- 2 weeks ago
Claire Foy, Danielle Deadwyler, Emma Corrin, Jennifer Lawrence, Michelle Williams and Michelle Yeoh joined The Hollywood Reporter to talk about their respective projects.
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00:00we had a female director the schedule made sense there were no huge fights if an actor had a
00:07personal thing instead of going oh well we'd all love to leave early we'd put our heads together
00:13and go okay how can we figure this out i honestly look at all of you with such envy because you
00:18know you get an opportunity to try all the different roles but we only get that opportunity
00:23maybe ones like how many times does a woman of color have to ask for something to go the way i
00:30need for it to go and then you just start
00:53welcome to the hollywood reporter actress roundtable i'm rebecca keegan and thanks for
01:01being here can we start by talking about what you do when you really want to roll
01:06what is the furthest you'll go when you really care about something
01:11write a letter i have done that yeah it's never worked no what do you say
01:22um please yeah yeah normally like very deep and emotional and like yeah when winter's bone
01:31turned me down they were doing la casting that i went to and then they were like no thank you
01:37and then they opened up casting in new york and i flew to new york and just kind of reentered like
01:41like a stranger they turned you down yeah and did they say we've seen you before you know yeah i think
01:50that they knew that they had seen yeah maybe they were just scared at that point and they were
01:54like okay she wants it yeah but isn't it good that they want the role wouldn't you want someone
02:01who's really passionate about it and will bring their full game on then just casting an actress
02:08who's like okay i'll do it for you know yeah yeah i don't think there's any harm in it maybe
02:13there's probably a line somewhere somewhere don't put anyone's house no well is it is it
02:20isn't it as you say michelle isn't it great to show interest or ambition about a part do you feel
02:26like there is a line that you can't cross when you're when you're wanting to express interest
02:31yeah the house thing the house yeah yeah y'all ain't ever you know cast a spell on somebody
02:37i think for me it was most difficult sometimes when you get a script a lot of the times i get
02:44the script and it's not written for a woman like me and if the director is kind enough to take a
02:52meeting with you that's a time when you are you think should i voice you know maybe you should give
02:57me this role which i think is more suited for me i remember doing this movie called sunshine with
03:03danny boyle and he's amazing director it's a story about the astronauts going to the sun trying to
03:09save us when i first received the script it was written for a man to start off with so that was
03:15already such a joy that danny thought well you know i would change it for you and then at that point
03:22i said to him why do you think at that time it's still the russians and the americans go into space
03:28would you have more japanese chinese and it would be a more united group going up to save the earth
03:36it's not like a mission to mars on your own right it would be a more collaborative effort and i think it
03:42takes a very um uh director with great confidence of who they are and their vision and he changed it
03:50so you know we had hero peace sonata we had benedict wong and myself you know so we had like a real
03:56good diverse group of astronauts going to save the world instead of just all caucasians
04:03right yeah so i think that's the the time when you think can i make that bold step right because
04:13the next thing they'll be like okay bye thank you but no thank you i was gonna say i think it's also
04:17really nice to live in that passionate state though like when you want something when you're
04:22so full of desire that it burns you to the point where you have to like go outside of your comfort
04:27zone and make yourself so incredibly vulnerable in front of a stranger and say like i want this with
04:32my whole heart it's like such a generative place to live when you're like i'm i'm i'm in a flame right
04:38now for this thing and i don't know if it's going to be expanded or extinguished but it's such a
04:44beautiful place to like to create from too and even that if you don't get it it just sort of gets
04:50a little bit stronger and stronger and it like carries over to the next thing like i love i kind
04:55of love being in a desirous state like before you like consummate something you get it like i think
04:59that's actually like the most exciting time you're like this thing exists and like whether i get to
05:04touch it or not it's out there and i'm and i'm i'm just grateful to know that it is it's in the
05:11universe and that it's like been created and that it's going to go like out into like even if i
05:17don't get to have anything to do with it i'm just glad to like know it's alive and i think you
05:22learned from each like if you ever had experiences where i've had like several meetings for things
05:26and ended up discussing in depth like the script and if it's a project you're so passionate about
05:31and even if you don't end up getting it there's this moment where you think god i spent so much
05:35time thinking about it and existing in that world of like what could potentially happen and
05:39it's sort of nice to remind yourself that there is there are things to be got from that in itself
05:45and that it's yeah it could be a good thing you learn things just from the discussions i guess
05:49danielle i know until you put yourself on tape with a scene where you were putting a tie
05:55on the child in the movie emmett till but you use your actual son to put the tie on for the tape
06:01and i'm just curious what was that experience like of recording that audition um i mean that's one
06:07one of the more lighter scenes of the entire film so i've done a movie with my son before
06:13and so he just you know lends me his skills here and there and so that was yeah that was easy that
06:20was light-hearted um the other two scenes that i did were more speeches or like from the courtroom
06:25scene and from the harlem rally speech but i mean he's he's a darling he supports me and
06:31if i ask he he goes in with me but i've always auditioned for everything that i've ever had to do
