- 3 hours ago
The 2025 Short Film Showcase filmmakers sat down with THR's Brande Victorian for a discussion about their films in a THR Q&A powered by Vision Media.
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00:00:00Hello and welcome to THR Presents Short Film Showcase. I'm Brady Victorian and I'm joined
00:00:09today by five early awards favorites. Thank you all so much for being here and let's get started
00:00:15with director Andre Hayoto Saito and actress Melissa Uihara of Amarilla, The Story of the
00:00:20Emotional and Seemingly Invisible Struggles of a Japanese Brazilian Teenager. Thank you both so
00:00:26much for being here with us. Andre, I want to get started with you. Amarilla, it's the third part
00:00:33of your trilogy of short films exploring your Japanese ancestry and you've specifically called
00:00:38this film an open scar of the Japanese Brazilian people living in the country with the largest
00:00:42Japanese community outside of Japan. How did you develop this specific narrative and why the 1998
00:00:50World Cup as the backdrop for this film? Thank you, Brent, for hosting us. I'm here with Melissa
00:00:59Uihara. She is at the English School, right, Melissa? So you're going to practice here with us. So 1998,
00:01:08Brent, when I was 14 years old, the age of the protagonist, it was 1998. And I was a fanatic,
00:01:18soccer fanatic, and I used to use soccer as a tool to belong to the Brazilian identity or what it's called
00:01:33the Brazilian identity, you know. So I was 14 at that period and I was always struggling a lot,
00:01:41feeling like a foreigner outside of my house. And at the same time inside my house as a third
00:01:49Japanese Brazilian generation. I was always denying actually my origins. And I've denied it for more than
00:02:0230 years of my life. So I think this process of investigating my roots and to shoot films about my
00:02:14ancestrality and about my interplace, like two Japanese to be Brazilian, two Brazilian to be Japanese,
00:02:21was a way to express myself, to express my pains, my, you know, living experiences. And I think through
00:02:32Amarela, the third part of the trilogy, I could really make like a yell for representation or yeah,
00:02:43for identity and belonging, which is something that the non belonging feeling is very common for the
00:02:50Asian Brazilian community. And for, of course, many diasporas around the world.
00:02:56Yeah, absolutely. And Melissa, I'm curious for you, what drew you to the role of Erica? And did you feel
00:03:02that kind of personal connection as well that Andre kind of speaks to?
00:03:06Yeah, no, absolutely. I mean, Erica is my first role as an actress. So it's really crazy to actually
00:03:19think that we're, we've came so far, like in this journey. And, um, I, I feel like, uh, first time I saw the
00:03:33script and all, uh, that just made me like, realize, um, how important this kind of representation is,
00:03:42for us Asian Brazilians. And, um, um, it really, I, I feel like it really touched me, uh, in some place that
00:03:52I didn't know was like empty before. So that was something that just, um, made me inspired to try and
00:04:03play Erica, even though I had never done anything like it before. So I'm glad she was 13. And she,
00:04:11and she was, she was 13. When we shot the film, she was 13. And well, she was brilliant, and embodied,
00:04:20I think the, the, uh, a pain of a whole, an entire community. Absolutely. Yes. And that's exactly what I
00:04:30wanted to speak to, you know, for you, Andre, what that, you know, Melissa was right. Even,
00:04:35you know, taking a chance on someone's first film role, which you were incredible in, um,
00:04:39you know, how did you know she could pull this off? It was love at first sight, you know, like
00:04:47director's, uh, intuition. Uh, we tested actually hundreds of girls, uh, and it was very difficult to
00:04:58find. And when I saw Melissa hitting the mochi, you know, and in the audition test, I was really,
00:05:07oh my God, there is so much, uh, emotion contained in this body. And so I could really feel it.
00:05:14So it was intuition and, and this crazy, incredible match that we had like really fast.
00:05:21Yeah. I think it's in the production notes. And you might say Andre where, um, Erica is described
00:05:28as a dormant volcano. Um, and I feel like we see that, especially in that final scene, um, in the
00:05:34kitchen where, you know, the emotion is just being held back and eventually she starts crying. I would
00:05:39love if you could both talk about the process. What did you talk about behind the scenes? You know,
00:05:44how many takes, what are you communicating in that scene? You can, you can tell Melissa first. Okay. I'll be
00:05:52glad to hear. So it was actually a pretty crazy experience. Like, I feel like I've never done anything,
00:06:03um, similar to that before. And, um, to be honest, I think we recorded like probably like more than 15
00:06:14times. Cause, um, we actually had an idea of what the scene should look like at first, but then, uh, we
00:06:24noticed, uh, a single and little detail about the scene that we felt like it was missing. And then we
00:06:32had to record it all again. So it was really crazy. And I remember that I used to like lock myself in a
00:06:41room in the house we were recording in and just like put on my air phone, my, my AirPods, and then just
00:06:49like listen to lots of like sad songs to just try to like get into the, the feeling of the, of my
00:07:00character. So it was, um, really insane. And we also shot the scene in just one take. So it's a really
00:07:10long scene and that was also something really difficult, but it was just amazing. It was, yeah.
00:07:18Yeah. Well, it was an intense choreography and the majority of the, of the crew, uh, was, uh, Asian
00:07:26Brazilians, right? So, uh, it was really beautiful to see each other on the set and, and, and, and seeing like
00:07:37our stories, like being told by us, you know, because we used to, to hear our stories, uh, being told by
00:07:47white people actually. So, uh, it was a really intense day. It was, uh, a day, a day of shooting just for
00:07:54this scene. It's a long take. And it was beautiful that, uh, before lunch, we, we had a shot like seven
00:08:02times and Melissa cried in every shot, you know, it was really beautiful and we were very like touched,
00:08:12you know, by the scene. But when we were to have lunch, I was like, we were not there yet. And I
00:08:19don't know why. When we got back, uh, from lunch, the DOP, a Japanese Brazilian, uh, DOP,
00:08:27Elcio Nagamine, he said, you know what I realized that my mom would kill me if I would do mochi
00:08:37after, uh, you know, getting back from the street and without washing my hands. And then we were like,
00:08:45oh my gosh, we, we miss it. Of course she, she needs to, to wash her hands. And then the, the,
00:08:51the dance and choreography was much better, you know, with this simple detail, uh, who, you know,
00:09:00was perceived in a very subtle thing, uh, from a Japanese Brazilian guy. So it was really beautiful.
