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Can new political movements reshape Malaysia’s future or are they simply adding to an increasingly crowded political landscape? This episode explores youth engagement, coalition politics, and the future of democracy with Haziq Azfar (Parti Bersama Malaysia) and Amir Fiqri (MUDA).
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00:07Hello, I'm Amirul Aiman, and you're watching It's About Youth.
00:11Malaysia's political landscape has changed dramatically over the past decade,
00:16alongside established political parties.
00:18We have also seen the emergence of new political movements
00:22seeking to challenge traditional ways of doing politics.
00:25At the same time, younger Malaysians have become increasingly an important bloc
00:30following the implementation of Undi 18.
00:33Yet despite the greater political awareness,
00:37and as we are heading to election season,
00:39many young people remain skeptical of political parties and institutions.
00:44Joining me today to unpack this topic are Haziq Asfar from Parti Bersama Malaysia
00:49and also Amir Fikri from Muda.
00:52Thank you both for joining us today.
00:55Amir, sorry Haziq, let me begin with you first.
00:59What was missing from Malaysia's political landscape
01:03that made you believe a new political movement was necessary?
01:08Thanks Amirul, firstly I'm speaking on behalf, not on behalf,
01:12I'm just an ordinary member of Bersama,
01:15so I'm not a spokesperson or just sharing my thoughts.
01:19Answering your questions, I think it's the current setting of political movement
01:28somehow nurture the maintenance of status quo.
01:33As an example, we can see in the structure of political party.
01:40Okay, but we need to answer some of the questions.
01:45What you need to have in order to join a political party?
01:49I mean, if you have some, not ambition, but you want to go far.
01:56You need big capital, you need your own supporters,
02:00or the so-called grassroots that you give handouts in order for them to support you.
02:07So, and to the extent of election machinery.
02:13So I would say that the reliance toward capital,
02:18maybe in terms of donor or capitalist,
02:21is something that we see the only way how political party works.
02:31So that it is quite hard for any political party, once they gain power,
02:38to make real changes, radical changes, because of demand by the capitalist,
02:44or the one, you know, who they rely on mandatory support.
02:52They more prefer for the status quo to be maintained,
02:56and that's why I think we now, before this,
03:01we have a government from Marisan National,
03:03then we have tried Pakatan Harapan,
03:06and the coalition government, unity government,
03:10although it's for the public to judge their respective, you know,
03:21in terms of how they are doing.
03:25But we can see that there is no radical changes,
03:30structural changes in terms of policy that could be implemented,
03:38because of this kind of reliance on this old kind of politics.
03:43Jack, let me bring you in here as well.
03:46What do you think has been missing from Malaysia's political landscape?
03:49And from Muda's perspective, what gaps were you trying to fill that existing parties were unable to,
03:56or unwilling to address?
03:57From Muda's perspective, or point of view,
04:01we see that some point of lacking is like the idea of how they portray themselves,
04:06especially on how they want to govern, or how they want to bring Malaysia forward,
04:12is quite different compared to the realisation or the actual on the ground.
04:17Because we see that some of the perspective or narrative made by the government itself,
04:25so they said that they want to introduce or they want to be the cleanest government in the world, right?
04:31So, for example, they want to be the whiter than white.
04:34So, they are comparing the values that they are portraying now,
04:40compared to during the election or during the campaign time, it's quite different.
04:44So, that's the one thing that I saw, the major difference that the gap that we are looking at
04:50and the vacuum that we need to address on this issue.
04:53And then, the next point would be on a certain level of working ethics,
04:58I would say that once they are into the government, they are quite relaxed
05:04and also being so comfortable on whatever they have compared to before the reform that they want to make.
05:10And once they are in the office, oh, they said,
05:14maybe we can wait for, I would say like the later or closer to the election date,
05:21only then they want to actually do it.
05:24And then there are two elections, right?
05:25Yeah, that was it.
05:27And then they said, oh, it's okay, we have ample time to do any reforms or any changes that they
05:34want to make now,
05:35or they just have to wait, okay, until there's a moment that they have to do it,
05:40only then they will say, oh, we are going to introduce or we are going to discuss this in the
05:45cabinet.
05:45So that's why I think that's the major vacuum or the major lacking that we are facing right now.
05:51And the cycle continues.
05:53I wouldn't say that only Barisan National or Pakatan Harapan did it,
05:58but then for every single government they are coming into, they have been very comfortable with it.
06:05And they say, oh, maybe we have, or maybe we are not in the position that,
06:13and then maybe we are waiting another time to do it.
