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A thrilling study of the UFO phenomenon and the people who dedicate their lives to it.
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00:00:00What are UFOs? Do aliens exist? Have they been here before? These are all questions
00:00:15that researchers in the field of ufology hope to someday definitively answer.
00:00:20UFOlogy has always been really fascinating to me because there are these things that are going on
00:00:28that we get these tiny glimpses of. It's easy to think somebody's crazy but it
00:00:34takes more time and thought to think, hmm could there be something more to this?
00:00:44Then I have the proof. I worked for the British government for 21 years at the
00:00:53Ministry of Defence and for much of the early 90s my job there was to research
00:00:59and investigate the UFO phenomenon.
00:01:04My father was a senior government scientist, director of the Royal Aeronautical
00:01:10Establishment at Farnborough and Ministry of Defence was almost the family business
00:01:15so you could say that I just joined the family firm.
00:01:19I'm one of these people who has a big passion and interest in UFOs but I've never actually had
00:01:25a UFO encounter. I got interested because my father was in the British Royal Air Force
00:01:31and he was a radar mechanic and he was involved in three UFO encounter incidents
00:01:37in September 1952. Interestingly enough this was at the height of a NATO operation
00:01:44called exercise main brace and it was a show of strength to the Russians you know you try anything
00:01:50we've got all this to fire back at you and over the course of three nights UFO activity was reported
00:01:57by the personnel out on the operation and so aircraft were scrambled fighter planes some of the pilots
00:02:05reported seen like classic 1950s era day the earth stood still flying saucers others saw these bright lights
00:02:14in the sky brilliantly bright lights everybody was told you won't talk about this and my dad didn't
00:02:20tell anyone until I was about 12 and it got me interested not because it was my own father
00:02:26but because he was also trained in the military as a radar mechanic.
00:02:31Ufology is the study of reports, visual records and other phenomenon related to unidentified flying objects.
00:02:39Well I think what attracts me to this is that you know my thing is really ancient aliens but on other planets
00:02:46if you look at the moon or you look at Mars you can see clear evidence of structures of manufactured buildings and pyramids and all kinds of stuff
00:02:55signs of ancient civilizations on other planets.
00:02:57UFO reports have been subject to various investigations over the years by governments, independent groups and scientists.
00:03:05But if I just find one artificial structure on Mars okay I've proven that either human history is completely different than they've taught us
00:03:13and we were there on Mars a long time ago the whole Atlantis thing and our civilization fell and now it's rising back up
00:03:18or I've proven that aliens exist one of the two so that's what attracted me to that line of things that Eric Von Daniken Richard Hoagland line of thinking is because it's provable.
00:03:29Ufology as a field has not really been embraced by academia and is largely considered a pseudoscience by the scientific community and mainstream media.
00:03:39So who are the people who champion and dedicate their lives to this field of research?
00:03:44What compels them to keep going in the face of derision and hardship?
00:03:49I wasn't that good a student at school. I didn't know what I wanted to do.
00:03:53And as fate would have it I got a job on like a what's on guide in the local town I was living on.
00:04:00I did a lot of the music stuff.
00:04:02After working for this magazine which was called Zero for a couple of years I thought well why not try and expand and take the journalistic approach I've done on the magazine but combine it with research into UFOs.
00:04:18Take that journalistic approach with aliens.
00:04:21So I've been sort of doing actively doing research for about 30 years.
00:04:26With new reports and sightings mounting on almost a daily basis and with many mainstream media outlets reporting on the phenomenon perception is beginning to change.
00:04:38Yeah I was about 12 years old it was a boy scout camp and we were taking a shortcut up for lunch because we were really hungry and I was with three other kids.
00:04:46There were four of us all together and this one guy knew of a shortcut and I could take you there today.
00:04:51It was at Camp Horseshoe Rising Sun, Maryland.
00:04:54And it was this kind of an uphill dry creek bed boulder to boulder so it was really kind of fun.
00:05:00And it was like either in the early spring or early fall.
00:05:04But the bottom line was we were you know single file hopping from boulder to boulder and somebody one of the kids goes wow what's that?
00:05:11And the other kids go whoa what is that?
00:05:13And I go where and they point and they go oh my gosh what is that?
00:05:16And we're looking at the classic UFO, the classic disc hovering in the sky, the sunlight glinting off of it for I would say at least 20 seconds.
00:05:26And we're looking at this thing and it just goes like this.
00:05:30Just like I mean you could follow it but it was just like and it was gone.
00:05:34We go running back to the camp.
00:05:36We saw a UFO, we saw a flying saucer, all the kids are gathered around us, the scout masters come out oh ho ho, that type of thing.
00:05:42And we told the story and they were all laughing at us.
00:05:46And we went to lunch and they laughed more.
00:05:49And by the dinner hour the other three boys oh we just made it up.
00:05:53And I just sat there and went no we didn't.
00:05:56We didn't make anything up.
00:05:57I know what I saw.
00:05:58It was my first lesson in herd mentality and groupthink and how dangerous that is.
00:06:03And so I've always been anytime I get a whiff of groupthink it's just like eh.
00:06:08I'm instantly repelled by it.
00:06:10The UFO subject matter is sort of the gateway drug to so many other venues of what is reality?
00:06:19What are we doing here on this planet?
00:06:21Asking the big questions.
00:06:22My curiosity got weaponized as my good friend Jeremy Corbell would say when I saw some craft in the sky.
00:06:30A daytime sighting back in 2007.
00:06:33There was a number of just kind of like white specks in the sky.
00:06:37Started off with just a handful and then they started showing up more and more.
00:06:42The whole sky was sort of peppered with them and I was like what the hell is going on here right?
00:06:46I thought for sure it was going to make the mainstream news that night and the next day and there was nothing there.
00:06:52And checking the internet checking you know the seven o'clock news.
00:06:55I thought for sure everybody could have would have should have seen this event.
00:06:59Nothing happened but I kept researching because I was you know baffled at what I saw and I wanted to know more.
00:07:06Ufologists come from all walks of life.
00:07:09One thing that they all seem to have in common is a passion for the subject.
00:07:14But of course not everyone in this field started out as a believer.
00:07:19When I grew up the UFO phenomenon was really not something that was looming large in my awareness.
00:07:29So when I joined the Ministry of Defence and then when I got posted into the UFO project
00:07:36I had no real in-depth knowledge about UFOs.
00:07:41This to me was just a government job.
00:07:44A pretty strange one.
00:07:45I wasn't even really sure what the deal was that I knew we did it but I wasn't quite sure how or why.
00:07:53I went into the job certainly and the individual investigations.
00:07:58We got about two or three hundred cases each year.
00:08:01I went in certainly with an open mind but I think intellectually it was difficult not to have the view that look we're probably going to find an awful lot of aircraft lights, weather balloons, meteorites.
00:08:15Of course that's exactly what we did find.
00:08:17The vast majority of sightings we found either had a conventional explanation that people were sincere enough but they had misidentified something.
00:08:27I don't think I would ever call myself a sceptic of the phenomenon but I've been a sceptic of certain cases.
00:08:3480% of the cases we found that we were dealing with misidentifications of known objects and phenomena.
00:08:42In 15% of the cases we had insufficient information to make an assessment.
00:08:46In 5% of the cases unknown.
00:08:49Now it was important to say of course unknown did not mean extraterrestrial spacecraft.
00:08:55I mean we constantly had to push back against this kind of UFO equals aliens equation which is totally bogus.
00:09:05I mean people say do you believe in UFOs?
00:09:08It's a meaningless question.
00:09:09You can't not believe in UFOs.
00:09:11I mean these are literally by definition things people see and can't explain.
00:09:16Most of them have conventional explanations.
00:09:18Some don't.
00:09:19With the ones that don't the extraterrestrial hypothesis is one of a number of competing theories.
00:09:26And absolutely we considered that.
00:09:28We didn't rule it out.
