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00:00:00another winter meetings has come and gone and Mets fans are left asking the same exact question
00:00:09that they always have been what exactly is the plan Edwin Diaz is gone Pete Alonso is also gone
00:00:16Jorge Polanco is now in and across Queens the reaction is swung from confusion to frustration
00:00:23to full-blown panic that's what it is right now so this week we're going to try to answer the
00:00:29only question that matters right now to Mets fans where do the Mets go from here and we've got a
00:00:36couple of guests this week to help answer the questions that every Mets fan is asking right now
00:00:42so let's get right to it this is straight out of fleshing
00:00:46okay so we need a serious breakdown of what I would say is the roughest or at least one of the
00:00:55roughest weeks in Mets franchise history it's a week where we saw Edwin Diaz leave we saw Pete Alonso
00:01:00both of them walk straight out of fleshing yes I decided to use that there so to break this all
00:01:05down joining me is somebody who is well-versed in the highs and the lows of this team and Mets fandom
00:01:13his name is Andrew Claudio he is the co-host of the Just Mets podcast and he joins me now
00:01:18Andrew after a rough week how you doing man I'm managing Dexter I think time heals and some
00:01:27context and some rational thought also helps understanding that the offseason didn't end
00:01:34this week just the tenure of two beloved Mets did end so I'm doing well how are you on that on those
00:01:41fronts I'm doing okay I felt a little better for people who missed it I was a guest on the
00:01:47Just Mets podcast just a few days ago and uh Andrew and I talked through some things then
00:01:51and we're gonna try to talk through some things now so I I'm doing okay I'm still trying to
00:01:56process still trying to make sense of some things I feel like you're gonna be able to help me too
00:02:01so hopefully I hope that I'll just say this the dark places I had gone to the other day
00:02:07I've gotten I've come out I'm out the other come out the dark places okay I'm able to see the light
00:02:12if there is one okay good you're not taking any more darkness retreats you just you're in the
00:02:17no no I'm now not worried that Soto's opt-out in five years will be David Stern's get out of jail
00:02:23free card that he will just look at that as like oh fine opt out please I don't want another 10 years
00:02:28on your contract anyway I'm I'm back to to somewhat rational thought now okay all right so since we're
00:02:35back to rational thought and I I think for this segmented episode we should try to employ some
00:02:42rational thought here so here's what we're gonna do we're gonna try to have a discussion rationally
00:02:45about what has happened and then also where the Mets can go from here right so Andrew I guess from
00:02:51your perspective when when you've thought about this you've had a couple of days to sit with this now
00:02:55what does it mean when a franchise lets two of their cornerstone players who are extremely popular
00:03:04with the fan base walk during the same winter meetings because that is what happened here with
00:03:09the Mets what does that mean for the Mets the fans their fan base what does it all mean so I I do think
00:03:16they were a victim of of timing just being awful that it does appear that they did want to bring
00:03:22Diaz back and then Alonzo got the offer that he did the day after they lost Edwin Diaz so it happening
00:03:31in back-to-back days in the span of almost identical time of day too like bam it happens on Wednesday
00:03:38bam it happens on Tuesday um I don't think they planned it that way for them to lose both Diaz and
00:03:44Alonzo in back-to-back uh days but I think for me in the readjustment of expectations about this
00:03:52offseason it's really that this is now David Stern's team the keys have been completely surrendered over to
00:03:59him there are no sacred cows no matter how long you've been with the organization no matter what
00:04:04moments you've had for the organization no matter how high your jersey sales are he's going to build
00:04:09this team however he wants it and in the vision that he believes will be the best for the team
00:04:15going forward and I think that's up to every Mets fan to decide whether that's a good or a bad thing
00:04:20but make no mistake the future of this team will now be put together by David Sterns and how he wants
00:04:26it to be yeah and we'll get to more of this a little bit later and the Steve Cohen-ness of it
00:04:31all too and obviously you want your ownership I think fans want their owners to let the people that
00:04:36whether it's any sport basketball baseball football whatever it may be let those people do those things
00:04:42but I want to go back to Pete for a second because there were multiple reports that the Mets never gave
00:04:49Pete or made him a formal offer how do you interpret that was it you know philosophical
00:04:56financial or simply a little bit of what you just alluded to in the last question that this is just
00:05:01Sterns looking at his evaluation Pete Alonzo does not fit the way he wants to build this team is it
00:05:07simply just that is it money what what did you make of of all that with the Mets not giving him an offer
00:05:12bit of a cop-out here for my answer here Dex it's all three it's it's a philosophical which is true
00:05:19it can be that it can be that it's it's a philosophical evaluation of where he was willing
00:05:24to go financially you know um he I think we could have said this last year that he did not want to
00:05:31bring Pete Alonzo back at a certain number and that was off a bad year and then off a good year when
00:05:36the market was a little more robust for Pete Alonzo he clearly had an evaluation that he was not
00:05:43willing to go outside of and if it wasn't for him waiting out the market last year for it to
00:05:51be possible for Pete to come back on a one-year deal where he was able to get him on the contract
00:05:56that made him more comfortable and I think this to your first question like also goes back to the
00:06:02no sacred cows thing this wasn't Pete Alonzo Mets cornerstone like guy that hit the home run against
00:06:08Milwaukee fan favorite all-time franchise home run leader this was in his evaluation a defensively
00:06:16challenged first baseman that his game is predicated on power and power usually goes away in your 30s and
00:06:23he was not willing to give that evaluation the evaluation of that player a five-year deal and
00:06:29there I think there's like that's a fair evaluation to be honest even though again the the payroll
00:06:35restrictions that I think there are a bit self-imposed bother me a little bit but on it in a vacuum and on
00:06:41its face I can at least understand the evaluation being what it is even if I think Pete Alonzo is a
00:06:48little more valuable than just what he is or isn't defensively so I just I look at it as it's all the
00:06:54above a philosophical thing he believes in that allowed him to let Pete Alonzo go to a place
00:07:03financially in the market that he wasn't willing to go to and it's fair and I think you and I would
00:07:09both agree that Pete Alonzo was limited in certain aspects as a player so I can understand that
00:07:16evaluation and I'll get more into this later in episode but fans are on the other side again say well
00:07:21he meant something to us he meant something more to this organization he is the team's all-time
00:07:27leader in home runs and all that stuff on one hand I kind of respect Stearns for not necessarily
00:07:34having the sentimentality here and doing what he necessarily will think is best I think there's got
00:07:41to be a balance with that but we'll get into that a little bit later so when you come back to Stearns
00:07:46right and and I thought about limiting this to this year in 2025 and looking at the last six months
00:07:52and going back to the trade deadline and all that but if you really even go back to last offseason if
00:07:57we really take that whole evaluation too right he's had a lot of restraint that's the word I will use to
00:08:06be sort of nice here right um he's had a lot of restraint right what does that tell you about his
00:08:13long-term roster building plan that he's got to is it restraint or is it another r word that I've
00:08:19been using in these conversations is it rigidity how do how do you like to look at this so I think
00:08:26restraint is the is the word um the the athletic used the word the mess will be disciplined in their
00:08:32approach this offseason and look five words I just haven't said a lot over the past seven days
00:08:39to give David Stearns credit um he does have a track record of building the infrastructure of
00:08:46organizations it's what he did with Milwaukee it's what he did in a lesser role in Houston and it's