00:09:07And when we, uh, finished, um, we called Melissa and we give, uh, gave her a huge applause,
00:09:18telling that it was like a pain for, uh, for, for many generations that she was like, just,
00:09:23you know, releasing. Yeah. And I'm so glad you brought up about the crew because I did want
00:09:29to talk about, you know, everyone predominantly being of a Japanese Brazilian descent. And I'm
00:09:34curious, you know, did they work on the prior two films and, you know, have they spoken to you about
00:09:39what opportunities like your work has created for them, you know, as artists, um, you know, in cinema?
00:09:45Yeah. I think it's a community, uh, that it's like, uh, growing and getting to understand and learn how to
00:09:55work together, you know, like my, my, the first and second short films, uh, one I did in, in,
00:10:02in Japan and the second with my family. So it's always like something that grows very, uh, slow.
00:10:08Yeah. Uh, but at the same time in recent years, Asians, Brazilians are getting the braveness
00:10:18to, to talk about races, uh, towards, uh, yellow Asian, Asian Brazilian people.
00:10:26And, and, and I feel that this community is getting bigger, like, and it's not only film,
00:10:32it's like, you know, art and, and we're, yeah, getting in touch and creating groups and creating
00:10:38immersions and creating, uh, groups of study and research. And we started, we're starting out to
00:10:45talk more and it's been a huge relief, collective, uh, healing and release.
00:10:51Good. Well, lastly, you know, Melissa, I want to know if you are going to continue to pursue,
00:10:58you know, acting after this experience. Um, and then also Andre, I believe Yellow
00:11:02Chrysanthemum will be your next project. And could you talk about that a bit?
00:11:07Melissa, can you talk a little?
00:11:08Yeah, no, um, I absolutely, uh, feel like continue acting. I think this project has changed me, like,
00:11:21for good. And it's really special that, um, I got to, uh, live this experience and it was definitely
00:11:31one of the best in my entire life. So I think, um, I really feel like continue acting and doing, um,
00:11:41this part of me that I didn't know until I got to try it, but it definitely, yeah, I, I would love to.
00:11:54She recently was called by a major Brazilian channel. Well, just a spoiler to, to make an
00:12:00addition and well, that's a good news. And about, and regarding Yellow Chrysanthemum, it's, uh,
00:12:07our feature film actually Amarella was a proof of concept for the feature film, but we weren't
00:12:14expecting that we, you know, the film has traveled more than 35 countries, more than 100 festivals.
00:12:23So it was a huge journey. Uh, so this proof of concept was really, uh, a success. It was,
00:12:32it was, you know, far beyond that we had never imagined. Uh, so, uh, that's like, uh, a slice
00:12:42of what is coming next. And now we have like 50% of the, the, the funds raised and we are, we expect to
00:12:50shoot it, uh, the next year. So fingers crossed. So, so we can see, uh, Melissa in a feature, uh, soon.
00:12:58Yes. And hopefully you'll come back and chat with us. So much. I appreciate your time and
00:13:06congratulations. Thank you so much, Brand and everybody. Take care. And now we are joined by
00:13:13director Gabriel Novice of the film, Alice, about a trans woman who comes into her identity
00:13:18and finds community following the death of her father. Thank you so much for being here with us.
00:13:24I would love to start, um, with how you met Alice and what made you want to tell her story.
00:13:30Of course. Um, I grew up in the same apartment building as her, um, even though we're not friends
00:13:36at young age because she was much younger than me. Um, both of her fathers were really close to each
00:13:42other, uh, which led me to event eventually start getting closer to her father as well. We'll go surfing
00:13:47together on the weekends. So I, I, I grew up really close to her father and I kind of saw her growing
00:13:55up as well. So she's always, she has always been in my life for some reason, which is very interesting.
00:14:01Yeah. And, you know, it was jarring, um, I guess for me as an American to hear the statistic
00:14:06that Brazil kills the most trans people, um, in the world. I'm curious, you know, was Alice hesitant at
00:14:12all, um, to be the subject of a film in this way and what ultimately made them say yes.
00:14:17Yes, of course. It's, it is true. Sadly, it is true. And, um, um, I was just having a two-hour
00:14:25conversation with Alice's close friend, Mia, which happens to also be a trans woman last night about
00:14:30that. Um, and it is every, the thing is every exposition is dangerous because it's a dangerous
00:14:39country to be, but people have to leave. And that's the whole point of the film. We want to
00:14:46make sure that she has normal life like everyone else because she's a normal person like everyone
00:14:50else. So at the same time that, you know, the more exposition, the more people will notice you.
00:14:54Uh, we wanted to have a free life too and do normal things that everyone does. And that's the whole
00:14:58point of the film to really show that people should be who they are and that's okay. So it's,
00:15:05it's, it's, it's, it's an important project. So yes, she, she wanted to be in the film.
00:15:09Okay. And when did you formally start working on it?
00:15:12Of course, I, um, so like I mentioned, I kind of watched her growing up and I was really close
00:15:18to her father. She was much younger than me. And then I moved to California to pursue my career in
00:15:23filmmaking. And then years, years later, probably 15 years later, I came back home in Brazil
00:15:27and I saw her at a bar. She was hanging out with a few mutual friends. I, I believe she was holding
00:15:32a skateboard under her arm. And I was instantly amazed by just her looks and how beautiful she
00:15:38was. She was very stylish and I love fashion. I love people that are creative in certain,
00:15:43in their own way. And I felt that, um, she had something to tell. She had a story to tell.
00:15:48Um, we started a conversation. We started chatting about her life, what went on in the past,
00:15:55like 10 plus years. Um, she opened up about her father and, and I started getting a little bit
00:16:00closer to her, really learning from her understanding more about her life. And that's when the story
00:16:05started to develop. You know, I found out that I wasn't feeling really comfortable being in the water.
00:16:11I started my career, I started my career as a surf film director. I started documenting surfing and
00:16:16surfers. And, and, and, and, and this sport, even though it seems like this peace and love,
00:16:22very loving place, it is not. It's a very sexist environment. Um, it's really, you know, healthy.
00:16:28There's a, we need to change it. So I wanted to bring Alice back to the water. I wanted to bring her
00:16:35back to the water and I wanted to create some sort of safe environment where she could share a little
00:16:40bit of who she is, how beautiful she is, how creative she is, and, uh, her vision on life.
00:16:46I love that you brought up, um, your past, you know, doing the surf directing, because, uh, that
00:16:52scene at the end is so beautiful. And I thought that must have been so hard to capture, but you were
00:16:56already kind of a pro at that, I imagine. But can you talk through that process a bit?
00:17:01Of course. That was my favorite moment in the film, actually just being in the water with her.
