00:10I'm Alison LaForge from HousingWire and in this episode of 10 Minute Talks I'm sitting with Brie
00:15Lise. Brie, thank you for joining me for this episode of 10 Minute Talks. Thank you for having
00:20me. I'm excited to be here. I'm excited to have you. I have seen so much come from you on
00:27LinkedIn
00:27and I feel like I have a little bit of FOMO because you've been everywhere and I saw in a
00:33post
00:34that you just had that you mentioned curating rooms and not events. What do you believe
00:42most people get wrong about designing experiences that actually bring people together?
00:50I mean I think listen like everybody has FOMO. It's not just isolated to you but not for me but
00:57in the
00:57industry right like we all want to be together at an event and that's never part of the problem.
01:03I think what people get wrong is that we don't need more reasons to actually attend an event
01:09because that FOMO already exists. What we're tired of is the same speaker lineup and the same conversations
01:14in the same city. Like I don't know if the industry knows but there are other cities and states besides
01:19Texas and Austin but with the table and with myself we've kind of flipped that. So you know for events
01:27broadly for every familiar name that you put on a stage I would say put someone on a name on
01:32the stage
01:33who doesn't have a name yet or nobody knows and make room for somebody that's new. Like nobody gets FOMO
01:39over a panel or missing out at that 3 p.m time slot. They get FOMO and be in a
01:44room where everybody else is.
01:45To that point I feel like you've been pretty outspoken about how safe and sanitized mortgage
01:53marketing really has become. What do you think playing it safe costs marketers?
02:01I think it costs us everything from your sanity to your creativity to eventually your seat at the table.
02:09You know safe marketing really turns a marketing function into a flyer department and it's measured
02:15by output reporting to sales and the first department that's cut when there's budget cuts. And so I think
02:23the irony is that people aren't really cut for saying something brave. It's saying something that's
02:28really safe and sanitized. So you know what it costs is everything.
02:32Something that's absolutely been an interesting thing that you've worked on that has really pushed
02:38that safety has been your work with First Home IQ and the MBA this year where you were part of
02:43an
02:43initiative that brought 50 loan officers face to face with lawmakers in Washington DC. What changed
02:51when you put professionals at the center of that conversation instead of relying on the usual
02:57industry safe sanitized messaging? That's a great question. I'm not going to sit up here and say that
03:05we passed a bill because we suddenly showed up and 50 loan officers were there on Capitol Hill. Policy
03:12moves really slowly but who was in the room changed. Historically who's been in the room is always C-suite
03:19executives or people who are on the front lines changing policy but loan officers are the ones who are
03:25in the seat on a day-to-day basis dealing with policy with their clients and working in and out
03:30of it.
03:31So in April when we brought those 50 LOs into 44 congressional officer or offices 90 percent had
03:39never advocated before. So instead of the you know the staffers hearing affordability they really heard
03:45from the people who are on the front of the line. So that changed the question from should loan officer
03:50be in these conversations to how do we get a hundred more loan officers here to start advocating for the
03:55industry? That is an amazing point because what you've said throughout this conversation so far is
04:04really been heavily emphasized in bringing more people into new spaces to create better conversations.
04:13Literally dragging more chairs into a room or to a table. How do you think the industry can create
04:21events and more space for additional perspectives and why do you prioritize bringing more people
04:29into the room and to the table?
