00:00Mesdames, Messieurs, je suis ravi d'être là. J'imagine que vous aussi, je ne suis pas un traducteur professionnel,
00:05et en tant qu'interviewer, je ne suis pas très objectif quand il s'agit de Léonard Cohen,
00:09parce que j'ai une petite affection, enfin on s'est rencontré il y a quelques années,
00:13il ne s'en souvient pas, mais moi je m'en souviens très bien, et donc je ne suis pas
00:16objectif,
00:16mais j'imagine que je ne suis pas tout seul dans cette salle.
00:19Donc je vais démarrer la session, et puis après ça sera à vous, on va faire ça le plus simplement
00:24possible.
00:25Is it easy, this kind of exercise for you, I mean, to listen to your own music
00:30in front of people who are going to judge this music?
00:33I was judging it more fiercely myself than anybody else could possibly judge it.
00:40But they were quiet, which is a good sign, I guess.
00:43I guess so. Nobody left.
00:49It seems to me that you have a special relationship with the French.
00:53I mean, I don't know why, but we were talking about it a few minutes ago,
00:58and you said, you didn't say that exactly, but you said that there was maybe an easy way
01:03for us, French, to listen to your work.
01:07Yeah, I always thought that the tradition that I work in was established here
01:18many generations ago, so that I didn't have to explain anything.
01:25So that the music and the song, the lyric, the position of the singer
01:31was already clearly understood in France and in many European cultures.
01:38It was a position that was not altogether familiar with North American audiences,
01:46but was very well familiar to European audiences,
01:52especially the French audience.
01:56Do you realize what you mean to us sometimes?
01:59It might be, you might be fed up with the kind of respect we show you,
02:03you're the perfect lover, you're the perfect singer, you're the perfect brains,
02:08you're, I mean, how does it feel?
02:10I hope it feels good.
02:11Terrific.
02:12You know.
02:13It feels really good.
02:15No, but you mean like,
02:17No, it's true, I mean what I say.
02:20Well, I appreciate that, but, you know,
02:23it's hard to respond.
02:25It's hard to respond to that kind of generosity,
02:28except by saying thank you.
02:32Since you're a very smart, brilliant man,
02:36let's put it that way, I guess you think about it,
02:38because you always seem to think about what you say,
02:42what you write, what you draw, what you do.
02:45And I was wondering,
02:47maybe you had a special thought about this.
02:50I mean, how can one, an artist,
02:53make such an impression on people all over the place,
02:56I mean, not only in France, of course.
02:59You know, I don't,
03:02like everybody else,
03:03I live on the front line of my own life,
03:06so I don't really have the luxury
03:11to examine those kind of questions.
03:14one is continually dealing with
03:16the urgencies of daily life,
03:19so I don't really speculate
03:21on the larger matters.
03:24Okay, I believe you.
03:26I met you in a monastery,
03:29and I guess you're a religious man.
03:33Correct me if I'm wrong,
03:35but it's feeling that you pay attention
03:38to what it means,
03:40I mean, the religion,
03:41religions,
03:42let's put it that way.
03:43And it's,
03:44I was listening to your record,
03:46and I was thinking,
03:48religion can make people really free,
03:50because you can express everything.
03:52I mean,
03:53it seems to me,
03:55like if you're a real free spirit,
03:57free man,
03:59it's not only a matter of age,
04:01I guess.
04:02Well, age has a great deal
04:04to do with it,
04:05I must confess.
04:11I don't know,
04:12you know,
04:13whether it,
04:15it is the result of practice
04:18or discipline,
04:19but I read somewhere
04:20that as you grow older,
04:24certain brain cells die.
04:27they're associated with anxiety.
04:30So,
04:31it doesn't really matter
04:34how much you
04:36apply yourself
04:37to the disciplines,
04:39that you're going to start
04:41feeling a lot better
04:43or a lot worse,
04:45depending on the condition
04:47of your neurons.
04:51I don't want to go private,
04:52but we were talking
04:53a few minutes ago,
04:54also,
04:54a dear friend of yours,
04:55who is one of them,
04:58four years old,
05:00and he's like a blade
05:02in his brains.
05:04I was impressed by that,
05:05you too.
05:06Well,
05:07I've been a friend
05:09and a student
05:10of an old
05:12Zen master,
05:13he's 104 years old now,
05:17and he shows
05:19no concession
05:21to old age.
05:23He seems to be
05:24at the very top
05:25of his game,
05:27so it's a great
05:29honor to be able
05:31to spend time
05:32with him.
05:33You spoke about religion,
05:36but this old teacher
05:37never speaks
05:39about religion.
05:41In fact,
05:42he indicates
05:44whenever he can
05:45that this particular
05:48study,
05:49this particular
05:51training,
05:51is not religious.
05:54It is
05:55the study
05:57of the nature
05:58of things,
05:59the study
06:00of the way
06:02that subject
06:03and object
06:04separate,
06:06and subject
06:07and object
06:07come together.
06:08So it has a kind
06:10of scientific
06:12basis
06:12that is based
06:14on individual
06:16examination
06:17under
06:18rather strenuous
06:20circumstances.
06:21So there's no
06:24dogma,
06:25there's no
06:26prayerful worship,
06:28there's no
06:28address
06:29to a deity,
06:31so it
06:32doesn't really
06:32fall
06:33under the
06:34description
06:35of a religion.
06:37it's just
06:39a kind
06:39of
06:44commitment
06:45to living
06:46in a community
06:47and in
06:49being
06:50extremely
06:51careful
06:51and aware
06:52of your own
06:54feelings
06:54and the feelings
06:55of others.
