- 1 week ago
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00:00I'm also your shaman, your guide on imagination. So this is the stage, the
00:05next couple of days we're going to be doing a few town hall conversations
00:11about black imagination, speculative design, art and technology, art and AI,
00:18music and AI, community building and activism. We're also going to be talking
00:23about school of thought, black radical education, and then finally what are
00:29practices we could take back home with us as we go through these series of
00:33conversations. Again my name is Rasu Jelani, I'm your host, I am also the
00:39executive director of the Brooklyn Arts Council back in New York City and it's
00:43full circle we have a bunch of activations here and in this Afropunk
00:48activations with a lot of technology activations. The full circle of all of
00:52this is that I'm a long alumni of Afropunk back when it was a block party in
00:58Brooklyn right and with being part of our alumni is a lot of gratitude and
01:06proudness but also I'm really proud to see the level of activations because I
01:12started I started Afropunk's first activation in 2007. The levels of
01:16activation here with robots and an AT&T graphic design and all this stuff is
01:23crazy right so I give thanks. I'm also going to offer people to come and take a
01:27seat because we're gonna have a family conversation. This is a town hall. Y'all
01:31gonna be part of the conversation too. And then I have a guest today right so
01:37what you see in the background is my brother Idris Brewster he has a technology
01:40art and technology company called Kinfolk. Idris come up on the stage brother.
01:45Thank you, thank you, thank you.
01:48So talk a little bit because we have some new folks here. We had a session earlier.
01:52Talk a little bit about what Kinfolk is, the aim, and some of the projects.
01:57So Kinfolk was really born out of the frustration that me and my co-founders
02:02felt around walking around New York City and not seeing ourselves represented in
02:06the monuments, walking around and seeing the archives, seeing not being represented
02:10in schools and so we wanted to create a way to share our history like we usually
02:14do orally but find a way to share with technology and so Kinfolk is an augmented
02:19reality archive of black and brown history and we use speculative imagination, design, and art
02:25creation to create these digital monuments of our past, our present, and our future.
02:30And so a lot of it is really about community building, building these
02:34monuments with community and then finding ways to place them in spaces so that we
02:38can take up more space without having to wait for governments and cultural
02:42institutions to make sure that we're represented through monuments and through
02:45public art. And so that's what Kinfolk is. So thank you for that. So that's a
02:49little bit of the context. We had a whole conversation about that back at 11 o'clock.
02:53New conversation. We're gonna get a little bit controversial here. So everyone here,
03:02are you aware of what's going on with art and AI? Raise your hand if you have heard
03:06about this AI and art generating. All right, cool. So we're gonna talk a little bit
03:12about that specifically, right? Because as people of color, specifically black people,
03:18we're oftentimes in the forefront of culture and creating and generating culture. Then technology
03:25is an extension of that imagination, of that phenomenon, but sometimes we can get lost and
03:30put technology before the phenomenon, right? So what I want to do here is get us back to
03:36the core of what culture is, right? And then what is creativity and that intersection with AI. So Idris, just to kick us off, I'm gonna throw the question your way. What is your thoughts behind
03:48AI and visual art specifically? Is it problematic or is it creative expression? Or is it a little bit of both? Talk to me.
03:57I mean, it's always a little bit of both. I mean, with technology, it's, there's positive aspects, but there's also negative aspects. And with AI, I mean, we'll be able to do things like never before. Like if you go online, it's called DALI. You can type in these different text prompts, like sentences, and then the AI will generate sort of images out of that text. I mean, that's something that we've never been able to do before. You've had to have someone who knows how to design, who knows how to paint, who knows how to, or knows how to code. And it's just so much
04:27to create these things.
04:28Not anybody can go online,
04:29type in Afropunk set up at Essence Fest
04:32and it will create an image
04:34based off of that.
04:35And so that is really democratizing
04:37sort of the ability to create art
04:39and do so really, really fast.
04:41But at the same time,
04:42it's like, what is the,
04:44at the same time,
04:45these models and this AI
04:46is taking all the data
04:48from the internet
04:49and running that through
04:50to create these things.
04:52And so one,
04:53who has given them permission?
04:54It's training this AI
04:56off of my art.
04:57Wait, wait, wait, hold on
04:58because you're about to go down
04:59the rabbit hole.
04:59I'm going down the rabbit hole.
05:00Go down the rabbit hole.
05:01Where are you going with that?
05:02So we're going to pause that.
05:03Pause, pause.
05:03Because when you start talking
05:04about agency data
05:05and all that stuff,
05:06that's IP,
05:07there's a lot there, right?
05:09But let's stick with here
05:10with the idea of workflow, right?
05:12So how many artists
05:13do we have in the room?
05:14Photographers, artists, painters,
05:17graphic designers, or artists?
05:19I see, oh, yeah, shorty,
05:20that's right, okay.
05:21Well, y'all can all be artists now.
05:23I'm going to come over there
05:23in a second.
05:24I want to,
05:24I want to have questions for you.
05:26But the artists, right?
05:27I think about graphic designers.
05:29I think about people
05:29that do landscapes.
05:31A lot of workflow
05:32can be hacked with AI.
05:34So that's a positive.
05:36I got, yeah, I mean,
05:37I like, when creating my art
05:39and sort of like trying
05:40to think about
05:40how to like create
05:42the final piece,
05:43the AI,
05:44just typing things
05:44into the AI generator
05:45can give you many ideas
05:47like never before.
05:48You can start to visualize
05:48things that you're thinking
05:49in your head
05:50before you actually create it.
05:51So that's a good
05:52workflow situation.
05:53All right, great.
05:54So I'm going to go
05:54to this couple in the back
05:55that raised their hand
05:56that said that
05:57they were artists.
05:58So I'm going to talk to you.
06:00Brother, I'm walking over
06:01to you and your baby girl.
06:02I'm assuming that's your baby girl.
06:04You just don't got
06:04no random kid in your lap.
06:06You know,
06:06what I like from you
06:08is your name
06:09and the type of art
06:10you both do
06:10because you look like
06:11you're an artist.
06:11I think you're really
06:12the artist
06:12and he's taking your,
06:13he's taking credit for you.
06:14All right,
06:15so we're going to figure this out.
06:17I'm Clarence.
06:17So I'm a creative director
06:19at an agency,
06:21an advertising agency.
06:23And what's your name?
