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Te Ao With Moana S07E16 H 264
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00:00Thank you so much.
00:40Thank you so much.
01:14Thank you so much.
01:29I live here in Kaikuhi with my siblings and we just lived here so it's opposite us where the little
01:37girl passed away and it's about coming together. It's about unity.
01:41It's about sending the message out there that children are our tonga, children are tomorrow and the generations to come.
01:58Fathers, grandfathers, uncles and brothers. They all came from all money and what it means to be a man.
03:35Thank you,かo-hee.
03:37Tākuhi Surface has received an awful rap, and the tragedy of the murder of this child I
03:46think, is the culmination of a long period of decline, the spread of the drug culture,
03:55and it's also a challenge for those of us who want to create solutions with the community,
04:03so those solutions have to be developed in such a way
04:07the community can see you kanohi ki te kanohi
04:11and I've always taken it in Maori politics
04:14you have to be a critic of your own people
04:18at the same level of consistency when you criticise
04:21the influences of mainstream or the crowd
04:25and obviously my own mokopuna
04:27go to school around here
04:30they go to early childhood kohungahunga education
04:36so it's good that I show up
04:40Te Pate Maori MP Maria Meno Kapakingi
04:43from the other end of the political divide
04:45also joined in
04:48I guess Maori media, Maori politicians, Maori community leaders
04:52we often get accused of
04:54from sectors of society for not caring
04:57when one of our tamiriki die
05:00just your response to that
05:01yeah it's an utter nonsense
05:03of course we care
05:05I don't have to announce that to te ao katoa
05:10that I care
05:10that's nonsense
05:12we care
05:13we care in our own particular way
05:15we show up quietly
05:17we do what we can
05:19there's definitely a care for Maori communities
05:21whether it's Maori politicians
05:23ordinary Maori like me
05:24Maori media
05:25we care and we engage in a very different way
05:29and we show up in a very different way
05:31well it's a burdensome responsibility
05:33because the media do have a disproportionately
05:41lurid level of interest
05:43when it's a Maori story
05:47but that's just the culture
05:48that you have to encounter and deal with
05:51but look I do feel
05:53that on this particular issue
05:56the banner waivers
05:58toitu movement
06:00and the new crusaders
06:02have been conspicuously silent
06:03and there's nothing worse
06:05in my view
06:07than a three year old
06:09dying in these circumstances
06:11so what are the circuit breakers?
06:13you're a part of the government
06:14how do we protect our tamiriki and our mokopuna?
06:17well there's a lot of putea
06:19coming into this part of the north
06:20for social rehabilitation
06:21but it has to be
06:22the cops have to do their job
06:25where people consistently smash over
06:28the boundaries
06:29then they held to be a count
06:30locked up for us I'm concerned
06:32but sadly the cops can't arrest them
06:35arrest society out of these dramas
06:37and I would say
06:40te kaikohe
06:42whanau leaders
06:44need to intervene rapidly
06:46when they see dysfunctionalism
06:48remove kids from a dangerous situation
06:51and in many cases
06:52remove them from their whanau
06:54if the whanau themselves
06:55are enveloped in a drug riddled
06:57level of social mayhem
07:01but it's also a wake up call
07:03for the people managing these housing complexes
07:05I'm very harsh on kainga ora
07:07and I'm equally harsh
07:09on the ngāpuhi management
07:11of the housing complex
07:13that if you're not going to retain
07:15a level of authority
07:17and maintain standards
07:18then the drug riddled cancer
07:21will occupy those areas
07:24and we can't have it
07:27Dr Lance O'Sullivan has worked
07:29the front line of health
07:30addiction and abuse
07:32what are we missing
07:35that's keeping our children safe
07:37it's all those drivers
07:38that contribute to child death
07:40and child murder
07:41that's you know
07:43demoralised
07:44despondent
07:46disenfranchised communities
07:47and you know
07:48so who
07:49where does that
07:50where's the answers for that
07:51where do they lie
07:52that's a big question
07:54but it comes
07:55at an individual level
07:56it's us
07:57seeing signs of abuse
08:00seeing signs of neglect
08:01and actually saying
08:03something about it
08:03so yeah
08:05I mean
08:05we all know times
08:07when we've
08:07you know
08:08maybe seen a bruise
08:09and we sort of said
08:10hey
08:10should that be
08:11something we should ask
08:12the question about
08:14and obviously
08:15you've driven here
08:15like a lot of
08:16many people
08:17so why did you come here
08:17to Baird?
