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00:00You perform marriages for a lot of people.
00:02Yes.
00:03He offered us money for reporting her.
00:07He said, I'll give you money if you go report her to a county clerk.
00:12She had a separate conversation with him.
00:14So he didn't offer you anything?
00:16No.
00:17Okay, sit down.
00:20Not a good witness.
00:21This is Judy Justice.
00:41Jennifer Flores is suing fellow minister, Jean-Claude Bensusson, for defamation and lost wages.
00:50Court come to order.
00:51All rise.
00:55Have a seat, please.
00:57Judge, case 4039, Flores v. Bensusson.
01:01Okay.
01:03Now, you both somehow became marriage officiants, and each of you claim that the other slandered them in your professions.
01:13How did you become someone who could perform marriages?
01:17I was working for an attorney, and we would get a lot of clients that were seeking to get married
01:25in county jail.
01:26But they just didn't have services like that, so we didn't know where to refer them to.
01:31So at that time, my cousin had gotten married in county jail, and she had an experience, and she was
01:39like, well, you should get a certificate.
01:40It's only a little certificate.
01:41And I'm already, I go inside the county jails to serve people.
01:45Just a second.
01:46So you became a marriage officiant by getting a certificate.
01:50Yes.
01:50Do you have to pay money for it?
01:52Yes.
01:52How much?
01:53$47.
01:54And you do that now as, I assume, a side hustle?
01:58Yes.
01:59How much do you charge to perform weddings?
02:02If they have ID, $475.
02:05If they don't have ID, it's $600.
02:07What kind of ID do they need, and what would be the difference?
02:10Any government-issued ID.
02:11So in California, there's only certain clerks that will issue a marriage license with the inmate not having specific identification.
02:20Well, if they don't have identification and they can't get a license, how do you marry them?
02:25There's another clerk recorders.
02:27There's two in the state of California that, as of right now, issue them with just the inability to appear.
02:32And that's where we go.
02:34It's about one is three hours away from where I'm at.
02:37The other one's almost five.
02:38I don't understand that.
02:39So there's a form that's called the inability to appear.
02:42You can only get that for two reasons, incarceration and hospitalization.
02:46That verifies through a notary.
02:48I'm also a notary, but I don't do these notaries.
02:51So when my notary goes inside to get that form, she's verifying that that is that person and no one
02:57else.
02:58So there's two clerks in California that will issue it just with the inability to appear.
03:02All the other clerks want the inability to appear, plus the ID and birth certificate and the inability to appear.
03:08So it's a little more trouble to get it without an ID.
03:11Yes.
03:12Okay.
03:12Now, sir, how did you get to be a marriage officiant?
03:16It was the same as her.
03:17Same.
03:17So you paid $47 and you've been doing it for how long?
03:2125 years.
03:22And you've been doing it since?
03:24January 16, 2022, I got ordained.
03:26Okay.
03:27Now, you say that the plaintiff has been slandering you for years.
03:33Tell me what proof you have of that.
03:36Well, we have Genesis here who can testify what happened at the jail not long ago.
03:41At the jail?
03:42Yes.
03:42Inside the jail.
03:44Okay.
03:47Tell me your name.
03:48Good evening, Your Honor.
03:49My name is Genesis.
03:50How do you know him?
03:51Well, I had hired him to marry me and my husband in jail because I was going to go to
03:58Ms. Flores and I didn't decide to hire her because I wanted a proper ceremony.
04:04And I asked her what was her services.
04:07She told me that she, at the time, she would only have me to sign paperwork and my husband signed
04:13paperwork but separated.
04:15No ceremony.
04:15So I thought that was illegal.
04:17So that's when I hired.
04:19So you called Ms. Flores first.
04:22Yeah.
04:22How did you get their names?
04:24So Ms. Flores, I seen her on social media because I was eager to marry my husband.
04:29And that's when I contacted her and I asked her for her services.
04:32So you saw her on social media.
04:34Yeah.
04:35And in your conversation, your husband is incarcerated.
04:39Yeah.
