'Force More Species Into Crisis': Julia Brownley Slams Attack On Conservation In Bill Draft

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During a House Natural Resources Committee hearing before the Congressional recess, Rep. Julia Brownley (D-CA) asked Principal Deputy Director of the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service Justin Shirley about a bill draft that she claims would weaken conservation efforts.

Transcript

00:00The chair now calls on Ms. Brownlee for five minutes of questions.

00:04Thank you, Madam Chair, and welcome to Washington, Mr. Shirley, and thank you for being here

00:10to testify today. As you mentioned, the Fish and Wildlife Service is one of the

00:16three federal entities responsible for implementing the MMPA. Mr. Shirley, can you explain how your

00:26agency currently assesses marine mammal stocks under the MMPA?

00:32Yeah, that is a great question and something I was trying to allude to in the prior

00:38questioning of how we collect that data. And again, very extensive when you're talking marine

00:44mammal stock and the service, the Fish and Wildlife Service is in charge of 10 of those stocks with

00:50the species under the act that we have ultimate responsibility with. So most of the other stocks

00:57are all set in nymphs priorities there. But with the service, we're dealing with polar bears,

01:06walrus, sea otter, and manatee specifically. And inside that, we have 10 stocks that we're

01:12constantly trying to evaluate and make sure we have the best and most reliable data that we have.

01:19That takes a lot of work. And marine mammals are one of those that we do. We constantly

01:26are trying to use models, the best models that we can find and available to make sure that we're

01:32getting the best estimates, if you will, of those populations. And it's hard to come up with a specific

01:40answer to your question as far as how we assess that, but it's no different than other species.

01:46And using those models is something we've done in the past.

01:50So, and as you know, this discussion draft would raise the threshold for assessing the health of

01:58marine mammal stocks. And in my opinion, effectively strip protections from marine mammals when that

02:06higher data threshold isn't met. So does your agency have any estimate of how many marine mammal

02:12stocks lack the level of data that would be required under this reauthorization to continue

02:21receiving the same MMPA protections? That is a great question. And one that I

02:27would ask if I could get back to you on the specific data there. I'm not positive. Again, with us, the

02:35the bottom line with with all of the consideration here is our our role and our goal of making sure

02:42that those populations are sound and that we're conserving those for future generations.

02:47Thank you for that. You know, I'm a little concerned that this discussion draft,

02:55there wasn't really any serious consideration. And I'm worried what the impacts would be on America's

03:03conservation framework, which is a particular shame as the MMPA and Endangered Species Act are regarded

03:11as the gold standards for conservation worldwide. So speaking of ESA, we dedicate quite a bit of time in

03:20this committee discussing this act. My colleagues across the aisle like to claim that the ESA is

03:27failing and often point to the fact that only 3% of listed species have been successfully delisted.

03:36But they conveniently ignore a significant barrier. Congress has consistently underfunded the ESA,

03:43making it harder for agencies to carry out the final stages of recovery. And yet, despite all that

03:50hand-wringing, this committee continues to entertain legislative proposals that would, like this MMPA

03:57draft, weaken proactive management and force more species into crisis before protection can kick in.

04:05So, Mr. Shirley, would you agree that the lower thresholds in this MMPA reauthorization discussion

04:11draft would lead to more marine mammals ultimately being listed under the ESA?

04:20There's a lot wrapped into what you just said, and I appreciate the context of what it's and how you

04:29share it. Again, because I think there's some commonality amongst the committee, amongst the service,

04:34amongst the American people, that the last thing we want to do is put these species

04:40in peril or at risk. And I think we can find ways that that doesn't happen. In fact, I know we can.

04:46We've been a nation of being able to do that. And that's what I hope we can continue to work on,

04:52is find common ground that we can continue to move forward with some of these species.

04:57Well, thank you for that. And I appreciate your sincerity, it sounds like.

05:02And I do, it is very concerning, again, because I think we're understaffed in terms of MMPA,

05:13and we know quite clearly that the Endangered Species Act is also

05:23underfunded as well in terms of its implementation. And so, I don't want, you know, mammals to go from

05:29one place to the next place. And in either place, they're not fully protected. So, that's my concern.

05:34Thank you. And I appreciate that. And I yield back, Madam Chair.

05:37Yes,

05:51I, I, I

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