08:19okay so
08:2114 years ago
08:22I was involved
08:23in a child murder
08:24in Kaitoho
08:24and I was
08:25the child was 2 years of age
08:27and I was working
08:27in the Kaitoho emergency department
08:29and that child was murdered
08:30and I was
08:32I had a lot of PTSD
08:34from that actually
08:34looking after a Maori child
08:36who died
08:36same age as my
08:37you know child
08:38who's 17 now
08:40and I'm here for that
08:42you know
08:42my own selfish reasons
08:43around this is
08:44to see that happen again
08:45in our community
08:46so close to home
08:47it's heartbreaking
08:48to be honest
08:50solidarity
08:50you know
08:51there's all these whanau
08:52here from Kaikoe
08:53and a wha
08:54to support this idea
08:56that you know
08:57it's not
08:57this is not right
08:58we are not
08:59a country
09:00that we could be proud of
09:01if we see our
09:02our tamariki
09:03our mokapuna
09:03die in these
09:04in these circumstances
09:05so yeah
09:06I guess it's a massive
09:07concern that even
09:08over a decade later
09:10we're still seeing this
09:14Northland towns
09:15like Kaikoe
09:16are currently battling
09:17overwhelming odds
09:18wastewater testing
09:19has revealed meth use
09:21tripling in the north
09:22over the past year
09:23higher than anywhere else
09:25and just last month
09:26ngā puhi chee
09:27mane tahere
09:28controversially called
09:30for an all-Pōtiki
09:31style police raid
09:32on affected communities
09:33and their meth dealers
09:37I think a sharp
09:41electrical jolt
09:42needs to be administered
09:44as happened
09:45in O Pōtiki
09:46Pōkai Kohe
09:48Mane is showing
09:50courage
09:50and boldness
09:54and I feel
09:55as a 65-year-old
09:58Māori political identity
10:00I should support Mane
10:01pardon me
10:03I came over today
10:04because I felt that
10:05Mane's voice
10:05was a lonely voice
10:07but
10:08why do you think
10:09it's a lonely voice?
10:10well
10:11there's an element
10:12of pakamā
10:14and look
10:15it goes against the grain
10:17I'm sure
10:18that this mokopuna
10:21suffered at the hands
10:22of someone
10:23who
10:24has themselves
10:26been unable
10:28to deal with addiction
10:29and all sorts of other
10:31social problems
10:32so
10:33this is
10:34a difficult area
10:35how as a Māori
10:36identity
10:38or Māori leader
10:40do you shine
10:41as being a kūpapa
10:43or a sellout
10:44of your own community
10:45and that's what makes
10:46Winston and I
10:47different politicians
10:48we don't
10:49bother about
10:50those epithets
10:51we know
10:53that
10:54all
10:54pockets
10:55of
10:57communities
10:57are challenged
10:58by drug-related
10:59dysfunctionalism
11:00it's disproportionately
11:02strong
11:02in Taitokero
11:04but it's not purely
11:05an ethnic thing
11:06I mean
11:07we don't
11:08we don't have
11:09an ethnic problem
11:10we have got
11:12problem
11:13ethnics
11:14and they are
11:15fuelled by drugs
11:16and violence
11:17and I am
11:18planning
11:19what's left
11:20of my
11:21shock word
11:24I'm not repelled
11:25by it straight away
11:26I've got to say
11:26but
11:28it's what's left
11:29behind
11:30it's just where
11:31the real work
11:32and the cleaning
11:33and the
11:34wātauna
11:35all of those things
11:36that's the longer
11:37journey
11:38that's the deeper
11:39journey
11:40we all want to
11:41protect our tamariki
11:42and mokopuna
11:43how do we do that
11:44I guess
11:44what are some
11:45steps forward
11:46to be with them
11:49five minutes
11:50out of your time
11:50out of your busy life
11:51is all they need
11:53they need that love
11:55they need their
11:56manaaki
11:57they need
11:58they need you
12:00they don't need
12:01mum or dad
12:02on the device
12:04you know
12:04they don't need
12:05mum or dad
12:06taking drugs
12:07they need mum
12:08and dad
12:09just to be with them
12:09this is how we grow
12:11this is how the children
12:12grow in love
12:33such a beautiful wee girl
12:35mā te mahitahi
12:37ano hoki
12:38tsuka
12:38so now what
12:40more after the break
