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00:00I
00:54Go away, go away!
01:00Go away!
01:04For your 60, go away!
01:05For your 60, go away!
01:09Let your 60 go away!
01:10Come here, come here!
01:12Come on!
01:12Come on!
01:30Visit boat.
01:30How do you want to push that out?
01:34Yes.
01:35The roll is in the other room.
01:37The pass is on that window's face.
02:01Europe is a garden, the best that the humankind has been able to build, and the gardeners should
02:08take care of it. Together we have to show that Europe manages migration in a humane and effective way.
02:25It's not either fundamental rights or border management, it's border management and fundamental rights.
02:30They go hand in hand.
02:59And how is the weather in Med?
03:02It's half-half.
03:07You might see 30, 40, 50 vessels like this just in one day, carrying thousands of migrants.
03:15The minute we spot the boat with our airplanes, we can identify the exact coordinates where this
03:21boat is. So we inform national authorities and according to which vessel is closer, they inform
03:29us that a vessel is going to rescue these migrants. We stay on top until this vessel arrives.
04:00we stay on top until rocks are the same.
04:10We stay on top.
04:14You stay on top.
04:29Oh, my God.
05:01Yes?
05:06Yes.
05:07Let's dive in, Mr. Leitens, switch to English.
05:11Is it even possible to guard Europe's borders without violating human rights?
05:18It's a matter of definition, I think.
05:19I mean, violating is that you intentionally violate rights.
05:23But of course in policing in general and in border guarding,
05:27you're of course touching human life.
05:29You're asking them to stop.
05:32And I think no one wakes up in the morning,
05:35not a single border guard, a code guard officer,
05:38looking in the mirror and saying to himself,
05:40okay, let's violate some fundamental rights.
05:43I think all of us took the oath to serve and protect.
05:47If Europe were once more united in the sharing of its common inheritance,
05:52there would be no limit to the happiness, the prosperity.
05:55Abolish the barriers.
05:57For today, they no longer make sense.
06:19The European Union is now one of the world's largest order-free zones.
06:27Since the agreement of Schengen,
06:29our foreign borders are increasingly controlled.
06:36Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen.
06:38This press conference is about the inauguration of the Frontex agency.
06:43This is a good day for Europe because Europe will be safer.
06:47Safe external borders are an essential precondition
06:51if we want to continue to enjoy this freedom of movement.
07:04We see that in the last decades more and more migratory flows are coming.
07:09And Europe does not have a problem with migratory flows.
07:11The problem is the irregular migration.
07:14Nobody says no to people coming to Europe,
07:17but it's the irregular migration that disrupts the system.
07:22There are some push factors that push this migrant from his country.
07:27Economical, political persecutions, war,
07:31the search for a better future.
07:33The situation in their lives and the difficulties force them to do it.
07:40Fire from the sky.
07:43Fosforous bombs falling on the rebel half of Aleppo.
07:47Syriërs vluchten massaal voor het geweld
07:49en een deel van hen komt in de Europese Unie terecht.
07:55All dat is niet meer weit weg,
07:57all dat komt te ons.
08:00En dat is een historische beweringsprobe voor Europa.
08:05Locals en holidaymakers
08:06are the only ones providing support
08:08as the boats wash ashore.
08:11But it's getting harder to keep up
08:13as refugee numbers grow.
08:18The refugee camp at Moria is full,
08:21far beyond its capacity.
08:22We have so much done, we can achieve it.
08:24We've got a swarm of people coming across the Mediterranean.
08:28The migration crisis is able to destabilize the whole European continent.
08:33The Bulgarian army closes the last windows in the border.
08:39The European border guards have been taking increasingly aggressive measures,
08:44violently sending back people over the border without procedure.
08:49A guard on board raises his weapon.
08:51Moments later, shots are fired into the water.
08:57It's known as a pushback.
08:59It's more than controversial.
09:00It's illegal.
09:06EU's Coast Guard and border agency has been accused of breaking humanitarian law
09:11by illegally pushing migrants back towards Turkey.
