00:00These are similar guys, Danny, because they're both aging hurts is 34 years old.
00:05Wagner's also 34, but it's going to be 35 before the start of the season.
00:09And both of them are declining physically in their skillset, but they can still help you.
00:14Wagner has played at a higher level. There's no doubt about that. But the question is,
00:18if you get to bring one of them back Earth, Sumo directly helps Jaden Daniels,
00:23Wagner, who was their leading tackler, which do you prioritize?
00:27It's Wagner for me. And it's closer than maybe I thought upon initial inspection,
00:32as soon as I heard, I go, Oh, it's, it's Wagner. I mean, hurts got every ounce
00:37out of what he had left this year, the previous track record for him. And this is why I don't
00:43say I was dubious at the signing. It didn't cost very much. And I said, that's smart. Give the,
00:47you know, a young tight end up a mentor in the room. It doesn't affect you. It's not one of
00:51those things where you're stuck with a $30 million dead cat pit or something like that.
00:55If it doesn't work out over the next couple of years, help Jaden Daniels, you know,
00:58acclimate to the offense, familiarity with Kingsbury system, no problem. But the track
01:03record was, I wanted to do something else because this guy always gets hurt. This guy's always
01:07limited, always has something nagging. He's always slowed. And all I did was show up and
01:12be second on the team and receptions targets the whole nine yards. He was available and got better
01:16down the stretch. He was better in the second half of the year than he was in the first in
01:20terms of impact and some things he was doing. You heard it in the, uh, that Atlanta game that
01:23they wanted over time. This right here is where they look for Zach hurts. They look for Zach hurts
01:27game, winning touchdown in traffic, boom, you're going to the post season. So it's closer than I
01:33thought. I think Wagner has more and offers more going forward. And that's kind of my only nod
01:39there, both in leadership and in terms of quarterback and that defense, I think what he
01:43can't do, isn't as big a deal as what arts won't be able to do. If that that's how I'm quantifying.
01:47I actually think that I am leaning toward arts and I'm surprised to the point you made
01:53when we first thought about this, I thought, well, it's obviously Wagner, but my logic that
01:58I've come to is I think that if one of them falls off substantially next year,
02:06I'd rather have paid and kept arts around where I can plug in either Ben Senate or John Bates or
02:14some other speedy weapon type. Like they kept Cole Turner on their practice squad all year.
02:19I don't know if he can block or what he's good at or what he isn't when he's in line,
02:22but whether it's Turner or somebody else, you could stash a guy like that on your practice
02:27squad that could actually make catches and be an athlete and help you a little bit in terms
02:31of weaponry offensively. Whereas I think if it hurts, hits that wall, you just kind of move
02:35them to the side. You've got three other guys in the position that can fill in and you've got
02:39running back and receiver and other ways around. I think that if Bobby Wagner were to run into a
02:44wall next year, it'd be a big problem defensively. So I almost don't want to be left holding the bag
02:49in an age 35 season for that year where the regression happens, because it's not always a
02:55staircase, which you could make the case with both of these guys. We're kind of on the staircase
02:59anyway, but it doesn't always mean, well, they're in a good place now. So two or three years from
03:03now is when they're not going to be able to play. Well, like it could be October and arts could look
03:09nothing like he did this season, right? I mean, it could be November and we're going, that's not
03:13the Bobby Wagner that was on this team, making 132 tackles last year. Now make no mistake about
03:19it. We are choosing one of the two. And so by nature, when you juxtapose these two options,
03:25we're kind of arguing against one. I would bring them both back. The price is same here, by the
03:29way. But I think my answer on arts is I'm a little less worried about him biting me in the butt
03:37than Wagner, because I'm preparing for a fall off from both and that age.
03:41And I could just better prepare for it with a tight end. I don't I don't hate that reasoning.
03:45I mean, to me, I'm going off the fact that I feel like we just got really lucky, whether it's
03:51playing all 17 games. I just I don't see that happening again. And maybe that's not fair. Maybe
03:55he's found something. Maybe he whether it's an offseason or different training regimen or
04:00whatever. But you look at games missed over the last several seasons. Significant. You're talking
04:06about five, six, seven, ten games at one point getting hurt. And now he's about to turn thirty
04:11five. Same with Wagner, by the way. They're the same age. So I don't know. That's my skepticism.
04:16There is if I get what I let's say for the sake of argument said unseen, if I get what I just got,
04:21you can guarantee me that for both guys, what's more valuable? It might be the tight end,
04:25might be the safety blanket. It might be that third and four when when everything's close or
04:29the goal line type stuff. Yeah, that's really, really helpful for a young quarterback that's
04:33going to have bigger challenges even maybe next year in terms of schedule, defenses,
04:38league making adjustments against you, et cetera. But I just don't buy it. And maybe again,
04:42maybe that's not fair. Ertz and Wagner are both leaders of men. They're both also vocal and
04:49outspoken when needed. Supposedly, Wagner is a little more diffident than you'd think. Like he
04:54when he gave that big speech where he stepped up in front of the team and gave the really nice like
05:01let's not let this season go off the rails. Rah, rah speech. He was basically asked to,
05:07in a sense. And it was important and significant because he normally doesn't do it.
