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An investigation into the Ayodhya Ram Temple donation theft has escalated following the arrest of eight individuals.
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00:00Hello and welcome, you're watching India First. I'm Gaurav Savant.
00:04The eight accused named in the Divya Bhavya Shriram Temple donation theft case have been remanded to judicial custody.
00:12But there is now a growing clamour for action against the General Secretary of the Shriram Janmabhumi Tirkshetra Nyas, Champat
00:21Rai, and his key aide Anil Mishra.
00:24There are of course conflicting reports on Champat Rai's alleged resignation.
00:31Reports from Lucknow seem to indicate that he took moral responsibility and turned in his papers.
00:36But Gopal Rao, member of the Shriram Janmabhumi Tirkshetra Nyas said Champat Rai hadn't put in his papers yet but
00:45is under tremendous pressure to do so.
00:47His brother Sunil Bansal also indicates there is a conspiracy against Champat Rai and reports of resignation are not true.
01:12Let me quickly get you up to speed with the latest developments.
01:16The eight accused including Tinnu Yadav, the driver of Champat Rai, they've all been remanded.
01:22The eight accused have been remanded to judicial custody.
01:25Police officials claim a series of raids and searches have also led to the recovery of 80 lakh rupees so
01:32far.
01:33As investigations into the Shriram Mandir donation theft intensify,
01:37Uttar Pradesh Chief Minister Yogi Adityanath promised zero tolerance towards those guilty of cheating the devotees of Marjada Purushottam Shriram.
01:48Within hours of the first FIR being registered at the Shriram Janmabhumi Police Station, based on the preliminary findings of
01:55the special investigation team, the Uttar Pradesh police arrested the eight accused.
02:00Let me introduce you to those who now stand accused of cheating the devotees of Lord Ram.
02:08Ram Shankar Yadav, alias Tinnu Yadav, he used to work as the driver of Champat Rai, the general secretary of
02:17the Ram Janmabhumi Trust.
02:19It's claimed Tinnu Yadav was so influential, he used to guide various arrangements and also had the key to that
02:28counting room.
02:29But on what authority? On whose authority is the big question?
02:35Lavkush Mishra, allegedly involved in counting cash and valuables received as donation.
02:41Anukalp Mishra, again somebody who was involved in the counting of money, stands accused of pilferage.
02:49Subhash Chandra Srivastava is a retired bank employee, was in charge of donation counting shifts
02:55at the counting room at the Pilgrim Facilities Centre in Ayodhya.
03:01Karunesh Pandey has been identified as being a part of the donation counting process.
03:08Manish Yadav, he was also a part of the team that counted donation money, would stack them, put them in
03:17boxes.
03:18That money was then taken to banks, but this is where the pilferage took place.
03:24Rama Shankar Mishra, alias Ravi Mishra, was working at the counting centre of donation.
03:31Avinash Shukla reportedly was a part of the team responsible for counting the money and transporting it.
03:38All eight accused have been remanded to three days of judicial custody.
03:42The accused have made certain disclosures during initial investigations.
03:46And on the basis of those investigations, not only are several other officials being questioned,
03:53there are a series of searches that have been carried out.
03:56Trust officials have told the police they had a hidden camera, a hidden CCTV camera installed in the counting room.
04:04And this camera revealed 70 instances of pilferage in 47 days.
04:10The whistleblower had already given details of how 500 rupee notes, they went missing.
04:17X number of notes would be attached to every block of notes that would be sent to the bank.
04:24The accounting was inadequate.
04:27And notes would be pilfered in between.
04:31There are questions being raised about the missing silver bricks, diamond necklaces, and other jewels.
04:38Yogi Adityanath is promising zero tolerance for corruption, but the opposition is clearly not impressed.
04:43The opposition insists the probe is not just about this donation scam or missing jewels,
04:50but also about the alleged land scam.
04:54They say they've been complaining about a land scam since 2021.
04:58Our Uttar Pradesh Bureau brings you our top story.
05:06It is undoubtedly one of the biggest assaults on Aastha.
05:10A scandal that has shaken the faith of millions of devotees.
05:15The loot of Ramandhi donations has struck at the very heart of Hindu sentiment.
05:22Gold, silver, and cash worth crores offered by devotees for the construction and development
05:28of the Bhavya Shri Ramjan Mubhumi Temple were siphoned off for personal gain.
05:35Eight people have been arrested.
05:38Senior members of the temple trust, including its chief Champatrai, have resigned.
05:46But this is no longer just a religious controversy.
05:49The Ramandhi donation theft has now snowballed into a major political flashpoint.
05:55For the BJP, the controversy is a serious political setback, even if the party is not directly accused
06:01in the alleged theft.
