They wheeled it away.
06:55Then they measured and cut and made connections to the new tank,
06:57pro-press connections to the tank.
06:59On the refrigeration side, we're going to run the new line set through an exterior wall penetration.
07:08We connect our line set to the heat pump and to the evaporator panel outside.
07:12We test with nitrogen for leaks.
07:15And we perform a refrigeration triple vacuum to get all the non-condensibles and moisture out of the system
07:20and make sure that the system runs as cool as possible and as efficient as possible.
07:27All right, the system is on.
07:29The tank is filled with cold water.
07:30The heat pump is operational.
07:32We're in business, right?
07:33Exactly.
07:34So this panel that we screwed it to the wall, it's got nice stainless steel screws.
07:37It only weighs about 10 pounds.
07:39Our line set goes through this nice line hide, and then our heat pump is about six feet away on the wall here,
07:43so it has a nice short line set length.
07:45Nice.
07:46So the panel is made of aluminum, powder coated, and no moving parts out here.
07:50Exactly.
07:51It can't rust.
07:52It can't do anything.
07:53It'll last indefinitely.
07:54Nice.
07:55And Bruce, I see frost on the panel.
07:56Is that normal?
07:57It is normal, and it makes us happy because that means that the refrigerant is coming out at relatively low pressure,
08:01and it's very cold.
08:02It's cold enough such that the moisture in the air is condensing on it and freezing.
08:07That means it's doing its job.
08:08There's no defrost cycle.
08:09This will run until it's 20 below Fahrenheit.
08:12That's amazing.
08:13I also brought an infrared camera.
08:15So on this infrared camera here, and you can see that panel is averaging around 20 degrees.
08:20Wow.
08:21So all the hot, you know, humid air, the 50-degree air that we see is actually condensing and creating frost on that surface.
08:27I see.
08:28So that means it's actually working.
08:29Exactly.
08:30Phase change is good.
08:31Bruce, as far as efficiency, you know, what will JC save compared to his old electric water heater?
08:36So it's about a third, right?
08:38The coefficient of performance or efficiency of these systems is about three.
08:42Your electric water heater is about one.
08:44That's great.
08:45That's cool.
08:46And installation cost-wise, how does this compare if you went with the centralized, you know, traditional heat pump water heater?
08:51Yeah.
08:52So our company installs both.
08:53We install the, you know, the conventional unitary heat pump water heaters, and we install these, of course.
08:57You know, we think everybody should have a heat pump water heater, but at the 80-gallon size, this is actually slightly less for us.
09:01And in most cases in Massachusetts, it makes more sense.
09:04Well, Bruce, this is great.
09:05Thank you so much for your help today.
09:07That was awesome.
09:08JC, you happy with everything?
09:09Thank you, Ross.
09:10Yes, I am.
09:11Awesome.
09:12Great.
09:13Thank you, Bruce.
09:14Hey, Jen.
09:18Hey, Kevin.
09:19Oh, boy.
09:20I'm seeing more bottles than plants.
09:22What are we talking here?
09:23This is the doctor section of the show.
09:25Okay.
09:26So we're talking about houseplants.
09:27A lot of times, people don't know what to do when certain types of bugs come in, right?
09:32So pest control.
09:33Yeah.
09:34There are solutions if you catch it early.
09:36Yeah.
09:37Okay.
09:38So let's start talking with mealy bugs.
09:39Let's.
09:40It's like a white cottony bug, right?
09:43That usually found at the base of the stem.
09:45This one, I know, started in the new growth and it migrated up.
09:49And what they do is they pierce the plant and they suck out the sap and then they create
09:55this substance called honeydew.
09:56Mmm.
09:57And then after they have the honeydew, it's like this sticky substance that's left on
10:01the leaf and that promotes something called sooty mold, which is black.
10:05Like a black spotty that you would notice over the plant.
10:08So a double whammy.
10:09Yeah.
10:10So the sucking of the sap is no good, but then that black mold that can grow because
10:13of it, no good.
10:14Correct.
10:15Okay.
10:16So what we have to do is attack the mealy bug.
10:17Don't worry about the mold because it's caused by the mealy bug.
10:20Mmm.
