- 3 months ago
Bobi Wine's 2021 presidential run shook Uganda’s political landscape. Though long-time leader Yoweri Museveni retained power, Wine's campaign sparked massive youth engagement and online mobilization. But can he do it again? And will Ugandans rally behind him this time?
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00:00If Bobby Wine won, I wish he would address the issue of health and education as priority.
00:07He's rallied millions and defied the Ugandan government multiple times in the name of change.
00:13But why have these efforts failed to get Bobby Wine anywhere near the presidency?
00:18This time he is calling for a protest vote against government's failures.
00:22But can this really end Museveni's tenure?
00:24The protest vote has two words. It has protest and it has a vote.
00:28We are good with one. We are preparing for the other. We are good with the vote.
00:33Bobby Wine also claims that his words echo the frustrations of many young, restless, unemployed Ugandans who feel that the system has failed them.
00:43Critics say that Bobby Wine is all fire but shot on tangible solutions.
00:48Is he the really qualified Ugandan to unseat President Museveni?
00:52I am not the most qualified. I've never claimed to be the most qualified.
00:56There are many qualified people there. My only quality is commitment.
01:00What is really standing in the way of political change in Uganda?
01:05Is it Museveni's iron grip or the opposition's lack of strong leadership and winning strategy?
01:11And can Bobby Wine's protest vote really inspire regime change?
01:15That is the conversation today.
01:17My name is Mimi Mefonewu. Welcome to Under the Baobab.
01:23And you can call me George Okachi on this show. We make Africa's complex stories personal.
01:27We do that every Friday of the week. We sit down with policymakers, politicians and also opposition leaders across the continent.
01:36We would like you to be part of the conversation because we can see you're so much engaged on our different social media platforms.
01:44Please join us and continue to subscribe.
01:48Of course, this show is for you. And today we are joined by Uganda's opposition National Unity Platform President candidate Robert Chagulanyi Sentamo,
01:57better known as Bobby Wine, the pop star turned politician, will be attempting to end President Museveni's almost 40-year decade.
02:06Imagine a pop star.
02:07No, 40 years in rural.
02:09Yeah, nearly 40 years. He's not like Cameroon.
02:14But when you hear a pop star becoming a politician, you're wondering what does he really have to offer?
02:20But he is 43. The NUP leader says that Uganda is in deep crisis, especially leadership crisis.
02:29And this time he promises a different approach. He is saying and urging citizens protest at the ballot box.
02:35This is something different.
02:37Yeah, that's completely different. He's urging Ugandans to vote not just for him, but against status quo.
02:43His current political messaging, Mimi, has been, you know, repackaged.
02:48Of course, he ran for presidency in the last election in 2021, which he claims still today that he won and the victory was stolen from him.
02:56But the messaging currently is such that he's using words of like this is a civilian democratic rebellion against the regime.
03:06He's using issues like freedom and we must, you know, we must have it on our side.
03:13Yes. And the words protest votes, you know, it sounds like rebellion, but it's actually a strategy to unseat a government that doesn't want to leave power.
03:21And it's kind of understandable because usually when the governments would hear words like rebellion, protests, they always feel threatened because they always want to stay in power.
03:31Bobby Wine says that Uganda's institutions like the Electoral Commission, as well as the courts, have all been captured by the ruling national resistance movement, the party of President Iwari Moseveni.
03:43Yes.
03:43But he is still insisting that despite all these failures within the structures, the systems, the institutions in the country, participation in the upcoming election in Uganda is still key.
03:54Yes, it is still key for him. And of course, he embodies that, you know, feeling of I'm not giving up.
04:01I'm going for this, even though the institutions may be wrong, may be broken, the electoral system may be broken.
04:07We're still going for it. And we want to go for it with this new strategy called protest vote.
04:12So I just want to know, like when you spoke to him, what is the story behind the protest vote?
04:17Remember when he grants interviews to the media, he always says, as long as I am alive, I would always run for the presidency and ensure that change comes to Uganda.
04:29But I sought to find out from him, why do this when you don't trust the system?
04:34Let's hear what he said.
04:36I was never on record saying that I would never take part in an election. I've actually not said that.
04:43However, I'm also on record saying that going into an election without any other thought was futile.
04:54Therefore, we decided this time around to go into this election in what we call a protest vote.