06:04The focus has shifted from the grand Ramandhi inauguration to allegations of loot in devotees' donations.
06:11A controversy like this risks overshadowing one of the BJP's biggest political achievements.
06:17It threatens to disrupt the party's election messaging.
06:21It could leave sections of its core support base uneasy.
06:25And it raises uncomfortable questions over transparency and accountability in handling public donations.
06:33Perhaps that explains the Yogi government's tough response.
06:37Chief Minister Yogi Adityanath has reiterated a zero-tolerance policy,
06:41promising that those who betrayed the faith of devotees will face the strictest action.
07:12Chief Minister Yogi Adityanath,
07:22Timing is crucial for the state government, as the scam has surfaced just months before
07:28Uttar Pradesh heads into assembly elections.
07:30The opposition has seized the opportunity to corner the Yogi Adityanath government.
07:35From the Congress to the Shripsena UBT and the Army Party,
07:40opposition leaders are holding the BJP accountable.
07:44It is the first time of the worship and cooperation of the Shripsena,
07:45who are Inladeshanath, who has refused to say,
07:52you will also experience having the struggle at this massive majority of the Shrips.
07:54Don't think that it will be done with all of the Shrips.
08:00It is a significant number.
08:07It doesn't have any role in its strong capital.
08:09foreign
08:16foreign
08:16foreign
08:16foreign
08:17foreign
08:25foreign
08:26foreign
08:46The investigation will fix responsibility.
08:50But politically, the controversy has already become a challenge for the BJP.
09:02This is not just a criminal breach of trust, theft, or violation of the Bharat Nyaya Sahita.
09:09This is far more serious.
09:11This, devotees say, is Ram Droh, cheating devotees of Maryada Purushottam Shri Ram at the Divya Bhavya Ram Temple at
09:20the Shri Ram Jan Bhoomi.
09:21The followers of Sanat and Dharm waited hundreds of years for this Divya Bhavya Ram Temple to come up at
09:29the Shri Ram Jan Bhoomi at Ayodhya.
09:30People made the supreme sacrifice of their lives for this Ram Temple.
09:34And those working at this temple, instead of working for the wider benefit of the Hindu society with this donation,
09:44were actually lining their pockets.
09:46Is the arrest of just eight the tip of the iceberg or an eye wash as the opposition insists?
09:54Why is Champat Rai still part of the trust that breached the trust of devotees?
09:59Can he detach himself from this horrendous taint?
10:04Should there be a wider investigation, not just into the donation scam, but also the alleged land scam at Ayodhya?
10:12Many questions. Let's seek some answers.
10:15Joining me on India first is Sri Rankateshwaran, Joint Secretary and National Spokesperson of the Vishwa Hindu Parishad.
10:22Sanju Verma is National Spokesperson of the Bharatiya Janta Party.
10:25Anurag Bhadorya is the spokesperson of the Samajwadi Party.
10:29Brijesh Kalappa is the national spokesperson of the Congress Party.
10:32Shubh Rasta is a respected author, political analyst who joins us on the show.
10:38Welcome. I want to begin by asking Sri Venkateshwara,
10:42Sir, have Champat Rai and Anil Mishra resigned or are they still clinging on to the trust despite this massive
10:51breach of trust?
10:53I just have to rely on, you know, press reports only.
10:59I have not got any direct information whatsoever from our leadership as to whether Champat Ji has resigned or not.
11:07But, you know, a little while back, I, you know, read a couple of news outlets that said that he
11:14has resigned.
11:15However, Gopal Rao, a trustee, we spoke to him just a short while back and he said there is a
11:21lot of pressure on him to resign.
11:23But he sees this as a conspiracy and that Champat Rai hasn't resigned so far.
11:29We shall wait for an official confirmation on this.
11:31But, Sanju Verma, opposition says eight employees being arrested is an eyewash, a cover-up to shield the higher-ups
11:39in the chain of command at the trust.
11:41Why have Champat Rai and Anil Mishra not been held accountable yet, madam?
11:48You know, Gaurav, first things first, as a practicing Hindu, I am completely pained at the revelations that have been
11:56coming out in the public domain over the last 72-odd hours.
11:59Because for us, Ram Mandir is not just about Aastha, it is about the civilizational battle that Hindus won after
12:07500 long years.
12:09And so many people have sacrificed for this cause, including Mr. Champat Rai.
12:15I was listening to one of your discussions hosted by you, where you rightly said that Champat Rai has been
12:22called, you know, Ram Lalla Ke Patwari.
12:25Because he used to maintain the books of accounts and the entire documentation in the run-up to that famous
12:31Ram Mandir verdict in 2019.
12:34Be that as it may, do I stand, does the BJP stand for accountability and transparency on this issue?