06:24What kind of art you got?
06:26Hannah.
06:27Anna?
06:28Anna.
06:29What's your art?
06:31Hannah.
06:32Okay.
06:32You are the art.
06:33Got it.
06:34Good answer.
06:35All right.
06:35So creative agency,
06:38we talked about AI.
06:39Are you using AI at all?
06:40Or what are your opinions
06:41in AI and art?
06:43Yeah,
06:43I'm using it for like
06:45writing scripts
06:46and, you know,
06:47getting ideas
06:48and doing quick research.
06:49You know,
06:49it's faster than Google.
06:51And then if you combine
06:53different types of AI platforms,
06:55you can come up
06:55with something really original.
06:57So that's kind of
06:58how I'm using it.
06:59Got it.
07:00And for you,
07:02the output,
07:03talk to me about the output
07:04in comparison
07:06to your previous workflow
07:08on a UNEX.
07:10But talk to me
07:10about the output,
07:11some of the benefits
07:12of it.
07:13I think the benefits
07:14are you get some
07:15quick iterations
07:16and examples
07:17of what you're looking for
07:19to go in the right direction.
07:21So that's the positive.
07:22Right?
07:22You can get it really quick
07:23and get hundreds of visuals
07:25and thousands of scripts
07:26really quickly.
07:28Anna,
07:28what you got to say about that?
07:30Yeah.
07:31All right.
07:32Yes is affirmation,
07:34exclamation point.
07:35Well done.
07:36Right?
07:37Anybody else?
07:37Anybody else have any
07:39concerns,
07:40questions?
07:41Because this is an open dialogue.
07:43It's just not us two
07:43on the stage.
07:45Hi.
07:46One question that I have
07:47about AI
07:49and one of the things
07:50that you were saying
07:51was you're bringing in data
07:52from the internet
07:53and I know you don't want
07:54to go down that rabbit hole.
07:55But the question that I have
07:58is around data integrity
08:00and how there's a lot
08:03of information online
08:05that is stereotypical
08:07black information.
08:10So as we are creating
08:12things in AI
08:13and we're mining
08:14that information
08:15from the internet
08:16but a lot of that information
08:18is stereotypical
08:19black information,
08:21how do we
08:23how do we know
08:24that we're mining
08:24you know like
08:26the right information
08:27so that we are creating
08:29the things that we
08:30really really want
08:31to create?
08:32Oh my name is
08:33Chelly.
08:35Brilliant Chelly.
08:36That's an amazing question.
08:38Now you have permission
08:39to go down a rabbit hole.
08:39I'll go down a rabbit hole.
08:41Well I mean
08:42these AI
08:44models
08:45I'll call them
08:46I mean they don't
08:47they have stereotypical
08:48information.
08:49I mean even before
08:50this whole revolution
08:51if you searched up
08:52on Google
08:53like monkey
08:54black folks would come up
08:55and so there is a gap
08:58in terms of how much
08:59the data that they have
09:01around black folks
09:01and I think that's
09:02because like
09:03we have like
09:04their white folks
09:06have been creating
09:06these AI
09:07have been creating
09:07these data
09:08and so that's why
09:09we need more
09:10black tech companies
09:11black folks
09:12who are gathering
09:13this cultural information
09:15of ourselves
09:15so that we can be
09:17represented in
09:18the proper ways
09:19because if you go
09:20into these AI models
09:21and type in man
09:23you're not going to get
09:25black people
09:26if you type in woman
09:27you're not going to get
09:27black people
09:28and even if you type in
09:30black woman
09:30black man
09:31it's going to be
09:31a stereotypical version
09:32of what that is
09:33you have to be
09:34very descriptive
09:34whereas that's not
09:36really the case
09:37and so
09:37we need as a community
09:39as a people
09:40we need to like
09:40really think about
09:41how are we
09:42gathering our digital data
09:43and how do we
09:45create our own models
09:46so that we can have
09:47our own spaces
09:48to engage with
09:49with black cultural
09:50information and data
09:51but it's a problem
09:52right now
09:53and there's not really
09:54that the solutions
09:55need to be created
09:56so I have some
09:57follow-up questions
09:58for you specifically
09:59recommendations for folks
10:02here who are creatives
10:03who are thinking
10:04about workflow
10:05who are thinking
10:05about you know
10:06not only mining data
10:08but creating art
10:09in this kind of space
10:10but I'm going to
10:11throw it back over
10:12to the crew here
10:13oh you got another
10:14all right
10:14before we come to you
10:16anyone else have
10:17any questions
10:17or response
10:18to what Idris said
10:20or this conversation
10:22the collision of AI
10:23and creativity
10:24I see you right here
10:25sister
10:25walking over here
10:27name and question
10:30or statement
10:31hi I'm Alice Farrell
10:34and my question is
10:35because I used to work
10:36with public radio
10:38for NPR
10:38and I'm just interested
10:40to see how
10:41how is the platform
10:43going to be set up
10:44for people to interact
10:44with this
10:45because only way
10:47you get the information
10:48is when you dive
10:49into black experiences
10:50so you speak about it
10:52at this forum
10:53but when we walk away
10:54from this platform
10:55how do we get involved
10:56great question
10:58Idris hold that question
11:00you got it
11:00yeah I got it
11:01all right cool
11:01one second
11:02and then I'm going to
11:03pile on the questions
11:04I'm going to this brother again
11:05so I think
11:08what I was
11:09what I was
11:10piggybacking off
11:11of what I was saying
11:12about intellectual property
11:14and you know
11:15that point you just made
11:16about when you google
11:17man you know
11:18it's not necessarily
11:19going to be a black man
11:20and woman same thing
11:21I think a lot of it
11:23is you know
11:24the owners of these platforms
11:26right
11:27who are they
11:28right
11:28so that's what we got
11:29to look at
11:29we got to become
11:30the owners of the platform
11:31if we want these
11:32situations to change
11:33so I hear about
11:36ownership and authorship
11:38right
11:39I'm going to come over
11:40there in a second
11:41I got you brother