04:39And she said you each signed paperwork and there's no ceremony that she performs.
04:44Yeah.
04:45Do you remember that conversation?
04:48That's either a yes or a no.
04:50No.
04:51Okay.
04:52Do you ever sign off on marriages where the two parties just sign paperwork?
04:58Your Honor, there's no way to.
04:59Okay.
05:00That's all I want to know.
05:01So then you called him.
05:03Yes.
05:03And you met him where?
05:05Actually, one of the inmates inside got married by him.
05:09So he just passed me on the number to John.
05:14Did the defendant actually perform a ceremony for you?
05:17When?
05:18On what date?
05:18On June 15th, on a Saturday.
05:20And what did he charge you?
05:21He charged me $1,000 only because my husband doesn't have papers.
05:26And we had to travel four hours away to go to a, I guess, to a clerk
05:32where they could approve it.
05:34That's what you were talking about if you don't have ID.
05:36Yes, ma'am.
05:37And did you ever have conversations with Miss Flores about the defendant?
05:43No.
05:44I didn't know nothing about her until when the day of my marriage, me and him had entered
05:50and we were just sitting.
05:51Entered where?
05:51The facility.
05:53And we sat down and while we were waiting for them to call my husband, that's when she
05:59came up to us and started slandering him in front of me and my witness.
06:04What did she say?
06:05She just started telling me that he was a scam and that he does girls dirty and doesn't
06:11do the full service and that she felt bad for me.
06:14You remember that conversation?
06:15Not that conversation, but there was a conversation.
06:18Okay.
06:22Me and my friend, at the time we were like, uh-oh, like, here we go.
06:25Just a second.
06:26So you knew that there was some friction between the two of them?
06:30I had...
06:31That's either a yes or a no.
06:32Yes, I did.
06:33And how did you know that?
06:44Jennifer Flores claims fellow minister Jean-Claude Bensouson owes for defamation and lost wages.
06:52Jean-Claude is countersuing for loss of business, defamation, and plagiarism.
06:58So tell me what you remember of the conversation.
07:01So they were sitting on a bench.
07:03I was there performing five different marriages from, like, weeks before when I got the licenses.
07:07And?
07:08I walked back to go perform a ceremony because they had called the inmate that was going to get married.
07:13Actually, Ryan was sitting there as well with someone else.
07:17Just a second.
07:18Were you there?
07:19Yes.
07:19Go outside.
07:20Go outside now.
07:21Okay.
07:29Okay.
07:29Okay.
07:29We're going to take this step by step.
07:31You went in the back.
07:32You performed a ceremony.
07:34Yes.
07:35And?
07:35So Ryan told me that he was, as soon as I got up, that he started just talking about me,
07:42like, saying that I was fraud, that they were not going to get their marriage licenses.
07:46And I just looked over and I told the young lady, I go, do you guys have a problem with
07:51me?
07:52Because this is something that's been happening constantly and, like, keeps happening.
07:56And he just went off on me.
07:58And she was like, well, I think it's kind of messed up that you're slandering him.
08:01I go, how do you know I'm slandering him if I have never said anything to you?
08:04I've never talked to you.
08:05The only person that you would hear that from is him.
08:07And he looked at me.
08:08She was like, well, I go, you probably, in my exact words were, you probably went with him because he
08:12was a little bit cheaper.
08:13She said, no, he charged me $1,000 because he doesn't have papers.
08:18I turned around as a minister.
08:19I turned around and said, Jean, you know that you don't submit any more documents when they don't have papers.
08:24There's nothing more or less that you submit, whether they have immigration status papers or not.
08:29It's clear as day.
08:31Were you having any conversation with her at all?
08:33I'm not the one that initiated.
08:35She turned around and said, you need to stop slandering him.
08:38Just a second.
08:39And what did you say to her?
08:40I turned around and I was like, and I said a cuss word.
08:44I said, what are you talking about?
08:45Because I was already fed up.
08:46Just a second.
08:47You responded to her.
08:48I don't know what you're talking about.