00:09:30But neither did we have any definitive evidence that could prove it.
00:09:35I've even seen things in the sky that I'm like okay what the heck was that?
00:09:40You know so to deny it would be essentially like denying a part of myself and my entire life.
00:09:47My entire existence and it just it doesn't feel right.
00:09:51Exactly there's nothing to believe it was all very real.
00:09:54You know it's not like a religion something that you have to be trained to believe.
00:09:59I'm now 70 years old and I teach my students incredible experiences with incredible people that have incredible wisdom to share.
00:10:08All over the course of my entire life I've been touched by the divine and I do these days I do not know if it's a curse or a blessing because the legacy that all those experiences brought me is just mind boggling.
00:10:27Two things I think began to challenge my natural skepticism with some of this.
00:10:35Firstly was delving into the archive of previous files.
00:10:40Now the Ministry of Defense had had a UFO program since 1953.
00:10:45Before that there had been sightings dating back certainly to the Second World War.
00:10:50And of course we had a vast archive of documents going back decades on all of this and I made it my business when time permitted of course to dive into that archive.
00:11:01To try and educate myself about the history of our program what I didn't want to spend time reinventing the wheel what what did we already know what information did we already have on this could we find patterns for example trends.
00:11:18That was the first thing and I began to realize that just as with the day to day citing reports that coming in just as most of them had explanations but some didn't going back through the archives.
00:11:30We had some pretty interesting cases in there which challenged me.
00:11:35The other thing that I think really made even more of an impression was sometimes a case would come your way that you would just say wow.
00:11:45And one in particular from 1993 we had a wave of sightings that took place over large parts of the UK over a period of six hours.
00:11:55We had police witnesses we had military witnesses I had people describing to me vast triangular shaped craft moving very slowly and then in an instant accelerating away to the horizon at high max speeds.
00:12:11And I had people say to me air force witnesses say look Nick I work at an air base I've been in the air force eight years I never seen anything like this in my life.
00:12:21And so when you have things like that when you do the investigation you build up a picture of the particular incident when you talk to the witnesses and get their story.
00:12:33I mean one person I remember literally hours later him relaying something and his voice still shaking with emotion.
00:12:40Serious career air force officer who is obviously around fast jets fast attack helicopters all the time but not the sorts of people to be impressed easily by speeds and accelerations.
00:12:57So when those sorts of people get impressed I listen I received about two or three hundred cases each year though in some other years it went as high as seven or eight hundred.
00:13:10Now most of those reports came from the public but some came from pilots police officers military personnel radar operators.
00:13:22And it was those sorts of people that we paid more attention to now that's not to say I don't want to sound patronizing here and it's it's ridiculous to think no good information can come from the public.
00:13:35Particularly if you're trying to do a proper intelligence assessment where the thing is you're not just investigating a single case but you're trying to piece together the puzzle.
00:13:46Draw connections look for commonalities and there absolutely you need the public reports too.
00:13:56But inevitably when when you get say an air force pilot sitting down and saying okay Nick this is what I saw.
00:14:03And then when when the radar operator comes forward and says oh yeah we tracked it on the radar too and here's the data.
00:14:10That's the sort of thing that is much more interesting to me.
00:14:15Well you know I mean again it comes to obviously Roswell's a big one.
00:14:19But I think you can also make a compelling argument that Roswell might have in fact been secret United States flying wing squadrons.
00:14:27That had an accident secrets but you know secret space program type stuff that happened in the desert.
00:14:32That's obviously a classic but the government did come out and say we have a flying saucer.
00:14:37And then they retracted it so that's that's what makes it I think really significant.
00:14:42In terms of other cases Travis Walton's abduction case is unassailable.
00:14:46Because you had five or six seven witnesses all of whom passed all of whom passed lie detector tests.
00:14:53And I think it's really hard to argue with with the evidence presented in the Walton case.
00:14:57So those ones are some of my favorites.
00:14:59You know some of the other ones Rendlesham Forest and Phoenix Lights I'm kind of tired of talking about them.
00:15:04There's nothing new on them and they are good cases but you know they're not really to me.
00:15:09They're not super compelling to me anymore because I think we've squeezed all the blood out of those turnips.
00:15:14The British government has fairly recently completed what was an 11 year program to declassify and release most of its UFO files.
00:15:25About 60,000 pages of documentation have been released some of which was classified secret UK eyes only.
00:15:34A lot of the material in there is fairly mundane people out seeing vague lights in the sky.
00:15:42But if you're prepared to go through that material you will find case after case after case where you have sightings from pilots.
00:15:54Radar operators simultaneously tracking these things.
00:15:57Jets scrambled.
00:15:59Pilots trying to intercept but the UFOs performing speeds and maneuvers that seem significantly ahead of our own capability.
00:16:08And those are the sorts of cases that I was most interested in.
00:16:12I suppose in the lifetime of the MOD's UFO program there were probably something like 12,000 cases.
00:16:21So hundreds and hundreds of cases where you had good quality witnesses.
00:16:27Pilots, police, military, radar, that sort of thing.
00:16:30Britain's most compelling UFO incident was probably Rendlesham Forest, December 1980.
00:16:37A UFO actually landed in the forest that lies between two military bases, Bentwaters and Woodbridge.
00:16:44And over three consecutive nights multiple military witnesses see a UFO.
00:16:51On the first night it lands and some of them get so close they touch the thing and they even see symbols on the side.
00:16:59Subsequently, and we were always looking of course for the things that move this from beyond a story into something that can be corroborated.
00:17:09Well, there was a landing site, of course, so people went there and they went with the Geiger counter.
00:17:15Radioactivity levels were found which were assessed by our own scientific and technical intelligence people as being significantly higher than the average background.
00:17:24There were indentations in the ground where this thing had apparently landed on some sort of tripod like device.
00:17:32There were burn marks, scorch marks on the sides of the trees in the small clearing where this thing had come down.
00:17:39So there was something over and above the testimony of the military personnel themselves.
00:17:45On the final night of these three nights, the deputy base commander finally, he got fed up.
00:17:53He heard that the UFO had returned again.
00:17:55So he threw together a small team of witnesses and he went out, as he put it, to debunk this nonsense.
00:18:01And he ended up seeing the UFO himself.
00:18:03So here you have a colonel who was a complete skeptic going out to debunk the story.
00:18:10Seeing this thing, as he put it, performing extraordinary speeds and maneuvers in the sky as if it was conducting a grid search, firing a narrow beam of light down at the ground in front of him and his team.
00:18:23And he said, thinking back to this, was this a weapon? Was this a warning? Was this communication? What was it? He didn't know.
00:18:30When I asked him, what do you think it was? He says, well, Nick, he said, I don't know what it was, but whatever it was, it was under intelligent control.
00:18:41And so when you have consistently cases like this, multiple military witnesses, physical evidence, and then this UFO was briefly tracked on radar.
00:18:52But here I'm talking about the radioactivity levels at the landing site, that soil samples were taken, parts of the trees were taken back for analysis.
00:19:01Things like this, I think, began to change my mind.
00:19:04This was a case, I did a cold case review on that. It had happened before my time, but it was the sort of thing in our files that leapt out at me.
00:19:13And, you know, made me think, wait a minute, this is not just aircraft lights and weather balloons.
00:19:18There's something over and above that. There's a phenomenon that we haven't yet got a handle on.
00:19:25Other cases that interested me and actually caused me some considerable concern, we had a surprising number of fairly near misses between commercial aircraft and UFOs.
00:19:37I remember a case, Manchester, 1995, a UFO passed down the side of a commercial aircraft at a height of about 9000 feet.
00:19:49The pilot and the co-pilot were so concerned that they almost instinctively flinched and ducked as this object came so close.
00:20:01Another time, somebody thought that maybe we accidentally fired off a surface to air missile or something.
00:20:08And the pilot again shouted, look out, look out, and assumed a bracing position.