12:58kia o rāno
12:59kia o rāno
12:59tia ashby is the chief executive
13:01o te hauora o ngāpuhi
13:03which oversees the community housing project
13:06where Katalia was attacked
13:07while visiting
13:08my first question to tia was
13:11tell me something about Kaikohe
13:13Kaikohe is a beautiful town
13:16we have creative artists
13:19we have entrepreneurs
13:21innovators
13:22future leaders
13:24it's a town that's full of mana and resilience
13:26and often the negative headlines that we see in the newspaper
13:32doesn't portray the beauty that is Kaikohe
13:36how are your team
13:38and how is the community
13:40inside that housing complex
13:42feeling after this
13:44they're feeling hurt
13:46they're feeling the heaviness
13:48of what's occurred
13:50they're feeling scared
13:51that something could happen again
13:52if the system doesn't change
13:55the issues we're experiencing here
13:57aren't just in Kaikohe
13:59they're across the country
14:00and it's not just within that housing complex
14:03it's other parts of the neighbourhood
14:05So this little girl
14:08was killed in this housing project that you manage
14:13and Shane Jones says
14:15it's a wake up call for those managing those complexes
14:18to maintain a level of authority and standards
14:22is that a fair comment from him?
14:25No it's not
14:26the responsibility is
14:28everyone's basically
14:30And your role is to manage this place?
14:34Yes
14:34Just tell me what that involves
14:36So what we get is a list of people from the social housing register
14:42and they're allocated a priority rating
14:46and based on that we have to place them into our units
14:50I'd say 95% of those tenants are fantastic
14:54rents paid on time
14:56some of them grow beautiful gardens
14:59they look after one another
15:01they're living in safe, warm, secure homes
15:045% of them however
15:07we have persisting challenges
15:10associated with managing these complex tenancies
15:15and so often there's hidden vital information
15:19that resides with other government agencies
15:22such as police, justice, child protection services
15:28mental health and addiction support services
15:33that we don't have visibility over
15:35So if someone ends up being a tenant
15:39and then the red flags
15:40and the neighbours notice
15:41oh heck this person's got some real issues
15:45and we don't feel safe
15:47what is your response?
15:49We cannot evit
15:50so that's the role of the tenancy tribunal
15:52we will go and approach the tenant
15:55to say a breach has occurred
15:58this is what's happened
16:00can we offer you any supports
16:02if it's addiction issues
16:03the individual has to want support and help
16:08you can't force her support services
16:10so that's one challenge we have
16:13another challenge is referring to specialist services
16:17that don't exist
16:19another challenge that's significant
16:23and there's limited housing
16:26eight times out of ten
16:29they're going to re-enter our housing
16:31as an emergency housing
16:32What practical things do you think
16:35would make a difference?
16:36Well for me some of the short-term solutions
16:38I definitely think are going to work
16:40is real-time sharing inter-agency
16:43sharing of information
16:44especially for high-risk clients
16:47drug testing
16:49of tenants before placement occurs
16:51there needs to be inter-agency
16:54proactive planning and collaboration
16:58housing providers need to have
17:01some level of control
17:03over that housing register
17:06and last but not least
17:07what we're needing in the short-term
17:09is a safe anonymous way
17:13for people to report their concerns
17:15and not necessarily through government agencies
17:18or it could be 0800 line
17:21where people can feel safe
17:26where they don't feel they're going to be judged
17:28or that there's going to be no other consequences
17:32to them reporting that information
17:35After the break
17:36what might the long-term
17:38circuit breakers be?
