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00:00I think there's going to be a level of curiosity.
00:03Are they going to drop dead when they're trying to actually make this happen?
00:06Will the flashpots go off and scare them that they're just going to keel over?
00:11And this is a chance for your kids and your relatives to see you do what you love.
00:15Well, I just think it's free roadies.
00:17I mean, I don't really care what they want.
00:19Rock, metal, prog, and everything in between.
00:23Welcome to this episode of Talkin' Rock with Meltdown.
00:26Don't forget to follow the audio-only Talkin' Rock podcast on all podcast platforms.
00:31And now, it's time for today's conversation.
00:34Here's Meltdown.
00:36Rick, I was just telling these guys before we start that Heidi from 97 Rock wanted me to say hello.
00:41And she doesn't know if you remember her back in the day.
00:43Heidi worked there, and she was like the promotions manager.
00:47And she's been in the business a long time, and she wanted me to say hello to you.
00:51Okay, well, tell her I said hi back.
00:54All right, here we go.
00:54Man, what a thrill to talk to all of you guys.
00:58Good to see you.
01:00It's always good to be seated.
01:02Yeah.
01:03I was thinking to myself, I'm like, why would Triumph want to tour in 2025?
01:09And then, as I was telling Gil and Mike, Rick, before you got on, I drove through your country the other day,
01:13and I drove through Toronto, and there was 27 lanes of traffic on a Sunday afternoon that were backed up.
01:18So you guys just want to leave Toronto.
01:20I get it.
01:20You got the perfect answer.
01:27But seriously, why are you guys going back out on tour?
01:30I have a couple ideas, of course.
01:34I mean, obviously, Rush, I don't know if that played anything into it.
01:37And, you know, Rick, you've had some health issues in the past.
01:41Maybe things, you know, maybe changed in your mind a little bit.
01:43Why don't you guys start there?
01:44It's an obvious question, obviously.
01:46My wife just wanted to get me out of the house, you know, and get rid of me.
01:51And I think maybe she's hoping that as I physically try to prepare for, you know, playing a 90-minute show,
01:58I don't know how many we got, like 24 in 60 days, I think she's maybe hoping it'll kill me.
02:03And then, you know, I think we all had to sort of bow to the ambition and desire of Gil Moore,
02:17who wanted to get the rock and roll machine back up on the road so that he could mount some sort of show thing that only he can imagine.
02:27And that Mike and I just go, oh, God, what are we getting ourselves into?
02:32Yeah, Gil, you were the one back in the day, right, with all the lights and everything.
02:36You were the mastermind behind all the stagecraft.
02:40I'll take one for the team for that, yeah.
02:43I don't know.
02:44I was always, I was always felt better behind the scenes, to be honest.
02:48I always liked the technology and the, you know, the big spectacle and all that.
02:55But I, I mean, I think we tried to use the, the stage, you know, in a way that we really enhanced the music.
03:03And I, you know, what I see now on a lot of, a lot of tours, I'm, I'm seeing a lot of flashing, you know,
03:09kind of gratuitous, just, you know, flotsam and jessam, you know, effects and stuff.
03:16And that's, that's not the intent here.
03:18Like what we're really trying to do is, is create a, you know, tell the story of triumph from the early days to the present
03:25and, and really trace the, the interest that our fans have had that's gone on for years and now decades
03:34to become what they tell us.
03:38So the, the, the, how they own the songs, how they have been impacted by the lyrics.
03:43And, uh, we've noticed that in that feedback, that it's, it's all about kind of the positivity
03:48and some of our songs are uplifting messages within the, you know, the never surrenders
03:53and the, and the, uh, hold onto your dreams kind of content that was in the lyrics.
03:59So hopefully the show, uh, we'll, we'll, you know, add another dimension to that I'll, I'll say,
04:06and, and, and not just be, you know, a bunch of flashing nonsense.
04:10It's going to be something that's very, very well crafted.
04:14Um, I've been working on it for about six years with our, uh, back in the day lighting director,
04:20Paul Dexter, who's, uh, really, uh, a kind of a genius in this area.
04:24So we're going to try to bring that to the stage and really have a show that people will
04:30never forget.
04:31That's what we're trying to do.
