- 2 days ago
After the remains of a 16-year-old girl are found in the woods with no identification, Gwinnett County detectives have little to go on to find her killer; in the pursuit of justice, the prosecution must prove the girl was murdered despite the lack of evidence for what caused her death.
Category
📚
LearningTranscript
00:11Investigators aren't saying how the woman died, but are calling the death suspicious.
00:15An elderly woman was murdered and her death was horrendous. Both of her hands were nearly
00:22severed completely off. It turns people into something that they're not. That, right there,
00:29is what you did. That ain't what I did. I'm telling you. And you can tell me Martians
00:34did it. I don't know who did it. And you know what? We have bull**** lie versus forensic evidence
00:40that you did it. Whatever you want to say, man. I'm done talking. That's it.
00:569-1-1, where's your emergency? My neighbor lady. Someone might have broken their house
01:01and killed her or something. I don't know where the address is. She is south of us.
01:09And why do you think that, um... My husband just went out. She's by herself over
01:13there. He saw tracks. Footprints going up. Nobody in through the door. You look. Her pants are
01:24down. She's lying on the floor. When I arrived at the scene, I met with several of the other detectives.
01:36I was told that there are some suspicious circumstances surrounding the death of the
01:41victim. So as you made entrance into the back door of the residence, the victim was laying in a pool
01:49of
01:49blood. The victim had both of her hands nearly severed completely off. And she did look like she had been
01:58struck in the head. Lying next to her was her cane. The cane was dented in. And that weapon was
02:05most likely
02:06the cause of the head injury. This is a violent and traumatic death. Somebody waited till she was alone
02:13and violently slaughtered her.
02:31He said that Mary kept to herself. Stayed in the house most of the time. But she was passionate about
02:37going to church. She was passionate about her faith and helping people that needed help.
02:42We learned that her husband had passed away about four years earlier.
02:49Mr. Kovacek, the neighbor, took it upon himself to kind of monitor her, take care of her, get her mail.
02:56On this particular morning, there was fresh snowfall. So he went over and shoveled the sidewalk.
03:02And when he couldn't make contact with the victim, he looked inside. He saw Mary Martinchuk
03:08laying on the dining room floor in a pool of blood.
03:15When we start to piece the scene together, it's easiest for us to work from outside in.
03:20We found some tire impressions in the driveway.
03:25And shoe impressions accompanied some small droplets of blood.
03:30When we looked inside, we did locate one almost complete bloody shoe print.
03:35It seemed to be the same footprint that we found in the snow outside.
03:42When we were searching the kitchen, we located Ms. Martinchuk's log of her blood sugar.
03:49That morning at 8.20, she had logged that she had taken her insulin.
03:55And the time that we got the call was after 11.
03:58So we had a very small window of when this crime occurred.
04:02In the living room, there were some void patterns in the dust on the entertainment stand.
04:10And we were able to find some receipts indicating that she had purchased a TV and a DVD the previous
04:17year.
04:18So we knew we had some missing items.
04:22We also couldn't locate the victim's purse.
04:25Finally, we collected pieces of evidence that we submitted for DNA analysis.
04:31There were definitely two schools of thought.
04:34One was that this was a home invasion robbery that had gone wrong.
04:39And the second theory was that Mary had been killed by somebody that she was intimately familiar with.
04:47Because of the brutality of the attack.
04:56A week after the murder, we received a call from the Ashtabula City Police Department.
05:01They let us know that the man named Jose Reynoso had located Ms. Martinchuk's purse on the morning of the
05:07murder.
05:08Sitting in the street about 12 miles away from Ms. Martinchuk's home.
05:13The purse was turned over to the Ashtabula Police Department, but not linked right away to our murder.
05:21Very close to a high drug trafficking area.
05:23So it was very possible that the person that killed Ms. Martinchuk did so for valuables that they were going
05:30to later exchange for drugs.
05:32Detective Ward and I recovered the purse, and then we went to speak to Mr. Reynoso at home.
05:38Jose said that he worked 12-hour shifts on the morning of the murder.
05:44He claimed to have left to work around 11.
05:46However, when we met with his employer, we learned that he got off of work at 7.15.
05:52So that was a red flag.
05:56We couldn't rule out the fact that this person, who is seemingly a good Samaritan, might be actually involved in
06:03the murder.
06:11This should only take a couple of minutes, just to go through the timeline again.
06:17If you can just start to think back to the day that you found the purse.
06:22Did you drive to work that day?
06:24Yeah.
06:24You drove the Taurus?
06:26Yeah.
06:26Okay.
06:27And afterwards, where did you go?
06:30After work that day?
06:32After...
06:32Shoot, man.
06:35Me and my girl, we should have run out of the house from her.
