00:00Well, let's bring in Lisa Jasko. Lisa is a Ukrainian MP for President Zelenskyy's party,
00:05Sluga Narodi, or Servant of the People. Lisa, as always, pleasure to have you with us here
00:10on France 24. We always appreciate your time. I know things are difficult there for you.
00:15Tell us, when you see that Mark Rutter is in Kiev at the same time as Vladimir Putin decides to
00:21launch this massive attack, can you take some kind of heart in the fact that this is the head
00:27of NATO witnessing firsthand exactly what you're going through?
00:35Well, I think actually it brings our reality to a very contrasting picture, because now I'm talking
00:43to you in the darkness, and I can show you that I have such kind of lamps with me. This is a sun
00:51battery lamp, and here is the candle, because since last night, we don't have electricity in
00:59the place where I live. I'm lucky that I have a heating today, so I can speak with you without
01:06my jacket on, just in my shirt. But many of the houses in Kiev are in a worse situation. And when
01:16we see Mark Rutter, who says that NATO is with Ukraine, if to be very honest, the average reaction,
01:25not only from me, but also from Ukrainian, is actually, OK, what exactly does it mean? It's been
01:31four years of the full-scale invasion. People are very tired and exhausted. We are living in darkness
01:39and coldness. And actually, it is possible to live in such circumstances. But I think NATO could do so
01:46much more. I'm always very optimistic about the role of Europe. But I think the NATO is actually
01:54one of the actors that could do so much more in terms of security. So I think people today are not
02:01very understanding what NATO is doing today.
02:05What would you like to see NATO do, Lisa? Could you spell that out for everybody? Just be clear.
02:10What would you like NATO to do?
02:14Well, I will speak very simple language. I want all of us to know that, for instance, NATO gave us this
02:25weapon that would protect this city, that NATO decided to close the sky so that if any drone or any
02:33attack would go on that area that NATO will start protecting that area, we want very clear response
02:41to all signs and a real Russian aggression, not only on Ukrainian territory, but also on the territory
02:49of other countries. And we know cases of the drones flying in different countries. The NATO needs to be
02:56tough. And not only as the consulting institution that comes together and discusses what shall we do.
03:07We are people of action, Ukrainians, not because we decided we wanted that because our life is,
03:14let's say, that tough that we cannot allow ourselves just to talk. We have to do things. And this is
03:23existential and needed for survival. We don't see the same thing coming from NATO as an organization.
03:30But again, I don't want to criticize, but I want to reflect the average mood of Ukrainians today.
03:37It doesn't come across as criticism, Lisa. It comes across as the natural frustration that you all must
03:42be feeling because you've been asking for these things from the very start to close the skies,
03:47to give you the weapons to fight, to give you the actual material support to do that. And to an
03:51extent, of course, there was some there, but not enough. And clearly there needs to be more support
03:56there and more concrete help as you're talking about. I'm wondering with this massive attack launched
04:02by Putin overnight with the scale of that, with Mark Rutte there to witness it and visiting one
04:07of the power plants that was struck. We're on the eve of talks resuming in some way, shape or form.
04:13And President Zelensky himself saying, who will believe that there is power to guarantee anything
04:19like a new outbreak of war when we see what Putin was capable of doing last night?
04:23Do you feel any optimism as these talks are about to restart?
04:27I don't have any optimism on that, but I have optimism on the fact that more and more Putin
04:40is exhausted himself as well, not as much as he could be before, not as much as we all could force
04:48him to be. We could stop this war machine so much earlier, not only by Ukrainian lives, but with so many
04:56other instruments as sanctions, as stopping trade with Russia, as isolating Russia, as making sure that
05:07the Russian war machine stops or at least has serious difficulties. These things could be done much
05:13earlier and much harder. But the timeline of all of that is unknown. And I think at this stage only God
05:23knows what will happen and when will it happen. Because this winter is the hardest for us, for all of us.
05:33But I'm not sure that this is the last winter. And I think we have to be prepared that
05:40we survive, not only as Ukraine, but as Europe, as other countries, as societies, as people. And accepting the truth
05:49and reality is already very important. And if I'm speaking on behalf of myself, I know that I don't
05:55have hopes. I accept reality and it helps me. I know that it's minus 20 degrees. I know that there might be
06:03no heating in my house, as it was a number of times. I know that there is no electricity and no water.
06:08This is a reality that I have to cope in order to survive together with my family here.
06:14Lisa Jasko, as always, it is a pleasure speaking to you. And we really appreciate the fact that you
06:19give us such an honest and open account of what you're going through on a personal level, but also,
06:24of course, on a state level, given your status as MP in the Servant of the People Party of
06:30President Zelensky. Thank you so much for joining us. Stay safe. I hope your family stays safe. And of
06:35course, power to you there in Ukraine with the continuing fight that you are leading. Thank you,
06:41Lisa Jasko for joining us.
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