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Qui paiera pour le réarmement de l’Europe ? Schirdewan et Terras s’affrontent dans The Ring
Dans le deuxième épisode de The Ring, nous débattons du thème hautement politique du réarmement de l’Europe, devenu un objectif géopolitique de la Commission européenne.
LIRE L’ARTICLE : http://fr.euronews.com/2025/11/13/qui-paiera-pour-le-rearmement-de-leurope-schirdewan-et-terras-saffrontent-dans-the-ring
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Dans le deuxième épisode de The Ring, nous débattons du thème hautement politique du réarmement de l’Europe, devenu un objectif géopolitique de la Commission européenne.
LIRE L’ARTICLE : http://fr.euronews.com/2025/11/13/qui-paiera-pour-le-rearmement-de-leurope-schirdewan-et-terras-saffrontent-dans-the-ring
Abonnez-vous à notre chaine. Euronews est disponible sur Dailymotion en 12 langues
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NewsTranscription
00:00Hello there and welcome to The Ring, Euronews' brand new debating show, broadcasting from the European Parliament here in Brussels.
00:17Once a week, two elected members of the European Parliament go face to face on some of the most pressing issues of our time.
00:24This week we zoom in on the topic of rearming Europe and ask the crucial points who will pay.
00:33Europe wants to rearm fast.
00:36Since Russia's invasion of Ukraine, EU countries have been pouring billions into defence.
00:43The upside? A European Union that is more secure and less dependent on the US.
00:48Supporters argue that a bigger defence industry also means more jobs and a stronger geopolitical role for Europe.
00:57The downside? The cost.
00:59Critics say that every euro spent on tanks and drones is one euro less for schools, hospitals or climate action.
01:08So the question isn't just how much to spend, but how to spend.
01:12Can Europe find a balance?
01:18But can Europe find a balance? That is the question we have for our contenders. Let's meet them.
01:26Rio Teres, Estonian army general and member of the European Parliament for the EPP Centre-Rite Group.
01:33Vice President of the Security and Defence Committee.
01:37A cheerleader for defence spending, he has stated,
01:40Martin Scherdewan, co-chair of the left group in the European Parliament.
01:54He strongly criticises shifting money away from social programmes to defence.
02:00His verdict on the European Commission's Rearm Europe plan was blunt.
02:06Investing billions in war will not make the world safer or more peaceful, he said.
02:14Rio Teres and Martin Scherdewan, welcome to the ring.
02:18The idea here is to give our viewers a taste of your debates inside the European hemicycle.
02:24So I hope you feel right at home.
02:26Rio Teres, let's start with you.
02:27You say the market should be providing defence equipment, but with tight budgets, who should pay?
02:33Nations should pay.
02:34But nations are broke.
02:36Nations aren't broke.
02:37They have been able to spend money on many other things, for example, climate change.
02:42At the current moment, where the war is imminent in Europe, we need to get stronger
02:47because Europe has not spent enough in the last 35 years.
02:53We are not talking about arms race, we are talking about fulfilling the promises we have made
02:59ourselves many years ago.
03:01But where is that money going to come from?
03:04Well, as Rio said, for now it's coming from the public budget.
03:08And this is, of course, a problem because every euro invested into the arms manufacturers
03:13will not go into, for instance, hospitals, schools, digital infrastructure or the necessary transition
03:21of our industry.
03:23So this is a huge problem.
03:25I would suggest that we take the money from those who have it, that we discuss new own
03:29resources for the European budget.
03:32And that means that we tax the rich, that we tax multinational enterprises, and that we
03:37also discuss something like a digital taxation for big tech companies.
03:40Would you agree with this idea?
03:41No, not at all.
03:42I think the defense is still a prerogative of the nations and not the European Union as
03:47a whole.
03:48So the nations themselves need to fulfill their own promises.
03:53And if somebody tells me that it is not possible to build up a social state and invest in the
03:58defense, that's wrong, because history has shown us that German, Federal Republic of
04:03Germany, during many years in the Cold War, was able to build up one of the most capable
04:09social systems in the world.
04:11At the same time, they invested 3.5% on the GDP on defense, because it is necessary and
04:17people understood why.
04:18What about the idea of defense euro bonds, Martin Schrodovan?
04:21Well, first of all, we don't have a Marshall plan today for the European Union, European
04:25defense, because you were referring to Germany.
