- 4 months ago
Greg Bedard of the Boston Sports Journal joined Joe Murray and Alex Barth on Patriots Postgame following the preseason finale against the NY Giants to break down the roster and look ahead to cutdown day.
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00:00Let's bring in Greg Bedard, he of the Boston Sports Journal.
00:04Greg, the preseason is over.
00:07Any big takeaways from you after watching tonight's game?
00:13I think my big takeaway from this was,
00:17and I sort of alluded to this on Fugger and Maz this week,
00:21this team has no depth.
00:24I mean, they, you know, it's rough.
00:28I mean, that they got completely worked by the Giants backups and third stringers.
00:33It just shows you where this operation is.
00:38And I'm not blaming, you know, Mike Vrabel and Ryan Cowden and those guys.
00:43This is the situation you get in when, you know,
00:46basically you're getting nothing from the 2024 draft a year ago.
00:51Like those guys should, at least some of them, should be giving you meaningful depth,
00:55you know, let alone, you know, the drafts under Bill towards the end.
01:00I mean, this is just, this is where they're at.
01:05The Patriots are screwed if many, any of their starters go down.
01:11They don't have, you know, a lot of NFL depth on this team and a lot of spots.
01:16And you better hope and pray that the Patriots have a lot of injury luck this year,
01:23or it's going to be a very long season.
01:27Greg, in particular on the, and I agree with you on the depth point.
01:30It's a, it's a great point, particularly on the offensive line.
01:33It seems like those backup spots, center guard have been rotating throughout the summer.
01:38Saw Caden Wallace get less reps as the summer goes on.
01:42City So's come on a little bit.
01:43Cole Strange has been in and out.
01:45But did anybody there stand out to you as a player who's maybe made a push or, you know,
01:50it feels like they might need to go out and add another tackle.
01:53Do you think they might need to go external to find a backup guard as well?
01:59I'm less, I mean, look, we know what you're sort of trolling in this time of year,
02:05as far as if you're looking for tackle depth.
02:07And maybe they do find a guy that is being let go that they think might be better than like a Vidarian Lowe or somebody like that.
02:16But remember, this is how the Patriots ended up with Vidarian Lowe and Devontree Jacobs a couple years ago.
02:22Do you think there's a chance that there could be somebody better than those guys available?
02:26Because I just don't think those guys have looked great this summer.
02:28No, I don't think so.
02:31I mean, you know, it's possible.
02:33And that's why those guys get paid in the pro personnel department to sort of figure that out.
02:38I'm more I mean, you know, I Vidarian Lowe gets a bad rap.
02:44I actually don't think he's that bad.
02:45I think, you know, we have to keep in mind how bad the coaching was over the past couple years on the offensive line.
02:51And he, you know, maybe he would be further ahead if he, you know, hit the practice field earlier.
02:57I like Marcus Bryant.
02:59I think he has a chance.
03:01Those are sort of my two backup offensive tackles.
03:05Maybe you find something better than Lowe.
03:07I'm not holding my breath.
03:09That's normally not how it goes.
03:10I'm more worried about the internal depth.
03:13I mean, I like Ben Brown.
03:15I think he was, you know, underrated last year, certainly in pass protection at center.
03:21He's shown a little bit of guard ability this summer, but they have nothing else besides that.
03:28Caden Wallace, Cole Strange, Tyrese Robinson, City So, Layden Robinson, Makai Butler.
03:34They should be gone.
03:36And, you know, if Caden Wallace or Cole Strange is on the roster after the final cut down,
03:42I would be renting, not buying, because I think that's a spot.
03:46I think the Patriots will look for help at center and guard, and they might put that over tackle at this point.
03:53Yeah, when it comes to Cole Strange, and you kind of just answered it, but is this the end of the Cole Strange era?
03:58It felt like he had a rough night tonight.
04:01It feels like he's been losing reps as the summer's gone on.
04:05Is this how this era ends?
04:09Yeah, I think so.
04:09I think this is the end of the road for him, and, you know, whether it's now or, you know,
04:16after waiver claims or something like that, you know, I think they're moving on.