11:42name
11:43I'm James Farrell
11:45with Montgomery Public Schools
11:47and I teach seventh grade
11:49and we have a lot of kids
11:51that are really into AI
11:54into developing things
11:55with computers
11:56and they always ask
11:59you know
11:59how are we going to get started
12:00how you know
12:01how can things
12:02do they have programs
12:03where they put into the schools
12:04where the kids can
12:06start development
12:07at a young age
12:07just because they're
12:08in the seventh grade
12:09doesn't mean that
12:10they are not capable
12:10of doing great things
12:12and they are
12:12I've seen some of the work
12:13they've done
12:14you know
12:15so
12:16I'm going to hold
12:17the questions for a second
12:18I saw there was someone
12:19over here
12:19I want to give us
12:20an opportunity to respond
12:21right
12:22so we have a question
12:23on how do we get involved
12:24we have a question around
12:26or a statement around
12:27authorship
12:28and ownership
12:29so we have an owner
12:30of an art and tech company
12:31who's doing exactly that
12:33so talk to those two elements
12:35and then the youth
12:37those three elements
12:38in response
12:40well I mean
12:41there's
12:42there's not
12:43I think there
12:44in terms
12:45I'll start with the ownership
12:46I mean
12:46the tech
12:48the ways that we have
12:49to get involved
12:49with AI
12:50and tech in general
12:50I mean like
12:51what do we do
12:51we have Facebook
12:52we have Google
12:53we have Amazon
12:54we have OpenAI
12:56who's run by
12:57all white folks
12:58and so there's
12:59ran by Microsoft
13:00y'all
13:01don't get it twisted
13:01ran by Microsoft
13:02ran by Microsoft
13:03and so the platforms
13:05that we have
13:06they don't care
13:07about black data
13:08they're not
13:08protective of our communities
13:10and so
13:10what we're trying to do
13:11is as an archive
13:12we're gathering
13:13a bunch of
13:14cultural information
13:14working with communities
13:15to digitize our stories
13:17and there's a way
13:19that we can create
13:21a platform
13:21that it's not only
13:22just us
13:23owning
13:23like we have
13:24people owning
13:25their own data
13:26the technology exists
13:28for people to be able
13:29to contribute
13:30to these archives
13:31these models
13:31but also have ownership
13:33and say over what
13:34gets done with those
13:35information
13:36but the platforms
13:37like that aren't
13:38they're not in existence
13:38yet
13:39so in terms of
13:39getting involved
13:40I mean that's
13:41that's a tough
13:42that's a tough question
13:43because there's not
13:44too many routes right now
13:46instead of doing
13:46something on your own
13:47where you can really
13:48bring that to life
13:49and so that's what
13:50we're trying to do
13:51at Kinfolk
13:51is trying to really
13:52make it so that
13:53we're working with
13:54communities to make
13:55this accessible
13:55provide the education
13:56so that like the students
13:58can really get ahead
13:59because these tools
14:00if you master them
14:01you're light years ahead
14:03of a lot of folks
14:04and so
14:05there's a lot of
14:05community building
14:07and work with
14:08the technology
14:08that has to happen
14:09and it's not really
14:11happening at the scale
14:12that it needs to
14:12and so there needs to be
14:13we need to build
14:14a movement
14:15sort of around
14:16black ownership
14:16of data
14:17technology
14:18and creation
14:19and I think AI
14:20is the sort of
14:21is the precipice
14:23and is like the
14:24the reason why
14:26we can all start
14:27to do this
14:27so
14:27indeed
14:28so I'm also
14:29going to respond
14:30how do we get involved
14:32authorship
14:33ownership
14:34and youth
14:35running an arts council
14:37my main operation
14:38is to provide
14:40resources
14:41money
14:41and professional
14:43development
14:43to artists
14:44in my borough
14:44Brooklyn
14:45right
14:46so
14:46one of the things
14:47I'm thinking about
14:48right now
14:49is being the first
14:50arts council
14:51in the nation
14:51that actively funds
14:53emerging technology
14:55as an art form
14:56the reason why
14:57it goes back
14:58to what Idris is saying
14:59is becoming an owner
15:00is becoming a content creator
15:03the thing about
15:04capitalism
15:07it extracts
15:08the thing about capitalism
15:09is going to maximize
15:11and it's going to think about
15:12who's using this
15:14how are they using it
15:15and how can we maximize
15:16profits off of that
15:18for us
15:19what we have to think about
15:20beyond getting involved
15:21is how do we get involved
15:22early
15:23right
15:24how do we get involved
15:25early enough
15:26to become
15:27the authors
15:28of our own stories
15:30because if we're not
15:31the authors
15:32of our own stories
15:33then someone is going to
15:33tell the story for us
15:35and then capitalize
15:36and appropriate
15:36and extract
15:37our stories
15:38so that's number one
15:40number two
15:40I think it's important
15:42to get on top
15:43of these technologies
15:44at a very early state
15:46so we're just not
15:47consumers
15:47right
15:48so think about
15:50I'm old enough
15:51to remember when
15:52web one
15:54right
15:55in the 90s
15:56when everyone
15:56started getting computers
15:57and everyone
15:58started going on
15:59AOL
15:59and Yahoo
16:00or whatever
16:00how many of us
16:02were thinking
16:02about building website
16:03thinking about
16:04creating content
16:05we weren't
16:06right
16:06now everybody
16:07named mama
16:07got a website
16:08right
16:09but we have to
16:10think like that
16:11it's to be ahead
16:12of the curve
16:12and to be that pioneer
16:13so that's one
16:14web two
16:15was social media
16:16how many of us
16:17were creating
16:18social media platforms
16:19did y'all know
16:20the first social media
16:21platform
16:22was Black Planet
16:23how many of y'all
16:25were on Black Planet
16:26back in the days
16:26I was
16:27that was the first
16:28web social media
16:30platform
16:30Black Planet
16:31does not get the
16:32credit for that
16:33yes there was
16:34AOL and AIM
16:35but in terms of