00:20:14And these are these are commercial aircraft with hundreds of people on board.
00:20:17So and cases like that in the British government's UFO files, other countries around the world.
00:20:24Pilots seeing these things, radar sometimes corroborating that, yes, there was an uncorrelated target.
00:20:31These sorts of cases moved me from just dismissing all this as nonsense to saying something's going on.
00:20:38Not saying it's necessarily extraterrestrial, though certainly can't rule that out.
00:20:43But but something over and above just misidentifications, hoaxes or delusions.
00:20:50Who are the men in black?
00:20:53On the matter of cases that I might have in my files and which haven't really sort of seen, you know, the light of day.
00:21:02I think the ones that I've got more than anything else relate to one of my most favorite things to write about.
00:21:09That's the men in black mystery.
00:21:11You know, people think of the men in black.
00:21:12They think of Will Smith and Tommy Lee Jones, you know, but the movies were based on real cases.
00:21:18But they kind of just turned it into a comedy adventure story.
00:21:21But I mean, the movies were fun, but they weren't like the real men in black who are actually described as like really pale skinned and scrawny and gaunt.
00:21:33And they have these bulging eyes that they hide behind these wraparound sunglasses and they don't actually look fully human.
00:21:40They almost look like a hybrid.
00:21:42And I've got a lot of cases like that where people have seen UFOs two days later as a knock on the door or even in the evening, you know, and they open the door and there's this weird guy in a black suit and an old 1940s style fedora hat, you know, looking like a mannequin out of a shop.
00:21:59I've got a lot of cases where people have been threatened and silenced.
00:22:04And also where they when they're in proximity of the men in black, they actually felt as if they were being drained of their energy, as if they were like a psychic vampire, like just draining their energy and their life force.
00:22:16I've got so many really weird MIB cases that some of them have been able to put into the, you know, the public domain into books, because I've actually done four books on the men in black and one on the lesser known women in black cases, which is similar.
00:22:31We did receive reports, not just of UFOs, but entity encounters, close encounters of the third kind, some abduction accounts.
00:22:45We didn't get as many as one might suppose.
00:22:49And I think people reporting that were more likely perhaps to report those sorts of cases to civilian UFO research groups.
00:23:00My connection with extraterrestrials started when I was six years old.
00:23:05I am what you call ADHD.
00:23:08I was born with a tremendous amount of physical and intellectual energy.
00:23:14And by the way, ADD is not a disorder.
00:23:17It's actually a gift.
00:23:19Einstein was ADD.
00:23:21We didn't have electricity.
00:23:22We didn't have running water.
00:23:24All the windows, the house were broken.
00:23:27So going to the attic was like going to hell for me.
00:23:31It was cold.
00:23:32And I was always hoping that before going there, I could get a cat because I could get the warmth from the cat.
00:23:40That night, I was really upset.
00:23:43There was no cat.
00:23:44So I knew it was going to be cold.
00:23:46So I went to bed and my mom was saying to me,
00:23:50Louis, make sure to blow your candle.
00:23:52Okay.
00:23:53We don't want to put the fire in the house.
00:23:54Yeah.
00:23:55Yeah.
00:23:56Mommy.
00:23:57Yeah.
00:23:58And then middle of the night, first time that I dealt with extraterrestrials, I felt something on my feet.
00:24:05So I thought it was a cat.
00:24:07So I said, yes.
00:24:08I kick it, trying to get it to come up.
00:24:12Because I didn't want to lose the warmth that I had accumulated into my little blanket.
00:24:17It didn't move.
00:24:18So I said, ah.
00:24:19Try it again.
00:24:20It didn't move.
00:24:21So I said, I have to go and get him.
00:24:23So I just sat on my bed and oh my God.
00:24:29For the first time in my life, I have seen the greys.
00:24:35What I did when I first saw them, I hide it because that's the initial response.
00:24:40You know, I was traumatized.
00:24:41What the hell is this?
00:24:43You know, then I get a little bit more courageous and I kind of peep.
00:24:47And one of those entities was less than two inches from my face.
00:24:53Big eyes.
00:24:54I freaked out.
00:24:56I literally freaked out and passed out of fright.
00:25:00And this happened so many times.
00:25:04For each time I was punished, I used to see those entities.
00:25:08The good thing about it is that I was okay the next day.
00:25:12I was always okay the next day.
00:25:14So I got used to, put it this way.
00:25:16Incidentally, in 1956, there was quite a lot of reports coming from Russia of those type of monkey,
00:25:25you know, ETs for lack of words to the eye of a six year old.
00:25:31They were, you know, little monkey with big eyes.
00:25:34That's all I knew.
00:25:35So that was my introduction to the world of extraterrestrials.
00:25:40Many of the people out there in the community thought that we in the Ministry of Defence already knew about all this and were actively part of a conspiracy to cover it up.
00:25:52If people were reluctant as they sometimes were, fearing ridicule, fearing disbelief, not wanting to be seen to waste government time, perhaps thinking we already knew about it and were covering it up.
00:26:04If those people were reluctant to report a UFO, they were much more reluctant to report an entity encounter or an abduction.
00:26:12But we did get cases.
00:26:13I opened a small file to try and draw together some of this material and that files out there.
00:26:21It's it's pretty far out.
00:26:22I have to say I wonder with some of that, whether we aren't dealing maybe with imagination and delusion and perhaps hoax a little bit more than, say, the military cases where we've got the pilot testimony, the radar data.
00:26:38Maybe we've got photographs and videos that I can then take to intelligence community imagery analysis.
00:26:47You know, I can get the imagery analysis resources and capabilities put on that and we can secure a proper scientific assessment.
00:26:56So you can't really do that with these these close encounter of the third kind reports.
00:27:02So all I could really say was that, yes, we got some cases.
00:27:07I was aware of many more in the UFO literature, but it's the old joke in the intelligence analysis community.
00:27:13Interesting, if true.
00:27:14That was about all we could say by way of an assessment.
00:27:18For decades, UFO enthusiasts have claimed the government is warehousing crashed UFOs and possibly aliens at Area 51, part of an Air Force base in southern Nevada.
00:27:30There's no doubt that sort of beginning in the latter part of the 1980s, the big story out of all UFO stories in that era was the Bob Lazar story.
00:27:39Bob Lazar is an interesting character.
00:27:42Of course, in 1989, he came forward interviewed by investigative journalist George Knapp, said, I worked at Area 51.
00:27:53And one of the things that I worked on there was trying to reverse engineer alien technology.
00:28:00And he talked about UFOs that were kept at Area 51, that maybe some of these were extraterrestrial.
00:28:08Maybe some of these were things that we had designed ourselves, but based on alien tech.
00:28:14I'm going to fall back on the old intelligence analyst joke of, well, interesting if true, being about all I could say on something like that.
00:28:27A lot of people may not know that Area 51 is actually a portion of what's called the Nevada Test and Training Rage, the NTNT.
00:28:35And Area 51 is literally a portion of it.
00:28:39And Lazar said for a brief period, he worked on trying to back engineer and understand alien technology to see if we could replicate it.
00:28:49Probably for military purposes, because that's the inevitable way it would go.
00:28:54There are two avenues, if you like, that most people in ufology go down.
00:28:59There are those who fully believe what Bob says and those who think it's a hoax.
00:29:04Well, one of the interesting aspects for me, at least, is the idea that he was used as like a patsy.
00:29:12And he may have been used unwittingly.
00:29:16I don't think he was a hoax or anything like that.
00:29:18But I do think he could have been unwittingly used in a program designed possibly to essentially tell the Russians,
00:29:26hey, we've got crashed UFOs, dead aliens.
00:29:29We're working on super extraterrestrial energy drives and so on as a means to freak out the Russians.
00:29:38Well, how do you do that?
00:29:39Well, you get the ultimate patsy and you expose that person to strange craft, which could have been sophisticated mockups.