00:08:51what he's done with the Mets so far in helping build out their farm system it's why it's so highly
00:08:58regarded even though he's only been here for two years what he's been doing level by level within the
00:09:03farm system is building um good habits like you're seeing third and fourth round picks now being
00:09:09highly regarded uh within the organization what that means from a free agency standpoint I actually
00:09:16don't think you need to just stop it last year Dexter during his time in Milwaukee uh combining it with
00:09:21the Mets he has given out a contract more than three years in his in his entire tenure uh only four
00:09:28times two of those were extensions to Freddy Peralta and Christian Yellich one was a signing of Lorenzo
00:09:34Kane and one was Juan Soto that I think you and I both agree Steve Cohen had much more to do with that
00:09:39than David Stearns did so look I do think he is really good at establishing the infrastructure of an
00:09:46organization you know you know I come from the basketball world what I always appreciated about Tom
00:09:52Thibodeau was the yes his rigidity which is why I think it's a fascinating comparison but the floor
00:09:58that he established with the Knicks and like they they might not be as high as you want them to be
00:10:03but they definitely won't go any lower than a place that they haven't been uh for the majority of this
00:10:09century and like I always appreciated the floor that Tom Thibodeau established with the Knicks even
00:10:15though they eventually decided they needed to explore a different ceiling with David Stearns he he's now in
00:10:21charge of a franchise that's made the playoffs in back-to-back years exactly twice in their franchise
00:10:27history I I will understand if he's able to build a Brewers-like floor with the Mets and Steve Cohen
00:10:34calls that a success I do think there will come a time that he has to turn the Mets from a playoff
00:10:39contender into a championship contender which will force him to go out of his comfort zone financially
00:10:44but for now I want to give him at least that benefit of the doubt that he's trying to establish a
00:10:50floor with his rigidity and with his discipline and we'll see if uh it eventually leads to to
00:10:57sustained success for a franchise that hasn't always been able to say they've had that see
00:11:01you're you're being very I think rational and logical here and you're trying and I think some
00:11:08Mets fans are going to hear that and say no forget that you said you wanted to be the Dodgers you
00:11:13wanted to be the Dodgers East we're trying to win championships now the Dodgers went better Edwin
00:11:17Diaz just joined the Dodgers there's good and I understand I want to say I understand that emotion
00:11:22I do I really do understand that emotion here and I'm gonna put a pin in what you just said there
00:11:30because I thought it was really good but I want to take that to Edwin Diaz now because we just talked
00:11:35about Pete how should fans interpret the decision to let Edwin Diaz leave and I think you and I we
00:11:40talked about this on your show I thought Diaz was the more important of the two between him and
00:11:46Pete Alonzo to bring back I really felt that way going into the season I know there are others who
00:11:51felt that way too but when you look at the decision to let Edwin Diaz leave and I use the word decision
00:11:57there very strongly because it felt like they they could have had him if they wanted to it at least
00:12:05appears that way right from all the reporting and everything so when I look at that my question here is
00:12:10Andrew was this simply risk management and and not wanting to pay him the amount that he wanted
00:12:17because he got less years than we thought a lot of people thought he was going to get five years he
00:12:21did not get that from the Dodgers right so you didn't have to worry about maybe the back end of
00:12:25that contract looking as bad as you thought it might have um so was it simply risk management based on the
00:12:31contract type or is it just a signal that Stearns does not value the closer position in the same way
00:12:39that the prior regime before him did how do you view Diaz walking away how should fans view it I guess
00:12:46rationally we use that word again how should fans view this rationally that's my question
00:12:51I gotta be honest this isn't the one to be rational about because okay if it was like Pete Alonso just
00:12:57the philosophical difference of evaluation where I evaluate him or you evaluate him higher or
00:13:04differently than David Stearns we could just agree to disagree on the evaluation right I think they
00:13:10valued Diaz to a certain level I think they wanted to bring him back I think they wanted to pay him
00:13:15more I think they were willing to go to a fourth year and give him what they want I think you can
00:13:20actually blame him and criticize him for how he handled the negotiations you walked in with a low ball
00:13:26offer that was just 15 million dollars more than the failed closer of the Yankees that you just
00:13:32signed and look they didn't owe Diaz a phone call I actually don't blame the Mets for not calling him
00:13:38and saying we're signing Devin Williams but when Diaz sees that and the offer you've given me is just 15
00:13:44million dollars more after what I've been able to establish in the closer position for your franchise
00:13:49I'm going to be a little offended and when the World Series champs of the back of back-to-back years
00:13:55are now available and now looking for a closer and are now looking to me to be the the new closer for
00:14:02their team they're a more attractive destination Dexter and we talked about this on Just Mets the
00:14:08other day when you're dating someone when you're courting someone you want to take them to the nicest
00:14:14restaurants you want to do favors for them you want to clean and cook and do things to show you matter
00:14:20to me and I want to commit to you long term you will not have any doubt in in your mind where my
00:14:27commitments are what where you stand on the priority chart um the Baltimore Orioles did that for Pete
00:14:33Alonzo they didn't have to go to four years for Pete they and then they went five to Pete like
00:14:38apparently Pete Alonzo's market was the Mets for probably a dollar um the uh Boston Red Sox and Cubs
00:14:47it's been reported that they were willing to go for for three years uh and look maybe the Mets were
00:14:51willing to do a similar one plus one or maybe a two to three year deal but then the Orioles saw that
00:14:57and said here's five years Pete we want you and Pete clearly read that by how they prioritized him
00:15:05if the Mets wanted Edwin Diaz I'm confident they would have Edwin Diaz they went in with a certain
00:15:12offer that allowed a more attractive suitor to enter the negotiations I don't blame Edwin Diaz for
00:15:19seeing where the Mets were last year compared to the Dodgers were last year and seeing the offers
00:15:24being that close and deciding to go to a much better situation oh yeah I think if you're I agree
00:15:31with you this is the one you cannot be you don't have to be rational on but if you're going to be
00:15:35rational about it in the way you just said you can't really be mad at Edwin Diaz for choosing the
00:15:39Dodgers right and I will use the same analogy that I used on your show I agree with you on the wine
00:15:44and dining when you want to court somebody you got to let them know what time it is you can't be
00:15:48taking them to Applebee's nope and and David Stearns came with the Applebee's offer and Edwin Diaz was
00:15:54like I'm better than Applebee's and he's right he's he's absolutely right here and it's almost like
00:16:02he's saying go go enjoy your Applebee's closer at this point you know the no disrespect to Devin
00:16:07Williams but again to your point if if they wanted Edwin Diaz they would have given him a four seasons
00:16:14offer right away it would have made it clear this is how we evaluate this is how we value you and to
00:16:21what we've been talking about I think there was a a comfort level he was willing that David Stearns
00:16:27was willing to negotiate with and he didn't go outside it initially maybe he was prepared to go to
00:16:33it after negotiations but got caught with his pants down a little bit and saw that the Dodgers
00:16:40enter negotiations and now he's a Dodger now he is a Dodger Mets fans if you're upset about that I
00:16:46completely understand why now and real quick yes no please go ahead are upset about this because I
00:16:53don't want to sound like just the only rational person like that I'm just trying to talk rationally
00:16:57here I walked into my wedding reception to Narcos like the Edwin Diaz walk-up means something to me
00:17:04personally I was so annoyed on Tuesday I I blame Stearns for it I don't this isn't like a try to