06:16Yeah.
06:17And both of your movements emerged from a belief that something needs to change.
06:20But despite calls for reform, political participation remains a challenge among many youth and among many young Malaysians here.
06:28Jack, many young Malaysians say they want to change, but they are not interested in it,
06:33or relative, only a few interested in joining it.
06:36Why do you think that is happening here?
06:38I think the first one would be, I'll categorise it into a few factors,
06:42but then the first one would be on the financial capabilities and also the connection.
06:49I think, you know, the connection they have not only within the party and also the outside of the party,
06:55especially for the support from the grassroots, if you are talking to the political party.
07:00So the first one, if you are saying that, especially for the younger people, right, like,
07:07below 30, so they are also facing with paying loans, especially for PTPTN,
07:13and also just started, they are working, and then maybe their pay grade is not as high compared to our
07:20seniors.
07:21So that would be a challenge, because once you enter the political scene,
07:25you have, like, to be in a certain position that you are sustainable,
07:30and also you are making, like, a good pay grade for you to spend and also for you to expand
07:39your influence.
07:40And then, comparing yourself between your seniors, I think that would be a major challenge,
07:47because they know, let's say, they know the Ketua Jabatan,
07:52and maybe they have, like, a bigger connection with the other parties.
07:57So, comparing us, like, who just started to enter into the political scene,
08:03we are only, maybe we only know our colleagues, I would say,
08:10maybe the same age of us, or maybe some from our own division,
08:14comparing to those that are already established in the party.
08:18Hasik, do you agree with that, or it does have something to do deeper about how politics is practiced today?
08:24I concur with Jack, I think it's given, because many young Malaysians are at the transitional stage at that time.
08:35We are starting a career, starting a bigger commitment, marriage, and also building financial stability.
08:46That is the status quo and the problem that we face on how getting the younger generation actively into politics.
08:56But, as long as the current ordinary political movement revolve around something that the youth could not afford,
09:05So, I think the system actually excluding the youth itself.
09:11As an example, I would say that youth could not afford a political environment that built because of capital,
09:26such as giving handouts, getting support from grassroots leaders so that you can be candidate for party election.
09:35So, if we continue this kind of structural practice in political parties,
09:42so the youth cannot engage actively and seriously in politics.
09:46They cannot be taken seriously in the system.
09:51So, what we need to do is we need to putting priorities on what youth can afford.
10:03As an example, I would say that youth really, really good at digital campaigns.
10:10They can use their social media to do their own campaign at the comfort of their house.
10:17And they can give ideas.
10:19And they are willing to be the volunteers if we set up a system that incentivizes them or acknowledge their
10:32effort.
10:32So, this is something that lacking in the current political parties.
10:38How they put priorities on why we should consider or taking serious on you because of your ideas or your
10:57volunteerism contribution per se?
11:01Or if you have money, then we talk.
11:04And also, one analyst always say that, people always say that, we should move away from the traditional way of
11:13political identities
11:14when it comes to race, religion or perhaps long-standing party loyalties.
11:20Hasik, do you believe that younger voters are becoming less interested in this way of politics, the old traditional ways
11:30of politics, which is race, religion or perhaps identity-based politics?
11:34I think it really depends on how the youth perceive politics.
11:40But, we can allude or make a hypothesis that youth, just like all of us here in this room and
11:51who is watching, they seek politics to solve their daily problem as a simplistic way to think about it.
12:00So, the honest, or to answer your question, whether the younger generation still prefer identity-based and racial-based politics,
12:13the honest is really on the multi-racial and policy-driven political parties.
12:20If they, or the current multi-racial or political parties, fail to convince the youth that they are the way
12:29forward, they can be the problem solver, they can solve their problems structurally, for another 20-30 years of problem,
12:39then the youth may be in another alternative.
12:47Which, it could be said that the race-based or identity-based politics, maybe can be the solution of the
12:56problem that they are facing right now.
12:58So, it's quite tricky. I wouldn't very, you know, can say that, oh, the current younger generation are rejecting all
13:11these kind of politics.
13:12It's really on who can convince them to solve their problems.
13:18Jack, do you agree with that as well? Are we seeing a genuine shift in political behaviour, or do you
13:24think these factors still carry significant influence during elections?
13:27For me, I can say that I'll see two different scenarios on how we are going to see this, I
13:36would say, this scenario.
13:37So, for the first one would be maybe the loudest, maybe you can see from the social media or from
13:43the news itself.
