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Reaching a Circular Economy Sustainable by Design
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00:00Sous-titrage Société Radio-Canada
00:30Sous-titrage Société Radio-Canada
01:00Sous-titrage Société Radio-Canada
01:04Sous-titrage Société Radio-Canada
01:09Sous-titrage Société Radio-Canada
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03:48Sous-titrage Société Radio-Canada
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04:07Sous-titrage Société Radio-Canada
04:35Sous-titrage Société Radio-Canada
04:37Sous-titrage Société Radio-Canada
04:39Sous-titrage Société Radio-Canada
04:41Sous-titrage Société Radio-Canada
04:42Sous-titrage Société Radio-Canada
04:45Sous-titrage Société Radio-Canada
04:46Sous-titrage Société Radio-Canada
04:49Sous-titrage Société Radio-Canada
04:51Sous-titrage Société Radio-Canada
04:53Sous-titrage Société Radio-Canada
05:07nous mettre tous nos profits dans la lutte contre les changements
05:0980% de ceux qui ont toujours été dans les plantations
05:11les restes vont dans un nombre de fonds
05:13regenerative agriculture, nous avons parlé un peu de ça aujourd'hui
05:16Renewables, nous travaillons avec des activistes
05:19pour financer leur travail aussi
05:20et nous avons aussi créé ce qui s'appelle le World Fund
05:23qui est un climatique VC
05:24donc tous nos ressources sont vraiment dans la lutte contre la lutte contre les changements
05:28donc resonant avec les valeurs
05:30c'est l'une des manières que nous compétons
05:32Mais est-ce que quelqu'un qui est utilisé Google
05:35est-ce que quelqu'un qui a de l'esprit est-ce que quelqu'un qui a de l'esprit
05:39est-ce que c'est ?
05:40Non à tout, non, non, non, absolument
05:42je pense que ce que le consommateur est en train de chercher
05:45c'est plus de choix
05:46quand il se passe à des issues de la lutte contre les changements
05:49comme la lutte contre les changements
05:50dans notre product
05:51en fait, chaque product, chaque business
05:52peut contribuer à ce qui est en train de contribuer à ce que nous avons
05:56en termes de différentes climatiques
05:57et des choses comme ça
05:58que les entreprises en particulier sont obligés à faire
06:00donc chaque company devrait absolument
06:02bien sûr, il faut absolument
06:04qu'il y ait des produits
06:06pour que chaque chose à faire
06:08c'est très important
06:09sur la lutte contre les changements
06:10donc un peu de choses
06:12les entreprises en fait
06:12c'est juste qu'on a cosia
06:14c'est vraiment notre mission
06:16c'est complètement written
06:17sur notre governance structure
06:18and how we operate.
06:20Is that the golden bullet for Fairphone as well?
06:24Is that appealing to values
06:25and making sure that people
06:26who really have climate change at their heart
06:28choose Fairphone?
06:31Yeah, I would say yes, partially.
06:33But then the difference also with the smartphone
06:35is that it's a product that, you know,
06:38you buy it once, you make a choice once
06:41and then hopefully you keep it for years.
06:43So it's actually not so much, you know,
06:46that you make a decision on the go
06:48as maybe with a search engine,
06:49you can make a choice every minute, a different one.
06:51But with a smartphone, we have to convince people,
06:54you know, before they make
06:55and also invest quite a lot of money into a smartphone
06:57and then making a sustainable choice.
07:00Yeah, maybe back markets,
07:02being sustainable, being competitive,
07:05sometimes going to back markets
07:07can of course be a very good choice for the consumer
07:10because it's more affordable.
07:11Is that then the sweet spot of sustainability
07:15and competitiveness?
07:16Yeah, it is actually one of the sweet spots as you say
07:20and actually most of our clients come on the platform
07:24for power of purchase reason, for price reason
07:27because refurbished is 30 to 70% less expensive
07:31than new in the world of let's say smartphones, for example.
07:35So that's actually the main driver
07:37and here we generate a sustainable business model,
07:41you know, out of people's needs for affordable products.
07:45And to me, that's also the beauty of a more circular economy.
07:49You don't have to propose products at a higher price
07:52if you work on expanding their lifespan, you know.
07:56So that's really all about sustainability
07:59and fighting against climate change, that's for sure,
08:02but also has a huge social role
08:05and the power of purchase dimension.
