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How do we teach children to understand their emotions before they ever reach a crisis point? Constance Luk from People’s Health & Emotional Wellbeing explores how the words we use, the stories we read and the way we engage with children from a young age can shape how they make sense of emotional wellbeing later in life.
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00:06Hello and welcome to It's About Youth with me, Fei Kuan. What if we could teach children the
00:12tools to better understand their emotions before they ever reach a crisis point? From the words
00:18that we use to the stories that we read, how we engage children from a young age could shape how
00:24they talk about their emotional well-being later on in life and in adulthood. Joining me in the
00:30studio now to discuss this further is Constance Luk. She is the founder of People's Health and
00:35Emotional Well-Being or better known as FU. Constance, thank you for joining me today.
00:40Thank you so much, Fei, for having me. It's a pleasure to have you on the show, especially
00:44with you traveling all the way down from Penang. We appreciate having you here today. Now, firstly,
00:49just to kick off the discussion, we often emphasize teaching children skills such as reading, writing
00:57and counting from an early age. But from your observations, how much are we teaching them to
01:02understand what they feel? Why should emotional well-being be taught from much earlier in childhood?
01:08Thank you so much for our question. So when we talk about mental health, we often talk about it too
01:14late later in life. And it's often way before we are able to teach our children more about their emotions
01:20and, you know, mentioning that their feelings are valid. So according to our National Health and
01:25Mobility Survey, one in six children actually suffers from mental health challenges. And the numbers is
01:31very worrying because it has doubled since 2019. So what if I told you we can teach our children things
01:37like, it's okay to not be okay, it's okay to be scared, it's okay to ask for help. In turn,
01:43we're
01:43actually giving them a language where they can carry on throughout their lives. And, you know, emotional
01:48well-being is kind of like learning a new language, isn't it? The earlier you learn, the more naturally
01:53you're able to use it. And it actually can help to set a foundation for them, introducing all these
01:58conversations in childhood, because we shouldn't wait until our children struggle before we talk about
02:04mental health. Definitely not waiting for them to reach the crisis point, teaching them the skills
02:09to be able to recognize their feelings, to process their emotions, and rather just also to understand
02:16that if it's on the other end of it, right, not just positive emotions, it's okay to not be okay,
02:22as you've mentioned. So to be able to sit with anger, with sadness, with grief, and to be comfortable
02:28with that. But I wonder then, what does it really mean for a child to have the skill of emotional
02:35literacy? And what are we hoping that children will be able to recognize or express with something
02:42that they might struggle to put into words? That's a very important question, especially when our
02:46emotions are so complex, right? So I guess emotional literacy, to me, for children, it means the ability
02:52to recognize those feelings, feel what you feel, and having the ability to also communicate it.
02:58So let's just imagine like a group of children, they wouldn't necessarily understood how to use the
03:03word, you know, I'm overwhelmed, or I'm feeling anxious, but we could see them perhaps feeling a bit
03:09quiet, becoming distanced, withdrawn, or even sometimes acting out or getting angry. But it doesn't mean
03:16that they are wrong, it means that they needed extra support. So let's talk about another hand.
03:21What about for adults? Emotional literacy for adults, it means learning those kind of behaviours
03:28can be part of communications. So how do we enforce those communications and actually dive in deeper?
03:34Is we can use art therapy, music, or even, you know, just reading through a storybook showing different
03:39kind of emotions. So let's just imagine a child, they do not know the word anxious, but they could see
03:46the character on the storybook feeling a bit frightened or even unsure, then they start talking about
03:51that character. So their behaviour in turn becomes a language that we can use to dive in further for
03:56mental health. And that's really why when we at least went from when you were talking, the first
04:00thing that came into my head was Disney's Pixar Inside Out. That movie is something that's really why
04:06that movie is so popular among both children and parents, right? And it opened up a lot of discussions
04:11revolving mental health and how to recognise these different emotions. You also talked about music and art
04:18therapy and also storybooks when it came to helping children recognise their feelings. I wonder then,
04:24what do you think personally is currently missing from the Malaysian children literature landscape,
04:30especially when it comes to stories that truly reflect our children's lives and experiences?
