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Building and Fostering a Culture of Wellbeing In the Workplace
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00:00Good morning everybody. I'm delighted to be here today to talk with you about building and fostering a culture of
00:08workplace well-being.
00:10My name is Nick Taylor. I am the CEO and co-founder of Unmind, and I'm also a clinical psychologist
00:17by background.
00:18I've been deeply passionate about the topic of mental health for a long time.
00:23I have three young children, and what gets me out of bed in the morning is thinking about how can
00:29we as a generation ensure that the next generation,
00:33those children, are not going to grow up in a world with a mental illness crisis, where workplaces are places
00:40that are not safe for people with mental illnesses.
00:44We have a responsibility to change that, and that's why about seven years ago now,
00:50I left the National Health Service, where I was leading health teams in the UK, to co-found Unmind.
00:58Unmind works with some of the world's leading organizations, helping them to transform the culture they have around well-being
01:06and mental health in the workplace.
01:09We believe deeply in science.
01:12We believe that fundamentally, well-being is a scientific topic, and if we want to do this well,
01:18we need a blueprint to follow, and that's why we built the Unmind Blueprint.
01:23It's a scientific approach to well-being in the workplace,
01:27and some of the most innovative and forward-looking companies in the world use this
01:32to design their multi-year strategies around well-being.
01:37Our approach, as I've said, is science-driven, and we really mean that.
01:42We have an in-house science team continuously publishing top-tier randomized control trials
01:48demonstrating the efficacy of our approach and what we do.
01:52What we do is we help an entire organization around the topic of mental health.
01:58That means we engage executives to think about how they need to be leading in workplace mental health.
02:04We educate leaders at scale across global organizations in how to talk about well-being and mental health.
02:11We give access to employees to preventative and reactive tools, meaning they have a complete continuum of health care,
02:19meaning they always get the right care at the right time.
02:22And critically, we also help organizations measure and quantify the impact that mental health has on them as an organization.
02:31I also have the pleasure in my role of hosting a podcast called Lead From Within.
02:36I would invite you all to take a listen.
02:38This is a podcast that focuses on the CHROs, Chief Human Resource Officers,
02:45people leading people policies and organizations.
02:47We've had incredible guests from some of the world's largest organizations
02:51joining and talking about how they are thinking about the future of work.
02:56So why are we talking about well-being?
02:59What is it about well-being that is important?
03:02And what even is well-being?
03:03And one of the things I'm going to talk about today,
03:05in addition to what we should be doing,
03:08I'm actually going to be defining what we're talking about
03:11because too often this gets confused.
03:13Would anybody like to put their hand up and guess or tell me what well-being is?
03:19What do you think well-being is?
03:22Someone has to put their hand up.
03:23Otherwise, it's going to be a very long silence.
03:26Thank you.
03:27Thank you.
03:29Adaptive state of mind.
03:31Sorry.
03:33An active state of mind.
03:34Super.
03:35Thank you very much.
03:36So what well-being is, I really like that actually as a term.
03:42But really what well-being is is actually quite a simple thing.
03:44It's a subjective state.
03:46It's how we're feeling.
03:47There's an amazing man called Lord Richard Layard.
03:51He's in his 90s now and still working.
03:53Just published his latest book.
03:55He's been transformational in the science behind well-being and mental health.
04:00And he defines well-being like this.
04:02Well-being is how you feel about your life.
04:05How satisfied you are.
04:07The thing that really matters is your inner subjective state.
04:10The quality of your life as you experience it.
04:12How happy you are.
04:15So in other words, well-being at a very basic level is how happy we are feeling.
04:21So it's actually quite a basic concept.
04:24And you might say, well, why do we care about this?
04:26We live in a world where there's threat of war, there is war, where there's economic hardship, where there are
04:34health pandemics.
04:36Why is how people are feeling in terms of their happiness so important?
04:42Well, the science is absolutely conclusive here.
04:45It's because we know when people report being happier, they are more productive, less likely to quit or call in
04:52sick.
04:53And happier companies actually have happier customers and earn higher profits.
05:01This piece of research has just been published and it's absolutely groundbreaking because it proves once and for all how
05:09important this is in the workplace.
05:10And what they did, this was a combination of professors from Oxford University and Harvard University.
05:16They researched data from more than 1,600 U.S. companies and more than 15 million employee surveys.