00:17:06The ocean has been a special place to me since forever. And I know the ocean, it is a place for
00:17:12healing. So I wanted to bring her back to the ocean where she can find peace and heal from everything
00:17:17that society has been putting on her. So, um, but in my opinion, it was probably the most beautiful and
00:17:23interesting and exciting surfing story I have ever documented. And I've worked with a lot of pro
00:17:28surfers from Olympic gold medals. And, uh, and, uh, I was obsessed with the idea of bringing her back to the
00:17:34water. So I'm glad it worked out. It was a really fun day. We, we got to, you know, to experience a
00:17:39beautiful sunset and, um, yeah, just the most beautiful surfing story we could ever find.
00:17:45Yeah. And to that point, you know, there's such a cinematic feature-like quality to the film. You're
00:17:51almost not sure it's a documentary, you know, as it starts with the reenactments, I mean, the music as
00:17:57well. How did you decide on the presentation and what kind of went into including some of those
00:18:02other elements? Of course, even though it's a documentary, I wanted to break stereotypes.
00:18:08The whole point of the film is that people should not be put in a box. That's what she says. At
00:18:12least she says that at the end, you know, there's a quote by her. And, uh, I want to, I didn't want
00:18:16this to look like one thing, but rather I wanted this to look like everything. I wanted to be free to
00:18:22experiment and then to, and to feel it out. We decided, me and my DP, that we're going to be
00:18:27very experimental and that we're going to try new things. So we wanted, we wanted to experiment
00:18:32with the language on which we're going to tell this story. Um, you know, the aspect ratio of the
00:18:37film changed as she evolves, as she, you know, claims her place on earth, when she says her,
00:18:43you know, really reassuring, referring, hey, I'm Alice and no one's going to take this away from me.
00:18:48The aspect ratio of the film changes almost as if she's inviting us to her world.
00:18:52The camera goes upside down at moments to try to reflect her perspective on that specific
00:18:58situation in her life. When her mother was, um, you know, making her go to the church,
00:19:02which she, which was back then, uh, an environment that had nothing to do with her beliefs.
00:19:08She's, she's, she's, she's open to, to, to, to ideas. She's, she's a creative person.
00:19:13So I wanted to, the film to reflect that. So that's why there's a little bit of everything there.
00:19:18Yeah. And how long did this project take from start to finish?
00:19:23We started talking, um, I think a year prior to shooting. It was very, the place I come from
00:19:30in Brazil, the Northeast, we don't have so much support. This film has been a dream of mine for
00:19:34the past two years until we finally got to the point where we raised some money. We all kind of
00:19:38put money into this and, and, um, we got to a place where we found that we had a little something
00:19:45to share. And then that's when we started shooting. And then obviously after shooting
00:19:49the whole post-production, which took ages because, um, I was really concerned, not concerned,
00:19:55but I really want to make sure that we write a fine tone to tell her story, a tone that will be
00:19:59optimistic, a tone that will share joy and light and, and, and, and really normalize
00:20:06minorities, you know, want people to see Alicia and see another person like anyone else.
00:20:11So we really wanted to make sure that she's seen the right way. She's great. She's beautiful.
00:20:15And if people leave this experience with a very optimistic, hopeful, um, feeling about the world,
00:20:23because, you know, there's a lot of bad things going on right now, and I'm kind of fed up about
00:20:28being sad, honestly.
00:20:31Yeah, same.
00:20:33Tell me, uh, when you showed Alice the finished product, um, and what was her reaction?
00:20:38Yeah, it was very nice. It was a little back and forth because, you know, I think it's, it's,
00:20:43it's a very vulnerable place for her to be, you know, exposing herself and, and especially seeing
00:20:49herself in front of a camera like that. And, um, it must be really hard. I'm not sure if I will be
00:20:54able to do that. So the main thing that I've been learning with this project is empathy. And that
00:21:00takes forever because I will never understand her pain, even though I try, even though I try to like
00:21:05do research and start conversations and talk to other members of the community, um, the trans
00:21:12community, it's, it's, it's hard. I will never understand. So empathy plays a big role in showing
00:21:16a project like this to someone that's so vulnerable on camera, but at the same time, it's a great
00:21:20opportunity for us to highlight trans stories and see diversity on screen. And, and, and we need that.
00:21:26The world needs that, you know, again, we need to normalize that. We need to make sure this is normal,
00:21:30that we need to see more trans trans trans women on the big screen, you know, that's the whole point.
00:21:36So, um, yeah, I think she, we was, she, we had a little back and forth, there's some ideas, but
00:21:42overall she was, she was happy with the final outcome. And I think we got through through a film
00:21:47that works and it's kind of cute. Yeah. And, you know, to the point of, you know, normalizing
00:21:52and representation, what has been the response from the larger film community in Brazil, you know,
00:21:56from audiences who, who you screened it for? Of course, we have been trying to screen a very
00:22:02diverse range of, um, um, audiences. Um, we have obviously started this whole project,
00:22:08this whole premiere film and, uh, at hot dogs in Toronto, which is, you know, very documentary
00:22:13center, um, festival. We won best national shortness. So, uh, we, we qualified for an academy
00:22:19consideration. So, uh, we have been doing, um, the screen, the film during some surfing festivals,
00:22:26and I think we just won like three awards at three different surfing festivals, the biggest ones
00:22:31for best national short. So that was a very good response because I was really nervous about showing
00:22:36this film to the surfing community because, you know, I've, I've seen horrible things as a surfer.
00:22:41I've seen things going wrong, going on around me. I've seen people treating other people badly in the
00:22:47water. So I was really not sure they're going to accept this film and apparently they are,
00:22:52it's touching them somehow. So, so that was kind of my job as a surf film director to communicate with
00:22:58people that have been listening to me for the past 15 years. Yeah. Well, congratulations on a job.
00:23:04Well done. And thank you, um, so much for being here with us and sharing your process.
00:23:09Yes, of course. I'm very grateful for being here as well. Thank you so much.
00:23:13Thank you. Take care.
00:23:14And next we are joined here by director Iros Yao and pianist Bishara Haroni and Yaron Kolberg of the
00:23:21film Amal, which chronicles the collaboration between the Palestinian and Israeli virtuosos.
00:23:27Thank you all so much for being here with us. Um, Iros, I want to start with you. You know,
00:23:32when did you learn of Yaron and Bishara and what made you want to make a film about their story?
00:23:37Um, okay. In 2023, I was involved with the piano restoration project and followed by a concert
00:23:46production by using this, uh, uh, restored historical instrument. Um, so I met Bishara and Yaron through,
00:23:53uh, this concert production. Um, so after I know them personally, I feel like their story is
00:23:59really extraordinary. I mean, something special there, um, with their relationship. So I would like to,
00:24:05uh, take this opportunity to dig deeper into, uh, their story. So I, uh, went to, uh, visit their
00:24:14family, their hometown, just to, you know, try to find more, uh, story about their background. And, uh,
00:24:22instantly I thought, oh, this could be, uh, uh, independent film, um, in a very special perspective.