09:14A new report has been looking into allegations that the agency has broken international and humanitarian law.
09:22This report is not about an incident or a few people, but about the structural human rights crisis at our
09:28borders and within Frontex.
09:31De directeur van de Europese Grenzen en Kunstwacht Frontex is opgestapt.
09:36Frontex-chef Fabrice Leggeri treedt terug.
09:39Er kwamen ook beschuldigingen dat Frontex bootjes met asielzoekers op de Middellandse Zee terugduwden of hinderden.
09:45Of dat de organisatie een oogje dichtkneep wanneer individuele EU-lidstaten zichzelf schuldig maakten aan dit soort illegale pushbacks.
10:01First of all, I'm very honoured and grateful that it will soon be able to lead as from March 1st
10:06Frontex.
10:08And we have indeed many challenges.
10:47I'm passionate about my job. And I like challenges.
11:10Just a second, let me make sure. Yes, you are the legal entity.
11:13Sure.
11:21Frontex, right now, 2,800 officers deployed.
11:25A couple of hundred vessels, 20 operations, 200 sites.
11:30So, okay, we're doing a big job together with the Member States.
11:35And they should not justify even one mistake.
11:40We're just trying to explain that we have a big job, big challenges, and it's not an easy job.
11:46Is that also why you're opening up to us?
11:48I think it's important to show, let's say, both sides, not of the story, but of the job.
11:56And again, people make mistakes.
12:04And perhaps sometimes even people might have the wrong intentions.
12:09But we have to face that.
12:11We have to really face that and show our colleagues, the world, the migrants, that we are to be trusted.
12:19And then you need sort of radical transparency, especially for us, being European Agency,
12:23because we have nothing to hide.
12:25For me, there are three guiding principles.
12:28First of all, accountability.
12:30And that counts for the organization as such, but also every individual Frontex officer.
12:37Second, fundamental rights.
12:40It's not either fundamental rights or border management.
12:43It's border management and fundamental rights.
12:45They go hand in hand.
12:48And last, transparency.
12:50We have to show what we do.
12:52Frontex is a European agency, so it should breathe European values.
12:57There should be absolutely no doubt about it.
13:00There should be absolutely no doubt about it.
13:06We have to speak to our own country.
13:07ŃĐŸĐČĐ”Ń untuk mana-kini, karena mereka beruhnya .
13:16And our landline is a European religion that lives,
13:19is a European religion that lives as such.
13:22There should be absolutely no doubt about it.
13:25And when we do this, we have to understand theND.
13:27rights, they are systematically violated at our external borders, for instance, through pushbacks
13:34which are happening before our eyes. And this prevents, of course, people to have access to
13:40the core of the Refugee Convention, namely access to an asylum procedure. And I must really say
13:47member states are even not hiding these practices anymore because they enjoy impunity. The commission
13:54is funding the border controls, Frontex is supporting the member states, but the violations
14:00simply continue. The commission should really step up its role as a guardian of the treaties
14:07to make sure that our common values are also applicable at our external borders. Thank you.
14:22You see that the neiging of Landers is much bigger to keep people outside the door. There
14:31goes all the political pressure. We do not do anything. Our nation will be sent to a
14:37submersion migratoire d'une ampleur jamais atteint dans l'histoire.
14:41If you are migratio tamagatja, as a terrorizmus is tamagatja. Mi ellen ezzuk a terrorizmus,
14:45ezért nem tamagatjuk om migratio.
14:47Dus, het is een heel giftig politiek klimaat, waarbinnen Frontex en ook Hans Leijters moet
14:54opereren. En dat vergt heel veel moed. Tegelijkertijd zien we nog steeds die schendingen die toen
15:02aan de handwagen gaan onverminderd door.
15:12It is now time to rise to the challenge to manage migration jointly with the right balance
15:20between solidarity and responsibility.
15:33Well, I live in Norway, and I used to go to Greece for holidays. It is kind of the
15:39Norwegian holiday country number one. So I was curious when I saw these very strange
15:47images coming out from a country where I like to go swimming, drink good food, relax.
