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00:04I'm not sure if I'm going to go in.
00:06Really?
00:07Yeah.
00:08You'll be fine.
00:09Be cold.
00:10You're drowning.
00:14Or maybe you try it for a bit.
00:15I'll go first.
00:18It's looking good.
00:19It's looking rough.
00:21Scaredy cat.
00:23I'm not sure.
00:24That's you.
00:49No prints.
00:53Nothing taken or disturbed.
00:57No.
00:59Unfortunately, the blood sample wasn't big enough for the lab to get a full DNA read.
01:05It's disappointing.
01:08Well, I really thought it was enough for a full sample.
01:12Apparently not.
01:14What about the glove mark?
01:15Not enough resolution for them to do anything with.
01:18You know, I took photos of the house right after the break-in.
01:23And nothing was touched?
01:24No.
01:26Or they put everything back in its place, which is what you would do if you were installing a listening
01:31device.
01:31I've applied for warrants to do exactly that.
01:34You're a copper?
01:34Serious Crime Squad.
01:36Covert Surveillance Unit.
01:37Counter-corruption.
01:38I mean, listen.
01:41Well, I mean, as you know, we've done a couple of sweeps.
01:49Nothing.
01:50No, me neither.
01:53So, there's not much more we can do.
01:57Okay.
02:02What?
02:23Do you want to be?
02:24I don't know.
02:24I don't know.
02:25Oh, my God.
02:59You've worked in surveillance, haven't you, for years, so you're telling me you can't
03:03actually see if they've got a new computer or not?
03:06No.
03:08I've done what I can to check, but you just can't tell now.
03:12You see, there's this incognito spyware runs a keylogger in the background, which means
03:17they can record every key you press, every mouse click, they can see the emails you write,
03:21your messages, your passwords, etc., everything.
03:23Well, they build it so you don't know it's there.
03:26What did the police say?
03:29Well, an officer came out, he took a sample of the blood, there was some blood on the handle
03:35downstairs and he thought he could see a disposable glove mark in it, which means that whoever
03:39did it wants to make sure they're untraceable, he did think they could find a DNA result,
03:44and then nothing, nothing happens.
03:47What do you think this is?
03:49Anything they can find to discredit us.
03:52Something that would look good on the cover of the Daily Mail, for example.
03:56I mean, I can't think of anything that, you know, I mean...
03:59Well, you know what it is.
04:01What's that?
04:03It's the Free Jazz.
04:05If that gets out, we're fucked.
04:06Oh, fuck off.
04:08But who would want to discredit us?
04:10I don't know.
04:11Could be a burglar who just got scared and legged it.
04:14Yeah, well, or he could have just seen Jala's Hawaiian Cushions.
04:18Don't say that in front of Jala.
04:20I'm not going to do that, am I?
04:21I want to hang on to my balls.
04:24You know, the other day when this happened, the first thing I did was pick up the phone
04:30to you.
04:31Yeah, no, I did see it, yeah.
04:33You probably saw it.
04:34I hung up.
04:36Just to...
04:36Yeah, I just think that what we need now is we need a whistleblower, don't we, and we
04:44need someone from inside the agency.
04:47And high up.
04:48From the top, yeah.
04:51Eileen said that we must be making a difference.
04:53Did she?
04:54Yeah, she did.
04:55So, come on, let's...
04:57That's the point, isn't it?
04:58Yeah, we are.
04:58There's no point doing this unless we make a difference.
05:00No, let's keep going.
05:01Let's keep going and let's find that fucking whistleblower.
05:04Right.
05:04June 2019.
05:07Sir James Bevan Environment Agency.
05:10Dear Sir James, I'm writing to your office as I'm sure you will know where to direct the
05:14question.
05:14October 2019.
05:16Dear Sir James, I wrote to you to raise concerns about a serious integrity issue involving the
05:22agency.
05:23Dear Sir James, 34 days have now passed since I sent you evidence.
05:27I've given up expecting a reply from you.
05:31Dear Ashley, I am in the receipt of your email to Sir James.
05:41Would you mind coming to our office?
05:42And would the 19th suit?