08:08Yeah.
08:08To test their competitiveness,
08:10you as a customer,
08:11have you used any of their services?
08:15So I haven't as a consumer yet.
08:18What I could say on that topic
08:20is that we noticed when the company was created,
08:22when SourceMap was created 10 years ago,
08:24people would come and reach out to us
08:26to discover their supply chain for ESG purposes.
08:29And then obviously the COVID crisis arrived
08:32and there was disruption in the supply chain
08:35and they couldn't produce anymore.
08:36So knowing your supply chain
08:38is actually a good way to stay competitive
08:40because if you can't produce, you have a problem.
08:43And the second thing I would say,
08:44if you engage with your suppliers on ESG matters,
08:48then you actually want them to stay with you.
08:51Otherwise, they would be able to go with another competitors
08:54and then you wouldn't have this supplier anymore.
08:56So having an ESG approach with your suppliers
08:59actually is a strong competitive asset.
09:02So your service is helping other companies
09:04to stay competitive.
09:05That's the pitch.
09:05Absolutely.
09:06Yes.
09:07And keep in mind that you maybe have to buy
09:10or use one of the other services and products.
09:12Exactly.
09:13Perfect.
09:15Maybe, of course, we had a hard winter
09:17with high energy prices here in Europe.
09:19We had the COVID pandemic.
09:22We had general inflation still very high at the moment.
09:27Do you think that a customer at the moment
09:29is really bothered by making the right choice?
09:32Maybe he just wants to make the cheap choice,
09:35the easy choice, the convenient choice.
09:36What is your reply to that concern?
09:39Let's maybe start with you.
09:41Well, what we can measure with back markets
09:44is that there's a strong appetite for consumers
09:47for cheap and green products.
09:49So you're right.
09:50There's a huge price dimension
09:52and it's really important.
09:53but if you propose something that's affordable and green,
09:58people will go for it, you know.
10:00That's why there's a huge challenge
10:03in building a more circular economy
10:05where people that do have sustainable business models,
10:09such as we are,
10:11but also a fair fund that creates funds
10:14that can last very, very long
10:16and are highly refurbishable is critical, you know.
10:22So it's more of a matter, I'd say,
10:26of the whole economy getting into the cycle of circularity
10:31and everyone is going to win from it.
10:34The consumer and companies being able
10:36to generate sustainable business models
10:38with a bit of a political support, I'd say.
10:43Let's get into that later.
10:45The price dynamics, it is mentioned.
10:48Do you feel that as well?
10:50What was the impact of the last hard winter for Fairphone?
10:54Yeah.
10:55No, I recognize that as well.
10:57But actually with Fairphone,
10:59because it is designed to last longer,
11:02you know, people actually,
11:03the total cost of ownership of buying a Fairphone once
11:07is actually not higher, you know, than for other phones,
11:10even though it is a very sustainable product.
11:13So what does that mean?
11:15And in the end, we design and support our products
11:18for more than five years.
11:20And usually people exchange another smartphone brand
11:23every two to three years.
11:24So, you know, by buying a Fairphone,
11:27you can easily replace the battery,
11:29take it out like with any other product,
11:31which is a very costly repair for other brands.
11:34So with only that, actually, you have to, of course,
11:38put down money once, but then for five years,
11:42you don't really have to think about another investment
11:44in a smartphone again.
11:45So it's a smart long-term investment?
11:48It's a smart long-term investment.
11:49And what about convenience?
11:50Can you really, like, pull, well,
11:53can you really convince consumers at this moment,
11:55at this hard moment, to make the right choice,
11:57the green choice?
11:58Well, people's, yes.
12:02The short answer is yes.
12:03I mean, of course, there are people who consider both
12:06and, you know, who consider, yeah,
12:09making a green choice and making an affordable choice.
12:11But we don't really see that Fairphone
12:14is the opposite of that.
12:15It's actually a good combination of it.
12:17Yeah.
12:18Price is maybe less of a concern at search engines,
12:21but what about convenience going always to the same choice
12:25is maybe what is easy for consumers at the moment?
12:29Yeah, I mean, I would just say,
12:30I think there is a sense of climate fatigue in some ways
12:33or rather bad news fatigue.