00:24:29Mm-hmm.
00:24:30And I'm curious for you, uh, Bishara and Yaron, you know, what was your reaction when
00:24:35Eros first threw the idea, you know, of a documentary out there? Was it an immediate
00:24:39yes for you both? Had you been approached by other filmmakers in the past?
00:24:43Well, Yaron, you want to answer?
00:24:45Sure. Um, so, um, yes. So first of all, I mean, it was, uh, thank you for so much for having us.
00:24:52Uh, and, uh, yeah, actually we have been approached by several documentaries. Uh, but, uh, I think that when
00:24:59Eros approached and especially when, uh, we got to meet him in person and actually talk with him,
00:25:04we understood that he has a really, and also I've seen some of his past work. We've really
00:25:09understood that we have, uh, a real artist here with us and somebody that really fit what we're
00:25:14trying to, to sort of like, uh, to bring and felt very, very comfortable because as we all know,
00:25:19the, you know, the topic where, you know, where, which a lot of people can talk about in connection to
00:25:25the duo is a very, very sensitive one. So it was extremely important for us as somebody that
00:25:29has that kind of understanding and the delicacy to really bring it up in the best way possible
00:25:35in a very, very, uh, delicate and sincere way. Uh, it was really, really going to be, uh, out there,
00:25:42you know, when the movie's out, because you never know in a documentary. And I think that
00:25:46Chara and I couldn't be happier, uh, and more satisfied with the way that Eros has and,
00:25:52and the team has done, uh, the work around that movie. And I think it's a, it's a pretty beautiful,
00:25:57uh, you know, film to watch. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. For you.
00:26:04Well, I, in the beginning I was, uh, I mean, I, I, I was afraid a bit because I'm, I'm when,
00:26:12when Eros first approached me, uh, I told him, look, I'm in the healing process with myself. I'm
00:26:19trying to resolve our, my inner conflicts. And I don't want to do anything with like
00:26:25negative energy or something that is, uh, like talk about politics or we want only positive energy
00:26:33and tell any story we want through the music, me and Eros. And he was like exactly in the same
00:26:40frequency of us. And he understood everything. And that's what he did in the movie. And that's
00:26:45actually, first time I watched the movie, I, I was very emotional and I cried myself
00:26:50because, uh, it was, I mean, the way he built it and, uh, and there is no like nothing political,
00:26:58no word of judgment. And still the movie is so with so much dramatic and tension and
00:27:04it met like emotions that it made me cry. And actually it, it's, it changed my definition of hope,
00:27:11the movie itself. Yeah. Because I mean, the, I realized that when I hope for something,
00:27:19I actually, um, imagine, imagine it when I hope I imagine it. And in order to achieve or to,
00:27:27to make something, I have to imagine it first. And this is what the movie is all about. And,
00:27:34um, and we could see it also in the reactions of the screenings of the people where all emotions and
00:27:40the most common comment is like that they were inspired and left the movie with a lot of hope.
00:27:46So yeah. Yeah.
00:27:49Yeah. And Eros, I would love if you could speak to, you know, finding that tone. I thought it was
00:27:54very important, you know, that both Yaron and Bashar talk about, you know, Palestinian-Israeli
00:27:59conflict is always in the backdrop of your lives. Um, and so it's woven in, but not the focal point.
00:28:04Um, you know, to Bashar's point, how did you, you know, find that balance?
00:28:09Um, I mean, first of all, this is, uh, uh, I, I use this as like a background. So like,
00:28:17we all know like what's going on there. We hear from the news every day and, um, um,
00:28:23feel like, you know, as like someone who is in the U S all this, uh, news that you heard kind of like,
00:28:29you know, been through the filters of the media. Um, so I just want to use like a different,
00:28:35um, perspective, like a human story, like, yeah, this is what it is. This is reality out there,
00:28:41but how musicians grow out of this. So that's really is my focus. I mean, um, it's just, it is,
00:28:48it is a perspective that we like really to see it. Uh, yeah. Through like a lens of a human,
00:28:55a personal story. Yeah. And, uh, Bashar told us his reaction. Yaron, I'm curious, you know,
00:29:01how did you respond when you first saw the finished film? Yeah, I was absolutely also,
00:29:07I mean, the feeling was completely mutual and, uh, also among everybody that, that really, uh,
00:29:12is around and people who know us and also people who don't know us. I mean, I think that everybody
00:29:16for exactly the same reasons was very, very thrilled. And I think that people feel that they
00:29:21need this at this moment, uh, because we see so many horrible things happening in our world.
00:29:27And, you know, in particular, of course, around the conflict and everything that comes from the
00:29:32area that we are from and to bring maybe some kind of story like that. And we know, you know,
00:29:38we're only musicians, uh, we play piano, you know, we don't aspire to, I mean, it's not our role to
00:29:44solve the problems of the world. I mean, unfortunately, this is not, some of the things are not under our
00:29:49control, but, uh, we can through our personal story. I mean, there's a very, very deep friendship
00:29:55that Basha and I have, uh, for almost, for, I think more than 20 years now, and we've been
00:29:59playing together and now we're also very active again as Dua Amal. Uh, we are performing, we have
00:30:05many performances coming up and I think just bringing that kind of story, uh, really through a
00:30:11film, it also really, really encouraged us to be, you know, think even forward about what kind of
00:30:16things can we do, what kind of contribution can we make as musicians to just make the world and
00:30:21especially what we're seeing right now, just a tiny bit better. Yeah. And I'm curious, in what
00:30:27process, um, were you all being filmed, you know, for this? And I'm curious, you know, as being pianists
00:30:32and performers, were you able to relax in front of the cameras right away? You know, did it feel
00:30:37natural and comfortable for you or was it a challenge?
00:30:39For me personally, it's a bit of a challenge. Uh, I'm not used to the camera. Um, however,
00:30:49I try to, to be myself authentic as possible and, um, um, um, just with, with the time it,
00:30:58it becomes easier. It's like also in the concerts when we first perform, usually in the beginning,
00:31:03we have some kind of, uh, butterflies, but the more you play, you feel better.