05:55Is Sir James not coming?
05:57I'm afraid not.
05:58No, Sir James wouldn't routinely attend meetings at this kind of level.
06:02I'd hoped he'd be here.
06:04He's time poor.
06:06Yeah.
06:06He's aware of your work.
06:07Well, we're trying to find out what you're going to do about the illegal sewage overflow
06:13at Boughton.
06:14The combined storm overflow.
06:15Yeah.
06:16The combined storm overflow at Burton has shown no detectable effects on the water quality.
06:21The water quality is stable and not deteriorating.
06:23I mean, our data shows very clearly that we have the best quality water since the Industrial
06:28Revolution.
06:31The water's turned brown.
06:32Yeah.
06:33It's turned so brown that when it joins the Thames at Newbridge, it makes the Thames look
06:37like a Swiss mountain stream.
06:40The water is brown in places, but that's a natural phenomenon.
06:45It's caused by a geological fault.
06:46A geological fault?
06:48Yeah.
06:48Yeah.
06:49Sorry, a geological fault is millions of years old.
06:53We remember when the water was clear.
06:55No one remembers the good old days before the geological fault.
06:58In the last 12 months since we installed sensors, there's been no evidence of pollution.
07:03Well, that's because you've installed the monitors upstream from the sewage pipes.
07:06Now, is that incompetence or an attempt to cover up a scandal?
07:10No, no.
07:10The agency would never position a monitor to achieve a particular reading.
07:14We are working extremely hard to transform the environment.
07:16We've improved and protected something like, I think it's 15,000 kilometres of river.
07:22But you've had 92 complaints from the general public about sewage pollution.
07:27And that's just the wind rush.
07:29I've actually got the breakdown here.
07:32Yeah, yeah.
07:35In 36 of those cases, there was no offence.
07:39And in 39, there was insufficient evidence.
07:44And in 6, we were unable to identify the offender.
07:49What do you mean you couldn't identify the offender?
07:51Why can't you identify the offender?
07:52There's seven sewage works along the wind rush.
07:55They're all run by Thames water.
07:56I mean, you say you've got insufficient evidence, but we keep giving you the evidence.
08:00All we ever do is give you the evidence and all we get back is it's under investigation.
08:04And then nothing, nothing, nothing ever happens.
08:09In exceptional circumstances, for example, after heavy rain, the sewage systems are allowed to overflow.
08:15No.
08:16No, no, no.
08:17You see, that's not the law.
08:18The law is that in all normal climatic conditions, including heavy rainfall, the water companies have to treat the sewage.
08:25They have to make it safe before they put it back into the river.
08:29The law is a grey area?
08:30No.
08:31No, it's not a grey area with respect.
08:33It's the law.
08:33Sorry, can I?
08:35Sorry.
08:37Thames is their own data.
08:40It shows they stopped treating sewage at Northridge for more than three months.
08:46Now, they told us that their sensors had broken down, but we think they're lying.
08:54They're lying.
08:55So why would they do that?
08:57Why would they lie to you?
08:59Why would they lie to me?
09:12Doors are closing in.
09:17We're attempting regulators.
09:22Sorry?
09:24The regulation isn't real.
09:27The government want us to look like a regulator, but they won't let us do our job.
09:32Okay.
09:34When Cameron and Trust gutted the agency, we went from regulating the industry to doing its bidding.
09:41Do you think we could take your number?
09:43Look, just keep going.
09:47This is going to be the first government in modern history that at the end of its parliamentary term
09:53has less regulation in place than there was at the beginning.
09:56We've now identified those 3,000 regulations that we're going to scrap.
10:00Let's reduce the amount and the burden of regulation.
10:03Strangled by red tape.
10:04Come back the health and safety monster.
10:06Guidance by 80% and we reduce farm inspections by 34,000 every year.
10:12Regulations will go.
10:13None of my ministers could introduce a regulation unless they abolished one at the same time.
10:17I massively reduce the number of rules, laws and regulations that frankly treat all of you by idiots.
10:27So really it's about stripping out as much unnecessary regulation as possible
10:33and taking responsibility for climate change and saying what more can we do to get us to net zero?