00:17:13rationalize that Diaz left because he didn't want to be here why didn't he want to be here that's the
00:17:17that's the question we now needed to ask of why the Mets with their payroll capabilities um but now
00:17:24payroll restrictions that seem to exist uh lost the best closer in baseball yeah and I'll tell you
00:17:30what and we'll have more time to get into this uh down the road but if you know Devin Williams is out
00:17:37there looking like uh no shades Devin Williams Applebee's level closer this season the city feels
00:17:45not gonna be happy that's all I'm saying that's more offensive to Applebee's than it is to Devin
00:17:49Williams Applebee's got me through some very broke portions of my life so I I will value the eating
00:17:56good in the neighborhood more than I will someone that can't close games in the night yeah I think
00:18:00Devin Williams will bounce back this year I he's gonna have to do it in a way that makes me forget
00:18:06that the Mets jumbled negotiations with Edwin Diaz it's fair that's fair very interesting you valued
00:18:12eating good in the neighborhood it seemed like the Mets didn't value Edwin Diaz but that that is that's
00:18:17a whole nother thing now you look with all this stuff happening Andrew it was at some point you
00:18:23have to move forward and on Saturday the Mets moved forward a little bit as they signed former Seattle
00:18:30Mariner Jorge Polanco and you know a lot of a lot of places you saw a lot a lot of journalists even my
00:18:37colleagues Joel Sherman John Heyman um they described this as a solid signing um you've seen this across
00:18:44several reports how do you look at Jorge Polanco as fitting into a roster that just lost Pete Alonzo
00:18:51and how much if any does he move the needle want to be very clear he is an infielder slash DH
00:18:59he's only played one game in his career at first base so I'm not sure he is the Pete Alonzo replacement
00:19:05he could be but how does he fit into this roster and and does he move the needle at all Andrew
00:19:11so my initial reaction in the moment whether it be uh what again your colleague John Heyman reported
00:19:19and what Jeff Passon at ESPN reported that this is someone who is going to play first and DH
00:19:26a bit curious that so much was made about Pete Alonzo's defense and run prevention yet the replacement for
00:19:36him is going to be someone that's played I mean you said one game uh not only did he only play one
00:19:41inning he's played one batter in his major league career he was an injury replacement for one batter
00:19:46uh at first base in San Francisco last year we're talking about someone that's played at first base
00:19:51in the major leagues for one more batter than you and I have in his 12-year career um this is not a
00:19:57replacement for Pete Alonzo I don't think anybody can actually spin this as a replacement for Pete
00:20:03um he did have a very good year at the plate OPS over 800 OPS plus over 130 I don't really look at
00:20:10the RBI numbers because I think anybody that now has Juan Soto hitting in front of them their numbers
00:20:15will just start to go up because the run scoring opportunities will be there um he doesn't have
00:20:22the power capabilities to replace Pete Alonzo at first and he's just never played first base so I
00:20:27can't look at this as the first base replacement what I can look at this as is an upgrade over the
00:20:33Jesse Winker Starling Marte platoon and I hate to say it also might mean something for Mark Vientos
00:20:39we'll see what his market starts to dictate maybe Mark Vientos is now going to be your first baseman if
00:20:44the Mets do want to try and bring him back um we'll see what what the trade market looks like with
00:20:50Brett Beatty if they decide to move Brett in a trade then you know uh Polanco could spend some
00:20:56time at third base instead having experience already playing the other two that position and
00:21:01more specifically the other two infield positions um it's absolutely an upgrade um especially with
00:21:09the dreadful season they got from the DH position last year a solid hitter to the team for a two-year
00:21:15deal in a vacuum it's fine it's what I've basically landed on it's fine it it's it's not your full
00:21:22off season you're not done but it is a step toward it moving forward as you said and I think if I'm
00:21:29just looking at it as a DH upgrade which is I mean he's basically split his time with the Mariners at DH
00:21:34and second base last year it is an upgrade over what they used to have so I'm okay with it yeah and
00:21:41two years I didn't mention the money two years 40 million dollars so 20 per there to upgrade a DH
00:21:47I'm with you I think it's fine I also agree you can't be looking at this as Pete Alonzo replacement
00:21:52but that goes to where I would like to go next because with Alonzo gone and at least right now on
00:21:59the roster no obvious big bat to replace him what do you think the Mets realistic paths logical
00:22:07rational paths are to add an impact bat here on offense with some power I don't know if you can
00:22:14replace all the power that Pete Alonzo has now taken with him to Baltimore but can you replace at least
00:22:20some of it and what do you think are some realistic options towards doing so great question Dexter
00:22:26because I don't know that there is replacing Pete Alonzo's power I guess it's time to quote what is
00:22:33probably David Stern's favorite movie Moneyball you don't replace Jason Giambi with one player right
00:22:41you got to replace him in the aggregate with multiple players and with these self-imposed
00:22:45payroll restrictions that probably take them out of Kyle Tucker or Alex Bregman or Cody Bellinger or
00:22:52some of the other high-profile bats that are on the market you're gonna have to look in different
00:22:58places to replace Pete Alonzo now that could mean like trading for Wilson Contreras Ramon Liriano out
00:23:04in San Diego it could just mean Mark Vientos playing better and hitting better this season it could mean
00:23:10Brett Beatty taking a step with what he had close to 20 home runs last year maybe this is a step towards
00:23:1525 maybe Ryan Clifford all of 22 years old comes up and takes over at first base and shows that he's got
00:23:23similar uh if worse but still adequate power numbers at the major league level this is where
00:23:29Carson Bench has an important role next season and you start to look at other places to collectively
00:23:36replace Pete Alonzo's power throughout the lineup um it's going to take a village to replace Pete
00:23:43Alonzo offensively and I guess we'll have to wait and see if David Sterns is able to do that
00:23:49none of that sounds encouraging I know not not very enticing but that's yes that's where I think
00:23:55we are at the moment the good replacing him in the aggregate you know yeah I nobody wants to hear
00:24:02that but it's very likely what it what it's going going to be let's go to pitching real quick here
00:24:08um because there's been several reports have indicated that you know and I think you would
00:24:12agree and you and I've talked about this before the Mets need a top-end starter they need that and
00:24:17it's been talked about will they sign an ace will they trade for an ace but the way Sterns appears
00:24:24to be operating I'm going to be careful and use the word appears there seems to be hesitation on
00:24:29in these deals and giving out length right you talked about the amount of over three-year deals
00:24:34that he's given out in his tenure running baseball teams so how does the Mets thread that needle like
00:24:41you need a top-tier starter but you're not necessarily willing to give out long-term contracts players want
00:24:46long-term contracts for the security obviously do you believe that a trade is more likely for the
00:24:52Mets than maybe a long-term free agent contract what do you think is more likely for the Mets to land
00:24:58a top-tier starter which they absolutely need I too would like them to address the actual reason
00:25:05why their team and their season fell apart last year in the starting pitching um you want the truth
00:25:12Andrew you want the truth to be put out there I'm just saying like it appears that Pete Alonso's
00:25:18defense had nothing to do with Frankie Montas and Sean Mania and Paul Blackburn and Kodai Senga and
00:25:23David Peterson all not being able to get out of third and fourth innings last year um look again those
00:25:30five words I haven't to give David Sterns credit there really hasn't been much activity on the free agent
00:25:35market for pitching it's still in season Merrill Kelly that's the only big names that have signed
00:25:39somewhere now look Merrill Kelly fits the David Sterns payroll restrictions that I'm talking about
00:25:45and it's a two-year deal so maybe he just wasn't in their evaluation maybe he just wanted to go back
