- 10 months ago
Amid mounting tension between the United States and Venezuela over narco-trafficking claims, the Trinidad and Tobago Defence Minister says this country has no quarrel with anyone — but stands prepared for any fallout if conflict reaches the Caribbean Basin.
Urvashi Tiwari-Roopnarine sat down exclusively with Wayne Sturge to discuss what could become the first US-led war in the Southern Hemisphere.
Urvashi Tiwari-Roopnarine sat down exclusively with Wayne Sturge to discuss what could become the first US-led war in the Southern Hemisphere.
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00:00Amid rising tension between the United States and Venezuela over narco trafficking claims and with a U.S. Navy carrier group stationed in Caribbean waters, Defense Minister Wayne Sturge says Trinidad and Tobago, while an ally of Washington and geographically close to Caracas, is not at war with anyone.
00:20We are not at war with anyone. We are mindful of the rhetoric coming from certain ministers in Venezuela, but we are not at war with anyone, so we have no real need to be concerned.
00:39Of course, if war breaks out, we expect that there might be a spillover. You might have persons running, fleeing for their lives and coming here. We are prepared for that eventuality.
00:54But I'm quite certain that if the U.S. has war in mind, they would keep in mind that we might be the subject to unreasonable behavior on behalf of the Venezuelans, and I'm sure they'll take steps to protect us.
01:15We might be that soft target. When we look at the rhetoric coming out of Venezuela, we do accept that, for instance, Delce Rodriguez has not attacked via words the U.S. They are instead targeting Trinidad and Tobago as a facilitator of the U.S.
01:37As a vassal state, as she put it. But in local parlance, they say, Mark, you know what, treat a crime. But I think we are a very good ally with the U.S., Trinidad and Tobago.
01:55So she would say what she would say, but I think she has a lot more sense than to attack us knowing what the repercussions would be.
02:05An American missile destroyer, the U.S.S. Gravely, is currently berthed at the Port of Spain waterfront with joint training exercises underway between the U.S. Navy and the Trinidad and Tobago Defense Force.
02:18Are local officers being trained to operate weapons of war?
02:22That's not something I can disclose, but we've had training on a continuous basis over many years, so it's nothing new.
02:32And this has been planned for some time. So it's, in essence, it coincided with what is happening next door.
02:41We had trade wins earlier this year, but things were not at the point they are now.
02:49Had it been, then you would wonder if, you know, if it was a coincidence or if it was planned for that purpose.
02:56But no, it happened to go inside now.
02:59Still, when compared to Venezuela's heavily publicized military parades, a show of force both at home and abroad, TNT's military capabilities remains modest at best.
03:11Well, this is classic, classic art of war. When you are at your weakest, you pretend to be at your strongest.
03:18So they are signaling that they received shipments from Russia. That's not necessarily true. There's no evidence to back up that claim.
03:27That, in my view, that's basically mounted as a deterrent. But I think the Russians have their own issues to deal with in Ukraine.
03:43And, again, there's no evidence that that shipment ever took place at all.
03:51And I think they know, just like Saddam knew, that they have to basically put out this rhetoric, this facade of being strong, when in fact they are weak.
04:03They are no match for the might of the American military. And I think they know better than to attack us.
04:12Because we have aligned with the U.S.
04:16Well, no, you're not going to attack any country in the region who has not attacked you. We have not attacked them. We have not facilitated an attack on them.
04:28And there would be no good reason to attack us.
04:31And in the event Trinidad and Tobago is attacked, Minister Sturge says the U.S. response would be almost immediate.
04:40But what if Port of Spain didn't side with Washington?
04:43The Americans could have taken the approach. Since we are factually a major transshipman point, the Americans could say,
04:51If you're not with us, you're against us. You would rather incur the wrath of the Americans who are doing something they consider to be legitimate.
05:02And we consider to be legitimate in the sense of going to war with cartels and those who facilitate that sort of thing.
05:10That's noble. Drugs destroy lives.
05:15Did the U.S. necessarily need Trinidad and Tobago's approval?
05:19I don't believe they do. But again, we are a major transshipman point.
05:24It's open to them to say, if you're not helping, then you are facilitating. That's classic.
05:31That may also explain why TNT did not join CARICOM's call to declare the Caribbean a zone of peace.
05:39The Caribbean is not a zone of peace. That's cause wallop, as they say in the southern states. That's nonsense.
05:50You can't be a zone of peace if you have the level of drug running and gun smuggling and lives being lost, either directly as a result of the drug trade,
06:04whether it's killing to protect drug terms or the drugs itself, and then there's the indirect death tool, cocaine destroyers, families.
06:22You know, the death might not be immediate, but you destroy more than the user.
06:27You know, you destroy entire families, and then what it's, what is, there's also the associated human trafficking, which is something to be despised.
06:41Already, some citizens are reportedly stocking up on food, water and medical supplies amid phase of a regional conflict.
06:49There's no need to panic buy, but if you want to take that precaution, it's open to you to do so.
06:56And what about the protection of our borders? Has that amped off?
07:02That's the good thing about having the U.S. military in the neighbourhood.
07:08We've been fighting a war with the cartels, our own war.
07:14And as I indicated in the last interview, we have a sailor, Kieran Simon, at the bottom of the sea.
07:22He was part of the war on drugs, and he went down with a submissible after we made an interception.
07:29And we were limited in our capacity.
07:35Our fastest boats can't compete with the boats they have.
07:39In fact, the boats they have can probably win the great race.
07:43So we were, in a sense, struggling to keep up the fight.
07:48And if you have this sort of military presence from the Americans,
07:54and the deterrence that their strikes have caused, then it can only be down to our benefit.
08:00If war does erupt, Venezuela has already claimed support from Russia.
08:05So who stands with Trinidad and Tobago?
08:08Well, you see, the French centre, a vessel.
08:13I'm sure the United Kingdom is also a partner.
08:17Canada will also be a partner.
08:20But definitely the U.S. is here.
08:23But, I mean, we have many other partners.
08:25And any right-thinking member of any government would agree that the war on drugs is a noble effort.
08:33Have you rallied support or attempted to write letters or make contact with the international partners?
08:40There's no need to at this point.
08:43I think the U.S. is doing a very good job.
08:46Do you think our response, Trinidad, and Tobago's response in terms of our rhetoric,
08:51what the Prime Minister has been saying, it could have been different?
08:54Why should it be different?
08:58Criticism has come from certain quarters that we have not been diplomatic.
09:02Well, she's not selling ice cream, so she can't please everyone.
09:06You'll always have critics.
09:08Right?
09:09It's better you be on the side of right, on saving lives and so on,
09:14than you're making excuses and talking rubbish about a zone of peace.
09:18There's no peace.
09:21To talk peace with the families of those who are killed as a result of the scourge of drugs,
09:29they wouldn't see it as peace.
09:30And finally, on a scale of 1 to 10, 10 being most likely,
09:36how likely is it that a war will erupt between the U.S. and Venezuela,
09:42with Trinidad and Tobago smack in between?
09:45Well, we are where we are geographically, so we are smack in between.
09:50But the question you're asking, that's something you should direct to the Americans and the Venezuelans.
09:58They would know how likely it is.
10:01And I'm quite certain that everything would be done to avert.
10:07But if it's necessary, then it's necessary.
10:09So while the Defence Minister insists Trinidad and Tobago is not at war with anyone,
10:15the shadow of conflict looms large as global powers posture for control over the Caribbean's southern flank.
10:22Arvashi Tawari, Rupnarein, TV6 News.
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