10:41As you know, this is a passion project for Sir James, who feels that we can bring our car usage
10:48down by 70%.
10:51Yeah.
10:52It's, yeah.
10:53So from next month, we're going to be taking the bold decision to cut back decisively on our car leases.
11:06Sorry, just like to clarify what you're going to get rid of our cars.
11:12So it's about reducing the agency's carbon footprint.
11:16Just getting that, yeah.
11:19Go ahead, Hannah.
11:19The cars that we drive to the inspections in.
11:23Right, yeah.
11:24Yeah, so self-monitoring and a more desk-based regulation is really, it's really helping us move the needle on
11:31climate change.
11:35But the remaining inspections?
11:39Well, yeah.
11:40How do we get to those without a car?
11:43Yeah.
11:45It's a great question.
11:46It's a really great question.
11:48And we'll take that forward to the next discussion meeting.
11:51Thanks, Hannah.
11:53Yeah, lovely. Thanks, everyone.
11:54Not easy news to break, is it?
11:56Yeah, surprise, surprise.
11:57Debbie's got something to say.
11:58I know, I know.
11:59But my car...
11:59Everyone's driving cars.
12:00We're the environment agency.
12:02Absolutely.
12:02What's wrong with the train?
12:03I'll keep mine, I think.
12:04So, yeah.
12:05Mmm, coffee.
12:06How do I get a coffee?
12:09Does anybody know what we're looking at?
12:12Anybody?
12:14Okay.
12:15Could you tell me what the reactants are?
12:17So, if you move your head even slightly, the vertical gets more intense?
12:21Yeah.
12:21And the attack's happening maybe twice a week?
12:24About that, yeah.
12:29The good news is that you don't have cancer.
12:32We actually think it's Meniere's.
12:34It's a disease of the inner ear.
12:36The main symptom is acute vertigo episodes, vomiting, tinnitus.
12:43It's a pretty neat fit with your presentation.
12:48They were dumping sewage in the water the last time before I got sick.
12:54Right.
12:55You know that from the surface against sewage app?
12:58Okay.
13:01Might that be?
13:02The causes are unclear.
13:04It's post-viral.
13:05This often starts with an ear infection.
13:07You know, they're common in surfers.
13:08Yeah.
13:09Every surfer I know.
13:10Oh, my God!
13:13This is a chronic condition.
13:16I'm afraid there's no cure.
13:18You know, I feel not.
13:42Just hold his back.
13:44Just so he's going to die.
14:08So, by ending on-site inspections into categories three and four,
14:13no or low-impact pollution events,
14:16and doubling down on the more serious Category 1 and 2 incidents,
14:22we think we can turn ourselves into a more effective fighting unit.
14:26Yeah. So, from today, we are ending on-site inspections for Cats three and four.
14:32Any questions?
14:34Well, yeah.
14:37A Category 3 incident can be two kilometres of sewage.
14:43We want you to not inspect, to not spend time on these incidents.
14:49Except that since the water companies have been self-reporting,
14:55they almost always only report Category 3s and 4s.
14:59So, they're not actually reporting serious incidents.
15:01And so, if the water companies are only reporting 3s and 4s,
15:05and we're no longer allowed to investigate...
15:08So, what exactly are we going to be doing?
15:11I've told the government, you get the regulation you pay for.
15:14We no longer have the money to go on inspecting low-grade pollution events.
15:19We need you to shut down these reports as unsubstantiated,
15:22or to silently pass them, and to not report them as pollution incidents.
15:28Is that clear?
15:33Yeah. Thank you. Thanks, everyone.
15:35You're on with your day.
15:36Yeah.
15:47We had to fuck.
15:49Fucking wanket.
15:50How are you going to get to fucking work?
15:52Fuck night.
15:54Horseback.
16:03What time did he call you?
16:05About past ten last night.
16:08He said he couldn't miss it.
16:20Oh, my God. Look at it.
16:26I'll get some shots, and we'll call the agency on the way back.
17:01That's alright.
17:01No, we're going to drop again.
17:08No, I'll start.
17:13Things that are being said.
