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The big talking points of this episode of To the Point is the West Asia war ceasefire and the showdown between the Election Commission and Trinamool Congress.
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00:16Good evening, you're watching India Today, I'm Preeti Chaudhary.
00:19There has been a ceasefire, but what does it really mean to what we've seen escalate in
00:25West Asia? We have our war council to decode it for you, but first up, allow me to take
00:30you through the headlines.
00:33Alright, we're going to get to the headlines in just a bit, but as the deadline closed
00:36in and the world braced for Donald Trump's next move, what came instead was a rare and
00:42widely welcomed U-turn. Instead of escalating strikes on Iran, Trump announced a two-week
00:47ceasefire, halting all offensive action. Israel has agreed to pause attacks, while Iran is
00:53set to join talks in Islamabad on April 10, with negotiations expected to build on a
00:5910-point proposal. So what will we do next? The ceasefire is in effect, but fragile. Its
01:04success hinges on Iran's compliance, especially on the Straits of Hormuz. Is the Strait of
01:11Hormuz reopening? The truce holds, if not hostilities, could resume. For now, diplomacy is back, but
01:18this remains a tense pause. Clearly, not peace.
01:38As the clock ticked down and the world held its breath, fearing massive escalation,
01:47what came instead was a dramatic U-turn. From the brink of a wider war, Washington hit pause.
01:57US President Donald Trump announcing a two-week ceasefire with Iran, halting strikes, opening
02:04a narrow window for diplomacy. Calling it a great day for world peace, Trump pitched the pause as
02:12the beginning of a possible reset, even a golden age for the Middle East. But beneath the optimism,
02:21the messaging war is very much alive. Trump claims total and complete victory, insisting a 15-point
02:31deal is nearly sealed, with Iran's nuclear program on the table and the most sticking points resolved.
02:42What the president did is he basically issued an ultimatum to the Iranians. He said, open up the
02:45Straits, stop trying to hold the world's economy hostage, and we'll engage in a ceasefire. And that's
02:52exactly the agreement that we came to last night. The Iranians have agreed to open up the Straits. The
02:57United States has agreed to stop attacking. And that, not just the United States, but also our allies, have agreed
03:02to
03:02stop attacking. And that is the basis of this fragile truce that we have, which is now, you know, 8
03:08to 12 hours old.
03:10The ceasefire, he says, is double-sided, but hinges on one critical condition. Tehran must reopen the
03:20Strait of Hormuz. Tehran, however, is telling a very different story.
03:29Iran claims it was Washington that blinked first, adding that U.S. had been pleading to halt the war,
03:35a call it resisted until its objectives were met.
03:46On the streets of Tehran, scenes of celebration erupted, flags waving, crowds cheering, a moment of relief
03:54after weeks of conflict. But the leadership's message is clear. This is not peace.
04:07Iran says the ceasefire is temporary, conditional, and most importantly, reversible. Its hands,
04:16it warns, remains on the trigger. Even as talks loom in Islamabad and proposals are exchanged,
04:23the reality is stark.
04:27John Cambrill, Associated Press correspondent, offers a detailed analysis on why the ceasefire
04:33is a welcome development, one that raises several critical questions at this stage.
04:42Iran insists that its military is still going to control access through the Strait, and we've heard
04:47from one diplomat that says Iran and Oman, whose territorial waters formed the Strait,
04:51would still be collecting fees from passing ships. This is a big departure from where it had been
04:56before. The world largely considers the Strait an international waterway that should be free for all.
05:03Meanwhile, we're seeing discrepancies from Iran in its language about the 10 points it's put forward
05:08on ending the war. In its Farsi language version, it included that it wanted to continue to enrich uranium.
05:15That's something that U.S. President Donald Trump has said is a non-starter. Trump fears that Iran's nuclear
05:20program could allow Tehran to potentially develop a nuclear weapon should it choose to do so.
05:26This is not the end of the war. This could just be a pause between rounds.
05:34Because in West Asia right now, the guns may be silent, but the standoff is far from over.
05:42Bureau Report, India Today.
05:48All right, to decode the ceasefire, I have with me India Today's esteemed war council.
05:55They've been pretty much bang on on every development. We have them in the studio with us.
05:59My colleague Gaurav Sawant, Geeta Mohan, Sandeep Unithan, Ankit Kumar, and from Washington, Rohit Sharma.
06:05Rohit, to begin with you, you've always said that, you know, there is going to be no harsh action.
06:11In all probability, we are looking at a deal. And we are looking at a deal.
06:21Rohit, unmute yourself, please.
06:25I'm sorry. I was saying today is a day of taking credit.
06:27And I think we should all take credit for keeping our viewers honest.
06:30You know, there was a lot of speculation going on, I think, but we had to trust our sources.
06:35They were telling us there could be a deal before the end of the day, and that's exactly what's happened.
06:39So after taking all the credit we can, I think, you know, there is some sense of relief.
06:45I think a lot of people, especially in the administration, are looking forward.
06:49And when I say they're looking forward, they're looking at what could possibly happen in Islamabad.
06:53We still have no confirmation, Preeti, if Vice President J.D. Vance is traveling.
06:58I think that was something that CNN footed out yesterday.
07:01We still have no confirmation if he's going to be there.
07:03We've also heard that there could be a virtual conference with the Iranians to see how serious they are in
07:09pursuing this.
07:10But President Trump is very happy.
07:12He thinks that, you know, Iran and U.S. can make money out of the state of Hormuz, and those
07:16details would be negotiated.
07:18But as far as, you know, the war is concerned, people believe that this is the end of it, in
07:23the sense,
07:24even Secretary Pete Hexett said that, you know, Operation Fury was, and he was addressing it in a past sense.
07:32So I think, you know, people believe that I think we will be possibly reaching towards a truce in two
07:38weeks' time, Preeti.