12:41Oh yes, that is point number one.
12:46Point number two, SIT report, the contents of that have not yet come out in the public domain.
12:52So my humble request is, let the contents of the SIT report be made public by the relevant authorities.
13:00Before that, to jump the gun and assume that Champat Rai or Anil Mishra are guilty.
13:06I think that is being unfair.
13:08I would have said this for anyone.
13:10Let's not try and guillotine people without having substantive proof.
13:15Point number three.
13:16Ram Ji had not yet one day, and then he said that there is a sin.
13:23And he took certain actions, right or wrong, he took those actions, on saying that.
13:29I am not getting into the merits of that, but all I am saying is,
13:32what people say, what a lot of sin is a big deal.
13:35You know that well.
13:37But let me bring Anurag Bhadoriya into this conversation.
13:40Anurag Bhadoriya, there is no evidence against Champat Rai.
13:42There is no evidence against Bhakti.
13:47The SIT report is the way to have been arugated by the SIT.
13:50It's a bit arugated by the SIT.
13:50And after that, the Kariwai's need to be the Kariwai's need to be the Kariwai's need.
13:52Eight people who have been arrested for driving,
13:57they are the first-person
13:57Do you agree with this?
14:33Do you agree with this?
15:18Do you agree with this?
15:27Do you agree with this?
15:57Do you agree with this?
16:22Do you agree with this?
16:43Do you agree with this?
16:56Do you agree with this?
17:37Do you agree with this?
17:50Do you agree with this?
17:56Do you agree with this?
18:25Do you agree with this?
19:20Do you agree with this?
19:23Do you agree with this?
19:33Do you agree with this?
19:53Do you agree with this?
20:01Do you agree with this?
20:17Do you agree with this?
20:46Do you agree with this?
20:56Do you agree with this?
21:37Do you agree with this?
21:41Do you agree with this?
21:43Do you agree with this?
21:49Do you agree with this?
21:53Do you agree with this?
21:57Do you agree with this?
21:59Do you agree with this?
22:34Do you agree with this?
22:39Do you agree with this?
22:48Do you agree with this?
22:52Do you agree with this,
22:57do you agree with this?
23:10said at the start i'm a practicing hindu and i believe thanks to accountability which bjp stands
23:17for we are pained but we are happy that this entire issue has come out in the public domain
23:22let the guilty be punished let there be no room for any leniency but what i'm saying is i don't
23:29need sanatana dharma from hypocrites of akhilesh adhaf's party fair enough i want to quickly move
23:37forward and bring in shubrasta into this conversation who's been very patiently listening
23:41to this entire conversation and shubrasta is the probe in the right direction or is there merit in
23:47the opposition saying that it's only those eight employees that the chain of command those who are
23:54responsible for acts of omission and commission commission are they now being you know are they
24:00being shielded why haven't they been booked yet um a toddler like ram lala had to fight his own
24:10case in court for five and you know it was justice done after 500 years so patience is something that
24:17that ram has taught all of us uh you know as hindus practicing or non-practicing so i'm not going
24:23to go
24:23into uh the the fact that what has happened is extremely unfortunate we all know it is unfortunate
24:30we i don't think any one of us sitting here in the panel is going to justify uh you know
24:35what has
24:35happened however let me also let me also yes yes i agree with you it is ram dro let me
24:42also put it
24:42out at the outset that i as a practicing and a political hindu will not allow samajwadi party or
24:49the congress party to take a moral eye ground on this ram uh you know rahul gandhi or akhilesh yadav
24:56none of them have even visited the temple what locust and eye do they have to tell us whose donations
25:02has uh you know uh been misappropriated this third point that i want to uh you know talk about here
25:08is
25:09uh this gaurav this is an opportunity to open up the whole conversation around freeing the temples
25:14yes it is a huge setback to that movement because what has happened you know uh via the trust
25:21via the trust needs to be uh uh in not only investigated but you know justice brought but
25:26it also tells us that because government interference if at all i were to you know uh parrot the line
25:33of
25:33the opposition if it's the government which is involved and which is why you know there are these
25:37discrepancies which is you know we need to all the more free the temples absolutely from this control
25:42last point gaurav same show a couple of months ago we debated vakf bill yes it was a conversation
25:52about muslim properties look at the samajwadi party and the congress party then and look at them now
25:58okay the point i'll come on the vakf it is a problem it is a problem in a hindu household
26:03we will figure it of course people who are who have been responsible are at the moment not uh you
26:10know
26:10put in jail it will happen eventually because those who are responsible will be put in jail
26:15you are accusing the samajwadi party and congress of double standards uh
26:19uh anurag vadhoria you want to do this
26:24uh
26:53political Hindu
26:55foreign
27:08foreign
27:17I don't know.