12:36And I think that that is something that,
12:38even though there's a lot of people
12:39who are incredibly concerned about the environment,
12:41they're also really disappointed at the moment
12:45in terms of what the governments are doing
12:47to kind of respond to this.
12:48So businesses definitely like ours,
12:50like lots of the people who are in the room here,
12:52absolutely are stepping in to fill a bit of a gap here, right?
12:55And despite all odds,
12:56despite a lack of regulation and policy
12:59that's really supporting businesses,
13:01you know, consumers are picking time and time again
13:02greener choices.
13:03We see that with Ecosia.
13:04That being said, in terms of accessibility,
13:08there are structural issues,
13:10which means that it's sometimes harder to pick Ecosia, right?
13:12And actually the digital markets like that the EU
13:14is bringing forward will help with that.
13:16So making sure that we do have the regulations
13:19and policies that underpin consumer choice for green.
13:22Yeah, maybe for the audience,
13:23the Digital Markets Act is a digital competition bill
13:26that the EU is currently rolling out, right?
13:29Yeah, absolutely.
13:30Yeah, yeah, yeah.
13:31What can be the,
13:33well, how can that move the needle, actually?
13:35I mean, there's a lot of different ways
13:37in which the DMA and the digital services at the DSA in Europe
13:41are pretty kind of, you know, huge, actually,
13:45in terms of the competition space.
13:46For Ecosia, I mean, you know,
13:48our main competitor, let's say,
13:50has historically owned 97% of the market.
13:53So it's been very difficult for us
13:55to penetrate the search market,
13:58but we have, and going back to it,
13:59it's been because of the values of people
14:01who are really concerned about climate change.
14:03So the DMA has a,
14:05the EU has a historic opportunity right now
14:07to open up the space
14:08and level the playing field for competitors in search.
14:11And as you know,
14:12the search market is being, you know,
14:14disrupted significantly right now.
14:16It's an exciting time in search with ChatGPT
14:18and a whole load of other things happening.
14:19But we absolutely need to make sure
14:21that the technologies and the space
14:22that exists for consumers to pick different technologies
14:25are oriented towards fixing climate change.
14:28I wanted to come back on something that you said,
14:30the climate fatigue.
14:31Do you experience that when you talk to companies
14:34and when you say like,
14:35let's look at your supply chain,
14:37if it is really all fit for purpose, really okay?
14:40Is there a climate fatigue at the moment
14:42or not at the company level maybe?
14:43No, I think the company are really trying
14:46to understand what's going on.
14:48I think most companies,
14:49they don't yet have all the information
14:51to be able to see what's exactly in the supply chain.
14:56And so, and to come back to the price,
14:59I mean, of course, price is important,
15:01and fat for the consumer.
15:03But like trust is very important.
15:05And in terms of the fatigue, it's the same thing.
15:08If you don't have access to the right data
15:10and to provide the right information,
15:12you can't make decisions for yourself
15:13and you can't actually communicate this to the consumers.
15:16So access to data and trust is fundamental.
15:20Yeah, and maybe if I may another reaction on price,
15:24we have to be at some point realistic.
15:26If we want good quality products that are sustainable
15:29and that are going to last long,
15:31they need to be a bit more expensive
15:33than most of what's done today.
15:36and that's why it's very important
15:38to invest in the circular economy
15:40because you mentioned the car business in the beginning
15:44and that's really the kind of business
15:45that's a good example of a very circular,
15:49very big industry
15:50where 30% of the market is made of new cars
15:54that are rather expensive
15:55and 70% of it is made of second-hand cars
15:59and everyone is okay with purchasing a used car.
16:02No one is shocked, you know,
16:04by going for a used car
16:05and that's what we need to target.
16:07Maybe the new products are going to be a bit more expensive
16:11but if you have a good circularity in the economy,
16:17then the consumer won't suffer from this raise of prices.
16:21But that's a message, of course,
16:22that you have to sell to also, for example, this audience
16:25I see some people on their devices even.
16:29You are telling now them
16:30these new devices will be more expensive maybe
16:33and that's the picture you're making.
16:36Well, at some point they will be
16:38but you are going to purchase second-hand devices
16:42that are as good as the new ones
16:45you have in your hands at the moment.
16:47That's the drill, you know.
16:48So the expansion of the lifespan of those type of products
16:52depends on their sustainability
16:54and their reliability as products.