08:50And she said to you.
08:52She said, you need to stop slandering him and saying false stuff about him.
08:58Okay.
08:59And?
09:00And I said, false stuff.
09:01I'm not the one.
09:02I go.
09:02Just a second.
09:03Let's go very slowly.
09:05Make sure.
09:05Because now your witness is going to come in and she hasn't heard all of this.
09:11Yes.
09:11So she's going to tell me her recollection of it.
09:14So let's go very, very slowly.
09:17Why are you blank slandering him?
09:19And you say to her.
09:21I never slandered anybody.
09:22And I go, you probably went with him.
09:24That's when I said, you probably went with him.
09:27Because he's cheaper.
09:28Cheaper.
09:28Then she responded, actually, no.
09:31He charged me over $1,000.
09:34That's when I turned around and I was not even engaging with her no more at all.
09:37And I turned around and I told Jean, I said, me and you both know that you shouldn't have
09:44charged her anything extra because there's no extra paperwork.
09:48And I go, if you don't.
09:49Why don't you get involved with that?
09:50Because she was the one that was telling me, oh, you didn't want to marry me because
09:53he doesn't have immigration status.
09:56She didn't use the word status.
09:57Or immigration.
09:58She doesn't have immigration.
09:59She doesn't use the word status.
10:00He didn't have ID.
10:01You know, those are fungible terms.
10:04ID, immigration status.
10:06He charged more because he had to travel four hours.
10:09You charge more because you have to travel.
10:12He may charge more than you do.
10:13Yes.
10:14That's not your business.
10:15I still, I'm not understanding why you got into a discussion with her.
10:20I'm still not understanding that.
10:22All right.
10:22Would you bring in her witness, please?
10:36Your last name is?
10:37Burton.
10:38B-U-R-T-O-N.
10:39All right, Ms. Burton.
10:40We are going to fast forward to the time in the county jail.
10:45What were you doing there with her?
10:46I visit my husband as well.
10:48My husband is also incarcerated.
10:49Did you know her from before this incident?
10:53I did know her before this incident because she actually did ordain me.
10:56No, she didn't ordain you.
10:58I mean...
10:58She performed the ceremony.
10:59She performed the ceremony.
11:00I'm sorry, yes.
11:01Okay.
11:01So you were there visiting your husband that day?
11:04Yes, I go every weekend.
11:05And I'd like you to tell me, Ms. Flores got up to perform a wedding.
11:10She came out.
11:11Yes.
11:11I want you to tell me what you heard because you were sitting right there.
11:15So the inmate got called, so she goes with the wife of the inmate and goes back there,
11:20does the ceremony, and then she comes right back out.
11:23So when she came right back out, I did notice that he made, like, he turned his head.
11:28Yes.
11:29And so me and my friend, at the time, we were like, uh-oh, like, you know,
11:33we were bumping elbows because we're like, here we go.
11:35Just a second.
11:36So you knew that there was some friction between the two of them?
11:40I had...
11:41That's either a yes or a no.
11:43Yes, I did.
11:44And how did you know that?
11:45I knew that because prior to this situation, one particular day, a Saturday,
11:50I was coming out from my visit and he was standing outside of the door.
11:54And so I did hear him mention Jennifer.
11:57And I believe it was with a potential witness.
12:00And as he was stating, the best bet is to go with me because there are other officiants here
12:07that do fraud and do scam and will play you out your money.
12:10So I already knew who the other officiants...
12:13Just a second.
12:13Sorry.
12:14He didn't name anybody?
12:15No.
12:16Okay, and that's all you heard?
12:17That's all I heard.
12:18Okay, so now you come out and you see him looking at his eyes like this.
12:22Yeah, he...
12:22Not looking at his eyes.
12:23He officially...
12:24He turned his head.
12:25Turned his head.
12:26Yeah.
12:26And?
12:26And so as he's turning his head, she came and sat right back down with us.
12:31Okay.
12:31So once that happened or whatever the case may be, now he's going in whispering to his witness.
12:37Yes.