28:08political hindu
28:12Okay, move on, move on, Shriv Yankar Deshwara Ji.
28:15Eight low-level counting staff have been arrested.
28:19FIR refers to others.
28:21Others.
28:22It does not name any of the senior trust functionaries and officials.
28:26Sir, we call it a very good person, Shriv Yankar Deshwara Ji.
28:29If you talk about it,
28:31after such a big quarry,
28:32how can they become a trust?
28:34How can they become a trust?
28:37Should they not step down?
28:40Exactly. Let us wait for, as Subrata said,
28:43let us wait for the SID.
28:45SID is investigating it.
28:47And they have already made some moves.
28:50And let us be patient.
28:51See, I mean, I would like to look at it
28:54not from this political point of view.
28:56I would like to look at it from a dharmic point of view.
28:59This is like, as Sanju Verma said,
29:02this is a civilizational battle that we have won.
29:04And it's a very hard-won battle.
29:07So, we don't want any of the Hindus to be, you know, hurt from this.
29:12So, we want...
29:13You tell me, as a Hindu, are you hurt or not?
29:15500 years of civilizational battle
29:16that you fought and won,
29:18that everyone fought and won.
29:20For what?
29:20For these people to line their pockets?
29:24I'm also really hurt.
29:26I want the culprits to be booked
29:28and exemplary punishment to be handed out to them.
29:31That is what I want.
29:32That is what every Hindu wants.
29:33No, only Tinnu Yadha.
29:34Only Tinnu Yadha.
29:35Let me just finish.
29:35What about those who Tinnu Yadha was driving around?
29:40See, everything is in habit of this particular investigation.
29:43Everything is going to be investigated.
29:45Every person who has made any mistake
29:48is going to be punished.
29:49Absolutely sure about that.
29:51And I don't want to get carried away
29:54by the Samajwadi parties
29:56and Congress parties' fake narratives.
29:59We know their intentions.
30:01Their intentions...
30:01What makes you think Samajwadi party
30:03or Congress party is setting the narrative?
30:05Sir, every Hindu is hurt.
30:09How could something like this happen
30:11at the Divya Bhavya Ram Mandir?
30:13Sir, you saw the emotion.
30:14Sir, I have personally covered this case
30:16from 2010, High Court verdict.
30:192019, Supreme Court verdict.
30:212021, when the Shalanyas was happening.
30:24Bhoomi Poojan was happening.
30:252022, Pran Pratishtha.
30:27You know, I have seen people
30:28when you go there,
30:29when the engineers were working there,
30:31when they went to Garb Greh,
30:32they would take off their shoes and socks.
30:34They would walk bare feet
30:35because of their devotion.
30:37That devotion has been maligned.
30:39Sanju Verma,
30:40that Maryada has really been hurt.
30:42You said, as a practicing Hindu,
30:44you are hurt.
30:44Ma'am, you've seen those CCTV images,
30:48the tampering donation box keys
30:50were controlled by specific individuals,
30:52inadequate background checks done,
30:54relatives given that job of counting money
30:56and no supervision.
30:58Which company has accountants
31:01not supervised at multiple levels?
31:05You know, Gaurav,
31:06that's a very pertinent question.
31:08So there are two aspects to it.
31:09You know,
31:11I have no qualms in saying,
31:12you know,
31:13whether you're a practicing Hindu,
31:14a non-practicing Hindu,
31:16a political Hindu
31:17or a non-political Hindu,
31:18it does not matter.
31:19Even as a taxpaying,
31:22honest Indian citizen,
31:23you need to demand accountability
31:25on certain issues.
31:27Absolutely.
31:28But the more important point,
31:30my only humble submission,
31:32this is not arrogance,
31:33this is simply being factual.
31:35Let the SIT's report
31:37come out in public domain.
31:39Was it sheer incompetence
31:42on the part of Champat Rai?
31:43Or was he involved
31:45in a larger conspiracy?
31:46Or was it neither incompetence
31:48nor any role
31:50in the larger conspiracy?
31:51But he was himself a victim
31:53of what transpired around him.
31:56Let's wait for the brass tacks
31:58to be out
31:59before guillotining somebody
32:01on national TV.
32:02That's my only submission.
32:04And I want to end
32:05by saying one thing.
32:06Do you remember
32:07your channel
32:08had done this story?
32:09In 2018-19,
32:11your story came out with,
32:13your channel,
32:14pardon me,
32:14came out with revelations
32:15about how
32:17Madarsas in Bankura,
32:19Birgum,
32:20Bardwan,
32:20and Nurshida Bagh
32:21under the erstwhile
32:23Mamata Banerjee regime
32:24had actually turned
32:25into mini bomb-making factories.