07:39All right, so we're possibly reaching towards a truce, what right now is a temporary ceasefire.
07:44Geeta Mohan, you want to comment so many swirling questions in it.
07:48Last night, all of us slept, you know, with, you know, great anxiety on what will happen in the morning,
07:57especially what President Trump had said of possibly ending a civilization.
08:01Most of us in India woke up to the very happy news of a ceasefire.
08:05But Geeta, how temporary do you see this ceasefire? How fragile is it, the role of Pakistan?
08:11Has Iran walked out of it with a win? How do you view the developments?
08:16Well, I look at it from a very positive prism in terms of the fact that at least there's a
08:21ceasefire.
08:22They've called it a double-sided ceasefire, which means it would have been a ceasefire if it was just U
08:28.S. and Iran.
08:28The fact that they're calling it a double-sided ceasefire is because now Israel has also stopped.
08:34In all the past occasions, Preeti, when there was a ceasefire, Israel continued the attacks.
08:40Israel didn't stop. But this time around, this is indeed a complete ceasefire.
08:44And last night when we were discussing it at the War Council, we were talking about the fact that, yes,
08:51the language, breaking down the language, very harsh, very unpresidential-like.
08:57But one where he was maybe arm-twisting them to come to the negotiating table.
09:02The win over here, nobody can declare a complete win, but the win over here for Iran is the fact
09:07that they have accepted the same 10-point proposal,
09:10which some time ago, Preeti, was called maximalist. Today, it's called workable by President Trump himself.
09:16So let's wait and see what happens in Islamabad when the two sides meet with Pakistan mediating.
09:25But the fact is that it is fragile. One bomb, one little fire somewhere, and you will have the whole
09:33cycle return and repeat.
09:35Gaurav, how much of this temporary truce hinges on the Straits of Hormuz?
09:42So, there are two aspects to it. One, Israel continues to pound Lebanon. In fact, it's actually intensified its operations
09:49against Hezbollah.
09:49And just in the past one hour, we've seen intense airstrikes and ground strikes that are taking place to, in
09:58a way, decimate what remains of the Hezbollah.
10:01While efforts have been made in the past, it's being done once again.
10:04I just interviewed Israel's ambassador to India, Ruven Hazar.
10:07And he said, the ball, or what's to that effect, the ball is now in Iran's court.
10:12In case Iran, which has, according to him, militarily been degraded, that it no longer poses a military threat.
10:20It can still fire a few rockets and a few missiles here and there.
10:24But as a potent military threat that existed on the 28th of February, now on the 8th and 9th of
10:30April,
10:32Iran no longer is that potent a military threat to Israel, but should it attempt once again?
10:38Now, their appreciation is their missile manufacturing capabilities have been taken down,
10:42petrochemical facilities, all the equipment that's used to bring together, equipment to make a missile,
10:48all that equipment is also no longer there.
10:50And they're keeping a hawk eye on every shipment that comes into Iran to ensure that they cannot make missiles
10:57anymore.
10:57So, they see it as a win for them.
10:59Again, the Islamabad leg, and I asked him a question, what about Islamabad being that so-called honest broker?
11:07They say America has had bad friends in the past, America is relying on one such person.
11:12Once again, we'll have to wait and see what comes out.
11:14All right, you know, Gaurav, we'll talk a little bit more about Pakistan's role as a mediator in it.
11:18But the question that I wanted to ask Ankit Kumar, stem from what Gaurav also had to add to it,
11:24that we're still seeing strikes.
11:26It's not that, you know, there has been an abject ceasefire.
11:29Ankit, who heads our OSINT team, has been tracking movements across the West Asia.
11:35Ankit, have things calmed down?
11:37What does it look like to you right now?
11:40So, I don't know what is happening behind the closed doors, but what is out there in open?
11:44Ankit, have been 50 IDF jets, 160 bombs being dropped on a country, which according to the prime broker, Pakistan,
11:55was part of the deal.
11:56Lebanon, Israel says Lebanon was not part of the deal.
12:00So, that is documented, but that is not all.
12:03What Iran has done, the only two alternate pipelines that exist, one in Saudi and other in UAE, both have
12:13been targeted by Iran hours after the ceasefire announcement.
12:17One in Saudi, one in UAE.
12:19So, what Iran is trying to do, Iran is forcing its way that you have to rely on state of
12:25Hormuz.
12:26I do not see this as an indication of peace.
12:30Now, let's see what is happening.
12:32One party is saying that it has agreed to 10 points agenda.
12:36Donald Trump, in his two social posts, has mentioned that there is a 15-point agenda.
12:41The only thing, the only thing I think that is common between Tehran and Washington today, that both sides are
12:49not telling the full truth.
12:51Both sides are kind of exaggerating.
12:53Look at the Pentagon press conference.
12:55It is being said that 90% of Iran's defense industrial complex has been destroyed.
13:02How do you get to that number?
13:03Three weeks back, you did not know whether the complex was a girl's school or a military complex.
13:11Today, you are giving a number.
13:1290% of Iran's defense industrial complex has been destroyed.
13:16There is a lot of exaggeration.
13:19I don't see many common grounds.
13:21We will know, hopefully, in coming days.
13:24But today, as of now, there are a lot of differences that we can pick up based on what is
13:30happening out in the open.
13:32Well, you know, Sandeep, what he is also reflecting on is the possibility of the impermanence of this ceasefire.
13:38Because while we are talking about a ceasefire, while America is already, you know, like Rohit pointed out, speaking of
13:45the Operation Fury in the past tense,
13:49things on ground, like Ankit pointed out, you still have jets up, you still have boots on ground.
13:54It doesn't look, there is a shadow war which continues.
13:57Israel has already told Gaurav that Lebanon is not part of the ceasefire deal.
14:01Exactly, Preeti.
