- 10 hours ago
Red Sox radio voice, Will Flemming joins Rich and Ken to talk about the changes at manager, ownership, and fan protests.
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00:001-2, Sadon drives one, high and deep into left field, it is back, it is gone!
00:09Sadon, say goodbye, a bomb, a two-run shot, and the Red Sox lead it 3-1.
00:20Two hosts and an enforcer, it's Rich and Ken with Ted Johnson.
00:31You know why Will Fleming is one of the best in the business?
00:35It's because he doesn't fake it.
00:37When he's pissed off, you can hear it in his voice.
00:40And last night was sweet release, as you heard in that clip right there.
00:45After day after day of just people showing up at the park wearing bags on their head
00:50and just awful baseball with people being left on base.
00:55Guys, I swear to you, those clips we were playing, I actually started to feel bad for Will.
01:00And joining us right now, right here on the hotline, we've got the great Will Fleming,
01:05who does all the calls here on WEI.
01:08Will, I gotta be honest, I started feeling for you.
01:11I almost wanted to send you like a Vermont teddy bear or something.
01:14It was getting a little depressing, to be quite honest.
01:19I must be doing something wrong.
01:20First of all, Rich, welcome to the station.
01:22And I would hope that over time you are able to emote the same way that I am,
01:26how annoyed you are with Ken and with Ted.
01:28He does that daily.
01:29I've already been there.
01:30I'm holding in a lot of rage.
01:32It will pop out one moment when nobody is expecting it.
01:35So, Will, this has been like a wild month.
01:39I mean, ever since the Alex Cora thing went down, being in the booth and being around the team,
01:44what has it been like just watching how this team has tried to navigate their way through
01:50such a weird period of time for these guys?
01:53It's been really wild, I will tell you that.
01:55I mean, it's just a totally different experience.
01:57I remember the day after it happened when the Red Sox fire half their staff,
02:04and you're standing around the cage talking to Roman Anthony,
02:06and you look over and you see six coaches you've never met before.
02:10I mean, I know Chad Epperson really well.
02:12I've been around him through his tours in the minor leagues,
02:15but all these young hitting coaches, players, and coaches are trying to learn a new staff
02:20and a new group and a new program all over again.
02:22So, it's been totally different.
02:24And listen, we had Trevor's story on last night, and he didn't come out and say it,
02:29but I do think it's worth kind of reflecting on the idea that it was incredibly –
02:35I mean, it's gutsy, and Craig Breslow, you know, had the idea that this was the way to save this
02:40season.
02:41And that may – the jury's still out on that, right?
02:44I mean, the results will be proven on that.
02:46But it is an unprecedented thing in midstream of a season to just say to all your players
02:53who've spent months and years with the staff to just say,
02:57we're starting over, and here are a bunch of guys really very few of you know at all,
03:01and they don't know you, and they don't know your routines.
03:03So, you know, we all develop such great relationships with Alex Cora
03:09and with Jason Veritek and with Pete Fatsy and with Kyle Hudson
03:13and all of those guys that it was just kind of bizarre to be a part of it.
03:18And now it's two years running where something like that has happened.
03:21I mean, last year on the plane to Seattle when Devers gets traded,
03:24everybody's just kind of like stopped dead in their tracks.
03:28So it's clearly a mark of this administration, for lack of a better term.
03:34They are not afraid to make bold moves, and we'll see whether this one truly pans out.
03:39Okay, now speaking of that, bold moves.
03:41My man Rich here is not buying that Breslow will do something bold
03:44to add some offense to this lineup.
03:47And you mentioned Devers.
03:48He was bold there.
03:48He's been bold with Crochet.
03:49Jay, he's had a couple of bold moments.
03:52Can you convince Rich that something is going to happen in the next few months,
03:55trade-wise?
03:56No, I can't.
03:57Come on.
03:58Suck it, Ken!
03:59I mean, I hope so, right?
04:01But, I mean, how can you ever be certain about anything?
04:03I would say, Ken, that right now baseball is such a different game
04:07where these modern GMs all feel sort of the same way.
04:12And I feel like the way the game works nowadays, the biggest and most impactful deals happen
04:18in the offseason because there's more time.
