00:00So the Minnesota Timberwolves traded Malik Beasley, Patrick Beverly, Walker Kessler, Jared Vanderbilt, Leandro Bomaro, four first-round picks, and
00:11a 2026 pick swap to Utah for Rudy Gobert.
00:16We all disparaged it.
00:18We all said it was a disgrace to the league.
00:20We did.
00:21Reset the trade market.
00:23I know we touched on it earlier, but I think it's time.
00:27At least me, I'm willing to admit I was wrong.
00:30I think they got the better end of the deal.
00:32They got the better end of the deal.
00:34That's 100% true.
00:36Did they win the trade, though?
00:38I still say you've got to win a championship.
00:40To give up all those draft assets, you've got to win a championship for it to be really worth what
00:47you did there.
00:48I mean, wouldn't you think the same thing about Desmond Bain?
00:52Yeah.
00:53With Orlando, what they gave up for Desmond?
00:56And they're running right now.
00:58When you invest that much in anything, there's a certain dividend that you're looking for at the end, right?
01:05Or else it didn't make sense.
01:07Doesn't Orlando have to win a championship for it to really have been worth it?
01:12Doesn't Minnesota have to win a championship for it to really have been worth it?
01:17When you give up that many assets, it's championship or bust because you're doing your entire four years moving forward.
01:27You're going all in.
01:28You're going in.
01:29Is Rudy Gobert going to be a championship or not a championship?
01:33Is Desmond Bain going to take Orlando to win a trophy?
01:38I don't think either one of those dudes are going to win a trophy for either one of their teams.
01:42But is it as simple as you have to win a championship for it to be successful?
01:46Because I'll ask you this.
01:47When Orlando makes that trade over the offseason, do you genuinely believe that the Orlando Magic front office thought Desmond
01:55Bain was a difference between them winning a title or not?
01:59I don't.
02:00I think it made them think that they would get closer to a roster that can contend, and that's where
02:08you want to be rather than being in the middle and rather than being really bad, right?
02:12You want to be closer to contending.
02:14That way, maybe you can land a free agent or maybe you're one trade away.
02:19I see what you're saying.
02:19You use it as a means to an end, and this might be the, you know, you're building a house,
02:25and so this gives you a foundation.
02:27And now you've built a pool room, and you still need, though, to add a bathroom and whatever, a vent.
02:37I know what you're saying.
02:39I'm just saying when it's all said and done, Minnesota's on a high right now.
02:43They should be, right?
02:44But when it's all said and done, 10 years from now, when you're looking back on all the dread, like,
02:49I just find it very difficult to say.
02:52Because don't we look back?
02:53What do we look back and think about the Jimmy Butler era?
02:57In my opinion, wildly successful.
02:59Overachieving?
03:00Overachieved, in my opinion.
03:02But was it, did it win?
03:06I mean, ultimately, it's always about did you get a championship out of it or not, right?
03:12I mean, for the most part.
03:13The Jimmy situation is interesting because a lot of Heat fans look back on that era and feel like they
03:19failed Jimmy Butler.
03:20Because they got to the promised land two times and weren't able to win, and they never maximized the Jimmy
03:26Butler window.
03:27But when I look back at the start of the Jimmy era and when they traded for Jimmy, I didn't
03:33in my wildest imagination think that without trading for another superstar, right?
03:38Without adding Kevin Durant or Giannis or Damian Lillard, that the Heat were going to be in three Eastern Conference
03:44championships.
03:45Right, that's fair.
03:46Eastern Conference finals and make two NBA finals.
03:49I didn't in my wildest imagination think that the ceiling of this team would be elevated by that margin by
03:57just making that one trade for Jimmy Butler.
04:00So, like, when I look back on it from the beginning, yeah, I think they overachieved.
04:04When I think back on it with the context of, hey, you were there three times and two times in
04:09the finals, you probably should have won one.
04:11Then, yeah, you definitely missed the mark.
04:13But that's what I was going to say, Solana.
04:15Do you talk about the Jimmy Butler era as a success because we got to the championship and lost?
04:21Like, you overachieve.
04:22Overachieving and having success is two different things.
04:25Right.
04:26Where you never say, three years ago, who lost in the Western Conference finals?
04:30Like, nobody talks about that.
04:32Right.
04:32Unless it was your team.
04:34Like, we'll remember having made the finals, but nobody else cares.
04:37But here's why I say it's a success.
04:39Yes, Minnesota was at a point where they knew because Anthony Edwards' trajectory was what it was, right?
04:47Like, it was pretty obvious.
04:48Anthony Edwards is going to be a top five player in the NBA.
04:51Because of that, they knew that the next five to six years with Anthony Edwards were going to put them,
04:59at the very least, contending for a playoff spot.
05:02Right.
05:02Like, at the very least, they're going to be a team that's going to flirt with the playoffs every single
05:07year, which puts them in the middle.