10:21How do we attack the mealy bug?
10:22So first of all, try washing it off first with just water in the shower or sink.
10:26Spray it down, physically try to remove it.
10:28Just wash them away.
10:29Yep.
10:30If that doesn't work, take a mixture of rubbing alcohol and water, spray it down, and then
10:35see if you can wipe them off.
10:36Mmm.
10:37Last resort, use neem oil.
10:39This is also a great product and it's an organic product.
10:42It's just derived from a seed from a tree.
10:44Some people don't like to use it because it has a little bit of an odor.
10:47That's effective.
10:48Very effective.
10:49And so when I hear oils, I think of it as sort of as not poisoning the bug but kind of encapsulating
10:53it so it can't do?
10:54It'll cover and suffocate it.
10:55Suffocate it.
10:56Okay.
10:57All right.
10:58So that's that.
10:59And then for other plants such as this succulent, the mealy bugs like to hide in little cracks
11:04and crevices.
11:05So take rubbing alcohol with a cotton pad, go like this, and then just physically pull them off.
11:12And the alcohol's not going to hurt the plant.
11:14It shouldn't.
11:15But do a test spot on the backside.
11:17Because I like mine with a little bit of tonic.
11:19But I get it.
11:20All right.
11:21What's going on with this plant here?
11:23This plant has spider mites.
11:26Ooh.
11:27So spider mites are a little bug that crawls around.
11:30You can see they start to create like a web, right?
11:33A spider.
11:34Therefore the spider.
11:35Yeah.
11:36You can barely see them with the human eye but they are visible.
11:39Kind of like if you look at that leaf.
11:42So you can't necessarily see the bugs but you can see the webs.
11:44Yeah.
11:45But I know they're there because of the webs and then also because of spotting on the leaves.
11:49You have yellow and brown spots.
11:52It doesn't look like a healthy plant to you, does it?
11:54Not at all.
11:55That one I can tell is not doing well.
11:56Right.
11:57And what causes spider mites to show up?
11:59Like why are they going after a particular plant?
12:01One reason why spider mites show up is very dry conditions.
12:05If your plant is dry, dry, dry all the time, it's perfect environment for spider mites.
12:11So proper watering could be preventative.
12:13Yeah.
12:14Keep your soil moist and appropriate but not soaking wet.
12:16Right.
12:17There's all the balance.
12:18How do we take care of spider mites?
12:19Well, start with spraying with a solution of dish soap and water.
12:24Dilute the dish soap, spray it on, and just like these guys over here, it suffocates it.
12:31So soapy water, spray it on, and if that doesn't work, go to the neem oil.
12:36Again, either one will work fine.
12:38Very good.
12:39What are you trying to show us with this?
12:41Here we have fungus gnat problem.
12:43Mmm.
12:44So what's a fungus gnat?
12:45It starts with the larvae in the soil, and once they grow up to be an adult, they start
12:50to fly around.
12:51Which you can see, right?
12:52Right.
12:53Because I do see gnats everywhere.
12:54I saved you one.
12:55This guy.
12:56You caught one?
12:57Yeah.
12:58So this is a sticky trap, right?
12:59That's one of the remedies?
13:00Yep.
13:01Yeah.
13:02You just stick it in, they fly, they hit, and then they get stuck.
13:04Look at you, Ninja Warrior.
13:06That could be used for any of these insects that fly around, a little sticky trap.
13:11Another thing, very important, is to kill the larvae inside of the soil.
13:15This is a natural granule that is a natural pesticide.
13:20So you mix it with water, apply it to the soil, and then it will kill the larvae.
13:25That's interesting.
13:26Big words, says kills mosquito larvae.
13:28Yes.
13:29Kills mosquito larvae, but also the gnat larvae.
13:31Yep, so if there's that outside, you could use that for treatment as well.
13:34Cool.
13:35So that's how we get rid of them if they show up.
13:37How do we prevent them, like stop them from ever even showing up?
13:41That's a good question.
13:42So with the fungus gnats, this is caused by too much moisture in the soil.
13:46Fungus gnats love a moist environment.
13:49So don't overwater.
13:50Don't overwater that.
13:51This one is the exact opposite.