04:21I mean, he's tried really hard.
04:23He has ability.
04:25Just what they're looking for in terms of, you know, football IQ, you know, being able to think quickly on the inside,
04:34which is a little bit more of an issue than it is at, like, tackle, he just, he doesn't have what they're looking for,
04:42and it's just a matter of time.
04:44Greg, is the offensive line woes more about giving the guys an opportunity and they just don't have it?
04:51You mentioned the draft.
04:53Did they just draft that?
04:54Like, I know they brought in, you know, Gary Bradbury and Moses, but did they just expect more from some of these guys
05:02and just didn't get it, and they tried to address the needs?
05:07Well, I mean, you know, I mean, it's a good question.
05:11Again, you know, the Schweitzer retirement probably didn't help things.
05:19You know, he probably would have been sort of the fifth guy on the inside there instead of, like, a Caden Wallace or a Cole Strange.
05:26You know, maybe even would have supplanted Ben Brown.
05:30Again, you know, Schweitzer wasn't, I mean, I wasn't in love with that or anything like that,
05:35and I'm sure they weren't either.
05:37It's just, you know, there's only so much you can do in one offseason.
05:43I mean, I think if they could have it back, would they have gotten in on Joe Tooney?
05:47Yeah, probably.
05:48I mean, maybe they did think that, like, a Caden Wallace and a Cole Strange, you know, had some potential.
05:55Layden Robinson's a kid who, you know, his talent is unquestioned.
06:00It's just he just hasn't figured things out, you know, well enough to stay on the roster.
06:06And so, you know, I think they tried.
06:10I think, you know, what they did was underwhelming.
06:14They certainly tried on the tackle market with some of the free agents.
06:19You know, the money just got silly for some of these guys that signed elsewhere.
06:25And they tried to make the best of it.
06:28And, you know, I do think they have the pieces there to piece it together.
06:33I will say that, you know, one of the best things about Josh McDaniels is his ability to game plan around an offensive line.
06:41And, of course, he had Tom Brady at the time.
06:43But they had some pretty crappy lines here that they got figured out.
06:47And it wasn't just Dante Skarniecki.
06:49A part of it was Josh McDaniels, you know, knowing how to sequence things to keep the defensive line off balance, keep the pass rush off a little bit.
06:58And he's going to have to do a lot of that this year.
07:01Greg, to go over to the other side of the ball in that line, specifically the defensive tackles, the interior defensive line, it felt like they got run on tonight with the backups in there.
07:09You know, I look at it, they have four locks in Barmore, Tonga, Williams, and I think Farmer just is a draft pick as a developmental player.
07:19Maybe Jeremiah Farms gets in there.
07:22Did anybody stand out to you?
07:24I think they probably need more than four guys there.
07:27A fifth guy probably helps with Barmore's injury history.
07:31Farmer's been banged up at times this summer.
07:33Has anybody stood out to you this summer, tonight, that can maybe help them?
07:37Has Jeremiah Farms shown to you enough?
07:39David Olajiga, the international pathway player.
07:43Pecco, who has some experience with Mike Vrabel from Tennessee.
07:47Do any of those guys look rosterable to you and guys that can provide depth in that spot?
07:52I continue to like Farms.
07:54He, you know, he just continues to show up and he grades out well for me.
08:00I don't know how he's going to grade out, you know, tonight.
08:04Tonga's a guy who's really, you know, impressed me this summer.
08:07I didn't know much about him, but, you know, he was known more as a run stuffer, but he's also shown a lot in the pass rush.
08:14Josh Farmer has flashed at times.
08:18He's been a little bit underwhelming.
08:20You know, he was one of those guys that's sort of the draft mix that, you know, even like a Greg Cosell were really high on.
08:28And he sort of has underwhelmed me.
08:32Pecco, you know, could he stick around just because he's a veteran and can do a few different things?
08:38I mean, it's possible, but you think you could get him to the practice squad?
08:41I mean, right now I have five with Farms on there along with Josh Farmer.