06:39and it's the intuitive spirit of if this comes i would do i would do this difficult challenging
06:46audition and then throw it away and let it go was there any part of you with till that was like
06:52whoo if i get this this i literally let that thing go yeah like i was working on from scratch and then
06:58uh it was difficult to even get to do the the the audition for it because i'm trying to negotiate
07:05these two things and reading this very very tension filled anxiety written script i had to go about
07:11it slowly and so you know when i did finally finish it after a week and then they were like hey daniel
07:17you want to go ahead and put this on okay nudge do it and just relinquish it because it was it was too
07:24much to to continue to carry you know yeah i totally get that claire i had heard that sarah
07:31polly originally envisioned you for a different role in women talking than the one you ended up
07:35playing is that right i don't know whether she envisioned me for it i think that it was one of
07:39those things where she was meeting probably everybody on the planet and was asking everybody
07:43i think it was for a part that i would have tried very hard to act but i would have really been
07:50acting it um and then in the meeting that we had like on zoom she said who do you like who's your
07:55you know favorite character or who do you like have an affinity with and it was salome it wasn't
07:59the original character but i think she did that with a lot of women that she met she was building a
08:04community and a group of women and also like a company of actors who was going to work well together
08:09and what that would be what that dynamic would be like in that room i think was the the main thing
08:14for her i really felt like i was chancing my arm by saying who i wanted because i was like everyone's
08:19going to want to play that part um and then she yeah and what was it about that part that you felt
08:25that connection i just really loved that she made the emotional weather in the room and with with
08:35like an acceptance and everyone had an acceptance of her as a as a person she was allowed to be big
08:40she was allowed to be loud she was allowed to be angry and nobody took it personally and i feel
08:46like not just in my life but i see a lot all the time that if you are that way if you are quite a lot
08:53as a person um people tend to want to squash it or pack like make it not quite so much for them to deal
09:01with um and the women in the room were capable of just letting her be who she was and they were just
09:05like yep she needs a moment okay let's move on um there was no judgment with that yeah i just loved
09:11being able to just be big once you have the role and you're starting to kind of sink your teeth into
09:18it um what's the first thing you do michelle i remember you telling me that you have an ipad that
09:25you sometimes put everything you know about a character on the ipad that that's something that
09:29you did for mitzi fabelman i've just done that with with women that i've played who actually were
09:34it just becomes like a localizing place because there's so much material and when i started doing
09:39it maryland was the first person that i played who was and i was coming to set with this enormous
09:45heavy bag every day that had like all the books that had ever been made about maryland it was like
09:50really big thing and i was like this with it and then somebody said why don't we just compress this
09:56for you so you aren't carrying all of your books to work every day um and trying to also be somebody
10:02who had so much uh had these like beautiful sloping shoulders and i got my backpack and stuff like this
10:08um and so and i thought oh that's really helpful i'm not i don't i'm not great with technology so
10:14um uh but i found that it's it's just an easier place and then you sort of have this like touchstone
10:21that you always go back to and then you can put in your little pods and you can like listen to a
10:25thing and it just sort of it also kind of just brings everything to the center too it's like
10:29a nice place to just go in between takes that you just have this kind of i don't know like homing
10:35device for this person i haven't done it for women that i've played that that there isn't so much
10:41you know archival footage that you need to gather all the photos and the sounds and all the things so
10:45i've just used it for the i think three women that i've played i feel you're wanting to be more
10:50tactile though like it's something digitizing it takes away a certain kind of intimacy like the
10:56book is like oh this is how it feels and this is you know where the information is deriving from and
11:00you can connect the dots you know it just it feels more um earthen and and connected yeah
11:07yeah i find that with scripts yeah yeah i want my script in my head yeah yeah i can't do an audition
11:14with and i because i'd lose my place as well i'd be terrible and then it yeah you know you've got to
11:18have it in your hand is it the same way in terms of wanting something tactile when it comes to your
11:23costume or your props like once you can touch something does that help you sometimes it depends
11:28on the character for me joy was very um i really found joy in the costume and i and i don't know if
11:39that had to do with like everything you know the sleeves had to be pushed up because she's a mom and
11:44she's busy but that that that was i think the time i was most affected by by costume yeah um maybe
11:52is much more of a a woman of a certain era and i am a bit of a thug and i'm i'm with you i'm over
12:02here right but you know the the costuming just it just pulls you up erect i mean she's already going
12:08through a particular kind of taut uh experience a tightrope experience but the dresses just make
12:14you elongate and then not to mention the societal and cultural uh uh rigor of the time there's a
12:21discipline to womanhood there's a discipline to beauty so yeah it definitely yanked me up in a
12:28certain way michelle and everything everywhere all at once you're a million different characters
12:34are you just showing up on the day and looking at what's hanging for you in your dressing room and
12:39putting it on how do you i think a favorite the rock my best acting
12:44and i said i'm not doing voiceover it's not it's got no voices um but that one really needed a lot