14:02And, you know, it's not a shadow war because even as we speak, troops are being moved into theatre.
14:07The Marine Expeditionary Unit, the second one, is still steaming towards, you know, West Asia.
14:13It hasn't turned around.
14:13So, what are we looking at?
14:14We are looking at a possible pause.
14:16It is a pause, of course, for about two weeks.
14:19Two weeks later, the U.S. is in a much better position to carry out a new wave of strikes.
14:23I mean, that's one way of looking at it.
14:25I don't discount anything when you're looking at this administration because, look, he's not achieved his major, you know, his
14:32objectives,
14:33which he's set out to, either about, you know, seizing the HEU, degrading Iran's nuclear capabilities, changing the regime,
14:41the ballistic missile, you know, production, the axis of resistance.
14:46And the most important thing, Preeti, to my mind, is that statement from Iran,
14:50where they've inserted themselves into the Strait of Hormuz, which was never contested.
14:55Before the 28th of February, it was open.
14:58Iran has now willy-nilly inserted itself into the Strait of Hormuz,
15:02and it's talking about putting a toll booth over there, a toll barrier,
15:06and they could possibly make more money out of the Strait of Hormuz by charging passage to merchant ships that
15:11are crossing
15:11than from their petroleum exports.
15:13I mean, that's how significant this moment is.
15:16So, this is what, they've been handed over the Strait of Hormuz on a platter.
15:20That's up for negotiation.
15:21It wasn't before the 28th of February.
15:24The former Deputy National Security Advisor I interviewed, Preeti,
15:28said that this is a military victory, but a strategic failure.
15:32And I seem to agree with what he was saying,
15:35is because, yes, they have met with some of the military objectives,
15:39like Gaurav spelt out, the Navy, the Air Force, you know,
15:43they have been talking about and breaking it down.
15:45But strategically, going back to negotiations, a ceasefire, is not good news for Israel,
15:51because their objectives have not been met.
15:53But neither has America's objectives have been met.
15:55I want to bring in, you know, Rohit, let's bring you back into this conversation,
15:58because you had Pete Hexet say, like you pointed out, spoke of the operation in the past tense,
16:06and that there has been a total regime change.
16:08But that really hasn't quite happened on ground, and America knows it.
16:10They might be looking at a way out of this war temporarily at that.
16:14But do you reckon or agree with what Sandeep and Geeta and Gaurav seem to believe,
16:18that possibly what we are looking at is a two-week pause,
16:21not a truce, but, yes, a temporary ceasefire?
16:26I think I do agree with that.
16:28But I think the, you know, the sentiment is to move forward.
16:32I think that is the directive, you know, to essentially figure out a way to end this now,
16:36right, and slowly, gradually, you know, move the troops out of the area.
16:40I think that is the sentiment, that is the directive.
16:42But again, even, you know, VP J.D. Vance just called it, you know, did not even,
16:47you know, I shouldn't say did not back it,
16:49but he was also skeptical about this truce, as he called it.
16:53So I think we'll have to wait and watch.
16:55Preeti, as I've said, you know, I think there's baby steps, one step at a time.
16:58We first have to see if somebody from the U.S. is in person traveling to Islamabad,
17:02right, and what happens after that.
17:03So we'll have to wait and watch.
17:05But yes, you know, not just baby steps, I would think, Rohit,
17:08because when we, last night, when you and I spoke,
17:11we were talking of bombing a civilization, and now we are speaking of ceasefire.
17:14So I think that's a huge step, not just a baby step there.
17:17But stay with me, Rohit, because let's speak of Pakistan's role
17:21and what it really also means for India, Geeta.
17:23A, we really don't know what is the modalities of this negotiation,
17:27how is it going to happen, who all are taking part, participating,
17:31what's on the table, what's off the table.
17:33How are you looking at this possible modalities of this truce
17:38that is being looked at right now and in Pakistan?
17:41For one, Preeti, there can be no forward movement
17:44unless and until we're looking at a leadership level exchange over here.
17:48So it just cannot be special representatives.
17:50And like Rohit says, we don't know whether J.D. Vance is coming.
17:53We have no idea how America is going to be represented.
17:55It has to be leadership level.
17:57When we were speaking with Iranians and when we were traveling over there,
18:01they made it very clear that Steve Witkoff was somebody
18:04who was coming out of the Russia-Ukraine meeting
18:07and entering the Iran meeting,
18:09very briefly spoke to them and went back to the Russia-Ukraine meeting.
18:12That's how not focused Steve Witkoff was.
18:16And so they're not interested in really engaging Steve Witkoff.
18:19But who's really going to be present over there is important news from Tehran.
18:24Some reports suggest that it could be the president himself.
18:27He shares a very good relationship with the current civilian dispensation in Pakistan,
18:33Masood Pazeshkian and the Sharif family.
18:36Again, Asim Oneer as well.
18:39So it could be him.
18:41But in all fairness, if you look at all the negotiations that have taken place,
18:45it should be Arakji, the foreign minister.
18:47We'll have to wait and see.
18:48But unless and until it's leadership level,
18:50there is going to be no forward movement.
18:52There has to be a stamp where they say,
18:54okay, we have agreed on this,
18:55rather than saying,
18:57we're going back to headquarters and getting our approval.
18:59No, but for it to reach leadership level,
19:02there has to be some common ground,
19:03which is found by the interlocutors,
19:05whether it's Jared Kushner, Steve Witkoff,
19:08or J.D. Vance and Arakji.
19:10J.D. Vance is leadership level.
19:12It's vice president.
19:12No, sir, vice president.
19:13But technically, leadership would be Pazeshkian and Trump himself.
19:17Yeah, it's not going to be Trump going to Islamabad anytime soon.
19:20And I'm sure, Gaurav, you don't want to wish that.