16:36a website
16:36Black Planet
16:37was the first
16:38online community
16:39social media platform
16:41so with that said
16:42is how are we
16:43creating these
16:44platforms
16:44like Kinfolk
16:45that allow us
16:47to tell our own
16:47stories
16:48that allow us
16:49to invest back
16:49in our communities
16:50that allow us
16:51to create content
16:52so we're telling
16:53very dynamic stories
16:54to be involved
16:56in a dynamic way
16:57there was a question
16:58over here
16:58one quick thing
16:59is like
16:59just being like
17:00you know how much
17:01Twitter
17:01you know how much
17:02money we probably
17:03made Twitter
17:03from Black Twitter
17:04the amount of
17:05content
17:05and the amount
17:06of like
17:07creativity
17:07that we've imbued
17:08in that platform
17:09and yet we see
17:10none of that back
17:10and so that's just
17:12another prime example
17:13of how
17:13we are generating
17:14the money
17:15for these large
17:16tech companies
17:16to exist
17:17but we need
17:18to do our own
17:19so we can generate
17:20profits for ourselves
17:21indeed
17:22and that's the route
17:23so there was
17:24someone over here
17:24can you raise your hand
17:25so I can see it
17:26alright I'm walking
17:27over to you
17:27just so the cameras
17:29know
17:29where I'm going
17:30state your name
17:34question or statement
17:35hi my name is
17:38Ane and I
17:38work in tech
17:39in the Bay Area
17:40I don't have a question
17:42I have a response
17:43to something
17:44that was said
17:44a little bit earlier
17:45I think that
17:47it's really important
17:48to have these
17:50conversations
17:50about agency
17:52and ownership
17:54but there's
17:56a bit of a
17:56missing piece
17:57there because
17:58yes agency
17:59and ownership
17:59are very very
18:00important
18:01but they can
18:03seem very daunting
18:04and overwhelming
18:04to people
18:05it's not easy
18:07to just be like
18:07I'm going to be
18:08an entrepreneur
18:08I'm going to start
18:09this tech company
18:10so there's a lot
18:11of other avenues
18:12to get involved
18:12in AI
18:13like for instance
18:14I've worked
18:15at an AI company
18:16for four plus years
18:19and I don't own
18:21the company
18:22I'm in marketing
18:22but being able
18:24to tell those stories
18:25is part of the
18:26conversation
18:26part of changing
18:27that narrative
18:28and in that same vein
18:31like we think about
18:32and people have
18:33mentioned
18:34like you google
18:35something
18:35and there's
18:36very stereotypical
18:37things that you see
18:38about black people
18:39or the diaspora
18:42but when you think
18:44about tech companies
18:45specifically in AI
18:47you have to also
18:47remember that AI
18:48models are trained
18:49on thousands
18:50and thousands
18:51of pieces of data
18:52so you know
18:54if there's more
18:54engineers in the space
18:56if there's more
18:57people who work
18:59in customer success
19:00and doing POCs
19:01like that all
19:03translates into
19:05the validity
19:05of the data
19:06that these different
19:07tech companies
19:08are using
19:08to then have
19:09these outputs
19:10so it's one thing
19:11to see something
19:12in Google
19:12but it's another thing
19:14to you know
19:15be in the spaces
19:17and like be in
19:19the different tech spaces
19:20whether you're a marketer
19:21whether you're an engineer
19:22or a writer
19:24and having influence
19:26that way
19:27thank you for that nuance
19:30response
19:32one second
19:33I want to
19:34I love what
19:35exactly what you're saying
19:36and in my mind
19:38it starts earlier
19:39because you mentioned
19:40the word
19:40engineers
19:41right
19:41so that brings me
19:42back to
19:43education and STEM
19:46so that we're
19:46raising more engineers
19:48so that
19:49to your point
19:50not everybody
19:51you know
19:51can or wants
19:52to be an entrepreneur
19:53you know
19:54there's other ways
19:55to contribute
19:57to that space
19:58and I don't want
19:59to go too deep
20:00with like
20:00you know
20:01school to prison pipeline
20:02and all that stuff
20:02or whatever
20:03you know
20:04but thinking about
20:05all of those things
20:06investing in education
20:08investing in our children
20:09and getting them
20:10involved
20:11early on
20:13so that we're
20:14raising
20:15you know
20:15the next generation
20:16of future thinkers
20:17because the school
20:19systems today
20:20they're
20:21they're not
20:21invested
20:22in our education
20:23at all
20:24and sometimes
20:24we don't have
20:25the resources
20:26to educate our kids
20:27like it's like
20:28few and far between
20:29and we need to
20:30pull that together
20:31as well
20:31so I think
20:32like a community
20:33from the ground up
20:34from education
20:35all the way up
20:36to entrepreneurship
20:37and even
20:38building more
20:39black conglomerates
20:41so that we can
20:42all come together
20:43smaller businesses
20:44could come together
20:44in a bigger conglomerate
20:45like that whole
20:47system needs
20:48to really be in place
20:49for us to really
20:50get ahead of the game
20:51that's exactly right
20:53so that's the reason
20:54why I'm in
20:54doing the work
20:55that I'm doing
20:56because I was
20:58all the way
20:58on the other end
20:59of the spectrum
20:59as a creator
21:00but kept getting
21:01in these obstacles
21:04of systemic issues
21:05so now running
21:06an arts council
21:07allows me
21:08to think about
21:09ahead of the curve
21:10of what are the systems
21:11that we're creating
21:12to allow for that fluidity
21:14to allow for the agency
21:15so the agency
21:16and authorship
21:17right
21:18so I think
21:18with engineers
21:19that's what the authorship is
21:21because you're designing
21:22right
21:22for the engineers
21:23thinking about people
21:24that are putting
21:25content
21:26for Google
21:27to
21:28or the AI
21:29to scrape
21:30that data
21:30is that authorship
21:32I'm talking about
21:32so that's really important
21:34that we're just
21:35not consuming
21:35that we're creating
21:37authoring
21:38and owning
21:38so we have an ecosystem
21:40that's reflected
21:41of us