06:37Because she lived upstairs, you know, and let me stay there with her.
06:41Do you remember seeing the purse when you passed there?
06:45No.
06:46Because, see, I turned, you know, I flew into, you know, the driveway, whatever.
06:51I walk in, you know, say hi to my girl.
06:54All right.
06:54You know, a little bit.
06:55Okay.
06:56Remember, we went and got cigarettes.
06:58You know, as soon as we walked in, her grandpa was like, is that a purse out there?
07:02You know, my girl was like, where, where, you know?
07:05So, she looked at the window, she's like, how do you look?
07:08There's a purse out there.
07:09So, we walked to her, I pick it up, you know, I hand it to my girl.
07:13They call the cop, you know?
07:14Right.
07:14That one looks right.
07:16And a couple days later, you know, because her grandma, she always read the newspaper,
07:21you know, she's like, freaking out, baby, look, this is the lady that we found the purse.
07:25She's dead.
07:26I'm like, holy .
07:27Do you remember what condition the purse was in when you found it?
07:31Like, was it muddy?
07:33Was it torn?
07:35Was it wet?
07:36Was it?
07:38No, it wasn't wet.
07:39I mean, I grew up with, and handed it to her, I didn't want it to inside.
07:44I mean, the outside was dry, like a, you know, normal purse.
07:48So, how did you schedule it?
07:50Like, our boss, he let us, like, he knows I'm going through a bad situation and I didn't
07:55get money.
07:55So, he's like, I'll tell you what, you know, I'll let you work 12 hours.
07:58All right.
07:59Seven days a week.
08:00By the time I get home, I'll be a little bit after 11.
08:02He gave the statement that he left work at 11 that morning, but we know that he actually
08:08left work at, at seven.
08:10That's a problem.
08:13Normally, you're out at 11.
08:15Yeah.
08:16But think back to the day that you found the purse.
08:19If your time card said that you were out Sunday morning at 7.15.
08:26You know, I might be wrong.
08:28You know, there's some days that there's, like, nothing going on.
08:32Our boss, you know, just go home for a day, you know, just sleep.
08:36All right.
08:36I might be wrong with the time, but most of the time, like every day, there's just
08:41barely there since I could understand it.
08:43And afterwards, you go to her house, and you didn't make any stops in between, right?
08:48Mmm.
08:50Yeah, but I can remember, to be honest with you.
08:54Is there anything at all that you could remember that might help us?
08:58Whenever we grabbed the purse, there was no cards at all.
09:01Whoever did it, we just missed it.
09:06All right.
09:07Man, I was hoping that, uh, you remember something.
09:12Nobody picked you up, drove you around anyway?
09:14No.
09:15No.
09:16I don't got a whole lot of friends, you know.
09:20During the interview, we did check the tire tread on Jose Reynoso's vehicle and concluded
09:27that it was not those tires that left the tread pattern in Mary Martin Truck's driveway.
09:32And when comparing Jose Reynoso's shoe prints to the bloody shoe pattern that we found in
09:39the dining room, we were able to eliminate him based on the shoe size.
09:44Let's get you back home.
09:46Okay.
10:00At some point, our victim scratched the suspect, and I don't believe there's any better evidence.
10:07There was also DNA on the doorknob, the cane, and the coaxial cable from the back of the television.
10:17Now we just have to find who left that profile there.
10:21And that's a lofty task, because we have no idea who it was.
10:34We're able to eliminate them very quickly, but when we exhaust the most likely contacts,
10:38then we have to cast a little bit of a wider net and become really imaginative in finding the murdered.
10:46We knew that Mary was missing a TV and a DVD player, so we looked at the receipts.
10:52I learned that two employees from Griffiths Furniture went to Mary Martin Chuck's residence about eight months earlier
10:59to unbox and hook up the TV and DVD player.
11:04We felt that the workers would be potential suspects.
11:07I was able to get statements from them and get DNA from both of those individuals.
11:21After several months of getting nowhere, we finally got a break.
11:36Mary was an independent woman.
11:38She was active in her church, and she loved to volunteer.
11:44Mary loved to bake.
11:45And one activity that Mary took part in at her church was a holiday cookie exchange.
11:50She would bake a set of cookies, and these cookies would be boxed up
11:55and brought to the senior citizens in the community to enjoy during the holidays.
12:00This crime was definitely shocking to Asheville County.
12:05It was frightening for people to learn that Mary had been killed
12:09and that she was home alone when this horrific crime happened to her.
12:28Tommy Richter from Griffiths Furniture was identified as the source of the DNA
12:33on the evidence collected from the murder scene.
12:35And I thought to myself, after months of getting nowhere,
12:39I'm going to finally get this thing solved.
