00:00I do want to talk a little bit more about the non-monogamy because, you know, that is something that so many people cannot wrap their head around.
00:07And I am in a monogamous relationship and that works for us.
00:11And it's kind of funny.
00:12I've actually said to my husband, I'm like, look, if you ever wanted to like have a threesome, I'd be open to it.
00:19If you ever wanted to, you know, try like, I don't know if I ever wasn't like delivering enough, which like, you know, it was fair.
00:28I'm a mom and I'm tired.
00:31Like, I would be super open to you, like being with somebody else as long as we were communicative about it.
00:36And like, I would actually prefer it be a sex worker.
00:39So I knew it was a transactional relationship and I could even like help you find somebody that I trust.
00:43I know some phones.
00:44Yeah.
00:44And he just like looks at me, he's like, you're fucking insane.
00:47They're like, there's no way.
00:48You know what I mean?
00:48Like, he's just like, he's such a, like a normal guy.
00:50Ma'am, this is a Wendy's.
00:52Yeah, exactly.
00:52He's just like, what are you talking about?
00:54So for me, like I'm in a monogamous relationship that works for me, but I've learned so much from people like you about non-monogamy and how that can work.
01:03And I just love hearing about other people's experiences.
01:06And it's really helped me see how there doesn't have to be one way for love to work.
01:11So I guess just give me your insight on that.
01:13So that's what I love about non-monogamy is there are so many different formats that you can have it in, right?
01:19A lot of people are like, oh, you're not monogamous.
01:21So you're like with all these people and you have all these very deep, different romantic relationships.
01:26And like, we're non-monogamous.
01:28Non-monogamous, but also this is my primary partner and like, man, have you ever tried to really date more than one person?
01:35It's hard.
01:35It's a lot going on.
01:36It's a lot of attention.
01:37And like, you know, just because we are open in our relationship doesn't mean we're not committed in a way.
01:42And I feel like people confuse what commitment is and what relationships really are and what's actually going on.
01:48Because like, if you take a closer look at it, you're in polyamorous relationships right now, every single one of you.
01:54You're having relationships with people outside of your primary partner, right?
01:58Whether they're romantic or non-romantic.
02:00And so like, that's just exactly how it goes.
02:02You can continue to have other relationships with people.
02:06You still have this relationship and you honor the like boundaries and rules that you've set up for it.
02:10And I think that there's so much we could do in a whole hour.
02:14Yeah, totally.
02:14So there's non-monogamy, right?
02:16Which is like, I have sex with people with more than one person.
02:20And let me tell you, during COVID, we had like a year of forced monogamy on us, which is like the longest I think either of us have maybe actually ever been practicing monogamy in our lives.
02:29And that was a little while.
02:30We actually did a little movie for Lust and Ex-Confessions that was called like Monogamish that was about exactly that.
02:38Like, oh my God, I miss my other lovers.
02:40Can we role play or something?
02:41Yeah, how was that for you guys?
02:42It was weird, honestly.
02:44Like, it was great.
02:45I mean, I love my partner.
02:46It was amazing.
02:46And also like, we were all going through this like, you know, collective grieving crisis moment.
02:52So like, that was the bottom of my list.
02:54Right, right, right.
02:54I was like, you know my girlfriend?
02:56No, it's fine.
02:56Yeah, like people are dying.
02:57You're like, oh God, I can't have sex with anybody else but my partner.
02:59And I'm like, oh, I'm stuck at home with my partner.
03:01That's better than the elf.
03:02I love so much.
03:02And we were also figuring out like how to, you know, we produced a scene for Reality Kings and for Brazzers.
03:07And just like, stepping into this new role.
03:10And we were doing everything ourselves too.
03:12Right, right.
03:12Like, the movie we made that was kind of a pure taboo vibe, Quarantined with My Stepdad.
03:18Instant classic.
03:20Instant classic.
03:21But that took us—
03:22It's going to take any situation and just make it like a faux-sass place.
03:26Exactly, anytime.
03:27Just throw a stepdad in there or a stepmom.
03:29You know what's hot?
03:31Quarantine.
03:31What?
03:32No.
03:32But it is a great little movie.
03:34And it took us like four days.
03:35You know, it's a single pure taboo scene, basically.
03:37But it was just—
03:38It was us doing sound, doing lights, doing acting, doing everything in our tiny one-bedroom North Hollywood apartment.