12:38As he's whispering to his witness, she turns around and she's like, oh, she looks at Jennifer
12:42and says, you really shouldn't slander him.
12:44Okay, and?
12:45And we all looked at each other like...
12:47Should...
12:47Sorry.
12:48I don't want to hear what you all looked at each other.
12:50Okay.
12:51What did Ms. Flores respond?
12:54Ms. Flores said, how am I slandering him and I don't even know you?
12:59Okay, and you're sure about that?
13:01Positive.
13:01How is he slandering you and I don't even...
13:03I don't even know you.
13:04I don't even know you.
13:05Yes.
13:06And then what was said?
13:07And then the witness went on to saying...
13:10Don't look at me.
13:11The witness went on to saying about how you say he's a fraud, you say he's this, and Jennifer's
13:17reaction was, how can I say anything about him if I don't know you?
13:20I can't tell you something about somebody else if I've never spoken to you.
13:23And then after that, I got called to my visit.
13:26Okay, sit down.
13:27Okay.
13:30Okay.
13:31Now we're going to come to you.
13:35You were with her when he discussed with Leilani in person about what the services were.
13:41Yes.
13:41And?
13:42And he offered us additional money for reporting her.
13:47Oh, just a second.
13:48Well, I want you to tell me exactly what he allegedly said to you.
14:04Jennifer Flores is accusing fellow minister, Jean-Claude Ben-Souzon, of defaming her and
14:11making false reports to the county.
14:13Jean-Claude claims Jennifer plagiarized his website.
14:17Now, the second part of your lawsuit is that she copied your website.
14:26Yes.
14:26Are you saying she copied the services that are on it?
14:29I'll take a look at both.
14:30She copied the content.
14:31Okay.
14:32Verbatim.
14:32I just, just let me see it.
14:35This is, so this is, this is the website.
14:40And then we pull out the content and that's what it is here.
14:52Now, none of this is proprietary information, sir.
14:55It's very straightforward.
14:57You can perform marriages in jail.
14:58She can perform marriages in jail.
15:01She lists the names, the addresses of all the places she can perform marriages.
15:05You list all the names and addresses of the places that you can perform marriages.
15:09There's nothing here that's proprietary.
15:11Listen, is there not enough business for both of you?
15:15There is.
15:16Okay.
15:17So I would suggest that you stop badmouthing each other.
15:20Neither one of you proved really anything other than you're not talking nicely about somebody else.
15:25And neither of you have any proof whatsoever that you lost any business.
15:30I actually did lose money.
15:33He actually had Ashley report me to Orange County clerk recorders while I was placed under investigation.
15:38And I was just cleared September 12th.
15:41Who's Ashley?
15:42That's you.
15:43Step up.
15:47Sorry.
15:48So tell me who you are.
15:50Hi.
15:50So my name is Ashley.
15:52Ashley what?
15:53Garcia.
15:54Okay.
15:54And?
15:56I'm a friend of Leilani's.
15:58Who is Leilani?
15:59Leilani is one of my dearest friends.
16:01He was going to perform a service for her.
16:03She was very nervous about the whole process and wanted to inquire about it.
16:08Did you ever speak to him?
16:10Yes.
16:10When?
16:11June 27th when I went with my friend to go see about her getting potentially married.
16:17She felt like she wanted the moral support.
16:19You were with her when he discussed with Leilani in person about what the services were.
16:24Yes.
16:24Okay.
16:25And?
16:26And he offered us additional money for reporting her.
16:31Just a second.
16:32I want you to tell me exactly what he allegedly said to you.
16:38So he stated that he was willing to give us an extra amount of money and also...
16:45How much was he willing?
16:46About $200 cash.
16:48He was willing to give you $200 cash if you what?
16:52If we reported her to the county as her not performing her services or fraudulently performing her services.
17:01No.
17:02It's not making sense to me.
17:03She went there to inquire about getting married.
17:06Yes.
17:06How did her name even come up?
17:08Her name came up because he spoke about her being another officiant.
17:13No, no.