04:32Now, when I've talked with you guys in the past, it always seemed like, yeah, there wasn't
04:35a chance that you guys would go back out on tour and whatnot.
04:38So, I mean, when, when did the impetus for putting a tour back together, you just said
04:41something about six years ago.
04:43Uh, but did you guys see like maybe, uh, the success of, you know, some of the stuff you've
04:48done, like the documentary and, uh, maybe the tribute album and maybe rush putting things
04:53back together and go, Hmm, we should try this again.
04:55Mike, I'll let you start.
04:58Um, the, the, the doc and the, and the tribute record certainly were, were, um, uh, I guess
05:05slight impetuses, if that's a word, um, for, for us to do more things.
05:12Um, I think the strongest impetus was the fact that, uh, Rogers communications, which owns
05:21the Maple Leafs and the Blue Jays and the cable networks and stuff, used late on the
05:27line in a TV commercial throughout all the Stanley Cup playoffs.
05:31It was like a hit record.
05:34And, and people were rediscovering triumph, including brand new fans.
05:40And, uh, uh, you know, you couldn't go anywhere with them without somebody singing, singing the
05:45song behind you.
05:46And, you know, they'd go, Oh, there's a guy from trial.
05:48Yeah, yeah, yeah.
05:49Lay it on the line.
05:50And so, uh, that's kind of, you know, has, had, uh, had some influence and, um, and live
05:58nation started to talk to us about maybe doing something.
06:02And, uh, as far as Russia was concerned, uh, you know, they just contemplated their, their
06:08return, uh, a long time ago.
06:10So, and we didn't even know about it while we were talking about what we were going to
06:15do.
06:16So, um, it just kind of went up with, we sat down and talked it out and said, okay, let's
06:24toss the coin and do it.
06:26And, uh, Rick, Mike just said something that's interesting.
06:28It's like, you know, there is a whole generation of fans that never got to see triumph.
06:32And I was thinking back and I'm not sure if I ever saw triumph and I'm old, but, uh, there
06:36was, you know, it was, it was a long time ago.
06:38I, I saw it, I think I saw the, the incarnation with Phil once, but not of course the original
06:42band.
06:43Uh, but Rick talk about, you know, all these fans, these Canadian fans and American fans,
06:47they're going to get a chance to see all three of you guys back on stage again.
06:51Uh, well, you know, um, I think that, uh, for me, the energy, we're not just going to do
07:00this on our own.
07:00First of all, we're going to have three other musicians join us.
07:03And I think that that's going to make it so that, uh, it's not just a good old triumph
07:08that's, you know, trying to see if they can survive this thing.
07:12Uh, it's, it's going to be a new thing.
07:14And there's an energy to that, that excites me and makes me want to be involved and make
07:19it happen, you know?
07:20Um, but I mean, Gil pretty much touched on it, that there's these folks that it was the
07:25soundtrack of their lives.
07:26And now they're bringing their kids and those kids have, there's grandkids involved in this
07:31now, you know?
07:32So yes, we're, we're old, you know, there's no question that, you know, there, I think
07:38there's going to be a level of curiosity.
07:40Are they going to drop dead when they're trying to actually make this happen?
07:45You know, will the flash pots go off and scare them that they're just going to keel over?
07:49Um, but I, I think I feel safe.
07:53Like we, the, the whole, the thing that Mike mentioned about Rogers and the, and we played
07:57out in Edmonton, Gil and I went out there, Mike didn't make it, but, but, uh, we went
08:02out there and it felt like it was fun.
08:06And I think at the bottom of it, all of this stuff that we're talking about, the, the, the
08:12songs and the, oh, the big show and, and all the nostalgia of the three of us getting
08:16back together, really the, the bottom line has to be, well, yeah, but is it going to
08:21be fun?
08:22Is it, is this going to, you know?
08:23And I think that's something that translates to the audience.
08:26I think they get a sense of, look at these guys.
08:29They're just having the time of their lives.
08:31Yes.
08:31They're very old lives.
08:33They're, they're in their seventh decade, eighth decade of life.
08:37You know, they, wow.
08:39You know, this is, but, you know, I mean, if we're not going to have fun with that, what's
08:44the point, you know?
08:45So, yeah.