03:45Madness.
03:45But so yeah, non-monogamy, which refers to sex.
03:49And then polyamory refers to like love.
03:51So not only are we non-monogamous and having sex with people, we are polyamorous in this like way of—I don't know, my heart is really big.
03:59We're both Geminis.
04:00Like, I need to have a crush on someone basically at all times to like feel like a human.
04:05It's just part of how my brain works.
04:06And also thinking about like while we are married and primary partners, like we don't really ascribe to hierarchical polyamory and just like primary partner, secondary partner.
04:17I think that's kind of—I get it.
04:19I get why that works for people.
04:21But it's like—it's not that—like this is my husband.
04:24We live together.
04:25We have a business together.
04:26Those are our activities that we do.
04:28Those are very big activities, weighty activities.
04:31But it doesn't mean that like my relationship with my best friend is less important.
04:36You know what I mean?
04:37We don't do the same activities together, but like the road trip we're going to go on next summer or whatever, as an example.
04:43Like we make space in our relationship for those heavy, important relationships to have as much weight as what we give each other, if that makes sense.
04:53And I think that's really important no matter what type of like sex you're having, right?
04:57The way that you talked about you and your husband having a conversation, I feel like that's within the paradigm that we like to work with, too.
05:04It's just like, hey, open, honest communication.
05:07What do you need?
05:07I'm on your team.
05:08What do we need to do to make us each have the best life possible?
05:12And that's why we do what we do, you know?
05:15Yeah, exactly.
05:17Okay, so you said that you guys are primary partners, but you also said that you don't have a hierarchical love.
05:22Like, can you explain that to me a little bit more?
05:25It's almost like incidentally primary partners.
05:28And I use primary and secondary and tertiary as language that people understand versus going into the lengthy explanation of, she is my primary partner.
05:38But also, like, I don't sit here and be like, yeah, she's number one.
05:42Because also I carry that same amount of weight to every relationship that I have.
05:46I treat every person like they are number one in what the role they are playing to me.
05:51I think it's a good way to-
05:52Even if it's a sexual relationship.
05:53Even if it's a sexual relationship, like, I love people.
05:56I truly love people.
05:57That doesn't mean I have to be in a romantic relationship with you.
06:00But if I pretend that I don't love you with that same love that I give to somebody else, I'm lying about what kind of love I give.
06:06Yeah.
06:06I think always about, so when we were sort of becoming good friends and I was crashing at his place in downtown LA, Robbie Echo, now Apples, was living there too.
06:16And Robbie and I were smooching and hooking up at the time.
06:19And I remember, like, the second time that Robbie and I hooked up, I was like, I love you.
06:24Like, we are, I love you.
06:26Like, I love you.
06:27And then, you know, that was just, like, where it was.
06:30And, you know, Robbie has gone on and has a wonderful wife.
06:32We love Kelly.
06:33But, like, that didn't, while that our activities and the way that, like, you know, we didn't start dating or, and we don't really have sex casually anymore either, which is kind of funny.
06:43You know, relationships grow and evolve and change.
06:45But I still love Robbie.
06:46Like, he's like my brother.
06:47That has not changed at all, you know.
06:50And while we don't have a bank account together, we don't live together.
06:53You know what, like, the activities that we do are, don't take up as much time, right.
06:58But it doesn't mean that, like, he doesn't still hold that special place in my heart.
07:02And that's, Mickey Mott is another great example of just, like, friendships are real.
07:06And sometimes we have sex with our friends in this industry.
07:09And also just, even if we weren't in this industry, sometimes that is true.
07:12But love is big.
07:14And when you give your love to someone, it doesn't take away from the love you have for someone else.
07:19I think that when we talk about, like, primary, secondary, tertiary, we don't really use those terms.
07:23But they're helpful when describing sort of the pie of time.
07:27Love is not, you know, finite, but time is, you know.
07:31And so, like, we spend the most, the bulk of our time together.
07:34We live together.
07:34We work together.
07:35And so, I think that's why we're married legally.
07:39So, you know, the activities you choose with people matter.
07:43You're not going to be a nesting partner and, like, shack up with every single person you go on a Tinder date with.
07:47But that does, I always say that you can build a fence around a piece of land, right.
07:51And that, within those boundaries, that land is yours all the way down to the ground.
07:55So, you can have boundaries, but you can have endless depth to the center of the earth.
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