00:29:47And then the Russians are like, oh my God, they really do have this.
00:29:51What are we going to do?
00:29:52We've got nothing like this.
00:29:53And so, well, then they send Russian agents and operatives and spies to try and figure out what's going on.
00:30:00And then American intelligence sits back then, waits for these Russian guys to get too close,
00:30:06and then they snare them in.
00:30:08And no real secrets have been lost.
00:30:10Instead, you've reeled them in with fabricated stories of UFOs.
00:30:15Now, I'm not saying that is the answer, but I do think that is to a degree a common sense scenario that could be played out.
00:30:25But on the other side, you know, I could sit here and say, I cannot deny that there isn't crashed UFOs and dead aliens,
00:30:34or even live aliens in Area 51, as some people have suggested.
00:30:38I could be 100%, and one day, you know, the aliens will come wobbling out of Area 51 across the desert toward us.
00:30:45That could happen.
00:30:46It's a story that is interesting.
00:30:49I think we can prove that absolutely, for a time, he did indeed work at Area 51 as a contractor.
00:30:59But whether his expertise in terms of some of the exotic physics that's being talked about,
00:31:08I think you'd have to put him together with someone like Nishi Okaku and see whether that works,
00:31:14in terms of does he really talk that language.
00:31:18With recent, I suppose, pop culture phenomena, such as the Let's Storm Area 51 movement from 2019,
00:31:27and some of the recent revelations about the Nimitz encounter, the ATIP program,
00:31:34it's almost, it has, I won't say it's proven Bob Lazar's claims, but it's certainly brought him back into the spotlight,
00:31:44and rightly, I think it has led to a call that we reassess his claims.
00:31:52In my view, one of the big problems with Area 51 is there are so many people in ufology
00:31:58who not only do believe or accept that there could be UFOs and aliens, dead or alive, or both, at Area 51,
00:32:06but they also want that to be the answer.
00:32:09They don't want it to be next generation stealth aircraft, why not?
00:32:14It's not as exciting as aliens.
00:32:16If you cross that line, you've crossed the line, you know, and you should not cross the line.
00:32:21And I think there is sometimes a lack of wanting to approach every angle.
00:32:29Instead, I just want to look at the aspect that really excites me.
00:32:34And I get that, that's just human nature.
00:32:37Whatever the answer is that's going on Area 51, I'll be satisfied if we can get the answers.
00:32:41I want the answers, not just the stories.
00:32:44In the light of what we see with the videos, the so-called tic-tac,
00:32:49do some of Bob Lazar's claims deserve a second look?
00:32:54And I think the answer to that is absolutely yes.
00:32:57Over the years, I've sort of, I guess, you know, you get a bit older and a little bit more cynical,
00:33:03but you don't lose the enthusiasm for it.
00:33:07I do sometimes think if the whole Area 51 is like a mind game kind of scenario
00:33:14for obscure disinformation, counterintelligence operations.
00:33:20Maybe one day, you know, the aliens will be reeled out.
00:33:24The UFOs will be reeled out.
00:33:26And we'll finally know that Area 51 really is like, you know, a place, an area where the aliens really exist.
00:33:36And according to some, you know, sit around guzzling strawberry ice cream, you know,
00:33:41which is one of the theories that's been around for a long time.
00:33:44You know, they love strawberry ice cream.
00:33:46I'm like, you know, what's wrong with chocolate ice cream?
00:33:48You know.
00:33:50Up until December 2017, if you had asked the United States government for a line on UFOs,
00:34:01what do you think?
00:34:02What do you know?
00:34:03You would have been told this.
00:34:05Nobody's interested in this subject.
00:34:07Nobody's investigating.
00:34:08Nobody has investigated since the end of 1969,
00:34:12when the old United States Air Force program Project Blue Book was terminated.
00:34:18It turns out that that was not correct.
00:34:21In December 2017, the New York Times published a story exclusively revealing that despite the denials,
00:34:30the United States government did have a program looking at UFOs.
00:34:36And this was called ATIP, Advanced Aerospace Threat Identification Program.
00:34:41A UFO program so cleverly concealed, it didn't have the phrase UFO anywhere in its title.
00:34:50Now, in parallel with the revelations about ATIP emerged a story of something that had certainly interested ATIP and been investigated by them.
00:35:02Some sightings involving the US Navy and specifically three videos of Navy jets chasing UFOs.
00:35:11There were two separate incidents.
00:35:13One had happened in 2004 on the west coast of the US and involved the USS Nimitz.
00:35:21The second incident had taken place on the east coast in 2015.
00:35:27Now, these three videos were made public and they fundamentally changed the narrative about the UFO phenomenon.
00:35:38Previously, I think the subject was regarded as fringe.
00:35:42This brought it into the mainstream.
00:35:44Suddenly, this was being discussed not just on various sort of fun, light-hearted, late-night talk shows and conspiracy blogs on the internet and things.
00:35:56Suddenly, it was in The Times, The Post, Politico, The Hill.
00:36:00It went from fringe to mainstream and it went because of these US Navy encounters, the three videos and revelations concerning the Pentagon's ATIP program.
00:36:13In association with this, we've seen congressional interest, the Armed Services Committee, the Homeland Security Committee, the Intelligence Committee.
00:36:23They've all taken a look at this.
00:36:26The president has, on two occasions, been specifically asked about this and, despite expressing a degree of skepticism, has said,
00:36:35yes, I attended a meeting on this, a briefing, and that, as he put it, our fine pilots are seeing these things.
00:36:44There does seem to be something a little bit different this time around.
00:36:47And, as he put it, we're watching.
00:36:49Either it's true, or somebody within the government, for reasons we don't fully understand, is playing a massive mind game.
00:36:58It could be we're being fed stuff to actually expose us to the fact that aliens are there.
00:37:05Or it could be to see how easy it is to play and screw with the human mind.
00:37:1268% of people today believe that the government is withholding information about UFOs.
00:37:21There are some fascinating statements that have been made about these encounters.
00:37:26One of my favorites actually comes from one of the pilots who first saw this, David Fravor, and he said,
00:37:33I don't know what it was, but I sure as heck want to fly one.
00:37:36And so when somebody who flies F-18 Super Hornets for a living,
00:37:43when someone like that gets impressed by speeds and maneuvers, then I think we should all sit up and take notice.
00:37:50Two of the other statements that really struck me were in June of 2019,
00:37:57a number of senators went on the record as saying that they had received classified briefings on some of this.
00:38:05One of the senators came out of that briefing and he looked, I think, quite stunned.
00:38:13And he said, look, I've just had a brief, but it's classified. I can't get into any of it.
00:38:18Another senator came out. She said, yes, I've been briefed.
00:38:24Again, it's classified. I can't discuss it.
00:38:27But she went on to say, if you were to ask me, do I believe in UFOs?
00:38:33I would say, well, there are some things that have not yet been satisfactorily explained.
00:38:39This is unprecedented.
00:38:41Yes, back in the 60s, there have been some congressional hearings on this.
00:38:47But to have Armed Services Committee, Homeland Security Committee, Intelligence Committee,
00:38:52all looking at this behind closed doors briefs where people aren't even able to come out and give you an unclassified summary.
00:39:01And that's telling. Normally, with most subjects, people will come out and they'll say, look, I can't go into the details because it's classified.
00:39:09But, you know, let me at an unclassified level, let me tell you this.
00:39:13This is what we're dealing with. We didn't get any of that. And that's interesting.
00:39:18I think there could be a mind game aspect to all of this that a lot of people in ufology don't think about things like this.
00:39:25They just talk about cases. They don't think about why did that retired general speak to you?
00:39:32Did he really just want to get it off his chest or was somebody guiding him to try and push you away from something that is genuinely good?
00:39:40A lot of people don't think about all those things, you know, but I do.
00:39:46People say that governments lie all the time. That's really not true.