21:42holistically
21:42not just
21:43blackface
21:44right
21:45so we got to be
21:46very careful
21:47of creating
21:48another system
21:49of blackface
21:50questions over here
21:51any responses
21:51sister
21:53walking on this side
21:54hi
21:56first
21:57your work
21:57is amazing
21:59my question
22:01is around
22:01kind of
22:02the rights
22:03that we have
22:04as black people
22:04over our
22:05intellectual
22:06and creative
22:07property
22:08so
22:08when AI
22:10first started
22:10to like
22:11emerge
22:11I'm like
22:12oh
22:13I kind of
22:14immediately
22:14just had
22:15concerns
22:15like
22:16you know
22:16we kind of
22:18you know
22:18go through
22:19this era
22:19of like
22:20okay
22:20cultural
22:21like
22:22vultures
22:23and
22:23I think
22:24that was
22:25my first
22:25concern
22:25with AI
22:26so I guess
22:27as an artist
22:28what are your
22:30rights
22:31you know
22:31kind of
22:32over your
22:32intellectual
22:33and creative
22:34property
22:34and do you
22:35have concerns
22:36you know
22:37that someone
22:37can kind of
22:38capitalize
22:39off of your
22:40work
22:40so first
22:44I'll speak
22:45to
22:45oh
22:46she left
22:46but
22:47I will
22:48then I'll
22:49start here
22:50and I
22:51think that
22:52I don't
22:54think the
22:54law has
22:55caught up
22:55to AI
22:57and that's
22:57a lot
22:57like the
22:58lawmakers
22:58and governments
22:59are honestly
23:01don't really
23:01know the
23:02inner workings
23:02of how AI
23:03is working
23:03so they
23:04we're sort
23:05of catching
23:05up
23:06AI released
23:07it had already
23:08scraped all
23:08of our
23:09information
23:09and so now
23:10people are
23:11starting to
23:11think about
23:12and building
23:13ways to opt
23:13in
23:14so now
23:14artists can
23:15potentially opt
23:15in
23:16be like
23:16I want
23:16my images
23:17to be trained
23:18on
23:18I don't
23:19want my
23:19images
23:20to be
23:20trained
23:20on
23:20but it's
23:22really
23:22it's sort
23:23of a wild
23:23wild west
23:24in terms
23:24of that
23:25so I have
23:25a lot
23:25of concerns
23:26and when
23:27folks like
23:27Microsoft
23:28are like
23:28firing
23:29their AI
23:30ethics team
23:31while investing
23:33billions and
23:34billions of
23:34dollars in
23:35building AI
23:35that is
23:36definitely a
23:37concern to
23:37me
23:38and I
23:40think we
23:41need to
23:41really start
23:42moving around
23:42what are the
23:42ethics in
23:43this space
23:43and how can
23:44I individually
23:44have control
23:45there needs
23:46to be
23:46transparency
23:47in terms
23:48of how
23:48these AI
23:49systems are
23:49working
23:50what they're
23:50using
23:51and what
23:52is my agency
23:53within that
23:53space
23:53because that's
23:54not clear
23:54it's a whole
23:55black box
23:55and so I think
23:57we need to start
23:57building in that
23:58transparency
23:58which all comes
23:59back to what I was
24:00going to say
24:00to her
24:01is the education
24:02I mean
24:02we need to
24:03educate
24:04we need to
24:04get the folks
24:04working in
24:05this space
24:05and it's
24:06about engineers
24:07but there's
24:08so many other
24:08not everyone
24:09can be an
24:09engineer
24:10like it's
24:11there's so many
24:12other ways
24:13to get involved
24:13in tech
24:13you can be a
24:14product designer
24:15product manager
24:16you can be
24:17a data analyst
24:18that doesn't
24:19code
24:19you can be
24:20a marketer
24:21like there's
24:22so many ways
24:22to get involved
24:23in tech
24:24that you can
24:24have a say
24:25in what's
24:25happening
24:26that we need
24:27to start
24:28building more
24:28inroads
24:28and it can't
24:29just rely
24:30on institutions
24:30like schools
24:31like these
24:32resources need
24:33to be available
24:33need to be
24:34like when I was
24:35building out
24:35Kinfolk
24:36I learned how
24:36to do computer
24:37science
24:37but when I was
24:38trying to build
24:38out the prototypes
24:39I was googling
24:40YouTubing
24:41following those
24:42YouTube tutorials
24:43was a lot of
24:43me parsing
24:43that stuff
24:44together
24:44so we have
24:45all the ability
24:46right now
24:46to make sure
24:47that there's
24:47courses
24:47and information
24:48that's readily
24:49available
24:50and making it
24:51culturally relevant
24:52as well
24:52I was working
24:53at Google
24:53at the education
24:54space
24:54to teach kids
24:55how to
24:56black and brown
24:56kids in New York
24:57how to do
24:57computer science
24:58but it was
24:58through the lens
24:59of art
24:59like making beats
25:00with coding
25:01like creating
25:02community solutions
25:03through design
25:04it's like
25:04how can we
25:05make this tech
25:05like
25:07make people
25:09want to be able
25:09to learn it
25:10because there's
25:11a way that
25:12it's sort of
25:12shown right now
25:13that seems
25:13daunting
25:14hard
25:14and doesn't
25:15relate to me
25:15but if we
25:17start to view
25:17the culture
25:18with the technology
25:18and art
25:20bringing that
25:20into the fold
25:21I think that'll
25:21make a lot
25:22more technologists
25:23than there are
25:23today
25:23you don't need
25:24to be
25:24just a coder
25:25to technologists
25:26to be a technologist
25:27and especially
25:28as AI
25:29starts to develop
25:30like coding
25:31might go obsolete
25:31in like 5 to 10 years
25:33that's the part
25:34right there
25:35we need to start
25:35being able to
25:36think about
25:36how to
25:37conceptually
25:38build these systems
25:39and use
25:39this AI
25:40like coding
25:41is not going
25:41to be
25:42the big
25:43like it's not
25:44going to be
25:44as important
25:45knowing how to
25:47use and work
25:48with these AI
25:48systems is what's
25:49going to be
25:49important
25:50moving forward
25:51so there's a lot
25:52of work to be
25:53done and education
25:54is at the core
25:54of all of it
25:55yes and I think
25:57I'll be remiss
25:58not to mention
25:59this but he
26:00talked about
26:01working with
26:01Google
26:01and training
26:02kids
26:03this brother
26:04got a technology
26:05and art
26:05platform
26:06where he
26:07actually
26:08hired
26:09the person
26:10that hired
