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00:00See, this is nice. Everyone's got round tables. It feels good. Chairs look comfy. It's going to be a good
00:06day.
00:06You're really worried about making sure everyone's comfortable right now?
00:09Yes. When people are stuck watching panel after panel, those chairs better be comfortable.
00:13No one's stuck. Let's be clear.
00:15They better be comfortable. This chair's very comfortable, but we won't get into that.
00:23Well, Colin, I want to start with you, actually, to talk a little about this John Candy doc and how
00:29it started, how you decided you wanted to get this off the ground.
00:33I had a conversation with Ryan Reynolds, who is the producer on the movie, and he volleyed a very interesting
00:39sort of question.
00:41He says, he basically is like, I don't want to live in a world where there's not a documentary about
00:46John Candy.
00:47I don't know what that movie is. I don't know what it's about, but I just think there should be
00:53one.
00:54And it was a great sort of artistic, you know, launching point of, okay, yeah, I agree with that statement
01:02completely, but what is that, you know, what is that story?
01:06What is the actual arc of the narrative film?
01:11Because otherwise, it's just going to be a Wikipedia entry of, and then he made Brewster's Millions, and that's not
01:16really interesting or engaging to watch.
01:18So he gave me the opportunity to really dig in and try and find something that was engaging to me,
01:25not only as a storyteller, but also just as a human, to try and find something that I could, you
01:32know, a story that I could tell that resonated with me.
01:35Definitely. And I mean, when you, you guys got so many incredible people involved, was it, was that an easy
01:40task for people to say?
01:41No!
01:42I'm curious, because I feel like a lot of people love John Candy, so maybe they were excited to chat
01:45about it.
01:45Yeah, I mean, it was definitely, there was a, it cuts both ways.
01:51I mean, we were very fortunate that everyone wanted to speak with us, and everyone was very eager to talk
01:57about John, and to celebrate John.
01:59The issue was, is that they're all incredibly famous and incredibly busy, and so the schedule ended up being really
02:08our biggest kind of obstacle.
02:11And then, you know, there were, there was a strike, you know, a couple of strikes going on at the
02:15same time, and I was thinking like, oh, great, we could actually get, you know, it's like everyone's going to
02:21be available, and they were like, no, we're all on vacation.
02:25No, so, yeah, the schedule really ended up just being, being the biggest issue, but everyone was, was very eager.
02:32And, and Martin Short said very early on, he says, you know, your biggest problem is that no one is
02:37going to say no.
02:39And having made a few docs before, I know if you are, take enough time with somebody, and, and then
02:46you don't include them in the documentary, that's a very awkward email you have to write.
02:50Right? So I was very, very cognizant of that at all times.
02:53It's a hard struggle to have.
02:56Isabel, what about you? What made you want to tell Selena's story?
03:00I mean, her story has been told many times, so taking a different point of view, taking a new angle
03:04on it.
03:05Can you talk a little about your approach?
03:07Yeah. So I'm a Mexican immigrant.
03:10I grew up between two cultures, and I think Selena always represented something crucial for my self, sense of self
03:22and self-worth.
03:24And I always really kind of looked up to her, like she was always really symbolically important to me.
03:31So, but I never in my wildest dreams thought I would be able to make a film about her, quite
03:37frankly.
03:38I made my first film, went to Sundance, and in the wake of its release, the family reached out to
03:44me.
03:45And it was like, I mean, I just, I'm still kind of reeling from it.
03:50It still feels pretty surreal.
03:53And I was initially a kind of like, I don't know, I guess I, I didn't know what more could
04:00be said.
04:01It's a story that we all know.
04:02Um, and in, in many ways has been mythologized.
04:07Um, but what I hadn't realized is that the family had never shared their personal archives.
04:12And so, um, and they hadn't shared it in the 30 years that she had died.
04:17So, they invited me and my team down to Corpus Christi.
04:23And the second I saw the archive, I just, it's, it became, you know, my main purpose, my main passion
04:31for the last four years.
04:33And, um, and it's just been the honor of my career to do that.
04:38Amazing.
04:38What was the process of working with her family?
04:41What was, you know, the, the challenges of that and, and things that were maybe easier than you thought?
04:47You know, I was, I was really impressed and, um, just by their openness and willingness to share their story
04:58with me and with the world.
05:00Um, it was also challenging because we, you know, over the years I got to understand that this symbol, you
05:11know, this person that had become a symbol for me was a real person.
05:15And it was a sister and it was a daughter and it was a wife and it was a friend
05:21and it was all these things that, um, Selena was, you know, a young girl who died.
05:29She, I, I'm like staggered by the age at which she died.
05:33She was 23 years old.
05:35And so I think that, um, holding that space for their ongoing grief, um, while also wanting to introduce her
05:47story to the world, um, it's, it's a really hard and fine line to kind of, it's a hard needle
05:56to thread.