12:59of prep because you were going from one to another coming back and going to the next one so apart from
13:07the continuity which of course the script director and they would help it's like in your mindset what
13:15why and how are you going how to be grounded the whole time and it was it was very difficult i do a
13:21lot of action films right so but in the action movies i'm generally the one who's always in control
13:27the mentor the teacher and in this one obviously evelyn has no clue what she's doing i mean she's a
13:37vulnerable and wonderful to play because she doesn't give up even though she fails she will
13:44try something else so that you know she's on track to look after her family and you know to
13:49not be a failure in her father's eyes so i go to this universe where i'm a kung fu master and then i
13:56come back to this and so i'm doing all the moves fighting with jamie lee curtis right that's a lot of fun
14:01and then the daniels they come up to me and say no michelle you you can't look like you know what
14:07you're doing i'm like what does that mean and then yes of course evelyn wong doesn't know what
14:14so she's got all these skills but your eyes have to go like what the hell am i doing but i'm doing
14:19all these you know amazing things so it was very you had to be fractured to think like this work like
14:26that and it was completely out of my comfort zone i was doing a lot of things that i normally have not
14:32done but i was also thinking maybe i've spent the last almost 40 years of my career rehearsing for
14:38this role because you know i was suddenly doing comedy physical comedy action horror every single
14:45genre all packed into one and jumping in and out of it the great thing was everybody was giving more
14:51than 100 percent when i look at jamie lee curtis and we just go mm-hmm and we do our hot dog dance
14:58there is no like oh i can't do something like this i'm you know that's below me or whatever it is
15:05like yes let's go for it and we're like spewing tomato sauce and ketchup um but it was it was such a
15:15gratifying experience i must say i mean i've waited a long time to receive a script like that
15:23because you know as you get older the letter that you were throwing around just you know as you get
15:29older you find that all the things goes you know the the box gets smaller and smaller and especially
15:36for us it's never been an easy ride to start off with i honestly look at all of you with such envy
15:43because you know you get an opportunity to try all the different roles but we only get that
15:48opportunity maybe once in a long long time crazy rich asians gave the asian community such a boost
15:56because the last one was joy luck club which was like 26 seven years ago and so it's very hard for
16:03us to say like who's your hero that i don't know who's my hero because i don't really see it up there
16:08because you know thank god we had joan chan and lucy liu you know they really fought for us to have
16:14a place and then as the box gets smaller then you're relegated to i've been fortunate i played in
16:20crazy rich asians because when when i did press for that what hit me the most was every time a reporter
16:26comes in they go like oh my mom my parents are really excited i'm doing this interview with you
16:31and you go i get it but it's true right because this generation of film goers don't really know me
16:39because crouching tiger was 22 years ago even the bond movie or whatever it is so with crazy rich
16:46asians suddenly i am the mean mom you know the mom that's very scary that says you'll never be enough
16:51so then go okay and then because of the success of crazy rich asians shang chi was made with marvel
16:59so we had our first asian superhero which was a big another great boost for our community in that
17:07way so then i was the auntie but then you can see the roles are getting from mother to auntie and then
17:13when i received the script and say please play the grandmother you're like no walking away
17:18yes i really i was like please don't put me in that box already you're like no no no no
17:27relate to that idea of the box though i mean we all get put in them in different ways does anybody
17:32feel like oh let me out of this one that you've got me in right now yeah i mean i think it's
17:37inevitable i think it's more convenient no fight it fight it no no no no no absolutely no i think
17:43i felt weirdly i felt that when i first started acting and i was doing lots of like tv like british tv
17:50stuff it's just inevitable what ends up happening is that everybody sort of goes i've done that so
17:54will give you this right but it's like almost identical um i really don't want to do that
17:59but then i suppose it's that feeling that you have that what do you do like sometimes it is i think
18:05very often it's things that you don't do that navigate your career if you even can navigate it
18:10i think basically it's what you go no i'm not going to do that because i don't that's not going
18:14to stretch me or that's not going to give me something that i need or and and then that might
18:18lead you to something else but if you go that way you know where it's going to go
18:21you're just going to keep doing that for the rest of your career i think basically but i do think
18:26that it is also our job to try and show people that that's not the case like sometimes it is worth
18:35making the decision that seems a bit strange and it's an odd job and you're doing something weird
18:39in it but that to go that's not all i can do but it's just you have to be given the opportunity to do
18:44that and not that doesn't happen and it hasn't happened for so many people for so long
18:47jen i read you said that you felt like your choices had kind of been hijacked by other people
18:53and that you had to really take the reins back for yourself yeah i was um i was at a really big
19:01agency and i i just feel like i had kind of given away my agency but that was also like
19:07it was also my fault you know i i would watch things and be such a fan and you know i i would
19:14watch uncut gems and be like oh my god the safeties that'd be so cool to work with them
19:18but like i didn't reach out and i didn't and that's something i've gotten better about in the
19:22last few years it's like when i watch something when i'm a fan let that person know um because yeah
19:29it just i i just realized so many things weren't you know kind of getting to me or people that i