00:31:13Yeah. I would, I would say the same. I mean, obviously we have a lot of experience performing,
00:31:17uh, so we're kind of used to being in the spotlight. I think a documentary is a little bit
00:31:22of a different kind of spotlight because, uh, because we know that what we say could
00:31:28of course be interpreted in a certain way. And, and it's sort of like, just like a little bit of a
00:31:32different setting, uh, and everything. And we, uh, I think that some parts of the movie,
00:31:36I mean, it didn't, there was not always a lot of time for the interview parts. We knew that we had
00:31:40to sort of like, you know, but I think that from the start, we were extremely natural. Uh,
00:31:46at least I can speak for, for myself, you know, that, that there was something really about the,
00:31:50the crew that made it extremely comfortable for us to be, uh, ourselves.
00:31:54Yeah. And did you expect the film to come out during this time? Can you talk about just
00:32:00release timing, um, and you know, conversations that have been sparked from screenings that you've
00:32:05had? Yeah. Um, the releasing time, I mean, we don't have any plan actually. So we, when we filmed it,
00:32:11I mean, that's like right after the concert and I took the opportunity to went to their hometown
00:32:17and then I came back editing and just everything just like really follow the flow. I mean,
00:32:22it just happened to be came out at this perfect timing. Um, yeah, I think it is, you know,
00:32:27there's a fate in there. Yeah. Also, I think, I mean, remarkable to have each of your families,
00:32:34you know, be a part of this, which they also seem very open, um, which I imagine maybe Eros is a
00:32:38testament, you know, to your approach. How did you kind of, you know, win over families or earn their
00:32:43trust? I would say, you know, to kind of share their story as well. Yeah. Yeah, definitely. I mean,
00:32:48that was like amazing, amazing experience that, that I got to, uh, meet with their family,
00:32:54especially, um, I think, I, I, I remember like a moment that I was interviewed Bashar's father.
00:33:01I was like, you know, tearing behind the monitors. Like, I, I can't imagine all the music around.
00:33:06I can't already have the, uh, finished product right in front of me, you know, it's a really
00:33:12touching and moving. Um, and, and they gave me a lot of good material that I can like make this,
00:33:20you know, film. Um, otherwise they wouldn't have a film, you know, we're really thankful.
00:33:26Yeah. Bashar, what did your family share with you, you know, about the finished film?
00:33:31I think we are, we were all surprised actually. Eros is very modest. He did a fantastic job.
00:33:38And he's like, I, I wasn't, I, I was very curious to watch the movie because I, I was thinking
00:33:44most of the documentaries, especially with our backgrounds is like, they need a lot of, you know,
00:33:51news materials and, and we didn't give that. And what he did with the movie starting even with the
00:33:58split screen and the white and black, and then they will, I don't want to ruin it for the viewers.
00:34:04Like I, I, I really recommend to watch it instead of talking about it.
00:34:08And I was like really fascinated from the beginning to, to the end with my family watching it,
00:34:14they all loved it. So I didn't expect to love my own self in the documentary movie. So yeah.
00:34:24Well, lastly, as you said, we don't want to ruin it, but I am curious, you know,
00:34:28seeing early reactions, um, you know, and as Yaron, you spoke to, you know, this has inspired,
00:34:33you know, your work together and thinking about other things, you know,
00:34:36what are your hopes, um, for what might come from this project? Are we thinking
00:34:40about a feature length version? You know, what might be next for all of you?
00:34:44Yeah. Well, first of all, I mean, this was, I think an opportunity for us to, to really,
00:34:49I mean, with Erosa's approach to really have just like, uh, you know, a glimpse into our lives, uh,
00:34:56and not only our lives, but really something for us to say, because, you know, especially a little
00:35:01bit from my perspective, I'm not very happy necessarily about what leaders do, uh, and what,
00:35:07uh, you know, and, and this is sort of like a, sort of like an opportunity to just maybe bring
00:35:13something that is, again, we're only pianists, but something that is a little bit kind of like
00:35:17different than that. And all we want to do is continue with that kind of energy. Um, we will,
00:35:24we don't yet have a concrete plan for making a large, sort of like a longer movie. I mean,
00:35:29this is certainly like something we would consider, but Bash and I have a, also an in,
00:35:33in collaboration also with a, with a production team, like various plans about, uh, also about
00:35:38broadcasting and, uh, you know, showing the movie in different places. And of course,
00:35:42a lot around performance. Uh, and, uh, we now have a lot of sort of like new videos that we've,
00:35:48we've been doing also in a very, very similar direction, very, very sort of like artistic that
00:35:52try to bring our story and primarily our music. Amazing. Well, thank you all so much for being here.
00:35:59with us. Um, congratulations on the incredible film and thank you for your time.
00:36:02Thank you very much. And up next, we have with us director Eden Wormfield, Dr. Raykel Hillier,
00:36:08and Nick Fiveogs of the film Classroom Four, which follows the experience of incarcerated students
00:36:13and those from a nearby college who are taught about the history of crime and punishment in the
00:36:17U.S. inside of a prison. Thank you all so much for being here with us. Um, Eden, I want to start with
00:36:24you. You know, Dr. Hillier, uh, has been teaching the history of crime and punishment, uh, since 2012.
00:36:30When did you first learn of her and her work, um, and decide you wanted to do a documentary?
00:36:35Thank you so much for that question. So, um, Dr. Hillier and I met when we were 11 years old in
00:36:41seventh grade, and I have been learning from her and alongside her really my whole life. And I know
00:36:49her extraordinary gift as a teacher because I'm her friend and I learned from her in the ways that I do.
00:36:56But when she became a college professor, she shared a lot about her experiences. And then when she did
00:37:02this inside out prison exchange training program, which allowed her to teach these kinds of classes,
00:37:08I not only heard about the training, but over the last decade, plus I've heard about the magic that
00:37:14happens in those rooms. And I always dreamed that maybe there could be a camera documenting
00:37:21and things aligned in the spring of 2023 for us to bring cameras in. And at that time,
00:37:26we didn't actually know we would make a film. We, um, wanted to document it for archival purposes.
00:37:34And because it's so hard to communicate with people on the inside, it's not actually possible at all.
00:37:39Uh, you can't reach them. They don't have the internet, et cetera, et cetera. There's no phone.
00:37:44And so we wanted to just be there with the camera document what was happening. And Reiko can talk about
00:37:52the purpose of that, but we gathered some seed money from our community from growing up. And that's what
00:37:58allowed us to get started with what became classroom four. Amazing. Thank you. And I would love,
00:38:04uh, Dr. Hillier, if you could talk about, you know, the intention behind that, um, and wanting to document,
00:38:09you know, this experience. Thank you. Yes. It's such a special class and it's such a special
00:38:15experience for everyone in the room and including me. Um, the mission of the Inside Out Prison Exchange
00:38:22is to bring, uh, free students together with incarcerated students to learn, uh, alongside and
00:38:29from each other as equals, as peers integrated together in the same class, studying the same topic.