16:00My friends told me you have to come down, you have to see it to believe it. So I did.
16:07I felt I could provide something. So that's the reason why I stayed.
16:20I got to hold the boat. Waheed, Waheed, Waheed.
16:29Drownings, dead people. It was kind of a difficult situation altogether. It was perhaps the closest I
16:41can get to a front line.
16:59Hello. You received your boat report. How can I help you?
17:10I'm sorry. I don't understand you. Could you please send me a text on WhatsApp?
17:17Please help us. We are so cold. Please.
17:22Well, Adrian Boat Report is the hotline for emergencies. I try to make sure that people who try to come
17:32into Europe gets the help they need. Help them to get from the landing point to the place where they
17:38could get assistance.
17:41We arrived from the sea. Yes, we are very tired. We need urgent, urgent help.
17:48Most of the other countries in Europe, you call 911 and you will get the help you need. So yeah,
17:53they should have called the authorities.
17:55In Greece, it's kind of the opposite. They don't want to come and help you because they don't want you.
18:14We have seen on videos taken by refugees.
18:21People on the Coast Guard vessels. We assume they are Coast Guard officers.
18:27But they have these balaclavas on them. You only see their eyes.
18:32And why would you do that if you were at sea only rescuing people doing your job?
18:41They take away their phones. Anyone trying to film them are severely beaten.
18:50They destroy the engine and then they move. They leave them.
19:12I try not to get the person involved in the cases. But in this case, I got to know one
19:21of the victims while investigating this, this, this, this, uh,
19:25a shipwreck.
19:27The sailboat was rescued by the Greek Coast Guard, but not taken to land in Greece.
19:34The passengers had been placed in four life rafts and set adrift close to the Turkish seaboard.
19:41We later got the information that one life raft was missing.
19:45The Turkish Coast Guard found a semi-submerged life raft.
19:50Six people were found dead around the life rafts and five were missing.
19:58And so, Muhammad had both of his children, three and five years old, in his arms.
20:05He tried to keep their heads above water.
20:09Um, and he was in the sea for 11 hours.
20:14For nine of these hours, he managed to keep them alive.
20:18But eventually they, the children swallowed too much water due to the weights.
20:24And they died or drowned one by one.
20:27But he kept holding them.
20:29Um, and his wife as well, she was the first to drown because he couldn't help her.
20:37Uh, because he was holding the children.
20:40Of the children.
20:55We knew that at some point, as long as I kept publishing about push-backs about Greek authorities' criminal behaviour
21:03at the border, that would try to shut me up.
21:06Try to silence me.
21:06So yeah, I'm not able to go back to Greece.
21:25MUZIEK
21:31Iets voor Ă©Ă©n uur lokale tijd ziet een vliegtuig van Frontex een vissersboot.
21:35De vissersboot zit dan in internationale wateren, ten zuidwesten van Griekenland.
21:46Er lijken geen problemen te zijn.
21:50Maar om twintig voor twee s'nachts lopen er berichten binnen over motorproblemen en komt de kustwacht dichterbij.
21:56Niet veel later kap zijnste boot.
22:05100 mensen op de kustwacht.
22:17MUZIEK
22:18MUZIEK
22:21Why did they not save us when they were 15 hours in their eyes?
22:26They saw us above, from the helicopter, from below.
22:30They all saw us and they did not save us again.
22:49I'm here also to show my solidarity and my help to the Hellenic colleagues who did their asthma upload to
22:56Seba.
22:57He was convinced that the Greek authorities had done everything in their power to rescue these people.
23:07The EU's Ombudswoman is opening an investigation into the role of the bloc's border agency Frontex.
23:27colloher.
23:59Just wash my hands, so thank you.
24:19Thank you that you accept the invitation on this press brief from Frontex.
24:25I already said that I want to engage, engage with, of course, the member states, engage
24:31with the Commission, but also with the European Parliament, civil society and media, to share
24:37what we know and also to be held accountable for what we do, and also for what we did not
24:43do, perhaps.