05:27So a really vast data set.
05:29And what they found was that the top 100 happiest companies in the sample outperformed the Dow Jones and S
05:37&P 500 by 20% since 2021.
05:40So they were able to prove conclusively that when employees report feeling happier, in other words, when they have higher
05:48well-being,
05:49the organization performs better.
05:53That is one of the main reasons that businesses need to be focusing on prioritizing this as a strategic priority.
06:01Because basically, when our people thrive, our business thrives.
06:06So it's actually a no-brainer.
06:08But I think if you're in this room, you probably intuitively already believe that.
06:12You probably already believe in well-being.
06:14You probably already understand that it's a really important thing for the future.
06:18But often when we talk about well-being and we talk about how it drives performance, we stop there.
06:24But it's actually incredibly important that we tell people why well-being drives performance.
06:30And again, the science here is really strong.
06:33So we know there's a clear pathway from well-being to performance.
06:38When somebody subjectively feels well, so in other words, they're feeling happy,
06:43we know that they are less likely to leave their jobs.
06:47We know that they are less likely to be absent from their jobs.
06:51We know that they're going to have higher self-regulation.
06:56And that's really important because that helps us achieve our goals.
07:00We know that they're going to enjoy better health.
07:03I'm sure we can all relate to when we are feeling good,
07:07we are better able to control what we eat,
07:11we're better able to stick to our exercise regimes.
07:14When we're feeling sad, it's much easier to start eating badly,
07:18much easier to deprioritize sleep, much easier to eat bad food.
07:22So you can see how self-regulation and better health can come from feeling happy.
07:28We're also going to feel more motivated and be more creative.
07:33And we all know how important creativity is to performance.
07:37These are our ideas.
07:39These are the USP of the human species.
07:42This is critical.
07:43And how happy we feel determines how well we do it.
07:48And finally, we know that we're going to experience more positive relationships.
07:53So subjective well-being, how happy we are, will determine all of those things.
07:59And ultimately, that's what drives individual and organizational performance.
08:06So you might then ask, well, that's great.
08:08I believe that.
08:10Then what are the key things that affect well-being?
08:14What are the key things that people say are important to them in relation to their well-being?
08:19I'd invite you to throw up some suggestions.
08:21What's important to you in relation to your well-being?
08:27You can shout ideas up.
08:30Feeling valued?
08:31I love that.
08:34Feeling centered?
08:36I like that.
08:36Yeah, thank you.
08:38Trust?
08:41Having fun?
08:41This side of the room is super vocal.
08:43You guys have got a...
08:44There's a lot of work to do over here.
08:47Personal time?
08:48Personal time?
08:51Being well-paid?
08:52Being well-paid?
08:52Yeah.
08:53Perfect.
08:54Thank you.
08:55So all of these things are right.
08:57All right?
08:58And actually, when you bottle them down and you look at big sample populations, when we
09:02interview and ask people about this, it falls into these five categories.
09:07The first is mental and physical health.
09:10People's mental and physical health is the main driver of how well they feel.
09:15Then it's relationships at home and at work, and things like trust are obviously critical
09:19there.
09:20It's relationships in the community.
09:22It's our income.
09:24And it's our state of employment.
09:27So those are the main categories that drive how well somebody feels.
09:31And that's, for anyone who works in healthcare, not hugely surprising.
09:35Most healthcare models think about what's called the biopsychosocial model of a human
09:41being.
09:41And what the biopsychosocial model really shows us is that our individual state as a
09:47human being is informed by psychological factors.
09:50It's informed by physical factors.
09:52And it's informed by social factors.
09:55So the biopsychosocial model.
09:57And what's super interesting is how high up that list mental health is.
10:03Our mental health is absolutely critical to how well we feel.
10:09And yet it's a topic that's highly stigmatized and really difficult to think and talk about.
10:15It's also a topic that is very poorly understood, which I'd like to kind of talk about.
10:20Now, if you, if you, let me just get some ideas from you.
10:24When you hear the term mental health, what comes into mind?
10:27There's no right and wrong answers here.
10:29It's not a trick question.
10:31I'm going to start with this side of the room.
10:35Stress.
10:36Less stress.
10:37Yeah.
10:38Being present.
10:41And now this side of the room.
10:48Like asylum, so mental illness.
10:52Yeah.
10:52Yeah.