04:21I feel like these guys nowadays need 55 phone calls to make something happen.
04:27And when it's pressurized and the deadline is creeping up on you,
04:31the other thing you have to remember is there are more teams in it nowadays.
04:35And everybody feels like they're within – look at the Red Sox.
04:38Everybody's within, like, three games of a playoff spot in the American League.
04:42So there's fewer teams that are willing to just move parts and sell off and make deals.
04:46And I think that this new wave of baseball executives, they're so reluctant to trade prospects.
04:54And I'll use the word overvalue.
04:57I mean, that's just my personal opinion.
04:59I think the modern GM is too reluctant to trade away guys with promise for proven commodities.
05:06And sometimes that works out.
05:08I think most of the time it does not.
05:09But I just think it's much, much, much harder nowadays to make huge, you know, blockbuster deals at the deadline.
05:17Will, with this team, is there value in protest?
05:20And what I mean by that is this seems like an ownership that does not like the perception of people
05:27wearing bags over their head on television,
05:30like, you know, taking up half the screen like they were the other night.
05:34I know that there was this shot of John Henry who's listening to the crowd,
05:38and you could read his lips saying, oh, they're saying sell the team.
05:40And then almost immediately after that, that's when Alex Cora was like, oh, it does seem that that's something they
05:46respond to.
05:47Is there value in protest by fans when they don't like the product they see?
05:51Fans can do whatever they want, right?
05:53I mean, they pay the ticket price.
05:55They come in here and they pay for parking and concessions.
05:57I think those shots are so overblown.
05:59I mean, I'm around John Henry a lot.
06:02Yeah.
06:03And that's just kind of what he looks like a lot of the time.
06:05And so I think it's really easy on social media to sort of like, you know, Photoshop, not even Photoshop,
06:12but you know what I mean?
06:12Like just to clip things together and say, oh, my God, because the fans are doing this, he looks like
06:17this.
06:17And that's the reason.
06:19I just don't think that the two are connected at all.
06:21I would tell you that John and Tom and Mike and everybody who owns the team, whether or not you
06:28agree with the decisions they've made and look, they are wide open to the idea that there are missteps and
06:34they want this passionate fan base to engage in that.
06:37I don't think that the narrative that somehow they're not involved, they don't care, they're not engaged.
06:46That's just ludicrous.
06:47I mean, think about what they've done.
06:48They just fired the manager and an all-time franchise legend in Jason Veritek.
06:53Like clearly they're paying attention.
06:55John flew to Kansas City last year, point blank, asked Rafi Devers to play first base.
07:00Rafi said no.
07:01And he said, OK, you're not going to be here much longer.
07:04So I would not read too much into those video shots, those clips.
07:12Look, they don't need to hear the fans say it.
07:15They don't need the fans to chant anything to know how unhappy everybody here is.
07:20I would say that I think that the more the Red Sox don't get it on track, don't get it
07:26going, it's probably likelier that massive change is coming.
07:30And again, I've said this like a hundred times, and I really believe it.
07:34I think the job of any great owner is to hire people to run your sport operation.
07:41You just totally empower them.
07:42And you say, all right, whatever you say, whatever contracts you want to sign, we'll do that.
07:46Whatever trades you want to make, we'll do that.
07:48What staff you want to have, we're going to do that.
07:50And I definitely think that's what John and Tom have done here.
07:53And so now it's totally Craig Breslow on the line.
07:56So that, to me, is the more interesting question, whether, you know, Craig, who is so steadfast in his belief
08:03about what this roster can be, what the path forward is for this team.
08:09Look, the pitching and defense, they got that right.
08:11I mean, the pitching has started to get much better.
08:13The defense has been phenomenal.
08:15But the question becomes, do they have enough hitters?
08:18And did they misread that part of it?
08:20Did they get enough hitters?
08:22That remains to be seen.
08:25And to me, if you're in John's office right now and asking him straight up, he wants to see that
08:31come to fruition.
08:32And if not, I think, Craig, you know, he's very much like everybody who works for this organization, whether you're
08:38a player, a broadcaster, a manager, every day, everybody's job is being evaluated.