19:36wanted to work with you know didn't know that i that i wanted to and it just kind of
19:40um i also think a lot of it was just kind of losing touch with the world a little bit i think
19:47i got so um i was working so much and so much of what we do is has to do with observing people
19:56um and i i felt like i couldn't really observe anyone because everybody was observing me
20:01and so taking a few years and kind of getting back to to life i feel like i can i can kind of be
20:08creative again in that sense yeah does has anybody else had that experience of kind of
20:16trying to make your own choices and there's a lot of people with a lot of opinions about what you
20:20should do and sort of figuring out for yourself yeah definitely especially when i guess success or
20:26whatever you want to call it happens very quickly and you haven't been part of that world before
20:31and also when you're happens when you're young and you haven't quite found the power in your own
20:39voice yet in terms of what you want to do but also in terms of knowing what's best for you and
20:47actually being able to advocate for what you need or yeah what you feel you want and um i think
20:53that's been something i've had to learn really fast because also i'm a very much people pleaser
20:58generally in life and i think that's a wonderful thing in many respects i think it's also
21:02can be very very harmful in this industry because it means you get taken advantage of very quickly
21:06it's really important not only in navigating career choices but also on set in terms of you know the
21:14hours you're asked to work the things you're meant you're asked to do especially um as um well
21:21women or non-binary people um yeah it can be really important to sort of be able to know that
21:28you can say no and draw a line and that's not disrespectful and that's not um you you can do
21:36that yeah yeah i think i always felt that i had such imposter syndrome or felt like i was so green or
21:42so inexperienced that i i had to take everything everyone else was saying as gospel and i think that
21:47yeah it's been a huge breakthrough so very recently to learn to advocate for myself has anybody had an
21:55experience of saying no and realizing oh i got away with that yes please share yes and yes
22:03no it's um see when you real when your body and your mind are pushed to a certain degree
22:12and you understand your limit you will resist right i was on a film things were being asked of me and i
22:20was expressing the need to not and i was like how many times does a woman of color have to ask for
22:27something to go the way i need for it to go and then you just you could sorry table um you you you go
22:36hard and that when you're pushed to a certain degree i mean i'm a taurus like don't push me against
22:41the wall because then you have to charge out why do women have to do that why do non-binary people
22:46have to do that you know it shouldn't be about being pushed to a certain degree in order to
22:51articulate your need um and so yeah when i realized that i was like oh yeah you you don't want to have
22:58to to go across the line don't do that anymore articulate articulate okay you not listen to me on
23:05the second third time that's it that's it you know is it oprah i'm hoping it's oprah who said
23:11hear the no like some people just can't hear the no and it's okay to say to someone yes why aren't
23:17you hearing me say no it's okay like and i think a lot of the time what you're dealing with is people
23:21obviously projecting onto you i can't tell you how many times i've said something so calmly
23:25like to the point of i'm almost asleep no i don't want to do that and um i get all right whoa whoa
23:31whoa whoa whoa whoa i couldn't be less aggressive i actually and then i then i'm like there and then
23:37i am like slightly aggressive but i feel like i my it's really difficult i noticed when i first started
23:44acting i was like oh this takes up a lot of time and a lot of my life and i'm expected to give a lot
23:49of my life over and even then i was like i don't think that's actually okay and now what i've
23:54noticed is i've just started to not think i have to do anyone a favor like i don't i'm being employed
24:00to do a job you're paying me i'm here i'm here i'm committed i want to do this this is great
24:05because an industry is creative i think sometimes i think there is an idea that it doesn't have to
24:10be professional and i really am a firm believer it should always be it's professional like it's like
24:15there are boundaries and they should be respected that's what i think it's okay to say
24:18we are going to work until 8 p.m and then we stop i'm sorry i i yes i know the day's running long but
24:26i i have to go home and i have a child i have another life like today i am not going to go over
24:31and it not to be seen that you are letting people down or bringing the film down like you want to or
24:36the whatever you're doing like you want to do it you want to be there but that i think this industry
24:42sometimes really does need limits it doesn't have any so i don't know what i'm talking about but like
24:47i think i feel like i just i think voicing it's important i think it we like people should talk
24:52about it because otherwise yeah it charges whatever the system or dynamic that we're working
24:58in because each production is a system and starts to articulate its own kind of you know qualities
25:03along the way you say i gotta go home my child needs me i'm doing this period and then they will
25:10adjust the others will act crazy but we have to force them to adjust i'll call you a crazy bitch
25:16i think that's the other thing there's a fear there's a fear of saying like i won't i can't
25:21work past this hour i physically can't do it and that's yeah like gonna damage my working ability
25:25for the next like tomorrow or the next day and i think there's a real fear of being thought of as
25:30a crazy bitch or a diva or like you hear these horror stories of people being like oh yeah i work
25:33with so and so and you know and you're like oh god i don't want to be like that and it's such a
25:38sort of self-fulfilling prophecy isn't it it's yeah yeah isn't it so interesting everybody seems to
25:43just need to be able to agree to say we're quitting it eat you know yeah then nobody's the crazy bitch
25:49and yeah and it doesn't have to be a fight it's okay like it's all right like calm down everyone