12:40It really just does start the clock ticking for us to try and figure out if there's a motive
12:45and trying to figure out if he had an accomplice
12:47and trying to see if he's responsible for other crimes that are similar to this.
12:51We started digging into his criminal history.
12:55Tommy was a 49-year-old general laborer, and he was divorced.
13:00He was no longer employed with Griffiths Furniture.
13:03He floated from job to job.
13:06He was most likely at this time unemployed.
13:08We learned that he was a severe crack cocaine user known to steal from people he knows
13:14to support his habit.
13:17So this told us that it was very possible that Tommy Richter killed Miss Martin Chuck
13:22so he could steal the television to get money to buy more drugs.
13:40It was determined that I would interview him and Detective Cleveland would monitor from an adjacent room.
13:45In this particular case, we have DNA, but a confession that ties up any loose ends.
13:52Tommy Richter was very cooperative when we brought him in and talked to him months earlier.
13:56So my plan was to kind of explain to him that this case has gone cold
14:01and lay a little bit of information on the table and see if Richter will bite.
14:10Okay.
14:11All right.
14:12All right.
14:12We're bringing in all the witnesses, anybody that had contact with Miss Martin Chuck,
14:19anybody that had been at her house.
14:22What is her name?
14:23Miss Martin Chuck.
14:24Martin?
14:25Martin Chuck.
14:26We're just trying to go back and rehash all this information and see if there's something that we missed, okay?
14:33Oh, sure.
14:33When I talked to you, the last time you confirmed that you did go there with one or two other
14:38guys.
14:38Yes, one.
14:39It was Matt that I was there with.
14:41All right.
14:42And what were you and Matt taking over there at the time?
14:45Delivering.
14:47A TV, and I think that was, I'm not sure, a television.
14:53I remember taking the television there.
14:55I do remember that.
14:57And Matt hooked it up?
15:00Matt hooked it up, yes.
15:02Yes, yes.
15:04See, I always liked it.
15:05See, there was a, especially televisions and things like that because you have to do all the, you know,
15:12programming and all that stuff, and Matt and them, they was really good at it.
15:15Yeah.
15:15So what I did is help carry the TV in and just open the box, put it up, everything like
15:21that.
15:21They, uh, get up, programmed it.
15:23We're gone.
15:24Okay.
15:25That's right.
15:28And you're adamant that you've been to her house one time?
15:32Oh, one time.
15:34One time.
15:36What was the reason for leaving Griffiths?
15:39I don't really have no reason that I left Griffiths.
15:42There was really no reason that I did.
15:43Did you quit or did they terminate?
15:47I quit.
15:47In doing this investigation, talked to some people that said that there might be some substance abuse problems on them.
15:53Yeah, I did. I did have substance abuse issues.
15:55Okay. How long have you been clean now?
15:57Uh, months. I'm not really sure.
16:03Several months?
16:04Several months.
16:05Several months?
16:05Several months, yes.
16:07Yeah, what was your drug of choice?
16:10Uh, cocaine.
16:12It's crack or powder?
16:13I prefer powder.
16:15And, Ted, have you ever done crack?
16:17Uh, I've tried it before, but it wasn't for me.
16:21Okay.
16:22I mean, cause the reason I'm asking is your work history is kind of reflective of somebody that's had an
16:27addiction.
16:28They'll get a job, and they'll stay clean for a while, and then they'll fall off, and then they'll end
16:32up losing their job.
16:33Yeah.
16:34Is that kind of what?
16:35No, at that time, uh, I was just, uh, I was going through a divorce with him.
16:40I was married, going through a divorce.
16:42And, uh, this was going through a rough time.
16:45Yeah.
16:45And I left, uh, Griffiths.
16:48I knew he was lying about his substance abuse problems, and these little lies are starting to add up.
16:55So, I wanted to kind of shift gears here and start really focusing on the crime.
17:01Tommy, have you been in trouble before?
17:03Any criminal history or anything like that?
17:05Um, I think...
17:08No.
17:09Any misdemeanor arrests, thefts, or anything like that?
17:13Misdemeanor arrests, thefts, no. No thefts or anything like that, no.
17:16Getting back to the delivery of the TV at Martin Chuck's house, we've got some issues.
17:25Okay?
17:26Okay.
17:27And we need to address those.
17:30We've got some evidence pointing at you for this crime.
17:33I think you have some explaining to do here.
17:37Now, just talking to you, you seem like a decent guy.
17:40But, Tommy, you're at this lady's house.
17:44Items came up missing.
17:47Oh, man, you can't do this to me.
18:00We have evidence pointing at you.
18:03Everything comes back to you.
18:05What's the bottom line here?
18:06But the bottom line is we're investigating a murder.
18:10An elderly woman was murdered.
18:13And her death was horrendous.
