United’s Rick Haase on competition, mission and brokerage values

Name: United’s Rick Haase on competition, mission and brokerage values
Uploaded: 2026-01-09T22:12:05+00:00
Duration: 32 min 46 s
Channel: HousingWire

HousingWire

8 months ago

In this episode of the Real Trending Podcast, Tracey Velt speaks with Rick Haase, President & COO of United Real Estate, about the current state of the real estate industry, focusing on the surge of lawsuits, particularly regarding private listing networks. They discuss the importance of having a clear mission for brokerages, the strategies for growth in a changing market, and the implications of the NAR settlement. Haase emphasizes the need for operational excellence and the financial wellness of agents as key components for success in the industry.

Here is a glimpse of what you'll learn:

The real estate industry is currently facing a surge in lawsuits, particularly related to private listing networks.

Private listing networks are not a new concept; they have existed in various forms for years.

A clear mission focused on the financial trajectory of agents is crucial for brokerage success.

Financial literacy and wellness programs can significantly impact agents' financial health.

The market is fragmented, and competition will naturally evolve without external intervention.

Operational excellence and disciplined cost management are essential for thriving in the real estate market.

The NAR settlement has complex implications that may not lead to a complete overturn but will require adjustments.

Growth strategies should focus on organic recruitment and mergers with smaller brokerages.

Agents need to be mission-driven and integrity-focused to succeed in the current market.

The market will ultimately dictate the success of new business models and strategies.

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00:00When it comes to running a large brokerage, United Real Estate's president and COO, Rick Haas, has a very clear vision of how the company grows, what they do for their agents, and what their mission is.

00:13We discuss all of that and more, including some of the trends in the industry, the massive lawsuits that are happening right now, private listings, and all of those fun topics.

00:24So enjoy the episode. And a special thanks to HomeBot for sponsoring this episode of The Real Trending Podcast.

00:32So Rick, it's always a pleasure to talk to you. Thanks for joining The Real Trending Podcast.

00:36Yeah, thanks for inviting me, Tracy. Glad to be here.

00:39Yeah, yeah. So I think you're the first, no, second of January, 2026 podcast that we have this year.

00:47So I appreciate you coming on. And because it's early in the year, there are so many predictions out there of what's going to happen.

00:56And we've called it the year of the lawsuit because it seems like they're just flying out there right now, specifically with the portals.

01:04But there's a lot of other ones out there, too.

01:07So what changes or trends are you seeing that might impact how real estate professionals do business?

01:16Or what keeps you up at night concerning some of the things going on?

01:21Well, one of the great question, one of the advantages of having time in a business like I have, getting in when I was 18 years old,

01:29and seeing so much transformation of the industry, is that I tend not to be alarmed about things that are going on.

01:39But you're right, there's a lot going on.

01:42And it's the industry trying to find its center amidst a lot of what I would say noise.

01:48In fact, that's one of the things I'm coaching all of our people to pay attention to signal, not noise.

01:54It's stay grounded in the fundamentals, kind of forward with the fundamentals, and be highly adaptive to what's coming when we know it's actually coming.

02:06Like, there's a lot of conversation right now, Tracy, around private listing networks.

02:11But anybody who's been in it for a long time knows that pocket listings, that's what we called it back then, pocket listings have been around since the beginning of time.

02:21And in the real estate brokerage industry, the whole notion of that is very interesting.

02:30It's taken on a new dynamic.

02:32And I think fear is driving a lot of the action and interaction.

02:36To elaborate just a little bit on that, if you think about companies and leadership is all about creating differentiation for their company.

02:47And through that differentiation, they can gain strategic competitive advantage.

02:53But strategic competitive advantage is a very elusive pursuit.

03:01It's important, and you need it.

03:04But when it violates a fundamental principle of basic guns and butter economics, I'm giving you an example.

03:12Supply and demand says, in order to achieve the seller's mission on real estate sales, you should create as much demand as possible.

03:23To create as much demand as possible, typically, you do that through widest possible area of coverage or widest possible exposure.

03:31So there's the fundamental, create more exposure, create, therefore, more demand, sell the property at its optimal price in a short period of time,

03:42and eliminate as many contingencies and problems for the seller.

03:47All right.

03:47So if I'm going to try to find a competitive advantage in today's market, I know that inventory shortages, and there are still massive inventory shortages,

03:58particularly in price points that are accessible to the typical or average buyer.

