- 1 day ago
Charli Penn talks to Kirk and Tammy Franklin about love and sustaining such a long and loving relationship.
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00:00Hi, everyone, and welcome to the second weekend of Essence Festival of Culture.
00:10I am Charlie Penn, the Relationships and Wellness Director here at Essence,
00:14and I'm elated to be here as we kick off the second installment of Wealth and Power,
00:20which includes dynamic panels and intimate conversations about economic empowerment,
00:25mental health, and of course, my personal favorite, Black love.
00:30We're going to get to the day.
00:31We're going to get going today with our first session, Unbreakable, the Strength of Black Love.
00:36I'm here with one of my favorite couples who's going to talk about the strength and power of Black love
00:41and give us a little insight on how they make it work, even during the most challenging times.
00:46You're going to love them.
00:47You already love them.
00:48Get ready to take notes because gems will be dropped.
00:50Joining us today is gospel music icon, Kirk Franklin, and his beautiful wife, speaker, and mentor, Tammy Franklin.
00:57Hey, guys.
00:58Hey.
01:00What's up?
01:02How you doing?
01:03He's already started.
01:06You two are a blast, and you guys are coming up on your next anniversary will be 25 years, correct?
01:1225, yes.
01:14That's incredible.
01:1525 years.
01:17Aren't those milestones just the best?
01:19Yes.
01:21Tell us a little bit about what it takes as a couple to get to a milestone anniversary,
01:26to make it for the long haul.
01:30It takes lots of buying shoes.
01:33Keep her in shoes, and your life is fine.
01:37It's like God blesses your life.
01:38It takes more than shoes, actually.
01:40A purse, buy a shoe, and a purse.
01:43Every now and then.
01:43And a good heart, and communication.
01:46Yes.
01:47I mean, marriage takes work, and we're getting to 25 years because we have put in the work,
01:55and we continue to put in the work.
01:56I think that we need to let people know that it's work.
02:00It's amazing, but it does take work.
02:03I mean, we are advocates of counseling and good communication and talking things out,
02:10and it hasn't always been easy.
02:12And even now, there are times where it's not easy, but you know.
02:16I love that you're mentioning counseling, too.
02:21And I also think, you know, that for me, everything flows through my faith.
02:30You know, I mean, my faith for me is more than just the music that I do.
02:34It's how I subscribe my entire life to.
02:39And so, as a believer, as a person who defines himself as a follower of Jesus, I understand
02:50that love is more than a feeling.
02:52That love is a commandment.
02:55And so, when the Bible says, love you one another, that's not like an option.
03:00You know what I'm saying?
03:00That's not something, you know, it's not a buffet.
03:03You know, like when we don't love one another, whether it's in relationships or human beings,
03:09then we're not in alignment with God's blessing of our life.
03:14And I think a lot of people always look for love to be an emotion.
03:18But love has to surpass the level of emotion, and it has to be a commandment.
03:25So, it's something that you do even when you don't feel like doing it.
03:29And so, and I think that a lot of people don't make it because when they fall out of love,
03:35they are responding to an emotional response to a decision they've made.
03:43Now, I'm not talking about levels of, you know, a woman's or man's life being, you know,
03:48danger of safety and health or if there's abuse.
03:52I'm not talking about those things.
03:53I'm talking about a lot of people get divorced because they may have had a disagreement.
03:56They may have an argument or they may, you know, feel bored with one another.
04:00And so, that's when the commandment to love has to kick in because when I say I do to her,
04:09I'm saying not only I do to her, but I'm saying I do to her father, you know.
04:14And so, I have to respond and I have to digress to this commitment when I don't feel it.
04:20And then when I am obedient to the commitment, then the feeling catches up.
04:25I think people make feeling the engine, what feeling is supposed to be the caboose and not supposed to be what drives the train.
04:32It's supposed to be what's at the end of the train, commitment, vows, a deeper spiritual authority over our lives.
04:42Those things are the things that drive the engine.
04:44Now, her been fine, that's just a bonus.
04:47When I'm able to see her booty and be able to see the ministry of how God shaped this woman, you know what I'm saying?
04:54That's just something extra that God did for me because he loves me.
05:00You are blessed, Kirk.
05:01And I love that you talk about that because love is an action verb, right?
05:05And that's what we say.
05:07And one of the things I think we all love about you all and your love is that you're clearly a great partner.
05:12You're a great partnership, best friends, right?
05:15Like you are connected.
05:17What does it take to be a good partner?
05:20I think that a man has to humble himself and allow the woman in his life to be everything that God created her to be.
05:31That there is a change agent that exists within the DNA of a woman.
05:37And a lot of times men, they push up against that.
05:42They fight that process because they are not aware of the eternal implications of the benefits of what the DNA of a woman has when it comes to the maturity that she brings into a man's life.
05:59And so a lot of men have to digress and allow this incredible being of what a woman is.
06:10But, you know, I'm the wrong person to ever talk about women because I'm a fan of women.
06:15Like I bow down to them because I was adopted by an incredible older woman.
06:21So I've seen the power of a woman in my life.
06:24And so when I submitted to the change agent inside of Tammy, I began to see God's hand in real time through her life.
06:40Hmm. Change agent in our DNA.
06:43I'm that just set with me.
06:45I received it.
06:46I just came up with that.
06:47That was just on my head.
06:48I received it.
06:50Tammy, I know you did.
06:51I read that online.
06:52Oh, Tammy.
06:53What makes.
06:55Oh, please.
06:55Go ahead.
06:56Please do.
06:58Yeah.
06:58Over these almost 25 years is that we both have evolved.
07:02And if we're the same people that we were at 25, 26 when we got married, then that's a problem.
07:08That means that we're not evolving and we're not growing.