08:47But, you know, could they could they add a little bit more?
08:52Maybe.
08:53But now you're it all depends on what they what they keep on the end.
08:57I mean, you know, I thought Truman Jones was a lock.
09:00Is he a lock now?
09:01Because right now I have six guys on the edge, which is a lot.
09:05But I think that, you know, Swinson is underwhelmed a little bit, you know, from the way he was sort of talked about during the draft process.
09:13Ponder has definitely shown up and is an NFL player.
09:17Truman Jones has flashed.
09:19But has he done enough to secure a roster spot?
09:22I'm not sure about that.
09:23And just Kyle Duggar.
09:24Yeah, he has got two interceptions.
09:27He spoke after the game tonight as well.
09:30Mike Vrabel.
09:30We'll dig in some of the Vrabel stuff on the other side.
09:33But just Vrabel said he has talked to some of the players like Peppers and Keon White about their playing time.
09:39When they asked Duggar, he said he hasn't heard from the coaches.
09:42Should we look into anything to his answer there?
09:48I think so.
09:49That's, you know, that's surprising that that hasn't taken place.
09:56You know, Vrabel did say he talked to Keon White about him playing tonight.
09:59I'm sure he talked to Jabril Peppers about wanting to see him with Craig Woodson tonight.
10:03But to have Kyle Duggar out there to the end of the last two preseason games and not to say anything to him, that's pretty rough and probably not a very good sign.
10:13Greg, I know it's about joint practices.
10:16And, you know, really, as like talk show hosts, we can really only go by what you guys say because you're there and you can see what's going on.
10:23But I think this week you had, I don't want to use the word reservations, but when things came out, you were at least high on the win total.
10:34And after watching a little bit, you've tempered your expectations a bit from what you've seen.
10:40What is it about tempering those expectations?
10:43Is it the depth, number one, the line, the quarterback play?
10:47What truly makes you kind of have reservations on the expectations for the team?
10:54Number one, by far, is their depth.
10:56Like, you know, I just think if, and I was just writing my column for tomorrow where I'm actually like going through and being like, how many real NFL players do they have on this team?
11:08I mean, because, you know, if, if they lose just some of the guys that I put together in terms of like, you know, there's nothing really behind them.
11:17Drake May, Robert Spillane, Will Campbell, Morgan Moses, Michael Wenu, Steph Diggs, Hunter Henry, Travion Henderson, Christian Gonzalez, Harold Landry, Kayla Vaughn Chason.
11:30You know, you know, I guess I could put, you know, Milton Williams probably, you know, in there, even though I think they have decent depth, you know, with Tonga and, you know, also, you know, farms in there.
11:49You know, I'm not, you know, Barmore, who knows what you're, what you're going to get with him.
11:54I'm not all that high on Keon White.
11:58He's basically like disappeared since Laramie Tunsil of the commanders in the joint practice kind of stuffed them in a locker.
12:06And he was out there tonight.
12:08Vrabel said he's got things to work on.
12:10I don't think he started off pretty well, but I don't think he's had a very good summer.
12:15So the depth is the big thing.
12:17When I looked at it, like, you know, you thought maybe, you know, whether it was a Cole Strange or a Caden Wallace, like somebody would emerge.
12:27I like Ben Brown as a depth piece at center and guard.
12:32But depth, you know, if they get any major injuries, if they have bad injury luck, they're going to have a tough time competing.
12:41So that's number one, because you can't bank on really good injury luck.
12:45Maybe it happens.
12:46Could.
12:47I don't know.
12:47Um, and then probably the second thing is, um, you know, just may in his, you know, development and what we saw in the preseason games.
12:59And it's, it's tough for me to rationalize because I think he's been pretty good in the joint practices.
13:05Um, he has not been good in the preseason games, you know, missing easy bunny throws, um, you know, missing reads that aren't all that complicated.
13:15Now, you know, you know, I do think it's going to be different in the regular season.
13:19I think the difference that you see in the joint practices to the preseason games is that McDaniels is using some scheme and may has a, is much more decisive with that.