04:04So if you have the ability to hoard listings and pull them into a private listing network and take them into your company,

04:16then ostensibly you'd be able to have more people follow your website, make sure you get more buyer traffic,

04:25and therefore have a benefit to buyers who shop for you and agents who work with you.

04:31Now, that's a great idea, and it's been tried many times before.

04:38And, you know, anybody who really fears that just hasn't done the math.

04:45I mean, post-acquisition of anywhere, as an example, Compass will probably have somewhere between 12% and 15% of active listing inventory.

04:54You can't dominate or act like a monopoly in an oligopoly market pattern with 15% of the market.

05:02That's just not.

05:03By definition, that doesn't work.

05:06So, but to create a strategic competitive advantage and, in the process, violate a fundamental economic principle of supply and demand,

05:16then, you know, that is short-lived.

05:18I think the whole concept of private listing networks today is a massive red herring and stuff that people are talking about,

05:25but not something that's going to get transient.

05:28That's a good example of what's going on and kind of how I'm perceiving it.

05:31What about, you know, we recently interviewed a broker in Florida who sued a buyer on breach of contract for buyer-broker agreement

05:40or buyer representation agreement, and he won, you know, do you see, I mean, there are obvious cons to that as far as reputational

05:51and, you know, working with other buyers, but do you see that as being something that might go further,

05:59or is that maybe just a one-off, or, you know, what are you seeing with buyer representation?

06:05Well, if you think about what's happened is the industry has been taught through court losses and settlements

06:12that we need to be clear about our expectations and how we get paid on the buyer's side of the equation.

06:21And in order to do that, you sign a contract.

06:24Well, contract law takes over, and if you violate that contract, then you're susceptible to whatever comes through a court process.

06:33I don't think it'll be widespread for the reason you just brought up.

06:37You know, Tracy, you can't build a great reputation in a region, in a marketplace, by suing buyers.

06:44But under some circumstances, I can see how it would be warranted.

06:47So, Rick, I want to talk a little bit more about private listing networks because you had some interesting things to say.

06:53Is there anything else you want to share about them and what's going on in the industry right now with the lawsuits

07:00and everything that's going on with private listing networks?

07:03Yeah, I mean, Tracy, we can talk for a long, long time about that, but there's a couple of key points,

07:09and one of them is that, you know, private listing networks and being creative about having competitive advantage.

07:17The first thing I would like to say is that organizations absolutely need to start talking about, you know,

07:24straight talk about why they're doing it.

07:27Instead of putting out the notion of private listing networks being, you know, consumer-centric,

07:35and they all have their advantages in some cases.

07:38But what we really need to focus on is that there's something going on within our industry that's much more potentially damaging to it than private listings.

07:50I mean, and that has to do with my belief is that no trade organization or no individual competitor in that space should have the right to dictate to small businesses

08:03how they can go after competitive advantage because it's a stifling of competition.

08:10So private listing networks, they'll work or they won't, and if they work, great.

08:15Somebody wins more market share, and if they don't, then they don't do well for the consumer,

08:20and therefore they don't do well for the company that's trying to promote them, and they'll stop them.

08:25Just let the market answer that question.

08:27But in no event, no event should an individual competitor or a trade organization try to intervene or collaborate to intervene

08:39to tell a company how to do their business.

08:42I mean, it's just, I know that sounds dramatic, but it's anti-capitalistic.

08:48It's anti-American.

08:50And let's have some straight talk about why we're doing all that stuff.

08:55Everybody's position in that debate is couched in what I call the non-straight talk.

09:05It's how it benefits the buyers, how it benefits the sellers, how it doesn't benefit them,

09:09when really what they want to do is eliminate it or promote it to gain competitive advantage,

09:13which is one of the greatest things about this industry.

09:17It's an incredibly fragmented business that is, and we can talk about consolidation too,

09:24but it's an incredibly fragmented business that through the natural competitive cycle finds its way.

09:35I mean, shared listings.

09:36When I got into the real estate business, there was no MLS.

09:40And then it became, oh, yeah, let's share because if we share, we can be more effective for buyers and sellers.

09:45And we'll sell properties faster and for more money and with fewer problems.

09:50So that evolution that got us to shared inventory was a natural byproduct of the industry growing up, evolving and maturing.

10:00So if, in fact, the time has come to change that, then the market will speak and it'll thrive.

10:08And my personal belief is that, you know, you violate a fundamental rule of supply and demand and you're not going to be successful in that effort.

10:17And it's a byproduct of the current times, short inventory.

10:21Believe me, if we're back in some of the other market cycles where there was too much inventory on the market and it was purely a buyer's market and sellers were having their prices driven down,

10:32there'd be no talk about hoarding or harboring listings, keeping them close to the vest.