00:39:50Certainly not in my experience. In my entire 21 years in the Ministry of Defence, I was never instructed to tell a lie.
00:40:01I never knowingly told a lie.
00:40:05If a politician in the United Kingdom was caught, say, deliberately misleading Parliament,
00:40:11the absolute convention was that that was a resigning offence.
00:40:15You would have to go. Generally speaking, there'd be no way back for you.
00:40:19These are career ending scenarios.
00:40:22That's not to say governments don't dissemble.
00:40:26They maybe you could say lie by omission. They absolutely spin.
00:40:34I mean, it's all about sometimes smoke and mirrors, slight of hand, misdirection.
00:40:41You talk up the good news story that you want to push.
00:40:44You downplay or maybe even sidestep completely the bad news.
00:40:51But but you don't outright lie.
00:40:54Now, I know a lot of people disagree with that.
00:40:56A lot of people probably watching me say this and say, oh, that's nonsense.
00:41:00Politicians lie all the time.
00:41:02But really, I don't think they do when even when you think they do.
00:41:07And even when some political commentators say it was a lie, it tends not to be.
00:41:13It tends to be all in in interpretation of details.
00:41:16When people say, do we have more jobs now or more people in employment?
00:41:20Well, you know, you've got to factor in a whole bunch of variables with this in terms of the size of the working population, whether those jobs are full time or part time.
00:41:29So it's always a debate to be had.
00:41:31So so when when people say governments lie, whether it's on UFOs or anything, not in my experience, they don't.
00:41:39It's they're very clever.
00:41:41And sometimes you've really got to know how to to speak the language, to go over things, the statements with a fine tooth comb and say, well, that's fine.
00:41:50But what about this? And very often, if you push back against something and you know, you're getting somewhere when someone comes back and says, oh, we don't have any further comment on that.
00:42:00But lies, not so much.
00:42:03Well, certainly, you know, there's stories about presidents and UFOs all along the way.
00:42:08We have the Richard Nixon, Jackie Gleason story where he took the famous comedian to I think it was Edleton Air Force Base in Florida and showed him the frozen preserved bodies of aliens.
00:42:19Nixon knew about it.
00:42:20You can make a very strong case, as I do, that President Kennedy knew about the alien presence.
00:42:25You have Jimmy Carter saying he saw a UFO.
00:42:27You have President Reagan constantly referring to, you know, wow, how united would we be if we were confronted with an invasion from outside?
00:42:36A number of other presidents have been asked about it and have made statements.
00:42:41Sometimes these statements have been done after their term as president or term or terms.
00:42:48And sometimes it's been on late night chat shows and they've kind of played it humorously.
00:42:54You know, we had President Obama was asked about aliens and he made some joke about, oh, yeah, yeah, I'll get you that stuff later.
00:43:01And then you have President Trump who's been asked directly about aliens on a couple of occasions and has admitted that he's been briefed on it.
00:43:09So that, you know, we're in a brave new world whether we realize it or not.
00:43:14I think that people under emphasize the importance of that response.
00:43:18No president has ever admitted that he's ever been briefed on aliens or UFOs.
00:43:23So that's a huge step.
00:43:24And I think we're just moving towards, you know, an inevitable climax where we will get something that's undeniable.
00:43:31One of the most intriguing things when it comes to UFOs is that sightings are made all around the world.
00:43:38It's not just, you know, in the US or the UK or Australia, whatever.
00:43:42You know, it's a global phenomenon.
00:43:44Many other countries have UFO programs of their own.
00:43:49We know from both intelligence sources and from open source material like the media that many, many different countries have for years run programs researching and investigating.
00:44:05Some countries we know more about than others.
00:44:08But many nations have now done what the United Kingdom has done and declassified and released much of this material.
00:44:16When you can put together a huge body of data where so many of the cases mirror other reports from the other side of the world and mirror cases that might be 50 years ago, then you see patterns and trends.
00:44:32And I think that's one of the most important aspects of the research is not just to focus on this area or that one because it's convenient to do that.
00:44:41But look at how the patterns are developing elsewhere.
00:44:45For that reason, I think it's important to look at the global aspects of it.
00:44:51And that's what I've done with my latest book, Flying Saucers from the Kremlin, which looks at some UFO Russian cases, but also as to how the Russians tried to manipulate the UFO phenomenon by creating bogus UFO stories to try and freak out the Pentagon.
00:45:09People say this subject is very U.S. and UK centric.
00:45:14And it is because a lot of this is English speaking.
00:45:17Two nations that we know are doing a fair bit are Russia and China, and they're bound to be important players in this.
00:45:25But because of not just language, but of course the nature of those regimes and the inherent secrecy and the mistrust of the West and the lack of openness and information sharing, we really don't know much about what's going on in Russia and China.
00:45:46Both in terms of the sightings, the case work, but also, of course, most importantly to me, in terms of what the governments know and think about the phenomenon, how they handle this in terms of policy.
00:46:00Geopolitics can't be taken out of the look at the phenomenon.
00:46:07And even amongst allies, there's surprisingly and disappointingly little collaboration.
00:46:16When I was running the British government's program, we didn't just pick up the phone and talk to our allies and say, send us your best cases and pop over for meetings about what we thought.
00:46:28No, this this was kept on a strictly national basis.
00:46:33Sometimes it can be a challenge to get information from far away nations.
00:46:39It's not the easiest thing to do.
00:46:41I mean, you know, the UK and the US have both got Freedom of Information Act, as has Brazil and Australia and numerous other countries as well.
00:46:52And you can liaise with the researchers and share data and that works well.
00:46:57But sometimes, you know, it can be so difficult. Countries, nations are isolated.
00:47:03There might be just a couple of researchers in the entire country, never mind the local county or whatever.
00:47:09You have to push and push and make connections elsewhere and try and put a picture together.
00:47:17Because I think so often what happens, you can have fragmented tales and somebody's got a little story here and there.
00:47:23But if you put all the material together, then you could see a pattern develop.
00:47:27And that's what I try and do.
00:47:29You know, look at, say, reports from India and then the next week you look at reports from Brazil, maybe Canada next week and Argentina the next.
00:47:39And look at the similarities between the cases. And it's kind of like a police officer looking into a case involving like a serial killer.
00:47:49You look for, they look for the threads that are followed in each murder.
00:47:54Well, we kind of do that in ufology. You look for the similar threads.
00:47:59If you look at history, if you go back hundreds of years, maybe thousands, if you get into ancient astronaut theory, the idea is that they have always been with us since the dawn of time.
00:48:15They've guided us, shaped us. Some people even say created us.
00:48:20We've worshipped them as gods, feared them as devils.
00:48:25You can go back hundreds of years and find various people, historical figures, who have certainly seen strange things in the sky that nowadays we would call UFOs.
00:48:37Whether it's Alexander the Great, whether it's Constantine, whether it's Christopher Columbus, some of these great figures have seen UFOs.
00:48:45And of course they didn't use that phrase.
00:48:48They would talk about fiery crosses in the sky or lanterns on or under the ocean.
00:48:56You can only use the language and conceptual ideas you have available to you.
00:49:03So when we say things like UFO, it's just a word. It's just a phrase. It's a label.
00:49:08We see these things through our individual eyes. We perceive them through our culture, our belief system.
00:49:16If a shadowy figure appears at the foot of your bed, if you're religious, you might think it's an angel.
00:49:22If you're interested in the paranormal, you might think it's a ghost.
00:49:26If you're interested in UFOs, you might think it's an abduction experience.
00:49:30So these are perhaps the same phenomena, but perceived and interpreted through the individual language, culture, belief system of the witness.
00:49:43The miracle of the sun, also known as the miracle of Fatima, is reported to have occurred on October 13th, 1917, attended by a large crowd who had gathered in Fatima, Portugal.