13:30When, when, when, when McDaniels is using a scheme in the preseason games, they just kind of wing it.
13:35There's no scheme.
13:36And I think that Josh McDaniels will use everything possible, including Drake May's legs to generate offense and score points.
13:47And so I have a lot of faith in Josh McDaniels, um, to be able to, to get, you know, Drake May up there.
13:54I just think it's going to be, I think a lot of people, including myself, we're like, oh, well, he's got Josh McDaniels.
14:00He's got Mike Rabel.
14:01Like, you know, here we go.
14:02Huge year to deep, huge, huge leap, year to leap.
14:07And while I think that's going to happen, I'm just not confident it's going to happen, you know, in the first four games or maybe the first eight games.
14:17And so I think there's still a pretty big learning curve for him.
14:22And I think it's just going to take time.
14:25Greg, just to go back to, to talking about Keon White and him playing as much as he did tonight, it, does that, the fact he played as much as he did,
14:35do you question his roster status at all?
14:37Does this open the door to him maybe being somebody that's on the bubble?
14:40Like we've talked about with Kyle Duggar and Anthony Jennings as late as they've played into, uh, into games.
14:46Or do you see this, like Rabel said, simply they wanted him to get more work in?
14:54Uh, I do think part of it, I think a lot of it was, he just needs more work.
15:00And, you know, Keon's a guy that, um, you know, and I've even seen this in some of the joint practices, like, you know, some of the, some of the issues that they've had on the edge in the running game in these joint practices, you know, sometimes it's Keon White.
15:16And you remember, he's, he's freelanced here in the past and, you know, could, could there be some, you know, patience running thin a little bit with him?
15:26I could, I could see that.
15:28Um, you know, it, it wouldn't shock me if they subtly put him on the block.
15:35Um, because I do think a lot of this first year and, and Rabel has sort of hinted at this.
15:40It's about, you know, finding out which guys are their guys.
15:45And in a lot of ways, you think Keon White could be that guy.
15:50Is he in actuality now that they've had him in the building for so long?
15:53Uh, I'm not sure.
15:55So, you know, what, would I be shocked if all of a sudden we hear that, you know, Keon White is dealt for a fourth round pick?
16:02Like, no, I mean, cause I think, I think with, you know, some of their youth that they have behind them, maybe they like Elijah, I mean, they might like Elijah Ponder better than Keon White at this time.
16:15I don't know that it wouldn't shock me.
16:18And, you know, like we talked about Truman Jones earlier, he's flashed.
16:22Like, do they just say, I don't know if Keon White's ever going to be our type of guy.
16:27So maybe we just move on and we play these other guys.
16:30I think, I think we could see that at a lot of positions on this team.
16:34And that's what I talk about when looking at this roster and how many, how many guys do they actually want to keep on this roster?
16:41And I think it's, I think it's up in the air.
16:45All right, Greg, I have to play talk show Joe here for a minute.
16:48Um, Mike Vrabel after the game, uh, when asked about Jalen Polk, uh, earlier this week about the trades between Jennings and Duggar.
16:56Uh, I'd like to find out where some of these reports are coming from.
17:00Some of these rats around here, we'll figure it out.
17:02I just, uh, I have a lot of layers to this one.
17:06Um, there, someone's leaking information.
17:08Is it a player?
17:08Is it an agent?
17:09Is it stuff in house?
17:10He doesn't like, um, that seems like, you know, a shot to wake everybody up about speaking.
17:16I just wanted to get your opinion on maybe what he, and let's not forget last week too, with the, with the Stefan Diggs stuff and Phil Perry back and forth.
17:25He's, I don't think he likes the reports that are coming out there.
17:28It sounds like.
17:29Yeah, it's, it's interesting.
17:31I mean, I'll have to go ask people in Tennessee, like how he handled this stuff.
17:35I mean, I do find it a little bit comical because, you know, let's face it.
17:39Um, every NFL coach leaks to some degree.