00:38:35Um, there are Inside Out classes on many different topics. Mine happens to be on the history of crime
00:38:40and punishment. Um, I'm a historian and that became one of my specialties in part, thanks to this class.
00:38:46Um, but the pedagogy, that is to say the method of teaching really depends on my seeing myself more
00:38:53as a facilitator of an encounter. Um, and the learning really happens not only through the texts that we
00:39:01read together, um, and historical episodes that we grapple with, but also just from, um, seeing each
00:39:09other, um, as, as students, as receptacles of, of wisdom, um, people deeply want to listen to each
00:39:17other in that class. And in doing so, we're breaking down a lot of, um, social barriers and preconceived
00:39:24notions. And, um, that to me is a very radical act and, you know, higher education is in many ways a
00:39:31form of replicating hierarchies. And so in that class, we have a chance to really break that down
00:39:37in, in, in, in a, in a truly, um, fundamental way where we, um, reconsider what can be known
00:39:45and who gets to know it. Absolutely. Um, and Nick, I want to come to you next, you know,
00:39:52as a participant, when this opportunity kind of came to you, you know, what was your first reaction?
00:39:56And, you know, was it an immediate, yes, you want to participate? Were you hesitant?
00:40:00No, it was absolutely not.
00:40:05It was, uh, I think Joey had said it best in there. Um, he, along with, uh, I and a few others
00:40:13were approached by the superintendent, Mr. Hanley, who was a huge part of this facilitating this, this, uh,
00:40:20class. Um, and he approached me one day and asked me if I would consider it. And at first it was like,
00:40:26no, I'm not, I'm not going to do this. I don't, I don't want to set myself up for, you know, uh,
00:40:34you know, fear of judgment or, um, you know, just putting myself in a position with people who are,
00:40:41you know, that I, I, I felt way smarter than me. Um, and, um, you know, it was, uh, after,
00:40:50after doing 16 years, I was getting close, uh, to the gate, which, um, talking with my family, uh,
00:40:59and after the, um, encounter with Ms. Hillier, um, and, uh, kind of pre-screening, uh, really set my,
00:41:07my mind at ease. And I was, uh, I was, I was ready to, to try this challenge because I felt like I
00:41:16also needed it for myself to, um, learn how to communicate again with, you know, strangers, um,
00:41:23individuals, especially from the outside, because all I had in there was my family who I spoke to all
00:41:30the time and, you know, other, other incarcerated individuals who shared a lot of the same stories
00:41:36and backgrounds and things like that. So you really weren't, you know, learning anything, anything new.
00:41:43Yeah. Yeah. Um, and I'm curious, you know, I've done some volunteer work at prison, so I know kind
00:41:49of how difficult access can be and, you know, entrance and all that. I would love, Eden, if you
00:41:53can kind of talk about getting permission, you know, to film what that process was like. Did you film
00:41:57every Friday of the 15 weeks? Um, can you kind of go into that event? Yeah, thank you. Um, so gaining
00:42:04access was easier than I could have imagined. Okay. It was really based on Dr. Hillier's
00:42:10relationship with the prison. There's one administrator there in particular who, James
00:42:15Hanley, who, who, whom Nick mentioned earlier, who is very helpful. And while we had to go through
00:42:21various protocols that everyone has to go through when you bring equipment into a prison where you're
00:42:26documenting everything and they examine everything and so on and so forth, by and large, because I have
00:42:31many peers, colleagues who've made films inside and I know how challenging it can be, this was
00:42:36relatively easy. And I, the irony is not lost on me that the prison doors were open to us and that's
00:42:42what allowed this to happen. Um, but grateful to Reiko for sharing her world and her relationships.
00:42:50That's what made it possible. Yeah.
00:42:51Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Um, Dr. Hillier, I thought about, you know, in the film, you said,
00:42:56I think I cry like every class. And I thought, I think I would do. I think I was crying, you know,
00:43:00when you said that, um, I would love if you and Nick can both talk about, um, just the impact,
00:43:05you know, the experience has had on you and just some of the, you know, conversations that came up and
00:43:11how they touched you personally. Um, it's, it's had a, it's, it's changed the course of my life.
00:43:19It's the most important thing that I do. And it's taught me to be a better person. Um, I think
00:43:25being able to, you know, hold that discomfort and hold people's stories and not necessarily rush in
00:43:33to fix them is actually a lesson that I, I feel like I, I'm trying to carry in my life. I also feel
00:43:40that, um, having seen people's reactions to the film, I've, I've, I've really been moved by, um, the,
00:43:48the kinds of people, I mean, the kinds of remarks people make that go beyond the situation of prison.
00:43:53People talk about the importance of vulnerability and the importance of conversation and human
00:43:59connection. Um, I was speaking with someone who suffers from disabilities and, um, she was very
00:44:05struck by the line that, that no one is disposable. Um, so there are all kinds of, um, sort of values and
00:44:12human practices that, that I think that the space of the class allow me and others to rehearse in a way
00:44:19that, you know, goes beyond, um, the context of prison. Yeah. And Nick, for you. Yeah. Um, I, I agree
00:44:28with a lot with, uh, uh, Reiko just said, um, you know, it, it opened so many doors for me. Um, my, um,
00:44:38my willingness to reach out and, you know, communicate with people that she,
00:44:46what Reiko did for me is something I can never pay back. Um, I am forever, uh, grateful for the
00:44:56opportunity to actually take this class. Um, the reactions that people have had, um, the support
00:45:03that people have given me, um, uh, during some of these interviews and, and the showings that at
00:45:11these, uh, film festivals has been amazing, you know, and, and not feeling, um, judged, uh, is a big
00:45:22thing for me because, um, I believe, um, Raiko had mentioned something, uh, well, like she was
00:45:30saying, you know, you're, you're not defined by the worst things you've ever done in your life. Um,
00:45:36you know, and, uh, that means a lot. Um, you know, I get to go forward, I get to move on and I get to,
00:45:48you know, um, help people, you know, think about, you know, what they're actually putting tax dollars
00:45:57into. Um, it's, it's, it's been amazing really. I, I just, I don't know how else to explain it other
00:46:07than that. Well, I'm curious when you saw the finished film, what was your initial reaction
00:46:12and was it what you expected? No, it was nothing like what I expected because, you know, at, at first
00:46:20it seemed like it was going in a different direction. Um, and the way Eden put things together
00:46:30in there, um, there's enough there to give you an idea as to what's going on. You know, for me,
00:46:38it's just like, it's, I'm always like, it could be longer. It could be longer. Um, but, um, you know,
00:46:46I, uh, I definitely cried, you know, I was definitely emotional. Um, and, uh, yeah, I just,
00:46:57it's it. I mean, I'm, I'm on cloud nine with this. Well, to that point, you know, and the last
00:47:04question, Eden, I do want to ask about the edit, you know, I thought I would watch an eight hour
00:47:08docu-series, you know, of this, how did you get it down to 38 minutes, number one? Um, and then are
00:47:14there plans to expand this into something larger? Thank you. Um, so it was, the edit was hard. I
00:47:23worked with an incredible editor named Lawrence LaRue, who's tremendously talented. I will say that
00:47:30there are a lot of gems on the editing room floor. I mean, it was not easy. Yeah. The reason why it is
00:47:39the length that it is lies primarily with the fact that we wanted so much for this to be used
00:47:47in classrooms and seen in communities. We want to show it to parole officers. We want to show it to
00:47:54legislators. We want it anywhere and anyone who's willing to sit for just under 40 minutes. And, um,
00:48:03I have made a lot of social issue films and I, that are feature length. And I feel like increasingly
00:48:10in the time we're in, people are not taking that space for longer. And certainly in the classroom with
00:48:18this emphasis toward teaching toward a test and so on and so forth on the high school level,
00:48:22it's not possible even to get it into classrooms at a longer length. So I, I didn't want to take
00:48:27the risk of that. Um, I won't lie that there's a lot of material. I would love to work with it more.
