Mastering Real Estate in a Complex Market: 10 Key Strategies

HousingWire

In this insightful interview, Debbie De Grote of Forward Coaching shares essential mindset shifts, strategies and tools for real estate agents to thrive in a complex and evolving market. Topics include becoming a market expert, leveraging AI, effective prospecting and adapting to new business models.   Here’s a glimpse of what you’ll learn:   Mindset shifts for agents in a complex market   The importance of being a wise adviser and market expert   Leveraging AI tools for efficiency and personalization   Effective prospecting strategies in a changing environment   Adapting to new business models and private listings   Related to this episode:   Debbie De Grote's LinkedIn  https://www.linkedin.com/in/debbie-de-grote-822a8477/  Forward Coaching  https://forwardcoaching.com/about/  Debbie's Script Book  https://info.forwardcoaching.com/podcastscriptbook   The RealTrending podcast features conversations with the brightest minds in real estate. Every Monday, brokerage leaders, top agents, team leaders, and industry experts join us to share their secrets to success, trends, and the lessons they’ve learned. Hosted by Tracey Velt and produced by the HousingWire Content Studio.

Transcript

00:08There's so many shifts happening in the real estate industry right now. And here to make

00:13sense of it and to help agents move through any uncertainties that they have is Debbie

00:20DeGroat. She is the founder and coach of Forward Coaching, and she shared some really wonderful

00:26insights with us today. So enjoy the podcast. Debbie, welcome back to the podcast. It's been

00:32a couple of years since we've talked. It has, it has. And here we are. We're still working away.

00:38Yeah, absolutely. Although the atmosphere is definitely more complex right now or the

00:43environment for real estate agents. You know, you've got affordability, you've got uncertainty

00:49in the market, you've got compensation changes, more selective clients. So what are the biggest

00:56mindset shifts that agents need now to stay competitive? You know, I think maybe the most

01:05important is that if they're going to shine in the environment now and in the future, they really

01:12need to own the space of being the wise advisor. They need to own that space of being seen as

01:20that

01:20market expert, not something you can find on chat GPT, but you can only get that advice from that boots

01:27on the ground person that's a true professional. So as we know, there's lots of lots of real estate

01:34agents with a license, but then you've got that, that top 1%, right? They just really shine in their

01:42market. Yeah. I mean, the advisor idea, you know, in a, in a market like the COVID market,

01:49it was much more transactional and being an advisor was more difficult because, you know,

01:55you're moving transaction to transaction. Now is the time to really hone those skills, right?

02:00Well, someone wants you to come and sit with them and say, you know, in spite of what's going on

02:05in the

02:05world, in the market, I really, I want to move. I need to move, but does this make sense to

02:10me right

02:11now? How do I do it without being homeless? What are the right steps? Should I wait six months? And

02:17of course, no one has a crystal ball, but I always think, you know, the magic's in the math and

02:22the

02:22data. And if someone can sit with them and go through the pros and cons, you know, it's funny,

02:29Tracy, with AI and all the stuff that's being talked about and, and will it replace, you know,

02:35real estate agents. And I, I remember when clients could first search on the internet,

02:43when that first happened, I was in the business and they told us that within five years,

02:49real estate agents would be extinct. And yet they're not. Why? Because people need someone

02:58to sit with them. And, and sometimes it's holding their hand through the emotional dramas,

03:02but often it's just really look at my situation, give me the best advice possible.

03:08Yeah, absolutely. So you work with a lot of agents at all different production levels,

03:13but what do you see as the biggest thing holding agents back right now?

03:17I do work with agents at all production levels. Although I, I would say our primary

03:23is the top 1% in the country. Um, and, and I think just because here at Forward, we've

03:30attracted always the seasoned producers because we have really experienced coaches. We take a really

03:37strong custom approach to the coaching that they like because they're so complicated. They're all

03:43so different. So where we really get exposure more to the, let's say everything from new ish,

03:51you know, and up is often in their teams. And as they're working to improve their per agent production.

03:59And what I see is one of the challenges, if I could just be pretty blunt is people come into

04:06this

04:06business, having watched the TV shows like selling sunset or, you know, whatever other, you know,

04:15back in the day it was million dollar listing that got that all started. And they think it's that way,

04:20you know, you dress up, you, you go to lunch and you go to the bank.