10:38It's a market anomaly.

10:40Yeah, yeah, it is interesting because, you know, even with the Compass Zillow lawsuit, you know, Zillow is an individual company who can make that decision, I guess.

10:54And Compass, you know, it's a hard, it's really a difficult one.

11:00You know, I think that people are short sighted when it comes to hating on companies.

11:05They just automatically will have, they find the, you know, the demon in it.

11:12When a lot of these companies are just trying to do what's best for their bottom line, which is capitalism.

11:17It's not necessarily what's best for the buyer or seller, though.

11:21Well, but won't the market prove that out?

11:23If I do anything, if I make a policy inside of our company and it doesn't bode well, it doesn't champion the buyer's efforts and the seller's efforts,

11:32then that marketplace is going to hand me my hat and tell me, thanks for stopping by.

11:38You're done.

11:39And our agents would lose business.

11:41Our business units would decline.

11:44So we have to be very careful to do that.

11:46But the market will speak.

11:47Make no mistake about it.

11:49The market will speak.

11:50And like I said, a lot of programming in our industry tends to be very time sensitive.

11:56And like you said, the short game, but again, it violates every one, every sensibility I have to have a third party entity tell us what decision,

12:07which decisions we can make in order to try to have our, have us have a thriving business.

12:14I think it's actually, I think it's brilliant to try.

12:16I think it's brilliant to see if they can, anybody who's trying to do it can morph that.

12:24But think about this.

12:25Let's, let's call it what it is.

12:27Compass is being the, is leading the charge that is right at the heart of that discussion.

12:33And if right now, I think Compass has about 5.6 or 6% of the overall listing market in the country.

12:40Post anywhere, they might be up to 12 to 15%.

12:42And that's with no breakage on the acquisition.

12:46Okay.

12:47So if they end up at 12 to 15%, you're just not going to, they're not going to, they're not going to shift the market.

12:53Right.

12:54Do the math.

12:54Stop worrying about it.

12:56That's good.

12:56That's, that's, that's the new source, noise and signal.

13:00Yeah.

13:01I mean, it just goes to show how segmented the, the market is.

13:04If some, a gigantic company like anywhere can, you know, merge with a gigantic company like Compass and still only have 12 to 15%.

13:14And of course they have higher market share in certain markets, but I think that those will be handled individually as if this merger or acquisition actually comes to fruition too.

13:24So yeah, and then those marketplaces will be competitive with each other and they'll find different competitive advantage to pull customers back into their, their world.

13:34So let the business, let the business, um, engine find its way.

13:40My, my thought on it.

13:42So I want to talk a little bit about United.

13:43Um, so you have talked about your agent centric, um, what does that actually mean in, in, um, in practice and where do most brokerages get that wrong?

13:55Yeah.

13:56Well, that I, that's an interesting way you asked the question because I, I actually think you answered it in the question.

14:01It's in practice that it goes wrong.

14:04Um, we, being crystal clear, like I, I've been around and in companies and led companies that if I walked into a principal broker's office,

14:13and I stood in front of the plaque on the wall that said, here's our mission.

14:17And I asked that broker, what's our mission.

14:21And you can just kind of see them like looking around, trying to get past it.

14:25The mission isn't operationalized.

14:27It's not even ingested properly.

14:30So the first thing is you must be mission centric and have a mission that includes that agent centricity.

14:37In our company is very clear.

14:39There isn't one broker you can call them all.

14:41They would not miss the point.

14:43That our mission is to, um, improve the financial trajectory of our brokers and agents, careers, and lives.

14:49That's, that's not something we say, but it, it, you know, that's, that's a focal point.

14:54That's our mission.

14:55How do we do that then comes when we operationalize it in everyday decisioning.

15:00So, uh, improving the financial trajectory doesn't just include top line revenue.

15:06How much money can you make here?

15:07It includes what do you do with that?

15:09So we have pillars that, uh, that financial wellness is built on.

15:13The first one is flowing as much gross commission income into our agents, bank accounts as possible.

15:18The second one is financial literacy.

15:20What do you do with that money?

15:21How do you pay down debt and increase savings?

15:25And what are the vehicles to be able to do that?

15:27And here's a good example.

15:29So we don't just say that, pay attention, be financially literate.

15:33We bought Dave Ramsey's smart dollar, a very expensive proposition, but every one of our agents,

15:39either, um, every one of the agents inside of our company and brokers and their family members

15:44have a seat on Dave Ramsey's smart dollar platform.