00:25:49to Arizona but like they were never going to give Dylan Cease seven years they're not going to give
00:25:54Framer Valdez seven years they're not going to give Ranger Suarez seven years and those last two I don't
00:26:00want them to give seven years to either of them uh so I think you're right it's going to probably be in
00:26:05the pitching uh in the trade market um I think they could be opportunistic whether it's like a
00:26:10Zach Gallen or a Michael King although I know the Boston Globe just reported that Michael King is
00:26:15probably uh I would just to make a prediction I think he'll end up with the Red Sox Boston native
00:26:20went to Boston College or Rhode Island native I should say went to Boston College uh and so I think
00:26:25he ends up there but like a two to three year deal similar to what the Mania Montas Clay Holmes
00:26:32offseason was last year uh would be something that they look to do if it's in free agency
00:26:37and in the trade market look this it's probably more appetizing to look there um the athletics report
00:26:44of the Mets Padres trade negotiations is enticing whether it's uh Nick Pavetta or um you go obviously
00:26:54the obviously the Tariq Skruble and Joe Ryan and uh Freddy Peralta aces that are out there are also
00:27:01you know front and center and I hope they'll be in on all of them uh it's probably going to be a
00:27:08trade um this is also where you got to go to the infrastructure we did see the uh Nolan McLean
00:27:15Jonah Tong Brandon Sprout uh call-ups last year one of them giving you what appears to be already a
00:27:21front of the line rotation option um so maybe he's just trying to keep the books open a bit
00:27:27or some more specifically some spots open a bit um because where I think we're going next is there
00:27:33are still guys here that uh are blocking paths to add new additions to the roster in the pitching
00:27:40department yeah that's exactly where we're going next and those guys you're talking about David
00:27:44Peterson Kodai Senga their names they both have come up in possible discussions in terms of trades
00:27:50and I just think even the fact their names are coming up makes me ask this how do you read
00:27:55where the Mets value their internal pitching options right now that are on the roster right
00:28:00now how do you think they value those guys like Peterson and Senga I think if they could find a
00:28:05trade partner for Senga they absolutely would um we've seen it reported the last couple days the
00:28:11need for need trades that the Mets um may be looking to do I think Kodai Senga the the ceiling is very
00:28:20high the floor is very low and as we've talked about David Stearns is trying to establish some
00:28:25high floors with the people that he puts on the roster so I think if you could find a partner there
00:28:31they'd absolutely look to find one um the David Peterson stuff is interesting because
00:28:38up until like six weeks left in the season I was very comfortable with David Peterson
00:28:44as a quality part of the rotation to the point where I was wondering if they should discuss
00:28:48extension with David Peterson and then whether he got hurt or just hit an innings cap on what he's
00:28:55normally what a place he's never gone to at a major league level he just was dreadful in September
00:29:02and it's part of the reason why they collapsed but again there was a portion of last year where
00:29:06nobody was going six innings except David Peterson so I'm very curious to see just because of how
00:29:13value valuable left-handed pitching is on the market if the mentioning of him in in trade rumors
00:29:21in trade speculation is just to see what his market is to see if somebody is willing to give you like
00:29:27a valuable piece that you like obviously they're going to need another reliever so maybe uh it's a
00:29:33big we just talked about San Diego they've got a great bullpen maybe they want to give you one of
00:29:39their key arms that's available for a David Peterson um you know Houston has uh Brian Abreu who was is
00:29:47one of the best relievers in baseball like maybe you trade him for David Peterson they're both on
00:29:52one-year deals and it's a need for a need for both teams so that I wonder if that's more the
00:29:59opportunistic um thing with Peterson the fact of the matter is is we're talking about what they might
00:30:06to when the pitching department and moves they might make and guys they might add and guys to
00:30:10my trade for the roster is currently full like as of as of right now um everybody from last year's
00:30:17rotation is currently still on the roster except for Frankie Monta so work is still there to be done
00:30:24for for Mr. Stearns now their work is still there to be done all right two more things real quick for
00:30:29you uh here we talked earlier about being rational and all that and some people may say it's overrated
00:30:35right now but do you believe the frustration that we've seen this week from the fan base is justified
00:30:41or is this more of a case of fans reacting before the offseason is complete do you think the the outrage
00:30:48if you want to say that a frustration that we've seen from the fan base is justified so you've heard me
00:30:53say a few times throughout our conversation Dex um self-imposed restrictions you should be able to
00:31:00re-sign Pete Alonso and bring back Edwin Diaz for the money he originally wanted and be smart about
00:31:08run prevention and other like floor establishing moves when Steve Cohen is your owner this last week
00:31:17for me and I think for a large portion of the fan base it's been a readjustment of expectations
00:31:23now that may end up being a good thing that they adjusted and pivoted to more David Stearns
00:31:30philosophical uh moves and and processes we may also be sitting here a month from now awaiting a
00:31:37Kyle Tucker Tariq Skruble press conference like it could just be that it's December and there's plenty
00:31:42of offseason left but in the moment I have now established a new line that the Mets aren't willing
00:31:51to go to in the offseason and in their team building and that's an adjustment for me especially
00:31:56after a few years under Steve Cohen of me thinking that line doesn't exist so yeah that's how I've
00:32:03processed the last week and that's how I think the fan base has either rationally irrationally or more
00:32:10specifically emotionally had to process this last week um I know that's that's definitely the the three
00:32:16different emotions I've felt over the last week for sure yeah there's been a roller coaster of
00:32:21emotions I guess last thing for me here Andrew if the Mets are going to shift the narrative you just
00:32:26kind of alluded to that things could change in a month you could be sitting at a press conference
00:32:30bringing in two high profile players and it's much different if you had to choose one move what's the
00:32:35one move that you think would immediately change the tone of this offseason because right now
00:32:42wherever you want to put it it's not here and I'm putting my hands up high for people listening to
00:32:46audio it's much lower that it's very low vibes in terms for the Mets fan but what's one move that you
00:32:51think would change the whole tone and people are like hey back on the Mets bandwagon feeling good
00:32:56about Stearns again what's that one move so I tried to keep it realistic because again I do the
00:33:01self-imposed restrictions that we've discussed throughout the convo today um I think going to Boston
00:33:08getting Jaron Duran um would be one I think the the the Brewers have been a a fascinating
00:33:15trade conversation to have because I don't think they had the best record in the National League
00:33:20last year I don't think they should be a team that's looking to trade really anybody of value
00:33:26on that roster they should be looking to add and try to get better but um a couple weeks ago
00:33:32Will Salmon put out that like a Freddy Peralta Trevor McGill Tyler's brother um combo that could
00:33:39be something that could be available so if the Mets were to go out there and get uh both Trevor
00:33:45McGill and Freddy Peralta and or uh Jaron Duran from the Red Sox I mean those are three quality
00:33:52baseball players that would suddenly help your run prevention issue be good offensively from Duran's
00:33:58part uh that's an ace that you compare with Nolan McLean with uh Duran and that's a bullpen piece
00:34:03that you compare with Devin Williams I said this to you the other day you're literally just recreating
00:34:07the 2024 Brewers which won 93 games and if Pete Alonso doesn't have the one of the biggest home runs
00:34:13in Mets history they're in the NLDS maybe the NLCS if they beat the Phillies um I do think that it's
00:34:21going to be a move like that a trade for multiple pieces that upgrade significant needs for this team