13:44So, that one, I would say that there are a certain group of people that are already literate enough to
13:51differentiate the issues and the identities possessed or brought by those certain parties.
13:57But then, the majority of the people out there are still, I would say, not care enough, but then there
14:07are certain things that are much more into their priorities or much more important to them, especially for the bread
14:13and butter issues.
14:13Because for them, in order for them to think much of a political situation, rather than their own survival, they
14:22have to think on that angle first, rather than, oh, we just keep politicking every single day.
14:27And then, at the end of the day, because they say that politics is just a cycle of the same
14:34or another vehicle for the same type of person, they are just using politics for their own gains.
14:41So, why do they have to bother on that? And because for them, once they have voted the right person
14:48to be your voice, and their responsibility is only up until that.
14:54So, for me, there's a certain type of people. So, in order to answer your question, right, there's two types
15:01of people that we are going to address on this issue.
15:04Whether they are voicing out that we can see on the social media, or they just keep quiet, but they
15:12know what they are going to do or what their thoughts on this, rather than only making a fuss on
15:19certain type of social media or expressing their voice out there.
15:24And also, many new political movements talk about bringing new politics into Malaysia, the phrase new politics. But that phrase
15:32can mean different things to different people.
15:33So, Jack, what does new politics actually mean in practice? What do you think, beyond simply being younger than the
15:41other established political parties?
15:43Yeah. For me, I would say that the young or fresh politics is not only based on their age only,
15:52because that's like a literal meaning of it. But then, for me, there's like two angles on how the politics
15:59should be.
15:59The first one, I would say, I would emphasize is, the way you are going to, like, doing your work
16:06or to be on the ground and meeting up the people and also hearing their voices.
16:11And then, you are the one who carrying their voices and then make sure whether they are heard in the
16:17sidang dun or in the parliament sitting. That's the least that you could do.
16:22And then, another angle of it is the politic khidmat and also politic dasar. So, politic dasar is how you
16:31are going to make sure that the dasar that you meet is not only for yourself, but then also represent
16:40the community that you bring from your kawasan.
16:43So, that's like, so, politic khidmat and politic dasar is, like, have to go hand to hand. So, it's not
16:51just only focusing on politic khidmat and then you're just lacking on politic dasar.
16:55So, on that perspective, I would say that those two key items must work in tandem for you to achieve
17:02the ideal political situation.
17:04Haziq, do you agree with that as well?
17:05Yeah, I concur and if I may add, I think it also needs a fresh approach. Maybe one in terms
17:16of political structure. And secondly, on our offerings to the public.
17:21So, the good example for Bersama, for structure of the party itself. All those, for 70 years, we have political
17:37parties like UMNO and maybe we have PKR and other political parties that have some sort of bureaucratic structure.
17:50that serve for a few political warlords. So, you gain your support through branch, through division, and from that you
18:06can go climb the ladder of the political and political ladder.
18:14So, in terms of structure of the party, it needs to serve the public needs. So, that's why in Bersama
18:22as an example, there is no this kind of division and branch structure.
18:28Because it only, what we call, wujudkan pelobi-pelobi, what we say in Malay. While the communication, the direction must
18:43go straight from the leadership towards the ordinary voters. So, I think that's first.
18:52Secondly, in terms of offering towards public, it must offer a real change and not only cosmetic changes. It must
19:03address structure of the problem and carry out through effective programs.
19:08As an example, I would say, in 10 to 20 years from now, we were facing an aging nation problem.
19:16So, there are so many problems in our nation that intertwined with it.
19:22But we are still in the mood of business as usual right now. We are still, how about the market
19:32forces for the next 20 to 30 years? How are we preparing our elderly care for the elderly people?
19:45So, I think that's why we need to have a better offering in terms of structural changes and problems so
19:56that we can, it is a real changes, not just a cosmetic or just a very impromptu changes.
20:05And, of course, political engagement looks very different compared to the previous generations.
20:11Haziq, like you mentioned before, the youth can now just do campaigns on online, digital.
20:16But, is social media enough to build a lasting political movement, Haziq?
20:22Or, does real influence still depend on perhaps traditional grassroots organizing here?
20:29I think it's improving from time to time. I mean, the digital campaign is, will be the way forward for
20:35us to, in the future.
20:38While we cannot discredit the importance of ground campaign, but the importance of it will be diminished from time to
20:51time. So, it's for us to increase our gear towards digital campaign.
20:58My worry is, for us to be more consistent on our bringing in the social media. So, it is something
21:12very hectic. You are going to war with the people who are playing race-based politics.