18:15I can't even imagine what she went through.
18:17Really?
18:18I mean, it's unfathomable.
18:20You know, and the family wants answers.
18:22Right.
18:22But how in the world is it pointing back to me, is what I want to know.
18:25I'm done beating around the bush.
18:27I'm not laying my cards on the table.
18:29We have evidence that points to you.
18:34Okay.
18:35And you're saying you did not kill that lady.
18:37Oh, I'm saying I did not kill that lady.
18:40There was a little bit of nervous tone in his voice.
18:42But I felt that he was waiting for this moment.
18:45And he was trying not to overreact and lay it on too thick.
18:49I certainly didn't want to disclose the location of the DNA evidence.
18:54That might have caused him to shut down.
18:56But I thought maybe a little bit more of information would push him over the edge and tell us what
19:02happened.
19:04I want to be fair to you.
19:05You've been up front and you've been cooperative with us.
19:08Absolutely.
19:09I don't have nothing to hide.
19:10I guess the question is, was there anybody else with you?
19:13During the delivery?
19:14No, no, no.
19:15During this crime.
19:17I wasn't in no crime.
19:18There was no crime for me, man.
19:20Then how do you explain your DNA being in areas of that house?
19:25I don't know.
19:26I don't know what you're speaking of.
19:28What we did, we went through the back door, delivered the television, hooked it up, left.
19:33That's it.
19:35So DNA you're speaking of or anything like that is beyond me.
19:39I don't know.
19:44And the only person that was with me in that house at all was Matt.
19:49That's it.
19:51Which is very interesting for somebody that did most of the work there.
19:54I didn't find any of his DNA.
19:57Who?
19:59He did do most of the work there.
20:01All I did is help unpack the television.
20:03From the time that you guys installed the television to the time that this crime happened,
20:09several months had gone by.
20:11Right.
20:11Right.
20:12Okay.
20:12So the quality of the evidence is going to deteriorate in that timeframe.
20:19However, yours was spot on.
20:20It was right there.
20:21It was fresh.
20:23I don't know what you're speaking of.
20:24That's the only thing I can tell you.
20:26I delivered a f***ing TV and that's it.
20:29Other than that, I wasn't around that house.
20:31Never been there afterwards?
20:32Never, ever been there afterwards.
20:34And never met that woman before in your life?
20:36Never met that woman before in my life, before the delivery of her television.
20:40Never.
20:41Never.
20:43I want to know what you're speaking of, really.
20:46I'm telling you.
20:47We're talking about a murder.
20:48I know.
20:48I'm looking at you.
20:50The evidence points to you as the suspect.
20:51You're right.
20:52That's what I'm talking about.
20:54That's all I can tell you.
20:55All right.
20:55I'll be right back.
20:56All right.
21:00At that point, I did feel like he wasn't going to disclose that he had any involvement
21:05in this whatsoever.
21:07Detective Cleveland approaches things a little bit differently than I do.
21:10He likes to get up close and personal with the suspects.
21:13And I thought, well, you know what, let him take a crack at Tommy Ricker and see what
21:17happens.
21:18Here's the deal.
21:20Detective Ward when he was talking to him.
21:22I was watching and I see that you're getting frustrated that you're not sort of being told
21:27straight up why you're being linked as a suspect in this crime.
21:32And I think you're entitled to an explanation.
21:35I hope so.
21:35Okay.
21:36So I'm going to break it down to you just like you've never seen it before.
21:39Everything that-
21:40What do you have on me, dude?
21:41Well, what are you saying that you have on-
21:43Your DNA is all over the crime scene, buddy.
21:45Like what?
21:47All over the place.
21:49The only time I was in that house ever delivered totally-
21:52He's not.
21:52We're past that.
21:54This is why we have you here today.
21:56And this is why we're talking to you today.
21:58Your DNA is all over the place.
21:59Your DNA is on doorknobs.
22:01Your DNA is on her cane.
22:02Your DNA is on her body.
22:05Your DNA is on where the television-
22:07Whatever, man.
22:08No, no.
22:09We're done.
22:10I'm not a bull****.
22:13I'm not here to be sitting here in judgment of you.
22:16I'm not here to be somebody who is trying to be coy or smart with you or think that they're
22:22better than you.
22:23Buddy, what we're doing right now here talking to you, we do every week.
22:29Stuff like this in Ashtaville County, I don't know if you read the papers a lot, there's a lot of
22:33murders that go along.
22:34No, I don't read the papers a whole lot.
22:35And you know why there's a lot of murders in Ashtaville County?
22:37Because there's a lot of drugs in Ashtaville County.
22:40We have a county of 100,000 people that are good, solid, decent people, but when they get exposed to
22:46some poison, it turns people into something that they're not.