24:43I also said quite early, one of my ambitions is to restore, to regain trust, both in the
24:51agency and in the external, in the ecosystem of the agency.
24:54The Ombudsman criticises your agency because it works with the Greek authorities having
25:02the full knowledge of their lawful practices.
25:05So what's your response to that?
25:07I understand the logic the Ombudsman is following.
25:11I do not really agree with her.
25:13We are not the European Search and Rescue Agency.
25:16We are the European Border and Coast Guard Agency.
25:19If you look at our mandate, it mentions Search and Rescue in the line of our primary duty,
25:25namely to secure the borders and to support member states while doing that.
25:28So we do not deploy primarily for search and not for rescue at all.
25:34We made a compilation of pictures which also are connected to Frontex.
25:42So these are like pushback pictures.
25:45What is your reaction on that personally, as a person, and then as the body of the Frontex?
25:51No, I think the person do look a little bit nice for the filmmaking.
26:13Yeah, so what I see here are officers, I think, evidently showing non-professional behaviour.
26:20And that, of course, is directed towards migrants.
26:23And I think for me there is no doubt that it is neither professional nor abiding fundamental rights.
26:30So this is behaviour I would not accept.
26:33But let's make sure that this is not what we stand for as Frontex, as Europe.
26:37And how can you make sure that this doesn't happen?
26:40We cannot make sure, because we are not there, of course.
26:42Because that means that you should be present everywhere.
26:45Okay.
26:49Thank you so much for your time.
27:06This is the morning briefing, and they are talking about this data.
27:09You are in the room, and even if you are not filming, you are not allowed to hear this information.
27:14It's sensitive information.
27:15Exactly.
27:16That's the point.
27:17So if you don't mind, I would ask you to go out now.
27:21This is the morning briefing, and there are sensitive data.
27:24And there comes from Eurozone.
27:26This is a sensitive security system in Europe.
27:31This is also, for a press officer, very difficult, you know, because I'm in between, yeah?
27:37Maybe you just can film the scene.
27:39You just see the back from the people, you know, but you know that you have to blur the data,
27:45the coordinates later on.
28:00Also, we are in a changing process as well, yeah?
28:04Within this agency, and the staff has to change, and change thinking about to be more open.
28:14There was a situation, the best friend from my wife, she accused and blamed,
28:20that I was working for Frontex.
28:23And so, also, because Frontex is bad, and they have something to do with pushbacks,
28:27and they are not effective, and they are against migrants.
28:30And even in my private life, because of my job, my wife got an issue with her best girlfriend.
28:36This, I understand this, I was shocked about this, yes, how deep my job goes into my private life, you
28:44know?
28:48My wife said, you have a lack of information about Frontex, and that's why Razor is doing the job.
28:53That's why I'm here for, you know? Yeah.
28:56Yeah, so that was quite not easy sometimes. Yeah.
29:51Yay!test
29:54It
29:54was so much like myself.