00:48:34I don't have any plans at this moment. We don't have any funders knocking our door down saying,
00:48:39make it longer. Um, but we would happily do that. Um, thanks.
00:48:45Yeah. Well, thank you all so much. I have a million more questions, but thank you. I appreciate
00:48:52your time. Um, and thank you for sharing your story as well. Thank you, Brandy. Thank you.
00:48:57Thank you. And so great to be here. Thanks a lot. Thank you. And lastly, we are joined by director
00:49:02Cora Adana of the film one last round about a husband and wife who debate a difficult decision
00:49:07when one of them is diagnosed with a terminal illness. Uh, Cora, thank you so much for being here
00:49:12with us. Thank you for having me. Of course. You know, this short has sort of a very black mirror
00:49:18esque, um, you know, quality to it. I'm sure people have said that, but I'm curious, how did the idea
00:49:23for this film come to you? Well, I've always been fascinated with this theme of whether or not
00:49:29the advancement of technology either helps or hinders our ability to connect to each other.
00:49:36It's a theme that's cropped up in a lot of things that I've written. Um, I was a writer producer
00:49:41on Mr. Robot. The theme was prevalent in that, uh, more recently I was a writer producer on Dune
00:49:47Prophecy and the theme was prevalent in that as well. And I wanted to do something that had this
00:49:52theme at its core and also had a lot of heart and really explored some of my own deepest fears.
00:50:00And one of the things that I'm most afraid of, uh, and, uh, is, is not, is, is, uh, one of the things
00:50:07I'm most afraid of is the loss of a loved one. So it got me thinking about how we deal with grief
00:50:15and how we remember our loved, our lost loved ones. Uh, what can you do? You can look at old
00:50:21photographs. You can look at old home videos. You can read archived text messages or emails or letters,
00:50:28but it's not the same as having them there and being able to talk to them in a time of need.
00:50:34Right. And, uh, the most auto autobiographical part of the film is when I was a child, I had an
00:50:41aunt who died of a brain of a brain tumor and it really fractured our entire family, uh, to a point
00:50:49where, you know, we haven't really fully been able to recover from it. And even to this day, when I speak
00:50:54to my aunts or my father or my, my cousins, the one common thread is, Oh, I wish I could just talk to
00:51:01her. I give anything just to be able to talk to her again. So that got me thinking like, okay,
00:51:05what if we were actually able to deliver on that? Like, what if we were able to create a digital AI
00:51:11that could actually do that? And, uh, you couple that with the introduction of a child at the center
00:51:18of the narrative. And I think that takes an already difficult decision and makes it turns it into a true
00:51:25dilemma because that parent child relationship is so important. And that thought of not being in your
00:51:34child's life, you know, if they're eight years old and you're going to leave, I'm sure that weighs
00:51:39heavily on the decision to whether to, to make, to, you know, to create this digital, um, AI version
00:51:45of yourself that you can leave behind for them. So all of those things kind of coalesced into,
00:51:48um, you know, me wanting to explore this with this short film. Yeah. And I love, you know,
00:51:54it's such an interesting take to have boxing kind of be the backdrop of this and even the ultimate,
00:51:59you know, kind of decision maker. How did you make that decision? A couple, a couple of things. Um,
00:52:05I box just as a hobby. So I, it was something that I thought was fun. Uh, just the motion of it was
00:52:10something that I wanted to explore and, um, just the metaphor of fighting for your family
00:52:18and exploring that visually through a boxing or a sparring match was something that was really
00:52:24appealing to me. Um, in the beginning, it's more of a meet cute, right? Are the leads are sparring
00:52:31with each other, but it's not, it's not like they're trying to destroy each other. It's more like
00:52:36she's giving him a test and seeing if he's worthy of actually pursuing, you know, a relationship and
00:52:42he passes the test. And I, I'm always more interested in these kind of, um, you know,
00:52:48an action sequence that has emotional depth. So that original one is, I treat that, I treated that
00:52:54first sequence more as a dance and as opposed to a fight. So that's just like a courting scene.
00:53:01And by the time we, we have the second fight, the more climactic moonlit fight,
00:53:08the stakes are literally life or death, right? And they're both fighting for their family in a
00:53:14different way. He's fighting to preserve his family and keep his family intact. And if he wins
00:53:20the match, you know, he's going to get to keep as much of his wife as, as, as, as, as, as possible,
00:53:27right. Yeah. With, with the, um, you know, with pursuing treatment and she's fighting for a chance
00:53:34to leave behind some semblance of herself for her eight year old daughter. So just that,
00:53:41that metaphor of fighting for your family, but in a way that makes you empathize with both characters.
00:53:46So there's not, you know, there's not a true force. I mean, there are forces of antagonism,
00:53:51but there are forces of antagonism that you can understand and kind of root for, um, that kind of
00:53:55storytelling always really excites me. Yeah. And, you know, as you talked about like the
00:54:00moonlit, you know, kind of fight scene, cinematography is such a, you know, a big factor,
00:54:04I think in this film, as well as, you know, the visual effects, um, that go into the representation
00:54:09of the ripple, um, you know, which Renee decides to become, can you talk about, you know, what went
00:54:14into that creation? Yeah, I had, I just lucked out. I had an incredible cinematographer,
00:54:19his name is Brian Jackson. We actually met while working together on Mr. Robot. Okay.