22:50I don't believe that the person that went in there and did that had any intent in the world of
22:55hurting that lady.
22:55I don't know, man.
22:56I don't know nothing about that.
22:58The person that went in there, thought that she probably wasn't there, and went in there to take something so
23:04that they could go buy drugs.
23:06Like happens every week here.
23:08It could possibly be. I don't know.
23:11And what I happen to know about her is that she is a fiery woman, and I think this fiery
23:17woman got into it with the person that was there to take something, and things got out of hand.
23:21That's what I think.
23:23But, you know what? We won't know. And there's a lot different case to be made for that than there
23:31is for somebody planning to go in there and killing her deliberately.
23:34But we don't know which one it is. We agree that one's a lot more serious than the other.
23:38I don't know either. I don't know either, man.
23:40I delivered the television. That was it. So, that's all I got to say.
23:45We are past whether or not you were involved in killing her. We're done with that. We're past that.
23:52But question what we're trying to determine. Is this something you thought about and planned?
23:57Man.
23:57Slaughter this woman like that?
24:09Our job is to find the entire story behind why somebody did something.
24:14We want to know, is the reason that something happened that they have a mental deficiency?
24:18Is the reason that something happened that they have an anger issue?
24:23I have no mental... I don't have no anger issue. I have no mental issue. You know, anything like that.
24:28How long do you have clean? How long do you have sober?
24:32Months and months. Months.
24:34Did you go to meetings? Are you working the program? That's my question.
24:37No. No. I didn't feel like I was that bad until they had to go to the program. I don't
24:41need anything.
24:42It's difficult interviewing. People are suffering from addiction because addiction is a disease of just lying.
24:47And he was not at the point where he was used to dealing with honest people.
24:53So I thought that it was very important to let him know that in this instance we were interested in
24:59the truth.
25:00What's the worst thing that you have done while you were using?
25:04Honestly, straight up no bull****.
25:06No, this is what we're going to do.
25:07Take my paycheck and spend it on something or whatever.
25:10This is what we're going to do right now.
25:12I don't think that you as a man deserve to be told anything but the 100% truth from this
25:17seat.
25:17And me as a man, I don't deserve anything but 100% truth from your seat.
25:21Okay.
25:21Are you shaking on that?
25:23Yeah, sure.
25:24So, did you ever steal from your aunt?
25:28My aunt?
25:29Uh, yeah.
25:31I've sold something.
25:32Did you ever steal from your ex-wife?
25:35Some things, yeah.
25:37Do you think that those are some things that you've done because of your addiction that are not glamorous?
25:43Well, there's a lot of things that people sold or whatever to get money.
25:50But murder, I mean, get out of here, man.
25:53I don't want to hear that.
25:54That's...
25:55This is what I think.
25:57Part of my opinion is that you are a good man.
26:00A good man polluted by some poison for a short period in your life.
26:06And out of some desperation and needing some money, you put yourself in a situation that got out of control.
26:13No way, man.
26:14Listen, man.
26:15I don't know what you're getting at.
26:16You know, what's going on here.
26:17You don't know what I'm getting at.
26:19You need to work on getting past this.
26:23You need to explain to me because...
26:25Man, you ain't putting this shit on me.
26:27I'm telling you.
26:27No, no, no.
26:28This stuff is on you.
26:29No way, man.
26:30This stuff is on you.
26:31No way.
26:32And you need to work on getting past this.
26:35This is on you.
26:37This is me officially telling you that it's on you.
26:39No way, man.
26:40No way, man.
26:41At that point, I wanted to go in a radically different direction.
26:44And that was getting to be more confrontational instead of accepting.
26:50Sometimes that snaps people back to reality.
26:53My question starts to be is, are you just somebody who made a mistake one time?
27:01Or are you somebody who does this all the time?
27:05I didn't make a mistake any time as far as murder or whatever goes.
27:08No how, no way.
27:11That, right there...
27:12What the hell?
27:13Is her.
27:16That.
27:17I don't understand.
27:17Oh, man.
27:18I see it now.
27:19Yeah.
27:20That is what you did.
27:21That ain't what I did.
27:22That is what you did.
27:23That is not what I did.
27:26Not what I did, man.
27:27You can shake your head.
27:28You can look away.
27:30You can lie.
27:31All that you want.
27:32But you...
27:33The facts don't lie.
27:36Man.
27:37The facts do not lie.
27:38The facts do not lie.
27:38You're wrong.
27:39You're wrong.
27:40No, I'm not.
27:42You're wrong, man.
27:43I didn't do anything like that.
27:44I couldn't do anything like that.
27:46I ain't doing that.
27:47No.
27:47No.
27:48I will agree this.
27:50There is a possibility that you could have been there with somebody else.
27:54There to take a television with somebody else and somebody else did this.