16:57But once they are sustainable and reliable,
17:00there are different models.
17:01You can purchase one and keep it for very, very, very long time
17:05and as you said,
17:06the total cost of ownership of the product is really low.
17:09but if you don't have the money to purchase a high-priced product,
17:14you also can go for a used one that is as good as a new one.
17:18And that's really the challenge, you know,
17:20in building a more circular economy
17:22is giving all the companies that are investing in those businesses
17:27the means to provide good quality.
17:30and that's the theme of this roundtable
17:33but it's all about eco-design, you know.
17:35If you design here, I'm talking about products
17:38because this is what I know well
17:40but if you design products in the right way
17:43you're going to be able to repair them,
17:46make them last longer,
17:48have very good quality repair
17:50and that's going to be a no-brainer for everyone
17:53to purchase a used, let's say, smartphone, for example.
17:57Yeah, before we went on stage, I was told that Fairphone
18:00was one of the only new products
18:02that was once on back market.
18:04Do you have the feeling that you're sometimes competing
18:07because, of course, you want to sell a product
18:08that really lasts very long
18:10while you want to make a business out of refurbishing
18:14and reselling and reusing certain products?
18:18Is there any competition here?
18:20I would actually not say there's competition
18:23because if, let's say,
18:24the segment of sustainable smartphones
18:26where it's Fairphone
18:28and it's refurbished phones of all kinds,
18:31you know, those are the green choices you have
18:33and so if that as a bigger pile actually grows
18:36then there's just more for everybody.
18:39So we don't see refurbished phones,
18:41you know, as a competition in that sense.
18:43It's really for consumers
18:44who want to make a greener choice,
18:46that's more or less the options they have.
18:48Yeah, so it's rather attacking.
18:50I agree and the fact that Fairphone
18:52is the only new brand we sold on the platform
18:55I think is a good example of it.
18:57Our end game is the extension of the lifespan of products,
19:01you know, and through the course of this
19:03we know we are going to build a sustainable business model.
19:06Don't worry for us,
19:07we are going to deal with it, you know.
19:09What we want is more of a Fairphone,
19:11you know, in the world
19:12and if all the new phones were like Fairphone,
19:15we would be selling other brands,
19:17you know, that are highly repairable
19:19and sourced in a fair way.
19:21So that's really about it.
19:23Let's talk a bit about regulation.
19:24We already spoke a bit about the DMA
19:26so let's leave that for a moment.
19:28I'll come back to you later.
19:30But in Brussels, where I come from,
19:33there are a lot of EU regulations
19:36at the table at the moment.
19:37We have, for example, the due diligence,
19:39which is a rule book
19:41that really will say to companies like,
19:43okay, you will have to check
19:45your whole supply chain better.
19:47We also have the right to repair
19:50that is really giving customers
19:52more access to spare parts
19:54and more opportunities for self-repair.
19:57So there's a lot of things happening.
19:59Are regulators your friend?
20:01Are they going to help you?
20:02Are they going to move the needle?
20:03Let's maybe start with you, Jean-Baptiste,
20:04on the due diligence.
20:05It's very important.
20:06We have to understand
20:07that what's going on at the moment
20:09in Brussels in the Green Deal
20:10for more due diligence.
20:12It will change the whole way of trade
20:15worldwide in the coming 10 years.
20:17A lot of companies at the moment
20:18are a bit scared
20:19because they are thinking,
20:20oh, I'm going to have to go check
20:21each supplier.
20:22How do I do this?
20:24Well, in reality,
20:26there are tools that already exist.
20:28And I guess there's two things
20:29you need to do,
20:30whether it's for due diligence,
20:31whether it's for substantiating
20:33green claims,
20:35whether it's for eco-design.
20:37It's map your supply chain.
20:40Know who your suppliers are,
20:43where they are from,
20:44what their problems are.
20:45And second, trace.
20:47Because if you trace,
20:48you will be able to understand
20:49if there's forced labor,
20:51if there's a risk of deforestation,
20:53if there's fraud.
20:54And you, if you, as a company,
20:56you might be exposed
20:57without knowing
20:58to these problems.
21:00And then,
21:01because you have the right data,
21:02you can report
21:02to your consumer
21:03and build trust.
21:05And if you don't have
21:06this element of trust,
21:08then you have a problem.
