Grand Designs Deconstructed Season 1 Episode 4
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00:00Hello and welcome to Grand Designs Deconstructed, where we delve into the latest episode of the
00:23greatest television show of all time. No debate on that, actually. And also talk about the
00:29bigger themes of this fantastic world that Kevin MacLeod allows us into. Kevin, hello.
00:35Thank you. Bless you. I'm just a regimental mascot. You understand that, don't you? There's
00:39a big team here. But look, this is the thing. When we watch Grand Designs, we've all watched it for
00:43many, many years. There are unanswered questions and we get access to you to ask those questions
00:48too. One thing that I've always thought about is about your hard hat. You got your own? I've got
00:54three. Oh, you're showing off. I do, actually. Okay. Well, you never know when you're going to
00:58need it. You need it every day. Well, I do for work, yeah. And also, if I'm home, I do some
01:02chainsawing, you know, before tea. And it's good to have, you know, all the safety equipment to hand.
01:08And you've got your own high-vis as well. Yeah, I've got a few high-vis. I've got one I made myself,
01:12which is made out of orange sequins. I reserve that for parties. I've got one that I got given.
01:17You know, when somebody gives you a high-vis vest and it's got pockets and a little clear plastic bit
01:21to stick your name, you know, those are the treasured things because they're not common.
01:25You're not putting your name on it though around the site because everyone knows it's you. That
01:28would be very silly, wouldn't it? Yeah. Yeah. But I like the odd pocket. See, these are the
01:33sorts of questions we're going to ask. Those are the really important ones. They are important.
01:37What do you keep in your pockets? This episode of Grand Designs is one of the most beautiful and
01:43touching and poignant episodes ever. And I've seen all of them many, many times before.
01:49It focuses around Pep and Melina's Viking longhouse, but it was really beautiful as we
01:55followed this very sad story of Pep dealing with her terminal cancer diagnosis and then passing away
02:03as you were filming the episode itself. But then this wonderful, joyful, life-affirming end of the
02:09episode where Melina went, I'm going to finish this thing. The beauty about filming these programs is
02:14that we do them over years. And so you see people move through all of the emotions and all of the
02:19difficulties and then out the other side sometimes. And in Melina's case, yeah. I mean, we didn't know
02:24when Pep passed away, whether Melina would want to finish it. And it was beautiful when she rang up
02:30and said, yeah, I'd like to do this to remember Pep by, and there was absolutely no guarantee that she
02:35was even going to live in it. But she is living there and has. And so it was a very beautiful and
02:41poignant end to what was a very poignant film. Yeah.
02:45Well, we'll talk to Melina a bit later on this episode. I'm looking forward to seeing inside
02:49the longhouse, which I loved, by the way.
02:52I'm very interested in the fact that Pep isn't from Scandinavia. Yet when she met Melina, Pep sort of
02:57borrowed Melina's Viking heritage. I mean, she was so fascinated by Scandinavia and loved everything that
03:03Melina represented. And at that time when they met, Melina was actually representing and selling
03:08Danish contemporary furniture in the UK. So she's got not only a Viking heritage, but also a bit of a
03:14design qualification as well. So the drinks pairing this week is, and it's a bit of the show that I'm
03:20really enjoying and getting into. I've gone simple because Scandinavian design tends to be
03:26simplistic. I've gone for a Viking mead. Oh yeah. Okay. Three ingredients, honey,
03:33water, yeast. Cheers. Cheers.
03:39Nice. It's instantly addictive.
03:42Good for a sore throat. Fantastic. It's a little bit like, you know,
03:44honey, whiskey and lemon, isn't it? You know, when you have honey in hot water,
03:48there's always a slightly cloying quality to honey after you've drunk. Not here. That's been removed.
03:55Also, it's quite celebratory, you know, a sort of Viking celebration. You have a big
03:58drinking horn. That's what the episode is actually. Yes, there's a lot of sadness within
04:03it, but there's lots of celebration as well because they built this wonderful house that
04:07was an emblem of their love. And Melina's living in it and has the beautiful memories of Pep
04:12throughout.