27:58Dude.
27:59But you were at least there.
28:00I was not there.
28:01I delivered a television, whatever you want to say, whatever you want to do.
28:05Nobody is going to believe that.
28:0712 people up there are not going to believe your DNA.
28:11Man, get out of here.
28:13I'm done talking right now, man, about this stuff.
28:16That's ridiculous.
28:18I delivered the television, dropped it off, got in the truck, boom.
28:22Gone.
28:23Simple as that.
28:25It bothers me that you don't show any rumors.
28:29Get out of here.
28:29Man, get out of here.
28:31No, I'm done.
28:31It bothers me that you don't show any rumors.
28:34Unbelievable, dude.
28:36You're good at it.
28:37You're good at your job, whatever.
28:38But he ain't putting this on me.
28:40No how, no way.
28:41No, it's on you.
28:42And your DNA is the last person's DNA on the doorknob.
28:45How do you explain that?
28:46Get out of here, man.
28:47Somebody doesn't come through.
28:48There ain't no way.
28:49There's no way.
28:50There is a way.
28:51You are throwing your life away.
28:53I don't want to hear this stuff, man.
28:54You are throwing your life away.
28:55I know.
28:56You can get past this.
28:59That's insanity, man.
29:01This is crazy.
29:02Don't let this define you.
29:04Get past this.
29:06Get past this.
29:07What are you saying, man?
29:09I want to know exactly.
29:11I delivered a total vision.
29:13That's it.
29:14So you can think and say what you want or try to push this on me.
29:18It ain't happening.
29:19There ain't no damn way.
29:21No.
29:21We're past that.
29:22Whatever you want to say, man.
29:24I'm done.
29:25I'm done talking.
29:26That's it.
29:27That's crazy.
29:28Don't do this to yourself, please.
29:30Do what to myself?
29:32You protect myself?
29:33Kicking you down this road of lies.
29:35Get out of here, man.
29:36I'm done.
29:37I'm done.
29:38I'm done.
29:39What's the next step?
29:40The next step is that you're under arrest for irate and murder.
29:53If you're finished, then we'll take you back to the gym.
29:58I'm finished talking, but there's no way that I did this.
30:02Stand up, man.
30:03Come on.
30:04For real.
30:06I sat here and I promised you no bullshit lies for me.
30:09And that's what you're getting.
30:11I'm here to sit here.
30:12I will sit in this chair, listen to you, and talk to you all day long.
30:17You control how long that happens.
30:19And you've said that we're done.
30:21If you're done, then I'll pull it off.
30:23There's nothing else I can tell you.
30:24There's nothing else I can tell you.
30:26Tell me the truth.
30:27The truth is.
30:28Okay.
30:28Here's the truth.
30:29My truth?
30:30Yeah.
30:31According to you, you're saying prior to this, I delivered a television.
30:36According to this.
30:36That's it.
30:37That is the story I've got to tell you.
30:39That is it.
30:40That's all there is to it.
30:41Why did you quit it?
30:42There's times I didn't even show up to go to work at all.
30:47Why?
30:48Um, slept in, just didn't feel good that day, whatever.
30:51It was a delivery job.
30:52It wasn't like it was any kind of, you know, executive position or anything like that.
30:57The delivery guy.
30:58It paid the bills.
30:59It gave you gas money.
31:00It paid the bills.
31:01It paid the gas money.
31:02Whatever I did in my life has nothing to do with murdering somebody.
31:06No, it has a hundred percent to do with somebody.
31:08I didn't do it.
31:10I know that my time with him is short at this point.
31:12I'm not getting through to him.
31:14The close relationship that we had had earlier has eroded.
31:17So, at that point in time, it was important for us to keep hammering home to him that we're
31:22not going to accept the lie.
31:23We need to let him know what this next process is going to look like.
31:28You can disavow responsibility to stuff to yourself all you want, but when you go upstairs
31:34at that jail and you lay down tonight, this is going to be running through your head.
31:38Man, no way.
31:38And you know what it should.
31:39No how, no way.
31:40No way.
31:41Yeah.
31:41This is bull**** and crazy.
31:43This is insane, man.
31:44No.
31:45I don't understand what you're going to do.
31:47No, we're...
31:47Okay.
31:49Understand what I'm getting at.
31:51You are being arrested for the murder of that woman.
31:54Right.
31:55I can't believe that.
31:56And you're in a police station.
31:58Right.
31:58And they are telling you your DNA is on the body.
32:01Okay.
32:01And I'm telling you that I did not do that.
32:04I'm telling you that I delivered a television.
32:06I'm telling you...
32:07And you can tell me Martians did it.
32:09I don't know who did it.
32:10And you know what?