26:10him at
26:10Google
26:11right
26:11so
26:12talk about
26:13that
26:13well so I
26:14was
26:14my
26:15mentor
26:16brought me
26:18into Google
26:18to help
26:19teach kids
26:20how to do
26:20computer science
26:21VR, AR
26:22AI
26:23and that was
26:25I left in
26:252018 to start
26:26Kinfolk
26:27and he
26:28has been
26:29working at
26:29Google ever
26:29since
26:30and he
26:30just quit
26:31a month ago
26:33and it's
26:33the most
26:33relieving thing
26:34for him
26:34being out
26:35of that
26:35system
26:35and being
26:36able to
26:36build
26:36on his
26:37own
26:37he built
26:38the AI
26:38tool
26:38a lot
26:38of the
26:39AI
26:39tools
26:39through
26:39the
26:40Google
26:40Creative
26:40Lab
26:41and now
26:42his
26:43being in
26:43that world
26:44and knowing
26:44how that
26:45machine works
26:46he came out
26:47being like
26:47alright
26:47we need to
26:48figure out
26:48how to get
26:49these tools
26:49to the
26:50black community
26:51how do we
26:52use our
26:52data
26:53and have
26:53us be able
26:54to have
26:54control over
26:55that
26:55and create
26:56a cultural
26:57sort of
26:57repository
26:58or archive
26:59that can
27:00fill in
27:00those gaps
27:00that the
27:01AI is not
27:01really
27:02accounting
27:02for
27:02and so
27:02now we're
27:03working
27:03together
27:03to figure
27:04out how
27:04AI can
27:05help our
27:06communities
27:06but also
27:07it has to
27:07be ethical
27:08it has to
27:08be safe
27:08I'm very
27:09critical of
27:09AI
27:10and so
27:11we really
27:11need to
27:11make ways
27:12to figure
27:12out how
27:13this can
27:13work for
27:14us and
27:14not against
27:14us
27:15so I'm
27:15very critical
27:16of AI
27:16as well
27:17brother I see
27:18you sit
27:19and I'll catch
27:20up to you
27:20right one
27:20second
27:21I'm also
27:22critical of
27:22AI
27:22my son
27:24uses AI
27:24my son
27:25is also
27:25an artist
27:26and a
27:27mini
27:27technologist
27:28so he's a
27:28multimedia
27:29artist
27:29that uses
27:30AI
27:30that uses
27:31machine
27:31learning
27:32and creates
27:33art for
27:33YouTube
27:34I don't
27:35understand it
27:35but it's not
27:36about me
27:36because he's
27:37creating the
27:37future
27:37and that's
27:38the part
27:39I'm mentioning
27:39when you're
27:40we're now
27:40in this
27:40web 3
27:41web 3.5
27:43space
27:43right
27:44who's creating
27:46work
27:46who's creating
27:46the platform
27:47for this
27:48we cannot
27:49settle to
27:49just be
27:50consumers
27:51we can't
27:52sit in front
27:53of Instagram
27:53all day
27:54while people
27:55are building
27:55algorithms
27:56that takes
27:57our attention
27:57away from
27:58our growth
27:58right
27:59that takes
28:00our attention
28:00away from
28:01our liberation
28:01that's the
28:02part that
28:02I'm really
28:03trying to
28:03drive in
28:04here
28:04I'm moving
28:04over to
28:05this brother
28:05right here
28:05who has
28:06a question
28:06or comment
28:07just got a
28:09quick question
28:10for you
28:10you've done
28:11a fantastic
28:12job with
28:13your business
28:13can you talk
28:14a little bit
28:14about your
28:15journey
28:15in terms
28:17of financing
28:17your business
28:18from a
28:18startup
28:19to scaling
28:20up
28:20to where
28:21you are
28:21now
28:21yeah so
28:23that's a
28:24great question
28:24I mean
28:24we're a
28:25non-profit
28:25and I think
28:27that was a
28:28part of the
28:29deal for us
28:30we started
28:31building out
28:32prototypes
28:32first
28:32Rasu was
28:33the one
28:33who brought
28:34me into
28:35our first
28:35incubator
28:36or residency
28:37at the
28:37new museum
28:38we were able
28:39to build
28:39out the
28:39idea
28:40to start
28:40seeing how
28:41it could
28:41work
28:42and after
28:43being able
28:43to build
28:43that prototype
28:44a lot of
28:45people go
28:45and sort
28:47of pitch
28:47ideas
28:48without having
28:48the thing
28:49to show
28:49folks
28:50that works
28:50so being
28:51able to do
28:52that
28:52without
28:53just learning
28:54myself
28:54it was able
28:56to show
28:56folks that
28:56this is
28:57something we
28:57can do
28:57and we
28:57can move
28:58forward
28:58and it
28:59started
28:59getting
28:59more
29:00residencies
29:01and that
29:02built into
29:02a few
29:03grants
29:03that we
29:03got
29:04it was
29:04really
29:04two
29:05grants
29:05that
29:05kept
29:05on
29:06giving
29:06every
29:06year
29:07which
29:07we're
29:08really
29:08grateful
29:08for
29:09to be able
29:10to get
29:10us to this
29:10point
29:10we were able
29:11to publicly
29:11release it
29:12in 2021
29:13that was
29:13about five
29:14years
29:14between when
29:15we started
29:15building it
29:16to when we
29:16were able
29:16to release
29:17it to the
29:17public
29:18and the
29:19part of
29:19it is
29:19as a
29:20non-profit
29:20we have
29:21the freedom
29:21to build
29:22this
29:22technology
29:22without having
29:23to generate
29:24a return
29:24and really
29:25think about
29:25the problem
29:26and then
29:29and that
29:30impact
29:31is really
29:31important
29:32as a
29:32for-profit
29:33I mean
29:34we would have
29:35had to
29:35been generating
29:3510x
29:36we're not
29:36generating
29:37returns
29:37generating
29:38money
29:38generating
29:38revenue
29:39that would
29:39have
29:39really
29:40shifted
29:40how we
29:41could build
29:42and who
29:43we were
29:43building
29:43for
29:44so now
29:45we've been
29:45able to raise
29:45a good
29:46amount of
29:46money
29:46to keep
29:46it going
29:47have a team
29:47of like
29:48eight folks
29:48building this
29:49out
29:49but it is
29:50as a
29:51non-profit
29:51and it was
29:52a lot
29:52of grants
29:52I was
29:53writing
29:53grants
29:54but the
29:55lens of
29:55art and
29:56technology
29:56really opens
29:57up a lot
29:58of different
29:59avenues to
29:59go get
30:00funding
30:00and it
30:01was art
30:01technology
30:02and education
30:03and so
30:04we can
30:04really pivot
30:04to each
30:05of those
30:05kinds of
30:06grants
30:06to be able
30:07to apply
30:07for new
30:08sort of
30:08funding
30:09and so
30:10it's really
30:10keeping the
30:10options open
30:11in terms of
30:12the lanes
30:12that you