17:15Toilets were first bater enfrent,
17:15Soilets is a, my neck.
17:15Does it issue with me?
17:15It's a big bad company.
17:15Correct.
17:18No, no, no.
17:22What's up?
17:25I'm coming back and say,
17:52Debbie, are you driving into work tomorrow?
17:54Oh yeah, obviously. How else would I get in?
17:56Well, can I borrow your car at lunchtime?
18:00What for?
18:02Someone keeps calling up and complaining about the same incident.
18:06It's near the bridge at Hawkrise, so I'm gonna go and take a look.
18:11Okay.
18:12A bit of freelance investigation.
18:13A bit of freelance. And also, it needs to be off the books.
18:17And I need you to promise me not to tell Sophie.
18:21I couldn't tell Sophie.
18:22It'll tell Sophie. Within our world, it'll tell Sophie anything.
18:53Hi. Hi, is that Justine?
18:57Hi, Justine. It's Hannah from the Environment Agency.
19:03Listen, it's about the pollution event at Hawkrise.
19:09It came through the system at a duration of 1.34 hours.
19:13And I'm here now. And it's still going.
19:19Yeah, yeah, I'm here now, yeah.
19:22The CSO's still discharging untreated sewage.
19:26I mean, there's a section of the river that is covered over with dried sewage.
19:31I mean, there's dead fish. You can see them from the footpath.
19:34I mean, you're gonna get more complaints.
19:36You need to sort this.
19:42Can you prepare and cook a simple meal unaided?
19:47Yeah. But not when I'm having an attack.
19:51Then I can't do anything. I can't move.
19:54Can you eat and drink unaided?
19:56Yeah, but again, not when I'm having an attack.
20:00And I've been getting the attacks every few days for the past six months.
20:05But if you're not having one of your attacks, can you eat and drink unaided?
20:09Yeah, but...
20:10Yes or no is fine.
20:12Yes.
20:15Can you dress and undress unaided?
20:20It's the same answer.
20:22Moving on to the mobility section of this assessment.
20:25Can you plan and follow a journey unaided?
20:30Yeah, but not when I'm having an attack.
20:33Standard move for 200 metres.
20:37Not when I'm having an attack.
20:39Well, you know, can you move around, walk for 200 metres?
20:42Of course I can, but not when I'm having an attack.
20:44Okay.
20:45Thank you, Mr Santa.
20:46Your total score for the daily living part of the assessment is zero points.
20:51Your total score for the mobility section is zero points.
20:55When you're not having an attack, you're able to do all the tasks I asked you about.
20:58That's the thing with my condition is that sometimes I can do these things and other times I can't.
21:04And when I can't, I can't do anything.
21:05I can't award you a personal independence payment.
21:08I don't know what to do.
21:09If you need further guidance about how to appeal, you can use the web chat to get some help.
21:15If you cannot access the web chat, you can contact the benefits appeal helpline on 0300103.
21:31HANNAH
21:31Sorry, sorry, sorry to scare you.
21:34Do you have a second? Can I have a word?
21:36Of course.
21:37OK, so I just got off the phone to Justine Wright Phillips at the water company.
21:42Yeah.
21:43Yeah, she said you called her.
21:45Yeah, I did.
21:48Okay, she said you called her from the site.
21:51Well, I saw that it had been logged on the system for the fifth time
21:54and people kept calling up complaining
21:56and nobody was doing anything about it.
21:57But we don't have the revenue to be investigating Category 3.
22:03It's not for Category 3, Sophie.
22:06The river is dried over with excrement.
22:09You can see it from...
22:09Yeah, so that's what I wanted to talk to you about.
22:11So Justine says that the dispersal rate in that area is really high.
22:16Is it?
22:17Yeah, she says there's like a strong current and a high dispersal rate...
22:20The overflow pipe has been discharging for over 36 hours
22:23and it is still going.
22:24All right, that is the water company's responsibility to report to us.
22:29You know this.
22:32Okay, and Justine says that actually really,
22:35because of the high dispersal rate,
22:37that it should come down to a Category 4.
22:41Be a Category 4?
22:43Yes.
22:43Right.