04:35So I do think Malaysia has a wonderful range of children's books, but we can always have more
04:40stories whereby the children will, you know, they will pick up a book where they see different elements of it
04:45and they feel it resonates with it, right? And they immediately become, you know, that's me,
04:49that's what I experienced going to Kelantan, even Trungganu or even Penang. So, you know, in terms of
04:57emotional literacy or even emotional wellbeing being showcased on children's books,
05:00I think one thing that we should actually showcase is the diversity of Malaysia's culture,
05:06because Malaysia is so beautifully diverse. There are states by the sea, by the mountains, rivers,
05:11even through the Borneo side. So different communities have different traditions, have
05:16different landscape, ultimately very different stories. So for a child, they may not really
05:22understand mental health terms, because I realised is that when we adults talk about mental health,
05:28we often become a bit clinical. We talk about diagnosis, we talk about symptoms, we talk about
05:33statistics. A six-year-old wouldn't understand those things. They understand stories, they understand
05:39characters, they understand the feeling of having a friend, you know, wanting to belong, feeling lonely.
05:44So that's why we are actually also releasing a children's book mental health series. It's going to
05:50be released starting this year, every single year, every single World Mental Health Day continuously.
05:55And one of the books, the first title is actually called Cocoa the Floating Coconut. And the sound is
06:00the coconut and the story comes from Penang. Because I'm from Penang, I want to pay homage to it.
06:05Yeah. Well, that's a very interesting story. And earlier, we were talking a little bit more about
06:10that project as well, because this is a 16-year project that you are going to embark on, creating
06:16a book based on every state in Malaysia to really reflect our country's diversity and to touch on every
06:22children in different states. I wonder if you could just elaborate a little bit more about that,
06:27because of how important and how large scale and long term this project is. Why would you say it's
06:33important for us to tell stories through local places, local communities, rather than creating
06:39a story for Malaysian children that's one and whole? Thank you so much for your question. So
06:44the reason why we wanted to create 16 stories is because we have 13 Malaysian states as well as
06:50three federal territories. So our series is called Little Malaysia Big Hearts. And the first title,
06:56as I say, is Cocoa the Floating Coconut. It's a story from Penang. And all these things,
07:00the book became a reality thanks to the support of YB Daniel Guay, which is our Penang Exco for Youth
07:05Sports and Health, as well as YB Serena Abdul Rashid, our MP for Buket Bandera. So when we talk about
07:12long term vision, why we wanted to have 16 books for like 16 years in total is because we see
07:19difference
07:19in every single state. The difference are unique. You know, like I say, different states, different
07:25communities, things like that. So it's not, I wouldn't say it's a good idea to create one generic story
07:31when it comes to talking about our children, our childhood, right? Because imagine a child growing
07:38up in Penang versus a child growing up in Starawa. They have different experience. They see different
07:42animals by themselves. Like, for example, in Starawa, there's hornbills, there's orangutan. And in Penang,
07:48there are otters, there are jellyfish, and there are white-bellied eagles. So it's not really fair
07:54for them. And we also want to tell the whole Malaysia is that no state or child should ever
08:00feel like their story is not important enough to be told. So we do want eventually, after 16 years,
08:06we finish the whole series. And we want every single child, when they open the book, they feel
08:10resonate with the story. And with story, it comes with lessons. And we hope those lessons can be carried
08:15throughout our whole life. It's genuinely very inspiring. I hope you know that, you know, what
08:21you're doing is really great work. And it is no easy feat to commit to 16 years. It's a long
08:28road ahead.
08:29And you've already been working on the first book that I believe will be launched in October,
08:34ahead of World Mental Health Day this year. What I'm curious to know, if you'd be comfortable to share,
08:40what have been some of the biggest challenges so far embarking on this project? And what have they
08:45taught you about sustaining youth-led advocacy when you're in?
08:49That is one of the biggest questions, isn't it? I guess one of the biggest challenges that we
08:55foresee is also, you know, eventually you realise having a good idea is not enough. Of course,
09:00funding is always an issue when it comes to sustaining a youth-led initiative. For example,
09:04this book is through different kinds of funding as well. And funding is not easy to take.
09:09Another thing is that, I think I'll just give this as a majority answer, is finding a way into people's
09:15hearts is very difficult. Because in the past, we did different kinds of avenues. We did random
09:20street interviews to engage with the public to understand what's their perception about mental
09:24health, which is great. We did online blogs, podcasts, as well as different kinds of awareness
09:29campaigns. While all those things were amazing, and we never regret doing those things, but we realised that,
09:36you know, people may hear your message, but they don't necessarily feel connected to it.