05:57I'm sure, um, I'm sure, um, both directors can relate to just kind of the challenge of, um, making, uh,
06:06a documentary about a public person.
06:09Um, um, you're having to navigate these two things at the same time, the personal life and the personal implications
06:17of telling a person's story.
06:19Um, while also wanting to honor what they meant to so many people.
06:24Um, so I think that was the most challenging thing about, um, doing that.
06:29Yeah, absolutely.
06:30Um, Andrew, telling the story of Charlie Sheen, of course he is alive and he is here to tell his
06:37story.
06:37Um, I guess to start, what made you want to be the person to, to put that story out there?
06:43Especially because similarly, there is a lot out there.
06:46I mean, the news has covered Charlie Sheen for years and people think they know the truth.
06:50So what, what made you want to tell this?
06:53Um, yeah, well he got John Candy, so he was not available to me to do that.
06:58Two, two peas in a pod, those two.
07:00Um, no, I just, uh, I, I was watching a lot of these sort of like icon stories and celebrity
07:05stories.
07:06And I thought to myself, knowing who I am as a filmmaker and knowing the things that interest
07:10me, I was like, I wonder if somebody would be around that might not have, um, you know,
07:17such a celebratory story.
07:18Like, is there a celebrity?
07:19And I, Charlie Sheen was always in my mind as someone that just felt very one of one to
07:23me and kind of fit tonally into the mindset that I have as a filmmaker, whether it be just
07:30sort of like diving into the darkest depths, but with a sense of humor sometimes.
07:34And it's just things I love.
07:36And so I, I literally just said to myself, like, I wonder what Charlie Sheen's up to.
07:40And he was available.
07:42That was for sure.
07:44So that made things a little easier.
07:46Um, I didn't have to worry about scheduling with him.
07:49Um, the strike did not affect him.
07:52And, uh, but, uh, yeah, so we, we got, we, we met each other and we got to know each
07:57other.
07:57Uh, it was just as important for me to get to know him, uh, probably as it was for him
08:01to
08:01get to know me cause I didn't know him and I didn't know whether I would be, you know,
08:06just frankly making a story about a bad guy that did bad things or a good guy that got
08:10wrapped up in bad things or what.
08:12And so it was really important for me to learn that as I went and, uh, come to my own
08:16conclusions.
08:16Absolutely.
08:17I mean, what conclusion did you come to?
08:21I think that's a fair question.
08:23Oh, very fair.
08:24Right?
08:25Very fair question.
08:26And I, and I have a very, very clear, uh, personal answer that, um, uh, this is the story
08:32of like, of an addict that goes to the deepest depths of addiction that you can go to without
08:36dying.
08:36There's no question about it, but, uh, throughout the way of his addiction, uh, there was always
08:40a good guy in there and always a good person in there that genuinely cares about, um,
08:45the people around him.
08:46And I think that what, without me having to explain that an indication of that is the
08:50people that showed up for the documentary, you don't show up if, if this is a person that
08:54you genuinely believe is not worth showing up for.
08:59And, um, and I was amazed at the people that were willing to sit for this, knowing the wreckage
09:03that he caused.
09:04And I thought that was a really clear indication for me of the type of person that he actually
09:07was and the complications there.
09:09It's like, you know, people aren't binary.
09:12And I think that he lives in a gray area much of his life.
09:15And I think that that's an interesting thing to explore.
09:17Yeah, absolutely.
09:19There's so many docs out there and done in different formats, whether it's multiple episodes,
09:24whether it's a film, whether, you know, any kind of angle, but I'm curious for you guys,
09:28what, what to you makes a good doc people who know this world very well.
09:32And like, what did you bring into that?
09:34That's something, a quality of a good documentary that you really wanted to take on Colin.
09:38I think it's, it, you, you want to be able to, uh, present someone who is incredibly well
09:45known and present a side of them that the, that the audience does not know.
09:50Uh, I think whenever you're able to sort of, you know, peel back a curtain, you, whatever
09:56saying you want to use, but you want to be able to show the audience what it was the
10:02person was going through at that time so that it can change their viewpoint, uh, uh, uh, as
10:09to, you know, their first impression of the person or a preconceived notion of the person
10:14or, you know, or just what, you know, the media tells you about the person.
10:19I think you're constantly trying to, to unveil humanity in, in some way, shape or form.
10:26And that can be challenging, especially when, you know, the events are salacious or, you
10:32know, tragic or, or, you know, just, uh, fun, you know, it, I mean, that was the, the, the,
10:38the hardest thing with, with John Candy is how do you, how do you make a film about someone
10:43who's just universally beloved, you know, who didn't really have, you know, a dark side
10:49or these horrible demons that, you know, that took his life, you know, John was, was melded
10:55by circumstance, um, and the very things that we celebrate them about the man, his heart,
11:01his generosity, his kindness, his, his skill as a comedian, those were all born of coping
11:06mechanisms that were instilled in him at the age of five, you know, um, and he was just
11:11getting to the point in, in his young life.