15:48We don't get to see what goes into that program, but we know the adoption rates that we see.

15:53We know that today we're at about $6 million of financial turnaround in the last 24 months.

15:59What that means is our agents have not only made a high percentage of the gross commission

16:05income because we're a transaction fee model company.

16:08We, we succeed in that somewhere around 96%, 96 and a half percent of gross commission goes

16:14into our agents accounts.

16:15That's their money.

16:17Um, now they have a platform.

16:19What do I do with it?

16:21So, um, $6 million turnaround on a couple thousand agents in a very short period of time means

16:28they paid down their debt and increased their savings to amass a net worth enhancement of

16:336 million.

16:33That's an, that's a, an example of operationalizing the mission.

16:39Okay.

16:40That's amazing.

16:41Yeah.

16:41That's awesome.

16:42And then in addition to that, we, you know, financial hardship and bankruptcies in America.

16:47The number one reason is underinsured or non-insured healthcare crisis.

16:51So we have a healthcare program.

16:53That's incredible for our agents, independent contractors.

16:57Um, those aren't, these aren't easy financial decisions to make, but if you're serious about

17:01your mission, you go make that happen.

17:03And then we have, uh, private banking services that are only available to, to people who have

17:11$2 million AUM and, um, assets under management.

17:16And before they get to that stage, do they have those services?

17:20Well, at our company, they do.

17:21So, and it's before they get to 2 million level, which is the majority of the population.

17:28So we know that our agent base is going to have, they're going to be well cared for from

17:32the top line to how they manage themselves financially.

17:37Then as they have some success and have a $75,000 in assets under management, they can avail

17:44themselves of some private banking and then on the operating expense side for each of

17:49their businesses, we make sure that we're delivering whatever tools and services that

17:55we can deliver, um, at zero cost to them or at the, um, we use, we use a philosophy called

18:01a partial cost recovery.

18:03When we have to pass a cost on to our agents, it's only, it's absolutely a portion of the

18:10cost that they would pay.

18:12So they have, they have purchasing power that's well lower than they would in another real estate

18:17brokerage.

18:18Yeah, absolutely.

18:19There are also, um, you know, you've done a lot of M&A and I think you've, you've kind

18:25of moved away some based on the market recently and moved into some of your other growth pillars.

18:32Um, talk to me a little bit about that and what United's strategy is for growth, um, moving

18:39forward.

18:40Yeah.

18:41Um, okay.

18:41So if you think about what's happened in the last 10 years in real estate, we went from

18:45a million to 1.6 and change.

18:48Now the market's readjusting, you know, this happens again, the experience, uh, it happens

18:54in every protracted growth cycle, uh, lots of agents get in the business.

18:59So what happens is those companies that, um, spin out of existing companies and they get

19:05to 50 agents and a hundred agents and 200 and 400, um, when the market contracts, like

19:12it has over the last nearly four years.

19:14Now we're in our fourth year of contraction, uh, when that happens, those companies have

19:19to figure out, oops, how do I get the critical mass of business and revenue flowing?

19:24And if they can't, then there's a great opportunity for them to join our company, drop their operating

19:29expenses nearly, nearly completely out.

19:33And in some cases completely out.

19:36And if they have their agent base, um, utilize the tools, recent tool services and supports

19:42that we have for them and still, and we've created, and that's one of the things about

19:47Dan and I is we've created a lot of mergers and acquisitions without a cookie cutter.

19:52Every one of them is different and every one of them is extremely manageable, but it starts

19:56with getting that, that, you know, that clay, fresh clay on the table and everybody putting

20:02their hands on the clay, not trying to squeeze a individual sellers wants and needs into,

20:08um, into that, you know, that, like I said, that cookie cutter environment.

20:13So our, our, um, our growth, uh, vectors are of course, organic recruiting every day, blocking

20:21tackling in a couple thousand, actually 5,100 of our agents came to us that way last year.

20:27So 5,100 organic, and then we have some, some brokers who are, you know, they want to roll

20:34in and walk over their 50 agents or 60 agents or 49 agents.

20:38These are real walk-ins and rollovers, 87 agents, um, 26 agents, 51 agents, 32 agents.

20:49These, these don't, they don't sound like, you know, great numbers, big numbers, but in the

20:54aggregate, we're growing organically in a marketplace that's going from 1.6 down to probably a million

21:00by the time we're done.

21:02NAR says there's, I think they budgeted on 1.2 million for the coming year.