04:12I've got to go back because I would like to take her a bottle of meat and I would like to toast Pep
04:16in a giant drinking horn, you know, and that would be the way to come because that's what that big
04:21space is for. It's a hall for celebration. And it's a place where you remember, of course, and where
04:26you pay tribute to your brave heroes who've lost their lives in battle, who've gone to Valhalla.
04:32And yeah, that's Pep. We didn't film it, of course, because we gave Melina some respect,
04:38but it was a very beautiful idea that for the funeral, they brought her body in her wicker basket
04:43and placed it in the middle of the hall. And I love it sort of using the building as buildings
04:49are meant to be used, not simply for watching television in or cooking or eating, but actually
04:53for celebrating, remembering.
04:55But also welcoming in all the colours of life into the house because they're inevitable.
05:00Death is part of life, very sadly, but that's the bit of the episode that I'm sure a lot of you,
05:05as me included, started tearing up because it's a beautiful thing.
05:08Yeah, not just you, but everybody on the team. I mean, you know, we all well up watching it
05:13because you spend time with these people and you get to know them and you become enmeshed in a way
05:19in their lives. And, you know, their stories, our protagonists, our heroes, our self-builders,
05:25they're not just the subjects of the programmes we make because we spend sometimes years in their
05:31company. They become part of our world and vice versa. And in fact, without that, I don't think
05:37we would have the opportunity to make films which are as intimate as they are because you
05:42understand the people that little bit better, I think, with time.
05:46Two big Nordic principles feature prominently in this episode. Hygge, which is sort of cosy,
05:52and lagom, which is just enough.
05:55Hygge is an idea about balance and restraint, but also, you know, beautiful materials and it's
06:01comfortable and it's really reassuring. And then this idea of lagom, which I could try and explain
06:08that principle, well, through the medium of mead. So...
06:11Please.
06:12That mead there, right? Three things you say. There's honey, there's water and there's
06:17yeast, right? So it's not complicated, not as complicated as beer. And there's something
06:21magical gone on there that actually creates something which is super moorish and really
06:25reassuring and feels crafted, but actually it's made from very simple things. And this is
06:30the thing that Danish furniture designers have, to recognise the maximum potential that a piece
06:36of wood has in terms of what it can do for you, you know? So suddenly that placemat is more beautiful
06:43somehow, has more energy in it, more...
06:46And I can't quite explain it, except I think it's in the people. I think it's in the makers
06:50and in the craftspeople, that they're all trained to work with these materials. And they've got quite a
06:54limited palette of available materials, timber being one of them. I suspect that's where it comes from.
06:59I think we should talk more about Scandinavian design. Why is it so attractive? Why am I so drawn to it?
07:04Why are people so interested in this? And why is it so calming?
07:08I met Mark Isid, who is the half-Swedish presenter of the Swedish series of Grand Designs, broadcast in Swedish.
07:16He said to me, well, the thing about the Swedes, first of all, is that if you mention the word design to them,
07:21they go all suspicious. They're not quite sure that design isn't necessarily a good thing,
07:26because they're so rational. And you said the word grand.
07:29Well, they just roll their eyes at that. But I'm a massive fan, by the way.
07:33I just want to flag that up. I buy, you know, old Swedish bits of wood and Danish stuff
07:39because I find it so comfortable to sit in. It feels as though it's been designed for human beings.
07:46Also the colour palettes as well. So it's pastel, it's greys, it's beige.
07:51Traditionally, people would say quite boring colours, but they're not.
07:54And the shapes can be angular, but at the same time, sort of rounded and feel soft.
07:59They fit the hand, they fit the shape of the human.
08:01There's also something in the colour palette, which is to do with the fact that the long nights, the low cloud.
08:08So I think it relates very well to the British climate, to the grey skies we have, to the blue light we have here.
08:14And the dark.
08:15And the dark for some of the year. We shouldn't forget Scandinavian furniture and ideas were being imported into this country in the 1960s.
08:22The influence of Scandinavia on British furniture making in the 1950s and 60s was massive.