10:55Sorry.
10:57More conversation, less action.
11:00Feeling respected.
11:03Sorry.
11:04Burnout.
11:06Stress.
11:08Sorry.
11:09Balance.
11:10Great.
11:11I don't need to be up here.
11:12You guys have got this.
11:13This is super.
11:14So, so with mental health, I think it's, it's generally speaking, often when people hear
11:19that term, they actually think about mental ill health, right?
11:22But mental health is a different thing.
11:25Mental health is something that we're born with and we have all of our life until the moment
11:29we die.
11:30So what is mental health?
11:31Well, I'll read you the definition from the World Health Organization.
11:34Mental health is a state of mental well-being that enables people to cope with the stresses
11:40of life, realize their abilities, learn well and work well and contribute to their community.
11:46It is an integral component of health and well-being that underpins our individual and
11:51collective abilities to make decisions, build relationships and share the world we live
11:56in.
11:56Mental health is a basic human right and it is crucial to personal, community and socio-economic
12:03development.
12:04What I love about this definition, and as you'll all notice, it doesn't say the word
12:09stress, anxiety, depression, suicide, schizophrenia, because that's not mental health.
12:14This is mental health.
12:16Mental health is actually a beautiful, wonderful part of our life, which I'll come on to.
12:19But we all know our mental health goes up and down.
12:22We have periods where our mental health is better and worse.
12:26And sometimes our mental health is bad enough that we have a mental illness.
12:33And a mental illness is classified by various different organizations, most famously the
12:41American Psychiatric Association, who published DSM-5, which is a manual of all the mental illnesses
12:46known to science.
12:47And it defines mental illness as, mental illnesses are health conditions involving changes in
12:54emotion, thinking or behavior, or a combination of these.
12:58Mental illnesses can be associated with distress and or problems functioning as social work or
13:04family activities.
13:06So why am I now talking about mental illness when we started out talking about well-being
13:12in the workplace?
13:13Well, it's because mental illness is in a state of crisis around the world.
13:19I'm sure you all know that.
13:20It's hard to go by a single day without there being a terrifying story in the news about the
13:26prevalence of mental illness.
13:28The World Health Organization estimates that 12 billion working days are lost every year
13:33to depression and anxiety at a cost of one trillion pounds per year and lost productivity.
13:39Between a third and a half of all sick days are due to mental illness.
13:43And at least a third of the population will have a diagnosable mental health problem at
13:47some time in their life.
13:49In fact, mental illness is the leading cause of absenteeism, presenteeism, which is turning
13:56up to work and not really being there, and staff turnover.
13:59So the cost of mental illness on an organization is vast.
14:07And what's critical with our mental health and with mental ill health is receiving the
14:14right care at the right time, because that's what gets the right health outcomes.
14:18That's what leads to our personal well-being.
14:21I can tell you as a clinical psychologist, I have never met anyone at the right time for
14:28therapy.
14:28I've only ever sat down with them and thought, I wish I'd met you six months, 12 months, 18
14:35months, 24 months, 36 months before when the problem began.
14:39Because had I met you then, I could have helped you.
14:42I could have helped you not go through what you've been through, and I could have helped
14:45you be better sooner.
14:47But you don't go to bed on Monday night with no symptoms of depression and wake up on Tuesday
14:53morning with clinical depression.
14:54It doesn't work like that.
14:56It happens over time.
14:58And our mental health can change based on what's going on in that bio-psycho-social model of
15:04our life.
15:05And a really helpful way of thinking about where our mental health can sit is called the dual
15:10continuum of mental health.
15:11This is a model that is used by, for example, the Canadian healthcare system to drive their
15:17mental health programs.
15:19And what it speaks to is the fact there are two continuums.
15:21You can have mental illness to no mental illness.
15:24And then you can have low mental well-being to high mental well-being.
15:27That gives you four quadrants.
15:29If you have a mental illness and low mental well-being, you can be really struggling.
15:34If you have a mental illness but high mental well-being, you have a mental illness but you generally feel
15:39quite happy, you can actually be symptomatic but content.
15:42And that's a really important group to highlight.
15:44So one of the degrees I did in psychology, I studied alongside a man who was a father, was happily
15:52married, was doing postgraduate research, and had a diagnosis of schizophrenia.