21:20So, I think Jack can relate also. It is something horrible. You can see in GE15 campaign, where the race
21:32-based politics really divide us so much.
21:34So, I think the focus should be on digital campaign with right motivation and also right energy to make sure
21:47that our bringings can go all along with so many complicated and sophisticated bringings outside.
21:58Jack, Muda started off quite strong, quite well with the online presence.
22:04But how do you balance digital engagement with the real realities of the on-ground politics?
22:11Okay, for me, the digital influence really shaped us from the very beginning.
22:17Because at first, Muda was registered also through, I think at that time, because of the COVID itself, we managed
22:27to register Muda using only, I would say, Webex, Google Meet,
22:32and whatever online medium that we can have during that time.
22:37So, and also we bring that forward and aspiration because we believe that such influence, especially using social media is
22:46quite important, rather than only for the real influence.
22:50Because I would say that some digital campaigns also penetrates to a wider audience that not only for Muda members,
23:02but then it also spreads across the nation.
23:04Because I believe that for now, looking at the data, because comparing from the last two general elections, more people
23:14are invested in campaign, I would say, using TikTok Live, FB Live.
23:22Because for them, to reach out or to hear the news or to hear the manifestos portrayed by the political
23:31parties, they can hear from the TikTok Live.
23:36And comparing, they have to be present because at the end of the day, it's just the same because you
23:40need to deliver the information that you want to project out to the people.
23:46And then, by the time you are receiving the information, I think that you can receive a lot of information
23:54at your own convenience, rather than you have to be present.
23:58And the next one would be, I would say, the importance of social media is because you want to not
24:07only penetrate your bigger audience, but then you have to be known because at the end of the day, the
24:16personality plays an important role for you to how you project yourself in the public.
24:24For example, I think, some, in my own case, right, I would say that people know me more in social
24:32media.
24:32And once I go out, they just say, not only from moi, or whether they are Moodle members or not,
24:38they just say, oh, thank you for bringing out this issue because I saw from, maybe from your posting or
24:45from your life, you are talking about the same issue.
24:47And then, they can relate it to their own story.
24:52So, from that angle, I believe that digital influence are quite important because for you to be seen and for
25:02you to be trusted enough from the audience, right, you have to be present and then you have to be
25:08presentable to the people.
25:09All right, before we conclude, we just have one minute or two, three minutes left.
25:13I'd like to step back from parties and elections so that we can focus more on the broader civic participation.
25:19Ami, if a young Malaysian watching today feels like they're disillusioned from politics, what would you say to convince them
25:26that political participation still matters today?
25:30So, my message for the youngsters out there would be pick the right candidates or wakil raya that you are
25:40going to choose for you to bring your voice out there because I believe the right person will remain true
25:47to their principle and also, at the end of the day, they are going to bring your voice and they
25:52are going to govern this nation.
25:55So, in order for us to move forward in a better way, try to move from a political-based identity
26:07and focus more on what issues they are going to bring.
26:11And if you are confident enough that that is the right person for you to vote in, that's the right
26:17way for you to do it.
26:18Hazik, what would your message mean?
26:20I would say we may try new things, which is different from any other political parties.
26:27For the past 70 years, we have tried Barisan National, Pakatan Harapan and also Unity Government.
26:34But don't get me wrong, the performance of each government is for the public to judge.
26:43But more or less, we will say that they are the same in terms of how they, you know, how
26:53they respond to dissenting opinions, how they deal with our every single structural problem.
27:00So, it doesn't harm to try another new political parties.
27:07And maybe it's time for me to promote because after all, Bersama is a political start-up.
27:17It brings a very fresh and new approach, represent the intersection of technology, data analytics, and civic engagement.
27:28And also, we aim to modernizing political campaigns and democratizing grassroots participation.
27:38And secondly, we are trying the new approach on going into election by not having any pre-election coalition.
27:49So, this is something that may be quite new for the nation's political landscape.
27:58And I would say that, after all, trying the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result
28:06is quite illogical.
28:08So, I think as a young nation of democracy for Malaysia, it is no harm to try for Bersama.
28:17All right. That was Haziq Asfar from Parti Bersama Malaysia and also Amir Fikri from Muda.
28:22A discussion on whether new political movements can offer genuine alternatives.
28:27How young Malaysians are engaging with politics today as well.
28:31I guess that's all the time that we have for today's episode of It's About You.
28:35I'm Amir Rahman. Thank you for watching. Good night.
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