00:54:24Killer eye. And we had so many conversations early on about what the visual grammar of this piece was
00:54:32going to be. And we decided to have this kind of, this ambitious goal of doing a warm to cool tonal
00:54:41shift throughout the entire piece. So the beginning of the movie, very warm, vibrant colors, very intimate,
00:54:48like visuals that allow you to fall in love with this family and understand, you know, what's at
00:54:55stake for them. Right. Right. And this is reflected through the cinematography. It's reflected through
00:55:00the wardrobe choices, through the props, through the color timing, through the shot composition,
00:55:05all of it. Right. Uh, and as the narrative progresses, that warmth dissipates a little bit
00:55:11more and more. And by the time you're about two thirds of the way through the narrative,
00:55:15it gets very cool. It gets very sterile. It gets very machine-like. And there's something about
00:55:23matching the arc of Renee and her decision to turn herself into a ripple, something more robotic,
00:55:31something more cold, something more calculating, right? Something less human that we were really
00:55:36excited by. So I don't think my department, my department heads were incredible, but I think I,
00:55:41I put, I think I drove everyone crazy with this kind of warm to cool transition. And, uh, I think I'm
00:55:48very proud of what I, what everyone was able to achieve. Uh, but yeah. And, and, and there's something
00:55:53else that Brian brought to it that I loved. He gave the script to his daughter to read. And the first
00:56:01thing that his daughter said was, Oh, I see a lot of red for Renee. And I, and then he, Brian came to me,
00:56:08he's like, Oh, can, can we incorporate red somehow? And I'm like, perfect. Cause that actually falls
00:56:13perfectly in line with this kind of warm to cool tonal shift. And it's something that we see, like
00:56:18the, the color red represents Renee. And there's a lot of red early in the film and it gets more muted
00:56:24and more desaturated. And by the end of it, there's no red at all. And it's something that we even
00:56:29foreshadow with our title card where it's just a lot of red. And then it kind of fades into gray,
00:56:33just to kind of give you a sense of what you're, what you're about to get. Yeah. I'm so glad you
00:56:38said that because, you know, as I was watching, I was like, Oh, it's so like loving and wholesome.
00:56:42And then right at the end, there's this switch and I'm like, where is this going? So it's so
00:56:46unexpected. I'm sure you don't want to give too much away, but I am curious if you can share,
00:56:51you know, maybe the genre category, you kind of see this falling into, you know, a feature length
00:56:56and maybe any commentary, you know, you might say. It's interesting. Uh, the ending is something
00:57:00that comes up quite often. Uh, and the reason it's there is because I think without it,
00:57:07it shades the decision that she made, um, to be a little bit too positive. It provides an answer
00:57:15and I don't want there to be a clear answer. And, um, maybe she's not right. Maybe his concerns are
00:57:22valid. And, uh, when I think about technology and the way that data mining works and then the way that
00:57:28companies, um, use this data, my mind goes to, okay, now we have a person that's represented by an AI
00:57:37who owns that data. And I, you know, I just start, you go, you start going down this track of, does it
00:57:43have personhood? Does it have rights? Um, can it be altered? Can it be modified? Uh, so I wanted that
00:57:50ending to reflect that, okay, there is something potentially more nefarious or more sinister at the,
00:57:56at the, at the heart of this. And for me, the feature length version of it, which I just finished
00:58:02writing actually is more of that kind of sci-fi thriller. Um, but it is deeply rooted in a core
00:58:10family drama. Like I, I feel very strongly that you need to fall in love with these characters and
00:58:15understand the family before we break the family apart and see how they can navigate this journey
00:58:20of grief. So, uh, the feature length version of it is like, how does a family that's been affected by
00:58:26the death of the mother, um, how do they navigate that journey of grief and how do you navigate it
00:58:32with a grief bot, like a ripple? And, uh, especially how does that drive a wedge between father and
00:58:37daughter? And is that something that they're going to be able to reconcile? So that's, that's kind of
00:58:41where the feature goes with it. But, uh, yeah, that, that shift in, in tone is just, I felt strongly
00:58:48that if that wasn't there, it would just feel like, okay, she was right. Um, and, uh, that's,
00:58:53that's, that's kind of, that's kind of why it's there. Yeah. Nice. You know, here's, you know,
00:58:58as you've shown the film, you know, what reactions have you gotten so far? Like how are people, um,
00:59:03engaging, you know, it's fascinating. They're engaging in the exact same way that all of the
00:59:09crew members were engaging with it when they read the script, which to me is a, is a dream come true
00:59:15because the conversations that I've had, that this has brought up with people were, uh, inevitably
00:59:21it leads to, would you do this? If you were in the same, this, this, if you were in the same
00:59:25situation, would you create a ripple? And I get different answers from everyone and no, there's
00:59:32no right or wrong answer. And it is so, there's something so compelling about it yet disturbing
00:59:40about it. And I, I sense that in people watching the film, they have, it brings up those similar
00:59:46questions of, okay, you know, if I, if I could bring my grandparent back or a parent back, even
00:59:52though it's not really them, would I do it? Or if I did have a young child and I was faced
00:59:58with a terminal diagnosis, would I, would I do this for myself to leave, leave behind some
01:00:04version of myself, even though it's not really them. Um, and then it brings up these kinds of
01:00:08philosophical questions of what does it mean to be you and what makes you, you. And, uh, so it's
01:00:14just fascinating. I love talking to people after they, they view the film and, uh, it's, I, what's,
01:00:22what's great about it is I don't have a, I don't have an answer for it. I'm not sure how I feel about
01:00:26it. Uh, I know the, the risks, uh, I know the technological risks of something like this. And,
01:00:31you know, I poured that into the father character, but I also like the human stakes and the
01:00:37longing to want to talk to someone. Um, even if it's not them, even if you can't really tell
01:00:43the difference, there's some comfort there and there's a longing there and, and, you know, maybe
01:00:49it's worth it. I don't know. And something that, that I, I wanted to explore with this. And, um,
01:00:55these are the kinds of conversations that people come up to me after they view the film.
01:00:57I imagine. Yes. Well, thank you. You've given us a lot to figure out as well, but thank you
01:01:05so much for being here and sharing your process with us. Thank you so much. Thanks for having me.
01:01:09Of course. Thank you. And thank you all so much for watching this episode of THR Presents
01:01:14Short Films Showcase.
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