- 4 months ago
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00:00You know, last time we brought on a distinguished guest from Sirius NBA Radio, it got hot and heavy.
00:09I got into it.
00:11Can I be honest?
00:12We're going to do it again.
00:13You needed to read the room better.
00:15That was ridiculous.
00:16That was ridiculous.
00:18My bosses over at 8 loved it, but that was ridiculous.
00:22They thought the video was amazing, and I'm like, we're not putting that video on.
00:25No.
00:25Why not?
00:26Because it's acidine.
00:28It was ridiculous.
00:30Bring him on.
00:30We got a little combative.
00:31Bring Justin on.
00:32Fine.
00:33I'm going to do what Ken...
00:33Make sure you mention his YouTube video.
00:35I'm going to do what Ken always tells me to do as Justin Termini joins us on the Weishart
00:39Right.
00:40We make it right.
00:41Call Kyle Wright Hotline.
00:42I'm going to improve my bedside manner, Kenny.
00:45And I'm going to welcome in the guest, Justin Termini.
00:48Don't be a jerk to people.
00:48Give us your time.
00:49I'm very pleased to have such a great guest on with us right now.
00:52How are you, Justin?
00:53I'm doing well.
00:54And, yeah, that was a really one-sided argument.
00:57Geltseiler owns you there.
00:58So most of you treat me with more respect than you treated Geltseiler, who, to me, I would
01:04have hung up on you and stayed hung up on you.
01:06I think he did hang up, but we welcome him back.
01:09No, he didn't.
01:09He wasn't going to give you the satisfaction.
01:10That's why I loved about it.
01:11He stood in there, and he should have hung up on you.
01:14And he stood in there, and he argued with you.
01:16And I got very uncomfortable as time went on.
01:21Anything else there, Tone?
01:23I'm excited to have a normal discussion with our guest right now.
01:26Well, it sounds like we're not going to have a normal discussion, so I guess I will ask
01:29him the first question now as we conduct this interview.
01:32Hello, Justin.
01:33Ken Carman here, 92.3 The Fan.
01:35Are we going to be able to bring LeBron James back home?
01:39Well, it seems like LeBron's trying to negotiate maybe a raise here from the Lakers to get
01:45as most money as possible or go to Golden State.
01:48I don't really understand the Golden State thing.
01:50I don't know if you guys do.
01:51Like, you're a Cavalier, right?
01:53His biggest rival during the heart of his career with the team he's most associated with
01:57is supposed to be Golden State.
01:59It's supposed to be Steph Curry.
02:00And you're telling me that he's going to spend the last year of his career teamed up
02:04with him in a city that probably disdains him more than any other city outside of maybe
02:10Boston.
02:11Why would you conclude your career in Golden State?
02:14Again, I don't understand that one, but he's done stuff in the past I don't understand.
02:18I don't think he's going to end his career in Cleveland.
02:21I think he wants to live in L.A., you know, and that's where he's been the last several
02:25years, even though I would recommend he goes to Cleveland because I think it's the one
02:29city that he's probably loved without qualification.
02:32Why is it, Justin, that it seems like with a month left to go in the regular season or
02:39whatever, you know, there was optimism about the Cavs roster, and then they get to the NBA
02:48Eastern Conference Finals, and now everybody's like, well, why would LeBron want to go there?
02:53Why would Giannis want to go there and sign an extension?
02:56Why would Kawhi want to go there?
02:58Like, how did the Cavs, by virtue of getting further and become one of the final four teams
03:05playing basketball, turn out to be some huge joke to people?
03:08Yeah, I mean, I don't understand.
03:10I can't speak of that because that's not how I view it.
03:13I mean, the way they went out was pathetic.
03:16They are still leaps and bounds away from, I think, winning an NBA championship.
03:21They're not the Knicks.
03:22They're not the Thunder.
03:23They're not the San Antonio Spurs, but they're also not a team that, like, lost in the first
03:29round.
03:30They're not the Philadelphia 76ers where it's hopeless.
03:33They have a lot better shot of what, like, if LeBron were to put himself on the Cavaliers
03:37or put himself on the Heat or put himself on the Warriors, I would say his best chance
03:42of winning would be with Cleveland.
03:44He'd have a better chance of winning in Cleveland with their current supporting cast than he would
03:49if he went to this version of the Golden State Warriors, if he went to even this version of
03:53the Miami Heat, who I think, despite Giannis, are very thin and would not be as good if
03:59he just inserted them into the Cavaliers lineup.
04:02So I can't personally speak to that because I don't agree with it.
04:06Justin Termini joining us on the show.
04:08Yeah, it's weird.
04:10I think he knows that we love him so much, and that's probably why he's not going to come
04:13back because he knows that probably he's going to be loved no matter what.