05:09But it devalues the picks, all those first-round picks.
05:15So they said, hey, if we make this one move, at the very least, we're going to be significantly better.
05:24And we're closer than keeping four first-round picks that are going to be, what, late first-round picks?
05:31Like, that's not going to drastically improve our roster, but this one move did.
05:35And at the time, none of us could understand that.
05:38At the time, we're all saying, why would you give up four potential rookies over the next six years for
05:45a guy in Rudy Gobert who is unplayable in the fourth quarter because he's not an offensive juggernaut?
05:50But now, looking back on it, what were they going to get with those picks?
05:54Late first-rounders?
05:56That doesn't significantly improve.
05:57Yeah, I guess it makes sense.
05:58I guess I can probably move off my argument that you can't say that they won the trade.
06:05How many players?
06:06What, four or five players?
06:09Yeah.
06:10Four first-round picks.
06:12Four first-round picks.
06:12But also, Solana listed off five players.
06:15Five players, four or more.
06:17Nine players.
06:18Those players are a dime a dozen, if I recall the names that he just mentioned.
06:20Yeah, Patrick Beverly jumped out to me, which that's funny that he was still talking about him.
06:25But if, and that's the, it's kind of the tanking thing.
06:29If you have a guy good enough, like Anthony Edwards, you're not going to be terrible because he's so good.
06:35But how much is Rudy Gobert going to set him over the edge?
06:38And that's what NBA, that's why great GMs are paid, and that's why they win championships.
06:44Because Rudy Gobert and Anthony Edwards, by themselves, aren't going to win a championship.
06:47But what can you put around them to win that championship?
06:50And that's the, that's why you tank.
06:53San Antonio tanked and got what?
06:55Dylan Harper, Vassell, Castle, and Wimby?
06:58And now they're one of the best teams in the NBA.
07:00It's a.
07:01But in the meantime, while San Antonio had four 30 win seasons or whatever it was,
07:07because Minnesota was in the playoffs year after year after year.
07:11And if me personally, I'd rather be the team in the playoffs year after year after year,
07:15even if I'm losing in the Western Conference finals, because I like fun basketball.
07:20Well, yes.
07:21It's a separate argument, though.
07:22Would I rather be a team that goes deep in the playoffs every year than a team that gets bounced
07:26in the play-in?
07:27Yeah, of course.
07:28That's, I mean, that's.
07:30It's because he's been brainwashed by Pat Riley.
07:33Maybe.
07:34If, if, if me like.
07:36But I'd still rather have that, too.
07:38I'd rather have that.
07:39It is so hard to win a championship.
07:41If you can keep getting there consistently or getting close to it, you're.
07:45Well, Hulk, I'm with you, but we, I'm just looking at what San Antonio has done,
07:51where tanking works.
07:53You have to admit that.
07:56No, I wouldn't admit that.
07:58Tank.
07:59San Antonio's four years of tanking didn't work.
08:02San Antonio worked, yeah, but Philadelphia didn't.
08:06Oh, the process, yeah.
08:07Like I said, good GMs know how to pick players.
08:10Well, that's what I'm saying, but it's not, it's not a slam dunk that tanking works.
08:13You still have to hit on your picks.
08:18And that's why it has to be a good GM, because even in football, basketball, all that, like
08:22the Wimby year.
08:24Tank before Wimby, but last year, tank before Cooper Flagg.
08:29I don't think Cooper Flagg is going to be anything close to Wimby.
08:31Well, Zachary, we should say is the one that you use as the example.
08:35You could have the worst season on the planet.
08:37I mean, I'm watching him play last night in junk time where he like, it just doesn't make
08:43any sense that that guy was the number one overall pick, but that's the luck of the draft.
08:46I think his shoes might be on the wrong foot.
08:51But he doesn't know how to tie his shoes right.
08:56Well, regardless, I owe Minnesota an apology.
09:00That's what I want to get out of this.
09:02Like, I thought that was the worst trade.
09:04We all did.
09:05But for winning, for winning round one quarterfinals?
09:10Well, that's, it's kind of like Jim Laranega says with Wimby.
09:14Hey, don't put the cart in front of the horse.
09:17Let's see some success.
09:18I mean, Minnesota needs to see some success as well, deeper.
09:23Yeah, I think that's fair, but I just, I genuinely, I don't discount like appearances to the Western
09:31conference finals.
09:32I'm not saying that that's fine, that like, that's what everybody should be happy with
09:36and satisfied with.
09:37I understand winning a title is what we should, everybody, the standard should be.
09:42I get that.
09:42But I also think like, if that's all you do, oh, win a title or I'm not interested, then
09:48you just devalue like a really good success story.
09:52I'm not, I'm not devaluing it, but I'm saying you're, you're, you're doing major recency
09:56bias right now because Gobert was so good this series, right?
10:00You're doing major recency bias.
10:02Let's see what happens next series before we do this.
10:06Yeah, that's fair.
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