30:12can work
30:13in
30:13and apply
30:14for
30:15so it's
30:15not really
30:16applicable
30:16to for-profit
30:17but as a
30:18non-profit
30:18that's really
30:19how we've been
30:19able to
30:20sustain ourselves
30:21and I think
30:21it's imperative
30:22for us
30:23when we have
30:23ideas
30:24to know
30:25the difference
30:25of what
30:27runway
30:27our ideas
30:28can actually
30:30grow
30:30right
30:31I run a
30:32non-profit
30:32as well
30:33I tend to
30:34be in
30:34non-profits
30:34a lot
30:35because ethics
30:36mean a lot
30:36to me
30:37and when you
30:37start going
30:38to I'm a
30:38retired
30:39technologist
30:40I left
30:41technology
30:41because the
30:42ethics
30:42was problematic
30:43I felt like
30:44I was working
30:44for the dark
30:45for the siths
30:46right
30:47I still work
30:48in technology
30:48but bringing
30:49the art part
30:50gives me a little
30:51bit of solace
30:51around the work
30:53is meaningful
30:53around culture
30:55the work
30:55is meaningful
30:56and bringing
30:57my people
30:57and seeing
30:57people like
30:58this
30:58this is the
30:59first event
31:00that we've
31:01probably been
31:01to
31:01that most
31:02of the crowd
31:03is black
31:03most of the
31:05events that
31:05we go to
31:06the crowd
31:06is predominantly
31:07white
31:07and they
31:08understand us
31:09they're like
31:09yeah
31:10you know
31:10cool
31:10you know
31:11but they may
31:12not understand
31:12the culture
31:13y'all understand
31:14the culture
31:14but the technology
31:15may be a little
31:16bit of a learning
31:17curve
31:17so my question
31:18to all of you
31:18and I see you
31:19right over there
31:19brothers
31:20I need you
31:20to come a little
31:20closer
31:21so the cameras
31:21can get you
31:21is how many
31:24of y'all
31:25artists
31:25raise your hand
31:26because I have
31:26more people here
31:27if y'all artists
31:28raise your hand
31:28cool
31:30how many of y'all
31:32are technologists
31:33raise your hand
31:33great
31:35how many of y'all
31:36are art and technologists
31:37see that
31:39one brother
31:40this is where
31:42the future is going
31:42the people that are
31:43merging these two
31:45paradoxical
31:46forms of expression
31:47coming together
31:49because in my opinion
31:50that's the charter forward
31:52where the brother
31:53at that raised his hand
31:55there you go
31:56all right
31:58thanks a lot
31:58I appreciate the
32:00brother's
32:00information
32:01your information
32:02I'm not in tech space
32:04but I did have a question
32:06as it relates to
32:07the non-profit
32:08because I've been
32:09grappling with
32:09other entities
32:11whether to go
32:12non-profit
32:12for-profit
32:13and
32:14when you mentioned
32:16getting the grants
32:17and I'm not familiar
32:19with your organization
32:20but do you have
32:21a revenue generating
32:22source
32:23that wants the grants
32:25because grants
32:25you know how they shift
32:26depending on the mood
32:27and the trends
32:28to be able to sustain
32:29what you're doing
32:30whether the grants
32:31coming or not
32:32I mean we're working on it
32:35we're working on it
32:36I think we've been able
32:36to work with museums
32:38and heritage sites
32:39to really create experiences
32:41about black history
32:42that activate
32:43these sites
32:45so that's been
32:45getting generated
32:47revenue from that
32:48as well as
32:49we're trying to work
32:50with schools more
32:51to provide curriculum
32:52around AI
32:53but also history
32:54so that
32:56that can start
32:57to generate some revenue
32:58but I think
32:58as of right now
32:59most of our funding
33:00most of our funding
33:01is through non-profits
33:04so that's something
33:04that we luckily
33:05very privileged
33:06to have the space
33:07to really work out
33:08and consider
33:09but yeah
33:10we haven't been able
33:11to generate that revenue
33:12as of yet
33:13but it's starting
33:15to trickle in this year
33:15so things are starting
33:16to shift for us
33:17especially in terms of
33:18contracts with museums
33:19and heritage sites
33:20so I'm going to answer
33:21that question
33:22but I want to also
33:23unpack a couple of things
33:24we're going to start
33:24to wrap up
33:25and you'll be the last person
33:26right
33:27one
33:28we use a lot of acronyms
33:30that creates
33:31accessibility issues
33:32for people that may not know
33:33what the fuck
33:34we're talking about
33:34so one
33:35AR
33:36augmented reality
33:39so augmented reality
33:40is different from
33:41virtual reality
33:42VR
33:43which is usually
33:44if you're in this space
33:45right here
33:46no
33:48actually those are headphones
33:49but the VR
33:50is when you have
33:51a headset
33:51goggles over your face
33:53that impairs your vision
33:54so it puts you
33:56into another world
33:57it's like wearing
33:57a television
33:58on your face
33:59AR
34:00is different
34:01it's what
34:01Apple is coming out
34:03with those goggles
34:04where you can still
34:05see everything
34:06but then you can
34:07put things
34:08in the space
34:09right
34:10what you're seeing here
34:11with his
34:12with his platform
34:13his platform
34:13is an AR platform
34:14with monuments
34:16putting monuments
34:16in spaces
34:17physical spaces
34:18right
34:18it's also like
34:19face filters
34:20like Instagram filters
34:21exactly
34:22Instagram face
34:22face filters
34:23AR
34:24right
34:24and then you have
34:25AI
34:26we're talking about
34:26artificial intelligence
34:27so I want to make sure
34:28I brought it down
34:29a little bit
34:30not down or up
34:31but just grounded it
34:32so we're just not
34:33I see elders in here
34:34they may be like
34:34what are you talking about
34:35what is AR
34:36VR and all this stuff
34:37it's important that
34:38we actually translate
34:39so we're not
34:40creating another
34:41caste system
34:42of intelligence
34:42sister right here
34:44one second
34:46he's setting up
34:47the camera
34:48that's where
34:49essence.com
34:50and stuff
34:51you know
34:51we gotta make sure
34:52you look cute
34:53at all times
34:56right
34:57and ain't no AR
34:58filter gonna make