00:49:56Newspapers published testimony from witnesses who said they had seen extraordinary solar activity, such as the sun appearing to dance or zigzag in the sky, careen towards the earth or emit multicolored light and radiant colors.
00:50:10According to these reports, the event lasted approximately 10 minutes. Some describe it as a religious event or an act of God. Others believe it was UFOs.
00:50:20It was a UFO event. We've got too much witness testimony from the handwritten 1917 documents, which are tucked away at the sanctuary in Fatima, written by Father Fiera, who was a parish priest in Fatima, who went to the witnesses and took their testimony, it's handwritten.
00:50:38And Fina de Armada had access to the sanctuary in the 20th century. And she began, she took a tape recorder and just read everything. Couldn't write, couldn't take pictures, but she just read as fast as she could in the tape recorder.
00:50:51And then later on would disseminate. And what she realized is that, wait a minute, the witnesses are telling us something completely different than what we've heard.
00:51:00The idea of the spinning sun and the miracle and the blessed Virgin Mary. All this was basically concocted about 11 years after the event by the Catholic Church.
00:51:11The whole event was dressed up in the secrets of Fatima. There are no secrets of Fatima.
00:51:17That comes later when Lucia has been hustled off to a convent and she's now 18, 19 years old. This happens in 28, where she begins, and guess what the first one is? Consecrating Russia's to the sacred heart of Mary.
00:51:31Well, you know, this is a three hour theological discussion. Mary does not have a sacred heart. First of all, if you read the biblical narrative, she says, I'm a sinner like everybody else.
00:51:41So, yeah, she's the God bearer. I get all that. And she's blessed among all women. I understand that. But it wasn't Mary that appeared to the kids.
00:51:48The entity had a very short dress on, had this weird kind of cloak thing and was holding some sort of a ball. All that's been dressed up.
00:51:56But you go back in the 1917, handwritten documents, and it's a whole different deal. We have the photograph that was taken by Joshua Benolio in the field at Fatima in October 13, 1917.
00:52:11We've got it. And just Jose Machado was the man who actually went into, he had access to the archives in Fatima and was able to handle the original glass plates, the original glass plates.
00:52:26OK, and he's looking at these things and he went on record and said that these are not chemical burns are not smudges.
00:52:33They're not scratches. This whatever this thing is, it's intrinsic in the photograph.
00:52:37And there's actually three other photographs which he was not allowed to reproduce.
00:52:43But he told us about them that had the object in it, too.
00:52:46And the object is clearly a disk and it's hovering right over the apparition site.
00:52:51I mean, so people can do with that what they want to.
00:52:55But witness after witness came on the record in 1917 and stated, I looked up and saw a dull silver disk.
00:53:01That's what they said. And all that, of course, has been obfuscated.
00:53:05You never hear anything about that. But that's why we went into it.
00:53:08So it was a UFO event, in my opinion.
00:53:10It's pretty clear that a lot of ancient texts describe what we would call today UFO sightings, flying saucers, alien spacecraft, that kind of thing.
00:53:20To me, there's no question that we've been visited for a very long time.
00:53:25And it does seem likely that the alien interest, the extraterrestrial interest in the human race has accelerated since World War II, for sure.
00:53:34The history of the UFO phenomenon, and particularly, I suppose, ufology, has been almost like a cat and mouse struggle between the UFO community and the government.
00:53:48The UFO community believing that the government is gatekeeper of some huge secret too terrible to be told and that there's a conspiracy and a cover up and that it's just a matter of time.
00:54:01If we keep pushing at this, maybe we'll break it down.
00:54:04And there have been various attempts to, I suppose, smash through the wall of secrecy as people perceive it.
00:54:14The disclosure project has been one such initiative.
00:54:19Dr. Stephen Greer certainly drew together a large number of people who had some kind of involvement with this or claimed to have had some sort of involvement either on the policy side or as witnesses.
00:54:34But within government, military, intelligence community, some of those witnesses, I think, were the real deal and had genuine exposure to information about this and sightings.
00:54:48I think there are question marks over others.
00:54:51But over the years, other people have stepped up too.
00:54:54Stephen Bassett has done a lot of work in this area.
00:54:59Many other figures, James Fox, Leslie Kane, people have put together events at the National Press Club in Washington, D.C. to try to draw together various insiders, pilots, generals, military officers going on the record.
00:55:16I think all this has moved us further forward, but I think it's a mistake to regard the disclosure as a single event and a binary process.
00:55:29It gets kind of complicated when you've got real cases and you've got government agencies fabricating stories as well for political reasons.
00:55:40But for me, that's also a fascinating aspect of it all.
00:55:44You just have to go where the data takes you.
00:55:47And I've never been someone really who has taken all this from the perspective.
00:55:52I think it's going to be this.
00:55:54So I'm going to try and prove this theory.
00:55:56That's the wrong way to take it.
00:55:57I just go where the flow goes.
00:56:00And that's all you can really do.
00:56:03And hopefully at the end of the day, you know, if we're all six foot underground, we get the answers, you know.
00:56:09We're going to divert a little bit from the format of past press conferences.
00:56:17I don't know that I believe in government disclosure, but I think the aliens are going to, you know, land on the White House law at some point.
00:56:23All the new revelations that are coming out daily, literally on the news and the mainstream media.
00:56:29I mean, this is old stuff for us researchers who've been in it for, you know, a decade plus.
00:56:33But it is exciting times and it's exciting to see the rest of the world sort of, you know, go through what I went through a little over 10 years ago.
00:56:4133% of U.S. adults believe that some UFO sightings over the years have in fact been alien spacecraft visiting the earth from other planets or galaxies.
00:56:5316% of Americans say they have personally witnessed something that they thought was a UFO.
00:56:59So within three to five years, your government is going to finally tell you we know nothing about it.
00:57:05We don't know who they are. We don't know where they came from. We know nothing about it.
00:57:10But they are here. They are here to stay. And they've been here forever.
00:57:15When I hear people in the UFO community talk about disclosure, they even capitalize it. Disclosure with a capital D.
00:57:21And to them it takes the form of the president going on television.
00:57:27My fellow Americans, people of the world, we are not alone.
00:57:32And then the secret is unpacked for everyone.
00:57:44I don't think that's ever going to happen. I don't think it's as binary as that.
00:57:50It kind of assumes that the U.S. government has the archetypal spaceship hidden in an Air Force hangar somewhere.
00:57:59I'm not sure they do.
00:58:01I think that, if anything, events like the Nimitz encounter, programs like AATIP, suggest to me a different scenario.
00:58:13A scenario where the government, the military says, yes, sure, there is something here. There's a phenomenon.
00:58:18But we don't have the answer. We don't have a handle on it. We don't have crashed spaceships and dead aliens.
00:58:27We have something in our airspace. Our pilots see them. Our radar operators track them.
00:58:32Our intelligence operators try to make sense of what's happening.
00:58:37But we still don't really have a definitive assessment.
00:58:43So therefore, in that situation, I say, there cannot be disclosure with a capital D, because there is nothing binary like that to disclose.
00:58:55So what you have is what I characterize as disclosure with a little d.
00:59:00And disclosure with a little d is what we're seeing right now.
00:59:03We're seeing the revelations about the Pentagon's AATIP program.
00:59:08We're seeing the videos of Navy jets chasing UFOs. We're hearing from some of the people involved in the program.
00:59:15Former Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, who set it up.
00:59:20Luis Elizondo, the DIA intelligence officer who ran a lot of this.
00:59:25David Fravor, one of the pilots who chased these objects.
00:59:31All these people are coming forward. We have a paper trail now that we didn't have before.
00:59:36The DIA wrote to Congress about this, releasing a list of studies undertaken under the AATIP contract.
00:59:46None of this we had up until about two years ago.
00:59:49This is, I suspect, as good as it gets.
00:59:52Until and unless extraterrestrials, if that's what we're dealing with, do decide to land on the White House lawn.
01:00:00So when people say to me, when will we get disclosure?