29:56because the one that we have it's too big yeah yeah the radio is also from frontex this is the
30:01radio from the front of the front of us yeah it doesn't really help you if you could listen
30:06the the hellenic frequency is that doesn't know because we don't speak same language so
30:11it's just limits kind of a it's in the picture huh
30:22nice to meet you nice to meet you hello there nice to meet you nice to meet you well we
30:27met
30:27already so yeah so how are we doing here
30:54there is a sort of narrative with the smugglers that europe is the holy land they
31:00facilitate that endangering lives but of course in a perfect world there should be no need to
31:07migrate because you can have a happy and a good life in your own country
31:16it's the 100th photo of you think it's okay okay okay okay thank you
31:24thank you it's good to talk to them to see and of course this is prepared and then
31:30i get the the the upgeposted version to see
31:36but people look at you as the base of frontex and that is for a lot of people a sort
31:41of
31:41dream where they are with hard work and yeah it's a short conversation so yeah you can't
31:46break the ice not really break but i think it's a small chance that i really see the truth of
31:51it
31:51and of course there is a lot of people
31:57the boat off of full water
32:00you need your help i was contacted by a group in distress since i learned a couple days
32:06afterwards that they had been pushed back i assumed that frontex informed or contacted
32:14the greek coast guard and greek coast guard arrived
32:20and towed them back into turkish waters did frontex call greek authorities and watch them tow them back
32:27or when greek authorities arrived was frontex then ordered to leave the area i looked up this boat
32:36on footage from actually the greek press that determined that it was a frontex vessel
32:42but it shows that the frontex vessel was very close to the boat they definitely heard the cries for
32:51help and they were ignored i took the file this i've done many times um i send it over to
33:01to frontex to
33:02jones from hayden i knew then that when they receive this kind of information they start this serious incident reports
33:23and you now have eight nine assets in the air or potentially ten
33:32and most of them are drones i'm a human rights lawyer that tries to deliver on my role which is
33:42objective independent advice informing the management board what is right and what is wrong and that is
33:49what i do on a very regular basis one task that i do is monitoring making sure that border guards
34:00respect fundamental rights and of course also that the agency respects and promotes fundamental rights
34:05we are not there to guard the borders we are there to make sure that the guarding of the borders
34:10is
34:10done in the correct way
34:17how are you all right hello hello hans we have a meeting come you have some time for me sure
34:25great and you have cookies yeah the remains of cookies
34:32we have the two serious incidents where there were frontex assets that were uh involved in early
34:40stage yeah if we should do maybe a joint uh statement of that but for me it's clear that this
34:47is something that went wrong something i think i should have reported on and it actually should be
34:51taken by me because well they operated under my responsibility so i wouldn't let them sort of
34:57get away with that this is significant it's both uh perhaps not direct involvement but it is indirect
35:05and the most worrying part is that they didn't report it yeah and that that's the the the real core
35:10issue for me um so mistakes can be made but but not reporting is not an issue no no the
35:18conclusion was
35:19that um the frontex vessel had not followed the rules in in the operational guidelines also they
35:27haven't filed a report on the incident and this is quite common that the captains on these different
35:33frontex vessels don't file reports to cover up for greek authorities
35:46in this case we were lucky we had pictures and videos it ended up as an investigation in frontex
35:52that was proven to be a pushback where frontex was involved but in most cases there is no evidence
36:02there is no videos there's no pictures and there is no one who is documenting it so it's
36:08um i think it's just a tip of the iceberg here a young man is covered in bruises this video's
36:28unverified of migrants being stripped and beaten in a pushback operation where mercenaries work for
36:35greek police international ngos have recorded tens of thousands of cases of alleged brutality by
36:41border guards and people being pushed back much of it is said to be happening in bulgaria reports of
36:48abuse are common the refugees shared this unverified video of what they say are bulgarian officials beating
37:22so nice to meet you out in the district nice to meet you nice to meet you out in the
37:26district this is a
37:27mix right because there are people from frontex and from border police yeah this is the headquarters of the
37:33regional border police yeah and is there both the border police and the frontex parts they make use of the
37:40same office
37:41yeah thank you due to the terrain here because we have flat terrain and mountainous area