19:22No, but okay, so Gaurav and Sandeep,
19:24because we are short on time,
19:25I want to bring the both of you into this conversation.
19:27And one point which Gaurav loves to speak of,
19:29let's address the elephant that is not in the room,
19:31and that's Pakistan.
19:32And these negotiations where Pakistan is the mediator right now,
19:36what does it really mean for India?
19:38Is it a moment for Pakistan as well?
19:41How are you looking at it?
19:43So Pakistan, I mean, it's played this role of a middleman in the past,
19:48and many times, whether it was in the 1970s for Kissinger's visit to China.
19:55Or after the regime changed then, or the revolution in Iran,
20:00Pakistan was the conduit for America to remain in touch with the regime in Iran,
20:04even after 1979, 1980.
20:06So, you know, this is a historic role for Pakistan, the messenger boy.
20:10A messenger boy that really doesn't play the classic role.
20:13It's not there.
20:14It cannot decide.
20:15It doesn't have the heft.
20:16It doesn't have the financial heft.
20:17It doesn't have the military heft.
20:19Because let's say one party walks out of it.
20:21What can Pakistan do?
20:23Pakistan can just say,
20:24oh, by the way, if you're leaving, just give us a little money
20:26so that we can live for another day.
20:27Okay, Geetha, do you want to come in?
20:29Do you have a contrarian view?
20:30Look, that's the truth about Pakistan.
20:32Okay, I'm not contending that.
20:35One second.
20:36Yes, it has been a conduit.
20:38But over here, it's more than that.
20:40It's not a very...
20:41Let's not just make it frivolous.
20:44It's a very important one.
20:45A messenger is not frivolous.
20:47I know what you call it.
20:48Okay, guys, don't argue.
20:49I don't have much time.
20:51I'm just saying that it's a very important role.
20:53And Pakistan will have to act responsibly over here.
20:57We'll have to see how Pakistan really performs over here as mediator.
21:02In the past, like he said, yes, they have been conduit.
21:05They have been messenger.
21:07But playing the mediator role is very different, Preeti.
21:10This is a large role that Pakistan has been given.
21:13No, it's actually China.
21:14China, Pakistan is the master.
21:16No, no, no.
21:17Pakistan is a servant.
21:18China is the master.
21:19Please understand what the equation is.
21:21Okay, let's Sandeep come in.
21:22Clearly, the Chinese, as Gaurav said, have played a very big role in this as well.
21:26Because it was Chinese oil that was being throttled.
21:30I mean, Chinese refineries are running short of oil, right?
21:33The Chinese needed to move in.
21:35They didn't want this war to go on endlessly.
21:37And that's how Pakistan entered the thing.
21:39And as far as our role in this kind of thing, I said, thank God for Pakistan.
21:45And, you know, India doesn't have to get into all of these things.
21:48It's not our war.
21:49It's not our battle.
21:50It's not for us to play peacemakers.
21:52Where angels fare to tread.
21:53And that's exactly what Pakistan has done.
21:55No, but that are here.
21:56Not our circus, not our monkeys.
21:57Exactly.
21:58And we don't want other...
21:59We don't want the U.S. certainly to come and say, we want to mediate in the Kashmir dispute.
22:03Since you've done such a great job with, you know, Iran, we want to mediate between you and Pakistan.
22:07I'm going to take final comments there.
22:10Ankit, would you want to quickly come in?
22:11Ten seconds.
22:13With what you are witnessing and tracking with the OSINT team, where do you see things headed?
22:18I will talk about things that is affecting India.
22:21The Strait of Hormuz.
22:22Today, we saw two vessels crossing the Strait.
22:25Both belong to Iranian businesses, Iranian entities.
22:30The real sign of confidence, which we are waiting for, is when vessels start to move from east to west.
22:37That has not happened.
22:39We are waiting for that.
22:40Once that happens, we can be reassured that our oil, our gas starts to come back.
22:45So as far as the Strait of Hormuz is concerned, we have, what, 10-12 hours we have seen.
22:50No movement so far, only two vessels, both Iranians.
22:52Right.
22:53And your team is keeping a keen eye on that movement front.
22:56But Rohit, 10 seconds.
22:58Where do you see things headed?
23:00Well, I just want to add one quick thing here, Preeti.
23:03We're talking about Pakistan.
23:04You know, they're enjoying their, you know, global praise and fame right now.
23:07But I'm 100% sure that it will be undone by the extreme voices within Pakistan regime.
23:12And we will all, you know, look at this and be like, all right.
23:15Everyone loves to speak of Pakistan on this war council.
23:17But okay, 10 seconds, Gita.
23:19No more than 10 seconds.
23:20Okay, I think.
23:20You see it resume in two weeks.
23:22Is that what you look at?
23:23Resume?
23:24What resume?
23:25The conflict?
23:25The war?
23:26Or do you think it's done?
23:27No, no.
23:28I don't think it's done.
23:29I think it's cyclical now.
23:31It'll be cyclical for a while.
23:33But I want to see whether if the ceasefire holds for the next two weeks.
23:37Oh, that's what you're looking at.
23:38Sandeep, is that exactly what you're looking at?
23:39I would wait for the ceasefire to hold.
23:41I mean, two weeks is a long time, clearly.
23:43Would you also be watching Iran, Lebanon, that front as well with what's going on, Gauru?
23:48So, Lebanon front will burn.
23:49But I'd like to see more ships move along the Strait of Hormuz.
23:52Because America will then play a much bigger role.
23:55Look, America is very smart here.
23:57They're letting Iran say, okay, we'll take $2 million.
23:58Then what America will do, they'll come and take the $2 million or they'll take probably $1 million or whatever.
24:04America will then control the Strait of Hormuz and Iran then will be jettisoned.
24:07Do you see that happening, America controlling?
24:09No.
24:09All right.