04:16But so he doesn't feel a pressure to come back here.
04:20LeBron James does there, Justin?
04:22But he wants to go to Golden State.
04:24Like, wouldn't that alienate him at all to that fan base?
04:26It's like the city that you compete in.
04:28Like, I'm not saying it's as great as, like, the Magic Johnson-Larry Bird rival, but, you
04:33know, they went up against each other, what, four times in the NBA Finals, and then you're
04:36telling me that, like, Magic Johnson's going to say, you know what, I'm going to play the
04:40last year of my career in Boston, and that would fly with the L.A. fan?
04:44Like, so would it fly in Cleveland that LeBron finished his career in Golden State, or they
04:50just understand that he's basically a mercenary?
04:53Like, is that just how they view him?
04:55I mean, how would that go over in Cleveland?
04:57I think that's a very emotional conversation that I think I'd like to ask people after we
05:00get off the phone with you.
05:01I think, you know, it's a great question, Justin, because it will be like every LeBron
05:05discussion.
05:05It will totally be dependent on how grateful you are that he won the championship for us,
05:11because there are some people, at times, I've got to say, that don't sound all that
05:14grateful, that they wish it would have been the baseball team or the football team and
05:19not the basketball team.
05:20And to those people, LeBron can do no right.
05:22To normal people and normal Cleveland fans, I think at this stage, it's just so late in
05:28his career.
05:29I just don't think you can be that mad.
05:33Yeah, I mean, it's just like you'd like some idea that there's a connection or that they
05:38care.
05:38I mean, like, look at Steph.
05:40Steph's willing to, I guess, not win the rest of his career in order to have that connection
05:44with the fan base forever.
05:46That's something that, you know, LeBron will just never be able to have.
05:49I would assume, again, I can't speak for the Cleveland fan, but a guy that's like bouncing
05:53around and doesn't show any reciprocal, like, hey, I love you guys, too, you know, seems
05:59like it'd be a little weird.
06:00And that's something that Steph has by remaining in Golden State.
06:03It's like, we're talking about LeBron going to join him.
06:05We're not talking about Steph joining LeBron or Steph going to other, some other city
06:10that just doesn't care about him.
06:12Justin Termini joining us right now on the hotline.
06:15So you're noticing teams are trying to do everything they can because of the aprons to
06:20improve their team on the margins.
06:22So when that happens, it seems like every move gets ripped, whether it's LaMelo Ball,
06:29that trade.
06:30I mean, anything you've seen so far in the offseason, is there anybody that's really
06:35changing their strata?
06:37Like, do you feel like the Heat are now fighting for Eastern Conference supremacy with their
06:43move?
06:44No, I feel like they're fighting to be a top six seed.
06:47I mean, I don't think that Miami is better than New York.
06:50I don't think Miami is better than Boston.
06:53I don't think Miami is better than Indiana coming back healthy.
06:56I'm not sure they're better than the Pistons, who were the number one seed last year.
07:00I don't think they're better than Cleveland.
07:02If Cleveland, like, comes back and is motivated and doesn't kind of just, you know, I guess fall
07:08prey to the continuity.
07:09And we've been going at it so long, maybe we're bored by the regular season.
07:14Heck, I don't know if they're better than Toronto, who really played you guys tough in
07:18the first round there.
07:20And, you know, defensively is as good as it gets, because Giannis is going to need to
07:25load manage throughout much of the season.
07:27They don't have any shooting whatsoever.
07:29Their offense is going to be horrific.
07:31Their defense will be great.
07:32They have a really good head coach down there.
07:34But I think that they're a team that's basically fighting for the play-in.
07:38So, I'm not sure they're much different than the last couple of years down in Miami.
07:44Tone, hold on here.
07:45Hold on here for just a second here.
07:48They're not better.
07:49So, why are we so critical of the Cavs and needing to make a move?
07:53Because I've heard some wild stuff here over the last week.
07:57I mean, I've heard some people kind of turn on Donovan Mitchell because of their willingness
08:02to want to trade Donovan Mitchell for Jalen Brown, but not want to trade Evan Mobley,
08:06which I don't understand why the Celtics would like that.
08:08You know, there's big conversations about Evan Mobley's future and whether or not he's
08:13ever going to reach this level that I think that I have probably falsely brought up for
08:17a lot of fans.
08:18Like, there is a lot of consternation in this fan base here, Justin.
08:21You're kind of making it sound like, hey, maybe running it back isn't such a bad thing
08:24after all.
08:25Well, no.
08:26Well, I disagree with that, too, because if your goal is to win the championship, this
08:29team's not capable of winning the championship, especially as, like, what, a second apron
08:33team?
08:34Why would they do that?