17:13He would never bring her up as being another officiant.
17:15He would never bring her up.
17:17Why would he bring up a competitor of being another officiant?
17:20He had a potential client who came with a friend to find out about the service.
17:24Mm-hmm.
17:25I don't understand how her name came up.
17:27Your friend is asking about getting married.
17:29And how did her name come up and this alleged bribe that he made to you?
17:37As I mentioned, I just went as a moral supporter to support her there.
17:40I don't care what you went there.
17:41I don't care if you went there as a chia pet.
17:45I don't care.
17:46I want to know what you want me to buy as to how her name came up and he said
17:54to two
17:55perfect strangers, I'll give you money if you go report her to a county clerk.
18:00So, like I mentioned, she was asking about the services.
18:04She had a separate conversation with him.
18:06Were you there when she had this separate conversation?
18:09No, she stepped away.
18:10Shh.
18:10So she...
18:11Okay.
18:12Now we're getting somewhere.
18:13Mm-hmm.
18:13So she stepped away with him and then she came back with him or alone?
18:19She came back alone with the offer that he had made her.
18:23She came back alone and he wasn't there.
18:27No.
18:27And so you had a conversation with her.
18:30Yes.
18:30That's hearsay.
18:32So he didn't offer you anything.
18:34No.
18:35Not directly.
18:40Not a good witness for you to bring.
18:42You understand that, Ms. Flores?
18:44I was just because of the story that they both told me about the situation that happened.
18:49She didn't hear anything.
18:50No, but she's the one that called the county clerk to actually report me to the clerk.
18:54Just a second.
18:54That I got suspended.
18:55Well, whether she did that or not, that was on her.
18:58How do I know that that was at his direction?
19:01Maybe it was at her friend's direction.
19:03He didn't tell her to do anything.
19:04Because nobody knew about the suspending only him on the party.
19:07He didn't tell her to do anything.
19:09She first testified that they were together and that he made this offer to both of them.
19:14But that wasn't true.
19:16Do you understand why it's sketchy?
19:17It just didn't make sense to me.
19:19Your case is dismissed.
19:21Yours too, sir.
19:22I suggest you both learn to live with each other.
19:24Do you understand?
19:25I do.
19:26You should both learn to live with each other.
19:28You're in the same business.
19:29It sounds as if you're never going to be for want of product.
19:33There are a lot of ladies who want to marry prison inmates.
19:36For what?
19:37I haven't a clue.
19:39But maybe I'm from another planet or another generation.
19:42I would actually like to marry somebody and could do a dance afterwards, have a spot of
19:48champagne, you know, something, go to a beach somewhere.
19:52When is your husband getting out of jail?
19:55Um, as she's getting, he got picked into life.
19:58Wonderful.
19:59Mazel tov.
20:00We're done.
20:02This court is adjourned.
20:08All the lies that I heard from this plaintiff, it's unbelievable.
20:13I was actually placed under investigation for somebody calling to make a complaint that
20:18I was doing fraud, so they have to put it under investigation.
20:20But I've been cleared of everything already, so I can go back to all of them now.
20:23Because she wants to be the only one to do this kind of business, marrying people incarcerated.
20:29He doesn't like me.
20:30Even on his countersuit, he said, I've been defending him for four years.
20:33But how is that possible if my minister license was since 2022?
20:38I'm not young, so I will not do that forever.
20:41I'm going to marry everybody in county jail.
20:45You know, at the very end where you asked the defendant's witness, oh, well, when is your
20:50husband, you know, she just got married in June, when is he getting out?
20:53She said, oh, it sounded like an oh in a couple of weeks or oh next Thursday.
20:58But instead, it was a, he's actually serving 15 to life.
21:02And for someone who seemed so young and well-spoken and seemed like she had at least partially
21:07her act together, shocking, shocking.
21:11Shocking.
21:12Yes.
21:13Life is a journey.
21:14That it is.
21:15And if at the beginning of the journey, you start off at the wrong foot, sometimes you
21:20can never recover your balance.
21:22Oh, yeah.
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