08:27I've got a chair by a guy called Ingvar Ekstrom. It's called the lamino chair.
08:32It looks very simple, but it's actually very intricate in its construction, laminating bits of oak together.
08:38It's supremely comfortable with a flex, fantastic engineering in the timber so that it moves with your body.
08:44Where is it in the house?
08:45It actually lives in more than one room because I move it around.
08:49Do you?
08:50Yeah, I like to sit in it, yeah. So in different times of the year, it'll be in that room or that room.
08:55Yeah, it's my immersive bath in Scandinavian design, that chair.
09:00But I also guess that things like IKEA have democratised Scandi living and buying furniture and things on a mass market level.
09:08Yeah, and IKEA has been an amazing entry level route in to understanding Scandinavian design and thinking.
09:14I love that.
09:15We've talked about Scandi design.
09:16I would love to talk about the pressures of building when there's such an emotional attachment
09:22because Pep got her diagnosis and she knew that she didn't have that long left but wanting to get on with this
09:29but also wanting to enjoy the process. That's a very difficult thing to balance, isn't it?
09:33It is. And the glorious circumstance around that is that she was driving it.
09:41It was Pep herself saying, I want to do this. This is going to keep me alive longer. This is going to keep me focused and energised.
09:47And Pep came to the project with a reputation as a project manager. Pep herself saying, I have never delivered a project over budget and not on time.
09:57Yeah.
09:58I love that.
09:59She seemed to get annoyed when she had to go and have blood tests. She went, no, no, no, I'm building a house here.
10:03Yeah.
10:04I was watching Pep and I thought, I completely get that because you want to keep your brain busy.
10:08And actually, what a lovely distraction for both of them. And with the Scandi dream, you can declutter the world by focusing on a project like this.
10:16Absolutely. You could see in our conversations with them that they found a huge amount of positivity in the building process and in the day to day of that and the distraction of things happening.
10:28And it is a distracting process. It is creative. When you're watching a building go up, you see people behind a vision wanting to kind of make something real and tangible out of something which is only an idea.
10:39That is really compelling.
10:41It's creating.
10:42Yeah.
10:43And it's fulfilling to do that. It's the best thing you can do with your brain is to make something that wasn't there before.
10:48And I guess that's what Pep and Melina were doing with this. In terms of the atmosphere on site, did you notice an even bigger focus and more important focus than usual?
10:58Not just a deadline of, we want to be in by Christmas, but life is short here.
11:02Look, you might expect the mood to have been a little sombre, a little maudlin, a little quiet perhaps, but it wasn't.
11:07Everybody was just focused on doing their job as well as they could.
11:10Everybody knew there was no room for slackers. There was no dead weight to be carried here.
11:15This was about delivering a single vision, a single purpose.
11:18So it was glorious because everybody bought into it.
11:20What happened was something that you pray for on a project, on any project, is that single-minded, common purpose, that shared drive.
11:29And it was beautiful to see.
11:31The Viking spirit. Should we drink to it?
11:34Oh God, let's do that.
11:35We'll drink to it. We'll have an ad break.
11:37Let's drink to Melina and to Pep.
11:38And then we're going to get Melina on.
11:40Oh, let's do that.
11:41See you soon.
11:42Welcome back to Grand Designs Deconstructed with me, Greg James, and the great Kevin MacLeod.
11:56Thank you, Greg. You're too sweet.
11:58Bit like that mead.
11:59Yeah.
12:00We are discussing the fantastic Surrey Hills episode.
12:04You forget that it's the Surrey Hills because we're talking so much about Scandinavia and beautiful Danish design and everything.
12:09But we're talking about the story of Pep and Melina.
12:12And should we chat to Melina?
12:14Oh, come on.
12:15I love doing this.
12:16We are going to be beaming live into the Viking house.
12:19Into the Viking world.
12:21Melina.
12:22Hi. Hi, Kevin.
12:23Thank you so much for being on Deconstructed from your beautiful long house in the Surrey Hills.
12:29It's an amazing build.
12:31And thank you for sharing the story with everyone, Melina.
12:34How have you settled into the house now?