15:59It's so important that we tell that story in relation to mental illness because otherwise
16:03we end up assuming as soon as you have a mental illness, you can't contribute.
16:06But it's not true.
16:08Then you can have people with low mental well-being but no mental illness.
16:11And during COVID, this group was made famous by Adam Grant and the New York Times who talked
16:17about languishing.
16:18This is a group who are vulnerable.
16:20Their mental health is vulnerable.
16:21And by the way, we are living in an age of multi-crisis.
16:24So this is a risk group.
16:26And then finally, we can have high mental well-being and no mental illness.
16:29And that group is flourishing.
16:31But the distribution across these four quadrants isn't equal.
16:35We actually know that 1% require support for intense mental health needs.
16:4024% require support for moderate mental health needs.
16:43And a whopping 75% need support to help with their well-being, to help move them up with
16:50their well-being.
16:51And what that really is speaking to is that prevention is better than cure.
16:56So when we're talking about well-being, we need to be talking about prevention.
17:01And what's critical here is when we're talking about prevention, we must position the topic
17:06properly.
17:07I'm sure if you go into the streets of Paris or any city in the world and you ask people
17:11about mental health, they very quickly start telling you about mental ill health.
17:16They very quickly paint a picture of crisis.
17:19Can I ask you all just for one second to stand up for me?
17:22For one second.
17:27Now, if you brushed your teeth this morning, can you please sit down?
17:33I like to think that somebody didn't, but you're just too embarrassed to share that.
17:37So if you think about dentistry, it's incredible.
17:41It's like where we're best at prevention.
17:42We're really, really good at prevention in dentistry.
17:45Has anybody ever bought a dental product with a picture of bad teeth?
17:50Never.
17:51I challenge you, if you ever find a picture of a dental product sold with bad teeth, send
17:56it to me, because I would love to see that.
17:59We sell prevention with aspirational images, pictures of perfect teeth.
18:04Even in Britain, where we have a disastrous reputation with dental health, we still sell
18:08it with perfect teeth.
18:10When we sell sunscreen, we sell pictures of people sitting on beaches, having a wonderful
18:16time on holiday.
18:17We don't sell it with pictures of people in hospital with skin cancer.
18:21When we sell sportswear clothes, we sell them majority of the time with pictures of athletes.
18:28In other words, when we sell prevention, we're selling the opportunity.
18:31We're selling the aspiration.
18:33We're selling the potential.
18:35And it's super, super engaging.
18:40There's a really good, if anyone here has seen Mad Men, they might know this story.
18:44But there's a lovely story here about how the history of marketing and cigarettes has
18:50evolved, right?
18:51The reason we sell prevention with aspirational messaging is it engages people.
18:57If you excite people, they're drawn to it.
18:59If you scare people, they move away.
19:01So in the world of cigarettes, once upon a time, believe it or not, we used to sell them
19:06as a kind of health thing.
19:07The dentist would recommend this cigarette for you.
19:11And then the doctors came along and said, turns out, it's not so good for you.
19:16And the cigarette industry had to go away and think again.
19:19So they came up with the Marlboro Man.
19:21They came up with this idea that to smoke is to be cool, right?
19:25And it engaged people.
19:28And then those pesky doctors came along again and said, not so good for you.
19:34You have to sell it and you have to present it in a way that's going to scare people because
19:39it will stop people doing it.
19:41So now around the world, cigarettes are sold with pictures of the consequence of doing it,
19:49right?
19:49So we're scaring people away by giving them scary images.
19:54If we think about how we're talking about mental health in society, 95% of the time,
20:01we're talking about it in relation to problems.
20:05It's like trying to sell a dentist product with a picture of rotting teeth on it.
20:11We're not going to engage people.
20:13If we want people to engage in the topic of mental health,
20:16we need to stop leading with stories of mental ill health.
20:20We need to stop the dominant narrative being depression, anxiety, stress, burnout.
20:26And we need to switch it and say to people,
20:28actually, the reason you should care about mental health is that it's profoundly wonderful.
20:34The reason you should invest in your mental health is it is the most beautiful thing about
20:40being a human being.
20:41And by doing so, you can reach your full potential.
20:45So when we're talking about well-being in the workplace,
20:48when we're talking about how corporates and organizations in the future of work
20:52need to be talking about mental health,
20:54they need to lead with that message.
20:57Because that will engage people.
20:59That will excite people.