01:00:03My answer is, you're getting it right now.
01:00:06Well, the sightings are coming out, you know, I mean, weekly.
01:00:11There's something on mainstream media covering sightings.
01:00:14Nimitz, the tic-tac-shaped UFO, happened well over, I think, in 2004.
01:00:19And, you know, Commander David Fravor is the pilot that chased this thing.
01:00:23You hear him go, whoa, that whole deal, got it.
01:00:26He says that and, you know, he's on Tucker Carlson.
01:00:29And it begs the question, I mean, Nick Pope and I sat down and talked about this thing.
01:00:32You know, they are ruling this out.
01:00:35How does someone like Nick Fravor wind up on Tucker Carlson?
01:00:38This guy's a nobody.
01:00:39He doesn't have a book.
01:00:40He doesn't have a DVD.
01:00:41He's a nobody.
01:00:42He's not on any type of a circuit.
01:00:44He's not doing any of this stuff.
01:00:45How does he get on Tucker Carlson?
01:00:47But he's there because he's a useful tool in the toolbox, as Nick Pope explained yesterday.
01:00:52And they took out the hammer and said, OK, go for it.
01:00:55And that was disclosure, 2017.
01:00:57And since then, on Tucker Carlson, they've been revealing the so-called extraterrestrial presence,
01:01:03which, of course, I believe is interdimensional and is part of the coming great deception.
01:01:07One of the biggest problems and challenges that we have in the UFO field is when it comes to the issue of what's real and what isn't.
01:01:16You know, we know there are genuine, really cool, good, solid UFO cases.
01:01:22But at times, government agencies have tried to muddy the waters by creating bogus stories and then revealing them as bogus stories.
01:01:32And that kind of makes people, they feel like, well, why should I keep doing this?
01:01:37It's just garbage.
01:01:38But it's actually just government manipulation and trying to sort of lower people's sense of excitement and vision for all this.
01:01:49And I think at times government agencies do this really well.
01:01:54You know, they build something up and then, well, it was just a hoax after all, and everybody gets kind of really down.
01:02:01And I think that's the whole point.
01:02:03You know, this is like a battle against UFOlogy to get us to stop what we're doing, you know, just by purely making us think, is it really worth it?
01:02:16Well, at the end of the day, it is worth it, but you have to find a way to dig through the real stuff and the disinformation and the bogus material.
01:02:26And sometimes that can be a big problem because some of the big disinformation stories are the really amazing, exciting stories that people don't want to give up on.
01:02:36And I'm sure these agencies recognize that there's a lot of manipulation of the UFO research community to prevent us from getting the answers.
01:02:45But the important thing of all of this is that the government agencies would not be putting out disinformation if there wasn't a real phenomenon.
01:02:54That's what it actually comes down to, and that's an important thing.
01:02:59When it comes to governments and UFOs, there are all sorts of rumors and accusations out there, misinformation, disinformation.
01:03:10There are characters in this story, people like Richard Doty, who claim to have an Air Force Office of Special Investigations background,
01:03:21who say that they worked at some point on maybe putting false information into the public domain on this subject to lead people down the wrong paths.
01:03:33What I will say is this, that certainly over the years, it does seem that there have been instances where, for example, governments would be almost promoting an extraterrestrial narrative to hide the reality that in some of these cases, it's our own technology.
01:03:54So, for example, in the 60s, when pilots were seeing and reporting things like the U-2 spy plane and the SR-71 Blackbird, it suited the CIA and the United States Air Force for any media reports about this to come out as flying saucer reports,
01:04:16as opposed to a report of an astonishing-looking next-generation aircraft.
01:04:25Does that mean that on occasion the government has itself fueled the fire when it comes to the UFO phenomenon and the narrative? Maybe.
01:04:3649% of Americans think that beings somewhat like ourselves exist somewhere in the universe.
01:04:43Even more, 75% believe that some form of life exists on other planets.
01:04:50So, for me, it's mainly UFOs and cryptozoology and that sometimes there's a crossover between the two.
01:04:57Of all the things that are going on, you know, two's plenty.
01:05:02Now, I don't want people to think it's a job, it's a passion, but it's a passion where I think you also need time away.
01:05:11Because I do know sometimes nightmare stories of people who it becomes an obsession to the point where it actually affects their lives and marriages and things because that obsession quite literally takes over.
01:05:25And I can see how easily that can happen.
01:05:27But for me, I have to have time to see what's going on with the soccer, you know, and never mind UFOs now and again.
01:05:35The cool thing is I come from a different perspective and most people in that audience have never heard it.
01:05:41But that's why I go really slowly and I speak in a language which I think people can understand.
01:05:46I didn't mention the word Jesus until the very, very end.
01:05:49And then I reveal the goods.
01:05:52But it took me three sessions to get there.
01:05:55I talk about my spirit guide, which is the Holy Spirit, the Great Spirit, the Holy Ghost.
01:06:00That's who my spirit guide is.
01:06:02But if I say the Holy Ghost or if I say the Holy Spirit, click, they won't listen.
01:06:07But if I say my spirit guide, which is what he is, right, they instantly relate.
01:06:12They instantly relate.
01:06:13So I'm not trying to be deceitful.
01:06:15I'm trying to speak in a language that I can communicate with the UFO community with.
01:06:20I've seen two myself.
01:06:21I come from that world.
01:06:23My third eye was open.
01:06:24I was in an ashram for three years.
01:06:26I mean, I did the whole deal.
01:06:27I mean, I was immersed in it.
01:06:29So I have a very unique perspective in looking at all this.
01:06:32And I'm a frank supernaturalist.
01:06:33I believe that the supernatural is more real than the natural world.
01:06:36And I've encountered it.
01:06:37And, you know, I encounter it all the time.
01:06:40And I mean that all the time.
01:06:42When the spirit of a living God speaks, you know, I've learned to listen.
01:06:46That's a process in itself.
01:06:47Certainly this kind of interaction, to talk with people, to hear their stories,
01:06:51to collaborate other people's stories, to then also verify some of my own experiences.
01:06:57You know, like, I'm not crazy.
01:06:59I saw these things in the middle of the day.
01:07:01Having an open mind and venturing into this world and having these experiences
01:07:06and interactions is a key part of it.
01:07:09I have an interesting relationship with the UFO community.
01:07:12Because I did this for the government, I think people are very polarized about me.
01:07:18A lot of people are very grateful and they'll say thank you for this great information.
01:07:26Because, of course, I don't just give people the information.
01:07:29I show them or tell them where they can get it.
01:07:33It's not just a story.
01:07:34It's something that can be verified in the National Archives, by going to the electronic reading rooms of various government agencies,
01:07:45by confirmation from the public affairs offices.
01:07:48So, a lot of people in the UFO community are grateful that I've helped them maybe make this more credible,
01:07:57by being maybe a communicator on this issue in some of the mainstream media work that I do,
01:08:05and by helping them find verifiable information.
01:08:09On the other hand, there are a lot of people in the UFO community who think that I'm still secretly working for the government,
01:08:18that I'm part of either a disinformation campaign or, flipping it the other way around,
01:08:26that I'm part of a campaign to acclimatize people to the reality of this ahead of an official announcement.
01:08:33But either way, of course, when you believe that someone's still secretly working for the government, they become the bad guy.
01:08:40So, I know that I'm the bad guy to a lot of people in the UFO community.
01:08:44Well, that's fine.
01:08:45It's difficult, if not impossible, to prove a negative.
01:08:48So, I'm not sure there's anything I could do to dissuade people who think I am still secretly working for them.
01:08:56It's all disinformation.
01:08:57I don't think there's anything I can do.
01:08:59If they want to believe that, fine.
01:09:00All I can say is, honestly, I'm not.
01:09:03But if they believe that, they wouldn't believe my denial, would they?
01:09:06So, I have mixed experience, I think, with the UFO community.