32:28And everybody said,
32:29don't get Madarsas
32:31into this.
32:32You're making
32:32the whole thing communal.
32:34You're giving it
32:35a communal spin.
32:36But what I'm glad
32:37is that when it comes
32:38to Hindu Astha,
32:40the BJP government,
32:41you know,
32:41Yogi Adityanath
32:42has clearly said
32:43kisi ko bakshah nahi jayega
32:45and harshest punishment
32:46will be accorded.
32:47I think therein
32:48lies the difference.
32:49We've got to like
32:50to stop this.
32:51There is another aspect,
32:52madam.
32:52Under the topic.
32:53There is another aspect,
32:55madam.
32:55That of an alleged
32:56land scam.
32:58You heard Sanjay Singh
32:59of the Aam Admi Party
33:00and Anurag Bhadorya.
33:012 crore ki bhoomi
33:02arrop ye hai.
33:042 crore ki bhoomi
33:0520 crore
33:07or 18 crore
33:089 crore ki 55 crore
33:11mean b├иchi.
33:11So,
33:12this 10 crore
33:12should be
33:13or not.
33:14Is it a CBI monitored
33:16or court monitored
33:18CBI jauch?
33:20So,
33:21Gaurav ji,
33:22I'm not
33:22going to do it.
33:23I'm not going to do it.
33:24I'm not going to do it.
33:26I'm not going to do it.
33:26I'm not going to do it.
33:26Sanjay Singh
33:27take his documents
33:28and take his documents
33:29for how many years ago
33:30before the land
33:32when the land
33:32was bought
33:322021-2022
33:33he told him
33:34he had a paper
33:35and he told him
33:37So,
33:37why do you know
33:38this inquire
33:38could not be able to do it?
33:39Do you know
33:40Can you know
33:40this?
33:41Can you know
33:42The jameen
33:43ka gotala
33:43kaise hoa?
33:44Abhi jamb
33:44mandir ki chori
33:45ki,
33:45abhi jamb
33:46dhan pate
33:46me chori
33:47ki,
33:47abhi dhubarrah
33:47se samaj
33:48vadi nha
33:48uthai,
33:48tab SIT
33:49nha bola
33:49abhi jameen
33:51ke paper
33:51lekei a
33:51ye.
33:52This jameen
33:52ke paper
33:52to pehle
33:53bhi
33:53mang
33:53sakti
33:54tih
33:54na,
33:54jab
33:54ye u
33:55uthai
34:24ta mudda
34:25with documents
34:26should they be probed sir
34:28in a court monitored investigation
34:30See,
34:31I'd only like to say this much
34:33that
34:33the moment you want to protect people
34:37and we have
34:38I have been in government
34:39I have been out of government
34:40I have seen
34:41you know
34:41how things work
34:42I have been a lawyer
34:43I know
34:44that if you want to protect people
34:46the first thing that a government will do
34:48is to have an SIT
34:50and that SIT
34:52is going to name the lowliest of individuals
34:55and then put them behind bars
34:57and then close the story
34:58right
34:58and this is exactly the same thing
35:00that is happening in Uttar Pratich
35:02point is this
35:04that
35:05who has facilitated this massive loot
35:09first
35:09second question
35:10when Prime Minister Modi comes
35:13does the Pratich
35:14does the inauguration
35:16does every single thing
35:17why is he keeping quiet
35:18is he not ashamed of the fact
35:20that such a huge amount of money
35:22has been stolen
35:23right from right under his nose
35:25second fact
35:26third point is
35:27Sanju Varma
35:28Sanju Varma wants to respond
35:30on your naming the Prime Minister
35:31here is a trust Gaurav
35:33sorry
35:33just one more point
35:34here is a trust Gaurav
35:36just give him 30 seconds
35:37to complete his point
35:3730 seconds he is completing his point
35:39I am coming to you man
35:40which has been registered
35:41the Ram Janam
35:42the Ram Temple Trust
35:43is registered
35:44can you imagine
35:46the RSS
35:47the RSS is still unregistered
35:49can you imagine
35:50the kind of money
35:51that they are stealing away
35:52without any accountability
35:52Sanju Varma wants to respond
35:55Sanju Varma wants to respond
35:56go ahead ma'am
35:58first and foremost
35:59I take strong objection
36:01to the kind of language
36:02used for Prime Minister
36:03Narendra Modi
36:04by the Congress spokesperson
36:05but I expect nothing better
36:07from him
36:07because
36:10the apple does not fall
36:13far from the tree
36:14but let me come to
36:15the moot point here
36:16the moot point is
36:18an allocation about
36:19Zameen Ghotala
36:20in Ayodhya
36:21has been made
36:22but I ask Gaurav to you
36:24we have done so many debates
36:25on other issues also
36:26you know revolving around
36:27criminality
36:28and usurping of land
36:30there has to be
36:32a money trail
36:33that has to be established
36:34by the person
36:35who is making the allegation
36:36there has to be
36:37a malafide intent
36:38that has to be established
36:39proceeds of crime
36:41need to be established
36:42Sanjan Singh
36:43is himself
36:44out on bail
36:45in the Delhi Liquor Gate scam
36:47Ardind Kejriwal
36:48is also
36:49in Delhi Liquor Gate
36:50R.O.P.