08:46Gil, you think you're going to have fun on tour?
08:48Oh, no doubt about it.
08:50You know, this is a real good excuse to get, you know, back in the gym and, you know, get
08:58all paradiddled up.
09:01You know, I think it's going to be, the most fun for me is going to be my, my, my kids and
09:08my, and my wife.
09:09And I guess, you know, folks here at Metalworks that are just, did you really play in Triumph
09:14or did you just make up that story about yourself?
09:17So, it's going to be a, I love all paradiddled up.
09:24I think that should be right in the bio.
09:28I'm getting all paradiddled up.
09:30Yeah, that's great.
09:31So I never thought about that.
09:32So when was the last time you guys actually played?
09:35I mean, was the last tour you guys did in 1998, but when was the last time you all played
09:38we were on the same stage together?
09:41The documentary.
09:44Oh, yeah.
09:45Yeah.
09:46Yeah.
09:46We, you know, we played three songs for the, uh, uh, the, the, the fans that were lucky
09:51enough or unlucky enough to attend the event.
09:55Um, but yeah, it was, and that was a very emotional evening, actually, for all of us, the fans
10:02and the fans.
10:04Mikey cried.
10:06Yeah.
10:07I bet.
10:08Mikey had tears rolling down his teeth.
10:11I should have thought that was you.
10:15He hadn't cried that much since he saw the Maple Leafs win a Stanley Cup, right?
10:19Oh, yeah.
10:20I could see that.
10:21Wow.
10:22I do remember that.
10:23I, I was in, I think I was in grade nine in high school.
10:26But, uh, you know, Gil just touched on some too.
10:30It's like, you know, not only the generation of fans, but, you know, we all do things for
10:33our kids and this is a chance for your kids and, and, and, and your relatives to see you
10:38do what you love and see what, and do what you, what made you happy.
10:41Well, I just think it's free roadies.
10:43I mean, I don't really care what they want, you know, keep labor.
10:48They're going to work for you.
10:49Hey, I'm joking.
10:52My wife will hit me with a rolling pin for saying that, but.
10:56Well, it's going to be a family celebration.
10:59I'm sure all around, you know, we're going to have a blast and, uh, you know, what could
11:04be more, what could be more fun?
11:06Uh, when we did Sweden, uh, and Rocklahoma in 2008, it was also kind of partially for
11:12the kids or a lot for the families, I'll say.
11:15And, uh, but they, you know, that was a long time ago and, you know, some of them were much
11:19younger.
11:19And so this is going to be, uh, this is going to be really something to be a big party backstage.
11:24That's for sure.
11:25When they're there.
11:25I, I got five grandkids.
11:28So, uh, yeah.
11:30The strollers.
11:32They've, they've never seen me do my rockstar impression.
11:35So, uh, it'll, it'll be fun.
11:38Listen, I'm also going to mention this, you know, since, you know, how often do I get
11:41to do these kinds of interviews?
11:42Um, I have Godin is making me a new guitar and it's like, I have a guitar that I already
11:49really, really love.
11:50And it's a model that I like to play.
11:51And I think it's appropriate for triumph.
11:53Um, but this one, it's going to be white and black.
11:56And so the guys that go down are calling it the storm trooper.
12:00So I'm going to get to have the storm trooper on stage.
12:03And I am really looking forward to that.
12:06That's a self-indulgent thing, but I thought I should mention it.
12:08Yeah.
12:09That's a good thing to mention.
12:10So Rick, you talked about, you know, bringing a Todd Kearns and Phil X and a Brad Fitz out
12:14there with you.
12:14What, what exactly do you guys have this all planned out as to how this is going to work?
12:18You said, they're going to be doing some new cool things.
12:21Yeah.
12:22Well, I mean, we, we, we made it through three songs out there in Edmonton.
12:25So there's a, you know, there's a little bit of a spine to build from.
12:29Of course that wasn't with any production.
12:31We were just playing out, you know, it was all these people that were outside the arena
12:34and, uh, it looked like a holding pen.
12:37It was, you know, they were, they were going crazy and it was fun, but it was like an outdoor
12:41show.
12:42Uh, what we're planning here is a much more intense, uh, multi-leveled multimedia, you
12:51know, Gil's got, I don't know, we DMX or something.