07:10And so I think that the goal is to evolve and grow together.
07:15And, I mean, you hear a lot of people that say we've just grown apart.
07:18And they probably have grown.
07:20But to choose to grow together is the key and the partnership.
07:25And just talking through those changes.
07:27I mean, we've both gone through different phases and seasons in our lives.
07:30And we really work at being proactive to that, too.
07:35Talking to people that we really admire and ask how, you know, we know that we're coming up on this season.
07:41Or, you know, a particular season.
07:42Maybe it's empty nesting or whatever.
07:44And just talking through it, being proactive.
07:46And I think that's really helped us to be great partners.
07:48And I think that when couples do change, that there are times can be the spirit of elitism.
07:56That my change sometimes in couples is like it makes me rise above you or makes me better than you instead of my change.
08:05And it's like, you know, let me take you with me.
08:07You know, let me.
08:10But, you know, there's just a lot of things about us that at times may be different.
08:15Like, Tammy's a homebody, you know, and I like to be out in the streets.
08:19Like, I'm in the streets.
08:22So, you know, you know, and so, you know, I have to find ways to be able to.
08:27It's like, okay, you know what?
08:29Is I like to be out.
08:30And so because I like to be out, let me find ways to entice her, to invite her to be out with me.
08:37Things that she may enjoy.
08:38And I think a lot of times we change and we look down upon the other person in the relationship like, you know, like they ain't at my level.
08:46You know what I'm saying?
08:47You know, like they don't have the receipts that I have now because I'm, you know what I'm saying?
08:52It's like, you know, as I'm, you know, doing big things, I'm coming up and it's like, you know what I'm saying?
08:56You're not about that life.
08:57No, but it's like, no, when you love each other, whatever change that you're exposed to, introduce that person and allow them to change at their pace.
09:06Or if they prefer not to change at the pace or they don't prefer the change that you may be changing to, to still love them for who they are and where they are and let your change inspire them.
09:19Yes, absolutely.
09:20But it's hard to inspire somebody if you're always belittling them if they're not at your pace and if they're not in your race.
09:26I'm on it today.
09:28What is happening to me today?
09:30I don't know.
09:30I told y'all it would be them.
09:32What am I talking to?
09:34I'm sorry.
09:36I love y'all.
09:37And okay, so we also know that love heals and it has been a very challenging time for us as a people, you know, for all of us.
09:46It's just a lot, you know.
09:48So can you both talk a little bit about the magic in marriage with healing and how it can be used as a tool to support each other during these times?
09:58Oh, gosh.
10:00Well, for me personally, especially as you mentioned, then the times that we're facing right now, whether it's the pandemic of the virus or the, you know, the pandemic of racism and injustice.
10:11It's been helpful to have him by my side.
10:16As a wife and a mom, I have different fears that I have for, you know, the men that are most important to me in my life.
10:25And to be able to talk to my husband about that, about my fears, my concerns, and there are times during this process that it honestly has been overwhelming to the point of, I mean, where I just would, you know, retreat into my shell.
10:42And so it took me even to take a step to come to say, hey, I'm struggling or for him to be paying attention enough to see, you know, that I am.
10:52And so it's really been a blessing and, you know, to have that as a healing component.
11:00And, you know, I've even been sharing with some women on my, through my Instagram, whether, you know, I've seen some ladies that say, well, I don't have a partner.
11:08How do I have that, you know, that same, you know, and I just would say just to have a community, whether it's, you know, family or extended family, just making sure you're surrounding yourself during this time with people that can uplift you.
11:22And, and really listen to you.
11:24And I also think that when it comes to people who we know don't have a community, it's also our job to reach out to them as well, that we shouldn't always wait for people, especially in this time that we're in.
11:37A lot of times people that don't have relationships or family, they don't want to feel like they're getting on people's nerves.
11:42So, once again, through my lens of my faith, the text says, ye that are strong, bear the infirmities of the weak.
11:50And so let's don't wait to, to have people reach out for us, that we should be reaching out to the people that we are aware that they're at home by themselves, that they're going through this dual pandemic by themselves to make sure that we're plugging in and that they have somebody to lean on.
12:08That is just the perfect note to end on because that is the strength of black love for all of us.
12:14It's couplehood, it's family, it's all, it's friendship.
12:19It's just, it's beautiful and it sustains us.
12:21And I thank you both for always coming through with the gems and for inspiring us.
12:26Thank you so much.
12:27Can you help me real quick as a sister, when we're talking about black love, because I've been trying to get Tammy to do something and maybe hearing another black woman that is inspired by love, maybe you can help me.
12:38Oh, Tammy, I think I got you.
12:39Let's see.
12:40I've been wanting her to get a tattoo of me and she won't, she won't do it.
12:47It's not going to happen.
12:48Where?
12:49If I dare ask.
12:50Anywhere she won't.
12:51Now, I have some places I won't, but I'm just trying to get her to get a tattoo, maybe like a, you know, maybe like my nickname, you know.
12:59Your face or your name, Kirk?
13:01My nickname.
13:03You want to get bae?
13:05Sweet daddy.
13:05Sweet.
13:06Oh, good Lord.
13:06I have a saying, love it, you know, love is about making sure that you honor their wishes too.
13:16So, you know, if she's not with it, you know, I'll get your wife on that one.
13:24Thank you so much.
13:25Look, if she's not with it, what you going to do?
13:28Happy wife, happy life, Kirk.
13:30You know that?
13:30I know.
13:31You know that.
13:32But I can see my name on something.
13:33You tried it.
13:34You have renamed me.
13:36I wear your last name.
13:38There you go.
13:39Thank you for the interview.
13:41No, but seriously, thank you guys so much.
13:43It's always a pleasure.
13:44I appreciate you guys.
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