36:51and this
36:52BJP
36:53has been given
36:54on corruption
36:55and other
36:56hypocrisy
36:57and crime
36:58is commendable
37:00indeed
37:00and I say that
37:01as a pun
37:03Shubhrasta
37:05Mahipal Singh
37:06and that's a name
37:07we've been hearing
37:08for quite some time
37:09had blown the lid
37:10of the scam
37:11as it's being called
37:12even earlier
37:13so is there merit
37:15in the demand
37:16for a total overhaul
37:18and a total audit
37:19of donations
37:21from the time
37:23of Pran Pratishtha
37:24whether it is
37:25cash donation
37:26gold, silver
37:28and other jewels
37:29that were donated
37:31Yes, I think
37:32that's a fair demand
37:33I don't have any
37:34issue with that demand
37:35but let me also tell you
37:37that this whole conversation
37:38about
37:38you know
37:39the probe
37:40not happening
37:41the way it should
37:42as the opposition
37:43is trying to say
37:44let me also put it out
37:45you know
37:46put the record straight
37:47legally and procedurally
37:49I think the government
37:50is absolutely right
37:51and has not faltered
37:52at any point in time
37:53for an FIR
37:54to be registered
37:55somebody from the trust
37:56had to come forward
37:57because nobody came forward
37:58an FIR
37:59couldn't be registered
38:00now the point is
38:01that there was
38:02a time bound
38:03limitation on SIT
38:04and I think the SIT
38:05has been doing
38:06its duties
38:06fulfilling it
38:07absolutely correctly
38:08but Gaurav
38:09again I would come
38:10with the same rider
38:11it is a problem
38:13that there is a problem
38:14that has happened
38:19this fight
38:22this fight is a Hindu fight
38:24and I will not
38:26I don't think
38:26Hindus like us
38:27will allow
38:28Samajwadi Party
38:29or the Congress Party
38:31to take a moral high ground
38:32those who have not even
38:32visited Ramlala once
38:34donated a single
38:37what local standard
38:38do these politicians
38:39have
38:40okay
38:4110 seconds
38:4210 seconds
38:4310 seconds
38:4310 seconds
38:4410 seconds
38:45Why is this that the government is being destroyed in the MPMLA,
38:50the people are being destroyed, the need is being destroyed.
38:54Because your MPMLA is being destroyed,
38:57because your government is being destroyed,
38:59because your government is being destroyed,
39:02you are being destroyed so much in your own party.
39:06So keep your intent.
39:09I am Hindu. You are political Hindu.
39:11I am a Hindu. You are being destroyed.
39:13Today we are being destroyed.
39:21We are being destroyed.
39:21We don't need permission for me.
39:23I am a political ambassador.
39:28You have permission for your people to keep their power in 30 seconds.
39:30I have permission to donate your rights.
39:35Our politicians are going to the Bharti people in the scene.
39:39Why do I need you?
39:42Only Sanju Verma. Respond, ma'am.
40:10To gain political brownie points ahead of Uttar Pradesh 2027 assembly elections.
40:16But I want to tell Anurag Bhadhoria,
40:18рдЬрдм 12-NASI рдореЗрдВ 2012 рдореЗрдВ blast рд╣реБрдЖ рдерд╛ рдЗрдВрдбрд┐рдпрд░ рдореБрдЬрд╛рд╣рд┐рджреА.
40:23рдмрд╛рдд рд╣реЛ рд░рд╣реА рд╣реИ, рд░рд╛рдо рдордВрджрд┐рд░ рдХреЗ рдЗрд╡рд╛рдБ рдкреЗ рдЪреЛрд░реА рдХреА,
40:25рдЖрдк рдЗрджрд░ рджрд░ рдореБрджреНрдзреЗ рдХреЛ рднрдЯрдХрд╛рдиреЗ рдореЗрдВ рд▓рдЧреЗ рд╣реИрдВ.