06:56It's more
06:57that kind
06:58of activity
06:58than any
07:00kind of activity
07:01that we would
07:02associate
07:02with religion.
07:04In other words,
07:05there's no faith,
07:05there's no belief,
07:08there's only
07:09activity.
07:10We were listening
07:11to your music,
07:12I was wondering,
07:13do you still
07:14learn a lot
07:14of things
07:15in your line
07:16of work?
07:17I mean,
07:17talking about
07:17music or books
07:19or drawings
07:19or anything,
07:21do you still
07:21have the feeling
07:22that you can
07:23learn,
07:23that your voice
07:24can learn
07:24something,
07:25for instance?
07:26Well,
07:27you're never
07:27free from
07:28your own
07:29stupidity.
07:31That's very
07:31true.
07:33There are
07:34abundant
07:36examples
07:37of your
07:39own
07:39incompetence,
07:41ineptitude,
07:43there are
07:43abundant
07:44opportunities
07:46for humiliation.
07:49Those
07:53realities
07:54never really
07:55dissolve.
07:56One is
07:56continually
07:57confronted
07:58with
07:58opportunities
08:00for intense
08:02and painful
08:03self-criticism.
08:06It's called
08:07All Ideas.
08:08What was the
08:09meaning exactly?
08:10It means that
08:11you are still
08:12revisiting
08:13old ideas
08:14or that
08:14old ideas
08:15are really
08:16the best
08:16after all?
08:17What does
08:18that mean?
08:19I'm not really
08:20sure what it
08:21means.
08:22It just
08:22had a certain
08:23kind of
08:24resonance.
08:26seem to
08:27be
08:29just
08:30looking
08:30into
08:31those
08:32matters
08:33that
08:34concern
08:35us.
08:37It's hard
08:38to put a
08:39finger on
08:39them.
08:40It's like
08:41what is an
08:42old friend?
08:43I mean,
08:44you could say
08:44that these
08:44are just
08:45the
08:46concerns
08:47that
08:48stay
08:49with
08:49one.
08:52just
08:52the
08:53ordinary
08:53daily
08:54concerns
08:55that
08:57arise.
08:59Tell me
09:00if I go
09:01too far,
09:01okay?
09:02I bet you
09:03told me
09:03a few years
09:04ago that
09:04you were
09:05a depressed
09:05kid,
09:06that you
09:07were depressed
09:07at seven
09:08years of age,
09:09which helped
09:10me tremendously.
09:12That's not
09:13the point.
09:13But is
09:14there a
09:14definition
09:15of a
09:15joyful
09:16depression?
09:18I don't
09:19know.
09:19I mean,
09:19depression
09:20is a
09:20serious
09:21matter.
09:24Depression
09:25is not
09:25just
09:25like
09:27a bad
09:28date
09:30or
09:30a
09:32weekend
09:32that
09:33didn't
09:33go well.
09:34When I
09:34speak about
09:35depression,
09:35I was
09:36speaking about
09:37a clinical
09:37depression
09:38that
09:38is the
09:39background
09:40of your
09:41entire
09:41life,
09:43a kind
09:44of background
09:44of anguish,
09:46of anxiety,
09:46a kind
09:47of sense
09:47that nothing
09:48goes well,
09:49that pleasure
09:51is unavailable
09:52and that
09:53all your
09:54strategies
09:56collapse.
09:58So that
10:00kind of
10:00depression I
10:01was very
10:01familiar with.
10:03I'm happy
10:04to report
10:04that at a
10:07certain point
10:08in my life,
10:08late in my
10:09life, but
10:10still I'm
10:11full of
10:11great
10:12gratitude
10:13that that
10:14depression
10:15by
10:15imperceptible
10:16degrees
10:17and by
10:19the
10:19grace
10:20of
10:22good
10:23teachers
10:23and good
10:24luck,
10:25that depression
10:26slowly
10:27dissolved
10:28and
10:29has never
10:31returned
10:31with the
10:32same kind
10:32of ferocity
10:33that
10:35prevailed
10:36for most
10:37of my
10:37life.
10:37so hopefully
10:40that's gone
10:41and hopefully
10:41it won't
10:42return.
10:43I'm going
10:44to leave you
10:44to the
10:46hands of
10:46my fellow
10:49newsmen.
10:50They are
10:50specialized
10:51into music,
10:52not me.
10:52One last
10:53question.
10:54Do you have
10:55any bad
10:55qualities,
10:56Mr. Cohen?
10:57One?
10:58Bad qualities?
10:58None.
10:59Just one?
10:59None.
11:00Please.
11:01I have no
11:02bad qualities.
11:05Do you
11:06feel,
11:07I mean,
11:08it might
11:09look silly
11:09what I say,
11:10but when
11:11people see
11:12you on
11:13a stage,
11:13for instance,
11:14it's like,
11:14if it's
11:15magic,
11:16you know,
11:16and you
11:17still enjoy
11:18it since
11:18you spent
11:19the last
11:19couple of
11:20years
11:20touring
11:20and it
11:21was a
11:22huge success.
11:23And what
11:24kind of
11:24pleasure do
11:25you still
11:25get from
11:26this meeting
11:27with the
11:28audience,
11:28with the
11:28public?
11:30Well,
11:31like any
11:32intimate
11:32relationship,
11:34it's very
11:34dangerous
11:35to discuss
11:36it.
11:37Is that?
11:40Okay.
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