05:12If you've seen after the game, you know, a couple of times when he got a game ball
05:16and they toss him the ball and they're all yelling speech, speech, speech. He's like,
05:20oh, you all know me. You know, I already spoke a couple of weeks ago or whatever. Like he does
05:23not want he doesn't want to be this loquacious guy who's out there just screaming all the time.
05:27I think Ertz, well, he's a little more selective. You see him doing a lot of interviews. He's on
05:33way more podcasts. Yeah. Like he's out there a little bit more. This is from earlier today on
05:38the fan. Joel Corey would be Mitch and Finley discussing the possible contracts. He's a
05:42contracts expert for these players. So let's start with what he said about Zach Ertz.
05:48Yeah. Ertz was practically the lowest paid starting tight end on a veteran contract
05:55at three million last year as the base value. If you look at him statistically, he's not going
06:01to get this type of money, but it compares very favorably to that fire move. Statistically,
06:09Hunter Henry, who is an older guy, fire move signed for twelve point one million per year.
06:14But he's just that was an extension of his rookie contract. Hunter Henry's at nine million per year.
06:20I don't think you're going to go there.
06:22That's Joel Corey on Zach Ertz as a potential AAV ultimately said seven, eight million dollars
06:29for a one year deal, which seems rich to me. I mean, he made three and change, I think last year.
06:34So doubling that plus feels like a lot. I do. I know he stayed healthy. Finally,
06:39he put up some decent numbers. So what about Bobby Wagner? I mean,
06:42if Ertz is making seven, eight million, Wagner's probably in line to make more than that coming
06:46off of six. Yeah. Not only do they make six, but he was a Pro Bowl player who was a second team
06:50all pro last year. You had Levante Davis on a one year deal for eight point five million dollars
06:57up to ten million with incentives. You had Mario Davis signed for two years, average eight point
07:05six to five million per year. Almost 14 was fully guaranteed. It's signing on the two years.
07:13Bobby's better than both of those guys. Always ever. Always has been. The cap has gone up 10
07:18percent at a minimum. To me, you would just that deal for cap inflation and go from there.
07:25To me, I think he could ask for more, but to me, that should be the should be his floor.
07:32Ten million bucks, maybe. Yeah. I mean, if I mean, if it's a 10 percent raise over what he
07:37just did or if it's a raise over Levante David or otherwise, it makes sense to me as the cap
07:42has gone up. I mean, again, the track record here is he's missed one game over the last handful of
07:47seasons. One was rest as Seattle had either all been eliminated or clinched a playoff spot
07:51since they've gone to 17 games. He doesn't miss time. He's a tackling machine. He is who he is.
07:55What he doesn't do anymore that well, you're still getting something positive. That makes
08:00sense. Like this would be who knows. Let's say he was in his prime at twenty six years old
08:04with one hundred seventy tackles where he's ranging all over the place, doing everything
08:08under the sun. Swiss Army knife who's just just destroying people that doesn't exist anymore.
08:14What you do have, though, still a very useful player that's dependable.
08:18The variable for me is the availability. Of course, free stuff happens. It's sports,
08:22it's football. It's such a violent thing. But at that spot to be that durable kind of tells
08:26you you got a durable guy. Well, he made more impact plays for Washington this past season
08:32than he did the year before with Seattle when he led the NFL with one hundred and eighty three
08:35tackles. Think about that. He made 50 fewer tackles, 50. That's like four or five games
08:42worth. Yeah. Fewer tackles despite playing in every game, both seasons from two years ago to
08:47last year. But he had more passes, defended, batted balls. He had more forced fumbles.
08:52He had more fumble recoveries. His sack totals were down from three and a half to two. But
08:57otherwise, tackles for loss, quarterback hits like almost every category. The numbers went up
09:03in Washington. Andre and Woodbridge, you're on Grant and Danny. If you can bring back either
09:07Ertz or Wagner, who would you prioritize? This is a very easy question for me. I mean,
09:13who's the future Hall of Famer? Who was the person who led the team or was amongst the team
09:19leader when it comes to tackles? Well, by the way, I think they're both future Hall of Famers,
09:22but I get your point is Wagner is one of the great linebackers who recovered the football
09:28against Tampa Bay, you know, individual championship. But speaking to twenty twenty
09:34five and being thirty five years old, I mean, we're not paying him based on his resume.
09:38There's a lot of questions. Who's the guy who tripped over his defensive lineman when he was
09:41trying to catch Saquon Barkley? I can't unsee that. I got to go with Ertz. There's no way we
09:47could beat Philadelphia again if we have to choose to. There's no way. I mean, the elephant in the
09:52room literally and figuratively is Philly and we can't be Philly as is with Wagner in the middle.
09:58Oh, that was a swerve there. I didn't see that coming. I did not pull the rug from
10:03underneath me. I'm like, yeah, all right. So he's gone. Wagner is like, we can't do Wagner.
10:07How about that? I mean, but he's referencing he mentioned the play where he the first play of the
10:12game against the Eagles. We're going to judge him on one of his worst plays, you know, on unlucky
10:18play at that, by the way, kind of stumbled and fell. And who was it? Who's the D lineman that
10:22fell down that he tripped on? Was that Dante Fowler or Cleland Farrell? I'm trying to remember
10:28the Fowler Fowler. Fowler like fell on the ground. Wagner got scooped up.
10:32Yeah. It was like bowling pins collide. Exactly.
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