21:09Thanks to this regulation,
21:11and there are always problems
21:12with the regulation,
21:13but companies will be able
21:15to do that.
21:16Have you got any thoughts
21:18about that?
21:19Because, of course,
21:19I can imagine that Fairphone
21:20is already roughly doing that,
21:22checking every supplier.
21:23But, again,
21:24for a smartphone,
21:26supply chain must be immense.
21:27How do you do that?
21:28How do you tackle
21:29something like that?
21:31Yeah, actually,
21:31you're right.
21:32The smartphone
21:33is a super complex supply chain,
21:36but that is actually
21:37where Fairphone started.
21:38So, we actually,
21:40Fairphone started
21:40as an awareness campaign
21:41for conflict minerals.
21:44And so, really,
21:45the social responsibility
21:46behind the supply chain
21:48was where we started
21:49roughly 10 years ago.
21:51And mapping out
21:52the supply chains
21:53and really opening that up,
21:55also being very public about it,
21:58because even if companies do that,
22:00I mean, that's step one.
22:02But then, many times,
22:03it's also kept secret, right?
22:05Or then, especially,
22:06if there are things
22:07that maybe you discover
22:08many times
22:09that's not really talked about.
22:11And that was what
22:12we really think
22:13that's exactly
22:13what we need to talk about,
22:15because only if you talk about it,
22:17then you can also, you know,
22:18change it.
22:21Also, on the Brussels table
22:22is the right to repair.
22:24It sounds magical,
22:26but can you explain a bit
22:27what it is to the audience
22:28and maybe to what extent
22:30it will help
22:31the business of back market?
22:32So, yeah,
22:33the right to repair regulation
22:34is going to be very important,
22:36but there's an ecosystem
22:38of regulations
22:39that are being discussed
22:40at the moment in Brussels.
22:42One is right to repair,
22:43and I'd say
22:43the other side of its coin
22:45is eco-design.
22:47And it's two regulations
22:49that are going to lead
22:50to better product repairability.
22:52And as I was saying,
22:53it's really the drill here,
22:55you know,
22:55in extension of the lifespan
22:57of products.
22:58So, what European policymakers
23:01are working on at the moment
23:03is on one side
23:07forcing manufacturers
23:09to be a bit more like Fairphone,
23:11if I may say so.
23:12So, pushing them
23:13into building products
23:15that are sustainable,
23:16that will last long,
23:18and that are highly repairable,
23:20basically.
23:21And on the other side,
23:23making sure consumers
23:24are aware
23:25of the repair possibilities
23:27they have,
23:28know where to go
23:29when they want to get
23:31their product repaired,
23:32and are capable
23:33of accessing
23:34good quality repair
23:35at a cheap price.
23:37That's basically
23:38what is being discussed
23:40at the moment
23:41in Brussels.
23:42On one side,
23:43by creating rules
23:44for when you want
23:46to put a product
23:48on the European market,
23:50so if you want to sell,
23:51let's say,
23:52a smartphone
23:53in Europe
23:54within
23:57three, four years,
23:58you're going to have
23:59to be way more
24:00like Fairphone,
24:01basically.
24:03And on the consumer side,
24:04it will be really about
24:07being empowered
24:08into choosing repair
24:10over replacement,
24:12basically.
24:13And is that going to happen?
24:14Because when the regulation
24:15came out,
24:16there was some mumbling
24:17from civil society groups
24:20that said,
24:20like,
24:20this is not going far enough.
24:22What are your thoughts
24:22at the moment
24:23about the state of play
24:25in Brussels?
24:25Well,
24:26it's in the,
24:27we are in the middle
24:28of discussions
24:29that are very intense,
24:31as you may imagine,
24:33and there's a lot
24:33of counter-lobbying
24:34from, let's say,
24:36the linear economy,
24:37if I may call it this way,
24:39on these files.
24:40So it's hard battles,
24:42you know,
24:43where we are pushing
24:45for as much ambition
24:46as possible
24:47and improvement
24:48of what's been proposed
24:49by the commission,
24:50of course.
24:52So I will read
24:52that it's not good enough.
24:54No,
24:55it's not perfect yet,
24:56but it's still,
25:01you know,
25:02a first step
25:03into building
25:04the grounds
25:06for a more circular economy.
25:08So of course,
25:09we are going to push
25:09for the maximum ambition
25:11possible.