04:27That was the case back in the day.
04:29So there were huge investments coming from the international community to Germany.
04:33But this is not the case today.
04:34So we need to really think about how to raise money.
04:37And you mentioned euro bonds for the arms industry.
04:39I don't think that this is a good idea, because we are already on the way to take on more debts
04:45by giving loans to the member states that they can then invest into military purposes.
04:52So I do not think that this is a good idea to go on following this wrong path.
04:57I think we are derailing the discussion here.
04:59It's not about to spend money on health care systems or defense.
05:04It's about defending Europe, because we see that an aggressive Russia is willing and able
05:10to use conventional military weapons against countries.
05:13And Putin has very often declared that he wants to rearrange the security system in Europe.
05:19And if we are not ready, if we don't fulfill our own taken tasks, then we are not able
05:25to defend Europe as a whole and separate countries of it.
05:29And Martin Shutdown, that is a fair point, what Rio Terrace makes there.
05:32Because just think of Brussels just the other day.
05:34The airport was shut down for 30 minutes because of drone incursions, allegedly Russian drone
05:40incursions, buzzing over Dool, the nuclear plant, right by the port of Antwerp.
05:44Brussels had to call the UK in order to come and help, but wasn't able to defend itself
05:48in this situation.
05:49Yeah, exactly.
05:49That was supposedly a Russian drone.
05:51We don't know that yet.
05:52Well, I'm not defending Russia here.
05:53Maybe it was Russia.
05:54Maybe it was the third country.
05:55Maybe it was a private here.
05:56Who knows?
05:57But obviously, Europe is tested also in its military capabilities.
06:02So, of course, we need to do something in order to discuss how to defend the European
06:06Union, how to defend the member states, in case there would be a violation of international
06:11law, meaning an attack against one of the member states.
06:14This is not the case so far.
06:15So we can take time, but just a little bit, to discuss how to spend wisely the money that
06:20we have at our hands into defense.
06:23And a new security order does not only depend on defense capabilities, it also depends on
06:29how we implement international law, how we strengthen international organizations.
06:34And this is something that I'm really missing, especially in the discussion of the conservatives.
06:38Reaction to that?
06:40Now, I agree that there are all other mechanisms there, but the one and the only which really
06:45is understood by Putin is if you have more weapons than him, he has.
06:51So it is very easy for me, very plain.
06:54If you are strong enough, then he will start to negotiate.
06:57If you are not strong, he will laugh about you, as he has done throughout the years in
07:01the last two decades.
07:03And are you pleased with the trends lately?
07:05We've seen defense spending has gone up in the past few years, Rio Terrace.
07:09According to Eurostat, between 2021 and 2024, the total of defense spending of the EU countries
07:16rose by 37 percent, whereas when it comes to social protection, it only rose by a tiny
07:22bit.
07:23How do you feel when you read this data, Martin Sherdogan?
07:26Well, I think this is completely out of line, this development.
07:29I mean, Rio referred to Russia and the threat Russia poses to the European Union.
07:34And this is always the explanation why we have to spend more and more and more money into
07:39our defense capabilities.
07:40But I think, actually, that we really need to discuss what that means.
07:46In the end, it means a new way...
07:47Well, what is your solution then to protect Europe?
07:48Imagine if there was potentially an invasion, if an EU member state was...
07:51If we have a look at the numbers, let's take a look at the numbers.
07:54NATO is spending nine or ten times what Russia is spending for its defense and military capabilities.
08:01Even the European NATO members, they spend four times what Russia spends.
08:06So there is no rational explanation why we should again spend more and more.
08:09But what about Russia's nuclear arsenal?
08:13They have 5,500 nuclear...
08:15They have that for decades now.
08:16That is no new development, right?
08:18How can we deter against that threat?
08:20The problem is that we have been spending less and less and less throughout the last 30 years.
08:25It's not about we are spending more.
08:27It's about starting to spend at all.
08:31Because the defense spendages, if you look from 1990 to 2020, then you will see how much we have lost, how big period of time we have lost, because we have not invested what we promised ourselves.
08:45It's not about 5%, 10%, it's about just 2%.
08:49It's exactly the same amount of money that Estonia saved introducing the digital government system.
08:56Is it possible to find the balance, do you think?
08:59It would be possible if you would look for other resources.
09:03And as I said, we need to discuss the introduction of new own resources.