12:54It's like, there's going to be screens that are doing things at the same time that we're
12:59playing.
13:00Uh, and, uh, I think there's going to be, um, like, you know, emergency medical people
13:05and stand by, I'm keep going back to the same joke.
13:09I'm sorry.
13:10Uh, anyhow, like, uh, we, we've got a lot of work ahead of us because there will be, uh,
13:16uh, an intense period of, of trying to figure out what the script is for this thing.
13:21Then you get to the point where it's like, well, now we're going to have to go into the
13:24studio and the six of us are going to have to be bashing away for a while.
13:28Then we're going to have to go into an arena somewhere and set this thing up because it's,
13:32it's a massive thing.
13:33The rigging is, you know, what is it, Gil?
13:3640 foot clearance or something?
13:3944, 50 points.
13:40Yeah.
13:41So there you go.
13:42You know, the technical, I, I just go, Oh, look at those lights up there.
13:46I hope they don't fall on you.
13:48So both the level extravagance, that's what I'm going to start calling it.
13:53All right.
13:54Fair enough.
13:54And, and I mean, this is probably too early to ask, but is this going to be it for triumph?
13:59Is this the final tour?
14:02Here's what's going to happen.
14:08If it, uh, if the tickets go on sale and it's kind of stiffened, then, you know, we may not
14:15even make it up for these shows.
14:17If they go on sale and it does pretty good, you know, obviously there's going to be people
14:21like live nation and folks that are going, Hey, you want to do some more?
14:26At which point there will be discussions between the three of us as to, you know, how long this
14:33might, uh, infringe upon my desire to want to be going on holidays.
14:38And, you know, um, I, I will say this though, um, last night I was, uh, practicing guitar
14:45and I looked at my watch and it was 1230 at night.
14:48I usually go to bed by like 1030, you know, at that time.
14:53So I thought, well, this is not so bad really.
14:57Is it like sitting up and playing guitar until all hours?
15:00So, uh, you know, I think that is a harbinger of that.
15:06There might be a future here.
15:07I don't know how it'll compartmentalize and work out, but yeah, I think, uh, I, it could
15:14extend.
15:14It seems like it's fun so far.
15:17And this might be another ridiculous question, but I'm going to ask it anyways, because I'd
15:20like to ask ridiculous questions, but you think that putting yourself out on this tour and
15:24getting yourself back into the spotlight, um, do you think the rock and roll hall of fame
15:28should take note?
15:28That's up to the fans, you know, it's not really up to us and everybody I know that has
15:39anything to do with that thinks it's a total waste of time and it's a, it's a whole fraudulent,
15:45um, bullshit kind of thing like FIFA, you know, the world cup people, it's all scam land.
15:53So, um, oh, would it be cool?
15:55Sure.
15:55But, um, do I go to sleep at night even thinking about it?
15:59Not a chance.
16:00Right.
16:00Yeah.
16:01I figured that much.
16:02And, you know, I couldn't believe that you guys just got in the Canadian songwriters
16:05hall of fame.
16:05What was the holdup on that?
16:09You couldn't find our addresses word in the phone book.
16:12There is an interesting thing about Canada, uh, which, um, you know, I don't know if this
16:20caused any kind of delay or not, but I think Canadians in general, the whole thing of songwriting
16:29came out of the world of, of Hank Snow.
16:32And, and then, you know, along came Gordie Lightfoot and, and Joni Mitchell and Neil Young.
16:38And, and so there's a, the songwritery thing, they look at a band like Triumph, which is larger
16:44than life and go, that's not songwriting, that's showbiz.
16:47And so then I think there's a little bit of a sort of, well, we don't want to go there.
16:52Like, like, let's make sure we honor the people that are, you know, um, the crunchy granola
16:58kinds of folks, you know, um, and I, I get that, you know, I mean, I'm as proud of that
17:05as a, as a Canadian songwriter as I am of anything.
17:09But, uh, I think it was a thing where it finally sort of got to the point, especially
17:14with the, you know, lay it on the line on the hockey, it was like a connection was being
17:19made there where Canada was going, Hey, you know, come on, let's get off the schneid here
17:25and make this happen.