24:09So, you know, in our war council as well, councillors differ sometimes in their views.
24:15And you saw that right here.
24:17But mostly if we look at it, they've got it bang on from day one.
24:20Thank you guys for joining us.
24:21We'll have you back soon.
24:23Hopefully not so soon with the kind of developments peter down a bit.
24:31The gloves are off in Bengal.
24:34This is no longer political sparring.
24:36This is a direct face-off.
24:38Mamata Banerjee versus the Election Commission.
24:41The latest flashpoint, a dramatic showdown in Delhi.
24:46A Trinamul Congress stormed out of a meeting with the poll panel on Wednesday.
24:50Alleging Chief Election Commissioner Gyanesh Kumar told them to get lost.
24:55Get lost.
24:58This is what the Chief Election Commissioner told the Trinamul Congress delegation.
25:03Get lost.
25:04What's going on in Delhi?
25:06Get lost.
25:06Get out of here.
25:08This Election Commissioner said last time.
25:10We're going to get out.
25:12The Election Commission hit back, flatly denying the charge.
25:16Sources say it was TMC leaders who were shouting, disrupting and derailing the meeting, forcing a breakdown in talks.
25:24And then a rare, no-holds-barred escalation.
25:28The EC went public, naming the TMC, and declared that Bengal will see free, fair and violence-free elections this
25:37time.
25:38This time, a loaded phrase.
25:40One that raises uncomfortable questions.
25:43TMC fired back, saying the 2026 polls must be free from Delhi's control, political bias and targeted persecution.
25:52What we are witnessing now is not a one-off clash.
25:55This is a long-brewing institutional confrontation.
25:59TMC has claimed the voter list revision is a deliberate purge of genuine voters.
26:04The EC has said it is only cleaning out bogus and duplicate names.
26:09TMC has alleged minorities are being selectively targeted.
26:13The EC insists there is zero community bias.
26:16TMC has claimed massive officer reshuffles to favor the BGP.
26:20The EC calls them routine steps for fair elections.
26:24TMC has accused the EC of acting as a BGP extension.
26:29The EC maintains it is an independent constitutional authority.
26:33TMC says the process is opaque and excludes genuine voters.
26:37The EC says it is rule-based, transparent, with safeguards in place.
26:42TMC has alleged a secret EC-BJP understanding.
26:46The EC dismisses it as baseless political rhetoric.
26:49TMC claims BGP violations go unchecked.
26:53The EC says action is taken across the board without bias.
26:59India block-led TMC had moved impeachment motion against CEC Gyanesh Kumar,
27:05accusing him of being biased and blocking probe against electoral fraud.
27:09The motion was, however, rejected by both the chairman of the Rajasabha and the Lokasabha speaker.
27:16There are, of course, many errors, fundamental errors of approach in the order which we received a couple of days
27:23ago.
27:24Pray tell us, did you consult anybody?
27:27Certainly not us, the complainants.
27:30You have strangulated the adjudicatory and the political process,
27:34and you have mixed up sub-judice, contempt, impeachment, all illegally.
27:39This is no longer just a political battle.
27:43It's a fight over the credibility of the election itself.
27:47In Bengal, the real contest may not just be about who wins,
27:51but whether the result itself stands unquestioned.
27:55Bureau Report, India Today.
28:01All right, as we cut across to our panelists this evening,
28:04the questions that we ask,
28:05should a constitutional body like the Election Commission of India
28:10make political attacks like it did on the social media platform X this afternoon,
28:17where it practically attacked the TMC, issuing an ultimatum to the party?
28:23Has the Election Commission, non-partisan image, been compromised?
28:28And lastly, has Bengal election now been reduced to a CEC Gyanesh
28:33versus Chief Minister Mamata Banerjee battle?
28:37Let's take all these questions to our panelists.
28:40I have with me Kirti Azad, Lok Sabha MP, TMC.
28:44Mr. Azad, there are contrary anecdotes and recalling of the seven-minute meeting
28:51that happened between the EC and your team members, which is the TMC.
28:56The TMC members would have us believe that they were told to get lost.
29:01The Election Commission sources will have us believe that it was your leaders
29:05that created a ruckus and started shouting, which led to the breakdown in talks.
29:13Why does the Election Commission have to go through sources?
29:16Why can't they come out and speak about it?
29:18Why can't they give us transcript of what went there?
29:22They should actually have it.
29:23And do you think a person like Derek O'Brien or Sagrika would go and speak loudly
29:29and talk, shout at them?
29:31I mean, it was a very simple meeting where they had put up nine letters
29:35that were written by our chairperson, saying that they have not replied even to one
29:39or even acknowledged it.
29:40They also gave examples of many examples, out of which five were mainly put across
29:44as how the Election Commission officers are working for the BJP.
29:48The details, the videos, and all of the facts were handed over to them.
29:54One being one SSP, Jayant Khan, who is from Bihar, Qatar,
29:59and is now a special police officer.
30:01I don't know under which it comes.
30:03It's not even a micro-observer.
30:05Is there in Malda, where, you know, all that problem that took place,
30:08his wife had contested an election from Puraniya.
30:11These were a few matters that were talked about, and she says,
30:16that's about it, get out.
30:17Is that the way to talk to four members of parliament?
30:20Is that how you speak to political party representatives who have come to you,
30:25who are just explaining to you, and this happened all within two to three minutes?
30:29Is this the way how you treat this?
30:31Is this the way how you talk?
30:31I think, is he, Mr. Amish Shah, the third power,
30:35is sitting behind his back and giving him that much of strength.
30:38Otherwise, he won't have at the guts, I mean, also the kind of position that he holds.
30:42I'm sure he knows how to speak and what the behavior and mannerism should be
30:47when he's speaking to certain people who are talking to him some serious points.