25:54i'm just gonna go home when you're sort of figuring out your relationship with a director
26:00how much is it that stuff versus the creative stuff well it's hard because you don't want to
26:05it's it's when when you're on a hard shoot like what claire and danielle are talking about you know
26:12where the hours are really long the crew's exhausted you're exhausted and you know it's a technically
26:18difficult job it's stressful to um interfere with your relationship with the director because your
26:24relationship with the director is should be purely creative and it's scary to think about the two of
26:32you not getting along or saying something what if he gets mad at me if i say i want to if i need to
26:37leave at eight and then he's mad at me and then tomorrow i you know it's going to be strange yeah it's
26:42going to be weird and awkward he's going to say something that's going to make me uncomfortable you
26:45know it's it's a it's it can be a fragile relationship yeah i mean i thinking michelle about when
26:52you're on a movie like the fablemans you're literally playing spielberg's mom i mean does that
26:58mean you get to tell him when to rap i don't know no what i think what i'm thinking about is how often
27:05how often actors are made to feel like children and that we don't get information it's sort of kept
27:12somewhere it's kept away from us because i feel like they think we aren't they can't trust us with
27:22the information because we might do something with it that's contrary to what they want us to do
27:27with it and that you always have this feeling of like something is happening somewhere and i can hear
27:32whispers of it yeah but it's not getting to me and i don't have the information and it's so
27:37frustrating um but i've i don't know it's happening less and less
27:45i think in my experience right now in like the last few years i really do feel feel a shift like
27:54i feel a difference after me too i really do i don't know if that's if you guys feel that or not
28:01but i just i feel like there's more information flowing because there's more information flowing
28:06between all of us and i think we're a little scary and powerful and i feel the i i see more
28:20information coming to me and saying like now based on the information what decision do you want to make
28:26with it that we're just being trusted more i don't know is that just me no no it's not i've definitely
28:33felt a shift as well sarah polly the director i did with the women talking with she's the most
28:37amazing i mean she's just the most inspiring amazing woman ever and obviously she was an actor
28:42is an actor as well but she said that with this film what she did was she prioritized the experience
28:48as opposed to the outcome of what the movie was going to be and i think that so rarely that's what
28:52happens and so rarely that's what's protected that the experience of making we've got to enjoy make
28:57i think the end game is so often the case especially with things if everything involves money but it's so
29:02often where you're trying to get to make something good as opposed to just trying to believe that
29:07what you're doing in that precise moment is good it is good and it feels good and the crew are happy
29:12and everyone's fed and everyone's had eight hours sleep and you know and she did extraordinary things
29:18on that film yeah yeah well she she's got three kids so she was the hours were this is what we're
29:25going to try and do if we can't do it we're going to talk to you about it you know and my daughter
29:28was sick at the end of the movie and i was like by that point so homesick that she was like just go
29:33just go just go and shoot you out you're gone you're gone got the flight maybe like i was like
29:36pushed onto the airplane i was like that would never ever happen it's doable it takes yeah it is
29:41doable she really made the time have you read her have you read her book yeah it's amazing it's amazing
29:46she published this book called run towards danger and it's so beautiful and it's like essays from a
29:50body of memory and it's about like yeah experiences she's had in her life with um i mean so many things
29:56but one of them is like her experience of acting as a child and the situation she was put in
30:00definitely before there's any kind of shift in the industry and it's yeah you just feel like she's
30:04learned so much through doing and i think that there's working with directors who've been actors
30:09themselves i recently worked with law who did chatily you see acted before and you just feel like
30:14there's an understanding and also it creates this ability for you to be able to articulate something
30:20because you know that they'll understand because they'll have been there it's relatable
30:23yeah which makes such a huge difference how did that show up on lady chatterless lover there was a
30:29real feeling like well i think because we're quite close in age it was just like a nice i just felt
30:36like i could talk to her about anything and also given the nature of what we were doing like so many
30:40sex scenes and so much nudity um yeah law being a woman was incredibly comforting and there was a
30:47it was just felt very safe and i really felt like i could talk to her about anything and really
30:53express my limits of like comfort or not comfort yeah i mean there's so much freedom in that damn movie
31:00so much that i would i mean you have to trust your director yeah i didn't think i could have done it
31:07the most important thing so i see that in every quality of how you're moving through the film
31:12and the relationship that y'all had on i like that
31:16i think with our movie the the daniels had to be so prepared because we are an indie film right
31:25so and there was so many things to be done and we did the film in 37 days over six weeks
31:31no you didn't no oh yes we did yes we worked every day but we were very conscious of the fact
31:39that you know when you're so tired there's no point pushing and forcing you to do it because
31:43it's just not going to come even if you do more and extend the hours yes and people get hurt people
31:50and you can see it's not there and it will never you know come again so what we do is like we have
31:56very fixed times and i think that's very important then you understand i have this time i have to use
32:02it to the best of my ability but at the same time they always took the first um 15 minutes of the