00:34:28or fill significant holes for this team I will be pleasantly surprised if it's a Kyle Tucker
00:34:35or a Cody Bellinger or a Tariq Skruval or something more aggressive that forces David Stearns to go out
00:34:41of his comfort zone I think you're being reasonable and rational as we try to be throughout this
00:34:46conversation those are moves that would change the tone I agree but some people are going to say
00:34:51Andrew the same Milwaukee bro and I understand that to some degree I don't disagree with any of
00:34:58those don't disagree with any of that but this is where we are with the uh as you said the self-imposed
00:35:04restrictions and we'll see how all of that plays out but this was a way with my guy Andrew Clodio
00:35:09co-host of the Just Mets podcast to try to talk rationally about what happened with the Mets and
00:35:16where they go next let us know what you think in the comments are we being rational are we not are we
00:35:20you know should we be angrier I don't like to live in a space of anger that's just not what I choose
00:35:25to do but if you're angry we understand we hope that we were able to bring you some some calm and
00:35:32some good feelings about it Andrew I always appreciate you coming on straight out of flushing
00:35:36the great job that you and Rich do with Just Mets podcast keep up the great work I will talk to you
00:35:40soon my friend he's there thank you Dexter now after a week like this the roster has been shaken
00:35:49up but so is the fan base they're feeling really shaken right now that's why I'm going to bring in
00:35:54somebody who speaks directly to the heart of Mets fandom her name is Ashley Winskowski she's the co-host
00:36:00of the why am I Mets fan podcast and she joins me now Ashley how are you doing thanks so much
00:36:07for having me on again Dexter I'm very happy to join you I feel like there's no other week where
00:36:13I'm more apt to get some things out about the Mets and I know a lot of fans a lot of fans feel that way
00:36:18as well oh yeah yeah I wanted to talk about it from the the fan side because there's been a lot of you
00:36:25know frustration there's been skepticism there's been angst there's a whole emotional fallout from this
00:36:31that I think you know we have to talk about and then try to try to we're going to try to figure out
00:36:37what's the bigger picture here that is at play for the Mets so let me ask you this for yourself
00:36:43and talking to other Mets fans what's been the vibe among the fan base after losing Edwin Diaz
00:36:50after losing Pete Alonso all in the same week during the winter meetings what's the vibe like right now
00:36:55I mean I don't think you can describe it any other way besides bad the vibe amongst Mets fans right now
00:37:02is not good um I believe it was Steve Gelbs of SNY who said earlier this week that he has not seen
00:37:07Mets fans so upset at least in recent memory as they were this week and that's really saying something
00:37:14when you consider missing the playoffs last year you know the trials and tribulations that this fan base
00:37:20has been through I think that people are upset this week they're confused and I don't necessarily really
00:37:25you know blame them for that I think this really this fallout from the winter meetings that we're
00:37:31discussing would be an entirely different story if we had sort of begun to see parts of David
00:37:36Stearns's vision be executed with a couple of signings but really aside from Jorge Polanco a couple
00:37:42of days ago you know we haven't and I think it's it's a bigger issue than just losing guys that have
00:37:48some star power in Alonso and Diaz and Nimmo in a sense right it's it's the end of an era these were
00:37:55guys that were you know for some Mets that a whole new generation grew up on you know for some people
00:38:01like myself it's it's a new generation of young adults that really deepened their Mets fandom
00:38:06through these guys for the last seven eight years so I think it encapsulates a lot of emotions it's
00:38:13you know kind of watching those memories of last year's NLCS run and some other big moments you know
00:38:19walk out the door and walk to rivals in some senses and I think it goes beyond the emotion of things
00:38:25too you know it's it's stings for fans because these guys were long tenured Mets they were likable
00:38:32they were really a part of the culture in New York but they were also at the top of the sport in points
00:38:39you know I mean Pete Alonso wins the home run derby twice Edwin Diaz the whole trumpets entrance and
00:38:45and being you know the dominant season in 2022 um this isn't just an emotional attachment to these
00:38:52players and I think that's important to separate as well you know these are guys that are the best
00:38:58in the game at certain points and did that in a Mets uniform at certain points but the flip side of
00:39:03that coin as Terry Collins himself said earlier this week is that as much as we loved this core as much
00:39:09as we wanted to see them succeed they didn't really do that right they haven't really won anything
00:39:15and I think from that perspective I don't necessarily dispute that it was time to shake
00:39:20things up okay so you do think it was time to shake things up and it can be fine to have that
00:39:25perspective and also still you know miss these guys that fans have grown attached to and and that's
00:39:30one thing about the vibes about everything that's happened this week but I guess also from you doing
00:39:35your pod you and Sam doing your pod and then you know you have to talk about the front office so
00:39:39what are the vibes about the Mets front office right now do Mets fans actually believe that
00:39:45David Stearns and you know company they have a clear and coherent plan because I think it's
00:39:49fair to question right now what is the plan well right you know David Stearns said at the end of
00:39:56this season at the end of 2025 that he wanted the Mets to get more athletic and he wanted to have an
00:40:01increased focus on you know defense run prevention he's operating in a really cold and calculating
00:40:08manner I think by settling for losing guys that were you know bona fide stars bona fide great Mets
00:40:15and I think the problem this week for fans has been you know to some extent his vision is still
00:40:21elusive he said those things getting more athletic focusing more on defense but you haven't really
00:40:27seen that fully come to fruition yet right you know they're not necessarily getting younger with
00:40:31the addition of Simeon or Polanco Simeon does help you out on defense that sort of felt like a one
00:40:38for one trade Brandon Nemo you trade a bat for Simeon's glove in a sense um but I I guess we just
00:40:45don't know and we haven't seen him put all of the pieces together yet I think the noise would be a lot
00:40:51quieter right now if they had done a few more signings at the winter meetings if you had sort of
00:40:56started to see things um you know shape up I think that David Stearns right now is trading some of
00:41:03that star power and what comes with it contracts that he's not comfortable giving out either money
00:41:10or lengthwise for some you know gritty more grinder type of guys for some more depth in the lineup um
00:41:17and I think you're going to see the young guys start to play plenty as well so while I hesitate to say
00:41:21that fans don't believe in the vision right now I think they're just going they're just having a hard
00:41:26time picturing it and I think it's going to take you know seeing it shape up and even seeing some
00:41:31proof into next season that it can work for fans to really buy in so when I heard you say that and
00:41:37even the last part of what you just said about fans having a hard time envisioning it right Ashley
00:41:43I think so much of that has to do with Steve Cohen because they look at the ownership and you know
00:41:49Steve Cohen now owning this team you know he's got a lot of money it's not my money or your money
00:41:54but a lot of money to spend right and so they maybe the expectations was this is the team's
00:41:59going to look a certain way it's going to look like the Dodgers are going to be aggressive they're
00:42:03going to go get free agents and things of that nature do you think this winter meetings and I'll
00:42:08call it a fallout has impacted how fans view Steve Cohen's stewardship right now and the promises that
00:42:15he made early in his ownership about trying to be the Dodgers East and having a sustainable winning
00:42:19do you think they're looking at Steve Cohen a little bit differently right now I think the
00:42:25unfortunate reality is that I think some of the shine around Steve Cohen is starting to wear off
00:42:30a little bit and I think that much of the vision you know so to speak for building the team is rooted