09:41So in 2023, we combined art storytelling and mural together. We created Penang's first art mural on
09:49mental health awareness. And it's all thanks to, we launched it together with Penang Chief Minister
09:54Chao Kwang Yu, YB Serena Abdul Rashid, which is our MP of Bukit Bandera, YB Joshua Wu,
10:01which is our arduin for Puratikus, as well as the former WTU Chief of Mission of US Embassy KL,
10:07Mr. Manu Bala. So what we did was, we painted 90% of it. And the mural looks like, there's
10:14a butterfly
10:14in the middle, saying it's okay to not be okay. And it's set between two trees. One tree is a
10:20willow
10:21tree. It symbolises strength, as well as resilience. While another tree is being left bare. The reason why
10:26we left it bare is because we wanted the public to come participate in it. So how they do it
10:31is,
10:31they came and they put their handprints on the mural. So even now, today is 2026 already, right?
10:38Three years since, when you walk past the mural, you could still see handprints on the mural.
10:42You could still see that southern hamstrings are big and small. And I come to realise that, you know,
10:47people, they remember experience, they remember things that make them feel something.
10:51Yeah. So when we talk about Coco, the floating coconut in the book, I ask myself, you know,
10:56instead of asking myself, how do I talk to people about mental health? I think the better question
11:01is, how do I make people feel these conversations belong to them? So this is a children's book, right?
11:08Our children wouldn't necessarily remember statistics, but they remember sitting next to a parent,
11:14sitting next to a teacher. And perhaps even after reading the book, they will say something like,
11:18I feel like Coco sometimes. So that's how we engage with the children. And hopefully we can
11:23go towards a future where mental health is an easier topic to talk about.
11:28I would love to get a little bit more into resonating and connecting with your audience.
11:33But first, let's head for a quick break. Stay with us. Don't go anywhere.
11:51Welcome back to It's About Youth, where today we are talking about how stories are connecting to
11:56children's emotional wellbeing. Now, earlier, Constance, we spoke a little bit about the
12:01importance of resonating and connecting with your audience and the efforts that you've done,
12:06including murals. And now you're embarking on this storybook project. In an era where children are
12:12growing up surrounded by digital content, what do you think physical books and art provide that online
12:19videos cannot? So I think, you know, digital content is very rare, right? Nowadays, we have electric cars
12:26where we can watch TV in it, watch the shows, listen to Baby Shark, there's VR, there's AI,
12:32there's no escaping it. So it's definitely a generation whereby our children has to adapt to
12:37those kinds of elements in it. But there is still something very special, holding a physical book.
12:43It creates a shared moment. So imagine yourself as a parent, or even a teacher, having your child
12:49sitting next to you, reading, flipping through the pages of Coco the Floating Coconut. And you may ask
12:54questions like, what do you think Coco is feeling? What kind of emotion Coco is showing here?
12:59And your child may say things like, Coco is sad. So that kind of creates a shared moment whereby
13:08it's more than reading just a story, right? It is having a conversation much deeper than you could
13:14possibly imagine. I think when it comes to talking about mental health, it's a bit difficult for most
13:21parents to start a conversation saying like, let's talk about mental health. But it's easier if you say
13:26things like, why do you think Coco is sad? And that's how you engage with your children. And perhaps
13:31even without realizing it, you would start talking about mental health.
13:35Mm-hmm. And I mean, there's these prompts that you have included in your books. But earlier,
13:41we also discussed about how you're going to include coloring activities, you're going to include stickers,
13:45even local mental health resources in all of your books for every state. Why is it important to make
13:51this a book that children can interact with rather than something that they can just read?
13:55Thank you for your question. So I think ultimately, we do not want our books to become just like any
14:00other books on the shelf. We do want students or even children or even teachers to participate in it.
14:06So we are including affirmation stickers, coloring pages, you know, guidance or questions whereby the
14:13parents can ask questions page by page to their kids and even local mental health resources.
14:18So when we talk about creating a mental health children's book, we want to connect our people
14:24to any resources available within proximity. So for example, this book, we are featuring Befriendless
14:30Penang Talian 15555, which is from our KKM, Body Bear Child Line, as well as an amazing article coming
14:38from UNICEF Malaysia. So when we talk about affirmation stickers, you can place stickers anywhere,
14:45right? You can place it behind your phone, iPad or even Tumblr. And it's set as a gender reminder
14:51for yourself that, you know, your feelings are valid. Coloring pages, on the other hand, creates
14:55opportunity for children to express themselves even without having the words for it. So suddenly,
15:02the whole book becomes more than a story. It becomes something that the children can actually use
15:06to feel, explore and talk about mental health.
15:10And when we are talking about exploring about mental health, I think adults really have a role
15:18to play in it as well, right? Because they are the ones facilitating these stories, encouraging these
15:24children to read and interact with these books. How do we continue to create spaces where children can
15:30genuinely and openly, safely talk about the things that they've read, for them to ask difficult questions
15:36and to also connect these stories to their own emotions and their own experiences?