21:01That will motivate people.
21:03That will break the stigma down and make it easier to talk about.
21:06And this isn't just a marketing piece.
21:09I'm not standing up here saying, screw the science.
21:12Let's market this differently.
21:14I'm saying, let's go back to the science.
21:16Let's remember what it tells us.
21:19And let's tell that story.
21:20The World Health Organization talks about these things.
21:24These are wonderful, wonderful things.
21:27And that is our mental health.
21:29But what's really critical when we think about mental health as well
21:33is that we don't just focus on the individual.
21:37When we think about well-being, we don't just focus on the individual.
21:41We saw that earlier.
21:43When people say what affects their state of well-being,
21:46mental and physical health, relationships.
21:50Relationships are key.
21:52And we are so deeply impressionable by the environment in which we spend time.
21:58Vincent Deary is a psychologist.
22:00Written a beautiful book about why we break.
22:02It's a really wonderful, very inspiring book.
22:06We're so deeply impressionable by the environment.
22:08And I often think about this as being similar to plants.
22:12I'm a very keen gardener.
22:13I don't know if anyone else here is.
22:16But even if you're not, I think you can follow the metaphor.
22:18If you take a seed of a plant and you put that seed in the wrong soil
22:24with the wrong water and with the wrong light,
22:28and you say, grow into a beautiful plant, it can't do it.
22:32It cannot become the plant you want it to become
22:35because it's in the wrong environment.
22:36If you put that seed in the right soil with the right water and the right light,
22:41it can become wonderful.
22:42Human beings are not that different.
22:44If we are in a toxic environment, we cannot succeed.
22:49So when we're thinking about the future of work
22:52and we're thinking about the role of well-being,
22:53we have to think about the environment our employees are in.
22:57And the science backs this up.
22:58We can think about how the approach avoidance theory
23:02impacts on how people engage in their environments.
23:05This is a very basic old theory.
23:07It basically speaks to we're attracted to things that are good and feel good,
23:11and we're moved away from things that feel bad, right?
23:14So when we have a positive emotional culture,
23:16it enables people to come towards that culture
23:19and be part of that culture.
23:22And also we know that when people are in places
23:25where it feels safe to be themselves,
23:27where their relationships are rich and strong,
23:30that they are going to be more creative.
23:32And again, this old theory,
23:33broaden and build theory, backs this up.
23:35The environment we're in switches our brain
23:38into a different mode, making it more creative.
23:42So we know fundamentally that our behavior
23:45will impact on our own well-being,
23:48but also it will impact on other people's well-being.
23:52And other people's behavior will impact on our well-being.
23:56We are intricately connected with one another.
23:59So when we're thinking about well-being,
24:01it's so, so critical that we are also thinking about our relationships.
24:07And when it comes to the future of work,
24:09the most important relationship we need to be talking about
24:13is the manager relationship.
24:15The relationship between the linee and the manager
24:18is absolutely critical.
24:20Some research recently was published
24:22that showed that your manager has a greater impact
24:25on your well-being than your spouse,
24:27which is quite a thought.
24:29We know that for almost 70% of people,
24:32their manager has more impact on their mental health
24:34than their therapist or doctor.
24:36And we know that nearly all employees,
24:39and this is repeated in multiple surveys around the world,
24:41feel their manager should have at least some responsibility
24:44for their well-being.
24:46And finally, research from Gallup
24:48found that managers are the single greatest predictor
24:51of long-term organizational success
24:54and employee well-being.
24:55But when we're getting our managers to talk about mental health,
24:59when we're getting our managers to lead on the topic of well-being,
25:02please don't just teach them to spot signs and symptoms of mental illness.
25:07Let's remind these people about how to build bridges
25:10with the people they're managing,
25:12how to listen effectively,
25:14how to know the person so that we can help them grow.
25:19That relationship can help foster a culture
25:22where well-being is not only prioritized,
25:26but is seen as a strategic priority
25:29for the business to succeed.
25:32I'm going to stop there
25:33and open up for any questions.
25:36But thank you so much for listening.
25:40Thank you so much, Nick.
25:41That was fantastic.
25:42And indeed, thank you also for your questions.
25:44We've got lots of them coming in.
25:46Let's see if we can get them up here on the screen
25:48so that we can start taking them.
25:49I'm going to grab my phone.
