- 12 hours ago
Celtics Insider John Karalis joins the show to discuss the Brad Stevens and Bill Chisholm press conference and what the Jaylen Brown trade means the upcoming season and beyond.
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00:00The absolute best question that was asked during the entire thing is from our next guest.
00:05We just played that clip right there where Brad Stevens was saying,
00:07well, we want to make this trade because we can't have 70% of all of our cap space tied
00:13up within two players.
00:14And then to that, our friend John Corrales asked this.
00:18I know there are salary matching rules, but you talk about how you can't have 70% of the salary
00:23cap tied up into these two players.
00:26Still do.
00:26You still do.
00:27That's right.
00:28So good follow up.
00:30What's next after this?
00:32I think the biggest thing is that it's the, again, it's that plus the picks, plus the optionality moving forward.
00:39Paul's contract is shorter.
00:41You know, he'll have his choice with his player option.
00:44There's that word optionality again.
00:46They could not resist throwing that word from finance classes in there.
00:50But joining us right now is our friend John Corrales from SI.com, Sports Illustrated, the Locked On podcast.
00:59John, look at you shaking the tree, getting in the face of the man and questioning authority.
01:05Well done.
01:08I mean, it's kind of what my job is, right?
01:10So, but yeah, I mean, he said something that was, you know, I think he was trying to, like, sneak
01:16a fastball by us.
01:17And I'm sure a lot of us had that same thought.
01:20I just happen to have a microphone in my hand.
01:22But I think what he's getting at is it's not just the 70% in two players.
01:30It's the 70% in those two players, Jason and Jalen.
01:35And I think the other thing he's talking about is potentially flipping Paul George.
01:42And yes, got the picks.
01:43And the picks are either picks that they're going to make or picks that they're going to flip.
01:47Well, that's interesting.
01:48So do you believe that they are going to flip Paul George anytime soon?
01:54Or do you think that that is something that they're imagining possibly doing after the season's done?
01:59My feeling is that Paul George picking up his player option next summer gives the Celtics $57 million in an
02:11expiring contract
02:12that they can then use to shop around to a team that is in an unfortunate situation of something not
02:21working.
02:21The CBA has strangled another team at the top, but they have to trade one of their stars.
02:28And I think the Celtics will use Paul George matching salary and then maybe these draft picks in combination with
02:37some others.
02:38And maybe that's where if they need to get the sweetener of Hugo Gonzalez, we'll see what kind of year
02:44Hugo has this year
02:46and how that kind of what the appetite is after this season.
02:49But that would be where the younger players, the picks, and that matching salary go out.
02:57Okay, so John, just the basics.
03:01After that press conference, and now that you've had time to think about it, what did you make of all
03:06of that?
03:08So I think, I feel like the CBA, I hate framing everything with the CBA,
03:15but I really think this is at the heart of everything.
03:19We have a couple of forces at play here.
03:22I think the league was expecting the salary cap to go up by 10% a year every year for
03:31like five, six years.
03:32I think the Celtics thought they would have more space, that the combined Jalen and Jason salaries
03:39wouldn't combine for 70% of the cap.
03:42It would be in the high 50s or maybe 60.
03:46Brad talked about it.
03:47He said, if these guys counted for 25% of the cap apiece, we'd be having a different conversation.
03:53And I think because the TV money, specifically the regional sports network, is dying,
03:59because of that, the money's not coming into the league the way they thought it would exactly.
04:04And now Jalen and Jason take up a huge, huge portion of the cap.
04:09Now what that does is, Jalen, he did come off a great year.
04:14He was a second-team All-NBA guy, sixth in MVP voting.
04:18All that was legitimate.
04:19But Jason's back.
04:22You've got Mitchell Robinson.
04:23You've got internal improvement from a bunch of these young guys.
04:27Hopefully Derek White bounces back.
04:29You need him to get the usage so he can bounce back.
04:33I think what the Celtics saw was, Jalen, for all of the shots that he was going to need
04:41and all of the money that he's making, the value has tipped out of Boston's favor.
04:47And so they had to find a way to reset the roster, whether this year or next,
04:53and either get a better player in for that money or find a secondary guy who makes less than that
05:01and break what was Jalen Brown up into two or three guys.
05:06That word usage, John, is very interesting.
05:09Do you think that is a sign?
05:11And did it trigger in the postseason in that series, late in the series,
05:16there was some reporting that they felt, for lack of a better term,
05:19J.B. went rogue and kind of regressed.
05:21Did the usage get out of control and did that rub, do you think,
05:24Tatum and the organization the wrong way, especially in the playoffs?
05:28I don't think Tatum is involved, to be honest with you.
05:31I don't think Tatum said anything.
05:33He has – I'll just leave it at that.
05:36I don't think Tatum was involved.
05:38I do think we all saw a tiny bit of regression.
05:43The forced shots, the turnovers, the trying to do too much by himself,
05:48that's been the knock on Jalen and Jason, by the way.
05:52Jason can fall into that trap too.
05:54But I'm not surprised that when push came to shove that some of the bad habits emerged.
06:02And I like Jalen Brown.
06:06I think he's an excellent basketball player.
06:08But the warts are obvious.
06:12And I think if he were making $40 million a year and the Celtics had more room to operate around
06:21that,
06:21it'd be different.
06:22And unfortunately, again, the collective bargaining agreement is so restrictive,
06:29so punitive, that you have to get these big salaries right.
06:34And when I say right, I mean, you do not have the wiggle room that you had in years past.
06:41So I think there is just – you've got to get it so right that if something falls out of
06:47latch,
06:48like with Jalen, that teams feel like they can't do an extra year or two,
06:55you have to get out ahead of it now.