32:09morning to bring everybody onto the set like you know the departments that you will never see because
32:15they're hiding at the back and making the props or you know getting the costumes ready and we have
32:20like what we call the warm-up session the bonding session so we do like crazy exercises and yeah
32:2515 minutes we will take turns into appreciating everyone and then once we start off the the
32:35starting block that was it we were all you know motivated we go go go and right at 12 hours
32:42we'll stop we have a 12-hour turnaround which makes such a big difference but this is also something
32:49that i've put i mean i've gotten to this stage in my career where i said i can't do it because
32:55i know myself by now if you force me to give you that 16 17 hours at the end of the day you can
33:01see me fade you can just see her go like
33:03so that i think that if you set ground rules you know but you have to work to be able to
33:11set those ground rules i think that experience for me was very uh fruitful because you felt that your
33:18time was not just wasted it was there and you were all in good energy and good form and there was no one
33:23that was ever going like oh i can't come to work tomorrow you know you're so refreshed and you
33:28want to be there so that that was a really really good experience is it silly that when we get to
33:34talking about acting in terms of awards that we divide it by gender should it just be
33:40best actor period and we don't we don't have a table for each
33:45no then there's more for everyone
33:48i mean it's silly isn't it because is there a best i mean i mean i probably shouldn't say this
33:54but is there a best act like it's like the whole concept is slightly skew already so i don't really
33:59know how you figure that out yeah i can't remember who said it i'm but my my husband told me it's an
34:08actress who said it maybe you guys know she said something like we all love to run but they make us
34:13wear colors and i just thought that was so beautiful like maybe there's just no best there's
34:19just like people making stuff yeah i think that in the way that the world is heading and the shifts
34:30that we're making towards representation across the board i think that there needs to be a change
34:35so that people who are non-binary or however you present or identify yourself feel included and
34:45represented i think it's about feeling acknowledged and feeling seen and um yeah and i but i think there
34:53is a lot of things to be worked out before then for instance i just think that there it also comes
34:58down to there being roles for queer people and i think that there are more and more but i think
35:03that there aren't enough yet that the categories like are changing i think that it's one of those
35:10things that's you know the work has to come from the bottom up um so it's kind of a question of
35:17representation across the board but i get asked this a lot in terms of um being non-binary but
35:22playing female characters and then where i feel comfortable in being considered for awards and
35:29stuff like that and i i don't really know it's very i don't know like it's um
35:35yeah i mean i i play female characters so there's also like is the award for
35:41you know how much does the award have to do with you and your gender or the
35:45the gender of the person who you play like yeah corny's female so
35:49yeah i don't it's it's it's so difficult i think but i think in general
35:54it's all of these conversations are about including and acknowledging those people and
36:00feeling like anyone can identify however they want and still be acknowledged there's been some
36:08conversation about how abortion is portrayed on screen um in tv and movies it tends to look very
36:15different from how it looks in real life does anyone have any thoughts on if there's a
36:21responsibility for tv and movies to adjust to portray it potentially more accurately especially
36:26given the changes at least in the u.s this year
36:30never rarely sometimes always did it the best that i've seen on screen eliza hitman um did this film
36:40about a girl who um needs an abortion but she can't get one in her state so she does a road trip with
36:45her best friend to get one in new york i think it's absolutely incredible but just in terms of like
36:51the way it breaks it really captures the mundanity and the sort of bureaucracy in terms of how you get
36:57it none of it's romanticized or glorified or like altered to you know work on screen it's just very
37:03truthful and um yeah there's an amazing scene where the main character is sitting opposite and
37:09uh and going through a form and that's where the title come comes from she asks her like a series of
37:14questions like on a scale of like never really sometimes always how much do you how often do you
37:19have sex like do you use protection who are you sleeping with and it's like you really it's like all
37:24the intrusive almost triggering sort of questions and that side of the experience which i don't think
37:29is ever really captured on screen yeah as you say all those little details yeah we're well well
37:35shown yeah i think it's critical i mean we're in we're in that moment now um where each state has a
37:42different dynamic going on i have close relationships where it had the bureaucracy is out of control
37:49you have to travel to this state this state can't do it got to go to this state this cake can't do it
37:54got to go here the medical records like all of those stories have to be evinced so that people
38:01understand how stupid it is to try to hinder women's choice i mean the state of georgia has counties
38:09without ob-gyns people have to drive across state hundreds of miles just to get a pap smear just to
38:17get medical care because the attack is that's on our that's on femininity yeah that's dncs are just
38:28as much a medical procedure i had one when i had a miscarriage if i didn't get a dnc i could have
38:34gotten an infection i could have died um so i think back to the way it's portrayed in films i think
38:42anytime an abortion is portrayed as killing babies is not helpful with that imagery um
38:50as emma was saying the the bigger picture of what someone's going through when they're in a medical
38:56situation brought on by sex and i um i think that's an important a more important part of the story
39:05more helpful for for women everywhere who need um who need voters to understand that um abortion is