17:26And so, yeah, I, I talked about this on the radio.
17:29I'm like, that's like 30 years too late as far as I'm concerned.
17:33Yeah.
17:34Well, you know, wait, we're still here, uh, and we're, we're still around.
17:39So it was, it was lovely to have our families there.
17:41And, and, uh, listen, Oh, a friend of mine, Ian Thomas, he's been around forever too.
17:46And he was getting inducted the same night and I got to sit with him and sing a song
17:50and, and, you know, his family was right beside mine.
17:53And so that kind of thing, I go, well, you know, when it happens, it happens and it's lovely.
17:58And, you know, why carp about how long it took or, you know, who cares?
18:05You know, I just thought it was a way too late.
18:07Hey Gil, since you're so tied up in all the, uh, all the stage theatrics and some of the
18:11stuff that's going on, I just saw the band avatar not that long ago.
18:14And, uh, they did some really cool things on stage.
18:17I'd never seen before.
18:18Are you bringing anything that, that maybe might wow the crowd as far as a different kind
18:22of elements that you've seen recently?
18:24Yeah.
18:24I mean, for all the, for all the scary stuff that, that AI is bringing on, you know, that,
18:30that, uh, bad actors get their hands on it.
18:32It's a real great creative tool, um, for things that, you know, that we're doing.
18:37So I know Paul and his, uh, and his team, like they're, they're using, uh, some AI tricks
18:43on, uh, some of the things for the show, you know, until we see it, you know, in, in, in,
18:48in the big venue like this and, you know, see what it actually blows up like it's, it's
18:54hard to say, uh, you know, how it'll, how it'll impact the show, but yeah, there's definitely
18:59some of that.
18:59And again, you know, we're not going to try to do things that are just gags for the sake
19:05of gags.
19:06It's, it's more like we want to tell the story visually that, you know, the songs, the
19:12lyrics of the songs are talking about and, and the, the, you know, the trajectory of the
19:17band from being, you know, three, three young knuckleheads from Canada that, you know, strapped
19:23on guitars and took on the world and, you know, where it's, where it's gone to, which
19:27none of us could ever have imagined.
19:31Um, so that's, uh, yeah, that, that, those kinds of tools that, uh, not being the only
19:36one, but that, that's one of the things that'll, that'll, that'll help with the creative process
19:41because things we couldn't done before that we can do now.
19:44So hopefully going to be cool.
19:45And speaking of Canada, I know you guys are starting this tour out in Canada.
19:50Was there a reasoning behind that or just the way the logistics worked out?
19:52No one else would take us.
19:55Fair enough.
19:57Do you remember back in 2000 and something, we went to Sweden to play a gig and it was
20:02like, Canadians were going like, why would you do that?
20:05Why wouldn't you just play here in your own backyard?
20:08And it was like, no, no, we want to go somewhere in case it's, it screws up and it's bad.
20:12And we, we want to be on the other side of the planet so that, you know, no one will
20:16see this happen.
20:18Uh, then we came back and we played Rock, La Homa and Canada was going, well, why didn't
20:22you come to Canada?
20:23You know?
20:24So I think, you know, we, this though is, is Sue really, isn't it?
20:27Because I mean, we, this is when you talk about the history of triumph, well, the first
20:32thing we did when we started playing is he went to Northern Ontario and we, and we played,
20:36you know, through the North along highway 17.
20:39And that was where we sort of honed our chops.
20:43So it's kind of like going back to the scene of the crime.
20:46And then we come right back to Toronto, which is our hometown and play the big rink.
20:50So I guess that's a serious answer.
20:53Yeah.
20:54Well, you'll be down here in Detroit, as long as you can get through the 401, I suppose.
21:00Oh, we'll be in Detroit.
21:03I'm going to get stuck in the Lincoln tunnel again.
21:05I got to come back to that scene of that crime.
21:08The Lincoln tunnel.
21:09Where's that?
21:10Well, you should know it's in Detroit.
21:13That they call the tunnel.
21:15I never did.
21:15Never heard called the Lincoln tunnel.
21:16Maybe they changed the name of it.
21:17They changed the name of buildings, you know?