06:57You'd rather do something too soon rather than too late.
07:02Because when it's too late, no one wants to take this.
07:07And the difference between getting stuck now and stuck in the past is stuck in the past,
07:13you, like, attach a pick or two and you, like, get out of that trouble.
07:16Now, no one wants that kind of money and you end up having to blow the whole thing up.
07:23I think what Brad is trying to do is keep things going and stay into some level of contention
07:29rather than risk having to blow it up now.
07:33John, I remember during the Giannis sweepstakes with the Celtics and the Heat,
07:37you were pretty adamant that this is unlike Brad Stevens and unlike the Celtics
07:42to be putting all their business out on front street like that.
07:44And as that sort of moved over from, all right, well, now you missed out on Giannis,
07:48what to do next, you heard tons of different rumors about all sorts of different kinds of trades.
07:53Do you feel differently about Brad Stevens and the way the Celtics sort of apparatus now operates
07:59when it comes to sharing information and letting stuff out?
08:03You know, look, Brad was pretty adamant that it didn't come from him last night.
08:11And I think some of that applies.
08:16I do think that there is some level of strategic leaking from all people, all sides.
08:23So if you're trying to make a deal, there has to be some signaling through the media,
08:29whether you're refuting something or something.
08:32So I don't buy that Brad is completely blameless here.
08:39But I will say that I think the landscape has made it so everybody has to operate a little bit
08:47differently now.
08:48And with the CBA being what it is, that the old rules don't apply.
08:55And I just don't think that we on the outside have been able to wrap our heads around it properly.
09:04This is not like the NFL or Major League Baseball.
09:09It's just, it's so different, so complicated, and so much more important that we have to, like, really,
09:20I hate doing this because it's so nerdy, but we have to be more in tune to it
09:25so we can understand that some of these deals, they don't make sense in a basketball like a pure.
09:30Paul George for Jalen Brown does not get the Celtics any closer to a championship this year.
09:37But there is a world where Paul George for Jalen Brown doing it now puts the Celtics on a trajectory
09:43to stay in contention longer versus having to blow it up sooner.
09:50And the reasons why are math and stupid legal stuff, and it's annoying,
09:56but that's just the truth of the matter now, and people have to operate differently.
09:59John Corrales, I am very disappointed in you, as you are the only basketball writer
10:05who has not yet written an article about how Peyton Pritchard is the next Jalen Brunson.
10:10Yeah, what the hell?
10:11I don't know.
10:13I don't know how much of a, you apparently are a rebel in the writing world.
10:18Why have you not written that article yet?
10:20Because it seems that everyone thinks that this is the year that he ascends to a level of Jalen Brunson.
10:25Well, because Peyton is a great, but I love Peyton Pritchard.
10:31I think he's great.
10:33I don't, I think, I think we've gotten to maximum Peyton Pritchard.
10:37I think this past season is maximum Peyton Pritchard.
10:40Like, I don't see, I don't see massive improvements from him.
10:44And also, this is not a situation like Jalen Brunson, where he's like the number one guy
10:49and he's going to get a ton of usage.
10:51I think Derek White is a much more important element to all of this, and that'll probably
10:56be one of the next things that I write.
10:58Derek White bounce back season.
11:01And on top of that, I think internal improvement from Baylor Shireman and Ugo Gonzalez.
11:06Like, Ugo is a guy that I, I mean, I'm also very high on.
11:09But I think if those two guys can improve and Derek White can bounce back, you have the
11:16potential for like, oh, wow, this is actually a pretty good season.
11:19But I am factoring into that Peyton Pritchard doing exactly what he did last year.
11:23I don't think Peyton's going to be a 25-point-per-game guy.
11:26I just, because he also has spent a lot of time on the court on his own.
11:30We see some of the deficiencies in the playoffs.
11:34I love Peyton, but I think, I don't want to say his feeling, because there's stuff that
11:40he can do better, but last year was such a great season from Peyton that improvements
11:45at this point, it's like he's already driving 80 miles an hour.
11:50You want to say, okay, maybe he can get to 85 or 90.
11:53That's not going to get you where you're going any faster.
11:55I think that Peyton's great, and this is what we're going to get.
11:59And I'm not going to put that kind of thing on him, because Jalen Brunson is just a different
12:05player.
12:06Real quick, John, are there more cuts to come?
12:08Like, do they still have to get under the repeater tax or something like that to truly
12:12slingshot next year?
12:14Well, I will say that Paul George rejected his trade kicker, which saved the Celtics about
12:21$3.5 million, which basically saved Jordan Walsh's job, I think, because now the only thing
12:27they need to do to stay under the tax is cut Delano Banton.
12:31They do that, they'll stay under the tax.
12:34But I don't think they're going to use that traded player exception.
12:37I think this team is basically set for the summer, and then we'll see in season if another
12:46team does something that piques Brad's interest.
12:49But all they're going to do is cut Delano Banton, who's on a non-guaranteed deal, and they'll
12:54be under the tax, so they'll be fine.
12:56Well, John Corrales, all I can say is it was nice knowing you at those press conferences
13:00because you're never going to be asked back, though.
13:05I'm too big, I'm too big.
13:07I'm here to force my way through, man.
13:09You pushed Shaughnessy right out of the way and said, I'm going to be the one who asked
13:13the good question.
13:14All right, John, great stuff, man.
13:15That was an excellent question, and good stuff, as always.
13:19You can read John Corrales over there at SI.com, also the Locked On podcast.
13:24John, thanks for coming on, man.
13:25We really appreciate it.
13:27Thanks, guys.
13:28Thanks, guys.
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