30:52Mr. Razad, do you see, because, you know, one could suggest that both parties are to blame,
30:57that the West Bengal election now has sadly been reduced to a face-off between the Election Commission and the
31:04TMC.
31:06It is practically a Gyanesh Kumar versus Mamata Banerjee.
31:09No, I mean, we, the houses, you heard it from Derek O'Brien.
31:16Why doesn't Gyanesh come out himself, Mr. Banerjee Kumar?
31:19Why doesn't he come out himself and tell us?
31:21Oh, why not best to produce the transcripts?
31:24If he's saying that they were not talking properly or they were not behaving properly,
31:29why did he tell them to get out then?
31:32Is this the way to talk?
31:34Is this the way how you treat members of parliament?
31:37And four of them, one is the leader of our party in the Raj Sabah,
31:41the other is the deputy leader with two other members of parliament along that?
31:45I mean, is that the way how an election commission?
31:48I mean, these people have lost no manner.
31:51They have no mannerisms.
31:52They've lost everything.
31:54They want to win Bengal by hook or by crook.
32:02But, you know, there's also been a social media post by the election commission.
32:07Many, Mr. Razad, would call it unprecedented.
32:10And it can be viewed from two lenses.
32:13One, from the purview of your lens, which would say that this is unprecedented,
32:16a constitutional body seemingly attacking a political party.
32:20On the other hand, there is also the lens which suggests that the TMC has coerced
32:25the election commission of this country to make a statement
32:29where they are issuing an ultimatum to a political party
32:32and practically suggesting that for the first time,
32:35elections in Bengal because of the election commission will be free of fear,
32:40hinting that you are the perpetrators of that fear,
32:43free of violence, free of intimidation, free of inducement,
32:47and without any raid, booth jamming, and sauce jamming.
32:55In 2011, 2016, and 2011, 2016, and to an extent, 2011, and 2021,
33:03when the three assembly elections took place, there was no problem.
33:07There was no violence.
33:08No election commissioner talked about it.
33:09No CEC talked about it.
33:11No CEO talked about it.
33:13But why is it that after BJP contested the elections of Raj's last assembly elections
33:18where they managed to get a few seats more than what they had done,
33:21I mean, their best performance,
33:22why is it that all this started coming up when Gyanesh Kumar has come?
33:26The question is this.
33:27Why not in 2011?
33:29Why not in 2016?
33:30Why not in 2021?
33:32Why in 2026?
33:34They are vindictive.
33:39That is all I can talk about then.
33:41And he is actually acting.
33:43It's actually the BJP commission of India,
33:45not the election commission of India.
33:47Why doesn't he reply or even acknowledge to the nine letters
33:51written by our chairperson, Mamata Banerjee,
33:53a sitting chief minister of Bengal for last three terms?
33:57Why?
33:59Do you have an answer for it?
34:00Why don't you ask him of that?
34:02Why sources?
34:03Why can't it come from the house's mouth?
34:06Mr. Razad, what do you have to say
34:09and your party have to say to those
34:11and a lot of political commentary
34:14that the TMC right now completely rattled
34:17at the back of the deletions that have taken place
34:19under the SIR where large chunks of bogus votes
34:23as per a certain set have been removed.
34:25You're so rattled that you're trying to now make this election
34:29that this election has been compromised
34:31and manipulated by the election commission.
34:34Basically looking for excuses before the results.
34:39Was there any logical discrepancies anywhere in any other state?
34:46Was there all the elections that they have taken in the past
34:49or in the current scenario where five states are going for elections?
34:53Has there been a single logical contradiction?
34:57You tell me it's all illogical.
34:59When you talk about Mamata Banerji
35:01and I'm speaking to you in English it's Mamata Banerji
35:04but when I speak in Hindi or go and speak in Bangla
35:07I'll say Mamata Pandupadhyay.
35:09Now one has to understand
35:11you can call a Tato here and a Tata back home in Delhi.
35:17So there are these differences
35:20which are called as logical discrepancies
35:22and people have been completely wiped out.
35:24A woman who gets married
35:26changes a surname to a husband's name
35:28has been wiped out.
35:29She is not a voter.
35:30Now do you think
35:31that these are only my voters?
35:34They are voters from Bengal.
35:36Who they vote for is their choice.
35:39But you can't take away their franchise.
35:4219 of these judicial committees
35:44that were formed
35:45by the Honorable Supreme
35:47have not sat till date
35:51and they have to go through these
35:531,40,000,000 voters.
35:56What do you say to that?
35:57Why is the Election Commission not expediting it?
36:03All right.
36:04Okay.
36:05Mr. Azad because I reckon
36:07this is a battle
36:07that is going to carry on
36:08in days to come.
36:09Thank you for joining us this evening
36:11and giving us your party's perspective.
36:13Let's take it there.
36:14Now moving on
36:14to our political face-off this evening.
36:16Joining me,
36:17R.P. Singh,
36:17spokesperson BJP,
36:18Monajeet Mondal,
36:19political analyst.
36:20R.P. Singh,
36:22for, you know,
36:22I just want to ask you this question
36:24with regard of being a politician, sir.
36:27For a constitutional body
36:30like the Election Commission
36:31or for any constitutional body
36:33to post on social media
36:35attacking a political party,
36:37giving ultimatums to a political party,
36:40does it befit the post
36:42of a constitutional body?
36:43It's unprecedented, sir.
36:44It's never happened in India's history.
36:50There's a question to me, Preeti,
36:52or the...
36:52Yes, sir.
36:52You, sir.
36:53You, you, you.
36:55Kalika, I'm sorry, Preeti.
36:56I missed out.
36:56My question,
36:58my question,
36:59Mr. Singh,
36:59is a constitutional body
37:02in an unprecedented fashion
37:03has put out a social media post
37:06attacking a political party,
37:07issuing it an ultimatum.