21:19Yeah, I know I tried riding my Harley Davidson through there once,
21:22and they turned me around and said I couldn't do that.
21:24So for whatever reason, but I'll tell you what.
21:29It's up on Wikipedia after the interview.
21:31How's that?
21:32I'm going to have to.
21:33I might have to edit this whole part.
21:35Yeah.
21:35The Lincoln tunnel might turn out to be something that goes into Washington or into Lincoln tunnel.
21:42Maybe I got the wrong tunnel.
21:43It sounds very New York to me.
21:45It's crossed from Jersey to New York.
21:47I was thinking New York myself.
21:49Okay, so that's 10GPT right here and find out.
21:53The thing is, here we call it the Windsor Tunnel.
21:57You know, like the Windsor Tunnel.
21:58Oh, you kind of got stuck in both tunnels.
21:59I don't know.
22:01Yeah.
22:02And Rick, you've been over here with baseball games and stuff, I remember.
22:04Oh, yeah, yeah.
22:05But we would go to the bridge that was up Sarnia, you know?
22:08Yeah.
22:08That one and cross there, which is a good crossing point, really.
22:14You know, it was a little easier than having to do the Ambassador Bridge or the tunnel.
22:19So I can't remember the name of the bridge, though.
22:21It's something Rainbow Bridge.
22:23Lincoln Bridge.
22:24No, the Rainbow Bridge goes into New York.
22:26The Lincoln.
22:26Yeah, yeah.
22:27The Water Bridge goes into Michigan.
22:29Yeah.
22:29The Water Bridge.
22:31That's it.
22:32That's it.
22:33I told you guys about my trip before we started.
22:37I went to Maine, and I've never been through customs.
22:41It looked like they wanted to take my order.
22:43There was, like, three people in line, and I had to open up my passenger window and talk
22:47to the woman.
22:47There was, like, nobody there.
22:49Yeah.
22:49I once played a gig, a New Year's gig, just across the border.
22:55You know, it was like a company thing, and it was like we played, you know, Happy New Year,
22:59and we got in the car, and me and Dave Dunlop were driving back, and we pulled up
23:03to Nanny Customs, and it was like 12, 15, you know, after midnight, and there was no
23:09one.
23:10Like, it was completely empty, and the guy at the booth was going, hey, Happy New Year.
23:16It was like he was trying to make it last, because there was no one there, and we're
23:21going, yeah, because we just wanted to hightail it out, you know.
23:25Anyhow, that was funny.
23:26Like, I've never pulled up to customs when there's no one.
23:29It was nuts.
23:30Yeah.
23:30Did he recognize you?
23:34Those things usually do happen, yes.
23:36I hate to act like I'm a, you know, rock star, but yes.
23:40Actually, a lot of times what happens is you pull up, and they go, hey, are you the guy
23:44in traffic?
23:44Oh, yeah.
23:44They go, so do you know Gilmore?
23:49Well, my friends that work at the border in Canada say Ty Domi would come across all
23:53the time and actually bring eight-by-tens, and he would sign them for the guys.
23:56Oh, there you go.
23:59And we don't need to go into stories about Bob Probert trying to cross the border.
24:03We all know what happened there.
24:04But, well, I'll tell you what, as a kid who grew up in Buffalo and spent the last 30 years
24:08on WRF here in Detroit, it's really an honor and a pleasure to talk to you guys.
24:12I'm so glad you guys are back.
24:13You got these shows coming up here, the Rock and Roll Machine Reloaded, and tickets go
24:18on sale this coming Friday.
24:19I think they have some pre-sale stuff going on as well.
24:21We'll point everybody in that direction as well.
24:22But congratulations on your success, and I think I speak for many Rock and Roll fans.
24:27We're happy that you guys are back.
24:29Great.
24:30Thanks.
24:30Happy to be back.
24:32Yeah, thanks a lot, Melndown.
24:34We're happy to be back, too.
24:35The bus is officially out of the snowbank.
24:38We're all para-diddled up.
24:42There it is.
24:42Okay.
24:44All right.
24:45We'll stop right there.
24:46Thank you guys so much.
24:46I appreciate it.
24:48Okay.
24:48Okay, man.
24:49Thanks.
24:50Bye-bye.
24:52Bye-bye.
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