32:10We have bull**** addicts lie versus forensic evidence that you did.
32:15And at the end of the day, I don't give too **** to what you tell me.
32:19Okay.
32:20You're getting charged with it.
32:21It was important for him to know that his lie is not going to get him anywhere.
32:29Because at the end of the day, we have Tommy Richter's DNA underneath Mary Martinschuk's fingernails.
32:35We'll go over and we're going to make a brand new treat to go back then.
32:38Stay quick.
32:42You're wrong, sir.
32:44That's all I'm telling you.
32:45Detective Cleveland and I spoke briefly after he left the interview room.
32:50I think we both agreed that it was kind of pointless continuing on.
32:54I said we're not going to get our confession.
32:56We wanted to leave it at a place where it's inviting for him to come back.
33:00When you treat people with dignity, they'll sometimes decide to come and tell us the truth in a subsequent interview.
33:06What the hell, man?
33:09This is crazy.
33:14All right, Tommy, I'm going to take you back.
33:16Are you serious, man?
33:18I'm just going to turn around and change him back.
33:21Oh, come on, man.
33:23Turn around.
33:26We're happy to sit here and tell the truth and talk to you.
33:30There's nothing else I can tell you.
33:31That's the truth.
33:32That's the truth.
33:33Okay.
33:34That's all I can say.
33:35Do you feel later on like there is something else you want to talk to us?
33:38You can write a page and talk to us.
33:40Tommy Richter was escorted to the jail and he was charged with aggravated burglary and aggravated murder.
33:46There was no doubt that he was going to be convicted due to that DNA evidence.
33:52But just convicting somebody isn't the total determining factor of justice.
33:57When somebody admits what they've done, it helps families heal and move past.
34:02So while we were hopeful that he might be honest with us in subsequent interviews, we certainly weren't counting on
34:09it.
34:14I received a call from a corporal in the jail at the time and she indicated that Tommy Richter wanted
34:20to speak to a detective.
34:21Once I heard those words, I escorted Tommy Richter from the jail back into the interview room.
34:31Corporal Anton said that you wanted to talk to a detective concerning what happened.
34:37I'm just going to let you talk.
34:39Well, I don't really want to get into the details and all that stuff, but I'm going to plead guilty.
34:46Okay.
34:47And just for the record, we're talking about the murder of Mary Martinchuk, correct?
34:51Yes, we are, sir.
34:53You were solely involved in her homicide, nobody else was with you, correct?
34:57Nobody else.
34:59When he's telling me that he did it and he acted alone, I didn't want to show my emotions, but
35:04I was elated.
35:06But I got to keep my composure. I need to get as much information out of them as possible.
35:11You understand that when you do that, the judge is going to ask you the details.
35:15I'm not, I'm not really want to get into no details.
35:18It was just, um, it wasn't me. It was the drug. It was me, but it was, you know what
35:23I'm saying?
35:23I understand that. Some of the nicest, hardworking people I've ever met were in here because of drugs.
35:29Oh, they're the devil. It's a horrible, horrible thing.
35:33This time in that cell just give me time to, you know, I just been thinking about it and it's
35:38been giving me nightmares.
35:39It's a horrible, horrible thing. And, you know, it really has been bothering me.
35:43The night before you guys came.
35:45I'm not, I'm listening. I'm not going to pass them, not passing judgment.
35:49People make choices. I have family members that have done time in prison for killing people.
35:55And I talk to them on a regular basis.
35:57It's just, it's just embarrassing and ashamed.
36:00I, you know, like sitting in there watching, you know, the lieutenant and, um, all the other ones working, normal
36:07citizens just working and doing the right thing.
36:10And, um, I just feel so, so, like scum and it's just, it's just a horrible, horrible, horrible, horrible thing.
36:20And I'm so, so sorry and I'm willing to pay my life for it or whatever I have to pay.
36:24Can I ask you a few questions? You said you were by yourself when you, when you went there.
36:30Yes.
36:30What was the reason why you targeted that house? Because you're familiar to it and you knew?
36:36It was, I just figured it was a snatch and grab thing. I'm going to go.
36:40Right.
36:40You know, that was all it was. There was no, you know, I didn't plan it for days. It wasn't,
36:46it wasn't, it wasn't planned out, you know, it was just, it was around that area.
36:50I thought, oh God, you know, remember her, you know, it wasn't like, man, I'm going to come back and
36:54get that someday.
36:55How did you get inside the house?
36:59The door was, uh, I just, uh, knocked on the door and, um, she let me in.
37:06Did she recognize you or?
37:09She didn't recognize me. What I, I didn't know if she was home or not.
37:12I was just going to break into the house and, you know, whatever. She was home.
37:15Seen the purse there, Knox was going to go in and get the purse.