09:07And now we have the discussion with the Mighty Annual Financial Framework, which allows us to look at new own resources.
09:12And this, for me, of course, means that we need to redistribute wealth in a society if we have those challenges in front of us.
09:18And we need to tackle them.
09:19I agree.
09:20We need to tackle the challenges.
09:21That's not going to happen.
09:22But therefore, we need money.
09:23That's not going to happen.
09:24I mean, the budget talks have already kicked off in Brussels.
09:26We can see how torturous they are.
09:27The strength of the European Union lies also on competitiveness.
09:32And if we start to introduce new taxes and distribute wealth, which we don't have right now,
09:38because we are not in the very good economical situation, then we will have less money to spend on defense.
09:45So we need to make Europe competitive again, which it's not right now.
09:51At the same time, we need to invest.
09:53And not the European Union, but the countries need to invest what they have promised to their defense.
09:59But then, Rio, really, you need to mention that.
10:02Because you're not doing that, then I will do it.
10:04Each euro invested into arms manufacturers means that there is no money left for social cohesion, for instance.
10:12And this will cause a new wave of austerity in Europe, which in the end means that those who have the least, suffer the most,
10:19working-class families, will pay for this arms race that you are advocating for.
10:24Well, that conflict is not existent.
10:26We see in Estonia, the government decided to spend 5% on the GDP on defense.
10:32And the Estonian mothers want the mother care as well.
10:34But the people are supporting it by 80% because they understand the urgency of the situation.
10:40And you don't need social services in Russia.
10:42Because as we see in Donetsk, Russia does not give you social services.
10:47It kills your people, your children, and all so on.
10:50But this is not Russia.
10:52The European Union people are used to relying on this.
10:55This is not a discussion.
10:56But our citizens expect us to invest into public services and social security systems.
11:01And defense.
11:01And they are rightfully doing so.
11:02And make sure that the country exists.
11:04Yes, I mean, they do exist.
11:07At the moment where it is attacked by Russia, it is not forgiven.
11:11And that is the discussion about.
11:13Well, let me stop you there, as it is now time to take the gloves off.
11:20Now, I want to give our viewers a real taste of the European Parliament chambers,
11:27where MEPs fire hard questions at each other.
11:30That means Rio Terras and Martin Shredovan will now have the opportunity to challenge each other directly,
11:36just like you do in the hemicycle.
11:38So, Martin Shredovan, can you start, please?
11:40Rio, we met before.
11:43And do you often say that this war in Ukraine will be won on the battlefields?
11:48Now, then, since Trump engaged in whatsoever diplomatic efforts,
11:54and even Ursula von der Leyen changed her language,
11:56do you still believe that this war will be won on the battlefield while Russia is advancing?
12:01Or do you agree with me that we need to ramp up our diplomatic efforts to end this war?
12:06Well, I have always been in the position and think that dialogue is the best way.
12:12But dialogue needs two sides.
12:15If one side is not willing to talk, you can do whatever you want.
12:19Putin will not come back to the table if we are not strong enough.
12:23And right now, Putin does not think we are strong enough,
12:26and we are not supporting Ukraine in the numbers where we really need to do.
12:30Yes, the war is won at the battlefield.
12:32And Putin invaded a country, and it seems like he's literally getting away with it.
12:36Rio Teres, it's your opportunity now to address the question to Martin Shredovan.
12:40The response to that, are you really sure that the known war criminal, Putin,
12:48is willing to come to the negotiation table in the situation
12:52where he has not listened to any discussions beforehand?
12:57And why you think so?
12:59And should we sit with the four criminals at one table?
13:02Well, we need to end this war.
13:04This should be the objective here, not judging that war criminal.
13:07I agree, he is a war criminal, but we need to end this war.
13:11And therefore, we need to discuss how to...
13:12So, discussion with a war criminal is legal.
13:13Please let me answer.
13:14Please let me reply.
13:15And therefore, we need to end this war, and therefore, we need to think about how to do it.
13:19And I think there are several options on the table.
13:22First, engaging in a more coordinated diplomatic effort, like including also in taking on board China,
13:30who wields a huge influence over Russia, and also India.
13:35Russia is dependent on, economically dependent on India.
13:38So, we need to take them on board.
13:39And then, of course, we need to target the sanctions.
13:42We have a sanctions regime in place, but we need to be more precise in targeting the industrial military complex of Russia.