00:42:37in David Stearns and his philosophies but there's no disputing you know there's no world where David
00:42:42Stearns is making these decisions without the blessings of the Coens this is still rooted in the
00:42:47Coens so you know fans are very quick to bring up and I don't blame them how in 2020 when Steve
00:42:54Cohen bought the Mets he promised fans he promised Mets fans a World Series in three to five years
00:43:00and in those five years they've missed the playoffs three times they had one quick exit in the wild card
00:43:06round and they did have one run to the NLCS and now on top of all that you know this offseason
00:43:12they don't appear to be operating with with much urgency to be honest with you so I think what
00:43:17you're seeing from fans is they're really starting to I guess maybe question the communication style
00:43:24of the front office I think the most alarming thing to me personally you know out of everything that
00:43:30has come out these past few weeks in Mets world is really the lack of communication or maybe even
00:43:37respect from the outgoing players last year the entire offseason narrative surrounding signing
00:43:43Juan Soto was Steve and Alex Cohen and you know their family style atmosphere and how much players
00:43:49wanted to play for the Mets and just really that palpable culture shift you know which was so stark
00:43:56coming out of the Wilpon era now this offseason in the last week alone you know you're hearing Pete
00:44:02Alonso say that he found the transparency from the Orioles refreshing you're hearing Edwin Diaz say that he
00:44:08wanted to go play for a winning organization you're even hearing a guy like Brandon Nimmo the longest
00:44:14tenured Met on the team say that he was taken aback to even be involved in trade discussions so I don't
00:44:22think that you know fans are out on Steve Cohen by any means but I just think that people still believe in
00:44:28the resources that he has and you know the desire that he has to be competitive to create a winner in
00:44:34Queens but I do think that maybe his his shine or that family atmosphere you know that they were so
00:44:42proud of last offseason has taken a little bit of a hit in the past in the past few weeks yeah and
00:44:48that's the thing I think a lot of Mets fans I even think people in the media thought with him you know
00:44:52purchasing the team that there was going to be sort of a change in culture and it felt to that point you
00:44:57talked about the family atmosphere that was being brought up so much last offseason it felt like that
00:45:01was kind of a turn okay this culture is shifting with Stearns with Cohen and now I think with the
00:45:06events of the last week and I'm not saying that it can't still shift Ash because it can but it does
00:45:11feel like ah maybe have they taken a step back players you know when players say this that kind of
00:45:17stuff that you hear from Diaz you hear from Alonzo that's not a good look because you wonder how it
00:45:21impacts free agency going forward and and things of that nature and and I just mentioned Alonzo
00:45:27and I thought bringing Diaz back I've said this on the show on this show I said it just now um you
00:45:34know talking with Andrew Claudio of Jets Mets podcast I thought bringing Diaz back was more
00:45:39significant than bringing Alonzo back just because of how elite he was in his position but Alonzo
00:45:45has a very significant emotional tie to the fan base right he's the all-time leader in home runs for
00:45:51the franchise how significant in your eyes is the emotional loss of Pete Alonzo for fans and what
00:45:58do you think that does to the identity of Mets fandom because it's like hey there's this guy that
00:46:01we've been rooting for this whole time a homegrown guy and they didn't want him back so how do you
00:46:08think this impacts the Mets and their fans seeing Pete Alonzo walk out the door yeah well to start I
00:46:13completely agree with you that I I felt like Diaz was a bigger loss but I do feel as though Alonzo
00:46:19is the more emotional loss you know when you take Mets fans as a whole you know this is a guy that
00:46:26was the face of the franchise to some extent for the past seven seasons sure Francisco Lindor in that
00:46:31conversation as well but Alonzo is your homegrown star the guy who has been a Met and only a Met for
00:46:39his entire career the past seven years you know this was the the David Wright for some people the Keith
00:46:46Hernandez for some people your homegrown power hitting star of course Hernandez not homegrown but
00:46:52he was likable off the field in New York he was involved he wanted to bring a winner to Queens
00:46:57and on top of all that on top of all the niceties I mean this is your all-time leading home run hitter
00:47:05that you just let walk to the Orioles um you know top five in multiple other offensive categories as well
00:47:12RBIs total bases among them so I think that this was absolutely a very emotional loss for fans you
00:47:19know it was also a guy who cared so much about New York but brought them to national prominence you know
00:47:25more than once won the home run derby twice five-time all-star won the rookie of the year so I think the
00:47:32departure of Alonzo is deeper than just the on the field stuff the off the field stuff it's really
00:47:39saying goodbye to the potential that his Mets legacy had right because you had seven seasons
00:47:45of this bona fide homegrown power hitting star and now you're sort of kissing goodbye the potential for
00:47:53the rest of his career you know you think about retiring his number up in the rafters at Citi Field
00:47:59you think about if he goes into Cooperstown he could have gone in as a Met will he still you know I
00:48:05so I think it's it's really rooted and tied to that legacy of him being a great Met and I think
00:48:12on top of all that you know the the news that came out that the Mets did not even make an offer to him
00:48:17that to me is what really rubbed myself and I think fans the wrong way because this was you know
00:48:26love him or hate him this was a guy that gave it his all in Queens for seven seasons you know was was
00:48:32highly successful both on the field and off and it feels as though the Mets didn't even make an
00:48:38effort to keep him and I know some will dispute that and say that they did offer him the seven
00:48:43years 158 million a few seasons ago they did what they could last offseason to bring him back on the
00:48:49smaller deal but you know to to what David Stern said that the negotiations reached a point where they
00:48:55were uncomfortable in talking about Alonzo to me is just sort of absurd you know you look at giving a
00:49:02guy like Juan Soto 765 million dollars and you can't give Pete Alonzo you know 155 so um I think
00:49:10that the loss of Alonzo was deeply emotional for Mets fans and I think that to be honest seeing him
00:49:15in a in a Baltimore uniform next next season is certainly going to be strange yeah it's just even
00:49:21you know with his introduction both him and Diaz it's it's it's weird it doesn't feel right and I
00:49:28would Ash you made a good point about you know what Stern said about being uncomfortable where he
00:49:34was willing to go with Alonzo and I would have liked to know more about that or why or what was
00:49:39that number and the reports that come out that you know they didn't even give him an offer it no matter
00:49:46what you feel about Alonzo and I do think Alonzo was not a perfect player he did have his limitations
00:49:51it does feel a little bit disrespectful like we we can we can we can agree with that now so you and
00:49:57I both agree that Diaz was the more important player to bring back and he obviously doesn't
00:50:01come back either but I was listening to what you said with Alonzo and everything and the attachment
00:50:08that the fans have to him as a homegrown guy but with Diaz as a closer not a homegrown guy but
00:50:12but he was a guy that brought an experience to it you know Andrew Claudio just talked to me about
00:50:17how he came out to Timmy Trumpets at his wedding um him seeing Diaz come out in the ninth inning to
00:50:24that song and just hearing those horns it was a really dope feeling for a lot of fans
00:50:29he was a beloved Met so you have this homegrown Met and you have this beloved Met that you can argue
00:50:37is the best closer in the game when you combine these two things that specifically we're talking
00:50:42about Diaz does that affect the fan base in a way that it's only going to sour the relationship
00:50:47maybe between more between the fans and the the front office and ownership because you had a
00:50:52homegrown Met and then a very beloved Met that's part of the Mets experience at Citi Field he's gone
00:50:57too so how does losing Diaz as a best closing experience impact this Met fan base yeah I mean