08:44Okay, so, Will, I'm just going to respond to two things to what you just said, because, you know, you
08:49mentioned that you do believe that ownership cares.
08:52The problem is, and you may be right, but the problem is the reception or the perception by the fans
08:57is that here's a guy that doesn't even speak to the media.
09:01I don't think he spoke to the media since the Mookie Betts trade.
09:04And that, if you're a fan, immediately makes you think, well, this guy obviously doesn't want to take any accountability
09:12for what's happening.
09:14You know, at least just get out there and say, this is not good enough.
09:17We, you know, we truly care.
09:19But out of his own mouth, you understand the perception that that gives the fans when he doesn't do it.
09:24You may be right.
09:24He might care his heart out.
09:26He might be the freaking care bearer for all I know.
09:28But this, but he doesn't speak to the media.
09:30So, what am I supposed to think as a fan when he doesn't make a statement about how unacceptable this
09:36all is?
09:37So, Rich, you think if he sat there and stood on a dais that that would change how much he
09:42really cares about this franchise?
09:44I don't.
09:44I think it would change people's perception.
09:46I absolutely do.
09:47Because what do you want to hear when someone blows a game?
09:49You want to hear somebody go, man, I stunk tonight.
09:53I got to do better.
09:54This one's on me.
09:55It just, it makes you feel that they actually understand the gravity of what's happening.
10:01And I just, there needs to be some sort of accountability.
10:04And so, yes, my answer is, is him standing in a dais going to make me think that he cares
10:08more?
10:09Absolutely.
10:10I don't think he cares about that at all.
10:12And I don't think he should care, frankly.
10:13I mean, look, if I were the owner of a team, I would speak.
10:16But I'm not, right?
10:18And I just think, here's the real bottom line for me, is that Boston is such a unique, crazy, special,
10:28passionate market.
10:29And people care so much about everything that goes right and that goes wrong.
10:33I think the world we live in today, everything you say, good, bad, or otherwise, gets totally spun and taken
10:40out of context.
10:41And I think, John, and all of us have had so many experiences where whatever you say is just going
10:48to be a news cycle for two, three weeks.
10:51And I don't understand why that matters so much to people.
10:57People should care about whether the team wins or not, period.
11:00That's it.
11:00Well, they're not winning.
11:01So that's why we care about the owner saying, well, this is unacceptable to us.
11:06And that's it, Will.
11:07And as I said, he may have the biggest heart in the world, and he might truly care.
11:12But it does go a long way.
11:13And, Will, that's just coming from a guy who takes calls and listens to people.
11:16And this is what they care about.
11:18And you're so right.
11:20You speak, and people twist it, and they clip it.
11:23And God knows that's our industry.
11:24We, like, try to, like, the whole Jalen Brown, Jason, what are they really saying?
11:28But you know what?
11:29You know what it stops?
11:30It stops people saying, well, that guy doesn't care because he doesn't speak.
11:34At least you can say, well, at least he spoke.
11:36And it might be, like, weird what he said.
11:38But at least he's addressing the media when things go bad.
11:42And I understand what you're saying, Will.
11:43I do.
11:44I do.
11:44But I'm just telling you how I feel and what a lot of people who are fans of this team
11:49feel.
11:50That's why you're getting paid the big bucks.
11:51To express your opinion.
11:53That's right.
11:53That's right.
11:53That's right.
11:54But, okay, on another side of things.
11:56So I like, obviously, what I saw last night.
11:58That was a fun, gritty win.
12:00I agree with you 100%.
12:01The pitching is back and back.
12:03It's just the pitching seems to be consistent.
12:05And you're right.
12:06That's exactly what we wanted at the beginning of the season.
12:08And they did deliver on that promise, at least up to this point.
12:11I like what I'm seeing with all these guys.
12:13Is there any hope that you have for the offense to continue?
12:17You know, I mean, what did you just say earlier?
12:19It's like they've, they've, there's, they have, when's the last time they hit over three
12:22runs or whatever?
12:23Well, no, the record, Lou had retweeted this, 14 and three, when scoring three runs or more
12:27in the last 17.
12:28Oh, okay.