13:49Do you endorse the fact that Viktor Orban, the prime minister of Hungary, and the Slovakian Robert Fijo,
13:55have the lines still directly open to Moscow and Beijing?
13:57Do I endorse that Trump invited Putin to Anchorage, Alaska?
14:03Well, what can I say about that?
14:05He did that, and he kicked off, as hard as it is to admit for European politicians,
14:11he kicked off a process that might, in the end, eventually lead to an end, diplomatic end of the war.
14:19Well, we will see if this happens or not.
14:21But he kicked off something new.
14:23Would you agree with that?
14:24It's naive.
14:25It's naive to think that Putin comes to the table.
14:29All attempts of Trump, of Wanderlion, many presidents have called, everybody has called him.
14:35He doesn't care about it, because he feels that he's strong enough to go on with the war.
14:41Time for you to address your next question to Martin Cherdovan.
14:43Putin announced that he wants to rearrange the world order to say what it was in 1997.
14:51So, coming to the discussion table, would you really think that NATO should withdraw from the Baltic states,
14:59from Finland and Sweden, etc., from Poland even, or even from the Eastern Germany,
15:04in order to please Putin and bring him to the discussion table?
15:09But, Rio, I never said something like that.
15:11I never said something like that.
15:13But what I'm proposing is that we work on a stable international security order.
15:20And, of course, NATO plays a role in that.
15:22But we need to take into consideration security guarantees for many political actors now,
15:27like China, like India, like Russia, like European Union, and, of course, the United States.
15:32But that means to rethink a stable international order.
15:36And we are far from that, because the European Commission doesn't play any geopolitical role.
15:42Your chance to address the question now to Rio.
15:45All right.
15:46So, we already touched upon the question of financing our expenditure for military purposes.
15:53And you are advocating for using public money, public budget, which, as I already explained, will lead to austerity, a new wave of austerity.
16:03Would you agree with me that we need new sources to raise money if we want to tackle our challenges both at international level and internally at the social level?
16:16No, I think we should invest more wisely.
16:20We should try to cooperate more.
16:21We should try to make our defense industry more effective so that for every euro we will get more impact.
16:29But never, I would agree, with more taxes on European citizens.
16:36No, not on citizens.
16:37He's referring to tax the rich.
16:38Tax the rich.
16:38But the rich, as far as I know, the rich are the citizens of Europe as much as the poor.
16:44Well, then let's tax U.S., American and Chinese big tech companies.
16:51Would you be in favor of that?
16:53Well, I would say competitiveness is not won by taxes.
16:57It's by investing in the new technologies and by making ourselves stronger, not trying to get money from the others.
17:04Look, we have heard now from Martin Shurdovan and Rio Terras, and I'd like to bring in a new voice now.
17:15The EU Council President, Antonio Costa, has been making headlines of late for his ambitious statements on the future of European defense.
17:23Speaking to EU heads of state and government recently, he said,
17:26To build the Europe of defense, we need efficient political oversight and coordination.
17:32And he said, our defense ministers need to play an increased role.
17:36Martin, how do you interpret this statement?
17:38Is it the first step towards a European defense union or, may I add, an EU army?
17:42Yeah, well, he hasn't been very clear about that.
17:45But what I think he is right about is that we really need to coordinate better.
17:50So, for now, we are just discussing imaginary figures that the European Commission came up with,
17:54based on no assessment of whatsoever we really need.
17:57Is there an appetite, Rio Terras, to coordinate?
18:00I mean, the EU and NATO together, and industry, of course, together, because they're all competing.
18:04Yeah, well, I think NATO has put requirements on the countries, members of NATO,
18:10which are part of the European Union.
18:13So, we have the requirements.
18:14We know the numbers.
18:15But, yes, I think the coordination between the ministers of defense is important
18:19in order to enable Commissioner Kobilius to work with them together,
18:26better solutions for our own defense.
18:28And where is the market hedging its best?
18:30Because we remember a few years ago, everyone in Brussels was discussing the European Green Deal
18:35as the growth model.
18:36Now, it's all about defense.
18:37We should be balanced.
18:38We should not focus on one and then another.
18:41We should do both.
18:42We should be social state also.
18:43I agree.
18:44Well, this week, I mean, this week COP30 is taking place.
18:48How can we rearm Europe by 2030 and also go green?
