00:00Ambassador, let me ask you, first of all, a broad question, which is how this widening war in the Middle
00:05East has sort of colored or changed strategy and the trajectory of that war in Ukraine.
00:09What have you been watching for and what's worrying you at this point in time as so much attention is
00:13diverted to the Middle East?
00:16Well, David, you're exactly right. There has a big change.
00:19One of the big changes is the pressure, the financial pressure on Russia has been reduced.
00:25The oil price has gone up, so every barrel that the Russians sell on the world market gets them more
00:30money.
00:31And that was a problem. There was big progress.
00:34There had been big progress in squeezing the Russian economy and the Russian Treasury by reducing the amount of oil
00:41sold, and that has been changed.
00:44We've relaxed sanctions on Russia, allowed them to sell more, and every barrel, as I say, gets a higher price.
00:51So that's a big problem.
00:52On the other hand, David, the people in the Middle East and the nations in the Middle East are very
00:58interested in the Ukrainian experience in shooting down Iranian drones.
01:04And so we got President Zelensky there talking to the leaders, making it very clear which side Ukraine's on, and
01:12it's also very clear which side Russia is on.
01:15There's also a report on Axios this morning that there were some tense moments between the EU Foreign Policy Chief
01:21Kayakalas and Marco Rubio at that meeting,
01:23in which Kalas essentially said, you said at a forum a year ago you were going to get tough on
01:28Russia if they hampered U.S. efforts to stop the war.
01:30That hasn't happened.
01:31And Rubio reportedly shot back, basically, if you think you can do it better, we're going to step aside.
01:36Now, I did reach out to some sources who were at that meeting.
01:38They were unable to confirm this exchange.
01:40But it does seem like there are tensions there about the U.S. not pressuring Russia in the way that
01:46we have seen America pressure other strongmen in other countries, including Venezuela and Iran.
01:52Do you think there's anything Europe can do at this point to change that policy from the U.S.?
01:58Well, yes, Christina, the Europeans are stepping up.
02:03They recognize that the American attention is diverted to Iran, and they recognize, Europeans recognize the real threat that Russia
02:13poses to them.
02:14And all of the effort that had gone into squeezing Russia, putting sanctions on Russia, all of that is at
02:22least reduced at this point.
02:24And so Europeans know they have to step up.
02:26They can do some things.
02:28They can continue what they've started, which is to put pressure on this shadow fleet, these old oil tankers that
02:35are moving the sanctioned oil around the world.
02:38And the Europeans have started to board these tankers.
02:43And that reduces the ability of the Russians to sell oil.
02:46And the Europeans are also stepping up in their support for Ukraine, and they can continue to do that.
02:52You've brought up these sanctions that have been relaxed by the administration.
02:54And I do want to get your perspective on that.
02:56We've heard explanation after explanation from the Treasury Secretary, from Scott Besson, as to why this is happening.
03:01I'm curious how that's ringing to you, if any of that makes sense, if there's a justification here that makes
03:07sense to you, if you can understand in any way why this is happening at this point in the war.
03:13David, it looks like the administration is trying to find ways to put more oil on the market so to
03:20put downward pressure on prices.
03:22They're very concerned about the very high price of oil.
03:26As I say, the high price of oil is helping the Russians, but it is also having a negative effect
03:30on the world economy.
03:31So the administration is looking for any way they can put more barrels of oil on the market.
03:36One way to do that is to allow people to buy Russian oil and to buy Venezuelan oil and even
03:43to buy Iranian oil.
03:45So they're doing this in order to try to put downward pressure.
03:48It's obviously not helping.
03:50And it is having a bad effect, a negative effect on the on the pressure that we need to put
03:56on Russia to stop this war in Ukraine.
03:59Before we let you go, I want to ask you about the status of NATO, because we heard President Trump
04:04growingly frustrated with European allies.
04:06He says not stepping up enough to secure the Gulf.
04:09NATO allies are frustrated about Trump not stepping up to help with the war in Ukraine.
04:14What is the status of that alliance?
04:16And are you concerned that it could fall apart?
04:20Well, Christina, NATO's gone through some difficult times before and has made it through.
04:26This time, however, it does appear that there's a serious movement toward a European pillar, a European pillar in NATO.
04:36So NATO would be comprised of a European pillar that Europeans have capabilities and have their own nuclear weapons with
04:46the British and the French,
04:47have their own defense, have their own defense industrial rights, to be a European pillar within NATO.
04:52Then the other pillar, of course, is the U.S. pillar.
04:55And in the best case, that's a stronger NATO.
05:00But you're right to point out there are tensions between the Europeans and the Americans at this point.
05:05And the question is how to move forward.
05:07One way to do that is for Europeans to develop their own capabilities, I would say, within the context of
05:12NATO,
05:13NATO and make it a stronger alliance.
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