04:23And I think what's missing is the cadence of the activities that are consistent and purpose-driven

04:32and, and, and being okay with the fact that every day I have to hunt for new business. I have

04:39to make

04:39new connections or I'm just not going to survive. And I find that many are not willing

04:45to do the work that it takes. And so they get a few deals here and there, but the consistent

04:52producers,

04:52you know, they know we've got to approach this like, like a real job.

04:58Yeah, absolutely. Um, and there's a lot of uncertainty about compensation and value. Um,

05:04you know, what can, what can, you know, average regular producers learn from the 1% as far as,

05:12um, their value and how are they reframing their value proposition today?

05:16Yeah. You know, it's interesting when all of the drama went down around the commission changes and

05:23rules, all of us in the industry, you know, top down in the industry, they were, we were concerned

05:30and what's going to happen and how's this going to disrupt things. Interestingly enough, most of the

05:37agents that I know that we coach that I connect with across the country, it has not been a problem

05:44for them. Actually, in many cases, they're earning more. And I think if, if someone is struggling

05:51with those conversations, it's more just mastering how to say it and how to explain it. And I think of

06:01it as options, you know, we're not pitching or pushing someone into a structure they don't feel

06:08comfortable with. However, each and every agent has the right to decide what do I feel is my,

06:15my value and what am I willing to accept this project and, and my compensation that I want for

06:23that. And then it's a seller or buyer's opportunity to say, yes, Tracy, I think you're worth that.

06:30But laying out the options, you know, especially when it comes to a buyer and how commissions are paid

06:37paid. And they do have options, you know, they can pay the agent, they can find sellers that are

06:43willing to pay the agent, they can negotiate between the two. If a seller won't pay, and they

06:48don't want to pay, they can say, I pass, I'm on to the next property. So just being able to

06:54empower

06:54them with their options, because our consumers today are pretty smart. Yeah, absolutely. And as far as,

07:02you know, private listings are concerned, what are the questions you're being asked by the

07:07agents that you coach? When it comes to, you know, there's, there's a lot of shift in the in the

07:13industry right now with that with a lot of the companies collaborating with some of the portals,

07:18and, you know, other companies have their own marketing plan. What are you hearing from them?

07:25What questions are they asking? Interestingly enough, not a lot. Like day to day, most of the top

07:33agents in the country are just, they're, they're just doing their job. They're like, when something

07:37changes, I'll adapt, I'll pivot. But in the meantime, a lot of noise out there, and we'll just

07:44see where it all lands and settles. However, it's interesting to me that a lot of sellers do prefer

07:52off market sales. And it's not just in the high end, that never used to be that way. They always

08:01in the

08:02past saw a lot of value with I want my house on the MLS. And now we're starting to see

08:07a lot more

08:08that would prefer to have a more private sale. So I think, again, I don't really see it changing

08:18anything yet. But changes will come, right? I know there's going to be changes coming. And I and we

08:24can't, we can't control what we don't know. But what we should do as strong professionals is just

08:31be ready to pivot and pick up whatever new skills, dialogue scripts, which by the way, Tracy, we want

08:38to give everyone listening our gifts of the scripts, you know, for for listening to this, but being able

08:45to just move in that and that's where the average agent does not. That's what they do not do. Yeah,

08:53this is the way I've always done it. I don't want to I don't want to see it. I don't

08:57want to hear it

08:58until it's too late, right until it's passed them by. So for agents who are maybe hitting a plateau,

09:05or they're they're trying to get to the next step in their career, but they're really having trouble

09:10not sure where they can go. What are maybe three tips you can offer them to get them at least

09:17moving

09:18forward? So I would say number one, leverage technology, AI included, but your CRM, your tools

09:27that you might be paying for, because agents are always incredibly busy, but they can't always afford

09:34to have administrative support. Number two, build your influence in your community. I'm encouraging

09:43them right now to expand, I call it their range, reach and influence. So if we get out in the

09:50community, make great connections, be a champion of small business owners, interview them post on social

09:57media, just find your influencers in your market. And I always believe in leading with value. And then

10:05in return, you know, they may send you referrals. We've got a great guy, Adam Dow, he's such a terrific

10:11example of this in New Hampshire, and he's built a 25 year career with a team doing almost 400 units

10:19a

10:19year, just by how he gives back and participates in that community. And the third thing might be,

10:26you know, there's certain people who probably would benefit from joining a team, if they find a strong,

10:35powerful team in their market that has the systems, the staff, the technology, and, you know, internal

10:44coaching, and mentoring. Because sometimes that's the catalyst, they plug in, they get that support

10:52behind them, which they could not afford, or even know how to do on their own. So I think in

10:59the

10:59future, we're going to see more and more, you have the great teams and team leaders. And you have agents

11:05in the business saying, maybe I don't want to do this on my own anymore. Right? It's just too hard.