40:27рдЖрдк 2012 рдореЗрдВ рдЪрд▓реЗ рдЧрдП, рдореИрдВ рддреЛ рдмрд╛рдд рдХрд░реВрдВ,
40:33рдЗрд╕ рдЕрдзрд┐рд░ рдмрд╛рдд рдХрд░рдиреЗ рдореЗрдВ рд▓рдЧреЗ рд╣реИрдВ, рддреЛ рдмрд╛рдд рдХрд░рдиреЗ рдореЗрдВ рд▓рдЧреЗ рд╣реИрдВ.
40:42It's a very, very serious issue.
40:48We've been assured that action will be taken, is being taken.
40:52I want to thank all our guests for being a part of this,
40:55because this is not just a violation of the Bharat Nyaay Sahita.
41:00This truly is also Ram Droh.
41:03If you can steal money, jewels or even land
41:07that belongs to the devotees of Maryadha Purushottam Shriram.
41:11We'll be tracking investigations in the story very closely.
41:14I want to thank all our guests.
41:15A quick...
41:30Mayday, Mayday, Mayday, or is it pan, pan, pan?
41:34Because there is engine trouble for the light combat aircraft
41:37and for the 5th generation fighter jets.
41:41That's our top focus story on this special edition of the Battle Cry.
41:45I'm Gaurav Savant.
41:46Mayday is an international distress signal
41:49and our India's light combat aircraft
41:52and the advanced medium combat aircraft
41:54or the FGFA, the 5th generation fighter jet programs
41:57threatened by similar distress.
42:00Are we in a Mayday situation
42:02or are we still in an imminent danger, pan, pan, pan kind of a situation?
42:07Because unavailability of engines and massive cost overruns
42:11are issues that the nation is grappling with.
42:15The light combat aircraft, incidentally,
42:17has been plagued by the unavailability of G404 engines
42:21for a very long time now.
42:23Remember, when the Pokhran test happened,
42:261998, India's nuclear test,
42:28Americans put restrictions.
42:30They imposed sanctions.
42:32The LCA that flies on the G404 engines
42:34saw sales being...
42:36supplies being curtailed
42:38with post-Pokhran sanctions imposed on India
42:40after the nuclear test.
42:42Once those sanctions were removed, engine supplies did resume.
42:46But there have been constant delays
42:49and those delays plagued the aircraft even today.
42:53The big question, why doesn't India, till date,
42:57have a fighter jet engine?
43:00When will we have it in future?
43:02The made-in-India fighter jet engine.
43:05The big question, why is that not priority number one for the nation?
43:10Air Marshal Chopra, China, today,
43:13has two fifth-generation fighter jets flying.
43:16Two different types of fifth-generation fighter jets.
43:19The older ones are being palmed off to Pakistan,
43:22which means Pakistan will also have the fifth-generation fighter jet.
43:25We are still waiting for engines for a LCA,
43:28LCA Mark 1, LCA Mark 2,
43:30and AMCA.
43:31Is this a mayday, mayday, mayday situation for India?
43:37Thank you, Gaurav.
43:39And I must say that aero engines have been the age-less heel
43:43of all fighter programs in the country.
43:46Starting back in HF24,
43:49when we were forced to put two NAT engines into the HF24,
43:55always remained underpowered.
43:57We built only 121 of them,
43:59and finally we had to retire them.
44:01And thereafter, we started the Kaveri engine in mid-1980s.
44:06Kaveri engine, perhaps,
44:07we didn't take it substantially seriously.
44:10We did not look for technology outside.
44:12We didn't put enough money in Kaveri.
44:14Now, perhaps, going to the Ghatak UKF.
44:18So, there has been an issue.
44:19And now, we are in a trap.
44:21You know, we are in a trap.
44:22We have chosen 404 for the ACA.
44:25We know for Mark 1,
44:26we have all the engines we got,
44:28all 40 of them,
44:2938 aircraft.
44:31Finally, inducted to have crashed.
44:33And that is what our LCA1 story is.
44:35LCA Mark 1A,
44:37404.
44:37We know we are behind schedule by two and a half years
44:40because of the engines.
44:42Very few engines have come.
44:43Exact numbers around 15,
44:45out of which six are already on board the aircraft.
44:48And some integration issues are holding up.
44:50The LCA Mark 1A needs.
44:52Okay.
44:52But the delay has been considerable over two years of delay in Mark 404 engines.
44:57And now, we hear the final bombshell.
45:00When AMCA is about to be given to a private sector for design and development,
45:03we need five prototypes.
45:05We require 15 F414 engines for the AMCA.
45:09Also, the LCA Mark 2 is getting more or less ready.
45:12And we require F414 for them.
45:14And our bombshell has come from the earlier price of 70 to 80 crores.
45:19And now, they're talking of something close to 200 crores.
45:21We understand the negotiations still on, on TOT, license, manufacture, and long-term support,
45:29warranties.
45:31DRDOHL are talking.