13:53Spider mites like a dry environment.
13:56So don't underwater.
13:57Don't underwater.
13:58So know your plants and know what soil to use and have a well-drained pot.
14:03It's a pretty good rule of thumb, right?
14:05A healthy plant that's taken care of is going to prevent the bugs from wanting to get there.
14:10Yeah.
14:11So keep them healthy.
14:12Inspect them.
14:13Very nice.
14:14Awesome.
14:15Thank you, Jen.
14:16Hey, Nathan.
14:17How's it going?
14:18Good.
14:19Nice to meet you.
14:20So you owe me about access to an attic space.
14:21Yeah.
14:22So right now all we have is this small hole.
14:23Oh yeah.
14:24And in the future we're thinking about getting heating and cooling.
14:25Okay.
14:26So we have some contractors come in and they told us to get something a little bit bigger.
14:27So kind of a small spot.
14:28Also kind of an awkward space, right?
14:29Right here next to the stairs.
14:30Yeah.
14:31Go down.
14:32Whenever I set up the ladder I do feel uncomfortable being close to the stairs.
14:33I don't blame you.
14:34Well, it's cool you already got the kit.
14:35It's definitely a two-man job.
14:36You got a spot you want to put it?
14:37Yeah.
14:38I was thinking about putting it in front of this light.
14:39This light over here.
14:40This does seem like a good spot right here.
14:41Yeah.
14:42So I was already in the attic.
14:43I moved around some insulation.
14:44Okay.
14:45I noticed that the joists do run this way.
14:46So I think it's a good spot.
14:47Perfect.
14:48I'm going to hop up there and take a look and we'll get started.
14:49Okay.
14:50Okay.
15:11All right.
15:12This is a great spot.
15:13Nice and open.
15:14No plumbing.
15:15No electrical.
15:16Danilson, what was the size of that unit?
15:17It's 22 and a half by 54.
15:20Nice.
15:21So we got 25, 54.
15:26That's perfect.
15:27That'll fit right in.
15:28All we have to do is close down this opening a little bit, create our new rough opening,
15:32but we don't have to cut anything.
15:33Okay.
15:34Great.
15:35That sounds good.
15:36All right, Danilson.
15:37I'm going to drive a screw down next to this existing ceiling joist right here in this
15:40corner.
15:41I want you to go over, take a look and see where it lands.
15:43Okay.
15:44I see it.
15:45You see it?
15:46All right.
15:47I'm going to go down a little bit further and I'm going to put another one in.
15:49Okay.
15:56Okay.
15:57I see the second one.
15:58All right.
15:59I'm going to come down and take a look with you.
16:00All right.
16:01Now we have something that we can measure off of.
16:02Let's see what we're working with.
16:05Okay.
16:06So over here, off this partition wall, I have about 38 1⁄8.
16:13And then coming back over here, I have about 38 1⁄4.
16:20So not too bad, within 1⁄8.
16:22And then I know I want to come off this back screw.
16:25My rough opening is going to be about 55 inches.
16:28So we're not too close to the light.
16:30This area is going to work out really well.
16:32The ladder's got a great area to land.
16:34I can go up.
16:35I'm going to start framing out that rough opening.
16:36Then we're going to cut that hole open, but we're going to create a lot of dust.
16:39So if you want to set a projection, you work on that.
16:41I'll work on that and then we'll cut it open.
16:43Okay.
16:44Sounds good.
16:45I'll take care of it.
16:46All right.
16:47To start framing down my opening to receive the ladder, I'm going to add two 2x4s down here.
16:53I'm going to fill in.
16:54They're going to be 25 inches long.
17:03I'm going to put two more down there.
17:07I'm going to add this 2x4 to the edge here, and that will drop the spacing down to 23 1⁄2 inches.
17:18All right.
17:19So we have all our four corners located, and I'm going to use a piece of 1x4.
17:23It's going to do two things for us.
17:24It's going to create a straight edge from screw to screw, but also it's going to compress your ceiling together
17:29because you have wood lav, plaster, and then I believe another skim coat of sheetrock.
17:34So probably a half-inch piece of sheetrock below that.
17:36So it's going to compress everything together as we cut.