11:12Yeah, absolutely. And, you know, there's also a lot of new business models. And I think we're going to

11:19see even more business models coming into, into the, you know, the real estate industry, we've got

11:27discount brokerages, of course, we've got 100% cap models, commission free platforms that are gaining

11:33some traction. How should traditional agents really position themselves to work, you know, to work with the

11:41competition or to thrive above the competition? Yes, there's two things like, as an agent, you could

11:50go work somewhere where you pay very, very little to that brokerage. And you get very, very little in

11:57return, you know, compliance on your transactions, very, very little support, probably not a physical

12:03location. If you're a well established seasoned agent, maybe that would work for you. I think from the

12:11majority of the agents out there that need more, that's where they would have to say, okay, there's

12:18no free ride here, either, I'm going to go somewhere and pay a split, or I'm going to go somewhere

12:25and not

12:26pay a split, but I got to pay all this out of my own pocket. And, and maybe that's not

12:30the best way for

12:31me. Now, when it comes to the other side, like the discount cut rate offers to the consumers.

12:41I mean, that's been going on forever. You know, I remember having to deal with that as a new agent

12:49in my career, where they would charge $500 and put you into the MLS. What was interesting,

12:56though, is the majority of consumers did not choose that option. And, and in fact, I even had

13:05an objection handler where I would say, you know, Mrs. Seller, that may be an option you prefer. And

13:12yet, you know, would just make sense that if it was incredibly successful, everyone would do it.

13:20Right. And yet less than 20% of home sellers or home buyers seek a heavily discounted option

13:29because it just doesn't work very well. Yeah. Yeah. And then, but then I think it's on us

13:36to be able to not only explain our value prop, however, to also prove it, which is why we encourage

13:45all of our coaching clients to be gathering those great reviews, right? Because when you think about

13:51your five-star Google reviews, we actually have someone, Nick Waldner in Virginia, who has

13:572,200 Google reviews. It's pretty hard to argue with his value, right? So I think we have to be

14:08able to

14:08talk about it, you know, shine in your market, and then show those reviews to prove that I do,

14:16I do provide what I say I provide. Yeah. Well, and I, I believe there's a model for every agent.

14:22So

14:22it, maybe it's not necessarily, you're, you're competing against yourself in a lot of times and,

14:29and providing, you know, the person you're representing the best service possible. Um, so,

14:37so, so yeah. Um, so, uh, so, you know, I think that there's a lot of concern about new models

14:44or,

14:45you know, agents want to jump model to model to see what they like and, and you know what,

14:50they'll find it, they'll find what they want. Um, and then of course, let's talk about AI because

14:55it's quickly becoming part of, uh, the, you know, real estate workflow and where are you seeing agents

15:04using it effectively? Well, it's, I, in fact, I was talking to my husband who's been in the business

15:09over 30 years and he said, I just love it for writing my property descriptions, right? It,

15:17because many of us are just not that creative and it's very creative. I see agents, you know,

15:23researching client challenges that they're having and saying, you know, and just getting that,

15:29that feedback from AI. Um, I was just thinking of another, Oh, area pro it's just happens to be a,

15:37a little technology that will run property data for you. You, you do have to subscribe to it as an

15:44agent, but what's cool about it is it will run the property and market data, but then you can say,

15:50can you now write a script for me? If I'm going to explain this to a seller who wants to

15:57overprice

15:57their home or write a script for me, if I want to explain this data to a buyer, who's thinking

16:03of

16:03making a very low offer and may not win the property. Now, can you turn it into a blog?

