Netanyahu's Gaza war plan doesn't have "anything to do with Israel's present or future security."

5 months ago

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00:00Benjamin Netanyahu says Israel has no choice but to finish the job and complete the defeat of Hamas.

00:06Speaking to foreign media in Jerusalem, he defended the planned military offensive,

00:10saying Israel's goal is to, quote, free Gaza.

00:14The Israeli prime minister added that there's a short timetable in mind for the next few steps.

00:19Jenny Shin has a recap of what he said.

00:23Amid growing calls to end the war,

00:25Benjamin Netanyahu remained defiant on his new plan to take control of Gaza's city.

00:30Our goal is not to occupy Gaza.

00:33Our goal is to free Gaza, free it from Hamas terrorists.

00:38The war can end tomorrow if Gaza, or rather if Hamas, lays down its arms and releases all the remaining hostages.

00:46Speaking at a press conference in Jerusalem,

00:48the Israeli prime minister said operations will be carried out quickly and safe zones will be established first.

00:54The aim of the new offensive, to dismantle what he called the last remaining Hamas strongholds.

01:00Given Hamas's refusal to lay down its arms,

01:03Israel has no choice but to finish the job and complete the defeat of Hamas.

01:08Last Thursday, Israel's cabinet, Israel's security cabinet,

01:12instructed the IDF to dismantle the two remaining Hamas strongholds in Gaza City and the central camps.

01:18Netanyahu says Israel plans to open safe corridors to evacuate targeted areas and establish new aid sites in Gaza.

01:26For now, the amount of aid entering the enclave remains limited due to an Israeli blockade,

01:31with its distribution marred by injuries and killing, either from Israeli fire or falling pallets.

01:37As starvation grips the enclave, the Israeli government has faced growing international criticism.

01:42On Sunday, the UN Security Council slammed Netanyahu's plan to expand military operations,

01:48calling on its cabinet to reverse the decision.

01:50The latest decision by the government of Israel risks igniting another horrific chapter in this conflict,

01:58with potential consequences beyond Israel and the occupied Palestinian territory.

02:03If these plans are implemented, they will likely trigger another calamity in Gaza, reverberating across the region.

02:14Netanyahu also faces mounting criticism at home,

02:18with tens of thousands rallying in Tel Aviv regularly to demand an end to the war.

02:22For more on this story of the planned Israeli taking of control of Gaza,

02:28I can welcome Oliver McTiernan, director and co-founder of Forward Thinking,

02:32a charity addressing issues related to the Middle East peace process and religious and secular dialogue.

02:39Good morning, Oliver, and thank you for joining us.

02:42Is this plan of Benjamin Netanyahu's for defeating Hamas,

02:45is it a new departure or is it more of the same?

02:50No, I think, Oliver, it's from the very beginning, it was his intention.

02:55He said, remember, in October 23, that he had a two-fold goal.

03:00One was to see the total demise of Hamas and the second was to rescue the hostages.

03:06What this plan has done, he's put a bit more, what we would say,

03:10a political vision on to the end of what happens if he achieves his first goal of defeating Hamas.

03:17And he's telling us he's going to separate Gaza from the rest of the occupied Palestinian territories,

03:23impose his own sort of leadership in Gaza,

03:27and then hopefully get support for security from some of the Arab countries.

03:33Well, I think right from the start, it's not going to work.

03:37And all it's going to do is to lead to more killing.

03:42Gaza has become the modern killing fields.

03:45And I fear we're going to see more of that if he attempts to implement this plan he presented.

03:52Now, Netanyahu is facing pressure from some in Israeli civil society,

03:57particularly the families of hostages, to bring the war to an end.

04:01But there's also pressure from the other end,

04:03particularly from far-right members of his own government who say he's not going far enough with these plans.

04:10Will he actually survive this internal dissent within the government?

04:15I think it would be a very unwise person who would bet on whether Netanyahu will survive politically or not.

04:22He's a past master at being able to manipulate situations and come out of it in his favour.