37:18Then one thing led to another. I don't really want to discuss it and talk about it.
37:21It just, um, it was just me, only me, and, um, um, that's really, you know, that's it, the bottom
37:30line.
37:31And I know that this is out of character for you, but I have to ask you this.
37:35Did she do something to you to set you off?
37:48I know that's something that nobody wants to rehash in your mind.
37:52You know, I understand that. But just tell me what happened.
37:56I panicked. Just flat-out panicked. I was scared and nervous as it was. I wasn't right in my right
38:00mind.
38:01She left the room when she came back in. It was like a startled thing because I thought I was
38:04just going to get it and go.
38:06And that's when she grabbed onto me or whatever and started screaming, and I just freaked.
38:10And I don't really want to talk too much about it. And I just did what I had to do
38:13and got the hell up out of there.
38:15Boom. And we're here and on a date, and I'm so sorry, and I picked my life right now.
38:20Just take me down right now.
38:21Stop. Just relax, okay? Just calm down.
38:29Just calm down.
38:30Good, good. I hope it is.
38:32You did something that's...
38:33Horrific. It's disgusting.
38:35But you did something today that's...
38:40It takes a big man to step forward and admit this.
38:44I know you are. I know you're sorry. I know you're sorry. Just...
38:48You, you...
38:51The worst thing I had was...
38:52I had a crack cocaine problem, you know.
38:55I never hurt anybody, man.
38:58I can't even believe I did this to myself. I can't believe I did it to my wife.
39:02I can't believe I did it to that poor lady.
39:03I can't believe I did it to the people around me.
39:05I feel like he's being genuine and he was carrying this with him since the day it happened for eight
39:11months.
39:11But I'm also trying to get him to calm down because I still need to get some information from him.
39:17And it's evident that he doesn't want to discuss the details.
39:20I can't speak very well about it. It was just me, sir. It was just me. It's done. I did
39:27it. And I'm so, so sorry. And, um, past judging on me, whatever it may be, you know.
39:33I don't think any differently about you. The first day I met you, I thought, nah, this isn't... No. He's
39:43a nice guy. A great guy.
39:47You know, and when we got the results back, I was a little bit taken aback, to be honest with
39:52you.
39:52Because I remember meeting you and I remember, oh, he's a nice person.
39:57I know.
39:57And I don't think any differently of you now. I mean, you made a bad choice.
40:01If you weren't doing drugs, I think this would have happened.
40:05Never in a million years.
40:07Can you tell me where you took the items? What items did you take and where did you take them
40:13to?
40:15The items that I took, I don't even know where I got rid of them at.
40:18All I can tell you, it was an individual. Along the road, I asked who was on the TV. Boom.
40:25And that was it. I'm sorry.
40:28There's nothing else I could say or do, no.
40:30There's not. I'm sorry.
40:31I'm not the person that you need to apologize to.
40:33I need to apologize to everyone, though. I'm just ready for judgment.
40:38I was totally out of control right then. Just hit rock bottom, man. Hit rock bottom.
40:43And I apologize and I'm sorry. I hope to, you know, that, um, I don't know what to say.
40:54I'm just willing to give my life right now. I'm done. I'm done. I feel better.
40:59I got it off my chest and let the, you know, hammer fall and whatever the judge says.
41:06I was excited. We finally got a confession from him.
41:10I think the efforts that myself and Detective Cleveland put in in the first interview paid off.
41:15I think it did help Tommy make this decision to come forward and be truthful about what happened.
41:21All right.
41:22We treated him with respect. So we left that door open for him to reach out and talk. And he
41:28did.
41:47Ultimately, when Mr. Richter was found out, that is when he confessed and has been very remorseful.
41:54But I would want to say, Your Honor, that this was a horrible crime. And this woman suffered tremendously.
42:01The outcome of this case was gratifying. The confession, you know, how he worded it, that was extremely important.
42:09And I do feel justice was served at the end of the day.
42:13Tommy Richter is a drug addict. And he's somebody who made a terrible choice because of his addiction.
42:18And cost the life of Mary Martin Chuck.
42:25Mary lived in the same house for more than 20 years. So she got to see a lot of the
42:30families and their children grow up.
42:32In the summers, she liked to take those children to go and get ice cream.
42:37She loved to volunteer and help the elderly in need at the church.
42:43Mary's death certainly was sad and a tragedy.
42:47But what's interesting is Mary Martin Chuck helped this investigation tremendously.
42:53Her record keeping led us back to our suspect.
42:56She was independent in her 80s up until the day that she died.
43:01And at the end of the day, she definitely helped solve her own murder.
43:05But she wore their Elvis.
43:07She was Australian at a daughter's in Salesforce telling her the story or something different.
43:09The only one of our characters as family was raped.
Comments