12:35A few months in.
12:36Does it feel like yours?
12:37And does it feel like you can own it?
12:38Yes, it does, actually.
12:39I've given myself a bit of time just to be in the house and getting used to it.
12:44And I find it extremely peaceful here.
12:46And it's very quiet inside.
12:48And you're in the middle of a meadow.
12:50And it's been good for the soul.
12:52And, yeah, I'm loving it.
12:54I still can't believe that I'm living in it.
12:57But, yeah, it's been difficult at times, of course, because Peppy's not here with me.
13:02But I feel she's with me here in spirit.
13:05And that she also spent a lot of time in the house before it was finished.
13:09You know, pretending that she was in the bath or in the bedroom.
13:13And she wanted me to sort of pretend I was cooking by the kitchen iron before it was even here.
13:18And it's those little memories that I have with me.
13:21I think everybody, when they're building, they move through the semi-finished space
13:25and imagine themselves doing things. Imagine what it would be like here.
13:28Yeah.
13:29And the memory of that, of that conversation, makes her presence, as it were, a little bit more recent,
13:33a bit more powerful for having shared that experience, yeah.
13:36You know, when the workmen were not here at weekends or in the evenings,
13:40we used to sneak down here like two naughty girls, you know, kind of, you know,
13:44having a little, you know, party down here and talking about each room.
13:48And yeah, it's just a nice memory.
13:50Do you think she'd be proud of how you became the project manager?
13:54Because that was so her department.
13:56Do you think she'd look down and go, yeah, you've nailed this?
13:59I think she'd be extremely happy with the outcome of everything.
14:02And also we had already agreed that she would project manage the outside
14:06and that I would be sort of more taking the lead on the inside of the house.
14:10So to be honest, Pep had already chosen materials and suppliers and everything.
14:14So it was almost natural for me to take over at that point
14:18because I was sort of doing my bit of the house build.
14:21I've never been there at night. I'd like to know what it's like,
14:24because by day it glows with all this light spilling in from the side windows.
14:29Yeah.
14:30Under that big white tent of a ceiling. What's it like when those windows turn dark?
14:35Well, it's absolutely wonderful because we have lived on the land for 19 years.
14:39Pep and I, we knew, you know, where the stars are, where the moon is, where the sun rises.
14:45So we designed the house that from the bedroom, you can actually lie in bed and you can watch the full moon.
14:50Pep really liked the full moon.
14:52I can lie in bed, see the stars and you can sort of see, you know,
14:55the shades of the trees in the background, in the moonlight.
14:58It's still a bit overwhelming, if I'm honest, to experience it.
15:03It's really beautiful. And we were talking earlier on in the episode about hygge
15:07and about that feeling of being cozy. You'll give me a proper definition, I'm sure, Melina.
15:13But does it feel like it's warming you up as it gets colder outside?
15:16Does it feel like it's looking after you, the house?
15:18Yeah, because I've been thinking a lot about hygge and hygge, there are so many dimensions to hygge.
15:23And, you know, it's just not one particular thing, but it's also about how you feel.
15:27It's kind of difficult to explain, but it's about feeling just right and kind of sharing.
15:33The house, it breathes. It's very beautifully and elegantly and quite minimally furnished in the spirit of La Gomme.
15:40Yeah.
15:41And I wonder if that's changed you. I wonder if it's made you a slightly tidier person.
15:45How relaxed are you in the building?
15:46This is really what, you know, Pep and I always wanted.
15:49You know, we weren't people who had a lot of material stuff, but although, of course, after life together,
15:54we were together for 37 years, you do acquire stuff.
15:57So this is just exactly how really Pep and I always wanted to live, just live like a simple life.
16:02So Pep was determined to clear the house out as well as building a house.
16:06Actually, one of the things I loved about this episode is it not only made me realise that I wanted to live in a house,
16:10maybe with Kevin in a long house one day,
16:13it also refocused my own opinions on love and where you want to live, the fragility of life,
16:19and how wonderful it was that you decided to tell this story.
16:24And I love the spirit, not only that the house has, but that you and Pep had towards life.