01:09:12And again, as with maybe a lot of fringe topic,
01:09:16there's no getting away from the fact that there are some out-and-out crazy people and fraudsters in this community.
01:09:24However, let's not throw out the baby with the bathwater.
01:09:28Most of the people in the community are honest, sincere, dedicated, hardworking, professional at what they do.
01:09:39They are genuinely interested and genuinely doing their best to uncover, as they would see it, the truth.
01:09:47Whatever that truth may be, wherever their journey takes them.
01:09:52You can't, like myself, have run a government UFO program without finding yourself cast by different parts of the community as hero or villain.
01:10:04Even as most Americans are skeptical that aliens have visited Earth, the majority, 56%, believe that those who spot UFOs are seeing something real, not just imagining it.
01:10:17And then came the ultimate, ultimate UFO experience.
01:10:23And I have the proof.
01:10:24It was during the solar eclipse in 2012.
01:10:28My wife, she wanted to take a picture of the solar eclipse.
01:10:34And I said, well, you can do that, but don't look, whatever it is.
01:10:38And then she went,
01:10:39six times, she took six shots.
01:10:43And I was going, what are you doing?
01:10:45Because she was looking through it and I was afraid for her eyes.
01:10:48And oh my gosh, when we develop the pictures, you can see the record.
01:10:55It's a hope.
01:10:56And believe me, you cannot duplicate this, regardless how good you are with Photoshop.
01:11:02You can see that hope coming to me, getting closer and closer and closer, entering my third eye and coming out of my heart.
01:11:13And since that day, I have been making predictions that are well documented, dated and unarguable about earthquakes above 6.0.
01:11:28I was on George Norrie, 40 million people listening to me.
01:11:32I said, be ready for fire and we're going to lose a hell of a lot of wildlife.
01:11:36A week and a half later, Australian fire killed millions of animals.
01:11:40And I said, be careful, there is a new disease coming for the lungs.
01:11:44And next thing you know, we're a virus.
01:11:47I gave the exact date for 9-11 with all the details.
01:11:52I gave exact date for a terrorist attack, which brought the FBI twice in my house.
01:12:01Believe me, extraterrestrials are master of matter, master engineer from the extreme.
01:12:08They do not care who you are.
01:12:10If you are the president, they don't care of your education.
01:12:12They do not care of your position.
01:12:14They have lost something that people like me were born with.
01:12:19They have lost the spirit.
01:12:21They have lost their identity.
01:12:23They have lost their connection with God and the divine.
01:12:27And humanity is moving in that direction.
01:12:30And that's why everything is rational and it's practical.
01:12:33Because the more you delegate with the tree, the less you're going to see the forest.
01:12:39There are many, many fascinating cases I've come across.
01:12:44Some fairly well known, some less well known, some not known at all.
01:12:50I mean, I think you could go, for example, through the declassified archives of Ministry of Defence files
01:12:57and you could pull out something almost at random and say, wow, that's interesting.
01:13:03I mean, we had some amazing cases.
01:13:05We had a great case, for example, where a UFO was seen to come down
01:13:11and the witnesses thought that it had landed in a field.
01:13:16They went to the field fully expecting to see something like out of close encounters.
01:13:22The UFO sat on or directly above the ground.
01:13:27No UFO, but in the middle of the field all the cows had congregated,
01:13:34stood in a perfect circle facing each other, completely silent.
01:13:39So you dip into the Ministry of Defence files and you can find cases like that.
01:13:45You can go into the UFO literature and you can find the well known cases,
01:13:50but you can find more obscure ones that really make you think.
01:13:55One thing that's caught my eye recently is that, and I think people have missed this,
01:14:02because we use the phrase UFO, we think of things in the air.
01:14:08But there have been many, many cases of UFOs seen either under the water,
01:14:15and I've spoken to witnesses who talk about some extraordinary encounters of UFOs under the water,
01:14:21UFOs transitioning from water to air, air to water, UFOs apparently drawing up water.
01:14:29So many, many of these so-called USO, unidentified submerged objects,
01:14:36many of those cases have kind of gone unnoticed, maybe until the Tic Tac incident.
01:14:44And that's kind of focused people's attention.
01:14:47But we're kidding ourselves if we think that that's the first time that a UFO has ever been seen moving,
01:14:53apparently seamlessly from air to water, water to air.
01:14:57And then, of course, the physics involved and implied by something like that is interesting.
01:15:02So you can almost, almost at random sometime, pick a country, pick an archive,
01:15:08and go and find interesting things that have maybe not been talked about much.
01:15:15Because everyone, of course, has their favourite cases, their flagship cases, Rendlesham Forest, Roswell,
01:15:23whatever it may be, the Phoenix Lights, Stephen Vell, Travis Walton, many, many different cases.
01:15:31But sometimes I think the lesser known or the completely unknown ones are more interesting.
01:15:37You've just got to dig and maybe find some interesting diamonds in the rough.
01:15:49This stuff is really, it's complex, but a good student can unravel the mysteries that are there.
01:15:57And look, I don't have, I don't know it all. I don't have all the mysteries unraveled. Nobody does.
01:16:02But that's why we're on the trail, because life is for learning.
01:16:06To me, the questions, are we alone or not in the universe? Are we being visited?
01:16:13Those are some of the biggest and most profound questions we can ask ourselves.
01:16:17Why wouldn't we want to get the answers to those questions?
01:16:21Is there a God? Does consciousness survive death of the physical body?
01:16:26Those are probably unknowable.
01:16:29But the question of, is there extraterrestrial life?
01:16:32Might be something that actually, surprisingly quickly and easily, we might get a definitive answer.
01:16:38That interests me. I mean, philosophy, hypothesizing, interests me.
01:16:44But at the end of the day, that's just belief.
01:16:47What intrigues me is the possibility of getting definitive, testable, repeatable proof on the extraterrestrial question that would tell us, yes, there are other civilizations out there.
01:17:00The technology. Could that give us, for example, solutions to problems that we have here on Earth?
01:17:10More generally, if we could either talk to other civilizations or access data about other civilizations, perhaps through picking up messages and signals.
01:17:21Could we learn things that might help us, again, overcome some of the problems we face here?
01:17:28Disease, poverty, prejudice and hatred.
01:17:32If there are other civilizations who've evolved and become more advanced than us, did they face those same problems and overcome them?
01:17:44And if so, how did they overcome them?
01:17:47Is there something, some tangible, whether it's technology or whether it's almost a philosophy, a political system, whatever it is, is there something we can learn?
01:17:58And again, I find this incredibly interesting.
01:18:01And my goodness, isn't it high stakes?
01:18:04At the moment, we have all our eggs in one basket here on planet Earth.
01:18:08One global pandemic, one big enough comet or asteroid strike, one nuclear war, and that's it.
01:18:15The human adventure ends.
01:18:17Someday, just through the natural life cycle of the stars, our sun will grow hotter and expand and life on Earth will be impossible.
01:18:28So, at some point, we have to develop viable interstellar travel.
01:18:33This is why I'm interested in ufology and the search for extraterrestrial intelligence, even though I'm no longer involved for the government.
01:18:42Because, as I say, these are not only the biggest and profound questions we can ask ourselves, but these are questions of existential importance.
01:18:52If we're going to get the answers, we've just got to keep pushing.
01:18:56You know, I've seen so many people, you know, they get into it at 20, 40, they're disillusioned, and 50, they're like, why did I waste that time?
01:19:04You know, but I don't look at it like that.
01:19:06I look at it that we're pursuing a major, incredible phenomenon.
01:19:11And to give up after this time or that time is just ridiculous, you know.
01:19:16I don't know how we could exist without beliefs. How can you have a thought without a belief?
01:19:20It would be nothing. It would be nothing. Everything starts with a belief.
01:19:25But it's we don't have to be totally created.
01:19:27I don't think we could really start our identity, aren't we?
01:19:29...
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