37:48we are not able to cover or to reach the border line still frontex is in the process of acquiring
37:56capable four by four vehicles yeah you can never patrol on your own it's always together with bulgarians
38:03right mostly yeah and but that does it then always have to be a frontex vehicle or could frontex people
38:12also be in a vehicle of the bulgarian authorities and then together with them in the mountains for
38:18instance it could be but they don't have enough uh cars yeah they also don't this rented car
38:26rented car agency doesn't allow us to drive off road yeah yeah that's a problem yeah okay no that is
38:35life it's not easy anywhere no in the beginning always it's difficult but but i think it's still
38:41important to stay vigilant and see indeed what's happening i'm i'm actually happy that serious incidents
38:47reports are submitted because then something also can be investigated um and and then it's so important
38:55that things are immediately reported and that if you see things that you immediately also address
39:01that to to to the colleagues many many years ago i don't say beating but let's say behaving in a
39:09rude way to migrants that was not usual but nobody would care or it would be normal among colleagues or
39:16nobody would dare to to to complain because of the yeah this uh mentality that okay he's a colleague
39:24what to do now it's not like that anymore someone who treats in a rude in a bad way or
39:32slapping a
39:33migrant and so on no he or she will have the consequences even from his or her colleagues and for
39:40me
39:40this is important the way of thinking and and and that you hopefully get access to the whole front line
39:47so that you are really also there to see what's going on
39:52yeah
39:55and and and this was eigenlijk precies wat ik ook in de evos in griekenland precies dezelfde discussie met
40:01frontex had van als er nou aantijgingen zijn over pushbacks op bepaalde plekken en vooral midden op de
40:09grens vragen jullie dan niet om daar ook te kunnen zijn om ook te kunnen observeren om je werk te
40:16kunnen
40:16doen het is antwoord komen nee nee nee nee wij zij bepalen alleen maar het nodig is en daar gaan
40:24we de
40:24fundamental rights observeren
40:28ik denk echt dat hans leiters doet goed doet met zijn medewerkers maar of ie hard en ferm genoeg is
40:37naar de
40:38gastlanden waar hij werkt dat durf ik niet zo goed te zeggen
40:59hey jongen sorry bother you on the weekend listen so a quick background uh hans is speaking to
41:05that radio in a few minutes i just want to quickly check on the progress in bulgaria
41:10on the phone door it's okay okay okay okay
41:16if they keep on pushing bulgaria and greece i will tell them that if they want someone to
41:21be accountable for this they should invite bulgarian and greek investor not me yeah because i'm not
41:26it's not unlimited what i can do of course and it's also important that i act with the presumption
41:32that there is a flaw that it's functioning well because if not it should be the commission and by
41:37the way the european parliament that should intervene on that it's not my uh neither my league
41:42nor my remit the lakmoes proef van leitens straffeloosheid aan de grenzen van europa
41:48goeiemiddag hans leitens vanuit warschau goedemiddag
41:51u zit op uw kantoor van het europese grenzagentschap frontex in bulgaria vinden
41:57veelvuldig pushbacks plaats daar worden rapportages gemaakt vaak op basis van meldingen van frontex
42:02agenten en wat is dan de de follow-up bij zo'n rapport kijk als het geen frontex mensen betreft
42:08dan
42:08wordt dat gemeld aan het land want die zijn verantwoordelijk voor hun eigen mensen ja het is
42:12om te beginnen heb ik heb ik geen lijk geef ik geen leiding over de burghase grenswacht in dit geval
42:17dat betekent dat afhankelijk van het land wordt het gemeld aan de betreffende organisatie dat
42:22in dit geval dan de de burghase grenswachters en aan het toezichthouder daar wij moeten er van
42:29uitgaan dat het land zelf en dat de rechtsstaat daar goed functioneert en dat betekent dus dat
42:33zij verantwoordelijk zijn voor de voor het echte onderzoeken want wij kunnen geen
42:37strafrecht onderzoek doen u weet ook dat dat niet gebeurt wacht even laat me even een verhaal
42:41afmaken dan vervolgens is het aan het land zelf om dat onderzoek te doen daar kun je
42:46ons questionaal te verbinden en dat terug te rapporteren ik heb geen enkele
42:49verantwoordelijkheid en bevoegdheid om daarin te reden dat is een afhankelijkheid die ik heb dat
42:53kan frustrerend zijn voor de mensen die u net sprak in bulgarijen dat is ook
42:56rustig en voor mij soms maar dat is wel de de zettingen waarin moet werken meer kan
43:00ik ook niet doen zo wat did you think yeah happy happy
43:09Hans Leighton promised more transparency
43:16I haven't seen it
43:19I don't know if you want my personal opinion on
43:21on on on I think he's for me he's more like a puppet
43:29you don't have any real power the power is in the in the board of Frontex
43:35the EU Commission
43:37and he's just a face
43:40I don't know if you have I haven't seen any reports that shows me that
43:45this figure has done anything positive for Frontex
43:50I would like to read them if they exist but so far
44:22um
44:24As a journalist, I've grown many years into the European migration policy.
