- 11 months ago
Paul Dano talks about his experiences directing his first film.
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00:00You mentioned your partnership with Zoe Kazan, and she was here with you when you came in in July of 2012 for Ruby Sparks, and you deferred to her, I guess, when it comes to the writing process, but what is that like when you have an idea, and you really love your idea, and then you give it to somebody else, and they say, that's not bad, but I'm going to tell you, is it trust, is it, how do you get to a point where you're like, alright, her idea is better than mine?
00:23Well, it's debilitating, first. You're crippled. What do you mean?
00:31This is his directorial debut for the film Wildlife. Please welcome back to our studio, after six years, Mr. Paul Dano.
00:39Yes!
00:39This morning. Good to see you, Paul.
00:42Thanks for having me.
00:43Thanks for being here. We appreciate it. Listen, so your directorial debut, and also you wrote the screenplay, or co-wrote the screenplay.
00:51Going into this, what kind of expectations did you set for yourself? That's a big, big, big project.
00:58Yeah, it is. And honestly, directing is such a long journey, and such a big experience. I think you're just sort of setting expectations one step at a time.
01:07Okay.
01:07So honestly, at first, you're just trying to write a good script, and set yourself up with a foundation that you can feel good on. Then you're just like, trying to get the actors to say yes. Then you're just like, trying to get the money.
01:18And we're talking years and years, and we're talking about, what, about like four years?
01:22I would say so. I read a book called Wildlife by Richard Ford, who's an incredible American writer.
01:27Right.
01:27Probably 2011 or 2012, and started turning this thing over in my head, thinking, okay, can this be a film? Can this be a film for me?
01:34So do you immediately option it because you're like, oh, okay, because I know how these things play, and you want to make sure you have it, correct?
01:40Correct, but I did not immediately option it.
01:42Really? Okay.
01:43Yeah, because I sort of wanted to make sure that I had something to offer it. Also, because I sort of do admire Richard Ford, I really wanted to sort of know that there was a film.
01:53You know, just a good book doesn't necessarily make a film, so why make a film of it?
01:58And when I thought of the ending for this film, which is different than the book, that's when I optioned the book, because I sort of knew the final shot sort of gave me the energy and the courage to sort of actually do it.
02:09It's very cool because I think when you take – so you and Zoe Kazan co-wrote the screenplay, and from what I understand, it was a back-and-forth process.
02:18And that actually – you know, you kind of took a very long run at it at first, and she sort of helped you, you know, whittle it down and get to that point.
02:27But you sort of got the blessing from the author of the book to just make it your own property.
02:32And at that point when that happened, did that – you have a sigh of relief?
02:36Because I think the onus would – or you'd feel sort of – you'd have to be as faithful to the source material as you – out of respect.
02:45But when he sort of cuts you loose, was that a breath of relief?
02:48Absolutely.
02:48Yeah, for sure.
02:50I mean, not only because I like his work, but he basically said that my book is my book and your picture is your picture.
02:56Oh, that's great.
02:57You have to establish your own values, and that sort of immediately gives you permission to sort of follow now what the film is.
03:04And you have to.
03:05He had the great bit of wisdom that you can't just sort of translate a book and, you know, make it into a film.
03:10And my partner and I, Zoe, you know, this sort of story there is that I wrote a first draft.
03:17I secretly thought it was pretty good, and then I gave it to her, and she quickly dissuaded me.
03:22Wow.
03:23As friends, too.
03:24As good friends, too.
03:25Yeah.
03:25Yeah, this is not as good as you think it is.
03:27Did Richard Ford, the author, did he ever visit the set during filming, or did he stay away from all that?
03:32No, he stayed away.
03:33I mean, we kept in touch via e-mail.
03:35He writes the most beautiful e-mails, and we've been in touch.
03:38We just did a talk at Lincoln Center the last week in New York.
03:42He loves the film, so that means a lot.
03:44So it's a story of a family and a family going through changes.
03:49And it's a funny thing because, you know, a simple story told this way, families can provide your greatest sense of support and love and also your greatest conflict in life and your greatest issues to deal with.
04:03And that's what you were looking to explore with this, correct?
04:07That's exactly it.
04:08Richard Ford sort of captured a duality where he was able to look at this hard situation with a lot of compassion, a lot of love.
04:15That's certainly how I, you know, sort of grew up.
04:18We lived in a one-bedroom apartment in New York.
04:20My family was close but probably too close.
04:24You know, and when my parents struggled, we felt it, you know, and it's sort of—I moved to a new town when I was 14 to enter high school.
04:33At that point in your life, home is sort of the edge of the world.
04:36You know, you don't—I didn't yet have friends in that town.
04:38Yeah.
04:38And so that is sort of what the film is trying to express.
04:43It's really about a kid seeing his parents change, their marriage change, and sort of just being, like, thrust suddenly into adulthood.
04:50It's got to be wild.
04:51You mentioned your partnership with Zoe Kazan, and she was here with you when you came in July of 2012 for Ruby Sparks, and you deferred to her, I guess, when it comes to the writing process.
04:59But what is that like when you have an idea, and you really love your idea, and then you give it to somebody else, and they say, that's not bad.
05:08But I'm going to tell you, is it trust?
05:10Is it—how do you get to a point where you're like, all right, her idea is better than mine?
05:14Well, it's debilitating.
05:16You're crippled.
05:20What do you mean?
05:21No.
05:21So in this case, it wasn't that somebody's idea is better.
05:24It was like, okay, this was my first time writing.
05:26Zoe is a proper writer.
05:27She's written plays that have gone up in New York.
05:29She's written screenplays that have been produced.