37:09Many see this as partisan
37:11and taking sides.
37:12Is this okay
37:14for a constitutional body
37:17to do so?
37:17It's never happened before.
37:19Well, I've gone through
37:21that social media post.
37:24It says,
37:25this time elections,
37:26I mean,
37:27it's a ECC,
37:28I stay talk to Congress.
37:31At this time,
37:31the elections in West Wingard
37:32would surely be fear-free,
37:35violence-free,
37:35interpretation-free,
37:36interruption-free,
37:38and without any chappa
37:41I don't see anything wrong with it.
37:44Sir, have you not seen
37:45the top part
37:46where it says
37:46an ultimatum
37:47to the Trinimal Congress?
37:49Have you not read that?
37:51Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
37:53Election Commission's
37:54ultimatum
37:55to Trinimal Congress.
37:56If that line wasn't there,
37:57it would have made sense
37:58because this is the job
37:59of the Election Commission.
38:00And if they are saying...
38:01You are referring to
38:02Election Commission's tweet today
38:05or something else?
38:06Today, sir.
38:06Today, today.
38:07I'm referring to the tweet today.
38:11I'm going to...
38:12I'm going to ask you
38:14to help you out.
38:15It says,
38:16stay talk to Trinimal Congress,
38:18TMC.
38:19It says,
38:19So, there's a problem
38:21with your audio.
38:22We're going to try and correct it.
38:23We can barely hear you.
38:24We're going to come right back to it.
38:25Correct R.P Singh's audio
38:27and we're going to come back to him.
38:28Let's cut across right now
38:29to Monojeet Mondal,
38:31political analyst.
38:32Mr. Mondal,
38:32the charge is very clear
38:33that at the back of SIR,
38:36that is what the BJP
38:38and certain political analysts
38:39will say.
38:40The TMC is so rattled
38:42by losing a huge vote bank chunk
38:44that they want to make this election
38:46and set the ground
38:47which seems to suggest
38:48this election was manipulated
38:50and doctored
38:51by the Election Commission.
38:53To answer this question,
38:55let me put the question back.
38:56So, does it mean that BJP
38:58and the Election Commission
38:59knew that the voters
39:01that they are going to delay
39:02are actually TMC's voters?
39:05Precisely that is the case.
39:07Are they going to say this?
39:08Because they could identify
39:09who are the TMC voters?
39:11Then the whole exercise
39:12is a gimmick.
39:13It's a deliberate ploy
39:14to exclude the voters
39:16who are actually
39:17anti-BJP voters
39:18or the TMC voters.
39:19That's what we are charging
39:21from the very beginning.
39:23And Mr. Ghanesh Kumar,
39:24we are not afraid of you.
39:25This is the place
39:27from where nationalism
39:28saw its opening
39:29in the country
39:30150 years ago.
39:32This is the place
39:33where I saw
39:34hundreds of revolutionaries
39:35going to the gallows
39:36smiling.
39:38Please do not teach us
39:39how it goes in India
39:41when the people
39:43were sacrificing their life
39:44150 years ago.
39:45You are behaving
39:46like the secretary
39:47of Mr. Karjan
39:48who divided us
39:50on communal line
39:50120 years ago.
39:52Please,
39:53please bring it on.
39:54Now it's absolutely,
39:55I mean,
39:56I can't call him
39:57a thick-skinned animal
39:58because he looks
39:59like a human being.
40:00I'm calling him
40:01still a human being.
40:02He should behave
40:02like a human being.
40:03Look at the way
40:04he has deleted
40:05the names
40:06of the prominent people
40:07and the common citizens.
40:09In the name
40:09of logical discrepancy
40:10and Ms. Priti Chowdhury,
40:12these people
40:13passed the two rounds
40:14of examination.
40:16First,
40:16their name figured
40:17in the 2002 list
40:18and then
40:19in the draft list.
40:20Thereafter,
40:21the deletion
40:21happened in the name
40:22of nasty logical discrepancy.
40:25Has this happened
40:26anywhere in the country
40:27as the Honorable MP
40:28was trying to argue?
40:29This was deliberate
40:30because the order
40:31came from the top
40:33to delete
40:33at least 30 to 40 lakhs
40:36of names
40:36because that was
40:37the difference
40:38between TMC and BJP
40:39as per the last election.
40:41That's what
40:41they are trying to make up
40:42and remember,
40:43it doesn't happen that way.
40:45Even the voters,
40:46many of them
40:47who are voting for you,
40:48they are coming back
40:49to TMC
40:50because of the fact
40:51that you have
40:52made them stand
40:53in the long queues.
40:54And many of them
40:55can't even vote
40:56because of the freezing
40:58of the...
40:58The time is up, sir.
40:58I want to bring in
40:59Arapi Singh
41:00back into this conversation.
41:01Hopefully,
41:01we have his audio right.
41:03Arapi Singh,
41:03once again,
41:04I'll refer back
41:04to the tweet.
41:05You know,
41:05it's the job
41:06of a political party
41:07to play politics
41:09even if it is
41:10at the cost
41:10of a constitutional body
41:12which was the EC.
41:13But on the other hand,
41:15the constitutional body
41:16has to reaffirm
41:18to the position
41:19that it has been given
41:20which is a constitutional body.
41:22For the election commission
41:24to put out
41:24a social media tweet
41:25where you are issuing
41:27ultimatums
41:27by naming political parties,
41:30does it befit
41:31that position
41:32it holds, sir?
41:35Well,
41:35the complete tweet
41:36speaks about
41:37the fear-free elections,
41:39voluntary elections,
41:40intimidation-free election.
41:41I mean,
41:42there's nothing wrong
41:43with this very
41:45fear of what...
41:46Sir,
41:46I will once again
41:47take you back
41:48to what it begins with.