05:00We are protesting, but we want to protest with and for legitimacy.
05:04For Ugandans watching somewhere in the suburbs, what would they understand by protest votes and how does it translate to you taking over the presidency in Uganda?
05:15Ugandan out there understand that we are going into this election as a way of protesting against the impunity, against the injustice, against the violence, against the corruption.
05:26And we are protesting by voting it out, not just casting the ballot.
05:30No, that's the usual casting. But this time, casting the ballot and standing there and counting it and following it up and then questioning any efforts of averting it.
05:43What are the guarantees that things are going to be different this time, given that you are using the same institutions to take part in the upcoming presidential election?
05:52Yeah, now, protest vote has two words. It has protest and it has vote. We are good with one. We are preparing for the other. We are good with the vote.
06:01But not only protesting for a leader to go and there's no other way. We are protesting because we have a problem and we have a solution as the people of Uganda.
06:11Now, to that Ugandan watching you at the moment, what makes you think that you are the most qualified to lead this battle for change that you want to see in your country?
06:21I am not the most qualified. I've never claimed to be the most qualified. There are many qualified people there.
06:27My only quality is commitment. And that commitment is born out of desperation. It's born out of lack of options.
06:35His commitment, born out of desperation and lack of people who are offering themselves to support the regime change that he's fronting for.
06:44And begs the question, why would some people still support a regime that many people are not comfortable with?
06:52That is the question that Bobby Wine is simply asking.
06:55Which is something that we've seen in some parts of West Africa as well.
06:59You know, President Bolatinubu in Nigeria, when you see people still supporting him.
07:05But the situation of Cameroon is kind of different because at least Bolatinubu has been in office for just a single term.
07:12But in Cameroon, it's so many years.
07:15And we saw during the elections that took place, elections governing body officials trying to violate laws just to keep President Paul Bia in power.
07:25And some of these people are kind of young people, young, energetic Cameroonians.
07:30And you're wondering, what is their end game?
07:33What is the objective trying to really keep pushing?
07:36Maybe that speaks to selfishness.
07:39People who are feeding from the system.
07:41That is the only way you can explain why they would be supporting a system that is not desired by the majority within a country.
07:48Because for me, I would support someone based on the policies.
07:51Let's look at the case of Uganda, for instance.
07:54We would want to question, what is Bobby Wine offering, which is better than what President Yowero Museveni is also offering as a leader of the country?
08:03Yes, and Mimi, and you see, as someone who comes from that region, concerns have been emerging that, you know, Bobby Wine is good with weeping emotion, you know, rallying support.
08:13And his political messaging rhetoric, you know, it brings the emotive support that we see online and also during political rallies.
08:22But his messaging is short of, you know, tangible policies that he is going to offer as an alternative to what President Museveni is offering.
08:32And also within his party, there have been claims that his, you know, his political style, if self-centered, he only fights for himself, things that are, you know, of his own interest.
08:44But let's find out if Bobby Wine himself agrees, because I ask him what his economic model for change in Uganda is and how he wants to turn things around for the country and for the people of Uganda.
09:00Listen, the first thing is for Ugandans to re-own the country, re-own the economy.
09:07We are not going to throw around economic models in a country where citizens are enslaved.
09:13We want citizens to re-get their freedom and economic freedom, and then we are going to move forward.
09:19We are under state capture.
09:21All institutions are captured.
09:23All the numbers and statistics are being manufactured by the regime to paint a rosy picture of a country that is enslaved.
09:33Yes, our health care system is sick itself.
09:36Yes, our education system is broken.
09:38You can go on and on and on and on and on.
09:40But all that is happening, not because we are broke.
09:43No, we are not broke.
09:44We have money.
09:45It's happening because money is not doing what it's supposed to do, because we are eaten by the cancer of corruption.
09:52So when we stop the corruption, we'll have that money.
09:55We'll just allocate the funds to where they are beneficial to the population.
10:02For example, General Museveni uses almost a million dollars daily.
10:07Now, that money can do so much in terms of our education system.
10:12Our budget is largely taken up by security, by the military.
10:17But are we fighting any war?
10:19No, we are not.
10:20So it's just reallocation of funds where they're going to benefit our people, and the rest will be history.
10:27It is not rocket science.
