00:00Well, for more on this, we're going to speak now to Aparna Pandey, research fellow and director of the India and South Asia Initiative at the Hudson Institute in the United States.
00:08Thank you so very much for joining us today, Aparna.
00:11So we're hearing a bit more about some of the deals that were signed at this summit, including notably on Russian fuel supplies to India.
00:19But is any of this really a surprise? I mean, is this summit more symbolic than anything else?
00:24Or is it marking the start of new, unprecedented, really, areas of cooperation between Russia and India?
00:32It is symbolic and there's almost nothing new.
00:37So, you know, the defense agreement, which was discussed, nuclear reactors, sort of, you know, training, sort of, you know, maritime cooperation and Arctic and the others.
00:49They're all predictable and along familiar lines.
00:53The only additional aspects would be that the two countries are trying to broaden their economic cooperation.
01:00As your correspondent noted, they would like to increase it to 100 billion.
01:04Right now, it's only 65 billion. And so at a time when India is facing pressure for American tariffs, it is seeking other countries where it can have it can enhance some of its economic relationship.
01:19And there's a final, there's a migration and mobility aspect.
01:22Russia needs workers. And India, as you know, has a lot of workers who would like to go to other countries and contribute and send remittances back.
01:30So, I mean, given what you said there, I understand that there's both a symbolic element and potential for new areas of cooperation.
01:40How much of this do you think is a consequence then not only of Donald Trump's tariffs on India,
01:46but even his administration's overtures towards rival Pakistan's civil and military leaders?
01:51I mean, do you think this is a natural course of evolution in their relationship or is it really a consequence of the Trump administration?
01:57So, I'd say it's more the latter, but it is predictable.
02:05That's how India reacts.
02:07For India, the relationship with Russia is not a sentimental relationship.
02:12It is based on realpolitik.
02:15Russia is India's balancer against China on the continental landmass.
02:20It's also its hedge against the vagaries of American politics.
02:23And so, when there are stresses on India at the global level, India needs to demonstrate that India has other partners and countries that it can work with.
02:36Russia is one of them.
02:37So is France.
02:39And there are many others.
02:40But this is India's way of hedging and demonstrating that it has partners.
02:45It's not dependent solely on the United States.
02:48You say it's not a sentimental relationship that India has with Russia.
02:53That brings to mind, of course, the war in Ukraine, which has, in a way, allowed the nations to build closer economic ties, as you detailed there.
03:02But it would, of course, be a stretch, again, given what you say, to describe India as pro-Russian when it comes to the war.
03:08How would you characterize its position and how might that affect some of its overtures towards other countries that you mentioned, including France?
03:18So, with respect to any conflict outside of the South Asian subcontinent, India's response has always been, for the last 78 years, that it asked both countries to stop the conflict and negotiate.
03:33And India has sort of has done the same with respect to Ukraine, but it's done the same with every other conflict anywhere in the world.
03:40India does not get involved in a conflict outside of its homeland, even if India sort of, you know, does not want any conflict, India does not get involved.
03:49So that's been India's stance with respect to Ukraine.
03:52With respect to its relations with other countries, France, you know, sort of most of India's partners, including France, know where India stands.
04:01Where India stood in the Cold War with respect to Soviet Union and United States.
04:06And then France knows where India stands today as well.
04:10India's biggest challenge is China.
04:13And so the main reason for the Russia relationship is that India needs geography matters.
04:20French understand that.
04:22For India, Russia matters because of the China threat.
04:26You said China is its main kind of problem, so to speak.
04:32But it does come as relations between India and China appear to be improving, at least in the wake of their last major conflict.
04:40I know that you wrote a piece about that just a couple of months ago.
04:43So do you think that in a way there is the possibility for a deeper kind of three-sided alliance between India, Russia and China, especially as tensions over the war in Ukraine and the Trump administration's tariffs continue to deepen?
04:57So for that to happen, China would need to sort of, you know, make overtures on the Indian border and actually sign a border agreement with India.
05:10Unfortunately, I'm sure you noted that a few weeks ago, the Chinese stopped and actually sort of, you know, held an Indian citizen from Arunachal Pradesh, claiming that since Arunachal is Chinese territory, that person sort of, you know, is a Chinese citizen.
05:27So as long as China keeps provoking India on any border-related issues and continues its relationship, sort of, you know, which is against Indian interests in India's neighborhood, this relationship will, it will be managed just as President Macron went to China.
05:45So the Indian prime minister will have a relationship with his Chinese counterpart because China is the biggest trading partner of any country in this world.
05:55So India cannot grow its economy without a relationship with China.
05:59That does not mean that China is not the biggest threat and rival to India in the foreseeable future.
06:07Aparna Pandey, Research Fellow and Director of the India and South Asia Initiative at the Hudson Institute.
06:13That's all we have time for today, but thank you very much for joining us on the program.
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