34:58you look cute
34:59you gotta be
34:59naturally cute
35:00you know what I mean
35:00at 30 you know
35:01we gotta look cute
35:02yes my name
35:05is Shanice Johnson
35:06I am here
35:08by the grace
35:09of the most high
35:10all praise
35:11to the most high
35:11I did want
35:14to know
35:14if our generation
35:16would learn
35:18to make
35:19vision boards
35:20happen
35:21more often
35:22like Oprah
35:24says that
35:25get into
35:25your vision board
35:26you can see
35:27your path
35:28more clearly
35:29if you vision
35:30your passion
35:31your passion
35:33I mean
35:33put it down
35:35on a big board
35:36put it on your wall
35:37see the vision
35:38and keep it going
35:40some of us don't
35:42some of our generation
35:43and our children
35:44our urban children
35:46don't see
35:47these things
35:48happening
35:48because
35:49they don't
35:50it's in your head
35:51but it's not
35:52it's all jumbled
35:54if we had it
35:56on a vision
35:56where are your thoughts
35:57at with the vision board
35:58did you make
36:00a vision board
36:00did you say
36:01this is what I want
36:02to do
36:02in 2023
36:032020
36:052021
36:06whatever it may be
36:07and you said
36:08I'm gonna go get it
36:09and I think
36:10that has
36:11when you say goals
36:12when you say
36:13your vision
36:13and this is what
36:14I wanted to do
36:15and I went
36:15and done it
36:16and
36:16but some people
36:18need a map
36:18Oprah says
36:20make a vision board
36:21thank you sister
36:24thank you
36:25thank you
36:26that's a great way
36:27to like ground
36:27like bring us
36:28grounded
36:29so
36:30two things
36:31one
36:32this is one
36:33conversation of six
36:34we did two today
36:35this conversation
36:37series is the vision board
36:38right
36:39we're getting out
36:40of our heads
36:41and sharing it
36:41with each other
36:42and bouncing ideas
36:43back and forth
36:44we're experts
36:45in our field
36:46but we're not experts
36:47of your imagination
36:48what I want to do
36:49is try to extract
36:50out of you
36:51parts of your imagination
36:53that can help us
36:54collectively realize
36:55our future
36:55the aim
36:57of these conversations
36:58these town halls
36:59this is the last one
37:00for today
37:00there's two more tomorrow
37:02around AI and music
37:03and community organizing
37:05right
37:05so
37:06as we're visualizing
37:08New Orleans
37:09as a black utopia
37:10right
37:11that's what this is called
37:13blacktopia
37:14right
37:14New Orleans
37:15as a black utopia
37:16what are we bringing
37:17with us
37:18what are we leaving
37:19behind
37:19and how we're
37:20imagining ourselves
37:20moving forward
37:21and what is that
37:22vision board for it
37:23so what these are
37:24this is visionary
37:26exercise
37:27in the form
37:28of a conversation
37:28so to answer
37:30your question
37:30about nonprofit
37:31and generation
37:32profit generation
37:34non-profits
37:35are still
37:36generating revenue
37:37it's one of the
37:38biggest misnomers
37:39I've had multiple
37:41companies
37:41I ran a tech
37:42incubator
37:43inside of a museum
37:44and now I run
37:45a non-profit
37:46arts council
37:47in Brooklyn
37:47I still
37:49have to
37:50get investors
37:51aka foundations
37:53and grants
37:53I still have to
37:55make sure
37:55that my budget
37:56I'm in a deficit
37:58this year
37:58I'm going to try
37:59not to get in a deficit
38:00that I'm staying
38:01in the green
38:01and not in the red
38:02same as
38:03for profits
38:04make sure I'm
38:05looking at
38:05partnerships
38:06to generate
38:07revenue
38:08so it still
38:09operates like
38:10a business
38:11one of the
38:12biggest misnomers
38:12is that
38:13a lot of
38:14why a lot
38:14of black
38:15institutions
38:15don't get
38:16funded properly
38:17besides racism
38:18is that
38:20our structures
38:21and the way
38:21that we think
38:22about running
38:22a non-profit
38:23we have to
38:23think about
38:24it like a
38:24business
38:24right
38:26so going
38:27to foundations
38:28is like
38:28going to
38:28an investor
38:29you got to
38:30pitch your idea
38:31are our values
38:33aligned
38:33great
38:34now let's do it
38:34you still have to
38:35deliver
38:35right
38:36then
38:37it's also
38:38knowing your
38:38landscape
38:39when you have
38:40that vision board
38:41and you lay out
38:42what your idea is
38:43who's in the game
38:44who's doing
38:45what I do
38:46right
38:47can I partner
38:48with them
38:48or are we in
38:49competition
38:49for the same
38:50funding
38:50competition
38:51is the biggest
38:52lie
38:52because there's
38:52a lot of
38:52money out here
38:53right
38:54so we have to
38:55think about
38:55that
38:55then we think
38:56about your
38:57staff
38:57so it's the
38:58same visioning
38:59it's the same
39:00thing
39:00whether it's
39:01for profit
39:01or non-profit
39:02for profit
39:03or non-profit
39:03it's both
39:03part of
39:04capitalism
39:04you still got
39:06to go to
39:06the capitalists
39:07to get the
39:07money to fund
39:08your non-profit
39:08and who do
39:10you think
39:10the foundations
39:11are
39:11slave owners
39:13oil money
39:13same shit
39:15right
39:16so I'm just
39:16keeping it
39:17very basic
39:18it's the same
39:19stuff
39:20we're running
39:21in the same
39:22system
39:22we've been
39:23tricked to think
39:24it's two
39:24different things
39:24it's the same
39:25thing
39:25it just has
39:26a tax
39:26distinction
39:27got it
39:29in that note
39:30peace y'all
39:31have a lovely
39:31day
39:31I love y'all
39:32so tomorrow
39:35we'll be here
39:35with Cavalier
39:36we're going to
39:37talk about AI
39:38and music
39:38and then we'll
39:39be here with
39:40Cavalier who's
39:41here in New
39:41Orleans
39:42and we have
39:43Stephanie McKee
39:44Anderson of
39:44Junebug Productions
39:45talking about
39:46community organizing
39:47solidarity
39:48and economy
39:49and that's about
39:51it
39:51and Idris
39:52thank you for
39:52your time
39:53brother
39:53yes
39:54peace
39:54I'll be here
39:55to that
39:55I'll be here
39:56to that
39:57to that
39:57to that
39:58to that
39:59to that
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