22:43Mm-hmm.
22:46So no impact on the environment,
22:48no action needed?
22:50Yes.
22:52Mm-hmm.
22:56Oh, you want me to change it on the system?
22:58Could you? Could you?
22:59Yeah?
23:00Okay, thanks so much.
23:02That's great.
23:03Lovely.
23:12So, you see how well we're doing?
23:14Yeah, of course.
23:14Are you joking?
23:16I'm not joking.
23:17You know SROIC?
23:19No, what's that?
23:21Strategic Review of Incident Charges.
23:23Yeah, it's like what we charge the clients for permits and that.
23:26So we don't have clients, Cheryl.
23:27We're an environment agency.
23:29Okay, yes, sorry, yes, we don't have clients.
23:32But Sir James has put the prices up, yeah?
23:35And I'm talking like up, up.
23:37Big time.
23:39Well, he's charging the water companies more.
23:41Yep.
23:42Well, surely they've gone down to the government,
23:44like, lobbying them, going,
23:45my, J-game, the charges are taken down.
23:48No.
23:48Not a peep.
23:49Not a peep.
23:51And they're just paying it.
23:53We've basically had such a high revenue spike, yeah,
23:58that we are on our way to becoming a client-funded regulator.
24:04Sorry, hold on one minute.
24:05This is going a bit...
24:06So you're saying that the water companies are funding the environment agency.
24:12That's what you're...
24:14You see the issues there.
24:16You can't be serious.
24:17A client-funded regulator.
24:22Amazing, isn't it?
24:22How can that even be a thing?
24:25It's a thing.
24:26Well, hold on, because literally,
24:28the other day Sir James said that you get the regulation that you pay for.
24:32Yeah.
24:32That we haven't got the money to do the investigations that we used to do.
24:37Nobody's paying for them.
24:38Okay.
24:38That's your area, isn't it?
24:40I mean, all I know is that we have got more cash than we've ever had before.
24:47I'm just making conversation.
24:51I've got the job.
24:53Postman?
24:53Mm-hmm.
24:54No!
24:54Yeah.
24:55Did you?
24:55Yeah.
24:56Oh, my God!
24:57Yeah, really good timing.
25:00Uh-huh.
25:01Because I did two pregnancy tests this morning.
25:05What?
25:06And, yeah, I'm pregnant.
25:08What?
25:09Yeah, pregnant.
25:10No.
25:11Yeah, yeah.
25:13I sort of just had a funny feeling, and then, yeah, did one test, two lines,
25:18and then I did another test, and it said two lines as well, and I was like, fuck.
25:33I'm Susan Davy.
25:35I am the CEO of Southwest Water.
25:37Basically, the wet weather events put a strain on our Victorian networks.
25:42And, unfortunately, we have a Victorian sewage system, which we have inherited, and that
25:49means things do go wrong.
25:51Did you say Victorian sewage network?
25:5312 percent.
25:5512?
25:5512 percent?
25:56What's 12 percent?
25:5812 percent of the sewage system is Victorian.
26:01What do they tell you?
26:02They knew that the whole of the system was Victorian, so that meant that the investment would be so high
26:08that it'd be impossible to actually fix it all.
26:11Bollocks.
26:12Should I tell you what stopped it?
26:14When privatization came in, they just stopped spending.
26:17After the war, they kept upgrading.
26:19Then, after privatization came in, they just stopped.
26:23Not just hems, all of them.
26:26Six percent new plants is privatization.
26:29Six percent?
26:30Six percent.
26:31Is that all?
26:31You know, it'd be good if we could maybe come and visit one of the works.
26:35I don't know about that.
26:36Well, I'd have to see, but lads want to see, because even just doing this, I feel a bit nervous.
26:42Fucking London Stadium.
26:43That's not a proper stadium.
26:44Fucking massive.
26:46Upton Park.
26:46Now, that was a proper stadium, mate.
26:48London Stadium's too big.
26:49You fucking binoculars, do you know what I mean?
26:51Yeah.
26:52Sorry, Pete, did you want to see an EDM?
26:54Oh, yes.
26:54Yes, that's right.