18:51This is not going to happen with the proposal that the Commission just made
18:54for the multi-financial framework for the EU budget.
18:57It's focusing solely on armament, rearmament Europe,
19:00and not focusing on the Green Deal anymore.
19:02Your party family wants to get rid of the Green Deal.
19:05And it's also putting into question the social state of Europe.
19:08The biggest threat to sustainability of Europe is if Russia attacks European countries.
19:15And again, it's always Russia.
19:18It is.
19:18It is.
19:19Today, backed by China.
19:21Not believing in now thinking that China will be on our side.
19:25Never.
19:26A communist country will never be on European side.
19:28Because we are democracies and we are defending here democracy.
19:32The reason why Russia attacked Ukraine in 2022 and 2014 was because Ukraine wanted to have
19:39an association agreement with the European Union.
19:41It's not about NATO.
19:42It's about free will of a free country.
19:44It is time now to take a short break here on The Ring.
19:47But stay with us.
19:48We will be back very, very soon with some more political punch.
19:51Welcome back to The Ring, Euronews' new weekly show.
20:04I'm joined by MEPs Martin Scherterman from the left and Rio Terras from the European People's Party.
20:09And the idea here is to bring the European Parliament's debates to your couch.
20:14So what about you?
20:14What do you think about the EU's drive to pump up defence?
20:18Well, according to EU data, 78% of Europeans are indeed concerned about the EU's defence
20:26insecurity in the next five years.
20:28That's 8 in 10 Europeans.
20:31How do you feel about that?
20:32I can understand that.
20:34Obviously, the international order is in turmoil.
20:37And of course, we need to provide also to our citizens stability.
20:41And that also means defence stability.
20:43What you're saying is very similar to what the head of the EPP said this week.
20:46He said, alone and naked we stand in a world of storms.
20:50Yeah, well, it only shows that I'm right.
20:52We need to spend more in defence and try to do it clever.
20:56What do your voters think?
20:58Well, our voters, my voters back home understand the necessity.
21:02We understand it already since 2010.
21:05As Estonia was spending 2% of the GDP on defence, as we promised to NATO.
21:09Today, it's 5% plus which we invest.
21:14But the Estonia's problem with 1 million people is that our 100% is too small.
21:19And we need to make sure that countries like Germany, France, Spain and Italy spend the same.
21:27Praising, of course, your country of Estonia, which is obviously your job as an MEP.
21:30But it's a much smaller country.
21:31Other countries like your, in Germany, much bigger challenges in this area.
21:35Yeah, well, the 5% target of the NATO means that Germany has to spend hundreds of millions into the military.
21:43And this is, of course, a huge burden, both for the public budget, but also for the citizens.
21:50And this is debated very controversially in Germany.
21:52And actually, I do not agree with that.
21:55Because the amount of money will only lead to cuts in public services and social security.
21:59And this is unacceptable.
22:00So citizens are not really on board with this plan.
22:0280% of the people in Europe.
22:04They are not that clearly in Germany.
22:07I mean, they are concerned.
22:08They are in Germany also.
22:09It's not that German public is against defence spending.
22:12That is not true.
22:13I think they're concerned until when it comes to the money coming from their pocket.
22:16Well, that's always the case.
22:18And that's why democracy works.
22:20You elect people who take decisions for you.
22:22And then next time you elect the other people.
22:25No, that is too easy.
22:25That is too easy, Leo, because that means actually that public money, meaning taxpayers' money,
22:30meaning our money and the working class families' money,
22:33goes directly into the pockets of the big shareholders of the arms manufacturers.
22:37This is not that easy.
22:38No, it makes Europe stronger.
22:41It makes Europe stronger.
22:43Can you name a single situation where world power without military packing has changed history?
22:52But Martin Sheridan is right.
22:53The arms industry will get much richer.
22:55But will ordinary citizens benefit too?
22:57We should use more SMEs.
22:59We should get the money.
23:00Then we should tax them.
23:01Then we should tax them.
23:02Yeah.
23:02But you don't agree with that idea.
23:03We should not tax the big ones, but we should make sure that the money comes to the SMEs,
23:12to the small technology companies, which right now are disrupting the battlefield in Ukraine.
23:18We need to get the big money, not to the big primes, but to the SMEs who are creating working space,
23:26who are creating jobs for the ordinary people who can earn more money.