16:09Now, can you turn it into a text? Like it's just, it's incredible, right? For when you think about

16:15being a brand new agent, having a tool like that, now you've got this beautiful data report for your

16:22client. But more than that, you now know exactly what to say, right? Yeah. To that client based on

16:30that scenario. So, um, I, that's really a few of the areas I, Oh, and I should mention, uh, some

16:37of

16:37the CRMs out there may have it. I just happen to be pretty familiar with Brivity because many of our

16:43clients use it. And I know that they actually built in AI coaching. So speaking of scripts,

16:50if I wanted to practice my lead generation scripting, I can go right online, get in there

16:57with my AI coach and the coach will role play back and forth with me and then give me a

17:04scoring at the

17:05end of how well that AI coach felt I did. That's pretty amazing. Oh, I love that. Yeah. I love

17:12that.

17:12I think, um, you know, one of the mistakes I'm seeing agents make is that they're just running

17:18it through AI and putting it out there. Maybe they're checking to make sure it's accurate,

17:23but it, it sounds like AI. Um, you know, what, how are you guiding the agents that you coach to

17:32use it

17:33in a way where their own personality comes through and, but they, they benefit from using it, um, to save

17:42time and be more efficient. Well, I think Jessica, my vice president here would be far better to answer

17:49that question. Cause she, she coaches me on it and she uses it for our marketing, our marketing bullets,

17:56you know, certain descriptions of our products. And what she always tells me though, is you got to be

18:02careful because there's certain words and phrases that people will quickly recognize that this is AI

18:08generated. So what she does is she uses it as her starting point. And then she goes back in and,

18:18and customizes it and, and removes any of that, that would make it appear very chat GPT. And it,

18:26and it is annoying if someone here applies for a job and they're going to present this project that

18:32they're going to do for us. And you can look at it and you go, there's no original thought here.

18:38So I do think to your point, we have to be careful about that.

18:41Yeah. You have to build your own voice into it for sure. Absolutely.

18:45So how do you coach agents to balance efficiency, efficiency with personalization,

18:50especially as like we talked about technology makes it easy to just automate large parts of the

18:55client experience. Um, you know, human is always important to be in there. So how do you balance

19:02that? Hmm. You know, I efficiency of systems for, Oh, I'll give you an example. And this may,

19:10it's just the one that came to mind. I just had to do a class last week on perfecting your

19:16listing

19:17process. And part of what I said is, you know, Tracy, if I were going to meet with you to

19:24list your home,

19:25I want it to be very engaging, interactive. I want to customize it to your personality.

19:35I want to speak your language in terms of the sales language. And, and, and that's what we teach

19:41our, our coaching clients to do. So it's highly customized. And yet underneath it, there is a

19:49framework. There is a process because otherwise it's like, Oh, I've got this appointment.

19:54And then I'm winging it or winging it is not fair to the client doesn't create predictable result,

20:02but you can have that framework underneath. For an example, I'm always going to ask these certain

20:07questions when I'm setting the appointment, which will help me, which are in our scripts that we're

20:13giving you guys, by the way, which will help me have a better understanding of the client.

20:18Then there's a process for how I do the home tour. And there's a process for how we discuss pricing.

20:25There's a process for how do I move to the agreement? What's the right time? So that runs

20:31underneath it, but engaging with that client in the way they want to be sold is that's fine art,

20:41really, I think, selling and negotiating. Yeah, absolutely. And so lead generation has gotten

20:48tougher, you know, especially since we have fewer transactions. So what are the most effective

20:55prospecting strategies that you're seeing work right now?

20:58Yeah. And I, and I think we're even being careful here at Forward to use the word lead gen versus

21:03prospect because, you know, people get so fired up about it. And one of the things I would suggest is

21:09each and every person needs to consult with their broker, with their board, and really find out what

21:16are the new restrictions. Every state is a little bit different, right? So you want to find out so you

21:23know. And then if you use certain tools and services, like a land voice as an example, which provides

21:31certain data points of people that you can then reach out and call, and their lists have already been

21:39scrubbed. So you know that you're only contacting people who are not on the do not call list.

21:47There are some new rules in many states about how you can approach or not approach expireds in certain ways.

21:56It's annoying. It creates another extra level of work for all of us. And yet,

22:04what's kind of good about it is when it takes more effort to figure out how do I do this

22:13approach to

22:14this particular area of lead gen, follow the rules, and yet do it at a really high level,

22:22it's a little more work, which means the average agent probably won't do it. So I think it may

22:30thin out the competition in some of those areas of opportunity. There's, there's still plenty to do.