17:56Kia ora no
17:58Katalia's death on May 21
18:00is set against a myriad of difficult
18:02and interconnected issues
18:03Mane Tahere, Ngā Puhi Chair
18:06suggested that police raids
18:07similar to those in Ō Pōtuki
18:09could be just one of many tactics
18:11to deal to the meth crisis
18:12Raewyn Nordstrom
18:14retired after 30 years
18:15working with whānau through SIPs
18:17and Oranga Tamariki
18:18still gets contacted
18:20from children of women
18:21she helped back in the day
18:23so many cycles
18:24first I asked
18:26former Deputy Police Commissioner
18:27Wally Haumaha
18:28who needs to step up
18:30and how
18:32When you say
18:33who needs to step up
18:34over decades
18:36our people have been trying
18:37to stand up
18:38in different
18:39in different periods of time
18:41and it's not a problem
18:43that can
18:44that's simply fixed overnight
18:45when you think about
18:46the social problems
18:47in our society
18:48that are impacting
18:49on our young people
18:51right across the spectrum
18:53of criminal justice
18:54So Raewyn
18:56Lance O'Sullivan
18:57said that we need to step up
18:59and see if there are signs
19:01we need to do something
19:03does that resonate with you?
19:04Oh absolutely
19:05I've always believed
19:06that we need to be
19:08brave enough
19:08to stand there
19:09and say to someone
19:10I don't like what you're doing
19:11to that baby
19:12give me that baby here
19:13and I'll look after her
19:14and then when you sort yourself out
19:15you come get your baby back
19:17you know like
19:18I think that
19:20we all need to be the aunties
19:21you know
19:22we all have those aunties
19:23and uncles
19:23that will tell you off
19:24hug you when you're sad
19:27give you a telling off
19:28when you're bad
19:28we need those aunties
19:30to step up
19:31in all our communities
19:34and be the village
19:36because a lot of our people
19:37that are out there
19:38don't have the village
19:39around them
19:40to support them
19:41I mean I was in court
19:42two weeks ago
19:42with two
19:44supporting two young mums
19:45who were also state wards
19:48to try and get
19:49their children back
19:50now there was no one
19:51there for them
19:52there was no whānau
19:53because they've been
19:53disconnected
19:54there was no social worker
19:55because they've been
19:56discharged from
19:57that care a long time ago
19:59they were there
19:59on their own
20:00it was really sad
20:01I support
20:02the kōrero around fathers
20:04and around our male
20:06males
20:07and our
20:09rangatira
20:09of our hāpore
20:10alongside our
20:12māreikura
20:12and so we need
20:14more pono kōrero
20:16with ourselves
20:16and I say everybody
20:17needs to step up
20:18system
20:19OT
20:20everybody
20:20but I'm focusing on
20:22ourselves
20:23looking into ourselves
20:24I sit with our marae
20:26with our hapu
20:27every month
20:28and we're talking about
20:30how do we have
20:30those tough conversations
20:32go and talk to your brother
20:33go and talk to your sons
20:35your aunties
20:37your sisters
20:38those who are either
20:41distributing
20:42and have the kōrero
20:43a whānau first
20:44it's uncomfortable
20:45I think
20:46for our community
20:47we're just
20:48in a situation
20:49where it's enough
20:50it is enough
20:50so
20:51so Wally
20:52for over 40 years
20:54you've been a policeman
20:56and
20:57been leading
20:58development of strategies
20:59that
21:00I guess
21:01would be more
21:02collegial
21:02or collaborative
21:03with iwi
21:04and with community
21:05leaders
21:06so what's your response
21:07to
21:08any call
21:09that
21:09ok let's just
21:10bring in the police
21:11bring in the police
21:12and just
21:13do the shock treatment
21:14police
21:15have a strategy
21:16they have to respond
21:17in the first instance
21:18if the balloon goes up
21:19but then there's the short term
21:21to medium interventions
21:22so what's happening
21:23in that community
21:24how are they planning
21:25how are they getting
21:26the right information
21:27how are they getting
21:28the right intelligence
21:28and how do they deploy
21:30to beat that demand
21:31or that situation
21:33at that point in time