23:31The money comes back to you if you are clever enough.
23:34It's a wishful thinking, do you think, Martin Sheridan, this idea to rearm Europe by 2030?
23:38No, not really wishful thinking because there are huge investments on the way.
23:42And I agree with the idea that we need to be capable to defend ourselves.
23:47But as also Rio now confirmed, we need to spend the money more wisely in order to address the new challenges,
23:53cyber attacks, drone warfare, etc.
23:55And we have to be very precise in our assessment what we need as a society, as European society.
24:01And that assessment hasn't been done yet.
24:03And I do completely disagree.
24:05That's why I do completely disagree with the proposals on the table.
24:08And Rio, how are you convincing other countries?
24:10Because, of course, Estonia is very close to Russia.
24:13You feel the threats every day.
24:14Countries, though, like Spain, Italy, Greece, they have other issues on their minds, like migration, for example.
24:19Well, the war criminal Putin is helping us always.
24:22If I have difficulties to convince somebody, he would attack somebody.
24:26And the events in Brussels airport recently show us that everybody is endangered.
24:33Everybody.
24:34From Spain to Portugal, everywhere.
24:36And we need to understand that the migration is not an existential threat.
24:41Migration is a threat to our way of life, to our economy.
24:46But war is an existential threat.
24:49And that is a difference.
24:50Final reaction to that.
24:51Would you agree?
24:51Yeah, well, I really don't get that.
24:53I mean, how can you say that migration?
24:55You put it all in one basket.
24:57You put it all in one basket.
24:59You put it in one basket.
25:00There is no clear political line.
25:01Why do you bring now migrants?
25:02I was not putting it all in one basket.
25:04I was just highlighting the challenges and the issues facing other member states.
25:09But it is now time to move on to our fifth and final round.
25:13Are you ready?
25:18Now it is time for something different.
25:21I'm going to ask you a set of questions.
25:23And I require a yes or no answer.
25:26Is this doable?
25:27I hope so.
25:27Let's find out.
25:29Let's find out.
25:30Should the EU develop its own nuclear deterrence strategy?
25:34Yes or no?
25:35No.
25:37No.
25:38Can the EU ever be a military power?
25:40Yes or no?
25:41It is.
25:43Yes.
25:44What about military conscription?
25:46Is this a good idea?
25:47Yes or no?
25:48I have my doubts.
25:50Conscription is the only way for small countries.
25:52I don't know about big ones.
25:54Should EU countries spend at least 2% of their GDP on defence?
25:57Well, it depends on what we actually need.
26:01Yes or no?
26:01So I would say let's look into it.
26:04Yes, of course.
26:05Not even more.
26:07Is Russia's threat big enough to justify the current surge in spending?
26:11No.
26:11Russia is not justified to do anything at the moment, I think.
26:14Yes, it is.
26:15Will Europe ever be military independent from the United States?
26:18Yes or no?
26:19Yes.
26:20Yes.
26:21Should the EU funds be used to subsidise weapons?
26:24Yes or no?
26:25Yes.
26:25No.
26:27It is not allowed by the European treaties, by the way.
26:30Even though it is on the cards?
26:31Yes.
26:32Should taxpayers accept higher public debt to fund military build-up?
26:37In separate countries, yes.
26:38No.
26:39Should EU defence projects prioritise European companies only, even if it raises costs?
26:43Yes or no?
26:44No.
26:44At the current moment, we need to take whatever is available in the world.
26:48Same question to you?
26:49Yes.
26:49We should prioritise European industry, yes.
26:52And what about drones?
26:54Is the future of warfare on drones?
26:57No.
26:57On people.
26:58Ah, well, the future is on peace.
27:01Final question.
27:02Have you agreed with anything that Martin Sherdogan has said here?
27:05Yes, that we need to be smarter in spending on defence.
27:08What about you?
27:10Well, no, I have my difficulties to find something that I agree with that you just said.
27:17But at least we have brought you together here on The Ring.
27:19Martin Sherdogan and Rio Tarras, thank you so much for being on The Ring.
27:23Thank you so much.
27:23And thank you so much for watching.
27:25If you have a comment for us, do reach out.
27:28The Ring at Euronews.com.
27:30That is our email address.
27:31Tell us how you feel about the EU's focus on defence.
27:35Thanks for watching and see you soon.
27:36Thank you so much for watching and see you soon.
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