12:28It's amazing.
12:29Yeah.
12:29It is strange.
12:30So, I mean, do you have any hope for this offense?
12:32Well, they need Roman to get back.
12:34They need Contreras to get hot again.
12:36They need Duran and Story to become the players that they've been in their whole careers.
12:40That's just the bottom line.
12:41Look, I, I said it in the off season.
12:43I said it on opening day.
12:44I've said it every time anybody's asked me about this.
12:46Would I have gone and got another couple proven hitters?
12:49Yes, I would have.
12:50I mean, I don't think anybody who pays attention to this team has sort of a different opinion
12:54of that.
12:55And again, it comes down to results.
12:57This is what this front office chose to do.
13:01And I, it is, there are many nights.
13:04What is it now?
13:0511 times that they've not scored more than one run, one or no runs in 11 games.
13:11I mean, the Red Sox have played 42 games.
13:14So that part of it has been really hard to watch.
13:17Now, I thought Chad Tracy was great.
13:20Uh, on the Greg Hill morning show today.
13:22He was, yep.
13:23We, we've gotten to know him very well.
13:25He's, he's seems to be really settling in and a great baseball man.
13:28What he said, I think is what Craig Breslow has to rely upon in, in lieu of some major
13:35splash move.
13:37And that is not everyone on the roster can stay where they are right now, where they're
13:43just way off what they've been in their career as hitters.
13:46And again, unfair or not, like it, to me, it is Duran and story.
13:51These are the guys who have proven track records who've been in the big leagues for years and
13:54years.
13:54I would say that one thing, if I were to quibble with, you know, sort of the, the projection
14:01of this team is that you can tell me all the models you want.
14:05It's very hard to project and predict what a first or second or third year player is going
14:10to do.
14:11Yep.
14:11And I think there was a lot of weight put on this offense into guys who just don't yet
14:17have a huge track record, uh, of doing it at the big league level.
14:21So it's a long season.
14:23Maybe they turn the corner.
14:24Maybe guys like Caleb Durbin really, you know, figure it out and, and start to hit, but there's
14:29just a lot of young guys who've not done it before.
14:32And it's really hard to, to depend a lot on that.
14:34Well, Durbin's at one 65 wheel.
14:36I know they've dropped him down to the order, but how much longer can they keep putting them
14:39out there?
14:39Don't they have a plan B at third?
14:41The problem is he's been awesome at third base, right?
14:44And, and like, if you were a rolling offense and let's say the Red Sox averaged five runs
14:51a game, he'd be in there every day.
14:53No doubt.
14:53Nobody care about it at all.
14:55I'm not saying he's Dustin Pedroia.
14:56We all know he's not Dustin Pedroia, but it's the same general idea, right?
15:00Where if you just play defense, you're okay, kid, just stay there.
15:04And I'm telling you, watching every pitch and every inning and every game, Caleb Durbin has
15:08played a gold glove third base.
15:10He has.
15:10And that is valuable.
15:13The bat is not even close.
15:15And I, he had big hits in the playoffs last year against the LA Dodgers.
15:19He does seem to, to kind of have a little clutch in him based on what he did with the
15:24Brewers.
15:25But I, you know, I, it's hard, Ken, to, to say like, what would be the plan B because
15:30it's sort of like addition by subtraction kind of what we're like, what are you going
15:35to, there's nobody down in the minor leagues right now that is like, if Nick Sogard comes
15:39up, is that a net positive?
15:41I don't think so.
15:42I mean, Durbin's defense has been so very good.
15:46And again, I, it just comes back to what they planned for and sort of modeled in this off
15:52season.
15:52They need Durbin to be the hitter that they thought he could be.
15:57And he needs to, I think personally, and I think Will and Lou and Lenny have been right
16:03with me on this.
16:04He's trying to hit too many home runs.
16:05I mean, there's just so much pull side, you know, launch angle stuff from Caleb Durbin.
16:11That's not who he is.
16:12He's not been that guy in his career.
16:14So I'd like to see him try to maybe go the other way.
16:17A few more line drives, maybe lay down a bunt here and there.