00:51:03you talk about the experience I think in game one next year at Citi Field fans are going to feel
00:51:10I mean if it's a closer closer situation fans are going to feel it right away right no trumpets
00:51:15none of that late inning scene that they made it into such an event with the way that
00:51:20you know the SNY cameras would capture it on the light show that they started to do and they really
00:51:25made it a part of the identity of coming to Citi Field and now that will be no longer but but you
00:51:32look at the on the field stuff and you know quality late inning relief is at such a premium right now in
00:51:40baseball and the Mets had a guy for seven seasons that was considered by many to be the best at it
00:51:46in the sport um so that's why I feel like Diaz is the more sizable loss when you look at the roster
00:51:53top to bottom um you know the Edwin Diaz experience is is just that it's really it is an experience right
00:52:01the trumpets entrance signifies that you are about to go on a wild ride because while we were talking
00:52:08about how he's great nothing with Edwin Diaz was ever easy right he would load the bases and then
00:52:14strike out the side he would certainly give you a few heart palpitations in between closing out uh
00:52:22tight games but you know aside from maybe a couple down years maybe 2019 maybe 2024 in some people's eyes
00:52:29you know Mets fans had that I guess luxury of knowing that the ninth inning was locked down bona fide
00:52:37dominant closer is coming out of the bullpen um to kind of shore things up and I think that that's
00:52:44something that you know other teams in baseball search for for years and years is Devin Williams
00:52:49going to be that now maybe he certainly has the potential that we saw in Milwaukee to do that
00:52:56but I I just think that Diaz for people you know his departure rubbed salt in the wound because all
00:53:03of the things that we've been talking about not only does he leave but he leaves to go to the Dodgers
00:53:09and he says that it's because he wants to win you obviously can't dispute that the Dodgers have won the
00:53:16World Series back-to-back years both of the last two seasons but I think it's also an indictment from a
00:53:22guy who was in Queens for seven years that he doesn't necessarily believe in the at least short-term
00:53:29vision for the Mets to create a winner so um yeah Diaz Diaz walking and just the manner in which it
00:53:37happened I think was really a knife in the heart to Mets fans yeah no I I feel the same way it's
00:53:44going to be weird to not uh hear those trumpets at Citi Field last next year excuse me next year
00:53:49and I'll tell you what if Devin Williams doesn't get the job done the booze are going to sound like
00:53:54reverse trumpets there nobody's gonna nobody's gonna like that you know it's gonna get badass but
00:54:00following when you look at the winter meetings and following everything that happened or I guess
00:54:05you could all say or didn't happen right at the winter meetings you then add on Saturday the Mets
00:54:12sort of move on right their next signing is Jorge Polanco um in the aftermath of everything that
00:54:17happened this past week when you look at the Jorge Polanco signing which I think it's it's fine
00:54:23solid signing um does that feel like consolation prize for you after everything that happened or
00:54:29is this part of the steps of the larger decision about what Stearns is going to do to try to shape
00:54:34this team in the way that he wants to shape it I mean I feel exactly the same way in terms of what
00:54:41you just said about the Jorge Polanco signing it's fine it's nothing more than fine to me it doesn't
00:54:46really move the needle in either direction your team is not going to be you know sent over the the
00:54:52edge so to speak it's your the last missing piece of your puzzle was certainly not Jorge Polanco um
00:54:58I don't blame fans for thinking that it was a consolation prize at the same time I do think
00:55:04it's a part of David Stearns larger vision I think it fits the type of player that he claims to be
00:55:10looking for I mean the time frame of the contract two years 40 million that certainly seems to fit I
00:55:17think we've seen a real hesitation from Stearns to give out lengthy contracts aside from Juan Soto
00:55:24so that fits sort of what he's looking for at the same time an average annual value of 20 million
00:55:31dollars per year for Jorge Polanco that actually struck me you know that seemed like a bit of an
00:55:36overpay in some senses I don't know if you can call a two-year contract an overpay but 20 million
00:55:41dollars average annual value kind of a lot for Polanco but you know he does bring more flexibility
00:55:46to the roster you know he's a switch hitter he's a decent you know to good hitter from both sides of
00:55:51the plate and I think that ability to move around the infield and really play multiple positions
00:55:55is something that was desirable to David Stearns you know will he DH of course will he maybe even play
00:56:03first base at times if they don't acquire a true first baseman and they don't feel comfortable with
00:56:08Mark Vientos there maybe so it just gives I guess Stearns and Mendoza some more flexibility on that
00:56:14roster but I don't think anybody was particularly tantalized by Jorge Polanco after losing you know
00:56:21Nimmo Alonso and Diaz within a week yeah I haven't seen anybody excited about everybody's been like
00:56:26yeah it's been fine it's a nice signing it's it's cool I would say you brought up the average annual
00:56:34value for his contract to 20 million I was a little surprised to some degree about it Ash but at the same
00:56:40time I'm like okay well hopefully it doesn't look like the Frankie Montas deal which was you know
00:56:45two for 34 so 17 for and everybody's hoping that's not the case you know Polanco's a fine hitter I think
00:56:51he can help and I think he'll be more of a DH like you said and he gives some versatility I don't
00:56:57what I said this with Andrew it's not the Pete replacement right like if you're looking at this is
00:57:02he's going to replace Pete Alonso at first base I think you know I think that's a little much
00:57:06there to to ask but I wanted to also talk to you about expectations because I think that matters
00:57:12sometimes do you think fans entered the winter meetings with unrealistic expectations for this
00:57:17Mets team in the front office or did the front office just simply undelivered here and look I'm
00:57:23not judging the whole offseason on the winter meetings but just based on what's happened in the
00:57:27past week we can I think everybody will say it was underwhelming right but yeah did the front
00:57:32office undelivered here or were Mets fans just had unrealistic expectations here you know I think
00:57:39there's two sides to this coin I by no means think that the expectations from fans were unrealistic
00:57:45nor do I think they should be labeled that way but I also think that the reality of the situation is
00:57:51that the expectations for this offseason were sky high you know you come off of missing the playoffs
00:57:57on the last game of the regular season Steve Cohen you have the richest owner in baseball
00:58:03I do think that people were prepared for a major offseason albeit one that may have shaken up the
00:58:10core to some degree um you know I said this on our podcast and I'm gonna say it here there is a part
00:58:16of me that thinks that we did get a little spoiled last year right but I mean how can you not you get
00:58:21Juan Soto from the team across town um and you sign him to the biggest contract in the sport in
00:58:28some senses that is major and I think anything that the Mets do this offseason of course is not going
00:58:35to live up to that um but I do think that the front office under delivered largely in terms of
00:58:43their hesitancy this team has a lot of holes right now you couldn't even feel the team right now if
00:58:51you're the I mean you could with guys on the on the greater 40 man roster but there's a lot of holes
00:58:57right you're looking for a first baseman you need another outfielder the starting rotation I don't
00:59:02even know where to begin and I don't think the Mets do either you still need help in terms of middle
00:59:07late inning relief so to leave the winter meetings I think with more questions than answers was not a
00:59:15great strategy in terms of satisfying the fans especially when you consider just the devastating
00:59:22way that the 2025 season ended yeah I think that's the thing for me right I don't think I'm with you
00:59:29155 percent here I don't think it was unrealistic the fans have high expectations for this offseason I
00:59:34you guys have spoke about it I've spoke about it on this show the Mets needed a big offseason they