16:29I thought it was life affirming, this house, which is an emblem of your love,
16:33is still standing there and you're in it and it's such a beautiful story.
16:36I feel very proud of it, if I'm honest.
16:38I think that it showed our dream and the things we went through through the filming
16:44and it's a lovely bit of history to have for the future.
16:49Well, I really, really want to thank you for allowing us to quietly walk along with you on your journey
16:58and for the privilege of meeting Pep and experiencing her energy.
17:03Yeah, and I thought that both yourself and the team have done it in an extremely sensitive way
17:08and yeah, I'm delighted with the end result of it.
17:12I mean, it was a complete and utter delight and an absolute privilege to record your story
17:17and to get to know you both and I won't ever forget it.
17:21It was an extraordinary experience for all of us, I think.
17:23So, thank you, Melina.
17:24I'd love to hear that.
17:25Oh, and you built a great house, by the way, as well.
17:27Yeah, well, I mean, the whole house is really kind of reflects, you know, me and Pep as people
17:32and, you know, again, the Nordic-ness, you know, about understated simplicity.
17:37But for Pep especially, it was all about sustainability and sort of the Nordic way of living is also very sustainable
17:44because when I say understated simplicity, it means that you have less but you buy quality
17:50and that means that you don't have to replace.
17:53You know, it's not like a short-term thing that, you know, you buy a new sofa
17:56or you buy a new chair in a year's time and the other one goes to landfill.
18:00And Pep felt very strong about that.
18:02You're creating something that's sustainable, but also for, you know, for long term.
18:07It's putting craft right in the middle, isn't it?
18:09And also, I think, obviously, Pep, she really wanted this to be her legacy
18:12and I think it's a wonderful thing to have that we will all long be gone, but, you know,
18:17Nordic Barn will still be here, hopefully.
18:19Isn't that a lovely thought?
18:20We've all got to be more Pep in our outlook.
18:22Yeah, I think we've all got to be more Pep and Melina.
18:24Yeah, absolutely.
18:25Well, I love that quote, when you chop a tree down, you don't build a bigger house,
18:29you build a bigger table.
18:31Yeah.
18:32That's the spirit.
18:33That's a great, great quote.
18:34That's a good one.
18:35That's a good quote.
18:36Yeah, that's excellent.
18:37It's good to see you so at home in that building
18:40and I'd love to come and see you again soon.
18:42Yeah, you're very welcome.
18:43I'd love for you to come and visit again.
18:45Bless you.
18:46That would be wonderful.
18:47Yeah, I'd love to show you the house kind of lived in.
18:50Yeah.
18:51Hey, listen, we've raised a glass to Pep and to you.
18:54All the best.
18:55Well, we can go again if you like.
18:56Let's go again.
18:57We've got some Viking mead here, Melina.
18:58Oh, lovely.
18:59Okay.
19:00Melina, to you and Pep.
19:01Give us a phrase.
19:02What's cheers?
19:03Give us cheers.
19:04Skål.
19:05Skål.
19:06Skål.
19:07Skål.
19:08Yeah.
19:09Skål.
19:10Melina, thank you so much for your time.
19:11We'll see you soon.
19:12Thank you very much.
19:13Lovely to talk to you.
19:14And to you.
19:15Bye.
19:16Bye.
19:17Fantastic.
19:18I'm so jealous of that house.
19:19It's so nice.
19:21The Scandi design is something that I've always loved.
19:23Just naturally, I've just always been interested in it.
19:25And I would love to think that one day I will live in something like that.
19:29I don't know if it will be with my wife because that's not her thing at all.
19:32Maybe living apart is the thing that will keep us together forever.
19:35That building is designed so that you can have two people living at opposite ends if need
19:38be, you know.
19:39Yeah, but the other end of the house would have to be a sort of Georgian terrace house.
19:42And then I get to have the Scandi house.
19:43With cornices.
19:44Yeah.
19:45Basically.
19:46If she wants lovely old fireplaces.
19:47But anyway.
19:48Kevin, let's have some questions from our wonderful listeners and viewers.