45:33They want deep tech, whether the deep tech is coming or not.
45:37Is this additional amount that being asked?
45:39Is it for all these things, in addition to just the engine cost,
45:43which is around 60 to 70 to 80 crores,
45:46is an issue that we are all trying to ascertain.
45:50But this figure is too high.
45:52Whether we have put too many engines into the American basket,
45:56another issue we need to discuss.
45:58We will discuss that in greater detail in the second part of this program.
46:02But that's a very interesting point you raise,
46:04that we are caught in a trap.
46:06Sandeep, how bad is the situation for the AMCA Dream,
46:09both Pakistan and China?
46:12So, China already has two different variants of fifth-generation fighter jets.
46:16Pakistan is likely to get the older variation of the Chinese stealth fighters.
46:21How bad is the situation for India?
46:23Well, Doran, the situation is extremely critical.
46:25As Air Marshal Chopra just mentioned,
46:28the fact is that we seem to have put a lot of our engine eggs in the American basket.
46:33And now we're paying the price for that.
46:35The United States of a few years back is not the United States it is today.
46:39We are looking at a quieter adversarial relationship.
46:43And you're dealing with a strategic partner, Gaurav,
46:47which does not share technology with any country.
46:49And you have to see the kind of headlines that come out when the U.S. OKs, spares and support
46:55for platforms that we have paid billions of dollars for.
46:59So, they like to have everybody on a short leash, Gaurav.
47:02And you have gone in and committed one of the most critical aircraft programs for us.
47:09Literally, our entire aircraft in digitization, Gaurav, depends on the LCA Mark II taking off.
47:15It depends on the AMCA Mark I taking off.
47:17And today, because of the kind of cost overrun that we're looking at,
47:21the future of these programs is in doubt.
47:23And the fact is that when the supplier knows that you have no option, Gaurav,
47:29that hobbles you at the very start of any negotiations.
47:32He realizes that you have no option.
47:34As they say in politics, there's a Tina factor.
47:36And it engines also, this seems to be the same problem, Gaurav.
47:40Let me bring in Air Marshal Kapoor on this.
47:42Air Marshal Kapoor, would you see this as a mayday, mayday, mayday situation?
47:46Or is it short of mayday, we're still at pan, pan, pan,
47:49that there's an imminent danger?
47:51Or are we walking into a crisis eyes wide shut?
47:54Because the problems were there right from the time of G404 engine,
47:58the delay in the supplies of those engines.
48:02Good evening, Gaurav, to Air Marshal Chopra and Sandeep.
48:06I take on from where Sandeep left.
48:09See, the rising India is not liked by anybody.
48:13The Americans do not want the French to help and cooperate.
48:17And after Opsindur, this shoot down of Rafale, you know, highlighting the issues of French equipment globally,
48:26now putting pressure on Safran, delaying the GE negotiations, not supplying.
48:32And to a large extent, I agree with Sandeep, our bureaucratic hassles are phenomenal.
48:39Look at the irony.
48:41The HEL is bargaining with GE for LCA Mark 2.
48:47And a separate government organization, that is ADA and DRDO, is negotiating with GE for same engine for TEDBF and
48:59AMCA.
49:00Same organization, same country, two different government organizations are dealing.
49:06It highlights somewhere that we are not very serious initially when we were laying the building blocks in understanding the
49:14gravity.
49:15The Indian Air Force has never, ever bought any American fighter.
49:20There has to be some reason why for the last 80 years, the India has not gone in for any
49:25of the American fighters.
49:27Now, we have programmed our complete fighter growth on American engine, which is the heart.
49:33Now, comes the real point.
49:35Last three to four years, India has grown in stature and more so after Opsindur in my appreciation in last
49:42one year.
49:42The Europeans are in a bad shape.
49:45The Europeans need a huge market, which is India.
49:48So that's why M88, Safran, MRO came up at Hyderabad last year, which the Honorable Prime Minister inaugurated.
49:55The Safran and the Rolls Royce both are now offering things which were not even on the table three years
50:03ago.
50:04Both the companies are now ordering.
50:06And if I recall, Raksha Mantri in February 2026 this year had said that India is looking at sixth generation.
50:14So the Rolls Royce now is saying that we will de novo start from scratch.
50:19What are probable solutions is for the government and the armed forces and especially the Air Force, DRDO, HAL, Government
50:29of India to put their heads together and find a solution.
50:32I want to thank Air Marshal Chopra, Air Marshal Kapoor and Sandeep Punithan for joining me on this part of
50:37Battle Cry.
50:37This is a story we'll be tracking very closely.
50:39A quick break.
50:40News and updates continue on India Today.
50:42Stay with us.
50:49News and updates continue on India Today.
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