08:35That would make no sense, and then you hurt your ability to, like, have these frozen draft
08:39picks in the future.
08:40So, I wouldn't run this team back.
08:42I think you do need to make some moves.
08:45You're good enough to, like, again, it depends on what your goal is.
08:48Are you fine with, like, being a really good second-round team, maybe making the conference
08:52finals, and hopefully doing a little bit better than you did this past year?
08:56Okay, then run it back, but if you're hoping to win an NBA championship, then maybe you
09:00do have to take a risk.
09:02I didn't realize that conversation was taking place in Cleveland.
09:05There are people that think you should trade Donovan Mitchell for Jalen Brown.
09:09Like, I highly, I mean, Donovan Mitchell, to me, is a better player than Jalen Brown.
09:14Plus, you're dealing with a guy that's not going to be, like, a bit of a distraction.
09:20Jalen Brown, I think one of the reasons that Boston wants to move him is they're sick of
09:24all the off-the-court, like, whining and playing victim and, you know, not necessarily
09:28accepting his role, where it's like, Jason Tatum's clearly the best, but, you know, but
09:33Jalen Brown wants the credit for being the best.
09:36So, I would not do that if I was Cleveland, and I think Boston, in a heartbeat, I think
09:42Boston, in a heartbeat, would do either a trade for Donovan Mitchell or for Evan Mobley.
09:49Really?
09:50Because my whole contention has been, and by the way, I'm not having an argument here,
09:54Justin.
09:54I'll acquiesce to you, buddy.
09:56My whole contention is, well, if you guys don't want Donovan Mitchell, why would Boston
10:00want Donovan Mitchell?
10:02I mean, isn't it kind of a, I mean, aren't the stats, aren't the metrics kind of similar
10:05to their tone?
10:06Isn't it player for player?
10:07But you're saying Boston would love to have Donovan Mitchell instead of Jalen Brown?
10:09He's become that much of a problem for that organization?
10:11Well, I think at this standpoint, like, look at somebody like Shams last night's talking
10:16about the Celtics getting 40 cents on the dollar, and let me ask you that, like, I sent out
10:20literally a tweet about 15 minutes ago, at Termini Radio, at T-E-R-M-I-N-E Radio, and
10:26I basically said that NBA team's apparent lack of interest in Jalen Brown, at the age of 29,
10:32after he finished sixth in the MVP award voting, says a lot more than, like, any analytic can
10:38say about how bad Jalen Brown is.
10:40Like, let me ask you, if Jalen Brown is so good, why are teams so hesitant to deal for him
10:46when he's 29 years of age?
10:48It's not like Jalen Brown's 34.
10:50Jalen Brown has three years left on his contract.
10:53So typically, like, a great player who's 29 years of age, the only thing you'd be hesitant
10:58about, wow, he can opt out after next season.
11:00He has three years left on his deal.
11:02He's 29.
11:03He stays relatively healthy.
11:05He just finished sixth in the MVP voting.
11:07Why aren't teams knocking down the door?
11:09And then I'll also ask this.
11:11This isn't like Nico Harrison trading Jalen Brown or some bad general manager.
11:16This is Brad Stevens, who just, you know, he's won an NBA championship.
11:19He's well-respected.
11:21He just won executive of the year.
11:23And this is a really good organization in Boston who's saying, hey, we're fine parting
11:27ways with Jalen Brown.
11:28So what does that say about Jalen Brown if teams are so hesitant to deal for him and the
11:33Celtics are so willing to part ways with him?
11:35To me, that says something about Jalen Brown, whether these organizations agree with the analytics,
11:40they're just afraid to say it out loud, or whether, like, they think just Jalen Brown's
11:45too much of a handful because he's always yapping about something.
11:48Like, who knows what it is?
11:49But there's obviously a reason teams are hesitant.
11:52Is there not?
11:52Does that make sense to you?
11:53Although you, it does.
11:54It does.
11:55No, it's a hell of an argument.
11:57Justin Devil's Advocate, wouldn't you have used that same point against, like, when Carl
12:01Anthony Towns is being traded?
12:02Well, why is Carl Anthony, why are teams hesitant to go after Carl Anthony Towns?
12:07And then here we are, and he's a champion, and people have a totally different view of
12:10him.
12:10You know, I mean, I think Jalen Brown is viewed as, like, maybe a better player than Carl
12:16Anthony Towns.
12:17Like, yeah, of course, Towns was the number one overall pick, but he just wasn't, I think,
12:21viewed the same way that Jalen Brown was, and certainly didn't have to be viewed the same
12:27way.
12:28Like, Carl Anthony Towns wasn't saying, I'm better than Anthony Edwards.
12:32I'm the best player on this team.