19:50Yeah.
19:51Really amazing that people are bothering to listen and watch this.
19:54No, I mean, people are busy and there's lots to watch, isn't there?
19:56Yeah, there is.
19:57There's lots to tune into and lots of content to access these days.
20:00Amanda's in New Zealand.
20:01Okay.
20:02And she says, how many houses are you filming in a year or a season as some take years to
20:07complete?
20:08Yeah.
20:09How are you keeping tabs on it all?
20:10Yeah.
20:11So Amanda, we have to turn that question on its head.
20:12Much like in New Zealand.
20:13Upside down.
20:14Yes, indeed.
20:15Actually, this is how they shoot the series in New Zealand and in Australia and Sweden,
20:19where it's also made.
20:20At any one time, we might have between 20 and 30 projects on the go.
20:25Wow.
20:26I mean, literally, I started one yesterday and I started one the day before.
20:29Where did you start yesterday's one?
20:30Give us an exclusive.
20:31Yesterday in South London, in Lewisham.
20:32Lewisham, that's where I was born.
20:34And the day before you were in Suffolk.
20:36Coastal?
20:37Near, but very much agricultural.
20:39Lovely.
20:40So without getting into the weeds, any one time on the go with 20 projects, 30 projects.
20:46As we get to the spring, we're having lots of conversations.
20:50Do you think I'll get it done by today?
20:52What about if we...
20:53Do you think that's going to work?
20:54Is that going to get the roof on or not?
20:56And the beautiful thing is, we have a wonderful channel who do not say,
21:01we will have eight.
21:03We try and generate and produce a season out of the crop we have coming forward.
21:09So we've seen what's maturing in the veg patch.
21:11Is that ready to crop yet?
21:12So it involves quite a statement of faith.
21:14You've got to sort of believe that it's going to, you know, keep going.
21:17I've got to say, it's a genius show for many reasons.
21:20Yeah.
21:21But also, you're uncancellable.
21:23Especially if you've got some poor people hanging on from 2012,
21:26who are going, we finished it, Kev.
21:29And you're like, I'm sorry, we were decommissioned 10 years ago.
21:32It's amazing, you can't ever be finished.
21:34Imagine making a phone call to them saying,
21:35we're not making any more, so we're not going to come again. Bye.
21:38See ya.
21:39That would be terrible.
21:40What's the oldest episode that hasn't gone out yet, if that makes sense?
21:45I think the oldest one we've got on the books is from 2016.
21:49But then you see, we then go back and visit projects from much earlier.
21:54We revisited the very first episode we ever filmed a couple of years ago.
21:59So all of the projects are still on the books, bizarrely.
22:03They're still there.
22:04They're still in our lives.
22:05And the lovely thing about going back and seeing people is measuring
22:08the passage of time through trees and children.
22:13Those are the two metrics of how time passes on buildings.
22:16Well, it's great news for fans of Grand Designs, and it's great news for me,
22:18because the podcast could also go on forever and ever.
22:21Yeah, I don't know how many we've got now.
22:22I've stopped counting.
22:23There must be two or three hundred projects out there.
22:25Fantastic news for me.
22:27And for me, Craig.
22:29Isn't it?
22:31Kevin, thank you.
22:32It's been a pleasure again.
22:33I love doing this.
22:34I love it, too.
22:35For me, it's therapy.
22:36I think I've said that.
22:37I'm very happy to be your therapist.
22:39The Grand Designs therapist will return next week on Deconstructed.
22:43Thanks for watching, slash listening.
22:45Goodbye, slash good night, slash good morning.
22:48Go away.
22:49Thanks for joining us again.
22:51You can come back next week, watch Grand Designs,
22:54watch us here in this podcast afterwards,
22:57and follow us also on your social media,
23:00and listen again to the podcast on Spotify.
23:03You can also access pretty well all of the Grand Designs we've ever made
23:07on the Channel 4 site,
23:09and watch selected episodes on YouTube as well.
23:12so much.
23:13.
23:14.
23:17.
23:18.
23:19.
Recommended
23:23
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