15:40Thank you so much. So this is one of the most important questions that we even asked of
15:45when it comes to visualising the whole series. So we do want this book series to be part of something
15:53much bigger. We are also bringing in storytelling sessions to every single nursery, primary school, orphanage
16:00and refugee centres. And potentially, we may bring it during our hospital visits as well with the
16:05relevant authorities. Because we really, like I say, I do not want this book to be just like any other
16:11books on the
16:12show. We want to help the children, right? So with every storytelling session, we are actually presenting
16:17one copy of the book to the school so that the conversation doesn't end when we leave. The children can
16:23go back to the library, pick up the floating coconut again, read it with their friends, teachers or even
16:28bring it back home to the parents. Because it's also a way for us to connect with all the children
16:33from different communities, because no child should ever be left behind. Yeah. And on that sense then,
16:39you know, because it's great to have these books in different contexts, right? Not just at home, also
16:46in the library and in schools. How do you think we can also begin to equip adults
16:52to listen to these children? Yeah, I think adults or even parents, teachers should try to learn to
17:01listen first before immediately trying to fix things. So imagine a child coming to you saying,
17:06you know, mommy, I'm scared. The first reaction we would usually say is do not be scared. But instead,
17:12maybe let's try a different way saying, you know, come here, tell me more. Tell me why you're scared.
17:17That's how you engage with the children and creating a safer environment for them to understand that,
17:22you know, you're not being judged, you're not being dismissed, your films are valid. I think
17:26also what we're trying to showcase to the parents is that you do not need to be mental health
17:32professionals. What you need to do is to learn to listen, learn to notice behaviour changes, and also
17:39perhaps connect your child to additional support if there's such a need. Yeah, and safe spaces,
17:47perhaps in a way, should not just be like any other special or specific room,
17:54it could be by the dining table, by at the library, or even my personal favourite, 10 to 20 minutes
18:01before bedtime as a storytelling, bedtime story session where you can talk to your kids more.
18:06So it creates a safe environment for them. Because I think in summary, home isn't where the child
18:12lives, it's where they feel seen, they feel heard, they feel safe enough to be themselves.
18:18So it's really, it really just goes to say that it doesn't need to take a lot of effort to
18:24even
18:25begin these conversations and to engage with your child. It doesn't take a lot of effort for you to create
18:30a so-called safe space. And it can be facilitated in whatever environment, whatever condition,
18:37it's really up to the parent to be able to create that for their child. We're almost out of time.
18:44But
18:44before we wrap up, though, I am curious to ask, as the founder of HUH, which is a youth-focused
18:50mental
18:50health and emotional wellbeing advocacy initiative in Malaysia, what do you think young people bring
18:56specifically to mental health advocacy? I think young people bring lived experience,
19:01they bring creativity and the courage to question things as well as listen to their peers or even
19:07elderly. So when I thought of creating initiative, I asked myself, you know, can I actually bring art,
19:14use art to create a mental health awareness programme? Can I create something that can engage the
19:20children with to talk more about mental health? So that led me to Koko. And it was also because I
19:25live in
19:25Penang, I go to the beach sometimes, I see, always see there's a floating coconut. And when you look at
19:30a floating coconut, it kind of reminds me of myself or perhaps yourself as well. Because you know, in life,
19:35we have ups and downs. But one thing that stays constant with us all is the strength to never let
19:41ourselves sink. So can we actually use mental health to, you know, change or perhaps can we use art or
19:49even
19:49storytelling to change mental health as a difficult topic or a conversation into something less
19:54frightening? So that led me to the creation of Koko, the floating coconut. And so I think young
19:59people bring that kind of mindset because we do want to change things. And ultimately, we still
20:04need to work alongside with the government, the policy makers, the community, because we want to
20:10show each other that we do care. And that's how advocacy becomes human. So yeah, I really hope we can
20:16be more acceptable when it talks about when we talk about mental health, you know, hopefully with this book
20:22series to be launched on the 3rd of October, it led us towards a future where we have each other,
20:29our future is bright, and it's something worth living for. And that's exactly what you are doing.
20:35And hopefully many other youths watching today will be inspired to do the same as well, or at least to
20:41be a little bit more open to have these conversations. And of course, to start reading
20:45Koko, the floating coconut. Thank you so much. Thank you so much, Constance, for sharing your insights and
20:50being here with us today. This has been It's About Youth with me, Fei Kuan. Thank you for watching,
20:56and we'll see you next time.