00:59:40needed to go out and address some things I think still think they need to go get an ace that's still
00:59:44something I think they need to do I need to address the thought bullpen they still bullpen arms they
00:59:48need now you're trusting in Devin Williams as your closer now you've lost all this is before they've
00:59:53lost all the guys that you mentioned the homegrown guys I don't think that was unrealistic and I
00:59:58don't think it's unfair for fans to have come away from the winter meetings and say ah this was
01:00:04underwhelming now there's still a lot of offseason left to go you and I were just talking about this
01:00:08before we started recording there's still a long way to go and who knows uh you know Andrew was
01:00:14telling me a month from now three weeks from now whatever we could be sitting here and the Mets are
01:00:18introducing some big name player they traded for and we'll all be like ah okay this this is better
01:00:23but absolutely for now for now Mets fans have to have hope ash they have to have some hope you know
01:00:29the motto is always you got to believe hope is something the fans need right now what just for
01:00:36yourself other fans you're talking to what what are Mets fans hanging on to right now because it
01:00:42feels like nothing I'm not sure there's something for them to hang on to but what are Mets fans
01:00:46hanging on to right now in terms of hope well you know we're talking about expectations and did the
01:00:53Mets meet the expectations of the fans in the winter meetings and in the offseason so far
01:00:57to some extent not to just circle back around and put a band-aid on it but to some extent I do think
01:01:04that the reaction that fans have had to this offseason and the lack of moves is a product
01:01:11of Steve Cohen resetting the expectations in Queens right because I think a few years ago under the
01:01:18Wilpons you know you would have been you wouldn't have thought twice about some of the things that
01:01:22would happen so to some extent I think Steve Cohen and David Stearns you know have reset expectations
01:01:29to a point where they're much greater and much larger than ever before and that's a good thing
01:01:34you want your team to obviously move in that direction you know to give people some hope this
01:01:38is at least what I've been telling myself you still have the richest owner in the sport who has shown a
01:01:45willingness to spend and has shown a willingness to make moves when he feels that things are right
01:01:51and you still have two bona fide superstars in your lineup in Francisco Lindor and Juan Soto you have
01:01:58a 1A and a 1B in those guys this doesn't feel like unless something happens in the next week and
01:02:06they trade Lindor or something you know this doesn't feel like a complete and utter rebuild and
01:02:12tear down at the same time does it feel like the Mets are settling a little bit and getting some
01:02:171Bs when they already had 1As on the roster yes and I understand how that's not a good feeling but
01:02:23I just go back to you know Steve Cohen and David Stearns being two guys who are lifelong Mets fans
01:02:29running the team they are well aware and in touch with I guess the urgency that fans feel to win and
01:02:38to bring a winner to Queens and I realized the other day and I've heard some people start to talk about it
01:02:45that next season the 2026 season is going to be the 40th anniversary of 1986 the last time the Mets
01:02:52brought a championship back home to New York they're going to celebrate that all year long that's going
01:02:57to be you know the talk of summer games at Citi Field is that it's the 40th anniversary of 1986 I do not
01:03:04think that's going to be lost on Steve Cohen David Stearns and the Mets front office I think that Mets fans
01:03:10can at least take solace in knowing these are two guys running this show that have deep rooted ties
01:03:16to Mets fandom and are right there with you you know in terms of of wanting to create a winner now do I
01:03:23know exactly what David Stearns is thinking you don't know maybe he is thinking more towards 2027 I'm not
01:03:30sure but at least you can rest in the fact that you know you know that these guys understand the history
01:03:36of the Mets yeah that does matter 40 years long time Mets fans still waiting for that next World
01:03:42Series title I guess last thing for me here Ash if you had to distill it what what's the one thing
01:03:48you know you talked about clarity and transparency that I think Mets fans would like to see a little
01:03:54bit more from David Stearns in terms of what's the plan here right um is it that is it a major move is
01:04:01it that any of those things would that help stabilize the mood of the Mets fan right now at this moment
01:04:07through the offseason is is there something you think that can get Mets fans to being like okay
01:04:11feel good about things again we we believe again what's that thing that needs to happen
01:04:16you know a part of me wants to say transparency because like we've been talking about I do think
01:04:23you know Steve Cohen has maybe lost a little bit of that trust with the fan base definitely something
01:04:28that he can earn back throughout the rest of this offseason and the years moving forward
01:04:32um you know all we've really heard from Cohen is I believe he texted John Heyman um and the and the
01:04:39post was reporting on you know he said I totally understand the fans reaction you know there's lots
01:04:45of offseason left basically and we have a lot of time to put a playoff team you know on the field
01:04:49um that's really all we've heard from Steve Cohen so far David Stearns was taking questions at the
01:04:55winter meetings but did not I believe towards the last day or two of them so it's sort of been radio
01:05:00silence that leaves people in a place of wondering what exactly the plan is when you have no communication
01:05:07to show for it and no signings to show for it but I think what Mets fans really need you know in order
01:05:14to calm down and to feel a little better about things is really some major signings I don't think there
01:05:19will be any stability among the fan base until you see a big splash and if there's not going to be a
01:05:26big splash then I think fans deserve some transparency from Cohen and Stearns as to why that's not happening
01:05:32when you know that the resources are there you know whether it's Cody Bellinger whether it's you know
01:05:37Scooble or Kyle Tucker I think people would be very happy with I don't think fans are going to be
01:05:43satisfied until they see that lineup and rotation really start to shape up because like I mentioned earlier
01:05:49there are just so many more questions than answers right now and so many holes but if you're the
01:05:54Mets and if you're thinking about this from a business perspective you know if I were the Mets
01:05:59I wouldn't want to wait until February or late January to kind of have things shape up because at the end
01:06:06of the day this is a business you know I don't know how much this matters to those folks who who run
01:06:12the Mets but you know you have season ticket holders to satisfy you have sort of a PR nightmare on your
01:06:18hands this week to kind of simmer down so I think that if you are the Mets right now if you are Steve
01:06:24Cohen if you are David Stearns the sooner the better in terms of making a big move yeah I think all Mets
01:06:30fans would agree with that the sooner the better they can get the bad taste of last week out of
01:06:35their mouth and they can see maybe where the Mets are going to go from here that will make them feel
01:06:40a lot better and we'll see how it all plays out there still is a lot of offseason left to go
01:06:43but you know what they say sometimes Ash sometimes it gets late early and Mets fans would like to see
01:06:49I think you're right a couple of big name signings a couple good moves that makes you know feel like
01:06:56it's New York where you have an owner who's got some money in his pockets I think that would have
01:06:59Mets fans feeling a whole lot better about things that everybody is Ashley Winskowski check her out
01:07:05on the why am I a Mets fan podcast which is a fantastic name and I'm sure a lot of you out there
01:07:11been questioning why are you a Mets fan at this time after last week Ashley always a pleasure
01:07:17having you on Straight Outta Flushing it was great to talk to you and uh hopefully things get better
01:07:22with the Mets thanks so much for having me I uh I enjoyed talking about it and I fingers crossed
01:07:29that we have some more to talk about in the coming weeks yeah we'll have more to talk about in the
01:07:32coming weeks again check out Ashley and her great work with the podcast I'm Dexter Henry we'll
01:07:37catch you next time another edition of Straight Outta Flushing
01:07:41you
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