26:55Well, I remembered.
26:56So, this is an event duration monitor.
26:59Now, we fitted one of these on every sewage pipe in England.
27:03In 2012, the coalition government, they ordered all the water companies to record how much time they spend dumping raw
27:11sewage.
27:12These little units, they measure how much poo goes into the river by hours.
27:16Management have been dragging their feet for eight years now.
27:19But we're finally getting most of it in now.
27:22And the agency, they've got to publish the numbers.
27:25They have to, by law.
27:26I mean, they're not going to like it, but tough shit.
27:30EDMs.
27:32Yes.
27:34So, we are finalizing plans for the statutory publication of the EDM numbers.
27:44As you know, there have been some technical delays, but it looks like they're almost ready.
27:50And they're going to come as a bit of a shock.
27:56The data is going to show that the water companies discharged raw sewage 400,000 times in 2020.
28:06That's 1,100 times a day for a total of 3.1 million hours.
28:17It's a bit of a shocker.
28:18Can I just say that since operator self-monitoring, we've had to rely on the water companies to report back
28:26to us.
28:27I think that the key here is that this doesn't get framed as a failure of regulation.
28:33That would be quite wrong.
28:35And I think managing comms on this is going to be key.
28:38And we are working actively with the water companies to bear down on the problem.
28:46But that's 1,100 criminal offences a day.
28:50Well, that's actually, that's debatable because that depends on the terms of the permit and the circumstances around each spill.
28:57Yeah.
28:58And we know the legislation permits discharging after heavy rainfall.
29:02No, it doesn't.
29:04Sorry, Hannah.
29:04The law doesn't say that you can just dump sewage after heavy rain.
29:09It says that in all normal, climatic and seasonal circumstances, the water companies have to treat the sewage, not just
29:16dump it.
29:17But it's not the agency's job to adjudicate legal matters.
29:20I mean, this is actually a matter for the courts.
29:23No, no, no.
29:24This is our job.
29:25It's our job to enforce the law.
29:28Yeah.
29:28That's what we're here to do.
29:33What?
29:35Can you, um, you...
29:37Did you want to...
29:37No, no, you finish off here, Sophie.
29:43So we've identified the problem and now we work on the problem.
29:45Yeah.
29:45Which is reframing and owning the narrative.
29:48Yeah, we don't want this to get misconstrued as some sort of failure on our part because it just isn't.
29:52Thanks.
29:52Thanks, guys.
29:53Thanks so much.
29:54Thanks.
29:56Cool.
29:57Lovely.
29:57Thanks, guys.
29:58Thanks so much.
29:59By the way, um, so I've heard you're going to give evidence in Parliament.
30:05Yes.
30:06Yes.
30:06Amazing.
30:07Yeah, I think you're bad.
30:09What does that mean, thinking about it?
30:11He's, uh, he's nervous.
30:12No, I'm not nervous.
30:14He's nervous.
30:14No, it's not that I'm nervous.
30:16I want to do it.
30:17It's just difficult.
30:19Pete.
30:19Don't worry about it.
30:20I'll do...
30:21Yeah.
30:21We're counting on you.
30:22We are really counting on you.
30:23And you can explain it in this scientific way.
30:25You're going to come across brilliantly.
30:26They're going to believe you, mate.
30:28Well, it...
30:30It's not really as simple as that.
30:31The boys from Ogden called me earlier, right?
30:34Yeah.
30:34They told me that they dumped two billion litres of sewage in the Thames over two days.
30:40Environment Agency haven't got a Scooby.
30:42Did they send you the data?
30:43I've got the data, yeah.
30:44All right.
30:44Can you send that to us?
30:45I will send it to you.
30:46We're not going to let you down.
30:48Exactly.
30:48Please, you can do this.
30:49Come on, Pete.
30:50You're a legend, mate.
30:53Come on.
31:03We now have the lowest number of serious pollution incidents from water companies that we have
31:09yet recorded.
31:11More water companies are now at the highest level of performance, what we call four-star
31:18performance.
31:19We now have the lowest number of serious pollution incidents from water companies that we have
31:24yet recorded.