04:32Sure, I'll answer that question and break it down and say that
04:38it's important to me because I was the person without a chair at the table and now that I'm in
04:44the room
04:44I look for who's missing. When I sit down the first thing I ask myself whether I'm looking at a
04:48list of attendees
04:50or for a dinner for the tables like who are we missing? The industry relies way too much on the
04:56same
04:56familiar names because they're easy to book or they draw attention but new voices are where the useful
05:02conversations are. So you know put marketing on a panel put the processor that's not at 4 pm by the
05:08way
05:08um put the processor operations on a panel and have a conversation um give people the mic on the topic
05:15that they actually run not just a generic diversity panel. You know mortgage loves to put women on a panel
05:22which is amazing but we need to be on a panel about marketing not just a women's panel advocating for
05:28women so more perspectives don't necessarily make the table worse by any means they make the table more
05:34useful and that's the first place that we should be starting is how do we get the right person in
05:38this room who doesn't already have a voice who has something to say. Digging in there a little more
05:45this is a pain point that I feel like I see discussed a lot in both networking opportunities and across
05:55social media that there are a lot of familiar panels and predictable talking points and very similar voices
06:03how do you think the industry should rethink its programming not just to give more people voices
06:09but to spark conversations that really challenge the way that professionals think and the problems
06:15that the industry faces? Well you know right now on a panel about marketing is probably five people
06:22sharing opinions nobody's really bringing numbers and the data and that's kind of the whole problem with
06:28my function specifically in one picture you know every um function and mortgage has a standard to argue
06:35from versus marketing has opinion so how should we rethink programming is bring receipts on stage bring
06:43real data real before and afters like and build a session around a real disagreement you know have two
06:49people who'd argue at dinner or at the bar at 11 pm on stage talking about that nobody ever
06:55walked out of a session because you know everyone agreed more like they we need more controversy more
07:03discussions more problem solving in live time and honestly housing wire putting more names we're not
07:09familiar with on stage is a really good start to do that you mentioned earlier how you've thought about
07:17a lot of things such as bringing more people into rooms and putting more chairs at a table because you
07:22were
07:23someone who did not have a chair at a table and i feel like that's a really common feeling i
07:29know i felt
07:30like i had to claw for a seat at the table when people are attending events and they're in that
07:38place how would
07:40you encourage them to make the most out of going to event to take risks speak honestly and move beyond
07:45those common corporate talking points that we see a lot of ask a weird question you know or like i
07:54i'll be honest
07:54and i'll be the first to say i don't love conferences i'd rather be at a dive bar eating chicken
07:58tenders but
07:59what i actually do is i find somebody else who wants to escape you know usually the people who are
08:05worth
08:05talking to are people who are trying to get out of the room first and don't just ask what do
08:10you do you know ask a weird
08:12question my favorite thing to ask is what's the one thing you never say on a panel and then just
08:17shut up
08:18and listen to them talk don't just say um hey i'm brie what do you do you know like skip
08:23a session go sit
08:24in the lobby the best conversations that i've had at any conference is late at night at a dairy queen
08:31at
08:31midnight or on after the conference when we're walking back from dinner and the habit is after every
08:37conversation write down one sentence that someone said that they'd never stay on stage and and use
08:43that for your talking point to build a relationship i would start there you know if you're thinking about
08:49what to do how to speak honestly is like ask the weird question you're afraid to ask and don't be
08:53afraid to be yourself and don't forget like don't be afraid to get chicken tenders you know like it's okay
09:00to to to bond over something that nobody else um has a commonality on i i think that that's great
09:07and it's memorable and it's honest and i feel like that honest experience where you have human moments
09:14where you recognize that people aren't this perfect corporate person or is what makes you have buy-in with
09:22them and it makes them realize that you have something interesting and different and it gives you just an easy
09:27talking point so i i love that advice so as we come up to upcoming industry events like mba annual
09:36what do you what excites you the most about the opportunity to bring more people into new
09:42conversations going back to those chicken tenders you know i want the hotel bar conversation the 11
09:48pm conversation on stage at 10 a.m we all already know what's broken in this industry like that's nothing
09:54new um but that's usually said after dinner when somebody's being really honest and then the next
09:59morning when you walk into a session you hear the really polished version of what they're saying so
10:04my point is is that the truth is already in the building it's already in our own minds it's just
10:08not
10:09on the agenda so new people help change that because they haven't learned all the things that we're
10:15supposed to not say yet and that's exactly why we should keep inviting them and bring the new people in
10:21the room so you know if you see me or yourself at a conference like don't be afraid to come
10:26up and
10:26strike up a conversation because we're all human at the end of the day and we all want connections and
10:31we all want to find someone with the commonality and don't be afraid to say the hard thing like we
10:36don't all have to agree either that's what makes us better in the industry better i love that say the
10:43weird thing ask the questions put yourself in the room brie what fantastic advice heading into what is the
10:51biggest or most busy conference season where people really should be putting themselves out there and
10:56taking risks thank you so much for joining me on 10 minute talks and i can't wait to see you
11:01at mba annual
11:03see you there thanks for having me