39:15health care it's really interesting i'm going to steal from sarah polly again because she's a genius
39:20basically but she our film is about obsessed with her i'm obsessed with her she's not my favorite
39:25person um but she but she obviously our film is about sexual abuse and rape of you know children and
39:32grown women and um what i think that she's articulates really beautifully is that a lot of
39:38these experiences um whether it's childbirth rape abortion are fetishized by movie makers and they
39:48become something which is less important than the actual human being that it's happening to and the
39:54impact of what that trauma does to them and i think that if we just dealt with that a little bit more
39:59then we would see the humanity of the situation which i think possibly might help a lot of people
40:03to understand it's human beings who are going through these things and that's what's happening
40:07to them in real life and hundreds of thousands of people every day are doing these things instead of
40:11making it you have to look at who's making the movie why they're making it and why they're choosing
40:15to put that scene in it and why are they choosing that frame of reference to portray it what are they
40:20trying to do are they fetishizing it and using it because it's gratuitous or that it's what does it say
40:25about that person that woman whoever it is like what does it say like i just think we have to ask
40:30ourselves so many questions we've got such responsibility yes for making sure that it's not
40:35just because it looks good on film well it's so interesting as you're talking claire i'm realizing
40:40there's trauma in the three movies of jen danielle and claire each of your movies has a character who's
40:46recovering from trauma but doesn't actually show it so the rapes aren't shown the beating isn't shown
40:52the war injury isn't shown it's such an interesting choice and it's pretty counterintuitive i think
40:59for filmmaking was that something that you and your filmmakers talked about at all i mean it's
41:03obviously we definitely did tanoya walked to i mean in the conversation that she which she had
41:08with the producers three years before you know coming to now um it was intentional to not show any
41:13violence um we all know that violence we've seen that violence there are plenty of black and white
41:19images to that galvanized us of uh the civil rights movement in that way but and also it was about
41:26the point of view of mamie and so mamie wouldn't know that right or she wouldn't she wouldn't have
41:32witnessed that um and it was also to not re-traumatize the filmmakers to not re-traumatize the
41:38audience um this was about the arc of someone who comes into an understanding of their power in a
41:44certain way and so yeah she intentionally did female directors too yeah yeah was that how conscious
41:51was that in the case of your film done because i know you shot some some war sequences um we did we
41:57shot it and i think less so for um the idea of seeing violence and and traumatizing people it was more
42:08of i think we once we got into the edit room it was clear it was more powerful to tell a story about
42:14ptsd in the present um by somebody who's haunted by the past and somebody who's making leaps and you
42:23know and and um healing not being linear and it almost feels like when you're when you're reading a
42:33book and you can picture something you know you know that this thing happened and it's kind of it
42:37leaves room for the audience to connect more with this character instead of it being about this
42:42specific thing that happened here and it looked like this what does that mean to you this person
42:47is healing from trauma they're trying to learn how to forgive you know how does that make you feel
42:54it almost includes more people the less specific it gets that is interesting that there that was three
43:00female directors um that made that choice is it easier to get a film with a female director made
43:07now than it used to be anybody had that you made such a face i have to ask
43:15easier than it used to be yes yeah still hard i mean you produced causeway so i assume you had some
43:21we did and i we just we it was making me laugh when we were talking about the hours and stuff because it
43:27was just so interesting to be on a female-led movie my producing partner and i were the lead producers
43:33on it we had a female director the schedule made sense there were no huge fights if an actor if an
43:42actor had a personal thing that and wanted to leave early instead of going oh well we'd all love to leave
43:49early we'd put our heads together and go okay how can we yeah like how can we figure this out we disagreed
43:56um and there was and we listened to each other's point of views sometimes i was wrong and would
44:04learn that i was wrong and sometimes i was right um and it was it was incredible to not be around toxic
44:14masculinity to get a little break from it and we would always it it did always just kind of make us
44:19laugh about how we are you know how we ended up with the um you know women shouldn't be in roles like
44:25this because we're just so emotional and we're just you know so and it's just i have seen i mean
44:32i've worked with brian singer i've seen i've seen emotional men i've seen i mean the biggest hissy fits
44:39i've ever seen thrown on set i've been i've watched a man i've i've worked she's i think my third female
44:47director and she's they they are the uh calmest uh best decision makers i've ever worked with i
44:55absolutely love working with with female directors but um yes it's getting easier this is i just think
45:03about y'all's film right like and how you're talking about oh i get to be this person this and have this
45:09kind of outburst like there's just a different kind of respect and comfort in dealing with
45:16personalities and emotions and i think of those scenes all of the women talking and having the you
45:23know having the outburst or being one being more demure and quiet and there's space for everybody to
45:30exist and no like sometimes with a man like if an outburst is had there is recoil there is fear there's
45:39all of this emotion where you you can't be a full self but as a result of even you know your character
45:45having an outburst or anybody else having an outburst okay they had it and yet i'm still going