31:54I'm an environment officer.
32:00When I first joined, it wasn't a job to get rich on.
32:07You know, I could see I was making a difference.
32:11You know, corporations want to make money.
32:14We make sure that they don't poison the rivers doing it.
32:16We could investigate, prosecute, whatever it took.
32:22But then they told the companies that they could regulate themselves.
32:27That's operates a self-monitoring.
32:29That's a self-monitoring.
32:31Then came the Cameron cuts, then the trust cuts.
32:35They laid off investigators, slashed prosecutions.
32:39I mean, they even took our cars off of us so we couldn't visit pollution sites.
32:42So, all these cuts meant you couldn't do your job properly.
32:46That's not it.
32:49In 2021, Sir James hiked the prices the water companies paid for their permits.
32:55It was called charge-funded regulation.
32:58We get 96 million from the government.
33:01We are now pulling in 411 million from charges.
33:06All these cuts, they're just a smoke screen.
33:10We're swimming in cash.
33:13I am doing this because I know that it is wrong.
33:16And it has ruined my whole working life.
33:23Good luck.
33:36Right.
33:40Fucking hell.
33:42What should we do?
33:43Well, first we read them.
33:46And then I think we should call some journalists.
33:50The Environment Agency has refused to comment on whether agency directors currently hold shares in UK water companies.
33:58The agency claimed it would break data protection laws if it disclosed the information.
34:03Environment Agency chiefs secretly held a series of private dinners with water company bosses at the Royal Automobile Club in
34:11central London.
34:11Documents released under the Freedom of Information Act showed the meetings were held to discuss how to quell public anger
34:18over sewage.
34:19As the sewage scandal deepens, Environment Agency CEO, Sir James Bevan, has been called to give evidence to a parliamentary
34:26committee.
34:27Well, we need to talk about what we say in public and the responsibilities we have.
34:33You have a duty not to openly criticise or discredit the organisation in the media or on social media, or
34:43to disclose confidential information to anyone not authorised to receive it.
34:51If your comments, inside or outside work, impact on the agency's reputation by making derogatory comments about the organisation, or
34:59your managers, or you make comments that bring the organisation into disrepute, you may be subject to disciplinary action.
35:08And in more serious cases, dismissal.
36:06One of those works, the Environment Agency said, over 10 years, only two pollution incidents have been reported.
36:16Our machine learning analysis, it showed hundreds of illegal spills, more than 300 lasted 24 hours, and some longer than
36:3210 days, and some for a month.
36:37Have you shown this evidence to the Environment Agency?
36:40Well, yeah, I've shown the evidence many times.
36:43What usually happens is that they say that they show a sign of interest, but then nothing happens.
36:54We work very closely with Professor Hammond of Windrush Against Sewage Pollution.
37:05He and Ashley Smith sent you at least 13 emails detailing evidence of illegal sewage dumping.
37:17He published five evidence reports documenting water company criminality, all of which were sent to you or your senior colleagues.
37:26They invited you to come and look at the river in 2019, and the following year sent you an email
37:34with the heading,
37:36Environment Agency Complicit in Law Breaking.
37:45They never heard back.
37:46You never once replied in five years.
37:51How did you manage to work so closely with Professor Hammond when you never once spoke to him?
37:55At the Thames Water Mogden Treatment Works, there was a spill of 240 Olympic swimming pools of sewage in a
38:07single day.
38:08The existing monitoring failed to pick that up.
38:11Now, why was that?
38:13There will always be times when something happens, usually accidentally.
38:18But if we find that a water company has breached its permit, we will take appropriate action.
38:26Does appropriate action include prosecuting water company executives?
38:30Prosecution is a very high bar, but...
38:34Where we think that's appropriate, we wouldn't hesitate.
38:38Did you prosecute in this case?
38:40No.
38:42Have you ever prosecuted any water company executives?
38:45Perhaps, no, but if we thought the evidence warranted it, we wouldn't hesitate.
38:52Last year, you told this committee that you became aware of sewage dumping in May 2021.
38:58Yes.
38:59But three weeks after that, you told the committee that the water companies were improving,
39:03and that more of them were getting four out of four stars.