17:43I know that Mike certainly has his favorite, um, you know, reporters, especially on the national scale.
17:50Bill Belichick leaks stuff all the time.
17:53And he was the, the guy who was most paranoid about people talking and saying the wrong things, but he leaks stuff all the time.
18:01Um, yeah, I don't know why, I don't know why this is getting under his skin.
18:06I mean, I can almost guarantee you that Jalen Polk report came from the agent, uh, you know,
18:12the reporter who had it out there.
18:14Um, what's his name?
18:16Uh, Jordan Schultz.
18:17Jordan Schultz.
18:18Yeah.
18:18He's, he's a, he's a big agent guy.
18:21Yep.
18:21Um, so I mean, look, it's on, it's on Mike to shut people up.
18:27I mean, maybe he hasn't set the tone that like everybody needs to shut up and maybe that's something he needs to address.
18:33All right.
18:34Uh, he's Greg Bedard of the Boston sports journal.
18:37Um, I just, I have to ask you one more Raiders are coming into town.
18:42Uh, Pete Carroll, uh, obviously we know about Josh McDaniels time, Max Crosby on the other side, even Tom Brady is part owner.
18:50I just want to ask who has more motivation here.
18:54Is it Josh McDaniels and the Patriots with Drake may and Mike Vrabel, or is it the Raiders with Chip Kelly and Pete Carroll?
19:02And, you know, it's, it's fascinating.
19:04The two teams, right?
19:05And I just, I kind of wanted to get your take on who has more motivation heading into week one.
19:10Uh, I would think the Patriots, you know, being at home and, and, you know, I think that Josh McDaniels certainly will have a lot to prove to the Raiders and, and, um, and the owner in particular, um, with what went down there.
19:26Um, you know, but it is an interesting mix.
19:29I mean, you know, that's one of the games when I, you know, sort of changed my, uh, prediction and progress.
19:37Um, you know, the Raiders game was one I always had for them.
19:42Um, you know, I don't know.
19:44I mean, part of the reason is what's difficult about this.
19:48Cause you have two new coaching staffs, you know, all the way around and, you know, including, you know, not only is it Pete Carroll and Patrick Graham is his defensive coordinator, but you have Chip Kelly as an offensive coordinator back in the NFL.
20:02And he's completely unpredictable.
20:03Like I have a lot of faith in, in Mike Vrabel and Josh McDaniels and their ability to game plan against teams where they know a lot.
20:13They have the film, break it down.
20:15They'll find the edge.
20:16They'll win in the margins for the Patriots.
20:18I don't think they can do that week one.
20:20I think there's way too much unknown about, about the Raiders.
20:25And, you know, when you look at like, you know, uh, Gentie and Brock Bowers, you know, they have a lot of talent.
20:31Of course, Max Crosby, um,
20:34And Gino, you know, I, you know, beat them last year.
20:37Gino beat them last year.
20:39Um, I just think that the Raiders have the ability, um, with their coaching staff and their talent to maybe get off to a little bit of a quicker start.
20:49Um, but you know, it'll be great to watch.
20:52All right.
20:53He's Greg Bedard.
20:54Just so you know, on that one, uh, the line was Patriots three and a half.
20:57It's gone down to three.
20:59So just like you have maybe, you know, come down from your win total Vegas also has moved the line just a little bit.
21:05So you're on the, uh, the side of the bookmakers, Greg, which is always the right side.
21:10Don't forget about a Landon Roberts on the Raiders.
21:13Oh God.
21:14Landon Roberts revenge game.
21:15Landon Roberts back in Foxborough.
21:17Love that one for the first time since he caught the touchdown pass.
21:20Maybe, maybe, maybe.
21:22All right.
21:23Greg Bedard, Boston sports journal.
21:24Thank you for staying up late with us, man.
21:26And now we'll talk to you week one.
21:28Sounds good.
21:28Thanks guys.
21:29You got it.
21:29Greg Bedard, Boston sports journal.
21:31Of course you can hear his breakdown with Felger Mez, uh, big boy Tuesdays.
21:35You can hear those there.