00:00Our next guest just produced a new film about Wall Street, which is adapted from his book, Discussion Materials, that draws upon his experiences in investment banking.
00:08I'm pleased to welcome Bill Keenan. He is writer and producer of the Bull Run film and author of Discussion Materials, and he joins us here in studio.
00:14So, Bill, good to speak with you. Bull Run adds to the canon of Wall Street movies. Is this a drama? Is this a comedy? Is this a romance?
00:23More of a satire.
00:25Okay. Yeah. So, look, there's a lot of classics out there. I think the story that everyone knows is the story of getting caught up in the greed and the money and the excess and then corruption and then redemption.
00:39Wall Street, big short.
00:40Exactly. And I think Bull Run, the protagonist, he's an outsider, but he retains that distance throughout the entire film.
00:46And it's been a healthy level of skepticism because ultimately this is an exploration of the absurdity that I witnessed on Wall Street.
00:54Right. And this movie is based on your book, Discussion Materials, which I tend to think of as like a 2020 version of Liar's Poker, except you're not chronicling bond traders in the bond floor, but you are chronicling investment bankers overall.
01:07You were working at Deutsche Bank as this rookie investment banker.
01:11At what point did you realize this is something that you want to write about as opposed to pursue your long-term career?
01:16Yeah. I think it was really like my first two days on the job.
01:21So day one, I didn't know where my computer was. I didn't know where my desk was.
01:26I was called over to the staffer and he gave me three names and he gave me an address.
01:31And basically I had to go to Midtown Manhattan and take these three energy executives around to these private equity firms to try to help them raise money for this new venture.
01:42And of course, I said to the staffer, you know, I just started here. I don't know what I'm doing.
01:45And he said, well, don't tell them that because for all they know that you're an expert in the energy sector.
01:52So thrown into the fire day one, Monday, it's very terrifying and it's exciting.
01:58And then day two, Tuesday, I show up. I'm planted at my desk for 12 hours and I was tasked on a fertilizer deal.
02:05And basically I had to make charts of cow dung spot prices historically over time in different markets.
02:11And then the managing director in that sector, he had recently undergone gastric bypass surgery.
02:18So he lost 80 pounds and he wanted his newer, slimmer headshot to be updated in all the pitch decks.
02:25So Monday and Tuesday, what would Wednesday bring?
02:29And I just felt like after those two experiences, this is a world that I couldn't help but write about.
02:35And so when you went to meetings with managing directors where everyone kind of gave their, you know, overview of what they're seeing in their corner of the market,
02:43you were sitting there taking notes for your book as opposed to?
02:46Absolutely.
02:47OK.
02:47Yeah. I mean, I was I think I got a lot of credit early on because people saw these this guy who's the guy with the notebook and furiously taking notes in the corner of the room.
02:57And obviously, it was not so much about, you know, what was happening with interest rates as much as it was like, you know, who's doing what to whom here.
03:05And what people are saying.
03:06This is your second book that's been turned into a movie.
03:09Your first book was Odd Man Rush, which was about your adventures in European pro hockey after playing college hockey at Harvard.
03:15So both your books have been adapted into films.
03:18What is that actual process like to adapt a book, your own book, into a movie?
03:22What what I love, the reason I start with books is that I'm always fascinated by the minutiae of these worlds.
03:29And and I think that in order to lend itself to a screen and make it visually compelling, you have to take the drama, you know, and look in banking.
03:39It was me versus Excel, me versus PowerPoint, me in my cubicle taking, you know, phone calls from people.
03:44I didn't know who they were, but I knew that they I had screwed something up on their behalf.
03:48And so how did how do we take that retain that sensibility, the drama, the humor, everything that I felt and make it into something that would be, you know, commercially appealing, visually appealing.
03:59And so that was a lot of what the director was able to do.
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