22:39My first advice would be, why don't you work very effectively the people who know who you are and are

22:46willing to talk to you? Because Tracy, probably 85% of agents that come to us for coaching say,

22:53a lot of my business comes from people I know, but I don't follow up with them effectively. I don't

23:00call

23:00them. I don't market consistently. That's a huge area that can easily be perfected.

23:08Yeah, absolutely. So looking ahead, what skills or behaviors will define the most successful agents

23:14over the next year or so?

23:15Well, I am a big fan of Chris Voss, who wrote the book, Never Split the Difference. Chris is the

23:21ex, you know, FBI hostage negotiator. If any of you listening have not read his book, I think it's a

23:27great book. He has a great masterclass online. And now he teaches at, of course, Harvard Business School.

23:35And, and I think that the days of order taking will be over if you want to earn significant commission

23:47amounts. Now you could be that cut rate, discount, flat fee, and just crank out, you know, people that,

23:57for an example, you know, we think of H&R Block for taxes. I don't even know if they're still

24:02around,

24:02but they just came to my mind because you could walk in their door down and dirty, quick little

24:06tax return. However, that would not work well for most of us, right? So I do think there will always

24:13be that market and not trying to make them wrong. That's just a different market. But then there's

24:19the market where you really have to be an expert negotiator. And you really have to look at everything

24:28from cross-cultural selling to selling to the personality styles to, you know, being that calm,

24:36cool head in the deal. Just, I think of it as just masterful. I was just on with one of

24:41our clients,

24:42Jennifer Leahy in Greenwich, Connecticut. And just today on our coaching session, we were talking about

24:50strategies on a $35 million deal she's working. We were talking about approach and email that she was

24:57constructing on a $7 million that she's competing to win. And of course, she doesn't want to make the

25:03other agent look bad or trash talk. How does she, though, explain her value? So, yeah, masterful.

25:14You need to study the art of selling, which many don't, which is kind of shocking to me.

25:19All right. So I have a lightning round. This is kind of the first thing that pops into your head.

25:24Most overrated lead source right now. I think leads that you only pay when you close the deal,

25:32and it's often a very stiff tariff of 40%. And you have to take a look at that and say,

25:39for my time invested and that high tariff, would I have been better off to do more deals from my

25:47sphere, right? Or fewer units with something where I get the full commission.

25:53Yeah. The most important conversation agents need to get better at?

25:57Talking to their past clients and sphere about how to build their wealth by investing and owning

26:04real estate. I think they hesitate because they feel they're being pushy. But there's so many people

26:13in their databases that if they could just be educated and shown the opportunity to invest or

26:20help their children invest, and I think shame on us for being reluctant to have those valuable

26:26conversations.

26:27Yeah, absolutely. All right. I'm going to go back to the one habit agents should drop immediately.

26:32Being so mean to each other.

26:34You know, when I think about all the stories I hear on negotiations of how agents feel that they

26:44have to be so aggressive and confrontational. And I'm certainly not saying that's all, because

26:50remember, we know some of the most amazing. I was riding with my husband in his car this weekend,

26:56and he's got multiple offers on a listing and an agent calling him on the Bluetooth. And she's just so

27:05like, he's very pleasant and calm. And she's so rude, and aggressive, and pushy. And I'm thinking,

27:12I feel so sad for your buyer, who does not even know that you're out here behaving this way. Or

27:20I

27:20feel sad for her, that she thinks that that is the mark of a true negotiator. And you know,

27:27Chris Voss says best negotiators are great collaborators.

27:31Yeah, absolutely. My last question is in one word, the agent of the future is

27:38masterful. I really think it's going to come down to that. You know, what would you expect

27:44of a brain surgeon? What would you expect if you're on trial for your life? You know, what,

27:50what would you expect if you're being audited by the IRS? Right? I mean, right.

27:55You want masterful. And those agents will still always command the highest rates of commission,

28:04because there will be people that are willing to pay for that.

28:08Yeah, absolutely. And we will have that link to the script, scripts and conversations in the show

28:15notes. But Debbie, thanks so much for joining the Real Trending podcast today.

28:20It's always an honor. And thank you. And I hope all of you have a great year.

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