12:33He wasn't being difficult.
12:34Uh, Jalen Brown kind of has been, and, you know, Jalen Brown had a finals MVP.
12:39He's finishing higher in MVP voting than Carl Anthony Towns, so I just think the way that
12:44we view as a public, maybe not within the league, but the public, the way they view Jalen
12:48Brown is at a higher level.
12:50What about Evan Mobley?
12:51Would you be so quick to move off of him?
12:53Uh, I mean, it depends on what it's for.
12:56If it was for, say, Giannis Antetokounmpo, and you weren't throwing in, like, extra draft
13:00picks, then yeah, I would have done that because, you know, what's the point?
13:04James Harden's getting older, Donovan Mitchell's getting older, Jared Allen's getting older.
13:08This hasn't worked the last couple of years.
13:10Why don't you go for it with a guy who, to me, when healthy, is the third best player
13:15in the sport, uh, behind just Jokic and Wembenyama?
13:18Uh, like, at times, could be even higher than that, but I think he's better than SGA.
13:23She goes to Alexander.
13:24If you told me he's healthy for the next couple of years, you team him with Donovan Mitchell,
13:29yeah, I would move off Evan Mobley for that.
13:31Uh, I'm not sure I would move off him for, uh, Jalen Brown.
13:34That might be a, like, hey, your problem for our problem, or we're getting antsy, you're
13:38getting antsy, let's make that move, but I wouldn't move him for anything.
13:43What is it about the analytical debate that we are, um, being confronted with right now?
13:49How is it that people don't know how to accurately assess a player like Jalen Brown, who I think
13:56is fantastic, he's everything that I think, like, the Cavs have been missing, you know,
14:00being able to, to playmake on offense, uh, hitting tough shots against good defense, the
14:07pedigree of an East, of an Eastern Conference Finals, MVP, uh, NBA Finals, MVP, all the defense
14:13that he can turn up in the playoffs, and yet we don't have numbers that reflect that.
14:19Yeah, I mean, it's strange, uh, the analytics must mean, like, why are they always negative
14:24on Jalen Brown, but just about every other player that's, uh, uh, that we view as great,
14:29like, the analytics are good, right?
14:30Can you name another player like that?
14:32Uh, like, I think if you go through all the all-NBA players, first and second team, uh,
14:37the only other one that was a negative, uh, from a on-off perspective was Kevin Durant, and
14:42that was, like, at 0.8, uh, whereas with, uh, Jalen Brown, it was negative 5.6, and then forget
14:49about it with the MVP candidates, like Jokic, like SGA, uh, like Wembenyama, like, their on-off
14:56numbers were, like, astronomical, like 10-plus, with Jokic, it's, like, 16, 17, 18 on a typical
15:02basis, so the analytics must mean something, uh, they're not completely irrelevant, and I watched
15:09Jalen Brown 41 home games this year, plus the playoffs, like, in person, I will tell
15:15you this, like, his usage rate is really high, the ball sticks, uh, so I don't think he makes
15:20his teammates better, and I think that's a negative, uh, for Jalen Brown, and then I
15:25think his off-ball defense is absolutely horrific, he's a very good on-ball defender, uh, but he
15:30falls asleep off the ball, uh, and then this is something, like, where it's different between,
15:35like, post-season player, regular season player, I do think he turns it on defensive
15:39defensively during the post-season, for example, in the finals a couple of years ago, he took
15:43on the challenge of guarding Luka, but you could watch him against, say, Chicago on a
15:47random Tuesday night, he's the worst defender on the floor, probably for both teams, because
15:51he's completely disengaged, but if he's got, like, the Lakers in a big game, if he's got,
15:56uh, you know, Kawhi Leonard in a big game, where he dropped 50 points on the Clippers
16:00earlier this year and guarded Kawhi, essentially one-on-one, like, he'll turn it up, uh, so, you know,
16:06there are some things there where you could see, like, how the analytics do lead to how
16:11they view Jalen Brown, I mean, the seventh best on a team, as Bobby Marks indicated, some
16:15executive told him, uh, is completely ridiculous, uh, but, uh, but, you know, you could see how
16:22they aren't necessarily a positive for Jalen Brown at times.
16:24Listen to him on SiriusXM NBA Radio, the NBA Today, with him and Eddie Johnson, also the
16:30host of Termini Crashes Out on YouTube.
16:34Justin, thank you very much for the time, my friend.
16:37Well, thanks for, uh, handling it with a little bit more professionalism, uh, this time.
16:42I appreciate it.
16:43Oh, yeah, we certainly appreciate your professionalism.
16:45Pay your dog for me.
16:46We appreciate it.
16:47He was on the Wiseheart Right, We Make It Right, Call Kyle Right hotline.