17:39There's a lot of vibration, and that old plaster and lav always likes to break up.
17:43So we're going to try and minimize any of the repairs needed.
17:48We're good.
18:16Perfect.
18:17Good job.
18:20We're going to cut the ceiling into two sections so it's easier to pull down.
18:28All right.
18:29Pass them down.
18:30Ready?
18:31Yeah.
18:32Okay.
18:35You got it.
18:36Yep.
18:37So just as we thought, you have your wood lav, you have your horsehair plaster, you can see all the fibers,
18:42and then they skim the ceiling with half-inch sheetrock there and then plastered over that.
18:47So a lot of layers.
18:48So it's nice to sandwich everything together for that clean cut.
18:51Okay.
18:52One more cut and we're done.
18:53All right.
18:54Got it?
18:55Got it.
18:56All right.
18:57Down to you.
18:58Nice job.
18:59Thanks.
19:00All right.
19:01What we're going to do now is we're going to take some 1x4 and we're going to do a couple of cleats across the bottom here.
19:15That's going to allow us to bring that ladder back, put it in.
19:22It's going to lower down and it's going to sit nice and flush with your ceiling.
19:25All right.
19:26How's that look down there?
19:27It looks pretty good.
19:28I'm going to shim it, screw it, and then we can open it up.
19:30Okay.
19:31Okay.
19:32Let's take a look and see how it turns up.
20:01So that goes down, looks pretty good coming through here, but then we've got a big gap right there.
20:08So typically these ladders do come along and you cut them to fit your space.
20:12If it was a little too short, we would adjust these brackets up here to try and make that drop more.
20:17But I think the solution for here is we got to cut those legs.
20:21To do that, I'm going to flip this up out of the way.
20:24I am going to project my tape down and then I'll grab one measurement off the back.
20:30So projecting that leg down 32 inches.
20:34So I'm going to hook onto that side, measure 32 inches.
20:39And I'm going to make this a square cut, 90 degree.
20:45Because once we put our feet back on, remember those feet have that angle to them?
20:51So the feet will go back on, slide up, and we'll stop at that 32.
20:56Okay.
21:08Let's see how we did.
21:09Flip it up.
21:10Put it down.
21:13Nice and tight.
21:14Nice and tight.
21:15Want to give it a try?
21:16Yep.
21:17Nice and sturdy?
21:18Yeah, it feels pretty good.
21:19Alright, awesome.
21:20If you want to go and cut all the shims, we'll trim it out, insulate it, and then we're done.
21:26Okay, I can do that.
21:27Alright, outside I put together this picture frame with some 3.5 inch colonial casing.
21:38So what we're going to do is we're going to hold it up.
21:41There's going to be just a little bit of a reveal.
21:56Alright, now I'm going to insulate the opening.
22:02And I'm adding an insulated attic access cover.
22:05That will help reduce energy loss.
22:10Alright, push this all the way down.
22:12Drop this.
22:17I think you are good to go.
22:18Yeah, thanks for the help today.
22:19I think it came out really great.
22:20Welcome.
22:21A little bit of homework for you.
22:22We'll paint the trim, tighten that up, and then once a year, oil these hinge points, and I think you're good to go.
22:27Okay, I can manage that.
22:28There you go.
22:30Nice to meet you.
22:31Next time on Ask This Old House, Nathan and Lee team up to bring some curb appeal to a homeowner's front yard.
22:48Put that top rail in.
22:52It just looks amazing.
22:53Then, Mauro is talking paint spills and how to clean them.
22:58And Heath gives a lesson on how three-way switches work.
23:01What do I screw into what?
23:03It looks confusing, but let me try and make it as simple as possible.
23:06All that on Ask This Old House.
23:09You get around, Tony bonito.
23:10Take care of yourself with
23:19Me.
23:23Anything else?
23:24You get around and you get around.
23:26Go rewind.
23:27Tell me one!
23:28The Stop.
23:29What is the last tip?
23:30It looks real.
23:31The Side Lucis already has Brave.
23:32Technology isẻ.
23:33에 dollars that came to me.
23:34If a lady is extending the roll, refinance.
23:35The Jump.
23:36The End Ride Club.
Comments