04:30I think the problem with the street protests in the Israeli political setting,

04:39they don't seem to have much impact.

04:41I think the real issue is what's going on in the Knesset, even though it is in recess.

04:47You may recall just before they went into the summer recess,

04:52the two major ultra-Orthodox parties, Shas and the United Judaism,

04:58our Torah Judaism parties, pulled out of government,

05:04leaving Netanyahu in a minority government.

05:08Now, he is to use this recess to work with those parties, I think,

05:14to get them back into his coalition.

05:16And the issue is over the draft law that students in the religious schools are exempt from military service.

05:25Now, there's been a strong reaction from other parties on that.

05:29I think if he fails to get them back in between now and October,

05:33what's going to happen is he's going to have to have elections.

05:37Meanwhile, he's placating Smuttridge and Ben Gafir by pursuing what they wanted from the start,

05:47the devastation of Gaza and, in fact, the deportation of the whole Palestinian population of Gaza.

05:54So he's playing political games.

05:57I don't think it's anything to do with Israel's present security or future security.

06:02Now, Netanyahu's troubles with the law are well documented,

06:07the very fact that if he leaves office, he is likely to face prosecution on corruption charges.

06:13But we're also beginning to see signs of serious dissent against the war within Israel,

06:18with scholars of genocide such as Omer Berthoff and Amos Goldberg,

06:22and also the novelist David Grossman saying that Israel is committing genocide in Gaza.

06:27So Israel is unlikely to ever cooperate with the International Criminal Court.

06:32But might this actually be added to a slate of offences against Netanyahu within Israel in the future?

06:43Yeah, I have many friends in Israel who are extremely distressed,

06:50and I use that word, by what is happening now in Gaza.

06:54And they would put it in that category.

06:56You know, they would feel that the consequences of what is going on now will be felt for some time to come.

07:04I think one of the issues, as you rightly point out,

07:08is how this will be dealt with in the context of international law.

07:13But my worry, Oliver, is that we have seen the whole post-war rule-based order

07:20just disintegrate before our eyes in the last 22 months.

07:24Certainly, the Geneva Convention has not been applied to Gaza.

07:29Gaza, as we constantly need to be reminded, is already an occupied territory in international law.

07:37And Israel, under the Geneva Convention, had a responsibility to protect civilians,

07:42to provide them food, to ensure the medical needs are met, and so on.

07:46We've seen that just totally ignored.

07:49So on the international level, in the law context, I think the jury is out.

07:57But I think the relationship between Israel and its neighbours,

08:02I've just come back from Cairo last week, the neighbouring attitude among the populations,

08:10I think it will take a long, long time to heal that,

08:13and for Israel to feel that it is part of the region, which it should be.

08:18If we're going to have lasting peace and security,

08:20it has to be an integral part of a sustainable stability in the region.

08:27As the way Netanyahu is driving the country at the moment and what's happening in Gaza,

08:31I think is making that extremely, extremely a difficult scenario to see how it will be implemented.

08:37Now, even Washington has begun to show some impatience with Netanyahu,

08:42with Donald Trump clashing with him over images of starvation from Gaza.

08:47Will Trump exert any significant pressure on Netanyahu?

08:52It's another unwise person who would predict that,

08:58because the one thing we know about Donald Trump is unpredictability.

09:03It's interesting, Haaretz yesterday had a headline saying that Trump has done nothing,

09:11nothing to ease the starvation crisis in Gaza.

09:15Now, I would say that would have been a first indicator.

09:19He expressed his alarm at the pictures he saw.

09:22He said those can't be faked.

09:24And yet we've seen him do very, very little to change the circumstances,

09:29to insist that Netanyahu allows sufficient food into Gaza.

09:34We're hearing an alternative narrative constantly, constantly coming out of Jerusalem

09:39that is challenging all the realities on the ground.

09:44Thank you very much for that, Oliver McChairnan,

09:46director and co-founder of Forward Thinking.

Netanyahu's Gaza war plan doesn't have "anything to do with Israel's present or future security."

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