41:49It's an ultimatum
41:50to the Tribunal Congress.
41:51You're practically,
41:52the election commission here
41:53is suggesting...
41:55Can you read...
41:55Not suggesting,
41:57stating...
41:57Preeti,
41:58can you read
41:58the complete tweet
41:59for the...
42:00Sir,
42:00I will just read it out.
42:01I will hold your...
42:02I will hold your...
42:04timer and I will...
42:05Yeah, yeah.
42:05Not it.
42:05And I will...
42:07Yeah.
42:08Election commissions
42:09ultimatum
42:09to Trinimal Congress.
42:11It's an ultimatum
42:11that they have issued
42:12to Trinimal Congress.
42:13They're writing that.
42:14And then they say,
42:15election in West Bengal
42:16this time,
42:17fear-free,
42:18violence-free,
42:19intimidation-free,
42:20inducement-free,
42:21raid-free,
42:22booth and source-jamming-free...
42:24Hold on, hold on.
42:24Will they be...
42:24Hold on.
42:25Preeti, hold on.
42:25Hold on.
42:26Yes, sir?
42:27I mean, this is...
42:28This is...
42:29Time is 10, 20 a.m.
42:32And this...
42:33It's not mentioning ultimatum.
42:34I mean,
42:35the setting will help you with that.
42:38It says,
42:38straight talk to the Congress
42:41TMC.
42:42It doesn't talk about ultimatum.
42:43I don't know
42:43what are you reading.
42:45I'm going to the complete ECI website
42:47and also the complete ECI
42:49feature handle also.
42:50Okay.
42:51Okay.
42:51So you're...
42:52Okay, so...
42:53EC straight talk to...
42:54You're saying the...
42:55Okay, you're saying the version
42:56which says
42:56EC's straight talk
42:58to the Tribunal Congress.
42:59That is the version.
43:00That is the version.
43:01Okay.
43:01Okay, so it's corrected
43:02and that's the version.
43:04EC's straight talk.
43:05Should the election commission, sir,
43:07be talking to a political party
43:09like this?
43:11Well, it's very clear
43:13that elections were being...
43:16Voters were being intimidated.
43:18Elections were being led.
43:19There are document...
43:22Videos on record
43:23for the object of purpose.
43:25But coming to the point
43:27which my friend is raising...
43:29Is it the election commission...
43:31Sir, there's a problem
43:31with your audio.
43:32There's a problem.
43:33We cannot hear you.
43:34There is a problem
43:35with your audio.
43:37Can you hear me now?
43:39Yeah, we can hear you.
43:41Okay, now the issue
43:43which is raising is
43:45that as we are elected
43:47and it is not...
43:48Muslim would have been targeted
43:50but it has been conducted
43:51by the Supreme Court,
43:53by the judicial officers
43:55appointed by the Supreme Court.
43:56And I remember
43:57after the Supreme Court decision
43:59on the appointed judicial officers,
44:01my friends for the GMC
44:03were saying something.
44:04Oh, we have won.
44:05We have put the election commission down.
44:08We have dropped the laws
44:09of the election commission.
44:11Now it is a judicial officer.
44:12Now it has been targeted
44:13to the judicial officer.
44:15We are accusing
44:15the Supreme Court.
44:17We are accusing
44:17the Supreme Court.
44:19And again,
44:21it's not...
44:21I mean, I'm sorry,
44:22Kiki, you just mentioned
44:231.40 lakhs.
44:24I'm not sorry.
44:25It is not 60 lakhs
44:26being done here around
44:27where no one raised
44:29the issue on that.
44:30After which almost 23 lakhs
44:31were the dead voters
44:32after which 8% voted
44:33last time also.
44:35I'm on record.
44:36I'm giving you the data
44:37which will put
44:398% voted last time also.
44:42Sir, we can barely hear you.
44:44So please correct your audio.
44:45But let me ask you
44:46this question again.
44:47We can barely hear you.
44:49So what you're saying is
44:50that there was documentary evidence
44:51of the election
44:52being manipulated
44:53the last time.
44:54Then that's a documentary
44:55on the election commission itself.
44:56Why didn't the election commission
44:58in 2021
44:58say that the election
45:00was stolen?
45:01Did they say that?
45:01That's the question.
45:02To say it now,
45:04you're already laying the grounds
45:05by suggesting
45:06one party is playing unfair.
45:09One minute, sir.
45:15Mr. Singh?
45:19The question is for you,
45:20Mr. Singh.
45:22Okay, I think he can't hear us.
45:23We're going to...
45:26I thank our guests
45:27for joining us.
45:28We're going to try
45:28and get across
45:30to our BJP spokesperson.
45:32But let me quickly dip
45:33into the latest news break
45:34that's coming in.
45:40All right, the latest news
45:41coming in amidst
45:42the Passport Rao.
45:43Congress Neta Pavan Khaira
45:44has now filed for
45:45anticipatory bail
45:46in Telangana High Court.
45:47Earlier, Pavan Khaira
45:48released a video
45:49from an undisclosed location.
45:51The Assam Chief Minister
45:53Himanta Biswasarma
45:54is surrounded by
45:55serious corruption allegations
45:56is what Pavan Khaira said.
45:58Instead of answering questions,
45:59he is using his police force.
46:01These are the allegations
46:02of Mr. Pavan Khaira
46:03who's made that video
46:04from an undisclosed location
46:06but apparently word coming in
46:08that he has now moved
46:09for anticipatory bail
46:11in Telangana.
46:12Mind you, Telangana
46:13is ruled by the Congress Party.
46:52All right, so that's the video
47:01in one state.
47:01In Delhi, you had the Assam Police
47:03that came knocking on his door
47:04yesterday looking for him
47:06in all probability
47:07to arrest him.
47:08He's moved anticipatory bail
47:09a quick break.
47:10Stay with me.
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