10:29It only takes love for a country.
10:30Now, Mr. Bobiwine, if you succeed in unseating President Yowero Museveni today, are you going to continue his agenda and plans, or are you going to start afresh?
10:41This country went off the rails a long time ago.
10:46We don't have a country, we don't have a government, we have a kleptocracy.
10:49So everything has to be overhauled in terms of health care, in terms of education, in terms of agriculture, in terms of infrastructure, but most importantly, in terms of governance.
11:04If I am watching from the ghetto, for instance, in a locality that is not well developed in Uganda, I want to hear my leader telling me exactly what he can do to either take me out of the ghetto or make the ghetto better for me.
11:20What are your concrete, specific plans?
11:23I come from the ghetto, I'm not sure about that.
11:27But I must also let you know that we are not only looked at ghetto people.
11:33We don't intend to take nobody from the ghetto.
11:36We as ghetto people, we believe that we work hard, we do everything we do, not to leave the ghetto, but to make the ghetto a better place to live.
11:47So to make the ghetto a better place to live is, first and foremost, give security to them.
11:53How do you give security?
11:55Secure them from poverty.
11:57Skill them, many of our young people, especially from the ghetto, are not only unemployed, but they are unemployable.
12:05We want to ensure that we tap into their abilities.
12:08The place of the young people in our government is going to be at the forefront, like it already is.
12:13Yes, I'm not a youth anymore, but I'm not the oldest, and I have an even younger mentality.
12:21So the question is, George, is Robert Chagulani, also known as Bobby Wine, the leader that Ugandans want?
12:27And that question can only be answered by Ugandans.
12:30And that's why we asked our correspondent, Frank Eager, to speak to Ugandans and tell us what they think Bobby Wine could do for them if he attains the presidency.
12:39We have several problems as youth that we are facing in this country.
12:44There's an issue of unemployment, poor service delivery, ETC.
12:50And what I would request from him and what I see and I've observed that he can really manifest through his works in this country is making sure that there is creating of job opportunities for the youth in this country,
13:08which I know he can do because he's part of the society.
13:11He has been in the hustling life with us.
13:13He knows exactly what the youth need in this country.
13:16I think I'd love to see how he strategically tackles corruption because, as we've seen, there are many initiatives that have come across over the years through the current government,
13:26but they are all brought down or watered down by corruption.
13:29So for me, corruption.
13:30If Bobby Wine won, I wish he would address the issue of health and education as priority, property in this country.
13:39The health system and education system is still so, so, so wanting.
13:44The social economic issues resonate across the continent, me, definitely.
13:48And, I mean, you've seen Ugandans express themselves to what they would want their leader or any leader they elect to do to them.
13:55And I'm sure that is what Bobby Wine's campaign team should be keen on, what Ugandans are demanding from them.
14:04But, you know, running against President Museveni, it's not an easy task for the faint-hearted.
14:12Especially for anyone who wants to stay in power.
14:15It's not always easy.
14:16You have to be well-armed because you are risking going to jail, arrested, beaten, or even killed.
14:23Sadly, we've seen some politicians also, you know, targeted and killed in some parts of Africa.
14:29And the people of the NUP of Robert Cagulani would give a lot of testimonies as to how dozens of its members have been missing, others in detention.
14:41Meanwhile, police have also been accused of using buttons and tear gas to disperse crowds celebrating the nomination of Bobby Wine.
14:48Yeah, definitely. These are things that we've reported, Mimi, and it's a fact that there are some leaders within the NUP and within the opposition rank that are still, you know, being imprisoned, politically imprisoned.
15:01And this is something that most Ugandans have stood against.
15:05But also, let's look at the opposition, Mimi.
15:08We wouldn't say that it is so much united to fighting all these injustices.
15:13You know, we've talked about opposition division a lot on this program.
15:16And when you look at also how close Bobby Wine is with someone, a veteran political figure in Uganda like Kiza Besije, you'd want to question how close are they when there are allegations that they are not having common grounds, that they are not working together.
15:35We know that Besije himself has contested for the presidency at least four times.
15:41And he is facing legal troubles, facing treason charges, and he could potentially, if...
15:48Here we go.
15:53So, then we want to hear a lot of lies in his stock.
16:03All right.
16:08All right.
16:08All right.
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