45:50to articulate my need i thought that was so powerful like it's but and being a part of a community where
45:57everybody all of them are repressed and yet what somebody's also saying oh they have all these
46:02different ways of saying what they need to to to to get you know i just it just i feel like that
46:08sometimes is how female it sits function everybody gets to be who they are yeah yeah yeah michelle it
46:18must have been pretty extraordinary to have steven spielberg with the stature that he has being so
46:23vulnerable as it sounds like he was on the fablemans i mean he's he's kind of opening up his whole family
46:30history and he's described kind of losing it sometimes when he saw you in his mom's clothes
46:35what was that like for you as an actor i feel like i'm like stuck like 10 minutes ago trying to figure
46:40out if you can how and if you can portray violence and rape without it being fetishized i've thought so
46:53much about it because you're you you so often see it in scripts and you're like how how it feels
47:00i and and hearing that i have i have a six week old so i haven't seen the movies but i hearing about
47:09how these films were created and that you you don't see what happened that it isn't because you don't
47:17know where it's gonna go like i i don't think that you can you can't trust that it isn't going to be
47:25fetishized when you put it into like the wrong person's hands and that if you can concentrate
47:32on the women and what their experience is and not concentrate on it's just really i'm like i'm so
47:39moved to hear that this is happening like i really i'm like wow there's so much change just so much
47:45change at this table it's um it's just like incredibly moving i feel like i'm uh absorbing some i
47:54don't know what the question was but i'm just wow glad you you were moved by i think it's pretty
48:00extraordinary too just having watched films in the industry um for as long as i have and my question
48:06was about steven spielberg who's someone we think of as this you know vaunted venerable filmmaker showing
48:14up seeing you dressed as his mom in a house made to look like his kitchen and and you know kind of
48:19breaking down does that for you as an actress make you go oh crap or does that make you go awesome
48:29yeah because you just don't know i mean we didn't rehearse there's you're not we didn't really
48:34you sort of everybody was sort of prepping in their separate sections and then you sort of come
48:39together and we we hadn't we hadn't said words out loud and we hadn't um we didn't have screen
48:44tests we didn't you just so you really show up on the day that you're meant to start filming with the
48:50person that you've been working on you don't know and um so yeah to see him have an emotional reaction
48:58just meant you're you're on the path and now you all get to to walk it together um i have some light
49:06questions as we wind down i know i hate you with abortion and trauma and a million things these are easy i
49:12i swear um okay best way to decompress after shooting something really intense margaritas okay
49:22martinis locked and loaded
49:27any others i mean i love my reality tv yeah
49:35emma what's your go-to all of them
49:38um love island which is great
49:43really guilty pleasure i'm so sorry god all of them below deck oh yeah i just finished all the
49:48below decks i had covet so i'm pretty caught up what is it about that that allows you to just kind of
49:54like slip into the space just doesn't require any thought just completely yeah but do you okay may i
50:03i try to defend myself please i had to defend myself to woody harrelson one time he came into my
50:09trail was like are you really gonna watch all this garbage and here's what i have to say about the
50:15garbage you're watching interpersonal relationships that are as real as far as i can see they're real
50:21i've never made a reality tv show so it's real it's real it's real i mean i'm watching this fascinating
50:27dynamic between like there's the narcissist that clearly has borderline my favorite diagnosis is
50:32i love diagnosing people with borderline on reality tv i'm studying and i'm a hero that's all i have to
50:40say about it i'm not gonna lie watch love is blind it's the best show ever it's crazy i fast forward
50:46through the ceremonies just yeah now i'm on the now i'm on the reunion it's a new one good i haven't
50:52started it so good okay it does it just doesn't know you're out you're not like what's i talking
50:57about it's fine go home right now and watch it there's three series to i mean honestly we have a
51:04great one in the uk naked attraction oh my god i've heard about that one you guys have the best reality
51:10show ever that i don't know why we is um don't tell the bride what's that it was a british reality
51:16whole wedding and they get the dress chosen by the husband and they always turn up in a helicopter
51:19and like it's really i've never seen them show up in a helicopter the best one i saw so it's the
51:24the groom plans the entire wedding and the bride can't know about it and sometimes it's great and
51:29romantic and like oh these colors are horrible but thank you honey and then sometimes they break up
51:34over it like one woman was like not vegas not vegas not vegas guess what it was vegas and he didn't
51:41invite her sister borderline okay last question what's your desert island movie the thing you
51:52could watch over and over and over again and it's always bridget jones bridget jones way really yeah
51:58that just is what i end up watching over and over and over again when harry met sally's mine you've got
52:04mail mail you've got mail y'all are cute i watched lord of the rings one over and over again because
52:13i'm in love with column i'll say it everywhere i go yeah i'm not doing it don't ask me
52:23i can do it i'm really good at it but i'm gonna keep this refined
52:27is it the voice yeah yeah well he's got big eyes and great hands something about this
52:38it literally was five seconds when he said you weren't gonna do it and she asked the question
52:42the whole time she was like gollum gollum gollum don't say gollum
52:49michelle williams do you have a music oh mine that's mine too really
52:54yes it's a michelle thing yeah you guys have a real connection um well i thank you all so much
53:01this has been a great conversation really appreciate it thank you thanks guys
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