21:07Um, it's interesting to see that happening because if they're budgeting at 1.2, yet they

21:11publish 50% of the real estate agents in the country, didn't do a sale last year.

21:16Then, you know, those are, those are agents at attrition risk.

21:20So net of attrition, we're a positive grower without mergers and acquisitions.

21:26Uh, you kind of alluded to the fact that we're not, we're not pressing pedal to the metal

21:30on acquisitions.

21:31The entire asset class is repricing.

21:36That's what happens in contracting markets.

21:38So that repricing gives us the opportunity to kind of, um, show, show off how we know how

21:45to make transactions work, preventing downside risk for us.

21:50And at the same time, giving upside opportunity for the person who's the seller for the owner.

21:57And because we think about it that way, um, because we think about it that way, we've had

22:04a lot of success.

22:05And so I wouldn't say that we've taken our foot off the accelerator.

22:11I think we, I think we slowed the closure rate as a normal occurrence in the marketplace.

22:17Somebody investigates the value of their company with us.

22:20We make sure that they understand what it looks like now in traditional valuation methodology,

22:26and then what it could look like over time with some of the transaction, uh, skill sets that

22:32we have.

22:33So, yeah.

22:34And so what are some of the kind of non-negotiable habits or operating principles that have fueled

22:40your growth?

22:42Um, non-negotiable is looking for the right people.

22:48You know, I say this pretty frequently as you might, we might've even talked about it before,

22:53but when you talk about mergers and acquisitions, the P and L is important and the P and L, uh,

23:01benefit is important.

23:02The balance sheet's important, but the real strength that we get through acquisition is

23:08in the, the intellectual capital, the commitment, the passion of the people who built these companies

23:14in the first place.

23:15I know what it sounds like.

23:18I know it sounds naive.

23:19It sounds soft.

23:20It sounds like something you say much more valuable to our company than the company that

23:25we're acquiring is the people who got it there in the first place.

23:30Those people are, they're the real goal.

23:35You know, Peter Drucker, I was part of the Drucker foundation for a long while and Peter

23:39Drucker had a saying, which was, there's no such great a waste of times to do things with

23:43great alacrity that should never be done at all.

23:46And I think a lot of acquisitions get done conceptually on a spreadsheet first and they talk about shared

23:55ownership or acquired ownership, but they don't talk, talk about acquired, um, leadership and

24:03managership.

24:03And that's a, that's a huge mistake.

24:05The money is the easy part.

24:07It really is.

24:08We can do structured transactions that help somebody win on the upside when the market comes

24:13back.

24:13So they don't sell at the bottom, we can do partial acquisitions.

24:16All of that stuff is easy.

24:19What's really important is can we find a landing spot that meets what that current owner wants

24:26to do with the next five, 10 years of their life, or in some cases the next one year of

24:32their life?

24:34Yeah.

24:34Yeah, absolutely.

24:35I mean, the, the number of large, like the compass anywhere, I mean, there aren't many more

24:42companies to, to buy at this point.

24:45Um, so you're, you know, it makes sense that you're looking for those opportunities, um,

24:50from smaller brokerages, you know, that, that are meaningful and have leaders that are, that

24:57are also great leaders.

24:58Um, so, well, the other thing though, is if you think about in the last two years, we've,

25:04we've had a 1500 agent company join our network.

25:08That's one of the largest franchise affiliations in the last 25 years.

25:12Then we had a 900, uh, agent affiliation.

25:16They didn't, we didn't buy their company.

25:17They just wanted to avail themselves of the OPEX, um, savings and the vision and the partnership

25:25and the collective capital.

25:28Like a lot of the brokers, Tracy are getting very, you know, this is a time where you can

25:32be, become very weary of trying to figure out what do I pay attention to?

25:37How do I get enough buying power to, to bring those assets into my current company?

25:41And, and they just, it's a, it's a tiring thing to push that rock up the hill all by yourself

25:48all the time.

25:50And what's thematic in the 12 or 14 that we've done in the last six years, well, five and

25:58a half or six years, what's thematic is an owner who says, I'm thinking probably six months

26:04to a year and I'm, I'm done, I'll go do something else that happens a lot.

26:11And then, you know, a year later, they're like, I'm having fun again.

26:15I'm not, I'm not trying to lift the load myself and they're having fun.

26:20So they stay.

26:21Yeah.

26:22Yeah.

26:23Um, so I, I do have a question on, there've been, there's been a lot of chatter about the

26:29NAR settlement possibly being overturned.