25:51What is the view on mental health support,
25:53such as finding romantic love
25:55as a means of achieving a work-life balance
25:57and finding fulfilling, loving relationship outside of work?
26:01What's the view on mental health support,
26:02such as finding romantic love?
26:04Is this one of the things that we can do?
26:06I think one of the...
26:07We talk about relationships.
26:09I think having good relationships is critical.
26:12One of those relationships can be a romantic relationship.
26:15So I think it can have a profound impact
26:17on the well-being of somebody.
26:19Okay.
26:19We're going to go fast with these questions
26:21because we've got lots of them.
26:22Next one.
26:23What emerging technologies do you believe
26:25will have the most significant impact on mental health?
26:27I'm going to add into this, you know, for example,
26:30having information like our heartbeats,
26:32our sleep rates,
26:33all of these biometric health.
26:35Is there some kind of mental health metric
26:38that we can have also through technology to help us?
26:41So I think that the most important thing
26:43that technology can help us do
26:45is deliver the right care at the right time to people.
26:48What we know at the moment
26:50is there is a chronic shortage
26:51of expert health care professionals
26:54to meet the needs of society at large.
26:56So what we need to do is work out
26:58how can we amplify the voice of those professionals
27:01to meet more people in the right moment.
27:03And one of the most exciting things about today's world
27:07is this transition to this new wave of technology.
27:11AI will play a profound role
27:13in the future of mental health care.
27:15It will enable people to have a personalized support system
27:18that is like a coach and like a therapist
27:20and to your point,
27:21that will connect in with your wearable data,
27:24ensuring that it knows you
27:26and can see why you didn't sleep well last night
27:27and I can see your calendar.
27:29Why don't we put a slot in there for you to recover?
27:31You know, so that hyper-personalized health care
27:33as a result of AI is going to be very exciting.
27:35Okay, I'm going to try and merge a few questions together
27:38so that we can go fast on them.
27:39Can you share any upcoming innovations and features
27:42that you're working on at Unmind
27:44and also what you're doing to maybe help organizations?
27:48So we're incredibly excited by AI
27:51and by the impact that can have.
27:53We launched in beta an AI coach
27:55with 60 global clients recently.
27:57It's had tremendous feedback,
27:59incredible engagement.
28:01Our roadmap for how that evolves
28:03to meet people in the moment
28:05in any language,
28:06with any avatar persona,
28:08with expertise from all different disciplines of psychology,
28:12from positive psychology to reactive psychology
28:14is incredibly exciting
28:15and how that integrates into the healthcare ecosystem
28:18employees find themselves in
28:19is going to be very exciting.
28:21I'm going to keep going quickly with these questions.
28:23What about for what is available
28:25for working mothers and new mothers?
28:27Oh, it's super important.
28:29And I would extend that out to working parents as well.
28:32I think that having people policies in businesses
28:36that support people effectively is critical.
28:38One of the tools we built at Unmind
28:40is an AI tool that will scan all the company's people policies
28:44and benchmark them against best practice.
28:46So we can tell an organisation
28:48if its policy around maternity cover,
28:51for example,
28:51or paternity leave is not good enough,
28:54then we will be able to highlight that to them
28:56because supporting parents
28:58as they transition out of work
28:59and whilst they're away from work
29:00and as they transition back into work
29:02is critical
29:03both to their wellbeing and mental health
29:04but also to ensuring they stay with you
29:06as a productive employee over time.
29:08We have 30 seconds left on the clock.
29:10I'm going to ask the last question.
29:11What can we offer to managers
29:13to improve a toxic work environment?
29:16So we need leaders to understand this topic broadly
29:19and to lead effectively.
29:21We need to empower organisations to have the data
29:23so they can quantify the impact mental health has on them.
29:27That helps get the executives buy-in
29:28and that should help dilute some of that toxicity.
29:32And then what we need to do
29:33is educate our leaders and managers
29:35on how to understand wellbeing and lead well
29:37and give them access to tools
29:39so they can learn about it
29:41and get answers to the questions
29:42they have at any given time.
29:44If they find themselves in an environment
29:46that is truly toxic that cannot change,
29:48they should leave and find another job.
29:50Nick, thank you so much
29:51for this awesome masterclass this morning.
29:53Thank you for sharing all of that information.
29:55Thank you to you, our audience, for your questions.
29:57Thank you.
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