25:12There's a decent possibility
25:15we are going to end up
25:16a bit frustrated,
25:17I have to admit.
25:19But still,
25:20you know,
25:20we are like building
25:22the economy of tomorrow.
25:23Do you have any lessons
25:24to give there?
25:25Because the DMA,
25:26the digital markets,
25:27there was also a massive fight
25:28between all the small companies
25:30and these five big US
25:32big tech companies
25:33that now will be targeted
25:34by this law.
25:35Do you have any lessons
25:35to give about
25:36how to tackle this?
25:37Well, I think keep going.
25:39I mean,
25:39we're not completely there
25:40with the DMA, right?
25:41I think one thing is
25:43the decisions
25:44and the designing
25:45of these regulations,
25:46but another question
25:47is the enforcement.
25:47too, right?
25:48I mean,
25:49so you can have
25:49all these great ideas,
25:50but if they're not enforced,
25:52then who knows
25:53what's going to happen.
25:53And we see,
25:54you know,
25:54now there's the EU
25:56deforestation bill,
25:57which was finalized
25:59earlier this year
25:59and will come into force.
26:00We'll see how well
26:02that's enforced,
26:03for example.
26:03So there's a,
26:04you know,
26:05the race is long, right?
26:06It's a marathon.
26:07It's not a sprint
26:07with some of these things.
26:08Yeah.
26:09So maybe next year
26:10we're back here again
26:11about enforcement
26:12or something like that.
26:13I wanted to,
26:13yeah.
26:14Sorry,
26:15I may say,
26:15there is something also
26:16that you have to keep in mind
26:17is that we're discovering
26:18all this.
26:19And it's very easy
26:20when you see it in Europe
26:21to say we want to go far
26:22and we demand
26:23that we respect it.
26:24But remember that
26:25on the supply chain,
26:26a lot of these people
26:27are sometimes,
26:28companies are small companies
26:29who don't have access
26:30to technology,
26:31who don't have
26:31the same maturity.
26:32and you can't decide
26:33and put the way
26:34on the supply chain
26:35on its own
26:36to bear what we want,
26:38what we think is right.
26:39So it will take time
26:40also because you have
26:41to onboard all the supply chain
26:43with good practices
26:44and that would be done
26:45step by step
26:46with companies,
26:47big brands,
26:48engaging in discussion
26:49with the supply chain.
26:50So yes,
26:51we have to have
26:52a very clear objective,
26:55an ideal,
26:56but we will need
26:58to take in consideration
26:59the reality
26:59and the feasibility
27:00and this will take
27:02five, maybe ten years.
27:04The important is
27:05to have the right direction.
27:06Sorry, I was...
27:07No problem.
27:08I wanted to get back
27:08on something you said,
27:09awareness.
27:10Customers must be aware
27:12that they sometimes
27:12have the rights
27:13to choose more for repair
27:15instead of replacement.
27:17They have other rights as well.
27:18I think that's an important point
27:19about awareness.
27:21Where do you...
27:21What are the touch points
27:23for a company
27:24where the customers
27:24to say like,
27:25you have this opportunity
27:26to go for a more greener choice?
27:29I always thought
27:30that your full title
27:32is the customer journey lead.
27:34When in that customer journey
27:35do you have to tackle,
27:37trickle,
27:38or seduce customers
27:40to make the green choice?
27:42Actually,
27:42along the entire journey.
27:44So it's really that.
27:45I mean,
27:46a lot of people
27:47don't have the awareness
27:48that there are problems
27:49in the smartphone industry,
27:51for example.
27:51Maybe people who
27:52are very much
27:53into sustainability,
27:54they know,
27:55but the general public,
27:56you know,
27:57about electronics
27:58and what are the problems
27:59there is not so well known.
28:01You know,
28:01the food industry
28:03or, you know,
28:04in the fashion industry,
28:05I think that's already
28:06a lot better,
28:07a lot more awareness
28:09about it.
28:10So we actually start there
28:11in our campaigns
28:13and in the topics
28:14we talk about,
28:15the content we create.
28:16We always explain,
28:18you know,
28:18what's behind,
28:19what are the issues,
28:20what are we trying to solve?
