01:30During rehearsals, there's a lot of sitting around and waiting for things, lighting checks
01:33and all that stuff.
01:34So I would be down in the pit.
01:35And I remember I was obsessed with the Headless Horseman at the time.
01:38So I wrote a piece of music on the piano in the pit that I titled the Headless Horseman
01:43theme.
01:44And I could probably still play it if I thought about it.
01:48But that's the very first thing I actually remember writing.
01:51Excellent.
01:52You know, which was weird.
01:53I'm still obsessed with the Headless Horseman.
01:56Now, you wrote this theme.
01:58I did.
01:59Very, very.
02:00Well, no, but very early on.
02:02Very early on.
02:02I know.
02:03I'm messing with you.
02:03No, yeah.
02:04But, like, way before I think they were even doing pre-production.
02:09Yes.
02:09It was before they even started shooting.
02:11You know, we did it.
02:13I wrote it in June of whenever the heck that was, whatever year that was.
02:19I don't even know years anymore.
02:20I just know movies.
02:21I'm like, oh, yeah, that was Batman.
02:23Or that was, like, I don't remember the numbers.
02:26But I wrote it because we were doing something at Comic-Con.
02:29They were going to have, like, a big unveil.
02:31And they were going to do, like, a drone show and all of this fun stuff.
02:33And so Kevin Feige, who runs Marvel, said, hey, do you want to, you know, write the theme?
02:38And maybe we could premiere it at Comic-Con.
02:40And I was like, yes, yes, let's do that.
02:43So I wrote the theme.
02:44And I had been thinking about it for a long time because I love the Fantastic Four.
02:49I love what it stands for.
02:50I love, like, the whole world that they embody, all of those things.
02:53I love Jack Kirby's art.
02:55I'm a big comic nerd.
02:56So I just jumped right in.
02:58And I remember Kevin saying, like, well, what are you thinking?
03:01What are you thinking of doing, you know?
03:03And Matt and I had had all these conversations, Matt Shackman, the director.
03:06And I basically told them both.
03:07I said, what I really think is that it should be a mashup of, like, the right stuff and the
03:15Disneyland electric light parade.
03:16I said, to me, that feels like the future, right?
03:19That felt, like, correct.
03:21And even though it was in the 60s, I didn't want to just, like, retread what I had done
03:25on The Incredibles.
03:26So I wanted to do something completely in the other direction with it.
03:29And playing with the synths of the era, all of that was really fun.
03:34And then getting the choir in there to do things that you normally wouldn't do with
03:37them.
03:37And it was just a blast.
03:38So I remember when I told that to Kevin, he looked at me and he was just like, hmm,
03:42okay, we'll see.
03:45And he did that to me before and a couple of times.
03:48But when I played it for him, he was like, oh, I get it.
03:51Yes.
03:52And everyone was, you know.
03:53But what was really fun was then Matt took that to the set.
03:56And he was able to play it for all the actors while they were recording.
04:01Because I had also done, like, Galactus's theme, the Silver Surfer theme.
04:04We did a whole big suite of stuff that we were able to use.
04:07So I think it was very helpful for them to kind of figure out, oh, that's the movie we're
04:11making.
04:11This is the tone.
04:12And it's so rare you get to do that.
04:15And I think anyone who's making movies should hire the composer first.
04:19And, right?
04:20Hire the composer first and then have them write their suite.
04:27Because then they can all get on the same page from day one.
04:29Because, man, people fight about what any movie is all along the way.
04:33It's really fun to watch.
04:34And going back, you really got your 1960s on.
04:38Yeah.
04:39Tell us about a couple of the instruments.
04:40You have the Farfisa.
04:42Farfisa, yes.
04:43I mean, when's the last time you heard of Farfisa?
04:45In ARP 2600.
04:47Yes, in ARP 2600.
04:48We had all of these crazy synths.
04:50The Farfisa thing.
04:51Of course, saxophone sections.
04:52There was all kinds of craziness going on.
04:55And the movie was constantly changing, too.
04:56So you were always, like, chasing things and then not chasing them and doing this.
05:00You know, because as you work on anything, you're figuring it out as you go.
05:03You know?
05:04Even in editorial, you go and shoot a film.
05:06But you really don't know what that movie is until you start putting it together.
05:09You know?
05:10Even if the script, you have the whole script.
05:12It's just always, visually, it's always different.
05:14So it was a lot of experimentation.
05:16A lot of trying things.
05:17I actually wrote a whole nother score for this film that you will never hear.
05:23Well, maybe you'll hear.
05:24I don't know.
05:24We'll release it.
05:25But you probably won't ever hear it.
05:27Because, and I just remember seeing it for the first time with the music.
05:31And something didn't feel right.
05:33And I was, like, told Kevin.
05:34I was, like, you know, I'm going to go back.
05:35I'm going to redo a bunch of this.
05:37And he's, like, wait, what?
05:38What are you doing?
05:38I'm, like, yeah.
05:39Because it just wasn't feeling right to me.
05:41Like, it wasn't.
05:42Because the movie had been changing and things had been doing, you know, that changes how you tell a story.
05:47And for me, musically, like, when I'm writing, I like to start at the beginning and end at the end.
05:52I always start from the beginning and go through that way.
05:54So I had built this out based on one version of the movie.
05:58And when I watched that music against the new version of the movie, I was, like, oh, my God.
06:03This is not working for me.
06:05You know?
06:05So I went back and redid a lot of it.
06:07Do you always write backup scores?
06:10No, no, no.
06:11I mean, you know, sometimes it happens.
06:13Sometimes you just never know.
06:14I mean, a lot of this is you have to remember what we do is the best guess, right?
06:17Like, everyone is just taking their best guess at something.
06:20And you're not always right.
06:22And even if other people think you're right, I always don't trust, you know, like, if I'm feeling it, I'm feeling like, ah.
06:29So I was able to go.
06:30And thankfully, we had, like, pickup days.
06:32You always have a few pickup days to go and get things in case you want to do it.
06:35So I went back.
06:36And boy, did we have a pickup day.
06:37It was like, it was, I just redid so many things just to make it right.
06:42I just wanted this movie to be perfect.
06:43I love this movie so much.
06:44It was so fun to work on, you know.
06:46What's next for you score-wise, but also you're going to direct a movie?
06:52Yeah.
06:52Yes.
06:53I am.
06:53Yes.
06:54Yes.
06:56Yeah.
06:57I mean, listen, this is not what I thought I would be doing with my life.
07:01Not in the, I mean, I know that sounds stupid and ridiculous, but it was like, this is not what I thought I'd be doing.
07:06Like, when I was a kid growing up, I thought, A, I'd be, like, working in a special effects house, blowing up miniature buildings and things like that.
07:13That's really what I wanted to do.
07:14And I still adore that side of the business.
07:19But directing was more what I thought I would be doing.
07:22And then music sort of got there, happened first, and then didn't let go for, like, 20-some years.
07:27So, when I, you know, recently I did a thing called Werewolf by Night for Marvel, which was really a fun thing to do.
07:35If you haven't seen it, watch it.
07:37It's on Disney Plus, if you still have that.
07:42But I miss it.
07:44I miss making things.
07:45Because as a composer, it's a very solitary thing.
07:47You're by yourself.
07:48And I miss that interaction with a group of people.
07:51You know, to me, movies are the greatest group art form there is, you know.
07:56And when you work on a film, you get to work with every amazing artist known to man, everyone who can do anything.
08:02And it's just such an inspiring thing to do.
08:04So, yeah, I'm going to be directing for Warner Brothers, and it's going to be really fun.
08:09And I can't wait to tell you more about all that.
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