16:19I thought the other night in the eighth inning or ninth inning, whatever it was, when he
16:22didn't bunt, that was absurd for me when he didn't square and move the runner up after
16:28in a one run game to get the tying run at first base.
16:31So we'll see what the adjustments are there.
16:35But he's been so good at third base, I don't think right now in the minor leagues, barring
16:41a trade that there's anybody who would net net be a better choice.
16:45So will they play in this game tonight or not?
16:47Oh, God, who knows?
16:48I mean, it's been off and on.
16:50I woke up this morning thinking no chance.
16:52I thought we'd be on an airplane in like an hour.
16:55But, you know, this is one of those problems with the balanced schedule and with all these
16:59National League teams coming in here.
17:01You play them once a year.
17:03There are mutual off days that could totally work in June and July for the Phillies to
17:08come back here.
17:09I think we're learning that Major League Baseball is super reluctant to try to do that.
17:14One of the weird things about this new CBA is that the season starts earlier, ends later,
17:19and there are many more off days.
17:21And I think the players union and all these team reps value those off days like gold.
17:26And so when baseball and the Red Sox and the Phillies are talking about what to do tonight,
17:31I'm pretty sure that both reps are like, we're not giving up an off day on pick a date, June
17:3611th
17:36or whatever that is.
17:37But to me, sometimes, you know, cooler heads need to prevail.
17:41Like, what would the Phillies rather do?
17:44Get on an airplane, get out of town and come back here in a few weeks when it's not a
17:47big deal
17:48or sit here for six hours and then maybe not even play tonight.
17:52So who knows?
17:53It's a tough call.
17:54I'm not saying these things are black and white.
17:56But what are we going to start at 945 and get to Atlanta at 7 a.m.?
18:01I just don't think that's good for anybody.
18:02That's what the forecast looks like, by the way.
18:04I don't think the rain stops until 945 from what I'm seeing.
18:07Arkan, get loose.
18:08There you go.
18:09Arkan is just, he's doing the throat coat tee and he's got lozenges and everything.
18:13He's ready to roll.
18:14Absolutely.
18:15Well, Will, listen, if they do end up playing, hopefully you'll sound as excited as you were yesterday
18:20because it really sounded like a man who would bust it out of prison.
18:23Please.
18:23I say this all the time and I mean this.
18:26Like, I don't, I'm not going to change who I am.
18:28Like, I don't, I, I, I, I'm thrilled when they win.
18:32I'm not that pleased when they don't.
18:33And that's just, that's just the way I do it.
18:36I'm sorry if that offends your sensibilities.
18:38No, that's my thing.
18:40As a matter of fact, I praised you when you weren't even on here.
18:42I was like, I love that Will doesn't fake it.
18:44It's like, he's kind of like the voice of the fan.
18:46Like, I'm pissed off when that happens.
18:47I'm more than pissed off.
18:49I'm just like disappointed.
18:50And that's kind of what he's there.
18:51It's just like, oh boy, here we go.
18:52You know, the truth of the batter too is, and I have to tell you this, this is the God's
18:56honest truth.
18:57It's just a different thing when you're around the people who do it every day.
19:01I can see that.
19:02You got to look them in the face.
19:04Relationships with these people and I want them to succeed.
19:06And if I'm ever frustrated, it's because I want them to do well.
19:10And I see the work that they put in before games and after games and all that stuff.
19:13So, um, I'm psyched when they win.
19:16And, uh, sometimes I, I may back come off as a little bit, uh, a little bit down.
19:22I want them to win too, because it helps our ratings.
19:25All right.
19:25We'll doubt about it.
19:26Great stuff.
19:27Uh, we'll, we'll, uh, continue to talk to you.
19:28And as I said, hopefully we get a game in, we shall see.
19:32But, uh, nonetheless, hopefully you're not, um, like running to the airport at the, I
19:37don't know when that game would end if they started at nine o'clock or whenever it's going
19:40to be.
19:40This is ridiculous.
19:41I'm going to take a lot of North shore adult diapers and take them onto the tarp and dry
19:45off the field.
19:46You know, that is a, that is a plan.
19:47All right.
19:47Well, Fleming, thanks for coming on.
19:49Love you guys.
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