26:32I know it's a prediction of Rob Hahn, but I've heard it from multiple people now in the industry.

26:38What are your thoughts on that?

26:41Well, a couple of things.

26:43The, the overturn is a very complex unwind.

26:48Yeah.

26:49And the pure overturn.

26:51So with all due respect to people who are predicting that that'll happen, I don't, I'm not in that camp,

26:56but I think there'll be accommodations made to lessen the impact of what they did.

27:05Um, and, you know, I know this isn't part of your question, but 88 companies left out in the cold on a trade organization that had,

27:14you know, there's so much deep seated bitterness about that, that occurrence, that, that is going to be impacting NAR one way or another.

27:26And it's like, you know, you can pay me now, you can pay me later, but pay me later for NAR is so much more costly.

27:34So if, if they want to, if they want, but the restructuring of NAR, the divestiture of assets, they shouldn't have as a nonprofit.

27:43I've run nonprofits multiple times in my life.

27:45And, you know, the asset accumulation that they've, they, and the self dealing and the, you know, the millions of dollars in salaries and all the things that,

27:57that you've heard tell about those things have to be restructured and they will, that that's a different topic than the, the, you know, the reversing of this account.

28:05But I don't, I don't really think it'll be overturned as such.

28:09I think it'll be, I think the impact will be muted by other types of changes.

28:18But it clearly, I mean, it's very interesting.

28:22The whole idea of a class action, class actions were not devised to, to be, to function like they just did.

28:31I'm not sure what, what series of events happened.

28:35I mean, I have some good ideas, but I'm, I don't want to speculate here.

28:39About what has to happen in order for that two week trial and damages phase to actually have happened.

28:47It's, it's quite, it's quite an event.

28:50So I think that, I think the effects will be muted by actions taken going forward, but I don't think it'll be completely overturned.

28:57I hate to have to round up all those sellers and ask them for their $16 back.

29:03Exactly.

29:04I'm, you know, I'm in a room with $8,000 worth of lawyers per hour.

29:11And, and I, I remember saying something naive, like, how much are, how much are buyers going to, sellers going to actually get back?

29:21Do the math on this thing.

29:23It doesn't work out.

29:24And they said, don't, make no mistake about it.

29:27Class actions benefit the lawyers.

29:28They don't benefit the, absolutely.

29:31They don't, they don't benefit consumers.

29:33You know, if there's a business process change on the other side, if there's a business process change that added more clarity, I'm all for it.

29:40More transparency.

29:40I'm all for it.

29:42Yeah.

29:43So looking ahead, what do you believe will separate brokers that merely survive the next five years with those who actually grow and thrive?

29:52Number one is having the right mission.

29:54I mean, number one, like we just finished our annual operating plan process for 2026.

30:00We're paying attention to four categories, making sure that we have the financial fortitude by reducing operational expenses and investing in those things like AI that are very transformational to the industry.

30:12Eventually, talent attraction at all levels, from employees to business unit leaders to branch operations.

30:23And then especially, and probably most importantly, attracting the right agents that are passionate, integrity driven.

30:31So, so we have financial fortitude, making sure that we're there.

30:34Talent attraction systems have to be in place, making sure that we do everything we do, maintaining our, our cultural North star, you know, remaining who we are in the business process.

30:47For instance, if somebody comes to me and says, Hey, you know, we've got this great idea.

30:53It's going to be very lucrative for our agents or consumers, and it ruins our effort at getting to mission, which is to improve the financial trajectory for brokers and agents, careers and lives.

31:03We're not going to do it.

31:04So making sure that we, we still, that we still operate in a way that's consistent with our culture and then operational excellence, having the disciplines in place to have the systems, to run the systems and make sure we're executing so that we're not, I'll give you an example.

31:24If we took the average American consumer now, when we ran that rocket mortgage or that rocket program that says, show me all of my subscriptions, there are millions and probably hundreds of millions of subscriptions that people signed up for.

31:40Don't even know they did.

31:41That's not a disciplined approach to running your personal finances.

31:45And in a real estate business, it's real.

31:47It's very easy to layer cost on cost on cost and never subtract from that.

31:53So we call it de-layering the onion.

31:55You've got to take cost out when it's not effective.

31:59And you have to be disciplined to know, does that add, does the add of that tool or service support the mission?

32:09If it doesn't or it damages our ability to do that, we don't do it.

32:13Yeah.

32:14Well, Rick, thanks so much for joining Real Trending.

32:17It's always a pleasure to speak with you.

32:19And I know Dan is going to be at the Housing Economic Summit.