39:08Why were you telling the committee that the water companies were doing a four-star job?
39:15Well, you've quoted everything I said.
39:19I think I stand by everything I said.
39:23I think you'll find them mutually consistent.
39:28The agency's job is to make sure the water companies obey the criminal law, but it doesn't do it,
39:35and the water companies do whatever they want.
39:37The alleged crimes of their directors are never prosecuted.
39:43They've built criminality into their business models because pollution is highly profitable and repeat offending has no consequences.
39:52Therefore, in the light of the remarkable absence of any counter-corruption measures,
39:58we demand an investigation into the environment agency.
40:04The key test for me on regulation.
40:07Less regulation.
40:08Is it something that enables the builders, not the blockers?
40:11Cut guidance by 80%.
40:13We've also got to look at regulation.
40:15Regulations will go.
40:17And where it is needlessly holding back the investment.
40:19Reduce the amount and the burden of regulation.
40:22Rip up the bureaucracy that blocks investment.
40:24Northumbria and Water recorded 30.1 spills per overflow over the course of 2023.
40:30280,000 hours and change in total.
40:35The chief executive, Heidi Mottram, received a bonus of £234,000 that year.
40:43Why did you take for all tickets from the parent company?
40:47Well, I didn't.
40:49OK.
40:49C.K. Hutchins Holdings owns 75% of Chung Kong Infrastructure Holdings, the owner of Northumbria
40:55and Water.
40:56And you declared £2,000 in football tickets and hospitality.
40:59Well, on that occasion, there was nobody from a water company that was involved in offering
41:05those tickets.
41:05There was nobody from a water company at that event.
41:08Well, I wouldn't have known that.
41:10They weren't present.
41:10Why didn't you know?
41:10You should have known that.
41:11You said that these sort of people should potentially be in the dock if they have been found to break
41:16the rules.
41:17Because you took £2,000 in tickets and hospitality for a football match from bosses linked to
41:22that company that polluted that water.
41:24Why should people in Northumbria think that you're fit for your job?
41:28Well, I certainly wouldn't have known that.
41:29And judge me by what I do.
41:29Why not?
41:30Judge me by what I do.
41:31No, no.
41:31That is what you did.
41:44Environment Minister Steve Reid is pursuing legal action against a group of anglers trying
41:50to restore the ecosystem of their local river on the grounds that cleaning up individual
41:55rivers is administratively unworkable.
41:59Concerns have been raised about the number of leading labour figures with links to lobbying
42:03firms working for water companies.
42:05Among the invited guests at the government's international investment summit was Macquarie Bank.
42:10Described as the vampire kangaroo by critics, Macquarie presided over the near collapse of
42:16Thames water, leaving it £10 billion in debt after having illegally dumped billions of
42:22litres of raw sewage.
42:40Reuben?
42:44Reuben?
42:47I know I can't be left alone with her.
42:57How did it come to this?
43:16How did it happen that England is the only place in the whole world whose water system
43:25is wholly privatised?
43:29That our seas and our rivers are full of shite?
43:35I just feel like we're trying to bring down England's biggest organised crime syndicate.
43:43I mean they're not the mafia, these water companies, they're not a drugs cartel but they do dump
43:50sewage a thousand times a day and almost all of those are illegal.
43:56And the cash they've accumulated, £145 billion since privatisation and they've got that because
44:06they seem to have built criminality into their business models.
44:11So they are like an organised crime syndicate and the CEOs and the owners are like crime bosses.
44:21I mean they don't murder people, obviously, they're not assassins.
44:28But me and Peter are sitting here waiting for these crime lords to put things right.
44:36And if we leave them to their own devices, they never will.
44:43They never will.
44:45We've put the things that we own and care about together, we've put them into the hands of financial speculators,
44:54who's job it is, is just to make money.
44:58We need to put the people who care in charge.
45:17So now we are all alive to me and look.
45:31So now what do we do is you check the police department.
45:32I don't know.
46:07I don't know.
46:38I don't know.
47:07I don't know.
47:41I don't know.
48:10I don't know.
48:32I don't know.
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