44:28But it seems that the deeper you dive into it, the more difficult it becomes.
44:54If something goes wrong.
44:59We had the Pylos incident, of course, and the cameras were not on.
45:04And we had the report of the Greek Ombudsman with the audio files.
45:08I can't answer that question.
45:09Yes, it was not in Crete.
45:13Yes, it is not something about Crete and he is not willing to reply.
45:18But you have a heart. What do you think?
45:21Like as a man, as a human being?
45:25I can speak if I put my opinion on it, but I can't speak about it.
45:29I can't speak as a person who is working on this issue.
45:33But as a human being?
45:35But as a human being, I mean...
45:38I can't answer that question. It's hard to answer that question.
45:43He can't respond to this issue.
45:45And you guys don't?
45:46Look at that. The Limeininko has saved hundreds of thousands of people over the years.
45:52With the pandemic.
45:54It's difficult to do things in the sea.
45:56So at some point, it can happen.
45:59But it can happen.
46:00It's not a surprise.
46:01We have no feelings.
46:02We have to stand on it with the Limeininko's Department.
46:03We have to do not try to run away with the family.
46:08On the other hand, we have to go through the towel...
46:11...that they support.
46:14They help a lot of money out since these two days.
46:19We cannot allow it.
46:25I've heard a lot about Frontex and the Guitse Kustwacht that it doesn't fit our responsibility.
46:34That's not my responsibility.
46:36The responsibility is obviously in blocks, or in boxes, or whatever.
46:42And it doesn't reach outside.
46:44On the one hand we don't know what we should do, and on the other hand it's very simple.
46:49Because from left to right we're always talking about legal routes.
46:52And we don't have that yet.
47:04And finally, the people who are talking about the people who are fleeing, the migrants, are there.
47:13Can you tell me the day that you left Sudan to flee?
47:17Me and my wife work in the pharmacy, because we are pharmacists.
47:21Both of you.
47:23After the war started, we lost our job.
47:26So the militias, they came to my house.
47:30We have no time for taking anything.
47:33We must go, or we must kill.
47:36This one is a way for Egypt, and this one is a way for Libya.
47:41You know, three days without food, without water.
47:44So this was on the beach in Libya?
47:46Yeah.
47:46Wow, you look really tired.
47:48Yeah.
47:48Yeah, like a different woman.
47:51Yeah.
47:51Wow, wow, wow, this is you?
47:53Yeah, this is me.
47:55Skinny also.
47:57Skinny also.
47:58Do you remember the last thing you were thinking when you went on the ship?
48:03Ah, the people of Sudan.
48:05Finally, I thought about it.
48:08If something happened when we were in the sea,
48:11they would be worried about what happened.
48:14Yeah.
48:15It's okay, we reached the same place.
48:24No?
48:34As a journalist, you get a step higher.
48:37You see things on the ground.
48:40You write about it.
48:41You go to institutions to get responsibility.
48:44So you have conversations.
48:46But despite that you get a step higher,
48:48you get a step higher,
48:51you get a step higher
48:52that's a big jump.
48:56I thought I was just saying
48:58that I was on the bell by Hans Leites
49:00and he knew it.
49:01That was naive.
49:16Frontex, sir, that does everything
49:19to ensure that I could not arrive to Italy.
49:22The freedom of movement is everybody's right.
49:26We are here and we will fight.
49:31It is Frontex who plays the role of watchman.
49:34Really?
49:35Look me in the eyes and tell me again.
49:37I'd rather be called a murderer.
49:40But perhaps that's your next statement.
49:44Vis was presented to Philippines.
49:44Or there are two, three,
49:47in the past.
49:48So you would enjoy yourself by having asked the xi.
49:57You would enjoy the peace of everything.
49:58And then of course you will feel the peace of life
50:05and the full power of the."
50:06We will stay with you for your
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