00:00Carol, this reform burqa ban story is going to be a massive, I predict.
00:06This is going to follow around Sarah Poacher, new female MP, first female MP for reform.
00:11She came out of the blocs yesterday in PMQ.
00:13She could have asked them anything.
00:15She asked Keir Starmer, does he plan to ban the burqa for safety like European countries?
00:21Which, of course, is not reform UK policy.
00:23Reform UK policy is to keep the burqa...
00:24Well, I was just going to say that, Piers.
00:25You're just taking the thunder there right now.
00:28So, no, she asked this question, which is a bit odd,
00:30because you'd think before you ask your first question,
00:32you might have a little chat with your reform colleague.
00:34I'm sure she did.
00:35And I'd think.
00:35Well, no, she didn't.
00:36Where was that next door?
00:36Well, apparently she didn't, because a lot of them have just said,
00:41didn't know anything about it.
00:42Faraj didn't know anything about it.
00:44Faraj, the guy called Zia Youssef, who you know...
00:46He's the chair.
00:47He's the chair.
00:47He said, he said, he was the one who called,
00:51he said he had no idea this was going to be a first question.
00:54And he said, and he wrote on Twitter,
00:56which is like a bit of a condemnatory thing to do.
00:58He said, I do think it's dumb for a party to ask the PM.
01:01They would do something else.
01:02Anyway.
01:03He's not wrong, is he?
01:04Well, well...
01:04I mean, he doesn't, he doesn't.
01:05It's very, it's poor for party discipline.
01:08I'm not saying this is any kind of reform bad.
01:09No, you're right, it is.
01:10But it's very stupid to open up a dividing line within your own party
01:13with a completely unprovoked, it's an unforced error.
01:17He's made an even bigger dividing line as a party chairman,
01:19to slap it down.
01:20It was her fault.
01:20Why on earth, if you know that there is a big dividing line
01:23in your party, which is quite divided on these sorts of issues anyway,
01:27well, she should know, she's an MP,
01:29that these are the sort of issues that would have been,
01:31would have very much appealed to the old UKIP party.
01:34In fact, UKIP used to talk about this stuff.
01:36Oh, stop it.
01:36But reform is the successor party to UKIP,
01:40but in all but name.
01:42It's not, it's nothing to do with UKIP.
01:44It's the same party leader.
01:46The left does that all of the time.
01:47The left does that.
01:48UKIP leader was Nigel Farage.
01:51Yes, but he's not, he doesn't support UKIP policy.
01:54Well, it's banned in nine countries in France.
01:56Yes, well, exactly, and that's the point.
01:58Let's stop going off the point.
01:59The point is, she asked, I think,
02:01which is a legitimate question of the Prime Minister,
02:03I think it was a trap for him,
02:05because whatever he says, he was going to be in trouble.
02:07The trap for her.
02:08The trap for them.
02:08They're the ones who fall into it.
02:10What she didn't realise was that it's actually going to,
02:11it's going to stuff her up now.
02:13Farage has had to come in and he's just saying,
02:15he's trying to balance it now by saying,
02:17it's a discussion that we should have at some point.
02:20And he said that on GB News last night, Carol,
02:22sorry for some trick,
02:22but if you want to see that,
02:23you can go to GB News.com and have a look at what Nigel said.
02:25Yeah, and I think it's, no, he's saying that,
02:28he's saying that.
02:30Do you think it should be Bambaloe?
02:32You know, I don't like seeing it.
02:35I really don't.
02:35I look at women in this country
02:37and I see them walking five paces behind their husband,
02:40sometimes two of them,
02:41and I think that's not our values,
02:44that's not how we live.
02:44But then you see a very distinguished academic
02:47at a university wearing a burka and you think,
02:49I don't think her husband told her to wear that.
02:50Well, no, probably not,
02:52but maybe that could be years of being taught
02:54that that's what you should do.
02:55Well, it depends what we're talking about here as well,
02:56because I think we say ban the burka,
02:58meaning all headscarves,
02:59but that's not really what we're saying.
03:00No, no, no.
03:01No, we're talking about the full face.
03:02No, it's a face covering.
03:03It's a face covering.
03:04You've been talking about the burka,
03:05which is a face covering.
03:06Yeah, it's a face covering.
03:07My position on this has always been,
03:09as a good liberal,
03:10that no one should be told what clothes to wear.
03:13I don't, it doesn't matter what I,
03:15it doesn't matter.
03:17Very, very funny.
03:18What other people choose to wear,
03:21I might not like it,
03:22especially on this panel often,
03:23but I'm not banned from,
03:25I'm not banned from it
03:26and no one else should be banned
03:27from wearing clothes
03:28and actually think that we should be,
03:30have a lot more liberal rules
03:31on what people are allowed to wear.
03:33Do you think it's right?
03:33I think women should be allowed to go to this.
03:35Do you think it's right
03:35that in a Western liberal democracy,
03:38I see women not just wearing the face covering,
03:40I see them wearing like cages on their face now
03:43and it's like a metal thing.
03:44No, that's the, that's the,
03:46that's the, that's the,
03:46that's the,
03:47they don't all have the metal cages on.
03:49That shouldn't be happening.
03:52I think when,
03:53we've got a problem with your mic Jonathan at the moment,
03:55so that's probably a relief to quite a lot of listeners.
03:57But, but don't you think when Starmer talked about strangers
04:00and people who feel like strangers are foreign land,
04:02part of that is the massive expansion of the book.
04:05I would say all head coverings are a barrier to conversation.
04:12Yes.
04:13I really do.
04:14If I'm sat on the bus next to somebody
04:15who doesn't have a head cover,
04:17a face covering or a hair covering,
04:18the chances are we will chat.
04:21And if they are covering their face
04:22and they're not looking,
04:24it breaks down that communication.
04:26But isn't that so,
04:27so.
Comments