28:22and that goes
28:23all the way
28:24until after
28:25somebody actually
28:26then bought a phone
28:27because it's also then,
28:29you know,
28:29you want to reconfirm people
28:30that they did make
28:31the right choice
28:32and you want to show them
28:33that there is an impact
28:34that you made
28:35even with only
28:36that one purchase,
28:37basically.
28:38Yeah.
28:39Is that recognizable,
28:40even reconfirming consumers?
28:42so it's really
28:44from the very start
28:44until when
28:45the cycle starts again
28:47to say?
28:48Yes, it is.
28:49I completely agree
28:50and on our side
28:52what we do
28:53and that's why
28:55we are a marketplace,
28:56you know,
28:56so we are not
28:57the actual refurbishers.
28:58We have refurbishers
28:59we work with
29:00that do sell
29:01on the platform
29:02because we do believe
29:03there's a strong value
29:04in our role
29:06in the value chain
29:07being the advertiser
29:10of refurbishment
29:11and that's a lot
29:12of what we do
29:13we invest
29:14most of our money
29:15into marketing
29:16basically
29:17because
29:17as you may imagine
29:19it's kind of
29:20a David versus Goliath fight
29:21in the world
29:22of electronics
29:24and sustainability
29:25and that's through
29:26the course
29:27of marketing investment
29:28so that's kind of
29:29traditional,
29:30you know,
29:30marketing online,
29:31advertisement,
29:32all that kind of stuff
29:33that you can grow
29:34consumers' awareness
29:35on the existence
29:37of these good quality
29:38used products
29:40that are sold
29:42on our platform
29:43you know
29:43and we are building trust
29:45and you mentioned trust
29:47and that's very,
29:48very,
29:49very important
29:50on the consumer side
29:51as well
29:51and a big part
29:53of what we do
29:54as well
29:54as back market
29:55and that goes
29:56a bit beyond
29:57being a marketplace
29:58but we work a lot
30:00on the quality
30:01of the products
30:02that are sold
30:03on the platform
30:03because we do believe
30:05one of the key pieces
30:06to convince consumers
30:08on our product
30:09is for them
30:09to trust
30:10it's going to function
30:11perfectly,
30:12you know,
30:13and that's a big part
30:14of the solution.
30:14Sorry, I have to cut you off
30:15because we're running short.
30:16Is that recognizable?
30:18Marketing,
30:19fighting that big Goliath
30:20and then trying to
30:22build the trust
30:23with a qualitative product?
30:25I mean,
30:25totally,
30:26absolutely.
30:27It is all about trust
30:28and that equals
30:29transparency as well
30:30so we publish
30:31our financial monthly reports
30:33it's actually
30:34despite everything
30:35it's our highest read
30:37piece of content
30:37every month
30:38which is amazing
30:39so people really care
30:40about this stuff
30:41they want to know
30:41where every single cent went
30:42where the trees
30:43are being planted
30:44and they also want to know
30:46the stories from the field
30:47as well
30:47so we always do
30:49a lot of storytelling
30:49so we're kind of
30:51the opposite
30:51to these larger
30:52big tech companies
30:53because whereas
30:54some of them
30:55might be a bit faceless
30:55it might be a little bit
30:56difficult to understand
30:57who's who
30:57with us
30:58our staff
30:59our partners
31:00the communities
31:00that we work with
31:01are front and centre
31:02in terms of our storytelling
31:03so it's much more
31:05of a personal service
31:06situation
31:07where there is
31:08a lot of trust building
31:09happening.
31:10Yeah.
31:11Rapids
31:11very quick.
31:13This is very important
31:14reporting
31:14the regulation
31:16will ask the companies
31:17to do three things
31:18identify the risk
31:21remediate
31:22and report
31:23on the way
31:24you remediate
31:25to this
31:26the risk you identified
31:27and what you did
31:28to make it better
31:29and this is very important
31:30the reporting
31:31will also be part
31:31of this
31:32and the trust
31:33perfect
31:33I think that's a great
31:34way to wrap up
31:35because indeed
31:36reporting
31:36and maybe coming back
31:38and revisiting
31:39what has been done
31:41is an important one
31:42I want to thank
31:43all my speakers
31:44and I want to thank
31:44you the audience
31:45for engaging
31:47and listening
31:47and hopefully
31:48it was a good
31:49source of inspiration
31:50for getting to
31:51a more sustainable future
31:52thank you all
31:53thank you
31:53thank you
31:54thank you
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