11:14Cause he, he died at 43, which is absurdly young.
11:17Um, but you know, he was just getting to the point where he was starting to dig into those
11:22things and ask those questions of himself.
11:25And so it was important for us to be able to highlight those, you know, what were those
11:29things that were ailing John?
11:31Because ultimately at the same time, I thought it was a really interesting juxtaposition, you
11:36know, the audience would look at John and think, oh, well, that's us.
11:39He's just like us.
11:41And learning that he struggled with anxiety and, and learning that he had struggled with,
11:46you know, the loss of his father at a young age and father figures and wanting to constantly
11:50people, please.
11:51I thought, well, that's the most relatable thing I've ever heard.
11:54Um, and I never thought that about John Candy, you know, I just thought he was always gregarious
12:00and great.
12:01You know, I didn't realize that he had his, his own demons, which we all do.
12:05Um, so you just want to bring the humanity.
12:07Yeah, absolutely.
12:08Andrew, what about you?
12:09What do you think?
12:09Yeah.
12:10I mean, I think that for me, um, I think documentaries aren't often equated, aren't always equated
12:16with like films, you know?
12:17And so for me, like, I love watching a documentary where I feel like, um, I'm in the hands of
12:22someone that's making a film, you know, like, I just love that.
12:25Like, I think that I'm up here with two directors that, that do that.
12:27And so a lot of times, especially with the, in the doc space, like I actually care a lot
12:32less personally about the story when I'm seeing something, cause there's so many great stories.
12:36Like I can convince myself that any story is incredible, but it's like how you tell it.
12:39So for me, I think it's all about, you know, finding things that aren't just like fitting
12:43the template of how a story should be told or a doc should be told and just like being
12:48taken on a ride.
12:49That's always, and like, I watch so many things.
12:51I love consuming things like, uh, you know, reality TV all the way to docs that win Oscars.
12:56And so I think that for me, it's just all about like, what kind of hands am I in and
12:59who's
12:59taking me on the ride?
13:00And do I feel like, you know, do I feel as though I'm, um, being taken somewhere that I
13:06wouldn't have done or that I wouldn't be able to do, or that it's uniquely for them,
13:09you know, um, yeah, I think my answer is an extension of both of theirs, which is just
13:17that I think I respond best and try to make films that are really emotionally honest, whether
13:24it's, um, the people that you're filming with or your own kind of self-expression of what
13:31you're experiencing or witnessing as a filmmaker, as a person who's telling that story.
13:37So, um, I, I really try to aspire towards emotional honesty.
13:43So important.
13:44Do you, I guess for any of you who want to answer, what was the thing that stood out to
13:49you when you were making, when you were telling these stories that you thought there's no way
13:52this is getting cut?
13:54Like, it was there one story that you were like, we are maybe building around this or
13:57we are focusing on...
13:58Charlie Sheen slept with men.
14:02I was assuming that would be that one, but I thought...
14:05I'm kidding.
14:05That's not it.
14:08Yeah, you had many.
14:09You had, there was many stories you couldn't cut out.
14:11I feel like all of you did.
14:12Honestly, there are a lot of important stories.
14:13Well, he had a two-parter.
14:15He's got time to tell him.
14:17He's got the time.
14:19Wow, that's hard.
14:21That's actually, that's actually hard because, you know, I think with, with docs, I mean,
14:25my experience is you're, you're a detective.
14:29So you're, you're not sitting there just making your movie in, you know, two weeks and then
14:34you sort of amass everything.
14:35You're constantly unveiling what the story is and you're, you're constantly, the film
14:43eventually over time presents itself and your story sort of presents itself.
14:48And the best thing that, that, that I can ever hope to do is have a good enough idea, a
14:53good
14:53enough starting point that I can then con enough other people to hold hands with me as I jump
14:59off that bridge.
15:00And then as you sort of, uh, uh, I mean, we were actually just talking about this before
15:06as you, you start amassing your interviews, you start amassing your, your, your, your,
15:13your footage, you then find things like the role of childhood movies that Charlie Sheen made,
15:21or you find those home movies of, of, of Selena.
15:24And, and, and, and those things end up sort of adding up to greater sequences.
15:31You know, I, I could break down, you know, yeah, I really wish we could have had, you
15:34know, this one particular shot, but we couldn't afford it, you know, whatever like that.
15:38We couldn't afford the licensing, but eventually you sort of break your films up into, or I break
15:43my films up into these little pause.
15:45And it's like, if I can just keep those three minutes, what those three minutes are now,
15:49I can't tell you, but at the time it's very important.
15:52Sure.
15:53Sure.
15:54What about you as well?