05:30She saw what I was trying to do, but was like, I can—and also, frankly, we just couldn't get through a note session because we live together,
05:37and you have to sort of protect the relationship from, you know, a certain amount of conflict.
05:43So I think she was like, why don't I just do a pass because I think it's healthier for us than if we just fight through these notes.
05:49Okay.
05:49And that turned out to be wonderful, and it sort of opened up our process, which was we would talk about the script for two or three hours.
05:58Then one of us would take it for a few weeks and sort of do a pass.
06:01So we each had our own process, and at that point, once you're into it, you're fighting on behalf of the characters and the film, so you're not fighting each other.
06:09You know, somebody has an idea, you believe in it, you talk about it, you get into it, and then time sort of reveals the right direction.
06:16Those moments, though, where you as a director, like you're not moving the camera a lot, and you're just kind of letting it happen, you know, to me, that would be such a hand-wringing thing.
06:27How do I do this?
06:28How do I convey the subtlety of this?
06:31You know, were there a number of passes, or do you just instinctively say, this is the way it's got to be?
06:35No, it was from day one a film that let's not move the camera if we don't have to for the moment.
06:40Let's not put score on it unless we have to.
06:43Let's sort of like...
06:44Let it breathe.
06:45Yeah, and also just like leave them to hang out to dry almost, you know, because you don't want to be reductive about something like this, something as complicated.
06:53My feeling is I've always loved the illusion of simplicity, like something that looks simple but is really not, you know.
07:00And it was something I said to my crew even was like, it's like we're trying to make a film that's like sushi.
07:05Like, it looks simple.
07:07Quiet moments.
07:08It's not.
07:08Yeah.
07:09You know, it's actually beautiful and, you know, it's hard to make.
07:12Yeah.
07:13Right.
07:13I like that.
07:14And you can kill people if you don't make it properly.
07:16So, yeah.
07:16There you go.
07:16Okay.
07:17I like the analogy.
07:18I love Mumford & Sons.
07:19They're like one of my favorite bands.
07:21Carrie Mulligan is married to Marcus Mumford.
07:23Yeah.
07:23Did Marcus show up at all?
07:25Oh, sure.
07:25Did he?
07:26Yeah.
07:26We hung.
07:26You made his day.
07:28Yeah.
07:28We would go hit some golf balls, hang out.
07:30We were in Oklahoma.
07:31We were sort of in, I don't want to say the middle of nowhere, but...
07:34You were in the middle of nowhere.
07:36We were in the middle of nowhere.
07:37Bomb F, as they call it.
07:39But that's also one of the beauties about making a film on location is this feeling of
07:43like summer camp.
07:45So, you know, Carrie and I have known each other forever.
07:47Jake and I have known each other, known Marcus forever.
07:50You know, there's something nice about the only people you have to lean on are the people
07:54you're there working with.
07:55And it's super fun.
07:57Right.
07:57Are they a part of the soundtrack at all?
08:00They are not.
08:02Okay.
08:02I do think they have a new record coming out soon.
08:04They do.
08:04I'm going to go.
08:05I watched a movie recently that you're in, Love and Mercy, about Brian Wilson.
08:08And it's an interesting movie.
08:10I didn't quite know what to expect.
08:12There are several different actors playing Brian Wilson in it.
08:14Can you talk a little bit about what that experience was like?
08:16And did you have a relationship or learn anything from Brian or talk to him about it?
08:20Yeah.
08:20I think that's the best time I've ever had acting.
08:23Brian is a really special guy.
08:26It's the story of Brian Wilson, by the way.
08:28And you play him as the younger Brian Wilson around the time of the recording of Pet Sounds.
08:33And John Cusack plays him later on in life.
08:36Yeah.
08:36Yeah.
08:36For somebody who struggles so much, Brian, he's got an incredible amount of light inside
08:42of him.
08:43And frankly, studying that music for six plus months was one of the greatest gifts I've
08:48had from work.
08:48I just felt so in love with what he's giving us through the spirit of this music.
08:54And I miss it.
08:55It's a great movie.
08:56And I just saw your film after seeing a documentary called The Wrecking Crew, in which they sing.
09:04And I told Preston, and I think you've seen it since then.
09:07Oh, yeah.
09:08And they talk about recording with Brian Wilson.
09:11And these guys, these are the top, top, top studio musicians.
09:14And they said, and then there's Brian Wilson and his genius level was off the charts.
09:21And I think you, the sequences where you're recording in the film and you specifically
09:25caught what I imagined it would have been like outside of the documentary.
09:29It was an amazing performance.
09:31That's very nice.
09:32Yeah.
09:32And that's frankly, we were in the studio that he actually recorded Pet Sounds in back
09:36in 65.
09:37Wow.
09:37At that point, you're just trying to summon the spirits and let them pass through you.
09:41But that is so moving that these brilliant musicians, The Wrecking Crew, they were the
09:44best.
09:45They were the best session musicians in town.
09:47And Brian was their guy.
09:49They were like, that's the guy.
09:50It's incredible.
09:50Yeah.
09:51Hey, great to see you again.
09:52Congratulations.
09:52Thanks for coming by.
09:53Thanks, guys.
09:54Paul Dano, everyone.
09:54Yeah.
09:54Yeah.
09:55Yeah.
09:55Yeah.
09:55Yeah.
09:56Yeah.
09:56Yeah.
09:57Yeah.
09:57Yeah.
09:58Yeah.
09:58Yeah.
09:59Yeah.
09:59Yeah.
10:00Yeah.
10:00Yeah.
10:02Yeah.
10:02Yeah.
10:04Yeah.
10:04Yeah.
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