21:34you know
21:35so that intelligence
21:36needs to come
21:37from community
21:38so when you're talking
21:39about police
21:39and iwi
21:40you're absolutely right
21:41it's a two way street
21:42and we can't be
21:43mutually exclusive
21:44of each other
21:45we've got to work together
21:46so
21:47so money
21:48Shane Jones
21:48was up there
21:49supporting your call
21:51for I guess
21:51a bit of shock treatment
21:52why did you make that call
21:54we need more
21:55baseline police
21:56there's not even
21:57enough of that
21:57around those raids
21:59that's police's job
22:00I'm not a
22:01vigilante group
22:03but what I really
22:05in the context
22:05to that
22:06have wanted
22:08was prior
22:10to those
22:10surges
22:11and those raids
22:13there was a
22:13high
22:14wastewater
22:14count
22:16after
22:16immediately
22:17after
22:17that dropped
22:18off by half
22:18that's what I want
22:19for Kaikui
22:20I love Kaikui
22:21I love our towns
22:22and so
22:23we're in that
22:24crisis
22:25where we need
22:26that short
22:26sharp
22:26I've also met
22:28community providers
22:30and looked at
22:31what happened
22:31in Opootiki
22:32and how do we
22:32prevent the fallout
22:34with our whanau
22:34in Tamariki
22:35so there's
22:36awesome people
22:37in our towns
22:37but ignoring
22:39the hard call
22:41it wasn't going to
22:41make that
22:42I think
22:43we'll be better
22:44off in the long run
22:45Wally
22:45where do we go
22:46from here
22:47because
22:48yes the police
22:48can come in
22:49and do the
22:49short sharp shift
22:50but what else
22:51needs to happen
22:52it's not just
22:52a police issue
22:54it's not just
22:54a government issue
22:55it's not just
22:56those government agencies
22:58however
22:59if they're sitting
22:59in those positions
23:00and they've got
23:01all the information
23:02to be able
23:03to drive
23:04the support services
23:05into iwi entities
23:06then that's what
23:07we should be doing
23:08it doesn't abrogate
23:10one or the other
23:10of their responsibility
23:11to step up
23:12and so I mean
23:13you know
23:14we've
23:14you think about
23:15the things
23:15that we've done
23:16over the years
23:16looking at
23:18giving our people
23:19a second chance
23:20you know
23:20and developing
23:21programs
23:22up in
23:23Kaitaia
23:24down in
23:25Whangarei
23:25across Taranaki
23:26right through
23:28the region
23:28you know
23:29that is a
23:30program
23:30that actually
23:32identified
23:32the problems
23:33that our people
23:34were going through
23:35without having
23:36to kick the doors in
23:36once those people
23:38came into the system
23:39and of course
23:39shoplifting
23:40was the most
23:40prevalent offence
23:41that you could
23:42pick up
23:42in this whole
23:43piece
23:44and so you know
23:46when we sat down
23:47and said to the police
23:48you know
23:48okay you've arrested
23:49that woman
23:50for shoplifting
23:50she's had
23:51seven previous
23:52convictions
23:53for shoplifting
23:54you know
23:55so why would
23:56you lock her up
23:56an eighth time
23:57without understanding
23:58the reasons why
23:59and often
24:00it was
24:01no kai in the cupboards
24:02kids are hungry
24:04no employment
24:05in there
24:06your mother getting
24:07beaten
24:07all of the stuff
24:09all of those
24:09issues that
24:10have social harm
24:11around family harm
24:12kids going to school
24:13you know
24:14feeling as though
24:15they've lost
24:16their self-worth
24:17the neglect
24:18the abuse
24:19all of those
24:20things come in
24:21and I know
24:21at the moment
24:22it's absolutely
24:22raw
24:23to think about
24:24how do we step up
24:25to support the families
24:26in our community
24:27who are suffering
24:28under the weight
24:28of this horrific
24:30homicide
24:31in Kaikohe
24:31when you think
24:32about the red flag
24:33somebody in those
24:34families knows
24:35they know
24:36what's happening
24:37but do they have
24:38the courage
24:38to step out
24:39and do we have
24:40the courage
24:41to step in
24:41because somebody
24:42in that situation
24:43up in Kaikohe
24:44somebody must have
24:45seen something
24:46in the past
24:47and not said anything
24:49and do you think