15:56Um, I, I tried to build the film around the personal home videos of, that the family
16:01had of Selena, because you really got to know her in a way that I felt like people hadn't
16:07seen before.
16:08So all that just kind of the raw footage, home videos where you're just getting the essence
16:14of her personality, um, that was basically the infrastructure that upheld the whole film that
16:21we built around and Andrew, do you, do you have a specific, no, there's, I mean, there's
16:26definitely not like, I think that when you, you fall in love with things because of probably
16:30what connects to you, like I, whether I know it or not, I, I, I tend to end up making
16:35movies
16:36about fathers and sons a lot, whether it's conscious or subconscious, I have no idea.
16:40But so I think for me, once, um, I got to sit with Martin Sheen to watch the first cut
16:47that I had put together just to show it to him, but also to see if he wanted to be
16:52in
16:52it.
16:52And, um, it was a intense experience.
16:57And, but I remember that the decision afterwards was like, I, this is Charlie's movie and I love
17:02this movie.
17:02Like you don't need me sitting here in an interview, you know, at my age reliving these
17:07things because like, I found a way to make him feel alive in the movie without being in
17:12it.
17:13And that was, I think for me, it was a really fun exercise and kind of the thing where
17:17I was like, I need to figure out a way to make these movies exist in my movie.
17:22And like, I have to figure out, cause there's never been a, you know, um, I mean, you would
17:27know this, there's never been a father son relationship.
17:28I think that's been on screen as much as those two potentially.
17:30I don't know.
17:31I couldn't point to it.
17:32And I was like, so interesting for me to figure that out and to say like, how can I make
17:37this?
17:38And also their relationship on screen was always a reflection of the real life.
17:42It was so weird.
17:43It's always the wayward son that's kind of screwed up.
17:46And the dad with lots of principles telling him not to screw up.
17:49And I was like, what an incredible opportunity just to tell their story with these things.
17:53So I think that was like a clear thing for me.
17:55It's like, how can I make this work?
17:56Like, how can I have this exist in my movie?
17:58Yeah, absolutely.
17:59And you did without, like you said, without having Martin sit down and do an interview,
18:03which is so impressive.
18:05Um, all right, we're, we're about to wrap up, but I want to ask each of you quickly, what
18:08is there a subject, whether it's a very far chance of happening or a possibility that you
18:13would really want to do a doc on?
18:15Is there one that stands out to you?
18:17Isabel, do you want to start?
18:20There's so many.
18:21Um, well, I, I really want to make a trilogy about powerful Latina musicians, and I really
18:30want to make a film about Shakira.
18:32So.
18:32Yes.
18:35Shakira, if you're listening to this, it's manifested now.
18:38Let's do it.
18:39I will watch that.
18:40Um, I mean, I guess I, I, I'm, I was happy that in the process of making Charlie, I met
18:46Heidi Fleiss and I'm almost done my Heidi Fleiss movie.
18:48And I was, I didn't think that I'd ever make a Heidi Fleiss movie.
18:50So that was cool.
18:51But I think in terms of like pie in the sky, oh man, I mean, there's a bunch, there's a
18:57bunch that I feel that kind of get me excited.
19:02He didn't show up for this one.
19:04So my pie in the sky is Nick Cage.
19:05Like, I really want to go on an adaptation, Nick Cage.
19:09Like, what is this?
19:10Is this real or fake documentary?
19:12Like, I'd love it.
19:14Yeah.
19:14I love that.
19:15That's a great.
19:16He like might be here.
19:17He's the kind of guy that would just be in the audience watching a panel about docs for
19:20no reason.
19:21So if you're here, Nick, please let's make a movie.
19:25All right, Colin.
19:26I want to work catering on their movies.
19:30You're hired.
19:31Yeah, no, I, I, it's impossible for me to answer that question.
19:34I, I, I, I feel bad ending with that.
19:37So that's why I came up with the zinger.
19:39I, yeah, I, I, I don't know.
19:41It's hard because, you know, you, you, you have these, these goals, these dreams of like,
19:47it would be great to tell this story.
19:48Great to be that story.
19:49But I've done this long enough to also know that that first instinct sometimes can not
19:54necessarily be the correct one.
19:55And so for me, I like to just keep myself open and find, you know, whatever story comes
20:02around.
20:02Um, it, it, it's, it's a lame answer.
20:06I know that.
20:07But, um, but you guys also don't understand how much I love craft service and catering.
20:12So that's, and there's not really catering on documentaries or, or craft service, to be
20:19quite honest.
20:20So I got you guys so many gummies.
20:22Don't worry.
20:22I got candy bars.
20:24I got chips.
20:25I got at least two different flavors.
20:27It's going to be great.
20:27It's a really important job.
20:29Someone has to do it.
20:30Yeah.
20:30Thank you guys so much for being here.
20:32Thank you all for coming.
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