24:51Raewon
24:52that some of
24:53the whanau
24:53that you support
24:55that they're likely
24:56to ring the police
24:58they're not likely
24:59to call the police
25:00and that's the
25:00unfortunate thing
25:01they'll look for
25:02I mean look at that
25:03some of these mums
25:04they call someone
25:05that they knew
25:06when they were a teenager
25:07going through
25:07child youth and family
25:08I think that they
25:09need to have
25:11definitely some
25:12other form
25:13of gathering support
25:15we're talking
25:16at this point
25:17in time
25:18how do we create
25:20platforms within
25:21hapu and marae
25:22that are like
25:23a call helpline
25:24like a
25:25anonymous call
25:26and actually
25:27kaumatua have
25:28a really
25:29important role
25:30to play here
25:31as well
25:31they can traverse
25:32across that
25:34concept of
25:34nanking
25:35because they've
25:36had a life
25:36experience
25:37and they're
25:38looking after
25:38mokopuna
25:39and so
25:39I'm having
25:40conversations
25:41with kaumatua
25:41happy to have
25:42the kōrero
25:43we need to
25:44make sure
25:44it's safe
25:44though
25:45if I can
25:45just touch
25:46on the
25:46hikoi
25:47and katalia
25:48it was so
25:48emotional
25:49that hikoi
25:50was about
25:50celebrating
25:51that tamariki
25:52that taonga
25:53he tapu
25:53te mokopuna
25:54and so
25:55I just
25:55really
25:56don't want
25:57to throw
25:57shade on
25:58everybody
25:59who has
25:59to contribute
26:00just get
26:01over ourselves
26:01and get
26:02to doing
26:02the solutions
26:03whether
26:03your
26:04government
26:04or not
26:05or whanau
26:06or not
26:06kick up
26:07the dust
26:08empty
26:08the tank
26:09on this
26:09everyone
26:10in the now
26:11but the
26:12generations
26:12to come
26:13will be
26:13better
26:13all
26:15last
26:15words
26:16Rowan
26:16so my
26:17thoughts
26:17are
26:17be brave
26:18you know
26:18be that
26:19auntie
26:19be that
26:20uncle
26:20that
26:21says to
26:22someone
26:22hey bro
26:23you know
26:24you need
26:24some help
26:24give me
26:25your baby
26:26until you
26:26know
26:26you get
26:27some help
26:27I'll look
26:28after your
26:28baby
26:28Molly
26:29I think
26:30that
26:30alternative
26:30justice
26:31program
26:31around
26:32getting
26:32people
26:32in front
26:33of our
26:33own
26:33people
26:34who can
26:35provide
26:35the
26:35services
26:36can provide
26:36follow up
26:37it's a
26:37safety
26:38mechanism
26:38it has
26:39all the
26:40key elements
26:40of providing
26:42aroha
26:42tautoko
26:43manaaki
26:44to not
26:45only the
26:46offender
26:47but to
26:47the offender's
26:48family and
26:49also the
26:49victims
26:50so this is a
26:51way of bringing
26:51that all
26:52together
26:52otherwise we'll
26:53be sitting
26:54here in
26:54another five
26:55years saying
26:55what are the
26:56alternative
26:56pathways to
26:57keep our
26:57people out of
26:58prison if
26:59they commit
26:59crime
27:00you know
27:00are we the
27:01architects of
27:01interventions
27:02that are
27:02going to
27:02prevent this
27:03long term
27:04are we
27:04simply the
27:05interior
27:05decorators
27:06that are
27:07going to
27:07step up
27:08when you know
27:08when the
27:09going gets
27:09tough and
27:10suddenly we
27:10all come
27:11out and
27:11say oh my
27:12god how
27:12did that
27:13happen
27:14good point
27:15wally we
27:16want to be
27:16the architects
27:17not the
27:18interior
27:18decorators
27:19so many
27:20cycles to
27:21break and
27:22as our
27:22guests suggest
27:23everyone
27:24including we
27:25as individuals
27:25need to
27:26step up
27:27our hearts
27:28go out to
27:29the people
27:29in kaikohe
27:30and once
27:31again to
27:31the parents
27:32and whanau
27:32of 15
27:33year old
27:33Kaia
27:34Karoudia
27:34there's been
27:35an outpouring
27:36of aroha
27:37for the
27:37family
27:38we want
27:38to thank
27:39everyone
27:39who has
27:40reached out
27:40to the
27:41police
27:41and to
27:42us
27:42with
27:42information
27:43around
27:44Kaia's
27:44death
27:45please
27:45keep it
27:46coming
27:47Pō marie
28:02Blackbird
28:11Blackbird
28:13Good day
28:14do
28:14Taki
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